Tensions raise spectre of 'war' between protesters

[Lite Beer]

Tensions raise spectre of 'war' between protesters
The Sunday Nation

BANGKOK: -- Politicians warned yesterday that rising conflict between opponents and supporters of the government-backed amnesty bill had the potential to become a violent national crisis.

Election commissioner Sodsri Satayathum expressed concern that the ongoing protests against the bill and the government could escalate into a political crisis or even a civil war.

"I don't think anyone would want to see that kind of crisis happen in our country. I would like to call on the people involved to get together and talk so that the dispute can be solved and we can all get out of this crisis," Sodsri said.

She said the nation was now disunited, which was dangerous for the country in the face of an imminent ruling by the International Court of Justice on a territorial dispute between Thailand and Cambodia. "We should unite instead and tackle together the problems emerging outside the country. It's better than getting into a fight and killing each other."

Former senator Boonthan Dokthaisong said that as the anti-amnesty campaign was escalating into a drive to oust the government, there was a risk of a "war" between supporters of both disputing sides.

However, he asked the military not to interfere and to avoid causing more damage to the country, as has been the case in the past. The warning come amidst a rowing number of confrontations between opponents of the amnesty bill and mainly supporters of the ruling Pheu Thai Party.

Pheu Thai's Labour Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung yesterday said Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra would not dissolve the House of Representatives or resign from her post.

He claimed that the protests against the amnesty bill were being financed by business groups that are enemies of the politicians in power.

Yesterday, a group of Thai expatriates and students in the United Kingdom joined the protest by issuing a statement against the amnesty bill

-- The Nation 2013-11-10

[JRSoul]

"Chalerm Yoobamrung .... claimed that the protests against the amnesty bill were being financed by business groups that are enemies of the politicians in power."

Chalerm certainly has experience of this occurring. Not that it makes it true of the current situation.

Must add that the current protesters are much more accurately informed than the red shirts of 2010, and much less prone to violence.

[SlideRiceFC]

One might almost think they tried their best to ramrod the amnesty bill through precisely because they knew the possibility of major turmoil when the ICJ plonks down their ruling.

[MaiChai]

They said this would reconcile both sides but it appears to be doing the opposite. Painting the big white lie has backfired.

[EricBerg]

He (Pheu Thai's Labour Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung) claimed that the protests against the amnesty bill were being financed by business groups that are enemies of the politicians in power.

Here's some financing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izNHIDiBTT8

[waza]

"Pheu Thai's Labour Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung yesterday said Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra would not dissolve the House of Representatives or resign from her post. He claimed that the protests against the amnesty bill were being financed by business groups that are enemies of the politicians in power."

If business is funding an anti-government protest then it would be due to this administrations financial mismanagement of the Thai economy and wish to stop the rot before everyone is bankrupt. Plus if this is true then some of your redshirt friends are taking that funding.

"However, he asked the military not to interfere and to avoid causing more damage to the country, as has been the case in the past. The warning come amidst a rowing number of confrontations between opponents of the amnesty bill and mainly supporters of the ruling Pheu Thai Party."

These protest groups have been active for about a week with no violence or major confrontations until now. Now that the government is making veiled threats and Thaksin's has sent his paid stormtroopers to get involved, crying, "stay out the way military, let us do our democratic work"

Edited November 10, 2013 by waza

[EyesWideOpen]

He (Pheu Thai's Labour Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung) claimed that the protests against the amnesty bill were being financed by business groups that are enemies of the politicians in power.

Here's some financing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izNHIDiBTT8

I have always loved that classic vote buying clip by the red shirts !!! Makes the denial of vote

buying by PTP look pretty silly. On a side note, I was buying some auto parts from a large

parts business clearly owned by a wealthy Thai-Chinese family. A few of the older members were

intently watching televised footage of the protests. As I ordered the parts, he said he was not

sure if they would come on time from Bangkok due to fighting breaking out. I asked

him why he thought there would be fighting, as it just looked like protests to me. He smiled,

and said there would be fighting for sure. Either way it was an odd statement by him. Almost like

all this was planned, and those on the inside know what is coming.....

Edited November 10, 2013 by EyesWideOpen

[fredob43]

I can see this lot ending in yet another military take over ousting the lot of them.

[craigt3365]

A few posts have been removed from view. This is Thailand, so please, nothing seriously derogatory towards senior politicians.

[noitom]

Thais live in a total vacuum of denial. No one ever speaks about the true situation and they code around it. Thais understand the code but occasionally one of the belligerents doesn't sign properly or their sign gets misread. This looks like a case where the Thai secret coding is getting scrambled and they will blunder in to another confrontation.

[assayer]

He (Pheu Thai's Labour Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung) claimed that the protests against the amnesty bill were being financed by business groups that are enemies of the politicians in power.

Here's some financing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izNHIDiBTT8

The video above should be the most watched viral video in Thailand today!!!

If this isn't proving graft from the Red Shirts( ie:Thaksin,ie: government) then what is?????

[AleG]

They said this would reconcile both sides but it appears to be doing the opposite. Painting the big white lie has backfired.

Either PTP, collectivelly, didn´t know that unrest would erupt by the move, or they knew and pushed on anyway. So either they are morons or they put their own agendas above the well being of the country; in both cases that makes them unfit to govern and should step down.

On the other hand and for the long term good of the country it may be better for them to stay the full term, so that the disastrous results of their policies occur while they are at the helm and blame would be placed squarely on them. for example let the Rice Scheme collapse under their watch and see them having to stop the payments to the farmers and deal with a bank going under and whatever consequences for the financial sector.

It would be bad for Thailand, but it will help people see them for the inept crooks that they are and ruin (hopefully) their chances of being voted in again.

[orchidlady]

Don't forget the video where Thaksin mentions payment for the protestors!

[Robby nz]

I see it reported elsewhere that the reds are arranging transport to get their followers to BKK, for instance :

Anuwat Thinnarat who is supposed to be organizing things has said that there are 40 buses and 20 vans to bring people from Nakhon Ratchasima to BKK.

Wonder how many of the people on these buses and vans will be committed enough to pay their own fare.

Seems the local reds are going round trying to get people to go as well, good fun , good food, good music.

Hope no one digs up the grenade launchers as they have done in the south.

Did not see anywhere that any of the anti amnesty groups were organizing transport, seems the people in BKK are mostly locals and any outsiders have paid their own way.

[EyesWideOpen]

I am getting confused by the red shirts. Have they gone rogue ?? Have they finally come to their

senses and realized they have been shafted and pitched aside ? Hopefully they have, and will

work to throw this government out. If not, and this government is allowed to loot the country at

undreamed of levels, there are going to be some REALLY hard times ahead for the average

person in Isan.

[Siripon]

Posters should bear in mind the red shirt leaders have vested interests in organizing protesters.

1. To show the big boss they are important and need to be paid.

2. The blanket amnesty bill would have enabled Kwanchai to escape his conviction and 4 year jail sentence for violent assault in Udon a few years ago. That case is now in the Supreme court so he should be going down soon.

And of course other prominent red shirts such as Korkaeow voted for the blanket amnesty to save his own skin.

Cowards and utterly devoid of ideals.

[marcusd]

I can see this lot ending in yet another military take over ousting the lot of them.

not being in favour of coups... In this case I can see no,other way as both sides have no clue for a way forward for this country... Only a stampede to their stolen money from the Thai people.

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

[chainarong]

Well the man is on the ball, I'll give him that much, what do you think will happen between two opposing groups , a game of leggo.

[marcusd]

They said this would reconcile both sides but it appears to be doing the opposite. Painting the big white lie has backfired.

 

Either PTP, collectivelly, didn´t know that unrest would erupt by the move, or they knew and pushed on anyway. So either they are morons or they put their own agendas above the well being of the country; in both cases that makes them unfit to govern and should step down.

 

On the other hand and for the long term good of the country it may be better for them to stay the full term, so that the disastrous results of their policies occur while they are at the helm and blame would be placed squarely on them. for example let the Rice Scheme collapse under their watch and see them having to stop the payments to the farmers and deal with a bank going under and whatever consequences for the financial sector.

It would be bad for Thailand, but it will help people see them for the inept crooks that they are and ruin (hopefully) their chances of being voted in again.

farrang and a small few of business people care. At the next election. Nothing will change.

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

[bigbamboo]

Don't forget the video where Thaksin mentions payment for the protestors!

I once looked up the Thai translation for the word 'clang' on the internet and it just had this video.

[thaidel48]

He (Pheu Thai's Labour Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung) claimed that the protests against the amnesty bill were being financed by business groups that are enemies of the politicians in power.

Here's some financing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izNHIDiBTT8

I have always loved that classic vote buying clip by the red shirts !!! Makes the denial of vote

buying by PTP look pretty silly. On a side note, I was buying some auto parts from a large

parts business clearly owned by a wealthy Thai-Chinese family. A few of the older members were

intently watching televised footage of the protests. As I ordered the parts, he said he was not

sure if they would come on time from Bangkok due to fighting breaking out. I asked

him why he thought there would be fighting, as it just looked like protests to me. He smiled,

and said there would be fighting for sure. Either way it was an odd statement by him. Almost like

all this was planned, and those on the inside know what is coming.....

Been here 25 years and been through a few coupes n errr.. uprisings and there are always fights.

[craigt3365]

A few posts have been removed from view. This is Thailand, so please, nothing seriously derogatory towards senior politicians.

its about time moderators did not fear the speaking of the truth...regardless of this being Thailand. Naming and shaming politician crooks should be in. Let us take our chances.

We can always leave here you know.

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

It's not just us we are trying to protect. But thank you for your concern.

Name and shame is a huge deal here, and we either have to live with it, or leave. You are always free to stay or leave. Up to you.

[mrtoad]

I can see this lot ending in yet another military take over ousting the lot of them.

not being in favour of coups... In this case I can see no,other way as both sides have no clue for a way forward for this country... Only a stampede to their stolen money from the Thai people.

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

I have no idea what is now classed as derogatory, but sadly the laws protect so much of what is wrong. The mods do have a difficult job, and to be fair most of them do a pretty good job. Now, on from commenting.

Anyway Chalerm has 51 days to do what he promised, which is to behead himself.

Sadly, though this could get messy when Senior Politicians, who are allegedly corrupt clowns, possibly carrying out orders from a convicted criminal on a Montengran passport, who also happens to caddy the PM start issuing statements. All we need now is for Jatuporn to go on hunger strike, and the whole rice stocks are doomed.

[hellodolly]

"Pheu Thai's Labour Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung yesterday said Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra would not dissolve the House of Representatives or resign from her post. He claimed that the protests against the amnesty bill were being financed by business groups that are enemies of the politicians in power."

If business is funding an anti-government protest then it would be due to this administrations financial mismanagement of the Thai economy and wish to stop the rot before everyone is bankrupt. Plus if this is true then some of your redshirt friends are taking that funding.

"However, he asked the military not to interfere and to avoid causing more damage to the country, as has been the case in the past. The warning come amidst a rowing number of confrontations between opponents of the amnesty bill and mainly supporters of the ruling Pheu Thai Party."

These protest groups have been active for about a week with no violence or major confrontations until now. Now that the government is making veiled threats and Thaksin's has sent his paid stormtroopers to get involved, crying, "stay out the way military, let us do our democratic work"

An excellent point why would big business back the protestors if the present government was not harming the economy and in so doing harming big business.

It is in the interest of big business to see a good economy. There is videos out showing the red shirts passing out money to red shirts why when the anti amnesty protestors are so much bigger are there not videos of them receiving money for backing the anti amnesty bill. Could it be they are not receiving money?

why dosen't "Pheu Thai's Labour Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung" tell us where the money is coming from that is so freely being handed out to the red shirts?

The more the Government fights the anti amnesty protestors the more sure the people are that the government should step down. the Government is trying to avoid it all by whipping up Nationalistic anger over the ICJ decision which has not even been handed down. They have put them selves in a position that if Thailand wins they will have nothing left to hide behind and must face a more and more informed public about their lack of action to help Thailand with the time they were in power by spending all that time trying to white wash Thaksin.

I don't have any first hand knowledge of what is going on in Bangkok but a friend of mine who comes over every year for about four months is in Bangkok while his wife is undergoing testing at that nice five star hotel/hospital. He told me he has seen army trucks driving around but is unfamiliar with what is going on or where they are going.

Incidentally his wife has seen several doctors in the states and she is receiving answers here that they could not supply in the states. My friend is happy happy with the service.

[ratcatcher]

A few posts have been removed from view. This is Thailand, so please, nothing seriously derogatory towards senior politicians.

its about time moderators did not fear the speaking of the truth...regardless of this being Thailand. Naming and shaming politician crooks should be in. Let us take our chances.

We can always leave here you know.

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

It's not just us we are trying to protect. But thank you for your concern.

Name and shame is a huge deal here, and we either have to live with it, or leave. You are always free to stay or leave. Up to you.

marcusd, it may be easy for you to up sticks and move along to the next sandy beach, but many here, including myself, have families and responsibilities and are well accepted by our Thai neighbors.

We can enjoy the friendly banter on TVF but let the Thais get down to the nitty gritty mud slinging.

All we, as resident expats, can do is watch with interest as this chapter in the Thai story unfolds.

No Thai politician can sue you for laughing at him, but making accusations about them, as a farang would be a dangerous and inadvisable activity.

[marcusd]

 

A few posts have been removed from view.  This is Thailand, so please, nothing seriously derogatory towards senior politicians.

its about time moderators did not fear the speaking of the truth...regardless of this being Thailand. Naming and shaming politician crooks should be in. Let us take our chances.

We can always leave here you know.

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

 

 

It's not just us we are trying to protect.  But thank you for your concern.

 

Name and shame is a huge deal here, and we either have to live with it, or leave.  You are always free to stay or leave.  Up to you.

 

 

I do appreciate this and understand. Thank you for what you do.

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

[marcusd]

 

 

A few posts have been removed from view.  This is Thailand, so please, nothing seriously derogatory towards senior politicians.

its about time moderators did not fear the speaking of the truth...regardless of this being Thailand. Naming and shaming politician crooks should be in. Let us take our chances.

We can always leave here you know.

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

 

 

It's not just us we are trying to protect.  But thank you for your concern.

 

Name and shame is a huge deal here, and we either have to live with it, or leave.  You are always free to stay or leave.  Up to you.

 

 

 

marcusd, it may be easy for you to up sticks and move along to the next sandy beach, but many here, including myself, have families and responsibilities and are well accepted by our Thai neighbors.

We can enjoy the friendly banter on TVF but let the Thais get down to the nitty gritty mud slinging.

All we, as resident expats, can do is watch with interest as this chapter in the Thai story unfolds. 

No Thai politician can sue you for laughing at him, but making accusations about them, as a farang would be a dangerous and inadvisable activity.

I understand. Aftersll.. My own Australian. Consul in Phulet received death threats and had to leave.. Albeit under another guise

Sent from my RM-892_apac_laos_thailand_219 using Tapatalk

[craigt3365]

One rule we have that we try to enforce quite strictly, is to not discuss moderation. I let this go a bit so you guys can understand what we have to deal with. Ratcatcher put it quite well.

Again, please be careful with what you say. Online or in person here. Consequences can be dire.

And please no more discussion of moderation.

[Thait Spot]

Have any people turned up at Muang Thong yet?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[chrisrazz]

'REALLY hard times ahead for the average person in Isan'

Funny that. Do you think the lives of a people who've survived on subsistence farming for generations are really going to change for the worse anytime soon. Everything they have is through hard labour that is set against a background of poor education, poor healthcare, limited rights, (due to social non status, though, one rung up from us falangs) and exploitation. The only thing I see that'll make things harder is climate change, when you have nothing to eat, that's when it gets really hard.

I could go on about how the current political awakening that has occurred is more related to historical ignorance of the ruling classes, their ignorance of the need for development and inclusion, rather than self interest.

The vacuum was filled by the opportunist Taksin. As opponents to Taksin, they have thus far failed miserably to tackle the issues in the region.

If you look at it. They have had plenty of time and opportunity. A coup, because he was corrupt, yet the conviction they finally landed is chicken feed when you consider the sum of accusations. Why didn't they get him on something really big to finally put his influence out of the picture? All that did is garner more support. The events of 2010, well, that hardly swung the Isaan view that things were changing. Perhaps now, realisation that they are just pawns in someone else's game is beginning to sink in, but you can't blame them for wanting a better life and something in which to believe.