Petition to expel Thammasat student activist attracts 3,000 signatures

[IBoldnewguy]

"Mr. Ong-on Phu-arkard, the Thammasat alumnus who headed the expulsion campaign, explained to Matichon that the transgender activist Aum Neko has disrespected the university in many occasions."

And just what devious methods has this gentleman devised to allow him to monitor the accused 24/7 - he must have some valid foundation for his accusation of "many occasions" - the pictures shown are just pictures - nothing special - it's not like the activist sat on the accusers face or anything but then again maybe that's the problem

If "the transgender activist has disrespected the university" then "the Thammasat alumnus" should be charged with disrespecting our intelligence.

[Bender]

really this lady boy student has a big mouth...

Edited December 13, 2013 by Bender

[Maestro]

I have removed an unintelligible post and the replies to it.

[Bkungbank]

Thai words of democracy always cross the border line, Student do what ever the want by display improper acts in university,

Farmers blocking roads to demand price increase , Politician etc..

[chooka]

It seems 3,000 students are there for an education.

If one student's behavior makes that uncomfortable, difficult or impossible, expulsion seems like a reasonable solution.

Has nothing to do with the "thought police". It's about 3,000 people getting what they paid for.

I tend to agree this Mr. Saran Chuichai bloke parading around in women's clothing and apparently disturbing the majority who are trying to study. Either he gets with program and doesn't disturb the lives of others or he goes. A University can't be based around a single person.

He can put on his frilly knickers after school and everyone will be happy.

[chooka]

It seems 3,000 students are there for an education.

If one student's behavior makes that uncomfortable, difficult or impossible, expulsion seems like a reasonable solution.

Has nothing to do with the "thought police". It's about 3,000 people getting what they paid for.

3000 out of how many?

Saying how many oppose her without knowing how many students are there is pointless.

And I'm very curious about that 3000. Were they paid to sign the petition like locals are paid to vote?

Thammasat - AKA The University of Moral and Political Sciences

32,166 students spread across 4 campuses in Thailand.

24,331 undergrads and 7,835 grads So that averages out to around 8,041 per campus.

http://www.opir.kyoto-u.ac.jp/w-opir/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/sessionC1-2.pdf

[citizen33]

When I think back to my own student days in the late 60s/ early 70s (occupations over files, Angry Brigade, LSD etc) Khun Aum's infractions seem minor indeed. The Thammasat authorities will be laughed at in the West if they punish this student. The point made about struggling to find the rule that fits the 'crime' is all too apposite. As for those students signing the petition - better not put that on your CV if you apply for an overseas Ph.D. place.

[DocN]

This is just sad!

What about "I don't agree with what you say (do), but I will to my death defend your right to say (do) it"?

This is just (again) the ultra-conservative seeing their way of life and their influence threatened and they need to silence the voice of a mind, thinking differently!

3000 students can not "learn" in peace, because one student behaves "disorderly"?

Maybe they should join that other university, where no one minds if you have your picture taken, not on the lap of the statue of the university- founder, but ...let's say...doing the Hitler-salute, in front of a Der Fuehrer- mural!

Yeah...that would be fine, I guess!

[impulse]

It seems 3,000 students are there for an education.

If one student's behavior makes that uncomfortable, difficult or impossible, expulsion seems like a reasonable solution.

Has nothing to do with the "thought police". It's about 3,000 people getting what they paid for.

Whatever she did, it has ZERO impact on other students . They are making a political statement and victimising one individual. It is a pathetic overreaction. If the other students don't agree, they can say so...no one is stopping them. However, they want to 'cleanse' the reputation of the university. Bullies, pure and simple

Here's what I took from the OP: Those offences include dressing inappropriately, using impolite words to the lecturers,

If this person is mouthing off to lecturers, robbing the others in the class of the opportunity to learn what they paid to learn, it's unacceptable. Just like my freedom of speech ends when I spray paint my thoughts on the side of someone else's building, or I start ranting my "protected speech" at the top of my lungs during a Broadway Musical.

And there's a reason for dress codes, just like there is a reason I couldn't pull out a ham sandwich and pop a beer at my desk during classes. I could argue that my dingleberries hanging out of my shorts, and the sight and smell of ham and beer don't affect anyone else, and I could also argue that I have not broken any laws. But we all know better.

I have no energy at all on those photos posing in front of the statue. That's not why I think expulsion is appropriate. Though I challenge anyone to pose like that in front of Sully Ross at my alma mater.

Edited December 14, 2013 by impulse

[EyesWideOpen]

if expelled

he can go work straight in pattaya with the next bus

No no no no no no...........Pattaya is already too full of them !!!

[englishoak]

She makes farangs think that Thamasart is full of katoi. This is not true at all.

Maybe just a few of out ten of thousands student.

No it dosnt, it makes them think its full of outdated, over reactive, backward thinkers ... about 3000 or so of them.

[willow033]

Yep, the " thought police" out in force....

She isn't being prevented from thinking whatever she wants to think nor is she prevented from expressing those thoughts as long as it's done in a way that doesn't deprive others of their rights. I would assume admission to the university involved acceptance of some guidelines regarding behavior. A university should be a place where differing views are expressed, tolerated and debated, not where one individual or group takes the entire institution hostage and forces her/their ideas on everyone else.

If she feels sufficiently passionate about the importance of whatever she's promoting to violate the rules of the institution, that's fine but then she has to accept the cost. It's very noble to say you'll sacrifice yourself for the cause, but then you have to be prepared to actually make the sacrifice.

So true... So many youths are told these days that they have rights to express themselves (which is true) but many seem to express themselves in a way that contradicts the rules or regulations that they originally agreed to follow. You have the right to do anything you want... but remember there are always consequences to your actions, be it good or bad.

[richard10365]

Yep, the " thought police" out in force....

She isn't being prevented from thinking whatever she wants to think nor is she prevented from expressing those thoughts as long as it's done in a way that doesn't deprive others of their rights. I would assume admission to the university involved acceptance of some guidelines regarding behavior. A university should be a place where differing views are expressed, tolerated and debated, not where one individual or group takes the entire institution hostage and forces her/their ideas on everyone else.

If she feels sufficiently passionate about the importance of whatever she's promoting to violate the rules of the institution, that's fine but then she has to accept the cost. It's very noble to say you'll sacrifice yourself for the cause, but then you have to be prepared to actually make the sacrifice.

This was a great answer! This should end the entire argument. I see the majority of people obeying the set rules in the university I'm in. Then someone comes along and thinks they don't have to follow the rules because they want to be different. Then they get upset when they are told to stop. They forget the fact that the business has the option to refuse service when it so desires. They get expelled and think they were done wrong.

Pleeeeasssssseee!!!! The university does not belong to these individuals. If they want to be different then find a stage where people will gather to watch them. The university is not that stage. Universities do not want people's money that much.

When a student was suspended from my university everyone was happy to see that person go. Life returned to normal and students were able to focus on their studies without being distracted by this lone individual.Studying is hard enough without someone like this as a distraction. It's not fair to the majority of students and the student who is the distraction must be told to leave if they choose not to stop being the distraction. It's that simple.

[atyclb]

Doubt that Pridi himself would have much time for those who've signed this petition, nor some of the hacks currently masquerading as academics. Their job should be to encourage criticial thought, not suppress it.

What critical thought is a female student expressing by climbing on the statue of the university's founder and and positioning her crotch next to the statue's crotch?

Might it be a sexual fantasy, to be with a "perpetually hard" man ??

[IBoldnewguy]

Doubt that Pridi himself would have much time for those who've signed this petition, nor some of the hacks currently masquerading as academics. Their job should be to encourage criticial thought, not suppress it.

What critical thought is a female student expressing by climbing on the statue of the university's founder and and positioning her crotch next to the statue's crotch?

What sort of dirty mind sees something that is not there? There is a leg plus clothing showing - no crotch - the lady is in front of the statue and it cannot be determined that the statue even has a crotch. Lots of imagination showing in your remark - not much substance.

[IBoldnewguy]

She makes farangs think that Thamasart is full of katoi. This is not true at all.

Maybe just a few of out ten of thousands student.

I doubt if farangs are losing much sleep because they are thinking of Thamasart. Katoi might be another matter...

[IBoldnewguy]

Yep, the " thought police" out in force....

She isn't being prevented from thinking whatever she wants to think nor is she prevented from expressing those thoughts as long as it's done in a way that doesn't deprive others of their rights. I would assume admission to the university involved acceptance of some guidelines regarding behavior. A university should be a place where differing views are expressed, tolerated and debated, not where one individual or group takes the entire institution hostage and forces her/their ideas on everyone else.

If she feels sufficiently passionate about the importance of whatever she's promoting to violate the rules of the institution, that's fine but then she has to accept the cost. It's very noble to say you'll sacrifice yourself for the cause, but then you have to be prepared to actually make the sacrifice.

This was a great answer! This should end the entire argument. I see the majority of people obeying the set rules in the university I'm in. Then someone comes along and thinks they don't have to follow the rules because they want to be different. Then they get upset when they are told to stop. They forget the fact that the business has the option to refuse service when it so desires. They get expelled and think they were done wrong.

Pleeeeasssssseee!!!! The university does not belong to these individuals. If they want to be different then find a stage where people will gather to watch them. The university is not that stage. Universities do not want people's money that much.

When a student was suspended from my university everyone was happy to see that person go. Life returned to normal and students were able to focus on their studies without being distracted by this lone individual.Studying is hard enough without someone like this as a distraction. It's not fair to the majority of students and the student who is the distraction must be told to leave if they choose not to stop being the distraction. It's that simple.

These simple opinionated answers solve nothing other than to prove that the writers have tried to express assumptions as fact.

"When a student was suspended from my university" Does this mean you own or run a University? If you are a teacher that is very bad form and you should know better, if you are a student you can be forgiven but it's still a (C-). "everyone was happy to see that person go" Does this mean that you actually asked everybody if they were happy to see that person go? Or did you just extended your remark to incude everyone so as to give your assumption some undeserved clout.

"A university should be a place where differing views are expressed, tolerated and debated" Agreeable, but where did you pick up the rest of your comment? If the the original article/post had been read closely there is no mention of any such action. "not where one individual or group takes the entire institution hostage and forces her/their ideas on everyone else." Your use of confabulation to make a point invalidates the point; hence, you have made your own comment irrelevant.

Edited December 14, 2013 by IBoldnewguy

[chooka]

Doubt that Pridi himself would have much time for those who've signed this petition, nor some of the hacks currently masquerading as academics. Their job should be to encourage criticial thought, not suppress it.

What critical thought is a female student expressing by climbing on the statue of the university's founder and and positioning her crotch next to the statue's crotch?

What female student? The student in question is a bloke by the name of Mr. Saran Chuichai. A guy positioning his genitals against the statue's. I don't think the titles "MR" has become unisex.

Mr. Saran Chuichai is a man dressed in women's clothing.

Edited December 15, 2013 by chooka

[DocN]

Doubt that Pridi himself would have much time for those who've signed this petition, nor some of the hacks currently masquerading as academics. Their job should be to encourage criticial thought, not suppress it.

What critical thought is a female student expressing by climbing on the statue of the university's founder and and positioning her crotch next to the statue's crotch?

What female student? The student in question is a bloke by the name of Mr. Saran Chuichai. A guy positioning his genitals against the statue's. I don't think the titles "MR" has become unisex.

Mr. Saran Chuichai is a man dressed in women's clothing.

...and that makes her actions worse in ...what way, again?

[scorecard]

Yep all 3000 students signed because they were threatened if they did not sign it. I have had students tell me these things happen all the time. If a teacher wants something done he or she tells the students to do it or else.

I have many years of lecturing experience at this same university. It's true that some of the Thai lecturers (especially the older female lecturers) are pretty strong* but I don't believe the notion of the students en masse being threatened that if they did not sign....

(* there is always a percentage of lecturers at any university in any country who are similarly strong.)

Edited December 15, 2013 by scorecard

[Prbkk]

How embarrassing for this once fine university to have fallen so low. Today's The Nation quotes a senior official from his Facebook page as saying that he wants " to trample" the student, that she is " evil" and "a snake" . This is Thammasat, a university with a long and fine tradition of liberal thinking. The scandal is not the student but the university's complete overreaction to dissent and efforts to silence critics. Pathetic Thammasat, you deserve your declining reputation.

[kriswillems]

Although, I support the freedom of expression of this student, I believe she has "asked" for problems by her actions and I don't feel sorry for her.

If I would climb up a respected statue in Thailand or if I would pull down the Thai national flag and replace it by another flag, I would end up in jail.

She grew up in Thailand, knew the Thai culture , so she knew where the limits are.

She choose to exceed the limits at a moment Thai culture is not ready for it.

That doesn't mean I think she's wrong - it just means that she should have known what to expect.

[napawan28]

May be they hate her poster that spread around university.

[jayboy]

When I think back to my own student days in the late 60s/ early 70s (occupations over files, Angry Brigade, LSD etc) Khun Aum's infractions seem minor indeed. The Thammasat authorities will be laughed at in the West if they punish this student. The point made about struggling to find the rule that fits the 'crime' is all too apposite. As for those students signing the petition - better not put that on your CV if you apply for an overseas Ph.D. place.

Good point.This whole incident reflects badly not on the student involved but on Thammasat itself which once had a decent reputation for intellectual rigour and independent thought.

[richard10365]

Yep, the " thought police" out in force....

She isn't being prevented from thinking whatever she wants to think nor is she prevented from expressing those thoughts as long as it's done in a way that doesn't deprive others of their rights. I would assume admission to the university involved acceptance of some guidelines regarding behavior. A university should be a place where differing views are expressed, tolerated and debated, not where one individual or group takes the entire institution hostage and forces her/their ideas on everyone else.

If she feels sufficiently passionate about the importance of whatever she's promoting to violate the rules of the institution, that's fine but then she has to accept the cost. It's very noble to say you'll sacrifice yourself for the cause, but then you have to be prepared to actually make the sacrifice.

This was a great answer! This should end the entire argument. I see the majority of people obeying the set rules in the university I'm in. Then someone comes along and thinks they don't have to follow the rules because they want to be different. Then they get upset when they are told to stop. They forget the fact that the business has the option to refuse service when it so desires. They get expelled and think they were done wrong.

Pleeeeasssssseee!!!! The university does not belong to these individuals. If they want to be different then find a stage where people will gather to watch them. The university is not that stage. Universities do not want people's money that much.

When a student was suspended from my university everyone was happy to see that person go. Life returned to normal and students were able to focus on their studies without being distracted by this lone individual.Studying is hard enough without someone like this as a distraction. It's not fair to the majority of students and the student who is the distraction must be told to leave if they choose not to stop being the distraction. It's that simple.

These simple opinionated answers solve nothing other than to prove that the writers have tried to express assumptions as fact.

"When a student was suspended from my university" Does this mean you own or run a University? If you are a teacher that is very bad form and you should know better, if you are a student you can be forgiven but it's still a (C-). "everyone was happy to see that person go" Does this mean that you actually asked everybody if they were happy to see that person go? Or did you just extended your remark to incude everyone so as to give your assumption some undeserved clout.

"A university should be a place where differing views are expressed, tolerated and debated" Agreeable, but where did you pick up the rest of your comment? If the the original article/post had been read closely there is no mention of any such action. "not where one individual or group takes the entire institution hostage and forces her/their ideas on everyone else." Your use of confabulation to make a point invalidates the point; hence, you have made your own comment irrelevant.

I should know better? I do know better. I encouraged the people to do something long before the person did something that got them suspended. In fact...that person's acts were video tapped. So we had enough evidence to rid ourselves of the trouble maker. And yes, we talked about this person and we were happy they left. There are limits to differing views. A university is where views are talked about but not acted on if it infringes on others rights. This person infringed to the point of the university having the option to press legal charges on the individual. They opted for suspension. To make it worse, this person was a foreigner. So please don't give me your freedom of speech holier than thou BS speech on protecting the individual. There is a limit to differing views. If another person comes in like this again, I will act quicker to make sure this person either conforms to university norms or leaves the university rather than infringe on others their poor attitude.

[IBoldnewguy]

This was a great answer! This should end the entire argument. I see the majority of people obeying the set rules in the university I'm in. Then someone comes along and thinks they don't have to follow the rules because they want to be different. Then they get upset when they are told to stop. They forget the fact that the business has the option to refuse service when it so desires. They get expelled and think they were done wrong.

Pleeeeasssssseee!!!! The university does not belong to these individuals. If they want to be different then find a stage where people will gather to watch them. The university is not that stage. Universities do not want people's money that much.

When a student was suspended from my university everyone was happy to see that person go. Life returned to normal and students were able to focus on their studies without being distracted by this lone individual.Studying is hard enough without someone like this as a distraction. It's not fair to the majority of students and the student who is the distraction must be told to leave if they choose not to stop being the distraction. It's that simple.

These simple opinionated answers solve nothing other than to prove that the writers have tried to express assumptions as fact.

"When a student was suspended from my university" Does this mean you own or run a University? If you are a teacher that is very bad form and you should know better, if you are a student you can be forgiven but it's still a (C-). "everyone was happy to see that person go" Does this mean that you actually asked everybody if they were happy to see that person go? Or did you just extended your remark to incude everyone so as to give your assumption some undeserved clout.

"A university should be a place where differing views are expressed, tolerated and debated" Agreeable, but where did you pick up the rest of your comment? If the the original article/post had been read closely there is no mention of any such action. "not where one individual or group takes the entire institution hostage and forces her/their ideas on everyone else." Your use of confabulation to make a point invalidates the point; hence, you have made your own comment irrelevant.

I should know better? I do know better. I encouraged the people to do something long before the person did something that got them suspended. In fact...that person's acts were video tapped. So we had enough evidence to rid ourselves of the trouble maker. And yes, we talked about this person and we were happy they left. There are limits to differing views. A university is where views are talked about but not acted on if it infringes on others rights. This person infringed to the point of the university having the option to press legal charges on the individual. They opted for suspension. To make it worse, this person was a foreigner. So please don't give me your freedom of speech holier than thou BS speech on protecting the individual. There is a limit to differing views. If another person comes in like this again, I will act quicker to make sure this person either conforms to university norms or leaves the university rather than infringe on others their poor attitude.

Evidently, my comment was not understood; it wasn't about YOU. It was about the weak argument (and poor use of language) to make a point of comparison with what happened at The University where you are involved and what is happening with the student in the original post. And since you wrote as if you were a member of a University... I, as an educated person, expected better.

"So please don't give me your freedom of speech holier than thou BS speech on protecting the individual." How did you manage to pull that out of your magic hat? Certainly not from anything I wrote.

"There is a limit to differing views." If you really believe what you say... you should also understand that totalitarianism can be used against you as well as by you.

Regardless, how one writes or phrases a statement determines a reader's ability to agree or disagree with the veracity of the statement; both comments I've read agree with my original suspicion of an adolescent trying to impress but not quite making the grade.

Edited December 16, 2013 by IBoldnewguy