can Thai citizenship expire?

[jaideeguy]

A person I know was born in BKK, but with 2 foreign parents approximately 50 years ago. The person was granted a Thai passport and went abroad and got a passport from another country and let the Thai passport expire. The person now wants to return to LOS with rights to own land and officials are denying a Thai ID which is required to have the land registered in their name.

Can anyone loose their original Thai citizenship along with the right to own land in LOS??

Seems to me that if you are granted citizenship at birth, then it is for life and if you obtain a passport from another country, then you are lucky enough to hold dual citizenship with all the rights of both countries............true??

[samran]

No.

Having said that he won't be able to get an ID without having proof of thai citizenship. That means, his original birth certificate, and in the absence of that, confirmation from the last ampur where he was registered where there pulled his names off old records.

His situation is no different to some of my relatives, who left Thailand 40 plus years ago and had to come back trawling through district files and then get back on the house registry.

Any and all old ID he has should be bought with him to help with that search.

[Tywais]

Troll post removed.

[jaideeguy]

No.

Having said that he won't be able to get an ID without having proof of thai citizenship. That means, his original birth certificate, and in the absence of that, confirmation from the last ampur where he was registered where there pulled his names off old records.

His situation is no different to some of my relatives, who left Thailand 40 plus years ago and had to come back trawling through district files and then get back on the house registry.

Any and all old ID he has should be bought with him to help with that search.

So, Samran............you're saying that proof of birth in LOS will be proof of citizenship and they can get the Thai ID card?? Once the proof of birth or ampur documents are in hand, does it take a long time to get the ID??

And, to confirm, the Thai citizenship does not expire??

[ubonjoe]

No citizenship that I know of expires if you are out of the country where it is from.

[jaideeguy]

Is there much of a problem [waiting time] for the person obtaining a new Thai ID card once all the proper documents have been submitted??

Edited November 7, 2013 by jaideeguy

[samran]

No.

Having said that he won't be able to get an ID without having proof of thai citizenship. That means, his original birth certificate, and in the absence of that, confirmation from the last ampur where he was registered where there pulled his names off old records.

His situation is no different to some of my relatives, who left Thailand 40 plus years ago and had to come back trawling through district files and then get back on the house registry.

Any and all old ID he has should be bought with him to help with that search.

So, Samran............you're saying that proof of birth in LOS will be proof of citizenship and they can get the Thai ID card?? Once the proof of birth or ampur documents are in hand, does it take a long time to get the ID??

And, to confirm, the Thai citizenship does not expire??

- Thai citizenship does not expire.

- But at the same time, authorities aren't going to hand out documentation to someone who can't prove their bonafides.

Proof of birth in LOS is not automatically proof of citizenship, however, if born 50 years or so, then in all likelihood he is Thai by virtue of the fact that prior to the early 1970's birth on Thai soil automatically granted Thai citizenship, regardless of the nationality of parents.

It would be easier to know what documentation your friend has. His original Thai birth certificate would be very handy if he had it, as it woud state his nationality as 'Thai', and he could easily be put on a house book, then get the ID and then passport.

But if he has got nothing, he's going to have to start back at the ampur where he was born/last registered, and find proof of his last place or registration. This can take time, as records were hand written. He'd probably have to hire someone especially to dig through the files, as my aunt recently had do to.

Once that is done, he can be put on a current house registration, and then the ID is automatically issued as a result.

Edited November 7, 2013 by samran

[Mario2008]

No citizenship that I know of expires if you are out of the country where it is from.

Actually, my citizenship expires if out of country, but only if two conditions are met:

1. I must not hold a valid passport of my country for 10 years

and

2. I must also have another nationality as they can't make me stateless.

[Arkady]

This is a special case due to various aspects of the Nationality Act. It would be important to know if the parents were permanent residents of Thailand when he was born, as that could strengthen his claim to recover Thai nationality. Until December 1971 anyone born within the Kingdom of Thailand was automatically Thai regardless of the parents' immigration status but in December 1971 a revolutionary decree that became an amendment to the Nationality Act retroactively cancelled the Thai citizenship of anyone Thai through being born in Thailand to alien parents who were not both permanent residents at the time, unless given permission by the minister to remain Thai. At the time there were a significant number of petitions to retain Thai nationality by Thais in such circumstances and a many were approved. Since it was very easy to obtain permanent residence at that time, it is quite likely that his parents had it but proving that might be another matter.

Another issue is that under the Nationality Act anyone who is Thai by virtue of being born in Thailand to alien parents can have their Thai nationality revoked, if they stay abroad for more than five years or there is evidence that they are using their foreign father's nationality, or both. This is not automatic, though, and requires a special procedure and the revocation of nationality needs to be announced in the Royal Gazette to be final. Most of the people who have lost Thai nationality this way were ethnic Chinese and there may have been a specific policy in the past to target children of Chinese immigrants who went to China for study or other reasons and didn't come back within 5 years of reaching the age of majority at which time they were liable to revocation of Thai nationality.

OK, so the OP's acquaintance has probably not had his Thai nationality formality revoked, although he does qualify for this, if some one has it in for him. Thus he is still technically Thai. I am not sure what the rules are for those who lost their Thai nationality under the 1971 decree. I believe that they are all entitled to get it back again under the 2008 Nationality Act (and under certain cabinet resolutions prior to that) but it is not automatic and is up to the minister's discretion which is only applied, if they the applicant has been residing continuously in Thailand and has no other nationality. Some poor sods never got it back and are still stateless to this day. However, assuming the OP's acquaintance had a Thai passport that was issued or renewed later than December 1971, his Thai status relative to the revolutionary decree can probably be taken for granted. My feeling is that, if he is planning to to live in Thailand, he stands a good chance of being issued a Thai ID card and passport again. It is a laborious process and he will need some help from knowledgeable people. I have known a couple of people in this situation who got their ID cards after a two year process in which they were knocked back several times. So it requires a lot of patience and is unlikely to be successful, if he comes to Thailand for short visits. I met one guy who worked in Thailand for several years on a work permit and later learned enough Thai to realise that he had been registered as Thai on his birth certificate, as a result of being born in Thailand to alien parents before December 1971. After two years of persistence he got his ID card and began to pursue a work permit free existence in Thailand.