What is Politically Correct

[HUAHIN62]

Only the very insecure mind being called a farang. If you called me a new Thai I won't know who you talking to. Since when is a tourist a new Thai whatever (does an American call a tourist a new American). If you stay in a country for 50 years on a tourist visa and don't become a citizen you are still a tourist. If you stay and work in a foreign country you are an expat (worker), but how the heck will a Thai know if you are an tourist or an expat. If you see a 51 year old ugly bastard that can speak a little Thai with bloody good looking wife please call me a farang, because until I get Thai citizenship I am one.

[Kilgore Trout]

Aoy, I really do not understand the point of your OP.  What is this "new Thai" thing?  And many of your points are just flatout wrong.  The term "farang" is not offensive.  I do not know of one Thai person who considers this term offensive.  Not one.  If you are a Thai, you would know this.

 

Frankly, I do not believe that you are a Thai person.  I think that you are a disgruntled farang masquerading as a Thai and complaining about the usual things that said farangs complain about.  Please come clean.

Not offensive to your misguided views

Most Thais WANT to be respected by the greater world and accepted as equals

Using a racial term to describe people even to their face will cause disdain and perceived insult

You just cannot do that. Try doing it to the Thais abd see what reaction you get.they don't like it

According to my grandmother you are a goy, In Mexico you are a gringo. Will you accept being called those things or just particular to Thai racial terms?

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Kilgore Trout]

Only the very insecure mind being called a farang. If you called me a new Thai I won't know who you talking to. Since when is a tourist a new Thai whatever (does an American call a tourist a new American). If you stay in a country for 50 years on a tourist visa and don't become a citizen you are still a tourist. If you stay and work in a foreign country you are an expat (worker), but how the heck will a Thai know if you are an tourist or an expat. If you see a 51 year old ugly bastard that can speak a little Thai with bloody good looking wife please call me a farang, because until I get Thai citizenship I am one.[/quote:

When you get citizenship you still will be a farang, genuis

It refers to race not nationality

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Berkshire]

Aoy, I really do not understand the point of your OP. What is this "new Thai" thing? And many of your points are just flatout wrong. The term "farang" is not offensive. I do not know of one Thai person who considers this term offensive. Not one. If you are a Thai, you would know this.

Frankly, I do not believe that you are a Thai person. I think that you are a disgruntled farang masquerading as a Thai and complaining about the usual things that said farangs complain about. Please come clean.

Not offensive to your misguided views

Most Thais WANT to be respected by the greater world and accepted as equals

Using a racial term to describe people even to their face will cause disdain and perceived insult

You just cannot do that. Try doing it to the Thais abd see what reaction you get.they don't like it

According to my grandmother you are a goy, In Mexico you are a gringo. Will you accept being called those things or just particular to Thai racial terms?

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

As I've said before, we in America refer to people by racial terms all the time. And honestly, "farang" does not refer to white people. That is a farang concoction. If Thais wanted to call farangs "white people," they would say "khon khao." It really doesn't even register to the average Thai that farangs are white people. To them, it's a simple term for westerners or Europeans. The technical term is Caucasian, which is the most accurate way to describe the word "farang." So it baffles me that anyone would take offense to this term. Would you be offended by being called a Caucasian?

In Japan, they refer to foreigners as "gaijin." I'm pretty sure Japan is viewed as an advanced economy. Many more examples where that came from.

[Halion]

As with so many generalizations the term "farang" can cover a multitude of situations. It is typical oversight to refer to a Caucasian foreigner as a "farang" as it is a generalization.

I am from the UK and I am a "falang" in as much as Thais are Asians.

Farang is commonly used owing to culture and lack of education as Thai's see Thailand as the center of the universe and have little knowledge of foreign history.

Whether or not "farang" can be deemed as derogatory is totally dependent on the context and or circumstance that it is used in. It under certain conditions can imply outsider or foreigner in a detrimental and derogatory manner. I am not fond of the term "farang" or in many of they ways it is used but it does not really bother me and I certainly would prefer it over the term "New Thai".

The Thai's express little sensitivity outside their own culture by are extremely sensitive in themselves. If you don't believe me try referring to them as Malay's, Vietnamese or Cambodian and see what response you get. Tell them that all Asian are the same in your opinion and wait for the national rhetoric to kick in.

[Kilgore Trout]

 

Aoy, I really do not understand the point of your OP.  What is this "new Thai" thing?  And many of your points are just flatout wrong.  The term "farang" is not offensive.  I do not know of one Thai person who considers this term offensive.  Not one.  If you are a Thai, you would know this.

 

Frankly, I do not believe that you are a Thai person.  I think that you are a disgruntled farang masquerading as a Thai and complaining about the usual things that said farangs complain about.  Please come clean.

Not offensive to your misguided views

Most Thais WANT to be respected by the greater world and accepted as equals

Using a racial term to describe people even to their face will cause disdain and perceived insult

You just cannot do that. Try doing it to the Thais abd see what reaction you get.they don't like it

According to my grandmother you are a goy, In Mexico you are a gringo. Will you accept being called those things or just particular to Thai racial terms?

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

 

 

As I've said before, we in America refer to people by racial terms all the time.  And honestly, "farang" does not refer to white people.  That is a farang concoction.  If Thais wanted to call farangs "white people," they would say "khon khao."  It really doesn't even register to the average Thai that farangs are white people.  To them, it's a simple term for westerners or Europeans.  The technical term is Caucasian, which is the most accurate way to describe the word "farang."  So it baffles me that anyone would take offense to this term.  Would you be offended by being called a Caucasian? 

 

In Japan, they refer to foreigners as "gaijin."  I'm pretty sure Japan is viewed as an advanced economy.  Many more examples where that came from.

 

Just cause you say it all the time doesn't make it right

If you used any racial term in the US the way Thais use "farang" you would be ostracized

Any American who is not a member of a hate group knows this

Makes me wonder if old berkie is what he says he is.....

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Gone]

The word "farang" comes frome the French word (during the Vietnam war) and is "ferenge" pronounced fah-ren-gee and all it means is "Foreigner". This does not bother me in the least.

It's just like in Canada for instance when we see Asians we refer to them as just that, Asians. Most can't tell if they are Thai, Malaysian, Philipina etc so we call them "Asians"

What should they call the mass of us when they see us?

[loong]

Aoy, I really do not understand the point of your OP. What is this "new Thai" thing? And many of your points are just flatout wrong. The term "farang" is not offensive. I do not know of one Thai person who considers this term offensive. Not one. If you are a Thai, you would know this.

Frankly, I do not believe that you are a Thai person. I think that you are a disgruntled farang masquerading as a Thai and complaining about the usual things that said farangs complain about. Please come clean.

Absolutely agree.

I also do not believe the OP is Thai, because if you are, you would have known that the word 'farang' means nothing more than what Thais call Westerners, no more no less. And one advice, Thais will never change the word they call Westerners, no matter how long they live in Thailand. This is not racism, it's just the way it is. The same applies to other non-Thais, says Chinese, Indians, or even Blacks (sorry for Black people the word may be of offensive but Thais wouldn't know it is).

So you think that the OP is not Thai because she does not share your (farang) view that the word "farang" is not offensive.

I believe it is perfectly acceptable to use the word "farang" in conversation when talking about a farang. Ie "The farang that lives down the street". In this case it easily identifies the person that is being discussed.

However, used to your face, it is different. If the person talking to you does not know your name, he/she will usually either not use a personal pronoun or will use the Thai word "Khun"

"Bpai nai" or "Khun Bpai nai" is correct, but "Farang bpai nai" is not.

I am sure that a person of African descent would not be happy if I asked "Where are you going black man?"

There is absolutely no reason for a Thai person to insert the word "farang" when talking to a foreigner as they know that they should be using "You", "Khun"

[Kilgore Trout]

The word "farang" comes frome the French word (during the Vietnam war) and is "ferenge" pronounced fah-ren-gee and all it means is "Foreigner". This does not bother me in the least.

 

It's just like in Canada for instance when we see Asians we refer to them as just that, Asians. Most can't tell if they are Thai, Malaysian, Philipina etc so we call them "Asians"

 

What should they call the mass of us when they see us?

Would you say to your Canadian friend in earshot of an Asian "we are going for a drink, the asian can come too"

I think you would not. Ask yourself why you wouldn't.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Thai-Aust]

Aoy, I really do not understand the point of your OP. What is this "new Thai" thing? And many of your points are just flatout wrong. The term "farang" is not offensive. I do not know of one Thai person who considers this term offensive. Not one. If you are a Thai, you would know this.

Frankly, I do not believe that you are a Thai person. I think that you are a disgruntled farang masquerading as a Thai and complaining about the usual things that said farangs complain about. Please come clean.

Absolutely agree.

I also do not believe the OP is Thai, because if you are, you would have known that the word 'farang' means nothing more than what Thais call Westerners, no more no less. And one advice, Thais will never change the word they call Westerners, no matter how long they live in Thailand. This is not racism, it's just the way it is. The same applies to other non-Thais, says Chinese, Indians, or even Blacks (sorry for Black people the word may be of offensive but Thais wouldn't know it is).

So you think that the OP is not Thai because she does not share your (farang) view that the word "farang" is not offensive.

I believe it is perfectly acceptable to use the word "farang" in conversation when talking about a farang. Ie "The farang that lives down the street". In this case it easily identifies the person that is being discussed.

However, used to your face, it is different. If the person talking to you does not know your name, he/she will usually either not use a personal pronoun or will use the Thai word "Khun"

"Bpai nai" or "Khun Bpai nai" is correct, but "Farang bpai nai" is not.

I am sure that a person of African descent would not be happy if I asked "Where are you going black man?"

There is absolutely no reason for a Thai person to insert the word "farang" when talking to a foreigner as they know that they should be using "You", "Khun"

The only reason why I think the OP is not Thai, because Thais would not have this perception, it's just the way they call Westerners since they came to this country. That's it. no more, no less. They don't even realise that this word would be offensive to some.

[khunPer]

Thank you for participating the Forum and raising a very good question.

However, I don’t mind being called a farang – perhaps I just got used to it – and my friends and people who know my name are always polite and they all call me khun Per. As long as I am not real citizen of Thailand – a Thai national – but just a kind permanent guest on extended visa, I am just a farang, because I am Caucasian and look different, and grow up in a very different culture and therefore act different.

The official indication as “Alien” is not better at all – sounds like some green little Martian fellow – I prefer farang.

So what is Politically Correct?

We had the same discussion years back in my homeland, Denmark, when lots of foreigners came to settle. They were politically correct at that time called “New Danes” – never a hit and quickly got a negative sphere – today the political correct title is “Danes with other ethnic background”. However, they are not Danes, because we call them something fashionable political correct, which separate them from the “real Danes”. If we want them to be Danes, we shall just call them: Danes.

Danes are ethnic mixed. Some 1600 years back in history the Danes from the East invaded the islands and peninsula today called Denmark, and about half the original population moved out and settled in today’s Holland and mainly Britain (Anglos and Saxons, named after their Danish homes), the other half over time mixed with the invading Danes and became: Danes.

So politically correct I think: Thai, when you are a Thai national – Thais are also not an ethnic group, but the mixed population of several ethnic groups living in the nation Thailand – and farang or whatever (Black, Chinese…) when you are not a Thai national.

You mention civil right for foreigners in your OP. Yes, I am sure a lot of farangs will be happy to be granted better rights, when staying long time or permanently living in Thailand. You compare with other countries and name USA. I don’t know about USA, but in Europe foreigners obtaining civil rights and public benefits like healthcare and unemployment support, has become a huge problem – mainly because so mane foreigners came over recent years and the countries economy cannot bear it – there is a big discussion going on at the moment.

There are mainly coming two kind of foreigners into Europe: Asylum seekers from war zones, who obtain their rights fairly easy due to International Treaties, and foreigners from marriage. The first group included a lot of economic asylum seekers, not coming because of war, but because of the financial social benefits. The other group, marriage, is where you find the Thais. In some European countries it is fairly easy to obtain permission stay or citizenship from marriage, in other countries – like Denmark – extremely difficult. The European medias at the moments flows with views about these matters, mainly because they cause both big financial problems and huge ethnic conflicts, the latter mainly from rabid Muslims.

In a way I am in favour of Thailand not handing out citizenship and social benefits – looking back on what happened in Europe – on the other hand I agree, that it should be easier for a foreigner to stay in Thailand when married to a Thai or having family (child/children) in Thailand. However, who shall pay?

During the past year there has for example been some articles in Thai media about foreigners without health insurance who cannot pay for their hospitalisation. Sure it may help a lot resident foreigners if they could have easily access to Thai healthcare system or a kind of affordable public foreigner insurance, which have been suggested. If you compare with Denmark, which I know about, then there has for some years been a rule, that if a Dane get married to a Thai and bring the spouse to Denmark, there shall be a cash deposit paid into a bank in cover for welfare claims like hospitalisation (the rule is abolished at the moment). Furthermore there will be claim to the Danes home (size, standard etc.) and that the Dane has a steady net income high enough to support a family (the spouse is not expected to be able to work). For many that has been or still is a problem. In Thailand you also have claims to a spouse, like the income of 40,000 baht a month or deposit of 400.000 baht (which in currency conversion is almost identical to the Danish deposit, but relative higher). To obtain permanent residence permission and/or become Danish citizen – having a Danish passport and giving up your Thai passport, as dual nationality is not allowed – the Thai need first to have been seven years legally in the country, pass a language test, pass a test about Danish culture including knowledge to as well ancient as present history, being able to work or being self supported etc. (the criteria change a little most years) – however you cannot buy a citizenship. That you can do in Thailand, if you are rich – else you need to pass more or less similar qualifications as those for Denmark.

So some Western countries are not that different from Thailand.

It is a very good and positive suggestion you come up with to make foreigners long term stay in Thailand easier – but I think that involves very careful thinking from the Thai authorities. However, in my opinion some smaller steps – which may not be a cost for the society, rather the opposite – could help “alien” spouses, partners and parents a lot.

[Richard Hall]

There is absolutely no reason for a Thai person to insert the word "farang" when talking to a foreigner as they know that they should be using "You", "Khun"

I was once addressed by a Thai (cleaning lady) as "Khun Farang" and found this indeed hilarious. Liked it much better than Mistoer, You or Boss.

Actually, that said lady approached me for advice how to get a farang boyfriend.

I recommended to attach a sign to her chest indicating in English language:

"I am looking for a farang boyfriend."

Surely, not politically correct but at least honest and most likely the most success promising way to realize the intended goal. It was quite a sanuk conversation despite the word farang was used.

Actually it is not the word itself but just the way it is used. Doesn't this basically hold true for any word? In a certain context even "honey" could be understood degrading and discriminating and hence to be politically incorrect. So I just say to myself "fock that political correctness" and will be even kind of 50% political correct that way. Sometimes an "o" for a "u" can make quite a difference.

[nong38]

Perhaps the OP will be returning with some more thoughts after the replies, on the other hand perhaps not.

[papa al]

The term 'politically correct" was first used in Stalinist Russia.

"The phrase was a colloquialism referring to the Communist "party line", which provided for "correct" positions on many matters of politics."...Wikipedia

[papa al]

As I've said before, we in America refer to people by racial terms all the time. And honestly, "farang" does not refer to white people. That is a farang concoction. If Thais wanted to call farangs "white people," they would say "khon khao." It really doesn't even register to the average Thai that farangs are white people. To them, it's a simple term for westerners or Europeans. The technical term is Caucasian, which is the most accurate way to describe the word "farang." So it baffles me that anyone would take offense to this term. Would you be offended by being called a Caucasian?

In Japan, they refer to foreigners as "gaijin." I'm pretty sure Japan is viewed as an advanced economy. Many more examples where that came from.

I've heard blacks referred to as 'black farang,' so not necessarily Caucasian/European.

None of my ancestors lived anywhere rear the Caucasian Mountains/Region, so...?

I don't like being called 'white.' I'm not the color of a sheet of typing paper. Maybe buff...!

[laobali]

Having spent most of the past fifteen years in Thailand and then Laos, I am not offended by being referred to as a farang (falang in Lao) unless it is obviously being used in a derogatory way. Compared to Thailand, In Laos there seems to be far less resentment of foreigners' perceived superiority in terms of education, worldliness etc; most are treated with respect.

As far as the origin of the word is concerned, in Laos at least, as most foreigners in Laos in colonial days were French, it is from the word français (the adjective French) pronounced by Lao as 'falangsay', now shortened to falang. It's as simple as that.

[loong]

The word "farang" comes frome the French word (during the Vietnam war) and is "ferenge" pronounced fah-ren-gee and all it means is "Foreigner". This does not bother me in the least.

It's just like in Canada for instance when we see Asians we refer to them as just that, Asians. Most can't tell if they are Thai, Malaysian, Philipina etc so we call them "Asians"

What should they call the mass of us when they see us?

But if you talk to an Asian, will you say "Asian, what are you doing?'

I doubt it - you would probably just ask "What are you doing?"

[chickenslegs]

Quite an original way to open up an old,old, topic.

I wonder when (and in what guise) our OP will bring sin sod and bum guns into the conversation.

Edited December 2, 2013 by chickenslegs

[dighambara]

I like your ideas. The term 'New Thai' seems to make sense, especially as Thai Immigration records over 10% of the population as being foreigners on long stay visas.

However, although theoretically possible, it is difficult to become a Thai citizen. Every lawyer I have contacted has either ignored me or said 'Impossible'...

As for the entire concept of 'Political Correctness', that is a lie foisted upon the public at large by idiots within the supposed 'Intelligencia'...

Being foreign born, I have no difficulty meeting someone, working out our differences and getting a job done - all without the time and money wasting process of Bowing, Wai-ing and 'Saving Face'...

[laobali]

I'm happy to continue being a farang/falang. New Thai may be well-intentioned but is nonsensical and would never catch on.

I've never heard of the French word 'ferenge'. Has anyone?

Edited December 2, 2013 by laobali

[overherebc]

Political Correctnes is a Doctrine that will try to convince you it's perfecly possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

[sustento]

95% of political correctness is simple good manners - AA Gill.

[super22k]

1. Political correctness means discriminating against your own people and favouring foreigners.

2. A farang is a small green apple. Who wants to be called that?

3. A Thai is someone who needs to travel the world more and learn from western countries.

[h90]

herewith I officially allow you to call me Farang...but also pinky or longnose is OK.

That political correctness is only for people with inferiority complex. I have no problem to be called the way I look like to like my heritage is.

[Benmart]

Be this a fake or not, it certainly stimulates dialog and the exchange of ideas.

I look forward to the posts, civil or otherwise.

[Benmart]

1. Political correctness means discriminating against your own people and favouring foreigners.

2. A farang is a small green apple. Who wants to be called that?

3. A Thai is someone who needs to travel the world more and learn from western countries.

I am a Small Green Apple waiting for my carbon footprint to be embraced by the Thai farmer.

Live and Let Live

[iamariva1957]

Come on... who really cares? we are what we are in the eyes of the people of LOS. That will never change. Farang is not derogatory. It is just a label and very far removed from '<deleted>' or 'N***** '. New Thai? What is that and where are they anyway? I have been here for 6 years now and have never met one yet and I get to meet a great many people in my job. Or do they just live in BKK perhaps? Nope... that cannot be right either. I do hear what you are saying however, but think that you are living in the shell game that is called the ASEAN Community. I wish it luck..but do not think that the Thais as a whole will find anything worthwhile in it. But I guess there is always hope. But then again there is always the hope that theThais will see things as they really are and not simply hide behind their cultural mis and dis information.

[super22k]

I quote from a Thai Tourist book:

"Guava looks like a big apple,green and round. The fruit is called farang in Thai and it is the same farang as they call the white people"

So,we are all big green apples,guys

[Thai at Heart]

I just don't get it.

Thais want to use a grossly simplified racial description which may offend some people, but they reserve the right to get very offended if not shown the according respect?

That is, the last time I looked the very essence of hipocrisy.

[trihent]

Well you can imagine that your from this country or that country. What you should remember is that your a Citizen of the World first as are everyone else!