Opinion and advice please on somewhat difficult "relationship" with Thai

[Sheryl]

My two satang:

Likely the son was the main damage doer and she has little or no control over him.

Throw the son out -- just tell him firmly that it is no longer convenient for him to stay, and then change the locks -- and let the matter go at that. Don't speak of it again to her, just pretend it never happened. That way there is a good chance you'll be able to keep her as an employee. You are never going to get restitution for the damage anyhow, and anything that causes her to lose face will jeopardize the working relationship.

To all those who jumped on the OP for letting these people in, please consider that he was forced to make emergency arrangements for animal care on extremely short notice.

[superdome]

Sorry to read about your misfortune......Thai's are a different breed....put it down to experience...you will find other staff...tell her & son...politely.....2 simple words really.....F..k Off

[attento]

A sad tale.

But my experience is different to yours. We have never had difficulties recruiting staff who have proved reliable.

However "reliable" the member of staff had been, we could not accept the standard of behaviour you have described.

If this happened to us and we believed the woman was complicit in this mayhem, we would really have little choice.

Good luck, anyway.

[lemoncake]

no i'm not. but i refuse to have any kind of relationship with someone who has no respect for me or mine.

I see your point, just can not afford to loose her as a staff- that is my biggest problem.

I also think she she is not aware of the damages " the family" caused and now that I made her aware, she seems to be doing the Thai thing, which is " hoping it will just go away and pass"

Can not really blame her as she is uncomfortable with each "finding" but being uncomfortable is simply not good enough in my opinion

I told her to have her bf come tomorrow to fix broken doors and toilets but ......... I feel need to have a serious talk

" she seems to be doing the Thai thing, which is " hoping it will just go away and pass"'

Which is pretty much what you're doing. The brother knows he should leave and he knows what he did, but they/he obviously assume you're too much of an soft touch to do anything about it. And every day it goes on just reinforces that.

Tell him goodbye. Change the locks. Start cleaning up and resurrecting your life. I hope the animals survived this. I can't imagine turning my home over to anyone, Thai or farang. Even when I wasn't living here full-time, I would never have rented my condo out while I was out of the country. Even when friends from the US or UK hinted they would like to visit Thailand and wouldn't it be nice to use my condo while they were here, I just ignored the hints. It's just not worth it.

Anyway, at this point, lesson learned. Put an end to the occupation by the brother and put things back together as best you can. Dragging it all out and announcing new discoveries to your employee every few days is serving no purpose now. She knows what a mess has been created. He knows he needs to go.

It's hard to believe this woman is such a paragon at work, but if you do not want to lose her, then wrap this mess up and move on. There's nothing to be gained by prolonging the situation and the more you do to make her uncomfortable is just undermining this fabulous working relationship you think exists.,

What brother? Do you mean the son?

As i posted yesterday already, son already left, bf came around and fixed all broken things.

Today i checked the room where son slept and found many items i was missing such as toothpaste, shampoo's, aftershaves, razors etc.

I told her that the missing items were found and her son used it, which i certainly did not appreciate, without even thinking she stated to cut his salary for everything his used.

Again i do not believe she was the one doing the damage and i believe trusted her family to do the right thing, because she was at work from 6am-21pm 7 days per week.

I will say again, if it was not for her, i would not have been able to attend to my mother.

Yes, i am soft, because i have to appreciate what she took on and did.

All animals are alive and well, hotel is operating and bills were paid.

.

I believe i have dealt now with the situation, the damages are fixed, the missing/stolen goods have been located and i will still decide to cut his salary or not depending on his performance at work.

The rest of the damage, i may well write off as suggested by others, but in the future will now know better and set rules if i had a need to go away.

The mess and filth, as much as i do not appriciate, again i can not put blame on her solely as she was doing long hours for over 2 months without a day off.

Family could have helped for sure, but chose not too, well again lesson learned.

Let me ask you a question.

If you had someone do you a huge personal favor, and i do mean huge, not only in moral terms but also financial(as boarding so many animals would have cost me way over 100 000 baht), would you simply get rid of them, or try to find a "nice" way of dealing with it?

[truckerjoe]

no i'm not. but i refuse to have any kind of relationship with someone who has no respect for me or mine.

I see your point, just can not afford to loose her as a staff- that is my biggest problem.

I also think she she is not aware of the damages " the family" caused and now that I made her aware, she seems to be doing the Thai thing, which is " hoping it will just go away and pass"

Can not really blame her as she is uncomfortable with each "finding" but being uncomfortable is simply not good enough in my opinion

I told her to have her bf come tomorrow to fix broken doors and toilets but ......... I feel need to have a serious talk

Not a good idea to invite her boyfriend round to fix things, he may refuse to leave also!

[lemoncake]

A sad tale.

But my experience is different to yours. We have never had difficulties recruiting staff who have proved reliable.

However "reliable" the member of staff had been, we could not accept the standard of behaviour you have described.

If this happened to us and we believed the woman was complicit in this mayhem, we would really have little choice.

Good luck, anyway.

You must be the luckiest business person in Thailand, because the entire country is struggling to recruit and retain staff

[lemoncake]

Sorry Cupcake. This charade is quite common in Thailand. Once the family move in the muck hits the fan. I am sure an agency could temporarily fix you up with a temp. Kick the girl and family out in a polite(face saving way for them) to avoid any repercussions and be prepared to have a problem with the labour dept if you withhold any wages owing. Pay up to avoid hassle. If you get up on your high horse you could get into a lengthy problem.

Please learn to read prior to addressing someone, thats to start with

Secondly , what agency? have you got any clue what you talking about?

[HeavyDrinker]

I once came back to the office in BKK after a few months leave in the UK to find it like a party zone. Kids and boyfriends all over.....needless to say they all saw the door sharpish as I had a golden rule: Strictly no family or friend visits are allowed in the office. I lost good staff, some not so good but none took the p*ss again....

[lemoncake]

Lemoncake, I have huge experience to deal with staff over the years, please believe that no staff cannot be replace.

She is not the only one people in Thailand who can do a good job especially if you provide a good income with bonus !

By the way, I remind you, you have deal with her and she took responsability of your house while you was away.

Your house has been damage and you personnal stuffs missing, she is responsible as she took the responsability of the job, that's it.

Be strong, don't find excuse to her because you appreciated her past work, you have paid her for for it, it was her duty !

If you don't do anything against her, she will think that you are stupid to let it go and might not respect you anymore.

If I was you,

1) I will push the squatting people and their stuffs to move out of the property and claim to call the police if no action done

2) I will have a direct conversation with her explaining the facts with a list of damages.

You can estimate the cost and suggest her that you might withdraw from her salary for a period of time.

3) If she do not want to take the responsability of the claim, it is mean that she is not trustable person, she has to leave the company as soon as possible.

Dont be too kind, as you seen, you did not desserve what you got and might regret it more later !

I totally agree with you, of course no one is irreplaceable, but its the timing that is the problem.

Keep in mind, i just returned after being away for over 2 months, have million things to catch up on, certainly do not have the time to look for new maid.

Also have 2 more dogs to look after, i can tell you, it is much harder than i ever even imagined.

As i just posted, i have dealt with it in a way i can live with, son is out, damage fixed, and person responsible for things missing is identified-her son

See my previous reply to Suradit to understand my position and feelings on the matter and it also addresses all the 3 points you had raised.

[lemoncake]

I once came back to the office in BKK after a few months leave in the UK to find it like a party zone. Kids and boyfriends all over.....needless to say they all saw the door sharpish as I had a golden rule: Strictly no family or friend visits are allowed in the office. I lost good staff, some not so good but none took the p*ss again....

I would have done the same thing, the difference is, her actual job is a maid in hotel(my business) the place with problems is my own house, where i did suggest and paid for her son to also live there to help her.

The rest of the family staying was not mentioned or prohibited as it did not even cross my mind at the time.

Could she have looked after the house better, of course if this was her actual job, but my house and animals was the over time of about 5-6 hours per day, 7 days per week.

Things are now becoming more clear and person responsible for the damage identified.

Without me even asking, she stated to cut his salary- that alone does mean a lot in my opinion

[Opl]

So everything is almost back to normal by now.. maybe it would be a good idea to think about a solution for the next time you'll need to leave again?

[givenall]

No staff worth putting up with carp. As they say everyone is replaceable and if want to leave a good hop then more power to her.

Sent from my ST25i using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[lemoncake]

So everything is almost back to normal by now.. maybe it would be a good idea to think about a solution for the next time you'll need to leave again?

Pretty much, still many many things moved and need to be put back in its place, the electronics is gone and i do not think worth trying to fix.

Sadly i was in a rush as my mothers cancer turned stage 4, so all i had was a 24 hour notice pretty much.

Before the known troll comes out with some crap, she may have already been in stage 4, but never told me, it was pure luck that i found out, because she let something slip, which made me aware.

Thankfully i no longer need to travel, as she was the last living relative, but having a holiday away or time off would be a challenge with so many animals

[Showbags]

I applied for the dog walker job.

Please view my application without prejudice.

[Scottythai]

Lemon you have been around for a long time and that this even crossed your mind was bad from the start. Business and personal life should be separate. If you go there are better options for a house sitter than your staff.

Now that you are in this pickle it seems you are being used and taken advantage of. Your house has turned you into a doormat. I would not care if she was the best employee in the world now you have to step up kick her son out and sort your stuff out. How could you let her son stay there after you came home is beyond me.

You dug a hole for yourself now man up and climb out of it.

[Kimera]

I have just wasted 30 minutes of my life looking through this post, and you know I don't know why !! you people who reply to this rubbish need to get a life...unfortunately it would seem so should I, its off the cliff tomorrow... as everything in Thailand Pungnee

[lemoncake]

Lemon you have been around for a long time and that this even crossed your mind was bad from the start. Business and personal life should be separate. If you go there are better options for a house sitter than your staff.

Now that you are in this pickle it seems you are being used and taken advantage of. Your house has turned you into a doormat. I would not care if she was the best employee in the world now you have to step up kick her son out and sort your stuff out. How could you let her son stay there after you came home is beyond me.

You dug a hole for yourself now man up and climb out of it.

Totally agree with you and never looked for anyone to blame,only asked for advice on how to deal with a situation as i was in total shock and most certainly was not prepared for anything like this, as i have never seen anything like this before.

I had left previously for 1 week at the time, leaving other staff members in the house and all was ok, but i also did not have that many animals before.

The person responsible has been identified, her son and as i said, without even me asking, she said to cut his salary for everything.

To address, how i let her son stay, i guess i was in such a shock that i could not think straight at the time. He stayed for 2 more days only

[Scottythai]

Well seems like a semi cheap lesson learned man. Happy to hear it all worked out

[Sheryl]

An incipient flamefest has been nipped in the bud. cease and desist, you know who you are.

As I said previously, need to consider that the OP had very little time to arrange for an unanticipated trip. I am myself often struggling to find pet care when I have to be away and cannot say that, if I had employees who seemed reliable, I wouldn't also have given them a try.

Fact is, could have chosen a kennel only to find the animals mistreated or worse. Or a "friend" only to find that they had untoward associates or habits unknown to you, or were less reliable than you had thought.

First time you entrust someone with pet-sitting or house-sitting is always a risk.

Chalk it up to sad experience and move on. And drop the subject with the woman or she may "lose face" and quit.

[quiuvo]

Come on dude. Kick him out and if need be call the police that an intruder is in your house. Forget all the other nonsense about directors, taxes, etc. she is indispensable, everybody is. Do change the lock and put an additional one if need be.

[wooloomooloo]

If anyone is in any doubt to the veracity of this thread, please note the following - lemoncake states he has been to Australia for 2.5 months and recently returned.

If you click on his profile and click 'Posts' under his avatar on left-hand side of screen then move cursor over to right-hand side of screen and click 'Find content', just under 'Help', you will note there is a beautiful, chronologically presented list of the threads he has participated in.

I have gone back as far as page 20 which is early May 2013. I can count on one hand how many days he hasn't posted.

So where does the 2.5 month break come from, lemoncake?

[Showbags]

If anyone is in any doubt to the veracity of this thread, please note the following - lemoncake states he has been to Australia for 2.5 months and recently returned.

If you click on his profile and click 'Posts' under his avatar on left-hand side of screen then move cursor over to right-hand side of screen and click 'Find content', just under 'Help', you will note there is a beautiful, chronologically presented list of the threads he has participated in.

I have gone back as far as page 20 which is early May 2013. I can count on one hand how many days he hasn't posted.

So where does the 2.5 month break come from, lemoncake?

What are you implying? That it is not normal to post on TV at your Mums funeral?

[Toscano]

I don't see how you can continue to employ the woman after she has betrayed your trust in this way .

You need to tell her son to get out of your house and not return , change all the locks .

I am not surprised your house has been trashed , but then you could be excused for not guessing that the whole family would move in and take advantage of

you . I live in Issan and am appauled by the state of some Falang houses ; where the wife lives in her husband's country and parents or other family are

supposedly looking after the place .

[Totster]

Come on dude. Kick him out and if need be call the police that an intruder is in your house. Forget all the other nonsense about directors, taxes, etc. she is indispensable, everybody is. Do change the lock and put an additional one if need be.

If you had bothered to read the full topic you would know that this issue has been resolved... and your post is pointless.

totster

[Totster]

If anyone is in any doubt to the veracity of this thread, please note the following - lemoncake states he has been to Australia for 2.5 months and recently returned.

If you click on his profile and click 'Posts' under his avatar on left-hand side of screen then move cursor over to right-hand side of screen and click 'Find content', just under 'Help', you will note there is a beautiful, chronologically presented list of the threads he has participated in.

I have gone back as far as page 20 which is early May 2013. I can count on one hand how many days he hasn't posted.

So where does the 2.5 month break come from, lemoncake?

What are you implying? That it is not normal to post on TV at your Mums funeral?

Are you implying that the funeral was 2.5 months ??

Also, where does it state in the rules that members can only post when in Thailand ?

totster

[Emdog]

Some good advice amongst the posts.1. Son was an employee, so fire and deduct from wages any damage. You changed the relationship by hiring him. And was she given employee role of supervising him, or just told to stay there? If not his "manager" then he was the boss at the house 2. Different culture, and perhaps you need to be more aware of how some Thai mothers often dote on their irresponsible sons, can't say no or correct them. Doesn't fit our western ideal, but again this is their culture. 3. Let the money thing go regarding the woman, and consider it tuition. If you ever decide to do such a thing again, bear in mind that everything needs to be spelled out in advance. Assumptions don't work well across cultures, as you found out.

[macca3248]

" Here's your hat,whats your hurry "

[lemoncake]

My two satang:

Likely the son was the main damage doer and she has little or no control over him.

Throw the son out -- just tell him firmly that it is no longer convenient for him to stay, and then change the locks -- and let the matter go at that. Don't speak of it again to her, just pretend it never happened. That way there is a good chance you'll be able to keep her as an employee. You are never going to get restitution for the damage anyhow, and anything that causes her to lose face will jeopardize the working relationship.

To all those who jumped on the OP for letting these people in, please consider that he was forced to make emergency arrangements for animal care on extremely short notice.

You nailed it Sheryl, as i posted earlier son was the one responsible for it all as i learned

At the time of posting, i was in such a shock that i could not even think straight, so was looking for advice to deal with a situation in a certain way.

Thanks to some people who have pointed something out, i managed to see outside the "square" sort of speak.

Son is gone, damage fixed, electronics and things missing i am still considering if i should cut his salary.

I am not sure if she has control of son, i think she did not even consider it.

When i pointed it all out for her, she told me to cut his salary for everything.

In my opinion, i dealt with it in a satisfying way to myself and her and lesson learned

[Loles]

Man! You have to show power, if don't this shameless team eats you for breakfast.

First at all you have to fire this idiot lady, whos is impolite, reckless and top shameless. This woman doesn't respect you at all and wants to exploit you and probably laugh about yourself.

Tell the dumb boy go home and forget the address.

Otherway you are very lucky cause your car is not missing and your house wasn't burned down, and they didn't sale them.

If you think I'm too rough you give your staff woman salary increasing again, buy them some nice present BUT please don't be surprised.

[A1Str8]

This is some filthy, immature, disgusting behaviour. She can be proud of herself. As there is no legal way to make her pay for all the losses and damages I would do the following:

1. Tell her son to move the fu_k out because you said so. It is your house and he doesn't have a choice. If necessary, take his stuff and put it outside on the street. If he doesn't shut up call the cops and tell them that this retard just decided to live in your house without your permission. He will need to move out.

2. Talk to the woman and tell her that you do not care and are not interested in her childish behavior that she denies everything. You trusted her, you let her into your house and that's how she says thank you? That's what she does to you after all those years of you being nice to her? Let her know that you didn't expect this from her and you are truly dissapointed. You are going to keep her as your staff or not that's up to you. I wouldn't keep a person like that. She is born stupid. However, the reason behind telling her all this is simply to get rid off your anger and let it go afterwards. Do not expect a thai to feel bad about it or say sorry for anything. She would rather end her life.

3. After dealing with these leeches get everything fixed in your house and just forget it. They are not worth the headache.

And in the future be a bit smarter. Realize that it doesn't matter how long you know a thai. They are not able to get rid of their messed up ways. The apple is rotting from the inside.