Eight rice millers to face charges

[drdoom6996]

And leave Supa alone. Don't kill the messenger. Like all the other messengers that have been sacrificed. And I don't mean Chalerm.

[FangFerang]

Just as an exercise in thought--what about this?

Commodities prices are determined by supply and demand, which means that every year Thailand has to stockpile rice to keep it off the market to keep the price per unit up (just as the US and India burn thousands of tons of wheat each year). When the yearly rice crop worldwide does not meet demand, the entire volume is sold. When the crop has a very high yield, some enters the market, driving prices per unit down in a controlled way (yes, Virginia, there is no Santa Claus). Beside the fact that this is Darwinian economics and plainly murderous in view of starving populations, what would I do if I had the key to stockpiles in my hands? I would illegally sell part of the stockpiles to poor provinces and also take the government money for a double dip. If it is unaccounted for, poor people are eating,I am getting paid twice, and the commodity price is unaffected. A curiously humane and greedy illegality..... If the issue is prosecuted vigorously, people will starve. If the issue is not prosecuted, money disappears. Maybe in this case looking the other way is not a bad idea.

In a similar vein, Thais are known to ignore the copyright of medicines for the simple fact that poor people would die. This ignoring of copyrighted medicines is seriously frowned on by the West and especially pharmaceutical companies, the politicians they own and their ilk, however, I find the morality of copyrighting medicines and medical procedures to be beyond dubious and well into the hypocritically inhumane. Again, maybe in this case looking the other way is also not a bad idea.

I am radically proposing that corruption is not always detrimental, and that strict regulation and the rule of law usually only serve those creating the laws and regulations. In both cases these situations are the result of international laws enacted by the West, and not laws originating in Thailand. I believe we are debating a symptom of the downside of capitalism, and it is a cruel and heartless turn.

This is just an exercise....a piece of intellectual chewing gum.

Edited July 7, 2013 by FangFerang

[how241]

Excellent news for the farmers, but this is probably the tip of the iceberg........

+1

[ramrod711]

He also queried how the government was going to manage rice inventories as it had not found a ready market because Thai rice was more expensive than rice from neighbouring countries.

Don't try to tell a Thai that world price is a concern. They are utterly convinced that they deserve to be number one just because they ARE Thai. Don't like the price you are getting for milk, rice, pork or any other product, block a highway like spoiled children. The government of the day will always cave in and pay more.

[tomross46]

Talking about rice. I have been wondering what happened to all the rice than was in the warehouses and millers that had rice during the flood. Did it get destroyed? What happened to it? Is it the rice people are complaining about the smell at the warehouses? Was it used to make alcohol?

[allan michaud]

All the provinces named are in the South are'nt they?....Funny!

Only Southern ones I recognise are Songkhla & Phattalung.

Don't let facts spoil a good conspiracy theory !!

The other 2 are just north of Bangkok and both provinces went to the PTP in 2011. However they are tiny provinces and it is notable that none of the major rice producing provinces are included.

Regarding the 19 rice millers not prosecuted, I can only assume they came up with the necessary paperwork, which was no doubt then passed on to the police... in large brown envelopes.

[allan michaud]

More pathetic journalism.

Did none of the journalists ask any rather obvious questions like, "What about the other 19 you are not prosecuting?"

[hellodolly]

Excellent news for the farmers, but this is probably the tip of the iceberg........

I still do not see where the farmers are gaining any thing. They no sooner got a raise in the price of rice and the government put a raise in the cost of labor the land lords raised the rent all their suppliers raised their prices. It seems to me one man gets a windfall and every one around him profits from it and he is left standing there wondering where all that money went.

I would like to see some one break it down for me. I hear this and that but never a over all break down of where the money goes and where it was going before the subsidy.

[rubl]

Pray someone help me remember. When did Dept. Minister of Commerce, Pheu Thai party list MP and UDD leader Nattawut tell us that no irregularities were found in a 'redundant' survey of warehouses?

[OzMick]

All the provinces named are in the South are'nt they?....Funny!

Only Southern ones I recognise are Songkhla & Phattalung.

Don't let facts spoil a good conspiracy theory !!

The other 2 are just north of Bangkok and both provinces went to the PTP in 2011. However they are tiny provinces and it is notable that none of the major rice producing provinces are included.

Regarding the 19 rice millers not prosecuted, I can only assume they came up with the necessary paperwork, which was no doubt then passed on to the police... in large brown envelopes.

Chainat's 2 seats are held by BJT.

[zyphodb]

Excellent news for the farmers, but this is probably the tip of the iceberg........

Excellent news for the farmers, but this is probably the tip of the iceberg........

Tip of the riceberg.... once they start digging here every part of the whole chain from farmer to politician will be found with rice flour on their hands... however of course if they can isolate the balme at the rice millers then this will suit all

But they won't start digging...

[jpinx]

Excellent news for the farmers, but this is probably the tip of the iceberg........

I still do not see where the farmers are gaining any thing. They no sooner got a raise in the price of rice and the government put a raise in the cost of labor the land lords raised the rent all their suppliers raised their prices. It seems to me one man gets a windfall and every one around him profits from it and he is left standing there wondering where all that money went.

I would like to see some one break it down for me. I hear this and that but never a over all break down of where the money goes and where it was going before the subsidy.

I was over-simplifying -- but the idea is that with less black market rice, the real market will be a better place. I know rice farmers are by no means blameless, but they certainly seem to be at the bottom of the pecking order - unless they are huge and connected -- but that's the same even in UK.....

[hellodolly]

Excellent news for the farmers, but this is probably the tip of the iceberg........

I still do not see where the farmers are gaining any thing. They no sooner got a raise in the price of rice and the government put a raise in the cost of labor the land lords raised the rent all their suppliers raised their prices. It seems to me one man gets a windfall and every one around him profits from it and he is left standing there wondering where all that money went.

I would like to see some one break it down for me. I hear this and that but never a over all break down of where the money goes and where it was going before the subsidy.

I was over-simplifying -- but the idea is that with less black market rice, the real market will be a better place. I know rice farmers are by no means blameless, but they certainly seem to be at the bottom of the pecking order - unless they are huge and connected -- but that's the same even in UK.....

I might have been a little misleading.

Basically I was wondering about the small farmers not the big fellows.

[jpinx]

Just as an exercise in thought--what about this?

Commodities prices are determined by supply and demand, which me.................................

Hold it right there -- you are basing your disposition on a false assumption

[hellodolly]

Excellent news for the farmers, but this is probably the tip of the iceberg........

I still do not see where the farmers are gaining any thing. They no sooner got a raise in the price of rice and the government put a raise in the cost of labor the land lords raised the rent all their suppliers raised their prices. It seems to me one man gets a windfall and every one around him profits from it and he is left standing there wondering where all that money went.

I would like to see some one break it down for me. I hear this and that but never a over all break down of where the money goes and where it was going before the subsidy.

I was over-simplifying -- but the idea is that with less black market rice, the real market will be a better place. I know rice farmers are by no means blameless, but they certainly seem to be at the bottom of the pecking order - unless they are huge and connected -- but that's the same even in UK.....

I might have been a little misleading.

Basically I was wondering about the small farmers not the big fellows.

I forgot to mention I don't care about the big guys as I believe many (not all) of them could operate at a 100% loss and there personal assets would still grow. Not always in the closet but off shore things like buying football teams, Diamond mines and citizenship's in other countries to name a few.

[hellodolly]

Excellent news for the farmers, but this is probably the tip of the iceberg........

I still do not see where the farmers are gaining any thing. They no sooner got a raise in the price of rice and the government put a raise in the cost of labor the land lords raised the rent all their suppliers raised their prices. It seems to me one man gets a windfall and every one around him profits from it and he is left standing there wondering where all that money went.

I would like to see some one break it down for me. I hear this and that but never a over all break down of where the money goes and where it was going before the subsidy.

I was over-simplifying -- but the idea is that with less black market rice, the real market will be a better place. I know rice farmers are by no means blameless, but they certainly seem to be at the bottom of the pecking order - unless they are huge and connected -- but that's the same even in UK.....

I might have been a little misleading.

Basically I was wondering about the small farmers not the big fellows.

I forgot to mention I don't care about the big guys as I believe many (not all) of them could operate at a 100% loss and there personal assets would still grow. Not always in the closet but off shore things like buying football teams, Diamond mines and citizenship's in other countries to name a few.

[rametindallas]

Oh yeah, I really bet the Rice Millers up north are all card carrying PT REDs

You really need to give this some thought before you open posts and insert foot

Why would all the rice millers up north have to be PT reds? Would that in any way change the disproportionate opposition representation in the named provinces?

Map of Thailand color-coded for political parties that won majority seats in the last national election:

http://readtiger.com/wkp/en/Thai_general_election,_2011

Superimpose a map of the provinces to see how a particular province voted.

[OzMick]

Oh yeah, I really bet the Rice Millers up north are all card carrying PT REDs

You really need to give this some thought before you open posts and insert foot

Why would all the rice millers up north have to be PT reds? Would that in any way change the disproportionate opposition representation in the named provinces?

Map of Thailand color-coded for political parties that won majority seats in the last national election:

http://readtiger.com/wkp/en/Thai_general_election,_2011

Superimpose a map of the provinces to see how a particular province voted.

Your map shows which party won the majority of seats in each province. This link gives the result for each seat http://en.wikipedia...._election,_2011

[hotrod4098]

It is just 9 billion dollar. The army is wasting that amount every quarter. Sometimes they buy an aircraft carrier for helicopters, sometimes they buy armored vehicles fro the Ukraine without airco that serves now as a artificial reef and sometimes they buy a leaky Zeppelin which the insurgents see coming from a 100Km distance.

It seems there is more than enough money. But I am still wondering, if it is really meant for buying votes (Abhisit sponsoring the army, hoteliers and other failing businesses and Yingluck farmers) what about the consumers that are far greater in number. Do they like it when their food prices go up dramatically? Come on there must be better ways to give farmers a better chance on a good income. Give them each 100K a year for the next 3 years and send them for that amount to school during the dry and hot season. Teach them to grow other crops and pay for the transition. Thailand seem to be stuck in the early 1900's. Too small farms, too much manual labor, too little help from agricultural universities without connections to the evil Monsanto's of this world. Learn farmers to innovate and use the 10 million USD for that purpose. It will work out money well spent.

thais wont change..live in a village for a while..you can see why..the thai men belittle those who ask any thing..they dont wont to learn any new things or ways..

i showed them many ways of doing thing..total waste of time

[Thai at Heart]

Just as an exercise in thought--what about this?

Commodities prices are determined by supply and demand, which means that every year Thailand has to stockpile rice to keep it off the market to keep the price per unit up (just as the US and India burn thousands of tons of wheat each year). When the yearly rice crop worldwide does not meet demand, the entire volume is sold. When the crop has a very high yield, some enters the market, driving prices per unit down in a controlled way (yes, Virginia, there is no Santa Claus). Beside the fact that this is Darwinian economics and plainly murderous in view of starving populations, what would I do if I had the key to stockpiles in my hands? I would illegally sell part of the stockpiles to poor provinces and also take the government money for a double dip. If it is unaccounted for, poor people are eating,I am getting paid twice, and the commodity price is unaffected. A curiously humane and greedy illegality..... If the issue is prosecuted vigorously, people will starve. If the issue is not prosecuted, money disappears. Maybe in this case looking the other way is not a bad idea.

In a similar vein, Thais are known to ignore the copyright of medicines for the simple fact that poor people would die. This ignoring of copyrighted medicines is seriously frowned on by the West and especially pharmaceutical companies, the politicians they own and their ilk, however, I find the morality of copyrighting medicines and medical procedures to be beyond dubious and well into the hypocritically inhumane. Again, maybe in this case looking the other way is also not a bad idea.

I am radically proposing that corruption is not always detrimental, and that strict regulation and the rule of law usually only serve those creating the laws and regulations. In both cases these situations are the result of international laws enacted by the West, and not laws originating in Thailand. I believe we are debating a symptom of the downside of capitalism, and it is a cruel and heartless turn.

This is just an exercise....a piece of intellectual chewing gum.

Yesterday on BBC it was stated that the Indians are going to give each rural family 5kg of grain power week for free. Presumably 50% rice to reduce rural malnutrition.

[slapout]

More pathetic journalism.

Did none of the journalists ask any rather obvious questions like, "What about the other 19 you are not prosecuting?"

What about the mill/warehouse owner first mentioned as being included in this group, by name, which just happens to be same name as a major toyota dealership across Thailand?

How many storage facilities were actually inventoried. 700 were reported as being fumigated so would be addressed later. Now we hear 1500 were checked. Another number thrown out, 2700 storage facilities, 700 not avaliable for inspection, 500 not inspected. So just to really confuse the people, they start throwing out milling facility numbers, suspect mills, paddy, parboiled, white milled, brown milled, etc.

[hellodolly]

It is just 9 billion dollar. The army is wasting that amount every quarter. Sometimes they buy an aircraft carrier for helicopters, sometimes they buy armored vehicles fro the Ukraine without airco that serves now as a artificial reef and sometimes they buy a leaky Zeppelin which the insurgents see coming from a 100Km distance.

It seems there is more than enough money. But I am still wondering, if it is really meant for buying votes (Abhisit sponsoring the army, hoteliers and other failing businesses and Yingluck farmers) what about the consumers that are far greater in number. Do they like it when their food prices go up dramatically? Come on there must be better ways to give farmers a better chance on a good income. Give them each 100K a year for the next 3 years and send them for that amount to school during the dry and hot season. Teach them to grow other crops and pay for the transition. Thailand seem to be stuck in the early 1900's. Too small farms, too much manual labor, too little help from agricultural universities without connections to the evil Monsanto's of this world. Learn farmers to innovate and use the 10 million USD for that purpose. It will work out money well spent.

thais wont change..live in a village for a while..you can see why..the thai men belittle those who ask any thing..they dont wont to learn any new things or ways..

i showed them many ways of doing thing..total waste of time

Hotrod4098

You come across as a little bit of a bitter man. They wouldn't listen to me when I tried to change their life style.

Did they ask you for your help.

I highly doubt it. If you don't like the Thai culture you might as well leave all you are going to be facing is continuous bitterness. They have a very nice culture and like any other culture it will change but not because some farong comes riding in on his white horse to save the day and show them to the land of milk and honey.

[rubl]

It is just 9 billion dollar. The army is wasting that amount every quarter. Sometimes they buy an aircraft carrier for helicopters, sometimes they buy armored vehicles fro the Ukraine without airco that serves now as a artificial reef and sometimes they buy a leaky Zeppelin which the insurgents see coming from a 100Km distance.

It seems there is more than enough money. But I am still wondering, if it is really meant for buying votes (Abhisit sponsoring the army, hoteliers and other failing businesses and Yingluck farmers) what about the consumers that are far greater in number. Do they like it when their food prices go up dramatically? Come on there must be better ways to give farmers a better chance on a good income. Give them each 100K a year for the next 3 years and send them for that amount to school during the dry and hot season. Teach them to grow other crops and pay for the transition. Thailand seem to be stuck in the early 1900's. Too small farms, too much manual labor, too little help from agricultural universities without connections to the evil Monsanto's of this world. Learn farmers to innovate and use the 10 million USD for that purpose. It will work out money well spent.

It's really amazing that the military who will get a minimally increased budget of THB 170 billion or so for 2013/2014 manage to waste US9 billion per quarter (about 9 * 30 = 270 billion Baht). Now that's truly amazing to be close to fabrication of a slightly arithmetic depraved mind. IMHO.

The suggestion that some money is thrown-away on farmers is interesting. Till now we only had a Minister of the PM Office explain that 352 spent - 59 sold - 156 still have = 137 loss (in billion THB and only over 2011/2012). Now if in this tragic kingdom we could have a bit more details and transparency and correct, honest figures rather than a 'let the dices flight high' kind of attitude in claiming them

Edited July 8, 2013 by rubl