dowery?

[davetrout]

l have been with my girl 4 years now. she want to marry. we have a baby boy 4 months old now. l love her very much. how much should l pay for marry her and give to parents. she stay home with family in isann.

god help me

[Thai Chi]

Have a quick look through these for your answer ....

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/85581-sin-sod-an-explanation/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/637393-negotiating-sin-sot-with-a-upper-class-family-with-unreasonable-request/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/463726-how-much-you-pay-for-sin-sod/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/656338-guarantee-of-virginity-the-original-intention-of-sin-sot/

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/425442-sin-sot-psychology-and-consequent-burnout/

[Costas2008]

You have to pay NOTHING.

Just live happily with your wife and child.....even if it has to be away from the in-laws house.

[riepan963]

I agree, PAY NOTHING. I didn't almost 13 years ago but I still help out (a little) whenever necessary.

[happylarry]

If you pay nothing, as people are saying, then you are showing a complete disregard for your gf's and her parents feelings. Face is such a huge importance in Thailand and if you do not follow the old tradition of paying sinsot then they will lose face in their village or town.

My suggestion is to arrange with the family to pay an agreed amount (say 100,000) so they can display this on the day and then they return it afterwards. This system is often used and everyone is happy.

HL

[MeMock]

Been together for four years and already have a child? You are already married so no sin sot necessarily.

[Hugh Jarse]

If you pay nothing, as people are saying, then you are showing a complete disregard for your gf's and her parents feelings. Face is such a huge importance in Thailand and if you do not follow the old tradition of paying sinsot then they will lose face in their village or town.

My suggestion is to arrange with the family to pay an agreed amount (say 100,000) so they can display this on the day and then they return it afterwards. This system is often used and everyone is happy.

HL

Agree, by far the best option. You will be looked upon as a miser/cheapskate if you give nothing and her parents will feel belittled. By the way dowries are paid by the wife's family to the grooms for e.g in India. It is the opposite in Thailand and called Sin Sot. Good luck and enjoy the rituals.

[robblok]

If you pay nothing, as people are saying, then you are showing a complete disregard for your gf's and her parents feelings. Face is such a huge importance in Thailand and if you do not follow the old tradition of paying sinsot then they will lose face in their village or town.

My suggestion is to arrange with the family to pay an agreed amount (say 100,000) so they can display this on the day and then they return it afterwards. This system is often used and everyone is happy.

HL

Agree, by far the best option. You will be looked upon as a miser/cheapskate if you give nothing and her parents will feel belittled. By the way dowries are paid by the wife's family to the grooms for e.g in India. It is the opposite in Thailand and called Sin Sot. Good luck and enjoy the rituals.

The trick is making sure it gets returned that is where they show respect to you.. if you don't get it back you know enough.

[SlyAnimal]

How much you pay depends on a lot of things, but mainly on the girl you're marrying.

The weddings I've been to recently in the villages nearby, the sin sod has probably averaged around 300k. They were all girls marrying Thai guys, none from rich families, but all have university educations, no kids and no previous husbands/bfs (well at least not any that were of common knowledge).

[rebbu]

I put a million on the tray/bowl thingy and got it back after the ceremony.

[NeverSure]

The trick is making sure it gets returned that is where they show respect to you.. if you don't get it back you know enough.

Well, I'll never get married so it isn't my concern. But I'd say losing US$3k in a sin sot ripoff would be a cheap enough way to get out of ever giving them anything else.

[Somsrisonphimai]

It is up to you. If you do not pay dowry, you might be asked to pay for the cost of the wedding. By now you should be able to tell if not paying dowry could back fire you. Some parents want to show off to the neighbors how their daughter has a wealthy husband,

so they request big dowry. But I think dowry or not most parents want their daughter to be happy and marry a good, have a small, simple and normal wedding is good enough.

[cassde]

I am recently married to a Thai wife after 6 years and get on well with the 'in-laws'. Instead of a 'dowry' and with the 'in-laws' agreement I decided to rebuild their house, so that my wife and I have a room inside for us to stay when we visit.

It is working out far cheaper than for us to purchase a house in the area.

Circumstances are different for every couple.

[robblok]

The trick is making sure it gets returned that is where they show respect to you.. if you don't get it back you know enough.

Well, I'll never get married so it isn't my concern. But I'd say losing US$3k in a sin sot ripoff would be a cheap enough way to get out of ever giving them anything else.

That is for sure, 3k is not that much. But it was more the point, if someone says it will come back and it does not.. broken promises are never good.

[honoluludave]

Sin sod is a thai tradition that every thai man and foreign man marring a thai lady must do. Even if you do not agree with it. Its all a matter of Face and respect for your in-laws and their traditions. When it came time for my brother in-law to get married the whole family came together to put it together. With that being said Sin Sod is usually negotiated between the 2 families with everybody in both families watching. Because you have no family to negotiate for you it is usually left up to the girlfriend to do on your behalf. Just try and remember how much you would end up spending in your own country to get married. Your girlfriend should by this time know what you can afford. Depending on what kind of parents she has, you should get most of the money back after the cost of the wedding. And if you don't then you have a real good idea of what kind of in-laws you have. I have seen the total cost vary but if you don't do it the whole village will know it. And they will look down on you and give you no respect.

[robblok]

Sin sod is a thai tradition that every thai man and foreign man marring a thai lady must do. Even if you do not agree with it. Its all a matter of Face and respect for your in-laws and their traditions. When it came time for my brother in-law to get married the whole family came together to put it together. With that being said Sin Sod is usually negotiated between the 2 families with everybody in both families watching. Because you have no family to negotiate for you it is usually left up to the girlfriend to do on your behalf. Just try and remember how much you would end up spending in your own country to get married. Your girlfriend should by this time know what you can afford. Depending on what kind of parents she has, you should get most of the money back after the cost of the wedding. And if you don't then you have a real good idea of what kind of in-laws you have. I have seen the total cost vary but if you don't do it the whole village will know it. And they will look down on you and give you no respect.

I call B.S. on this one

But then again plenty of gullible foreigners around.

I have not paid a dime in sinsod and i know many other Thai and foreigners who have not paid it. Its an old custom and some use it to extract money from the foreigner / Thai. Its ok if it is returned but often it is not.

It certainly is not a thing everyone does that is just something those that have paid (and lost the money) say to feel better. I can see how if your twice the age of your prospected bride that you have to pay. (normal id say) but if your both educated same age ect ect. Why pay who even says its Thai custom that should rule a marriage between Thai and a foreigner.

*Sorry did not read good*

yes the money returned part .. then its just a show thing.. i think most could go with that and with the fact that you pay for your own wedding. I would find this a perfectly acceptable thing.

Edited December 28, 2013 by robblok

[davetrout]

I am recently married to a Thai wife after 6 years and get on well with the 'in-laws'. Instead of a 'dowry' and with the 'in-laws' agreement I decided to rebuild their house, so that my wife and I have a room inside for us to stay when we visit.

It is working out far cheaper than for us to purchase a house in the area.

Circumstances are different for every couple.

yes l can see this working l will put this idea to my g/f

cheers

[honoluludave]

Sin sod is a thai tradition that every thai man and foreign man marring a thai lady must do. Even if you do not agree with it. Its all a matter of Face and respect for your in-laws and their traditions. When it came time for my brother in-law to get married the whole family came together to put it together. With that being said Sin Sod is usually negotiated between the 2 families with everybody in both families watching. Because you have no family to negotiate for you it is usually left up to the girlfriend to do on your behalf. Just try and remember how much you would end up spending in your own country to get married. Your girlfriend should by this time know what you can afford. Depending on what kind of parents she has, you should get most of the money back after the cost of the wedding. And if you don't then you have a real good idea of what kind of in-laws you have. I have seen the total cost vary but if you don't do it the whole village will know it. And they will look down on you and give you no respect.

I call B.S. on this one

But then again plenty of gullible foreigners around.

I have not paid a dime in sinsod and i know many other Thai and foreigners who have not paid it. Its an old custom and some use it to extract money from the foreigner / Thai. Its ok if it is returned but often it is not.

It certainly is not a thing everyone does that is just something those that have paid (and lost the money) say to feel better. I can see how if your twice the age of your prospected bride that you have to pay. (normal id say) but if your both educated same age ect ect. Why pay who even says its Thai custom that should rule a marriage between Thai and a foreigner.

*Sorry did not read good*

yes the money returned part .. then its just a show thing.. i think most could go with that and with the fact that you pay for your own wedding. I would find this a perfectly acceptable thing.

[honoluludave]

You can call BS if you want. Whatever. I was only commenting on what I have seen since I have been out here. I realize that most foreigners hate the idea and it does bring a rather strong response most times .I myself do not care for it. But I do not think that I am gullible and I do know that thai men do pay it.

[rgs2001uk]

You can call BS if you want. Whatever. I was only commenting on what I have seen since I have been out here. I realize that most foreigners hate the idea and it does bring a rather strong response most times .I myself do not care for it. But I do not think that I am gullible and I do know that thai men do pay it.

Please not another farang studying for an MBA in Thainess.

What I have observed is the happy couple saving together for about 5 or 6 years and putting in say 6k per month between them,the girl included.

If this girl is contributing nothing to the wedding you may want to reconsider your choice of partner.

What is the girls family contibuting towards the cost of the wedding and the honeymoon?

If you as the farang are expected to pay for the whole lot you are being taken for a ride, I can assure you in the Thai/Thai weddings I have attended both parents share the costs.

Its nothing to do with hating the idea, its based on observing what happens in most Thai/Thai weddings.

If little Lek from Nakon Nowhere does let you know these things, then the wedding is just the start of your problems, no Thai man would stand for some of the stunts that are pulled.

Its all about compromise, respect is a two way street, how are the girl and her family repsecting you as the farang?

Do they know in your culture is expected for the brides family to pay for the wedding?

This isnt a Thai/Thai wedding, there is a farang involved, how is he being respected?

Lets ask the OP, where does the girl and her family stand on the Thai totem pole of face?

Are they business owners, how much land do they own? etc etc

What are the girl and her family bringing to the relationship?

What type of Thai guy would she have been expected to marry?

Too many questions, not enough info provided.

[robblok]

You can call BS if you want. Whatever. I was only commenting on what I have seen since I have been out here. I realize that most foreigners hate the idea and it does bring a rather strong response most times .I myself do not care for it. But I do not think that I am gullible and I do know that thai men do pay it.

Please not another farang studying for an MBA in Thainess.

What I have observed is the happy couple saving together for about 5 or 6 years and putting in say 6k per month between them,the girl included.

If this girl is contributing nothing to the wedding you may want to reconsider your choice of partner.

What is the girls family contibuting towards the cost of the wedding and the honeymoon?

If you as the farang are expected to pay for the whole lot you are being taken for a ride, I can assure you in the Thai/Thai weddings I have attended both parents share the costs.

Its nothing to do with hating the idea, its based on observing what happens in most Thai/Thai weddings.

If little Lek from Nakon Nowhere does let you know these things, then the wedding is just the start of your problems, no Thai man would stand for some of the stunts that are pulled.

Its all about compromise, respect is a two way street, how are the girl and her family repsecting you as the farang?

Do they know in your culture is expected for the brides family to pay for the wedding?

This isnt a Thai/Thai wedding, there is a farang involved, how is he being respected?

Lets ask the OP, where does the girl and her family stand on the Thai totem pole of face?

Are they business owners, how much land do they own? etc etc

What are the girl and her family bringing to the relationship?

What type of Thai guy would she have been expected to marry?

Too many questions, not enough info provided.

Great post.

[swissie]

Just a reminder: No Thai-Male would consider paying any sort of sin-sod for a Thai-Female, married before (with of without children). Period.

Thai-Male Comment: Never no pay for used P***y.

No wonder that Farangs in the autumn of their lives and not familiar with Thai-Customs are in such demand. Sin-Sod plus building mansion on family land = Jackpot !!

All of the (in the meantime) under-employed bar-hostessess in Pattaya dream of such happy circumstances. But time works against this concept. Farangs are getting "street-smart" and more familiar with "Thai-Ways" including the legal-system that is stacked heavily against them.

.

Cheers.

[DILLIGAD]

Honeymoon?

Is that a Thai tradition too?

[Paangjang]

Just a reminder: No Thai-Male would consider paying any sort of sin-sod for a Thai-Female, married before (with of without children). Period.

Thai-Male Comment: Never no pay for used P***y.

No wonder that Farangs in the autumn of their lives and not familiar with Thai-Customs are in such demand. Sin-Sod plus building mansion on family land = Jackpot !!

All of the (in the meantime) under-employed bar-hostessess in Pattaya dream of such happy circumstances. But time works against this concept. Farangs are getting "street-smart" and more familiar with "Thai-Ways" including the legal-system that is stacked heavily against them.

.

Cheers.

This is very true. Sin sod is not viable for used pu**y. However i agree with the post about showing respect for the family. Their daughter might be soiled goods but if you want to marry the spoiled goods then you must offer them something to save them from losing face. It's not their fault that you got their daughter pregga's before you made a woman out of her. Offer them a sinsod of whatever amount you can afford but make sure you agree that it comes straight back to their daughter. This will give her some security and save the family from losing face infront of the other villagers. It will also start a respectful relationship between the 3 parties involved.

[soihok]

Never paid a sinsot but bought a house, which my wife, children and I live in (when we are back in Thailand).

As I managed to accumulate wealth over the years, I have provided my in laws with a shop house and a pick up.

We help each other, everyone's a winner.

All one big happy family really.

Cheers

Edited December 30, 2013 by soihok

[Donnie Brasco]

l have been with my girl 4 years now. she want to marry. we have a baby boy 4 months old now. l love her very much. how much should l pay for marry her and give to parents. she stay home with family in isann.

god help me

Yes Dave, you are into the glue.

Your sinsot is not necessary because your couple hood is time tested and your love for her and your baby is evident.

The poor women is just being badgered by her family to squeeze some more money out of you.

You have to man up NOW

They will never stop nagging her, yapping about some other gal of their acquaintance who has shown her love for family by blackmailing the farang husband.

They will also be asking her who she thinks will take care of her in her old age.

They will mix examples from both cultures to make their point.

Ad nauseam.

Get her to tell them to get lost.

[robblok]

l have been with my girl 4 years now. she want to marry. we have a baby boy 4 months old now. l love her very much. how much should l pay for marry her and give to parents. she stay home with family in isann.

god help me

Yes Dave, you are into the glue.

Your sinsot is not necessary because your couple hood is time tested and your love for her and your baby is evident.

The poor women is just being badgered by her family to squeeze some more money out of you.

You have to man up NOW

They will never stop nagging her, yapping about some other gal of their acquaintance who has shown her love for family by blackmailing the farang husband.

They will also be asking her who she thinks will take care of her in her old age.

They will mix examples from both cultures to make their point.

Ad nauseam.

Get her to tell them to get lost.

I agree, though a show of money (the kind that is returned) is acceptable. Otherwise why.. I mean love is proven your happy now. If you pay the other sin sod the one that does not get returned you will be an ATM for life.

[rgs2001uk]

Honeymoon?

Is that a Thai tradition too?

These days its just another example of Western Crapola that is washing up on these shores.

These girls have nothing better to do with their lives than watch Thai soaps and read those stupid "dara" magazines at the local hairdresser shop, of course their "sisters" who have relocated to farangland also keep them informed of what to ask for.

You know what they are like up that way, never miss a chance to gain some face at the local market, bonus points if you can rub your neighbours face in the buffalo shit at the same time, double bonus points if the farang footed the bill for the lot.

The last 3 weddings I attended all involved a honeymoon, the first one the couple were going back to Virginia in The States where they met at uni, another couple went to The Gold Coast in Oz, the third couple went on one of these 10 day Singapore/Honk Kong/Macau holidays.

As for weddings, have you seen the costs involved, screwed if you do screwed if you dont.

These weddings can easily cost upwards of 1 million baht ++.

400 people at 700 baht per head Chinese table, throw in the free whisky (dont lose face now by providing el cheapo Thai rubbish) Black Label or Chivas (otherwise you will be called a tight ass) then the live entertainment, dont forget the coyote dancers for some extra face, thats us at 600k just for starters.

Next a honeymoon, another 300k, 1 week at the Sabai Lodge in Pattaya really wont do, if its in Thailand Laguna beach in Phuket.

Dont forget photographers and poncy outfits for the hangers on.

Alternatively you can do like many Thais do, just move in with each other and dont worry about a wedding.

I know many couples who tell me they cant afford to get married, rising costs, rising property prices etc etc.

Just do what these couples do, say maybe next year, next year repeat.

[swissie]

Never paid a sinsot but bought a house, which my wife, children and I live in (when we are back in Thailand).

As I managed to accumulate wealth over the years, I have provided my in laws with a shop house and a pick up.

We help each other, everyone's a winner.

All one big happy family really.

Cheers

Quote: "When we are back in Thailand".

By not even living in Thailand yet and having already made major financial commitments, this would make any Thai-Family very happy. Everyone is a winner.

In a couple of years let us all know how the game of "everyone is a winner" has unfolded.

Cheers.

[soihok]

Never paid a sinsot but bought a house, which my wife, children and I live in (when we are back in Thailand).

As I managed to accumulate wealth over the years, I have provided my in laws with a shop house and a pick up.

We help each other, everyone's a winner.

All one big happy family really.

Cheers

Quote: "When we are back in Thailand".

By not even living in Thailand yet and having already made major financial commitments, this would make any Thai-Family very happy. Everyone is a winner.

In a couple of years let us all know how the game of "everyone is a winner" has unfolded.

Cheers.

Er--Swissie.

Best not to judge a book by its cover eh? After being a member since 2006 you should know this.

Been living in Thailand for many years, together, but not at the moment as I have found employment which pays me the equivalent of more than half a million baht a month (in Malaysia). My wife and I have been together for approaching 15 years now.

My Thai in laws and one of our sisters in law care for our severely disabled daughter in Thailand, we are paying to send one of our nieces to a decent school.

No need to explain myself more, but you are obviously experiencing some negative situations in Thailand aren't you ? Do you want talk about it?

Seems we don't appear to be in the same boat do we.

Have a nice day, all the same.

I didn't give my in laws a sinsot, but as I said, everyone's a winner and happy (which is the main goal in life, is it not?).

Edited December 30, 2013 by soihok