Bringing items in on retirement visa

[aussiebrian]

Would anyone know when you are on a retirement visa if you can bring in a motorcycle tax free in you personal items in the first 6 months from Australia. Also, when is the 6 month period valid? Is it from when you send the item, from when it arrives in Thailand, or from when it is processed or collected? Thanks

Sent from my N9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Edited June 26, 2013 by aussiebrian

[Langsuan Man]

There are no tax free benefits of having a "retirement" visa. The visa is for you, not your possessions. Your six month "grace" period only applies to persons that come to Thailand on a work permit, they are limited to the six month time frame, not retirees

Your six months (if it applied to you) is based upon the date of arrival of the goods in the country

As far as the motorcycle goes, you may be able to import it, after paying outrageous import fees, but whether or not you are going to register it is going to be problematic. My advice is to sell it back home and buy a new legal one here

[Jingthing]

Yes, there are some countries (like Panama) that offer tax breaks for foreign retirees, but Thailand offers no such thing.

[Michaelaway]

So, what exactly is the law if a retiree wants to bring over a container from his native country?

[stoneyboy]

So, what exactly is the law if a retiree wants to bring over a container from his native country?

You get shafted by the authorities here,for a change.

[TerryLH]

"Your six months (if it applied to you) is based upon the date of arrival of the goods in the country"

That doesn't make sense to me. I appreciate it might just be me...

What would the six months be for if 'the date is based on the arrival of the goods'?

Should it be six months from when the person arrives?

[jrtmedic]

aussiebrian

My advice is to wait for the experts to respond !

[Langsuan Man]

"Your six months (if it applied to you) is based upon the date of arrival of the goods in the country"

That doesn't make sense to me. I appreciate it might just be me...

What would the six months be for if 'the date is based on the arrival of the goods'?

Should it be six months from when the person arrives?

The six months is based upon both your arrival date and the arrival date of the goods. You have six months to import the items. That six months ends when they arrive at the port, if they arrive any later than the six months allowed then they would be subject to duty or confiscation (if applicable)

[lopburi3]

As said there is no six months - retirement entry does not offer duty free entry of possessions. If you want to ship anything it will be subject to normal duty on arrival so a good agent should be used with relationships for such payment. Normally it will be a reasonable amount but motor vehicles are another subject.

The six months is for those on extensions of stay for work.

[Michaelaway]

As said there is no six months - retirement entry does not offer duty free entry of possessions. If you want to ship anything it will be subject to normal duty on arrival so a good agent should be used with relationships for such payment. Normally it will be a reasonable amount but motor vehicles are another subject.

The six months is for those on extensions of stay for work.

"A good agent..." what makes them good & where to find??

[thrilled]

There's A good chance you'll pay 100% tax on the bike.50% anyway.

[lopburi3]

Check forum posts for recommendations - normally it is those that have offices or established relationships here and ship to Thailand regularly.

[simple1]

As said there is no six months - retirement entry does not offer duty free entry of possessions. If you want to ship anything it will be subject to normal duty on arrival so a good agent should be used with relationships for such payment. Normally it will be a reasonable amount but motor vehicles are another subject.

The six months is for those on extensions of stay for work.

"A good agent..." what makes them good & where to find??

I used http://www.conroyremovals.com.au/ for importing a 20 foot container of household goods, their local agent in BKK was Asian Tigers

Edited June 27, 2013 by simple1

[Hornell]

I have brought good in from the UK three time since I retired 15 years ago. Forget m/c or vehicles - not worth the cost and hassle. Best agent is Pickfords Thailand who handle everything.

[Michaelaway]

I have brought good in from the UK three time since I retired 15 years ago. Forget m/c or vehicles - not worth the cost and hassle. Best agent is Pickfords Thailand who handle everything.

Ok, so please tell what duty you paid.

[montrii]

I notice a lot of people saying there is no duty-free provision for retirees bringing belongings. I think that in practice that may be true, but when I moved here permanently 5 years ago, the information on the government website (not sure anymore which one) said retirees were indeed entitled to this. I think there were limits. I brought a half-container worth of stuff in from the U.S. - theoretically under the limit - with that assumption. When it arrived, customs wanted me to pay something ridiculous, like 40k baht. I referred them to chapter and verse of where I had gotten the information, and they came back with some excuse about why that didn't apply to me. Wish I could be more specific, but it was long ago. In any case bargained (!!) and ended up paying about 17k, which was about $500 US at the exchange rate then, if I recall. I was told by Thai friends at the time that the customs dept. is generally considered the most shifty of them all in terms of under-table money, and I just figured, well, OK, paid, and forgot about it. Short version: you'll have to pay to bring in anything of value.

[Michaelaway]

I notice a lot of people saying there is no duty-free provision for retirees bringing belongings. I think that in practice that may be true, but when I moved here permanently 5 years ago, the information on the government website (not sure anymore which one) said retirees were indeed entitled to this. I think there were limits. I brought a half-container worth of stuff in from the U.S. - theoretically under the limit - with that assumption. When it arrived, customs wanted me to pay something ridiculous, like 40k baht. I referred them to chapter and verse of where I had gotten the information, and they came back with some excuse about why that didn't apply to me. Wish I could be more specific, but it was long ago. In any case bargained (!!) and ended up paying about 17k, which was about $500 US at the exchange rate then, if I recall. I was told by Thai friends at the time that the customs dept. is generally considered the most shifty of them all in terms of under-table money, and I just figured, well, OK, paid, and forgot about it. Short version: you'll have to pay to bring in anything of value.

Oy.

[simple1]

Thai Customs department info in English for household goods:

http://www.customs.go.th/wps/wcm/connect/custen/individuals/importing+used+or+secondhand+household+effects/importingusedsecondhandhouseholdeffects+

Vehicles

http://www.customs.go.th/wps/wcm/connect/custen/individuals/importing+personal+vehicle/importingpersonalvehicle+

[Langsuan Man]

I notice a lot of people saying there is no duty-free provision for retirees bringing belongings. I think that in practice that may be true, but when I moved here permanently 5 years ago, the information on the government website (not sure anymore which one) said retirees were indeed entitled to this. I think there were limits. I brought a half-container worth of stuff in from the U.S. - theoretically under the limit - with that assumption. When it arrived, customs wanted me to pay something ridiculous, like 40k baht. I referred them to chapter and verse of where I had gotten the information, and they came back with some excuse about why that didn't apply to me. Wish I could be more specific, but it was long ago. In any case bargained (!!) and ended up paying about 17k, which was about $500 US at the exchange rate then, if I recall. I was told by Thai friends at the time that the customs dept. is generally considered the most shifty of them all in terms of under-table money, and I just figured, well, OK, paid, and forgot about it. Short version: you'll have to pay to bring in anything of value.

What you read applied to Thais that had worked overseas and were returning to Thailand. If they were overseas for over one year they were allowed to import their household goods back into Thailand without paying duty. This never applied to any foreigner on a Retirement Visa (long stay). I did move here coincidentally five years ago and I had to pay duty for my household goods that were shipped here for free. I was given two options, pay and get a receipt for 80,000 THB or pay without a receipt for 40,000 THB, fortunately at the time the baht was considerably weaker than today. Since I availed myself of the free transport option, I did not complain too much about having to pay duty for all my stuff, including many items that had been purchased in Thailand and were returning with my shipment

[montrii]

I notice a lot of people saying there is no duty-free provision for retirees bringing belongings. I think that in practice that may be true, but when I moved here permanently 5 years ago, the information on the government website (not sure anymore which one) said retirees were indeed entitled to this. I think there were limits. I brought a half-container worth of stuff in from the U.S. - theoretically under the limit - with that assumption. When it arrived, customs wanted me to pay something ridiculous, like 40k baht. I referred them to chapter and verse of where I had gotten the information, and they came back with some excuse about why that didn't apply to me. Wish I could be more specific, but it was long ago. In any case bargained (!!) and ended up paying about 17k, which was about $500 US at the exchange rate then, if I recall. I was told by Thai friends at the time that the customs dept. is generally considered the most shifty of them all in terms of under-table money, and I just figured, well, OK, paid, and forgot about it. Short version: you'll have to pay to bring in anything of value.

What you read applied to Thais that had worked overseas and were returning to Thailand. If they were overseas for over one year they were allowed to import their household goods back into Thailand without paying duty. This never applied to any foreigner on a Retirement Visa (long stay). I did move here coincidentally five years ago and I had to pay duty for my household goods that were shipped here for free. I was given two options, pay and get a receipt for 80,000 THB or pay without a receipt for 40,000 THB, fortunately at the time the baht was considerably weaker than today. Since I availed myself of the free transport option, I did not complain too much about having to pay duty for all my stuff, including many items that had been purchased in Thailand and were returning with my shipment

Ah, I think this is true as far as new things are concerned, but everything I was bringing in was used: LOTS of books, a bicycle, computer equipment, etc. . . . and thanks to Simple1's post we now have a text to refer to, which says (emphasis mine):

REQUIREMENTS FOR DUTY FREE ALLOWANCE

Both Thai and non-Thai residents changing residence into Thailand are eligible to bring used/secondhand household effects into Thailand, in reasonable quantities, free of taxes and duties. It is also required that the imported used/ secondhand household effects have been owned, possessed, and used in the country where the importers resided before returning to Thailand to resume residence.

In case where the household effects are electrical appliances e.g. radios, televisions, refrigerators, microwaves, ovens, air conditioners, etc., only ONE unit each of such items is eligible for tax and duty free allowance. However, if it is the family change of residence, TWO units each of the items will be allowed to bring in tax and duty free. Any excess unit shall be subject to regular taxes and duties, and Customs will place the items that have the lowest rate of duty under tax and duty exemption.

It is important that the used/secondhand household effects must be imported not earlier than one month before or not later than six months after the arrival of the importers. Under exceptional circumstances, Customs may extend the time limits for the importers.

So this should indeed apply to us retirees. I remember the bit about the "one month before or not later than six months." I was right in the pocket, a month after I arrived. I think I got just plain steamrolled by some officials looking for easy pickings.

[ubonjoe]

non-Thai residents changing residence into Thailand

This is the catch phrase. If you are coming into the country for retirement you are not considered a resident.

[montrii]

non-Thai residents changing residence into Thailand

This is the catch phrase. If you are coming into the country for retirement you are not considered a resident.

Well, you are probably right . . . would have to see it in Thai to really be sure. But "non-Thai" to me means "non-Thai." By English grammar and syntax rules, "non-Thai residents" means "people who are living somewhere and are not Thai." Too lazy to research this further, and it was so long ago, but if you're right, the Thai for that should read something like "คนไทยที่อยู่ต่างประเทศ." And I believe I was referred to this by some site for retirees. If someone has a link to the Thai version I'd like to see it. Of course the question is academic now!

[Mario2008]

You have to read a bit further:

REQUIREMENTS FOR CHANGING OF RESIDENCE

• Nonresidents: Nonresidents may import the used/secondhand household effects acquired abroad tax and duty free if such household effects accompanied them in the change of residence and they are qualified under the criteria listed below:
• Nonresidents resuming residents in Thailand must be granted a non-immigrant quota as shown in a passport or a Nonresident Identification Card; or
• Nonresidents granted to work in Thailand are regarded as resuming residents in Thailand provided they have a one-year non-immigrant visa issued by the Immigration Department. In case where the non-immigrant visa has not yet been granted, either of the following documents may be accepted:
  • The letter from the Immigration Department certifying that the nonresidents shall be granted an annual temporary stay in Thailand; or
  • The work permit from the Department of Labor to work in Thailand for at least one year.
• Nonresidents entering Thailand as an expert, specialist, or under a contract of government agencies are required to present the letter from relevant agencies certifying that such nonresidents are granted a non-immigrant visa issued by the Immigration Department and shall work in Thailand not less than one year.

Accompanying spouses of the nonresidents in (2) and (3) are regarded as resuming residence in Thailand provided the spouses have non-immigrant visas issued by the Immigration Department to stay in Thailand for the first 90 days.

But the key element is to understand what a resident means, and that is not a person living in Thailand for more than x days a year. What is actually meant is a foreigner who has permanent residency or who has an immigrant visa (and not a non-immigrant visa). But an immigrant visa has not been issued for almost 10 years. They used to be issued for big investors etc.

[montrii]

You have to read a bit further:

REQUIREMENTS FOR CHANGING OF RESIDENCE

• Nonresidents resuming residents in Thailand must be granted a non-immigrant quota as shown in a passport or a Nonresident Identification Card; or
• Nonresidents granted to work in Thailand are regarded as resuming residents in Thailand provided they have a one-year non-immigrant visa issued by the Immigration Department. In case where the non-immigrant visa has not yet been granted, either of the following documents may be accepted:
  • The letter from the Immigration Department certifying that the nonresidents shall be granted an annual temporary stay in Thailand; or
  • The work permit from the Department of Labor to work in Thailand for at least one year.

But the key element is to understand what a resident means, and that is not a person living in Thailand for more than x days a year. What is actually meant is a foreigner who has permanent residency or who has an immigrant visa (and not a non-immigrant visa). But an immigrant visa has not been issued for almost 10 years. They used to be issued for big investors etc.

I don't dispute what you're saying, it may be perfectly ture, but it's still not clear to me from this . . . doesn't say it can't be a non-imm visa here. And with a retirement visa (non-imm O-A) you can definitely get a letter from the Immigration dept. saying you can stay a year. I think I did. The English is just very confusing. I would probably be as confusing if I tried to write rules like this in Thai, tho my Thai is pretty good. Even the Thai might be ambiguous to me, but it might clarify some things. In any case, I was given to understand - from a couple of sources - that it was policy to allow retirees one import of used stuff. But I freely admit it didn't work out that way. It's just that the policy seems quite muddled to me.

[turgid]

I'm in the process of being gouged on this with delivery due tomorrow. Currently at an estimate of additional charges and duties of $500. The shipper insists that only work permit holders can get duty relief. I've complained loudly. They estimated a liability of 1000-2000 dollars. Graciously however they have been able to get it down to $250 with an additional admin $250 as a fee for actually completing the delivery. I'm a 1 year OA with plans for retirement extension. Clearly I'm being screwed over but equally clearly I have little choice at this stage. Im refusing to pay any further fees until i see my goods.

[yankee99]

I'm in the process of being gouged on this with delivery due tomorrow. Currently at an estimate of additional charges and duties of $500. The shipper insists that only work permit holders can get duty relief. I've complained loudly. They estimated a liability of 1000-2000 dollars. Graciously however they have been able to get it down to $250 with an additional admin $250 as a fee for actually completing the delivery. I'm a 1 year OA with plans for retirement extension. Clearly I'm being screwed over but equally clearly I have little choice at this stage. Im refusing to pay any further fees until i see my goods.

Why do you think your being gouged? How much was the invoice with shipping and what type of product? If invoiced at$1200usd or more$500 is fare

[kurnell]

Langsuan is correct, retirees do not qualify for tax and duty free privilege. Only returning Thais and foreigners with a work permit do. Whatever everyone else is claiming, is either a lie, an error or a case of being very lucky. I have been doing this business in Thailand for 14 years, and have handled thousands of shipments like the above.

The bike, forget it. 300% ++ tax and duties, plus a lot of headaches getting it registered.

[turgid]

Langsuan is correct, retirees do not qualify for tax and duty free privilege. Only returning Thais and foreigners with a work permit do Whatever everyone else is claiming, is either a lie, an error or a case of being very lucky. I have been doing this business in Thailand for 14 years, and have handled thousands of shipments like the above.

Then why do shipping companies not say so ? Do you tell your customers and agents explicly and clearly that they will need to pay duty if they dont have a WP? If I had known any duty was payable on household effects I would have thrown most of them away. My vendor gave me the "we do thousands of shipments" BS but in a more recent mail said its impossible to ever know what customs will do. If i had done a thousand deliveries I would know what customs will do in 8 out of 10 situations and be able to advise a budget for 8 out of 10 situations. Presumably as always the money is in the magic. Keep them confused and milk the confusion for cash. Once the goods arrive they scare you with the full value of duty and then when you say chuck the stuff away they save you with a reduced amount they think you will pay. I apparently just paid tax and shipping on a ten year old bicycle. But they "saved" me from it being subject to 30% of new value.

My advice to any retiree considering this is to hand carry as much as possible and use fedex/dhl 25KG door to door boxes. Chuck or sell everything else unless you really really love it. Budget 50% for contingency and argue every charge.

[yankee99]

Langsuan is correct, retirees do not qualify for tax and duty free privilege. Only returning Thais and foreigners with a work permit do Whatever everyone else is claiming, is either a lie, an error or a case of being very lucky. I have been doing this business in Thailand for 14 years, and have handled thousands of shipments like the above.

Then why do shipping companies not say so ? Do you tell your customers and agents explicly and clearly that they will need to pay duty if they dont have a WP? If I had known any duty was payable on household effects I would have thrown most of them away. My vendor gave me the "we do thousands of shipments" BS but in a more recent mail said its impossible to ever know what customs will do. If i had done a thousand deliveries I would know what customs will do in 8 out of 10 situations and be able to advise a budget for 8 out of 10 situations. Presumably as always the money is in the magic. Keep them confused and milk the confusion for cash. Once the goods arrive they scare you with the full value of duty and then when you say chuck the stuff away they save you with a reduced amount they think you will pay. I apparently just paid tax and shipping on a ten year old bicycle. But they "saved" me from it being subject to 30% of new value.

My advice to any retiree considering this is to hand carry as much as possible and use fedex/dhl 25KG door to door boxes. Chuck or sell everything else unless you really really love it. Budget 50% for contingency and argue every charge.

Better advice might be to google customs and read the rules.

http://www.customs.go.th/wps/wcm/connect/custen/individuals/importing+used+or+secondhand+household+effects/importingusedsecondhandhouseholdeffects

[kurnell]

Langsuan is correct, retirees do not qualify for tax and duty free privilege. Only returning Thais and foreigners with a work permit do Whatever everyone else is claiming, is either a lie, an error or a case of being very lucky. I have been doing this business in Thailand for 14 years, and have handled thousands of shipments like the above.

Then why do shipping companies not say so ? Do you tell your customers and agents explicly and clearly that they will need to pay duty if they dont have a WP? If I had known any duty was payable on household effects I would have thrown most of them away. My vendor gave me the "we do thousands of shipments" BS but in a more recent mail said its impossible to ever know what customs will do. If i had done a thousand deliveries I would know what customs will do in 8 out of 10 situations and be able to advise a budget for 8 out of 10 situations. Presumably as always the money is in the magic. Keep them confused and milk the confusion for cash. Once the goods arrive they scare you with the full value of duty and then when you say chuck the stuff away they save you with a reduced amount they think you will pay. I apparently just paid tax and shipping on a ten year old bicycle. But they "saved" me from it being subject to 30% of new value.

My advice to any retiree considering this is to hand carry as much as possible and use fedex/dhl 25KG door to door boxes. Chuck or sell everything else unless you really really love it. Budget 50% for contingency and argue every charge.

Better advice might be to google customs and read the rules.

http://www.customs.go.th/wps/wcm/connect/custen/individuals/importing+used+or+secondhand+household+effects/importingusedsecondhandhouseholdeffects

Shipping companies are not removals companies. They handle less than 1% of the used household goods coming into Thailand, so know very little of the import regulations. They handle general cargo normally and if you are dealing with a Thai, then they will do what Thais normally do when they don't know something and give you false information, then take zero responsibility when they are wrong and tell you "pay or the shipment will stay at port incurring port storage and demurrage" until you pay or abandon the goods.

The customs regulations website link above is ambiguous (at best) and mostly useless when it comes to importing household goods, and this is probably the way customs like it, so they can interpret it their own way.

In 14 years I have seen many people that claim that they know "big police" or have a friend in customs, blah blah blah and none of them have cleared their goods for free. I even dealt with an ex-Ambassador that told me he would use his senior connections to avoid tax, but still had to pay. Can I be clearer than that? Rates are negotiable so best to get advice from someone like me before you ship.

Someone should pin this as this advise is golden!!!