Sell Car = Greater Happiness?

[puukao]

I am 100% sure there is a direct correlation between driving and unhappiness. I do ride in a car when I go shopping, but I have a friend who drives me. I don't need a car for many, many other activities. take the red/yellow bus to bus terminals, airports, whatever....and walk, bike to other places. if you are married, have kids, i am sure a car might be mandatory.

When in a car, people are allowed to be judge/jury. it's about having power. maybe they hate their job, life, whatever; however, when in the car they have more power.

In CM, it is one endless frustration after another when behind the wheel. It's like I end up hating every other driver; why are you going 50 kph over the speed limit and flashing your lights at me to move? it's a one-way street with one lane. are you drunk, crazy? it's like every other driver is bothered by my "safe, speed-limit, common-sense" driving.

anyhow, rant somewhat over.......if you are like me and get more mad than happy when driving. sell the car. i did. gone. i am sure my stress level is done. it might just be me, i know. but maybe not. so will post this and curious if others agree......if not, mai bpen rai.

[Thighlander]

unnecessary liability and expense. Thais are horrible drivers. Live on songtaew routes that are non-dog infested, so you can walk sometimes. The massive advertising campaigns brainwash people into thinking they need a car. GM successfully did this in the US, and it seems to be working in Thailand, too, because of the massive amounts of individual debts people carry.

A fancy car in front of a slummy rental is right out of the old South.

[lachiplo]

i barely use my car as well, only for longer trips out of town. the hassle is just too much. the parking and traffic situation within the town is plain annoying.

it took me nearly 2 hours from ksk to drive to maya the other day. its insane and i can really feel the frustration and blood pressure building up

[mesquite]

I'm not going to sell mine, but if I had it to do over again, I wouldn't buy a car.

[FolkGuitar]

Five years ago I sold my car. My stress level was instantly reduced 90%. The difference was amazing. It was like throwing a light switch.

The odd times that we need/want a car, I can have one delivered to my door for under 1,000 baht a day, and picked up when I'm finished with it. For the rest of the time, we use motor scooters and don't have to deal with sitting in massive traffic jams or endless rides at 4km per hour. Same with a large motorcycle... When we feel like going motorcycle touring, we can rent a big bike for the day or the weekend and go. With the little scooters, parking is no longer an issue, and getting from point A to point B (if we survive) is quick and easy. No stress at all.

But stress isn't the only issue. We figured out that we can take 4 selor trips around town per day for 5 years before we equal the expense of buying and maintaining a car. And we rarely need to take 4 selor trips per day! One or two every few days at most, doubling the savings.

Stress down, money up. I like that!

[mesquite]

In the positive column, having a car is quite convenient when it is hot or raining. Also, what is a minor collision in a car can mean a head injury, paralysis, or death on a motorbike.

Edited January 30, 2014 by mesquite

[cloudhopper]

Your problem is not having a car, your problem is living in a city that has too many rats in the maze.

[BlackArtemis]

Got rid of the civic and now have a Ninja 650 and a Honda Dream, best. decision. ever.

[NancyL]

Thank you puukao, for starting this topic. One reason we retired here was because we wanted to live in a city where we didn't need a car. Yes, you can definitely live here without a car, but it's becoming less-and-less pleasant.

Now we ask ourselves -- is there anything about this city that is better than it was when retired here and we'd gave to say no. The cause of all the reasons we'd have to say no is the increase in car traffic.

Well, I suppose it's really the growth of the city, with no thought given to how to handle the cars. No thought given to developing real public transportation. No thought given to improving pedestrian access in the city . And on a national level, no thought given to the ramifications of building a consumer credit bubble by encouraging car ownership by people who can ill afford to make payments.

Edited January 30, 2014 by NancyL

[Dante99]

Driving can be stressful but most people seem to choose to very significantly increase that stress by getting emotional and dramatic about other drivers should or should not, delays, parking, judging, power, common sense and a lot of other things which are not essential to the operation of a vehicle. With regard to the stress of operating a vehicle, a motorcycle is more stressful for me but it can of course be quicker and easier to park if time is really that important and you do not want to walk a bit after parking.

When you are stopped by traffic or a red light, say thank you for the opportunity to do some deep breathing meditation and do it.

[jackr]

Yep, sold it years ago, same as you, just a nightmare driving anywhere in town and there is always some unbelievable manoeuvre occurring on any journey. On a bike you're tucked away from the madness in the hard shoulder.

Problem with the way this society has evolved is, a car is seen as a status symbol and you are a bit of a nobody without one. Perfect for the car makers and I guess it is anywhere, but here many locals with a pickup will be basically living in squaller to pay for the thing. What a state of affairs.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

it's dismal situation.

Thai's are attracted to status and avoiding any physical exertion so not a lot is going to slow down the increase in vehicles.

We know from recent studies Thailand has produced the now 2nd or 3rd most fatal driving conditions in the world.

I am giving more and more thought to retire in Southern California (Coachella valley) because the walking and bicycling infrastructure is wildly superior. I can go weeks without almost being killed by a car. I sometimes feel lonely there that nobody wants to kill me every few minutes.

One thing is certain. If there is an invention that can solve this mess then it will not be invented or implemented in Thailand.

Maybe keep your fingers crossed for a big recession or something.

[Tywais]

No thought given to developing real public transportation.

Actually there has been thought about that but certain 'powers' keep squelching it to protect their business. When I first came to CM 20+ years ago there was an operational bus system with bus stops around the city but slowly faded away. Attempts to start another metro style bus system kept running into obstacles due to the tuk tuk, sawng taew and now taxi mafia groups. Even took a very long time before metered taxis managed to break through that barrier but even so, rather limited.

[Berkshire]

Yet another thread about Thai driving, with a slight variation. People convincing themselves that they don't need a car. Good for you. Will absolutely save you money. You can also save money by not having A/C, eating plain rice every meal, no TV, no internet, no cable, etc., etc.

I could not live without a car. My quality of life, freedom, etc, would go straight down the toilet. I drive every single day. Every single day. Rarely a problem getting to and from. Zero stress most of the time. What are you people on about?

[ttthailand]

It really depends where you live and if you require assistance in getting around. I once lived in a village in Buriram and a car made life so much more enjoyable. There was no real public transportation that went anywhere except to some of the other small villages. Big C and other stores were 50Km away. I now live in Bkk and am only a 10 minute walk from the BTS and have taxis running up and down the street all the time. If I had a car here I would never use it, no need. In Chiang Mai city or other similar cities I think it is also not really required unless you can not get around by yourself and require a wheelchair or walker. If I want to take a week trip up country I can rent a car for a week.

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[BlackArtemis]

Yet another thread about Thai driving, with a slight variation. People convincing themselves that they don't need a car. Good for you. Will absolutely save you money. You can also save money by not having A/C, eating plain rice every meal, no TV, no internet, no cable, etc., etc.

I could not live without a car. My quality of life, freedom, etc, would go straight down the toilet. I drive every single day. Every single day. Rarely a problem getting to and from. Zero stress most of the time. What are you people on about?

Surprisingly some of us may drive different routes and times than you do.

Such as I was at the Canal road/ Suthep intersection where the morons were controlling the lights as usual. Except yesterday they were giving my light 10seconds and the other lights 40-60. Thai people are not that great at starting fast from a light, so 3 cars were getting through, there was a 300-500m back up already. On my bike I got through on the second green, but barely since the girl in front of me was too afraid to filter between parked cars.

We are not convincing ourselves that we don't need the car, we just don't. If I had a small child, sure, but I and many others do not.

As for saving money, my bike is worth more than my old civic :shrug:

I ride everyday, I ride up to 10 hours, routes that I have done with a car, the bike is FAR more enjoyable, my quality of life has improved as I can go anywhere faster, avoid traffic, and park anywhere I want.

Is it better than what you have? I don't know, I am not you, but it's fantastic for me, and it seems others as well.

[Bung]

Having a car is great, I cannot imagine not having one! just the freedom to go where you want and when but that is just me, I have a gf and son to take care of. One thing I do is not drive anywhere from 4pm until 8pm then the traffic is much more civilised. I use a motorbike to run errands in town so much easier to get around and park. I also sold my pickup for a smaller car.

Driving up a mountain road with my GF with the windows down and warm sunshine streaming in to a nice place for lunch.....Priceless....I'll keep my car thanks.

[searcher22]

I have a car but avoid driving during peak hours. Or I just park in a secure location and take the red bus from there. Saves time and reduces stress, and you get to mingle with other people.

I used to get around in a scooter but I sold it for two main reasons: 1) not practical during the wet season and 2) the risk of an accident and the prospect of long-term disability or worse. I began to realize how fragile life is when you're on a motorcycle. I feel I was "pushing the envelope" unnecessarily, that if some insurance companies won't even cover you or have limits to what they'll pay if you have an accident... there must be a reason for that.

If you can't have a car, the only time I would opt for a motorcycle is if 1) you need it to make a living 2) it allows you to live in a quiet and less expensive area of town not easily accessible by bus, or 3) if you have wanderlust and love to live for the moment.

It's sad to say, but having a car in Chiang Mai is an advantage for most people most of the time. Not only does it provide transportation, for some it also provides a sense of security (you're "locked up", your shopping bags are safely tucked in the trunk, and you don't have to deal with them dogs. Those who come from one of the many beautiful walkable cities of Europe and America are in a for a shock here in Chiang Mai. Hopefully there's a skytrain somewhere in the city's future, but it's gonna get a whole lot worse before it gets better, so hold on tight...

[hml367]

No thought given to developing real public transportation.

Actually there has been thought about that but certain 'powers' keep squelching it to protect their business. When I first came to CM 20+ years ago there was an operational bus system with bus stops around the city but slowly faded away. Attempts to start another metro style bus system kept running into obstacles due to the tuk tuk, sawng taew and now taxi mafia groups. Even took a very long time before metered taxis managed to break through that barrier but even so, rather limited.

I agree with you , Tywais. People have more misconceptions and believe what is being said if it fits their needs.

Specifically for "thought being given developing real public transportation", just one of the places you can check is CMU. People make assumptions that nothing is or has been one about certain things and it is not that way at all.

[circusman]

You couldn't pay me to ride a motorcycle in Thailand. I want lots of steel around me when someone crashes into me. And as for climbing into to those diesel belching song tows, forget it. I taught the person who drives me and he is a great driver. Could drive in any city in the world. And I am not a backseat driver.

[true blue]

my god no car i would be completely lost without my wheels,i drive everywere all over the city no proplem,i enjoy the husle and bustle of everyday driving,im never ever in that much of a rush to get from a to b so i never have any stress,and any way watching the totty on the motor bikes trying to squeeze past your car is well worth the wait,and the view.and as my chest is getting its yearly cough,i just could never imagine sitting in a cattle truck or a tuk tuk breathing in all them car fumes.

[onthedarkside]

I have a car, my wife has a car but uses her motor bike to go to the local market. My wife insisted that I not drive my motor bike about 6 years ago as she was concerned for my safety. So I bought a small car and have never used a bike since then. Sure it's a hassle in heavy traffic, and the traffic is growing heavier year on year. I need to be mobile for our business and I am happy to have a car. Just recently I have been pushing for my wife to stop using her m/bike completely as we have had far too many bike accidents in our area. Think she is coming round to my way of thinking as she has started using her car even on short trips to the market. To all our members driving motor bikes - take care out on those Thai roads.

[beau thai]

Thank you puukao, for starting this topic. One reason we retired here was because we wanted to live in a city where we didn't need a car. Yes, you can definitely live here without a car, but it's becoming less-and-less pleasant.

Now we ask ourselves -- is there anything about this city that is better than it was when retired here and we'd gave to say no. The cause of all the reasons we'd have to say no is the increase in car traffic.

Well, I suppose it's really the growth of the city, with no thought given to how to handle the cars. No thought given to developing real public transportation. No thought given to improving pedestrian access in the city . And on a national level, no thought given to the ramifications of building a consumer credit bubble by encouraging car ownership by people who can ill afford to make payments.

Disagree Nancy that no thought has been given to the car growth.

For me and many, the ring roads just work so well. No need to drive through the city just take nearest access point to a ring road and cut back in at the convenient point. And many underpasses on ring roads to avoid junctions.

I started here without a car but now I wouldnt be without it. Despite what may farang say about bad driving, Thai's drive to expect the unexpected as the unexpected happens every trip. My experience of driving in many other western cities is that drivers ar far far more aggressive than defensive drivers here.

Of course there are far too many cars in the old city but I would hate to see them fix that any way other than banning cars altogether as it would lose its character.

Electric Tuk-tuk and songthaew, plus resident's cars only in the old city-now that would be progress in my view. But many will disgree....

[BlackArtemis]

Thank you puukao, for starting this topic. One reason we retired here was because we wanted to live in a city where we didn't need a car. Yes, you can definitely live here without a car, but it's becoming less-and-less pleasant.

Now we ask ourselves -- is there anything about this city that is better than it was when retired here and we'd gave to say no. The cause of all the reasons we'd have to say no is the increase in car traffic.

Well, I suppose it's really the growth of the city, with no thought given to how to handle the cars. No thought given to developing real public transportation. No thought given to improving pedestrian access in the city . And on a national level, no thought given to the ramifications of building a consumer credit bubble by encouraging car ownership by people who can ill afford to make payments.

Disagree Nancy that no thought has been given to the car growth.

For me and many, the ring roads just work so well. No need to drive through the city just take nearest access point to a ring road and cut back in at the convenient point. And many underpasses on ring roads to avoid junctions.

I started here without a car but now I wouldnt be without it. Despite what may farang say about bad driving, Thai's drive to expect the unexpected as the unexpected happens every trip. My experience of driving in many other western cities is that drivers ar far far more aggressive than defensive drivers here.

Of course there are far too many cars in the old city but I would hate to see them fix that any way other than banning cars altogether as it would lose its character.

Electric Tuk-tuk and songthaew, plus resident's cars only in the old city-now that would be progress in my view. But many will disgree....

If there was forethought, why is there no extra lane at the intersection and / or underpass underneath Maya. Part of the construction agreement should have included the constructin of these extra lanes.

Or what about that huge condo at the corner of Sirmunkalanjarn and Suthep not have an extra left hand turn lane, but instead just a huge area of empty concrete?

Tons of corner lots are being bought up around town and none show any sign of this.

As for aggression, get on a bike in an area they need to come into your lane to pass another. For a nation of people who " drive to expect the unexpected as the unexpected happens every trip"

They sure like to pass on blind corners, cut across lanes of traffic without looking, and a myriad of other actions that are no where near defensive in nature.

Why are cops allowed to control lights when they obviously have no clue as to what their doing?

They tried one way streets in Nimman and it helped a lot, but they didn't decide on keeping it permanent because it would mean police might actually have to do some paper work (tickets).

I still like riding here, but I accept that my host country has deadly roads and my hosts are shit drivers who are more likely to kill me and drive off than give me the right of way.

[searcher22]

Yet another thread about Thai driving, with a slight variation. People convincing themselves that they don't need a car. Good for you. Will absolutely save you money. You can also save money by not having A/C, eating plain rice every meal, no TV, no internet, no cable, etc., etc.

I could not live without a car. My quality of life, freedom, etc, would go straight down the toilet. I drive every single day. Every single day. Rarely a problem getting to and from. Zero stress most of the time. What are you people on about?

It's not so much about saving money. It's about reallocating resources. When you consider the huge costs of car ownership over a span of years, that money could have been used for other things:

* taking many small trips to other countries or visiting your home country every year or two

* buying top-notch medical insurance and medical care, and having a solid "emergency fund" available

* living in a roomier, more beautiful condo (maybe even with a jacuzzi and part-time cook)

* eating at finer restaurants

* early retirement or not having to work as much

These things will enhance your quality of life, not diminish it. But I agree, for some people, it's not an option.

If you have all of those things and still own a car - and you're happy - then you're living the dream. Enjoy!

[true blue]

Yet another thread about Thai driving, with a slight variation. People convincing themselves that they don't need a car. Good for you. Will absolutely save you money. You can also save money by not having A/C, eating plain rice every meal, no TV, no internet, no cable, etc., etc.

I could not live without a car. My quality of life, freedom, etc, would go straight down the toilet. I drive every single day. Every single day. Rarely a problem getting to and from. Zero stress most of the time. What are you people on about?

It's not so much about saving money. It's about reallocating resources. When you consider the huge costs of car ownership over a span of years, that money could have been used for other things:

* taking many small trips to other countries or visiting your home country every year or two

* buying top-notch medical insurance and medical care, and having a solid "emergency fund" available

* living in a roomier, more beautiful condo (maybe even with a jacuzzi and part-time cook)

* eating at finer restaurants

* early retirement or not having to work as much

These things will enhance your quality of life, not diminish it. But I agree, for some people, it's not an option.

If you have all of those things and still own a car - and you're happy - then you're living the dream. Enjoy!

[true blue]

the cost of all the items you mentioned i presume people who live here already have them and having a car is just another expense in life,like wifes, girl friends, good wine ect ect.

[NancyL]

No thought given to developing real public transportation.

Actually there has been thought about that but certain 'powers' keep squelching it to protect their business. When I first came to CM 20+ years ago there was an operational bus system with bus stops around the city but slowly faded away. Attempts to start another metro style bus system kept running into obstacles due to the tuk tuk, sawng taew and now taxi mafia groups. Even took a very long time before metered taxis managed to break through that barrier but even so, rather limited.

I agree with you , Tywais. People have more misconceptions and believe what is being said if it fits their needs.

Specifically for "thought being given developing real public transportation", just one of the places you can check is CMU. People make assumptions that nothing is or has been one about certain things and it is not that way at all.

Well, OK, some people in Thailand have "given thought" to the growth of Chiang Mai, how to deal with all the cars, public transportation, etc. Good to know there is no shortage of academic studies on these subjects. Perhaps a better choice of words on my part would have been "lack of political will" to implement what needs to be done to maintain Chiang Mai as a liveable city". Or something like that.

As for saying the ring roads work just fine and there's no need to drive into the city, then how come there are so many cars in the city? Why isn't Huey Kaew a pedestrian mall, served by a skytrain? Obviously thousands of people with cars feel the need to get off those ring roads and come into the city every day.

[BillyBobThai]

Until they get the bugs worked out of this system, Chiang Mai will continue to have traffic problems.

[puukao]

I am glad I wasn't alone in my thinking. Of course, part is MY fault. I see a car coming much faster than necessary while I am in the slow lane, and I'm sure I instantly tell myself, "calm down, no horn, relax, don't let the gf see you get all upset if this guy goes crazy." It is safer in a car than motorbike, and a bicycle will never total a car/van/bus; however, once i got over the stigma of walking i was fine. CM will definitely have traffic problems, since driving is simply so much easier on the body than walking, biking, and why sit next to stinky strangers in a bus if you don't have to. So, next time you see the crazy road rage........smile, and forget about gas, insurance, and repair bills.