Wire transfer US to Kasikorn; any better way?

[Drew345]

I am soon going to do another wire transfer to my Kasikorn Bank account; but before I do, I just wanted to check if there is a better way yet. The world is moving forwards, but wire transfers seem to be still stuck in the 1970’s.

I had done numerous successful wire transfer from America to Thailand, using the detailed directions given by the Los Angeles Kasikorn Bank office (using JPMorgan Chase Bank as intermediary bank), then last time it all went terribly wrong. The US sending bank reported the wire transfer as complete, but Kasikorn bank said they didn’t know where to look for the money they had received. This was all made much worse because the US sending bank gave me a “wire tracking number”, but Kasikorn bank said they didn’t know what to do with a “wire tracking number”, but needed a “MT103” number to locate the funds. The US side then replied that they didn’t have any “MT103” number, only a “wire tracking number”. So this went on for 3 nervewrecking weeks. Finally, I pulled the plug and said “pull the money back to America!”, and within 3 hours the money was deposited into my Thai account (coincidence? I think not).

Anyway, before I repeat this whole episode, are there any more modern or updated ways to send money to Thailand now rather than wire transfers?

I won’t be going back to America soon, so carrying cash isn’t really an option.

Thanks,

[pmarlin]

If you use SWIFT transfers the transfer should be complete in less than 24 hrs. All your sending bank needs is the SWIFT code for the receiving bank, Account information , like name and account number and bank branch. A K-Bank branch has a handout that has all the information you need to give to your sending bank, The K-bank SWIFT code is KASITHBK. Most US banks charge a fee when doing the transfer. Usually $25.00 to $50.00. K-bank also charges a small fee.

[Drew345]

Yes, that's the way I've always done it before, but after the fiasco last time (taking 3 weeks and KBank saying they don't know how to find money in their accounts), I was hoping for a better way. With all the international banks now, and electronic connections between the banks, hopefully there will someday be a more automatic way to move the money, with less chance of human error.

[lopburi3]

Bangkok Bank has had ACH domestic transfer service with US banks for years and is normally the easy and cheap way to transfer funds - but does normally take one day longer than SWIFT. But that would require you open a local Bangkok Bank account as that number is the transfer account used along with the routing number of Bangkok Bank New York. Many of us use this system regularly.

[roger1999]

I always write a check (my bank asks for it to be less than $10,000 since they can avoid paperwork) and it usually takes 30 days for the funds to arrive. I will follow this thread since I am rather certain my solution is far from the best. I pay a fee for this (300 baht?) and probably get a terrible exchange rate.

[Drew345]

Does the Bangkok Bank ACH transfer work with any US bank, or only certain US banks? I have BofA, and Everbank.

Usually Domestic ACH (US domestic) are set up by first "linking" the accounts through sending small test transfers (like 35 cents, 17 cents) to verify the links and then the links can be accessed on the bank's website (no need to interact with a person to make the links). Do you know how to set up a link with Bangkok Bank and how to initiate the transfer from the US bank side?

Do you know if the Bangkok Bank account has to be in the same name as the US sending account? I don't have a Bangkok bank account and not sure I can get one, but my significant other does have an account there.

Thanks,

[Pib]

Get yourself a U.S. bank account that provides a "no foreign transaction fee" Visa debit card, like Schwab Bank. Then just get your money from a AEON ATM. As you probably know, an AEON ATM does not charge the foreign card fee of Bt150 like Thai bank ATMs do, the Visa exchange rate is always plus or minus a few stang of the Thai bank TT Buying rate used for wire transfers. The debit card will probably come with a daily withdrawal limit of $1000 (approx. Bt31,000). If you happen to live where AEON ATMs are scarce, you can still use an Thai bank ATM but the ATM will charge you a Bt150 foreign card fee which Schwab will reimburse....but do try to use an AEON ATM if at all possible to avoid helping to kill the reimbursement golden goose. Going that "no foreign transaction fee" debit card route results in money "immediately in-hand" (just as soon as it spits out from the ATM), absolutely no fees along the way, and you get an exchange rate equal to (usually a few stang better) than the TT Buying Rate. If you need a BIG amount of money within a few days that some daily visits to the ATM to withdraw Bt31K with your debit card then use the wire transfer method like you are usng now. And as already mentioned in another post, with a Bangkok Bank account you can use the low cost ACH transfer method versus the pricey SWIFT transfer method.

[Pib]

Does the Bangkok Bank ACH transfer work with any US bank, or only certain US banks? I have BofA, and Everbank.

Usually Domestic ACH (US domestic) are set up by first "linking" the accounts through sending small test transfers (like 35 cents, 17 cents) to verify the links and then the links can be accessed on the bank's website (no need to interact with a person to make the links). Do you know how to set up a link with Bangkok Bank and how to initiate the transfer from the US bank side?

Do you know if the Bangkok Bank account has to be in the same name as the US sending account? I don't have a Bangkok bank account and not sure I can get one, but my significant other does have an account there.

Thanks,

It will work with any U.S. bank that uses ACH transfer which is the great majority of them. BofA definitely does as I used them for many years to do regular transfers to my Bangkok Bank account...although not free, BofA charges a $3 sending fee for each 3 business day ACH transfer....they also have a next business day transfer for $10 and next day ACH transfers for $25....I've only ever used the 3 day/$3 fee transfer speed. All the other U.S. banks I use provide free ACH transfers...I have transfer links to Bangkok Bank setup with all of them. "You setup a link just like you would to any bank in the U.S., that is, you enter the Bangkok Bank "New York branch" routing number and your "in-Thailand" Bangkok Bank savings account number." Two trial deposits are sent which you must verify. See this Bangkok Bank webpage for more info. But here's the downside for you: you need a Bangkok Bank account with your name on it to transfer to yourself.....no different than setting up a transfer link say between your BofA and Everbank accounts. Now, there will be associated Bangkok Bank fees such as the typical 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 min) that all Thai banks charges...even K-Bank....and as the money flows through the Bangkok Bank NY branch they will slice off $5 or $10 for the amounts people usually send...the webpage link will give you specific fee....but say you were going to transfer $2000....Bangkok Bank NY would slice off $5....so $1995 continues on to your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank account where you receive their TT Buying Rate for the exchange rate and then above mentioned Bt200 (approx. $6.50) funds receipt fee is deducted and the remaining amount posted to your account. So, if you used BoA, the total transfer fees would have been $3 + $5 + $6.50 = $14.50....use one of your U.S. bank accounts that provide free ACH transfers and you can drop that $3 part and transfer say $2000 for $11.50 in fees....and it will post to the Bangkok Bank account in 2-4 business days, excluding weekends and Thai & U.S. holidays.

Use the ThaiVisa search function on using Bangkok Bank for ACH funds transfers and you will come up with many, many, many.....many threads/posts talking about this.

I just looked at my BofA account and you can setup a transfer link to "Someone else's personal account at another bank (only transfers to)." I stopped at that point but I expect they don't even do the trial deposits thing as they are leaving it up to you to get the routing number and account number correct and since you can't pull money from someone else's bank account then it really no different than you sending someone some money from you account using a mailed check, using PayPal, etc. Note: as FYI, you can't pull funds from "your own" Bangkok Bank account either...Bank of Thailand regulations restrict the outflow of funds from Thailand. Land of Smiles for incoming money; Land of Frowns for outgoing money (unless you have the proper docs). However, I can't say whether your "significant other" local Bangkok Bank will allow the in coming money to be posted to their account since the name of the Sender and name on the account don't match....no shortage of ThaiVisa posts where apparently Thai banks (not just Bangkok Bank but any Thai bank) have rejected incoming funds transfers when the Senders name does not match the name on the Thai bank account....I guess this is to help prevent money laundering.

And remember, when setting up the Bangkok Bank link be sure to select "domestic" versus "international" because you are using the Bangkok Bank New York branch routing number. Good luck.

Edited August 20, 2013 by Pib

[Pib]

I always write a check (my bank asks for it to be less than $10,000 since they can avoid paperwork) and it usually takes 30 days for the funds to arrive. I will follow this thread since I am rather certain my solution is far from the best. I pay a fee for this (300 baht?) and probably get a terrible exchange rate.

You are probably getting the check/sight bill rate which is 0.1 to 0.2baht/USD less (depends on the Thai bank) than the TT Buying Rate used for wire transfers....so this means your losing approx. 0.32% to 0.64% in the exchange rate. Fee-wise/exchange rate-wise---from the sending bank to the receiving bank-- it's a one of the cheaper ways to get money for certain amounts of money especially in comparison to usually pricey SWIFT transfers...a person needs to price out the associated fees between different transfer methods and transfer amounts; however, the downside can be the wait for the check to clear/post to your account....but if you get in a regular routine of writing the checks (ex: say every two months, every month, etc) it can workout pretty good as the inflow of funds will also be occurring on a regular routine assuming all the checks consistently clear after X-days.

[keeniau96]

I have been using the Bangkok Bank transfer method for almost a year now, recommend it very highly for cost and convenience vs. my previous use of SWIFT transfers. Many posts in TV about this, including the several in this thread. Read the Bangkok Bank instructions on "how to", they are very clear. Looks complex at first but really only a domestic transfer from your bank to the BB NYC branch, whence BB routes it to your BB account in TH. The only tricky item is the test transfer procedure. Tricky because your bank makes two separate transfers of very trivial amounts eg. US$0.12 and US$0.16. However, when they appear in your BB bank account in TH they will show up as baht, so you have to convert back to the US$ sums, guessing at the rate used. You have to use these received amounts (US$ version) when confirming the transfer at your USA bank; such confirmation is the final step in establishing the transfer linkage. Don't get intimidated by the seeming complexity of it all, it is actually far simpler to do than to describe it.

[khunbillmex]

We have used Bangkok Bank for over two years with great success - you can go to their website here: http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/PersonalBanking/DailyBanking/TransferingFunds/TransferringIntoThailand/ReceivingFundsfromUSA/Pages/ReceivingFundsfromUSA.aspx

The only time we had a problem was when I tried to send from my US account to my wife's Bangkok Bank account - the names didn't match and the transfer failed - it may have done so because of the way the instruction was written rather than just the difference in account names.

What I haven't seen mentoned here re these transfers is that Bangkok Bank asks to be told that you have made a transfer so you need to send them an e-mail to this address:

Advice of incoming ACH to New York Branch

Client Services Group <[email protected]>

From Account of

xxxxxxxxxxx xxxx at

xxxxxxxx Community Bank

Chanhassen MN USA

11/4/2011 XXXX acct me XXXX BANGKOK BANK NY, NY $xxxx.00

Advice of incoming ACH to New York Branch

for credit to:

BANGKOK BANK ACCOUNT

00000-000-0000

Name XXXXX XXXX

Address

Branch Bang Kapi (0105)

182 Sukhumvit Rd. Khlong Toei Khlongtoei Bangkok 10110



ACH -from- ABA RTG # 091000000

You can reach me by e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx

--as you can see from this example it is dated Nov 2011 - my wife has been handling things since then and I'm not sure if she is sending an update every month - I'll check and update post in 12 hrs.

SCHWAB ATM has been mentioned - It is great we use that here in Mexico. They get it right most of the time - we avoid ATM's they can't auto-detect fees from.

Edited August 21, 2013 by khunbillmex

[Drew345]

This information has been gold, thanks to much.

I'm going to try to get a Bangkok Bank account when I visit Bangkok next month, not sure how that will go as a tourist though.

I'm also persuing the no-fee debit card option. My online ING bank was just bought out by Capital One, and they offer a no foreign fee Mastercard debit card. But is is mastercard, not visa. The fee schedule says that Capital One doesn't charge any foreign fee, but Mastercard MIGHT when they do the rate converstion. I hope mastercard gives rates as good as the VISA rates mentioned above. I'll just have to note the exchange rates and do a few withdrawalls to test.

Thanks again

[lopburi3]

There is no requirement to notify Bangkok Bank of any such action that I am aware of - you just instruct your US bank to transfer using ACH to the Bangkok Bank routing and your account number. That is all that is required and I have been done this for several years without any issues. I get an SMS notification from Bangkok Bank here of the amount/exchange rate/fee between 0800-1000 without any contact required.

[fletchsmile]

Sounds like a classic communication issue between Thailand and the US.

Actually MT103 is the most commonly used SWIFT communication people come across without realizing it. The MT + number just refers to the format of the message used by SWIFT. For laymen in English they often call it a "wire transfer".

So MT 103 / SWIFT/ wire transfer all effectively are referring to the same process

While I can sort of understand the Thai bank employee not using English layman terms, for a US banker sending these things to not to know that MT 103 is the SWIFT message format number that the whole world uses, and that other countries worldwide will refer to it as this, is somewhat poor for someone working in international fund transfers.

quote: "The US side then replied that they didn’t have any “MT103” number, only a “wire tracking number” - classic

As to what went wrong your guess is as good as anyone else's.

You cut down the chances of mistakes (and often fees) if you:

1) transfer from a bank that can actually clear in the country you are sending from and to a bank that can actually clear in the country you are sending to (so cuts out the correspondent bank middle man) - not always possible though as also depends on the currency

2) use the same bank in both countries, eg BKK Bank (NY) to BKK Bank Thailand; Stan Chart NY to Stan Chart Thailand

I recently did USD from Vietnam local bank, which sent it via Wells Fargo in the US and on to Stan Chart in Thailand. No fee for sending or receiving but the greedy middleman correspondent Wells Fargo took a cut. That said it was negligible in the scheme of things, and not something I do regularly, and preferable to sticking my Vietnamese debit/ATM card in a Thai bank machine dozens of times - probably over several days to exceed the daily limits and messing around, and probably getting a slightly worse exchange rate which outweighs the fee to boot. ATMs may be OK for small amounts of USD 1k at time, but for serious money SWIFT/MT103/wire transfer will usually be a good bet.

Cheers

Fletch

Edited August 23, 2013 by fletchsmile

[slipperylobster]

I am reading several ways...but after reading the fees involved....Wiring sounds very expensive, if you are doing it monthly.

I withdraw from an ATM and keep my money in the USA (I am not required to have a bank account here for my Visa...but many people are)

The fee is about 5 bucks a transaction. I do three a month, but the safety and convenience is well worth it. I do not care to enter a bank, take a number, fill out forms, and pray that everything works.

I understand that Aeon has no fees, (my bank charges an International Fee but it is miniscule) There are just a few Aeon Banks up here, and it was a nightmare when a failed withdrawal was charged, but not payed out (happened the second time). Took more than a month to get the amount put back into my bank...and guess what? My bank refused to speak to Aeon and Aeon refused to speak to my bank. I had to literally play middle man...both banks had requirements. Well, that cured me of ever using Aeon.... In 15 years, no other ATM made that same error. Just my luck...I supposed 2 or 3 Aeon ATM machines were just too many to keep serviced.

I tried a direct deposit using a routing number for BBK in New York city, with my girlfriends account number...that took 3 months to recover....nightmare. Only a hundred dollars though. As mentioned before, the name of the account was critical, and I had followed some erroneous advice.

I kind of like the idea of one poster who writes a check and waits 30 days to clear.... but I would need to know the charges and rates he is getting.

Bottom line..... Lived overseas 18 years with a U.S Atm card. It was always about the same fee for wiring/direct deposit (XOOM and Western Union are convient if yoiu use their online websites for emergencies. The service is immediate..however the exchange rate is not good. That is my backup) I am quite happy with my ATM card, regardless of the 5 buck fee.