China court rejects Bo Xilai appeal, upholds life sentence

[webfact]

China court rejects Bo Xilai appeal, upholds life sentence

JINAN, China (AFP) - A Chinese court on Friday rejected fallen politician Bo Xilai's appeal against his conviction and confirmed his life sentence, state media reported, a ruling likely to seal his fate as authorities look to close a damaging scandal.

"The Shandong high court rejected the appeal and upheld the first instance life sentence verdict on Bo Xilai's bribery, embezzlement and abuse of power case," the official Xinhua news agency said on a verified account on Sina Weibo, a Chinese equivalent of Twitter.

Until 2012 Bo headed the southwestern megacity of Chongqing and was one of China's highest-ranked politicians.

Chinese courts are tightly controlled by the ruling Communist party. Security was heavy around the courthouse in Jinan, the capital of the eastern province of Shandong, with hundreds of police officers stationed every few metres around the building and the surrounding streets blocked off, with nearby shops closed.

A few minutes before the hearing was due to start a convoy of cars and minibuses with darkened windows passed by and entered the compound, suggesting that Bo had arrived.

Bo was last month condemned to life imprisonment on charges of bribery, embezzlement and abuse of power, after a spectacular downfall which exposed infighting within the Communist party ahead of a once in a decade transition of power.

The courts have no further obligation to reconsider his case after the appeal, lawyers said, and Bo is unlikely to appear in public again.

He was not present for the consideration of his appeal, which took place earlier this month in a "closed hearing", a lawyer with direct knowledge of the case told AFP.

Friday's court decision "will be the final verdict. After that, the process is over", the lawyer said.

According to Chinese law, Bo will not be able to lodge any further formal appeals, and while he can submit a "petition" to China's supreme court it is not required to take further action.

Analysts have said that the verdict against Bo was decided as a result of backroom bargaining between elite members of the Communist party - some of whom are still thought to be allies of his.

"From the beginning, the verdict was not totally the court's decision... it's very likely that top leaders played a role," said He Weifang, a law professor at Peking University.

Bo, whose father was one of Communist China's "Eight Immortals", its most prominent revolutionary leaders, was ousted last year after a lurid scandal which saw his wife convicted of the murder of a British businessman.

Bo's trial in August revealed a lifestyle far in excess of what Communist Party officials on modest salaries should be able to afford, with evidence of bribes from rich businessmen, including a close associate who bought his family a villa in France.

His defiance over the course of the hearings astonished a public unfamiliar with the open airing of top-level intrigue and was in stark contrast to previous Chinese political trials, in which most defendants have humbly confessed their crimes in opaque court proceedings.

Bo's populist policies in Chongqing won him supporters across China, but his openly ambitious approach also alienated other top party leaders, who saw it as harking back to a bygone era of strongman rule.

The decision comes as the party attempts to show it is cracking down on corruption and government waste.


-- (c) Copyright AFP 2013-10-25

[Jay Sata]

Bo and his nasty scheming wife are paying for their past arrogance.

They amassed a fortune when he was mayor of Dalian but greed led to the killing

of UK businessman Neil Heywood.

[Credo]

It's good to see China taking a tough stance on corruption. I hope that Thailand can take a lesson from their playbook.

[LawrenceChee]

It's good to see China taking a tough stance on corruption.   I hope that Thailand can take a lesson from their playbook.   

Nanjing mayor is the next in investigation. With the prosperity of the Zhejiang region, let's see what the findings are for him.

Sent from my iPod touch using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Credo]

There are only two things that really scare the poop out of me, one is getting into trouble with the Chinese gov't and the other is getting into trouble with the IRS.

I am not always a big fan of the Chinese gov't, and they certainly have plenty of reason to be criticized, but when they put their mind to solving a problem, it's a pretty impressive job.

I don't think I'd want to be a corrupt gov't official in China these days, that's for sure.

[Baerboxer]

It's good to see China taking a tough stance on corruption. I hope that Thailand can take a lesson from their playbook.

I'm sure they will. Once the amnesty bill has been passed and the boss is back the corruption investigations will be able to start against all the Dems and their supporters in earnest.

It's impressive to see the strides little sister has made in eradicating corruption from her government

[jackhardoon]

it is amazing THAILAND once again we in thailand live and let live our court systems that definitely need a rethink about politician and their misdemeanour's while Bo Xilia, did similar things as far as greediness as our Thaksin Sh.....tniwat who is the man behind all this trouble in our country . We should take the sample from China and terminate with extreme prejudice for all those who was caught with their hands in the till of the Thai people that deserves a better government not a club for social misfit

bless us all till we see the light of change. It needs to happen fast ???????!!!!111111

[boomerangutang]

Bo's trial in August revealed a lifestyle far in excess of what Communist Party officials on modest salaries should be able to afford, with evidence of bribes from rich businessmen, including a close associate who bought his family a villa in France.

Why does it take a big deal trial to reveal such things? I can understand that no Chinese big shots will tell the truth about their riches, but is there no investigative prowess there? Or perhaps, all Chinese just docilely accept that all their political bosses amass money in nefarious ways, and the little people should just look the other way, because no one can do anything about it anyway.

Edited October 25, 2013 by boomerangutang

[Publicus]

This is an instance in which a person, Bo Xilai, is gone but the force, the movement, of which he was a leader continues, which is bad news for the good guys.

The powerful Bo in in prison for life - for life - primarily because he and the then head of security Zhou Yong Kang, who has been disappeared, had been planning a coup against Xi Jinping for next year.

The coup was revealed by Bo's alarmed former Chongqing police chief, Wang Li Jun, when the uncooperative Wang attempted to defect to the United States in 2011 by slipping away from Bo's grip to the US Consulate General Office in neighboring Chengdu in the middle of the night. Alas, however, Wang's timing was poor: He was denied asylum as he spilled the beans at the Consulate because then vice president Xi simultaneously was en route to the US to visit with Prez Obama.

Bo is a Maoist whose father was a general in Mao's inner circle, and Bo has the loyalty of a number of generals and a number of high CCP officials. One of Bo's principal supporters is the commander of the 13th Army corps of Chongqing, where Bo was mayor and party chief.

The 85 year old former president Jiang Xi Min, a Maoist who ultimately had to bend to Deng's reforms while at the top, had been in league with Bo - Jiang in fact is the chief reactionary in the CCP-PRC, having failed as behind the scenes leader of an unsuccessful 2006 coup attempt against then president Hu Jin Tao.

Bo lost the battle to carry the mantle of Mao to Xi Jinping in a strictly internal CCP battle of personalities, power politics, control over corruption.

Someone mentioned the mayor of Nanking is next to be prosecuted for corruption, which is the present plan but always subject to change as there are a huge mass of candidates for Xi and his personal loyalists to target for their own political purposes. Another unexpected turn of events could occur at any time to make someone else the political target of the moment.

The list of CCP officials Xi and his personal loyalists can politically or personally prosecute under the guise of fighting corruption is virtually endless. The CCP's defining problem of massive and endemic corruption however will continue to condemn it to its own people and preclude the successful development of the CCP-PRC.

[Publicus]

Bo's trial in August revealed a lifestyle far in excess of what Communist Party officials on modest salaries should be able to afford, with evidence of bribes from rich businessmen, including a close associate who bought his family a villa in France.

Why does it take a big deal trial to reveal such things? I can understand that no Chinese big shots will tell the truth about their riches, but is there no investigative prowess there? Or perhaps, all Chinese just docilely accept that all their political bosses amass money in nefarious ways, and the little people should just look the other way, because no one can do anything about it anyway.

The Chinese have always accepted that their local and provincial officials are compulsively corrupt, self-serving, uncaring. This remains true of CCP local and provincial officials and the PRChinese sheeple know it.

The Chinese people however have believed their emperors and national leaders have always had the best interests of China at heart and foremost in mind, despite some naturally occurring corruption.

The PRChinese sheeple had believed this to be true of the CCP as well, at least until recently. The PRChinese have come to recognize that the corruption common to local and regional officials is also true in spades of the national leaders in Beijing, who have enormously bigger bucks to play with.

The difference between the beliefs of the past and the present is the internet. Word spreads fast among the young PRChinese netizens who are better educated and more mature, even sophisticated, than previous generations who did not have access to any such means of mass communication media.

PRC netizens for example follow the sordid adventures of Bo Xilai's graduate school son at Harvard's Kennedy School of Government, Bo Gua Gua, formerly of Harrow and Oxford, and his Ferrari. While on breaks in Beijing, the dapper Bo Gua Gua dated a dubious daughter of then US Ambassador John Huntsman. As reported by the Wall Street Journal, Bo Gua Gua since his father's arrest, and his mother's commuted death sentence, has hired private security guards to "escort" him from his $3000 a month luxury apartment a few blocks from the Harvard campus.

PRC netizens however have become constrained by the law pronounced this year by the CCP that netizens who "spread rumors," on the internet are subject to arrest and punishment. Rumors are of course anything true, or even half true, of CCP officials in Beijing. For about a year now, any PRChinese netizen going to what they call a TVF style Discussion Board, such as Weibo and others, have to also post their national ID number and code. Using this and the netizen's IP Address, the CCP can thus trace your "rumor" and deal with you accordingly.

If your "rumor" is read by 5000 or more other netizens, the CCP comes after you.

Edited October 25, 2013 by Publicus

[LawrenceChee]

Bo's trial in August revealed a lifestyle far in excess of what Communist Party officials on modest salaries should be able to afford, with evidence of bribes from rich businessmen, including a close associate who bought his family a villa in France.

 

Why does it take a big deal trial to reveal such things? I can understand that no Chinese big shots will tell the truth about their riches, but is there no investigative prowess there? Or perhaps, all Chinese just docilely accept that all their political bosses amass money in nefarious ways, and the little people should just look the other way, because no one can do anything about it anyway.

It's a indifference in culture where Asians in general regard the politicians as a necessary evil more than anything useful

As long as the abuse is not rampant, they take it with a pinch of salt and rather not bother with the day to day day running of the government which at times frustrates the western counterparts who view this indifference as oppression

However once it crosses the line of "fair corruption" (if this is the most politically correct statement) , citizens react thru the web and the government takes the right action to being it back down where people ignore the hubris and carry on with on with what they feel is most important

In fact ...it's interesting to note of recent developments in the last 2 year in Singapore .

Singapore consistently ranks among the top 3 corrupt free governance in the world and yet on the last 2 years have been hit with repeated cases of misappropriation of funds, sex for commercial contacts at the highest level of civil service.

The latest case involves as officer of protocol for the government who mishandled almost 600k in fund used for purchased as gifts for overseas visitors over pineapple tarts ?

So being a realistic man...and not in any way to condone or support corruption ...if in a country that pays the highest wages to their civil servants in the world to battle corruption still faces corruption at its higher level, do we honestly believe the CCP will be squeaky clean ?

I for one look at the bigger picture ...if they uplift the country to a respectable level of living standards while being an engaged international member of the world community , I am willing to accept the reality of corruption happenings as long as the major cases are on trial and flat with severely ...the smaller ones let's just leave it that it is part and parcel of life in Asia.....Phuket Airport Taxi or Jet Ski anyone ?

Sent from my iPod touch using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Publicus]

Bo's trial in August revealed a lifestyle far in excess of what Communist Party officials on modest salaries should be able to afford, with evidence of bribes from rich businessmen, including a close associate who bought his family a villa in France.

Why does it take a big deal trial to reveal such things? I can understand that no Chinese big shots will tell the truth about their riches, but is there no investigative prowess there? Or perhaps, all Chinese just docilely accept that all their political bosses amass money in nefarious ways, and the little people should just look the other way, because no one can do anything about it anyway.

It's a indifference in culture where Asians in general regard the politicians as a necessary evil more than anything useful

As long as the abuse is not rampant, they take it with a pinch of salt and rather not bother with the day to day day running of the government which at times frustrates the western counterparts who view this indifference as oppression

However once it crosses the line of "fair corruption" (if this is the most politically correct statement) , citizens react thru the web and the government takes the right action to being it back down where people ignore the hubris and carry on with on with what they feel is most important

In fact ...it's interesting to note of recent developments in the last 2 year in Singapore .

Singapore consistently ranks among the top 3 corrupt free governance in the world and yet on the last 2 years have been hit with repeated cases of misappropriation of funds, sex for commercial contacts at the highest level of civil service.

The latest case involves as officer of protocol for the government who mishandled almost 600k in fund used for purchased as gifts for overseas visitors over pineapple tarts ?

So being a realistic man...and not in any way to condone or support corruption ...if in a country that pays the highest wages to their civil servants in the world to battle corruption still faces corruption at its higher level, do we honestly believe the CCP will be squeaky clean ?

I for one look at the bigger picture ...if they uplift the country to a respectable level of living standards while being an engaged international member of the world community , I am willing to accept the reality of corruption happenings as long as the major cases are on trial and flat with severely ...the smaller ones let's just leave it that it is part and parcel of life in Asia.....Phuket Airport Taxi or Jet Ski anyone ?

Sent from my iPod touch using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Yeah, well.

Bo Xilai is in prison for life while his son drives a Ferrari, graduated Harrow, Oxford, is a grad student at Harvard, lives in a $3000 a month apartment.

Bo's wife was given a commuted death sentence for the murder of UK businessman Neil Heywood who died of poisoned cocktails for threatening Bo's son via contacts in the UK and USA due to business conflicts with Bo and wife.

Since the subject has been presented, let's look at some of the Transparency International Corruption Index of the CCP-PRC contrasted to that of Singapore. The following data are the most recent, which means either 2011 or 2012 as applicable.

Corruption: The CCP-PRC ranks 80th most corrupt of 176 countries examined; Score 38/100. Singapore is 5th in corruption of the 176 countries; Score: 87/100. (Thailand: Rank is 88th and Score is 37).

Bribe Payers Index: CCP is 27th worst of 28 countries studied, Score: 6.5/10. Singapore is 8th worst of the 28 countries examined, Score: 8.3/10. (Thailand: Not scored or ranked.)

Budget Openness: CCP is ranked "Scant or None" while Singapore is ranked 6th best of the 71 governments examined. (Thailand not examined.)

Control of Corruption: CCP Score is 33/100 while Singapore scores at 99/100. (Thailand scores at 47/100.)

There are instances of individual cases of corruption everywhere, anywhere. The issue is the norm - what is the norm? Citing individual instances is petty, meaningless. What matters is the normal patterns and practices of the place and its elites.

The everyday sheeple of the CCP-PRC (and the people of Thailand) are disgusted by it all, repulsed; find it sickening. Having spent time in each country, however, I'd say the PRChinese are more likely than are the Thais to eventually do something about it. The PRChinese really demand much better of their republican leaders and elites.

[folium]

This is an instance in which a person, Bo Xilai, is gone but the force, the movement, of which he was a leader continues, which is bad news for the good guys.

It is so nice (irony-free comment) to see that you recognize there are some "good guys" in China after all.

[Publicus]

This is an instance in which a person, Bo Xilai, is gone but the force, the movement, of which he was a leader continues, which is bad news for the good guys.

It is so nice (irony-free comment) to see that you recognize there are some "good guys" in China after all.

Some of my personal best friends in the CCP-PRC were and remain among the "good guys," sure. Since Einstein it's been clear that everything is relative, however.

So, conversely, too many were among the "bad guys," the ethnic fenqing especially and in particular, to include some who are just simple minded ethnic nationalists.

It's interesting tho that even the America detesting fenqing and some of the otherwise fiercest nationalists and I still could communicate and interact. It sometimes was and remains awkward, but they and I had and continue to have a good deal of positive personal and professional interaction.

It's the old truism of personal relations and personal relationships, face to face knowing one another and respecting the legitimacy of each human , each human being. Tuffer for them than for me, actually. But the PRChinese, to include the CCP, remain fascinated by an American more than by any other Western nationality. So they tolerated me, explored my thoughts and values, and I was pleased to cooperate and to reciprocate.

The worst shock however was learning of the fenqing. Horrible, ugly minded, impenetrable. Uncompromising in the absolute. Won't listen, won't discuss. It's open and shut - the despicable United States must be destroyed. Japan too. The United States has come along to disturb China's 5000 year old world. Unacceptable. The fenqing are unimaginably awful. One has to experience the fenqing to believe it.

Edited October 25, 2013 by Publicus

[LawrenceChee]

Justice is a lot quicker in China. I just read they are finally planning for the pre trial of some 9/11 suspects in Jan 2015 after more than a decade of delay.

As for the fenqing mentioned, when one visits any country , there is always a very small group of anti-haters (whatever they hate is a variety) and the correct way is to politely excuse yourself and leave and never be confrontational

I just made mention on this because in all my years of travel in China , I never was invited to meet any of them or met any while I was visiting or traveling in the many regions.

Indeed if one just walks around discovering China many cultural aspects, I would think the odds if meeting any of them is really really really really like really really really really low.

Anyone that visited can concur ?

Sent from my iPod touch using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[simple1]

Bo's trial in August revealed a lifestyle far in excess of what Communist Party officials on modest salaries should be able to afford, with evidence of bribes from rich businessmen, including a close associate who bought his family a villa in France.

Why does it take a big deal trial to reveal such things? I can understand that no Chinese big shots will tell the truth about their riches, but is there no investigative prowess there? Or perhaps, all Chinese just docilely accept that all their political bosses amass money in nefarious ways, and the little people should just look the other way, because no one can do anything about it anyway.

It's a indifference in culture where Asians in general regard the politicians as a necessary evil more than anything useful

As long as the abuse is not rampant, they take it with a pinch of salt and rather not bother with the day to day day running of the government which at times frustrates the western counterparts who view this indifference as oppression

However once it crosses the line of "fair corruption" (if this is the most politically correct statement) , citizens react thru the web and the government takes the right action to being it back down where people ignore the hubris and carry on with on with what they feel is most important

In fact ...it's interesting to note of recent developments in the last 2 year in Singapore .

Singapore consistently ranks among the top 3 corrupt free governance in the world and yet on the last 2 years have been hit with repeated cases of misappropriation of funds, sex for commercial contacts at the highest level of civil service.

The latest case involves as officer of protocol for the government who mishandled almost 600k in fund used for purchased as gifts for overseas visitors over pineapple tarts ?

So being a realistic man...and not in any way to condone or support corruption ...if in a country that pays the highest wages to their civil servants in the world to battle corruption still faces corruption at its higher level, do we honestly believe the CCP will be squeaky clean ?

I for one look at the bigger picture ...if they uplift the country to a respectable level of living standards while being an engaged international member of the world community , I am willing to accept the reality of corruption happenings as long as the major cases are on trial and flat with severely ...the smaller ones let's just leave it that it is part and parcel of life in Asia.....Phuket Airport Taxi or Jet Ski anyone ?

Sent from my iPod touch using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Yeah, well.

Bo Xilai is in prison for life while his son drives a Ferrari, graduated Harrow, Oxford, is a grad student at Harvard, lives in a $3000 a month apartment.

Bo's wife was given a commuted death sentence for the murder of UK businessman Neil Heywood who died of poisoned cocktails for threatening Bo's son via contacts in the UK and USA due to business conflicts with Bo and wife.

Since the subject has been presented, let's look at some of the Transparency International Corruption Index of the CCP-PRC contrasted to that of Singapore. The following data are the most recent, which means either 2011 or 2012 as applicable.

Corruption: The CCP-PRC ranks 80th most corrupt of 176 countries examined; Score 38/100. Singapore is 5th in corruption of the 176 countries; Score: 87/100. (Thailand: Rank is 88th and Score is 37).

Bribe Payers Index: CCP is 27th worst of 28 countries studied, Score: 6.5/10. Singapore is 8th worst of the 28 countries examined, Score: 8.3/10. (Thailand: Not scored or ranked.)

Budget Openness: CCP is ranked "Scant or None" while Singapore is ranked 6th best of the 71 governments examined. (Thailand not examined.)

Control of Corruption: CCP Score is 33/100 while Singapore scores at 99/100. (Thailand scores at 47/100.)

There are instances of individual cases of corruption everywhere, anywhere. The issue is the norm - what is the norm? Citing individual instances is petty, meaningless. What matters is the normal patterns and practices of the place and its elites.

The everyday sheeple of the CCP-PRC (and the people of Thailand) are disgusted by it all, repulsed; find it sickening. Having spent time in each country, however, I'd say the PRChinese are more likely than are the Thais to eventually do something about it. The PRChinese really demand much better of their republican leaders and elites.

According to the Global Financial Integrity Group about US$2.83 trillion was illegally transfered out of China from 2005 to 2011. Is it correct to say the major players are only prosecuted if they step on someones toes in political power plays?

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSBRE94I0CB20130519?i=2&irpc=932

[boomerangutang]

The worst shock however was learning of the fenqing. Horrible, ugly minded, impenetrable. Uncompromising in the absolute. Won't listen, won't discuss. It's open and shut - the despicable United States must be destroyed. Japan too. The United States has come along to disturb China's 5000 year old world. Unacceptable. The fenqing are unimaginably awful. One has to experience the fenqing to believe it.

Fenqing. My new 'word for the day.' Sounds like they may even be worse than American red neck racists, if that's possible. I hope there aren't any fenqing in the Politburo.

Brought to mind: After the Americans dropped two A-bombs on Japan, the emperor and nearly all top Japanese generals conceded they had to give up. However, there was on officer (we could call him the Japanese equiv. of fenqing) who was determined to resist - to the death of the last Japanese man or woman. He tried taking over the room in the radio station which was designated to make the announcement, with the emperor's own voice recording (first time heard by his underlings). But he was kept from doing so, just barely.

[Publicus]

Justice is a lot quicker in China. I just read they are finally planning for the pre trial of some 9/11 suspects in Jan 2015 after more than a decade of delay.

As for the fenqing mentioned, when one visits any country , there is always a very small group of anti-haters (whatever they hate is a variety) and the correct way is to politely excuse yourself and leave and never be confrontational

I just made mention on this because in all my years of travel in China , I never was invited to meet any of them or met any while I was visiting or traveling in the many regions.

Indeed if one just walks around discovering China many cultural aspects, I would think the odds if meeting any of them is really really really really like really really really really low.

Anyone that visited can concur ?

Sent from my iPod touch using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Justice in the CCP-PRC?! Justice is completely absent in the CCP-PRC. The CCP is to justice as military music is to music. And, indeed, everything is quick or quicker in the CCP-PRC, to include the burning flameout.

You well know of the fenqing but you haven't met any in all of your visits or travels in the CCP-PRC. So how do you know you didn't meet any fenqing? I'm confident people didn't meet you and initiate the subject, to specifically say they're not fenqing. I'd be confident you didn't ask. I'm confident you get my drift, i.e., your business affairs, settings and venues, circumstances, were not conducive to fenqing talk.

And what is fenqing talk?

The fenqing hate corruption but like Bo Xilai and they like Xi Jinping, among other disciples of Mao.

From Wiki:

"Zhonghua nationalist websites tend to style themselves as "ultra-left socialist", venerating Mao as an anti-colonial icon over his capitalist successors, and identify Japan and US as their prime enemies,^{[citation needed]} and focus very heavily on the goal of militarily invading Taiwan.

"Most fenqing are highly skeptical about the free market and often blame it as the source of corruption, social inequalities and the weakening of the central government. They also generally perceive the government as being too nice or ineffectual in a variety of issues, such as the Taiwan Straits, relations with Japan or the U.S., and Tibetan and Xinjiang independence."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fenqing

The fenqing make the tea party or extreme right wingers in the United States look like boy scouts. The fenqing are fierce, profoundly so. Ultra-rightists in the US are zealots who over read the Constitution. The fenqing are entirely ethnic extremists rooted in 5000 years of being Chinese, i.e., superior.

And this is too precious:

Suggest one about fighting corruption. But I guess that comes after defeating your enemy.

Edited October 26, 2013 by Publicus

[boomerangutang]

Well, I hope the fenqing are no more successful, if they openly fight the 'imperialists' (real or imagined), than the Boxers were in their rebellion.

[LawrenceChee]

If you let me have the address where you snapped this picture I will gladly drop by on my next visit to have a chat with them

In the meantime while you do not yet set stand what I do for a living , it would be most socially polite not to make any inferences you cannot or do not know.

Sent from my iPod touch using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Publicus]

It's a indifference in culture where Asians in general regard the politicians as a necessary evil more than anything useful

As long as the abuse is not rampant, they take it with a pinch of salt and rather not bother with the day to day day running of the government which at times frustrates the western counterparts who view this indifference as oppression

However once it crosses the line of "fair corruption" (if this is the most politically correct statement) , citizens react thru the web and the government takes the right action to being it back down where people ignore the hubris and carry on with on with what they feel is most important

In fact ...it's interesting to note of recent developments in the last 2 year in Singapore .

Singapore consistently ranks among the top 3 corrupt free governance in the world and yet on the last 2 years have been hit with repeated cases of misappropriation of funds, sex for commercial contacts at the highest level of civil service.

The latest case involves as officer of protocol for the government who mishandled almost 600k in fund used for purchased as gifts for overseas visitors over pineapple tarts ?

So being a realistic man...and not in any way to condone or support corruption ...if in a country that pays the highest wages to their civil servants in the world to battle corruption still faces corruption at its higher level, do we honestly believe the CCP will be squeaky clean ?

I for one look at the bigger picture ...if they uplift the country to a respectable level of living standards while being an engaged international member of the world community , I am willing to accept the reality of corruption happenings as long as the major cases are on trial and flat with severely ...the smaller ones let's just leave it that it is part and parcel of life in Asia.....Phuket Airport Taxi or Jet Ski anyone ?

Sent from my iPod touch using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Yeah, well.

Bo Xilai is in prison for life while his son drives a Ferrari, graduated Harrow, Oxford, is a grad student at Harvard, lives in a $3000 a month apartment.

Bo's wife was given a commuted death sentence for the murder of UK businessman Neil Heywood who died of poisoned cocktails for threatening Bo's son via contacts in the UK and USA due to business conflicts with Bo and wife.

Since the subject has been presented, let's look at some of the Transparency International Corruption Index of the CCP-PRC contrasted to that of Singapore. The following data are the most recent, which means either 2011 or 2012 as applicable.

Corruption: The CCP-PRC ranks 80th most corrupt of 176 countries examined; Score 38/100. Singapore is 5th in corruption of the 176 countries; Score: 87/100. (Thailand: Rank is 88th and Score is 37).

Bribe Payers Index: CCP is 27th worst of 28 countries studied, Score: 6.5/10. Singapore is 8th worst of the 28 countries examined, Score: 8.3/10. (Thailand: Not scored or ranked.)

Budget Openness: CCP is ranked "Scant or None" while Singapore is ranked 6th best of the 71 governments examined. (Thailand not examined.)

Control of Corruption: CCP Score is 33/100 while Singapore scores at 99/100. (Thailand scores at 47/100.)

There are instances of individual cases of corruption everywhere, anywhere. The issue is the norm - what is the norm? Citing individual instances is petty, meaningless. What matters is the normal patterns and practices of the place and its elites.

The everyday sheeple of the CCP-PRC (and the people of Thailand) are disgusted by it all, repulsed; find it sickening. Having spent time in each country, however, I'd say the PRChinese are more likely than are the Thais to eventually do something about it. The PRChinese really demand much better of their republican leaders and elites.

According to the Global Financial Integrity Group about US$2.83 trillion was illegally transfered out of China from 2005 to 2011. Is it correct to say the major players are only prosecuted if they step on someones toes in political power plays?

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSBRE94I0CB20130519?i=2&irpc=932

It's pretty complex so I'd have to condense it as best I can, then others can make their own observations, analysis, thoughts, and relate any personal experiences they might have.

My own experience in the CCP-PRC is in the exact geographic area discussed in your link - I've spent time in every city mentioned, lived in one, Guangzhou, four years. The province, Guangdong, is the wealthiest province of the PRChina, perhaps on a par with S Korea circa 2000, which is pretty good.

One might not recognize it by reading the link, but Guangdong (GD) province is reform central in the CCP-PRC, in economics, politics and government. Its former and radical governor (and party chief) Wang Yang is presently 3rd vice premier (of three) who last year managed to clear GD for Beijing with clean hands, meaning his pockets got filled but were never deep.

China always has been a loose confederation of strongly independent minded regions (starting with the North-South divide at the Yangtze River).

Accordingly, Bo Xilai was king of the huge southwestern metropolis of Chongqing and who, with deep pockets and a wheelbarrow to boot, is the antithesis of Wang Yang. Wang won't make it to the Standing Committee (reduced to seven members from nine by Xi Jinping), but he won't spend life in prison either, as will Bo. The key difference is that Bo was interested in maximum money and maximum and sweeping power, while Wang remains, as always, interested in significant power and some money.

So I say to reiterate, that's the difference.

That is, you can be a politically radical Wang Yang and jockey and maneover for power as much as you can manage to do, and get for you and your allies some of the bucks that come with the process and the territory, but you can't go for control over all the money and grab all the power, which is Bo's big boo boo..

And Bo got caught plotting a coup besides, working outside of the regular order of things.

Bo's camp hates Wang but couldn't get allies outside its own grouping because Wang doesn't, well, yes, step on toes. Wang's limits are his radical reformist ideology, whereas Bo's downfall are his radical and forceful neo-Maoist ideology combined with his boundless lust to control all the money.

As with Bo, Xi Jinping is a Maoist too but Xi was put on the succession track for numerous reasons, chief among them is that he guaranteed reformers and fellow reactionaries alike their fair slices of the money pie and no purges of political opposites, ie, reformers or of the many fence sitters. Consequently, Xi is in Zongnanhai, Beijing's Kremlin, while Bo is in prison for life. Bo and his crew wanted it all, the money and the strong and uncompromising imposition of his Maoist ideological bent. Even Xi opposed that.

Xi and PM Li Kejiang are opposites but they're the new team running the CCP-PRC. Li is working (feverishly) to try to restructure the economy to try to make it viable and sustainable, while Xi is politically and culturally irredentist. The key to the workability of Li and Xi at the top is that they are two cooks in two different kitchens, two money changers in two different temples. It's sort of a church-state wall of separation and it is effective.

It's another question however whether they are working at cross purposes or that, because there isn't any overarching connector of authority or power, they are going off in differing and therefore incoherent directions.

Sorry for such a long winded reply, but your question invites a huge discussion of many elements, components, aspects. This post is pretty much the core of it however. Don't demand it all ideologically and concerning control of the money, and no wholesale purges.

Just play ball and keep your nose clean.

[Publicus]

Well, I hope the fenqing are no more successful, if they openly fight the 'imperialists' (real or imagined), than the Boxers were in their rebellion.

I've said the fenqing are fierce, ethnically motivated against the new upstart United States of America which during the past couple of centuries has come along to "disturb" China's 5000 year old world. There's nothing for the fenqing to discuss. The historical blip that is the US of A must be dispensed with and the world returned to its normal order as being obliged to the Middle Kingdom.

Period.

Accordingly, I'm afraid I have to note the Boxers did not have cyberwarfare capabilities. Nor did the Boxers develop technology to incapacitate US satellites in inner space, nor did the Boxers have nuclear weapons or biological weapons, the latter not being destructive of infrastructure if one can get away successfully with that in one strike.

With the United States gone, and throw in hated Japan too for good measure, the world will be China's oyster. That's the long and the short of it.

The fenqing. They keep the midnight oil burning at the Pentagon. Good thing we're always several steps ahead of 'em cause the Fen Qing believe the Nazis lost because they were too soft on their enemies.

If you let me have the address where you snapped this picture I will gladly drop by on my next visit to have a chat with them

In the meantime while you do not yet set stand what I do for a living , it would be most socially polite not to make any inferences you cannot or do not know.

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Actually, as far as I know the photo is not directly connected to the Fen Qing. It was with an article I read a while back. I couldn't resist throwing it in with the post. The name of the, can we say center, and the extensive use of English suggests the building is in the United States, as does the floodlight on the building at the upper right. But I dunno, sorry.

And aren't we self-righteous and sensitive. You'd said in more than one post you were involved in the Travel and Tourism Industry, or made some references to doing some activities in those respects, connected to property too. Whatever you post is in the public domain, but of course you know that. All the same, if it makes you less indignant, I won't again make any references to anything you might or might not do for a living.

[LawrenceChee]

It is always interesting to see the relationships between the Presidents and PM in China. Often you have a conflicting management style which appeals to the differing groups in China

The current team of Xi & Li is a good match rather similar to the old team of Hu Jin Tao and Wen Jia Bao.

While Hu was the leader , aloof and hard stance on many issues that Xi inherited, Wen was much like Li now ...the approachable one who spoke with the market leaders, attacked reforms and often the CCP rep to natural disasters as he had a more gentle touch that appealed to the Chinese and was commonly known as grandpa Li in affection.

I remembered the Sichuan earthquake and how Wen was there comforting the victims ...would be hard to see Hu doing that.

I call that a good play of the strengths ...I rarely see Presidents and Vice Presidents of other countries having such a nice tandem.... In fact I can think of a highly paid president that does almost nothing noteworthy...and nope he is not from the west.

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[LawrenceChee]

The venues where most businessman conduct our business is in hotels and restaurants and site visits of tourist areas, unsuitable for any protest groups as they feel out of place having not ordered a $20 pot of tea ( excluding tax ) in the lobby lounge

The moderates would have figured out that the hate groups are always a very small minority in the country and the more you ignore them, the smaller their platform gets and they stay irrelevant to the mainstream views.

Ever saw the Ku Klux at Walmart or Disneyland lately ...

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[boomerangutang]

KKK members do frequent the same big box stores as other Americans. When they're not in their pep rallies, they're pretty much like other Americans you might pass on the sidewalk or highway. However, don't get in an opinionated argument with them, particularly if one or more of their buddies are nearby, as they'd feel compelled to perform. They get offended and angry easily (and often carry guns), as I assume the fenqing and others with extreme right wing beliefs do.

Interesting though, if such people are completely out of their element (like if they visit a foreign country, which is rare), they won't get offended and angry so readily. They're much more tolerant of others when in unfamiliar territory. It's the people who they're similar with, but who have slightly different beliefs, that they have the biggest problems with. Example: Shiites and Sunnis, or Hell's Angels and Bandidos, Sharks and Jets (West Side Story).

[LawrenceChee]

KKK members do frequent the same big box stores as other Americans. When they're not in their pep rallies, they're pretty much like other Americans you might pass on the sidewalk or highway. However, don't get in an opinionated argument with them, particularly if one or more of their buddies are nearby, as they'd feel compelled to perform. They get offended and angry easily (and often carry guns), as I assume the fenqing and others with extreme right wing beliefs do.

Interesting though, if such people are completely out of their element (like if they visit a foreign country, which is rare), they won't get offended and angry so readily. They're much more tolerant of others when in unfamiliar territory. It's the people who they're similar with, but who have slightly different beliefs, that they have the biggest problems with. Example: Shiites and Sunnis, or Hell's Angels and Bandidos, Sharks and Jets (West Side Story).[/

quote]

U will probably feel safer in china then ...no folks carrying guns just because they think they should have the right to do so..so less odds of getting shot by a guy that has just gone off the <deleted> ...although a hammer will hurt just as much

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[Publicus]

The KKK is ultra-nationalist and are xenophobic so they don't go to live abroad. The don't welcome them fererners either.

Some analysis say the Fen Qing are China's KKK.

I'd say without a doubt the fenqing are far worse than the KKK.

Infinitely worse.

The PRChinese know the fenqing exist because the sheeple of the PRC feel their presence and influence every day, and see it in policy decisions.

The fenqing for example drove Hu Jin Tao to initiate territorial disputes with neighboring countries, the disputes we see today and which Xi Jinping is trying to withdraw from because they've been so damaging to the standing of the CCP-PRC throughout the Indo-Pacific strategic region. Xi can do this because he too is a Maoist, same as the Fen Qing.

Hu had no interest in initiating conflicts with neighboring countries of the region. He undertook to start the conflicts only under constant and heavy pressures from the fenqing supported strongly by the military.

The Fen Qing are awful, abysmal. They scare many PRChinese too.

[LawrenceChee]

I find it ludicrous that it can be assumed a small group of right extremists can influence the president of china into making all the decisions that was mentioned be interesting to see the supporting links

In the meantime ...an interesting read into Japan ...by the same token, I guess these are the guys behind Abe's recent rhetorics although I think more likely or not it was Hullo Kitty from Sanrioland who was feeling the snub from shanghai who picked Mickey over her eternal cuteness

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_extremism_in_Japan

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[Publicus]

By all accounts, the CCP brought an unprecedented razzmatazz to the Bo Xi Lai guilty until proved innocent trial.

Bo was allowed to defend himself without much interruption and without being silenced, which is a break from CCP jurisprudence which has the policy and practice of the judge regularly limiting and silencing the defense while allowing the prosecution to speak freely. Bo even said in the courtroom he thought the judge had done a good job.

The judge, Wang Xu Guang did break new ground but that's not a news bulletin. The US trained Wang has been a leading innovater in the judicial system from a public relations perspective and in allowing the defendant to speak in his defense, not that actually allowing a defendant to speak in his defense changes the guilty until proved innocent presumption - it doesn't.

Wang runs a probably unique in the PRC online courtroom, which is why his lowly municipal court was chosen by the CCP as the venue of the Bo trial. It could seem Wang got some eccentric ideas while earning his law degree at the University of Illinois, Urbana Champaign, a longtime favorite campus among PRChinese who study abroad..

Wang's innovations include citizens being able to email to him, to file complaints by email, and to get transcripts of trials (censored and redacted, but accessible). Because of Wang's technology courthouse, the CCP chose it as the venue because the Boyz in Beijing wanted to send online internet feeds of the corruption trial proceedings to the PRC's Twitter equivalent, Weibo.

As always, however, Bo was judged guilty before the trial began and was even more guilty after the trial had concluded.

Which also means the CCP has done some window dressing, even opening the curtain just a bit, but that in fact nothing substantive has occurred.

It's more likely the case that Bo got these unprecedented privileges because of his power on the Politboro and because of his connections with the wealthy corporate types who have financed him in return for favors while Bo was mayor of the high tech Dalian Municipality and then as king of the huge metropolis of Chongqing.

It took the powers that be 15 months to get Bo into a courtroom after his arrest. That's a long period of negotiating and horse trading.

[folium]

The KKK is ultra-nationalist and are xenophobic so they don't go to live abroad. The don't welcome them fererners either.

Some analysis say the Fen Qing are China's KKK.

I'd say without a doubt the fenqing are far worse than the KKK.

Infinitely worse.

The PRChinese know the fenqing exist because the sheeple of the PRC feel their presence and influence every day, and see it in policy decisions.

The fenqing for example drove Hu Jin Tao to initiate territorial disputes with neighboring countries, the disputes we see today and which Xi Jinping is trying to withdraw from because they've been so damaging to the standing of the CCP-PRC throughout the Indo-Pacific strategic region. Xi can do this because he too is a Maoist, same as the Fen Qing.

Hu had no interest in initiating conflicts with neighboring countries of the region. He undertook to start the conflicts only under constant and heavy pressures from the fenqing supported strongly by the military.

The Fen Qing are awful, abysmal. They scare many PRChinese too.

Quite how are the Fen Qing worse than the KKK? Are you just talking about the present versions of KKK, because the KKK post the Civil War and it's second incarnation in the 1920's was responsible for thousands of lynchings/murders, and the campaign against Civil Rights campaigners and others it detested in the 1950's &1960's resulted in dozens of further murders.

Has the Fen Qing murdered anyone? What evidence is there that the FQ influences Chinese govt policy? Is not more a case of the government using the FQ for some street thuggery and noisy protests?

Interesting take re the FQ below:

http://froogville.blogspot.co.uk/2009/03/how-to-be-fenqing.html