Grace period ignored by immigration

[giddyup]

A friend of mine in the course of a conversation said he'd been hit with a 2000 baht fine for being four days late on his 90 day report. He was totally unaware of the seven day grace period, he'd never been told about it, but how do they get away with these scams in immigration? I assume that the grace period is still in effect, otherwise I need to eat crow.

Edited July 6, 2013 by giddyup

[Mario2008]

In general, everything is clear when you get a receipt for the fine paid.

Did he receive a receipt?

[lopburi3]

Did he actually make a report only 4 days late or did he leave country 4 days after it was due and found out on next report? That could explain it as a legal fine.

[giddyup]

Did he actually make a report only 4 days late or did he leave country 4 days after it was due and found out on next report? That could explain it as a legal fine.

It was a normal 90 day report, he never left the country.

[giddyup]

In general, everything is clear when you get a receipt for the fine paid.

Did he receive a receipt?

Never got a receipt AFAIK.

[lopburi3]

Did he say it was an actual immigration officer rather than perhaps a counter clerk - as said a receipt is always provided for a legal charge and payments should never be made without obtaining. I understand that many will not want to rock any boats; but receipts are a requirement so should always be politely asked if not provided. You can always say you need for tax or your government/embassy/wife needs and no face loss is involved.

[MegaRanter]

13 years of yearly extensions, never bothered myself with that particular rule and no one raised an eyebrow.

After the first seven years, they put their foot down I had to take pictures with my wife at home, inside and outside of it. I took several inside the house, but with only shorts, showing off my pretty well formed chest and biceps, my wife grinning beside me.

When the lady officer opened the picture envelope, she made a startling sound and quickly dropped the pictures. She said I know your were indoors but you did nt have to pose nude. I was quite happy with myself.

[giddyup]

Did he say it was an actual immigration officer rather than perhaps a counter clerk - as said a receipt is always provided for a legal charge and payments should never be made without obtaining. I understand that many will not want to rock any boats; but receipts are a requirement so should always be politely asked if not provided. You can always say you need for tax or your government/embassy/wife needs and no face loss is involved.

It was one of the guys that issues you with a new 90 day slip. He realises he made a big mistake not asking for a receipt, but he's aware of the grace period now, so the guy won't get away with it again. At least not with him.

[monty]

Not only have they give a receipt, they are also required to put a stamp in your passport which states you were fined for reporting late, and the stamp has a space where they have to enter the amount of the fine as well.

[arthurwait]

How long is the grace period ?

[giddyup]

How long is the grace period ?

7 days.

[arthurwait]

How long is the grace period ?

7 days.

Thanks. I was 11 days late yesterday. Wondered if I could have got away with it.

[lopburi3]

Flame and reply to removed post removed.

[Utley]

As explained to me, the grace period is at the discretion of the immigration official. It does help to show up well dressed, have all your documents prepared and present the appearance of the type of person that the immigration official would welcome into his country.

[Lite Beer]

It is actually the official rule.
You can report up to 15 days early and 7 days late.

http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/en/base.php?page=90days

The foreigner makes the notification in person, or
The foreigner authorises another person to make the notification, or
The foreigner makes the notification by registered mail.
The notification must be made within 15 days before or after 7 days the period of 90 days expires.
The first application for extension of stay by the foreigner is equivalent to the notification of staying in the Kingdom over 90 days.

[brewsterbudgen]

In general, everything is clear when you get a receipt for the fine paid.

Did he receive a receipt?

Never got a receipt AFAIK.

Was it at the main Immigration in Bangkok? Very unusual to not get a receipt.

[IMA_FARANG]

As explained to me, the grace period is at the discretion of the immigration official. It does help to show up well dressed, have all your documents prepared and present the appearance of the type of person that the immigration official would welcome into his country.

------------------

Exactly,

The "Grace period " is at the discretion of the immigration officer.

They normally will give you the benefit of the doubt, but they don't HAVE to.

The person before you (just for example) may have been an a--hole who made the immigration officer angry.

Then you came next, all nice and polite, but he or she was still angry.

You could have just have been there at the wrong time.

P.S. I must say in my experience at Changwattana they always give me a receipt for anything I must pay for.

That may not be the case at other places in the country.

Edited July 7, 2013 by IMA_FARANG

[giddyup]

In general, everything is clear when you get a receipt for the fine paid.

Did he receive a receipt?

Never got a receipt AFAIK.

Was it at the main Immigration in Bangkok? Very unusual to not get a receipt.

No, it was at Jomtien (Pattaya).

[keeniau96]

The police order quoted above is quite specific about the 15 days early and 7 days late. No room for interpretation or discretion.

[BrianCR]

Before I learned of the 7 day grace period I was "fined" 2000 baht for being TWO days late with a receipt issued in Chiang Mai! Also when they first introduced the 90 day reporting you may remember there was total confusion as to when it would be formally applied. I decided that, as I was not a terrorist, and had no intention of becoming one, I would refuse to comply with the reporting. I actually got away with it for nearly three years (as then, the system was so lax and confused) until one visa renewal (in that Soi off Sathon) the delightful officer noticed that I didn't have the reporting documents and sent me to another room. Another delightful lady looked at my passport and said "mi ben rai", charged me 2000 baht and put me back on the radar.

[ubonjoe]

In reality 90 day reports have been required since 1979 when the current immigration act was approved.

They were not enforcing the rule for a long time before somebody in power noticed and told immigration to do it.

[ubonjoe]

The police order quoted above is quite specific about the 15 days early and 7 days late. No room for interpretation or discretion.

What was posted is not a police order. I think it is more of a policy than a police order.

I think the 7 days can be ignored if a immigration office takes a mind to.

It is a bit like being able to mail in your reports. Even though the immigration act says you can do them by mail there are several offices that will not allow it.

[Tywais]

Also when they first introduced the 90 day reporting you may remember there was total confusion as to when it would be formally applied.

Believe many won't remember as it was introduced decades ago, Immigration Act B.E. 2522 (1979). When I moved here permanently in '93 there was no enforcement and it didn't catch up to me for 10 years. So 10 years late, 2000 Baht - fair enough.

[evadgib]

The "Grace period " is at the discretion of the immigration officer.

A receipt isn't

Edited July 7, 2013 by evadgib

[lopburi3]

Troll post removed.

[giddyup]

The "Grace period " is at the discretion of the immigration officer.

A receipt isn't

About a year ago I was given a slip of paper (wish I'd kept it) by the officer that handles the 90 day reporting, that clearly stated that there was a 7 day grace period on reporting. Nowhere did it say that it was at the discretion of the immigration officer. I find it hard to believe that the period of grace is left to the whims of somebody.

[kimchibob]

[giddyup]

[attachment=223460:ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect Thailand1373176703.946057.jpg

This is the paper that Jomtien Immigration puts in your passport. It says nothing about a grace period. Also, when applying for a Certificate of Residency, Jomtien charges ฿300 and will not give you a receipt.

This is from the Thai Immigration website:

Notification of staying in the Kingdom over 90 days

Procedure and notification

The foreigner makes the notification in person, or

The foreigner authorises another person to make the notification, or

The foreigner makes the notification by registered mail.

The notification must be made within 15 days before or after 7 days the period of 90 days expires.

The first application for extension of stay by the foreigner is equivalent to the notification of staying in the Kingdom over 90 days.

Edited July 7, 2013 by giddyup

[davejones]

[attachment=223460:ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect Thailand1373176703.946057.jpg

This is the paper that Jomtien Immigration puts in your passport. It says nothing about a grace period. Also, when applying for a Certificate of Residency, Jomtien charges ฿300 and will not give you a receipt.

This is from the Thai Immigration website:

Notification of staying in the Kingdom over 90 days

Procedure and notification

The foreigner makes the notification in person, or

The foreigner authorises another person to make the notification, or

The foreigner makes the notification by registered mail.

The notification must be made within 15 days before or after 7 days the period of 90 days expires.

The first application for extension of stay by the foreigner is equivalent to the notification of staying in the Kingdom over 90 days.

Some of what it says on the immigration website is wrong. It says you can report by post, but that is no allowed in some areas. So you can't believe everything you read there. Don't report late and you won't have this problem. I know some people may have to occasionally, but many people are just too lax.

Edited July 7, 2013 by davejones

[Mario2008]

The law says you can report by mail, so the immigration website is correct.

Some immigration offices refuse to follow the law, that is something different. But if you send it by registered mail they will have a hard time fining you for failing to report if you refuse to pay the fine.