Aeon Bank now charge 150 B ATM fee

[meand]

meand, lighten up. It's a discussion forum and folk are merely positing pros and cons in relation to this topic as they would to questions like the relative attractiveness of women in Nong Khai versus their Lao cousins just over the border. Fortunately, we all have options and no-one is stopping you or I carrying as much or as little cash as we deem fit.

I am light as a feather.

[Gillyflower]

I have just walked down Thae Phae Road (CM). I passed some violent blue bank - K something. Travellers Cheques - Fees

Fee 30

Stamp Duty 3

i.e. 33 baht

We only accept American Express.

[meand]

Survey results are in...9 out of 10 muggers/thivies prefer cash over traveler cheques and credit/debit cards.

But the survey also showed 10 out of 10 Thai banks prefer travelers cheques and debit/credit cards since then earn a Bt150 or more fee on each transaction.

Sent from my Samsung S4 (GT-I9500)

The survey is 999 out of 1000 thieves preferred the variety of victims whom they knew was carrying something valuable by way of "showing" it to them, in one capacity or another.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I did about 3 or so over the counter debit card withdraws at Bangkok Bank with no problem, with signing papers, showing id and deposited into my account there until I found out that the usa bank csr told me wrong and my bank was charging me a 1% cc fee then I stopped doing it. All of these were over the atm limit.

Thanks for the info and report Zeek... You mention using a debit card, but then talk about a "1% cc fee." What's a CC fee? Currency conversion?

Edited February 19, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[zeekgarcia]

I did about 3 or so over the counter debit card withdraws at Bangkok Bank with no problem, with signing papers, showing id and deposited into my account there until I found out that the usa bank csr told me wrong and my bank was charging me a 1% cc fee then I stopped doing it. All of these were over the atm limit.

Thanks for the info and report Zeek... You mention using a debit card, but then talk about a "1% cc fee." What's a CC fee? Currency conversion?

yes sorry I was lazy cc fee= Currency conversion fee

[Pib]

Survey results are in...9 out of 10 muggers/thivies prefer cash over traveler cheques and credit/debit cards.

But the survey also showed 10 out of 10 Thai banks prefer travelers cheques and debit/credit cards since then earn a Bt150 or more fee on each transaction.

Sent from my Samsung S4 (GT-I9500)

The survey is 999 out of 1000 thieves preferred the variety of victims whom they knew was carrying something valuable by way of "showing" it to them, in one capacity or another.

But farangs are almost always carrying something valuable or its back in their hotel room....let's follow them...those farangs almost always have money....plus they'll be gone back to their home country in a few days/weeks and we won't have to hide from them in case they happen to see us...robbing a Thai would be different.

Nope, not for me...before I moved to Thailand and was just visiting for a week or two every year I would carry along around $1,000 in cash with some travelers cheques but then I was staying with Thai in-laws and on some business trips in some 4 and 5 star hotels which probably had better security. And during my military days I was at locations in Thailand where it got down right dangerous at night. But coming over with a big wad of cash like $5-$10K, I just wouldn't do that...too many things can happen. For short visits of a few weeks or less I think a person would be much smarter and safer to bring along some cash and then use travelers cheques and debit/credit cards unless the total in fees just hurts too much because for many folks I know traveler cheques cost to be issued (but at many U.S. credit unions you can get them for free) and of course you got the fee on this end which now appears to be climbing up to a Bt150 bank fee + 3 baht govt stamp fee per check...definitely best to use large denomination travelers cheques. Even better if they are frequent visitors to Thailand to already have a Thai bank account and wire the funds over in advance if really sure of coming and associated fees don't hurt too bad. My mom and dad grew up during the U.S. depression...they definitely taught me the value of money and not to be stupid with it. Cheers.

[Pib]

.

I think the 32.52 rate posted earlier is realistic. There's been a spike the past two days vs. USD

X-Rates is currently reporting 32.47

http://www.x-rates.com/graph/?from=USD&to=THB&amount=1.00

THB 0218a.jpg

PS: If you're always that good at hitting the hot spot, I'd book the next flight to Macau or Vegas . . .

.

But Visa/MasterCard exchange rates are set for a 24 hour period...once set, they do not change over that 24 hour period barring a major financial event occurring.

However, Forex rates change second by second and those bank rates like Thai bank TT Buying Rates used for incoming wire transfers, Notes/Cash buying rates at the bank counter, etc., which follow Forex rates to a great degree (but at a lower rate) can change quite a few times everyday...not uncommon for the bank rates to change a half dozen times per day...I've seen SCB rates change around 18 times a day when the Forex market was very volatile. And these Thai bank rates will be a little lower than Forex rates because that's the main way the bank make a little on every exchange.

But remember, debit/credit cards MasterCard/Visa rates only change once a day...currently the Visa rate changes at noon except when the U.S. is on Daylight Saving time then the Visa rate changes a 11am in Thailand...not quite sure during the day when the MC rate changes...maybe the same time. Yesterdays MC rate was 32.08...today the rate is 32.17/USD.

Yeap, I just don't know what a happened in Paz's case other than maybe K-bank processed it such a way that mistakenly gave the Selling Rate. If I was him I would be happy also. And if it was a mistake K-bank may or may not process a correction...sometimes submitting a correction is very hard to do so and the bank/merchant who made the mistake just sucks it up.

[joealx]

.

I think the 32.52 rate posted earlier is realistic. There's been a spike the past two days vs. USD

X-Rates is currently reporting 32.47

http://www.x-rates.com/graph/?from=USD&to=THB&amount=1.00

THB 0218a.jpg

PS: If you're always that good at hitting the hot spot, I'd book the next flight to Macau or Vegas . . .

.

32.47 is what Bangkok Bank gave me this morning at 9:20. This should be the $5.00 rate (for trial deposits $0.40 and $0.60) and it was 1% less than the posted $5 selling rate.

Edited February 19, 2014 by joealx

[Pib]

.

I think the 32.52 rate posted earlier is realistic. There's been a spike the past two days vs. USD

X-Rates is currently reporting 32.47

http://www.x-rates.com/graph/?from=USD&to=THB&amount=1.00

THB 0218a.jpg

PS: If you're always that good at hitting the hot spot, I'd book the next flight to Macau or Vegas . . .

.

32.47 is what Bangkok Bank gave me this morning at 9:20. This should be the $5.00 rate (for trial deposits $0.40 and $0.60) and it was 1% less than the posted $5 selling rate.

Since you mentioned trial deposits you are talking an incoming ACH/wire transfer consisting of 2 trial deposits which would have got the TT "Buying" Rate. And your 32.47/USD was the Bangkok Bank TT Buying Rate all day....in fact they had no exchange rate change all day today...their opening rate didnt' change throughout the day from the opening rate which is unusual and means it was a quiet Forex day.

The Selling Rate is when you are selling your baht to buy another currency like U.S. Dollars....like it's time to go back to the U.S., you got a bunch of baht you are not going to be able to spend before leaving Thailand and you want to convert it back to dollars (buy dollars)...then you get the Selling Rate because you are Selling your baht.

But since your trial deposits are incoming to "buy baht/convert to baht" you get the TT Buying Rate.

[paz]

And what logo card did you use..Visa...Mastercard....????

MC. I whish I had knew this method before, I had been driving for miles to get to AEON ATMs, just to find them out of service at times. Or wired money in, with all the associated costs.

I'm beginning to think Kbank messed up. When looking at their exchange rate I see they have a 32.54 TT "Selling" Rate which is what a person would pay to buy dollars using baht and real close the rate you got. But you were buying baht using dollars which would give you the TT Buying Rate. Maybe the bank messed up. I can't believe a MC rate change would have jumped up so much from the current rate because the Forex rates and Thai Baht TT Buying Rates are not showing such a big jump and they move much faster that card rates do since card rates only change once every 24 hours but bank rates change numerous times during the day with the Forex market. Watch your account...if you see a correction come through that would indicate Kbank gave you the wrong rate and are correcting themselves. That's my guess right now.

The transaction has finalized to $621.69, or a rate of 32.1704. Virtually the same as MC published rate for the 18th, 32.1705.

[M71]

Just to confirm, you were charged a B150 fee for an AEON ATM transaction...a fee Bt150 fee appeared on the screen and on your AEON ATM receipt?

Yes the 150 B fee appeared on the screen. I didn't take money out as we'll go to Citibank instead.

So your saying Citibank ATM does not charge the 150 baht correct ?

[Gillyflower]

I am alternatively extremely bored (so many repeats) and rather interested. Some of you should have (or perhaps you were) been in charge of the biggest of the worlds' banks or perhaps just in charge of the IMF - held by a woman - no?

[Pib]

And what logo card did you use..Visa...Mastercard....????

MC. I whish I had knew this method before, I had been driving for miles to get to AEON ATMs, just to find them out of service at times. Or wired money in, with all the associated costs.

I'm beginning to think Kbank messed up. When looking at their exchange rate I see they have a 32.54 TT "Selling" Rate which is what a person would pay to buy dollars using baht and real close the rate you got. But you were buying baht using dollars which would give you the TT Buying Rate. Maybe the bank messed up. I can't believe a MC rate change would have jumped up so much from the current rate because the Forex rates and Thai Baht TT Buying Rates are not showing such a big jump and they move much faster that card rates do since card rates only change once every 24 hours but bank rates change numerous times during the day with the Forex market. Watch your account...if you see a correction come through that would indicate Kbank gave you the wrong rate and are correcting themselves. That's my guess right now.

The transaction has finalized to $621.69, or a rate of 32.1704. Virtually the same as MC published rate for the 18th, 32.1705.

That's more like it...you did get the MC exchange rate. I guess Kbank did mess-up or more likely on the initial transaction they use a higher rate/in the ball park rate for the card transaction and then during the settlement process (a.k.a., final posting process) over the next few business days the necessary adjustment/correction occurs. Kinda like a temporary charge just to get the initial/estimated charge in the ballpark...like what happens many times when you rent a car and they charge you card immediately the estimated amount upon picking up the car but don't do the final charge until you return the car.

Glad you posted the outcome because the high rate you posted earlier just didn't match anything except being close to the Selling Rate (but your transaction was a Buying Rate transaction). But as you showed that was indeed the rate "initially" hitting your bank account.

When I used my PenFed Visa credit card for my counter withdrawal at a Bangkok Bank branch 6 days ago the settlement/posting date was the same day as the transaction date (like a debit card)...and matched the Visa exchanged rate.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just to confirm, you were charged a B150 fee for an AEON ATM transaction...a fee Bt150 fee appeared on the screen and on your AEON ATM receipt?

Yes the 150 B fee appeared on the screen. I didn't take money out as we'll go to Citibank instead.

So your saying Citibank ATM does not charge the 150 baht correct ?

Citibank ATMs in BKK certainly do charge the 150 baht fee at least against U.S. cards, both VISA and MC.

[oncebefore]

Folks, this is my experience of today, Feb. 21 at a SCB ( SIAM COMMERCIAL BANK ) in Chonburi city. I took my USA debit card with a MC logo to the counter and told them I would like to make a cash withdrawal. They said how much. I said 3000. She said you mean a cash advance. Yes. The girl asked for my passport. As she did that, the girl next to her told her in Thai it has to be 5000 up. I said ok and asked if there were any fees. The one who said in Thai 5000 up told the girl 3%. So I guess they already figured out how to get the minimum 150 B charged at the ATM's. I suppose it will be a bank by bank, branch by branch decision, but seems like this will be the norm soon if not already. Just no way around the withdrawal fee unless you got a card that reimburses all fees and does not charge anything on their end. Of course, some others from other countries still claim their cards are not charged the withdrawal fee at ATM'S. Anyhow, good luck to all.

[paz]

Citibank ATMs in BKK certainly do charge the 150 baht fee at least against U.S. cards, both VISA and MC.

And that settles it, ASAIK there are no Citi ATMs outside BKK.

Edited February 21, 2014 by paz

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Oncebefore, SCB appears to be one of the bank companies that has specially low exchange rates for credit card cash advances, lower than ATM withdrawals or even wire transfers.

See the details here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/703641-aeon-bank-now-charge-150-b-atm-fee/?view=findpost&p=7449725

They list those low exchange rates as being applicable to credit card cash advances. But I'd bet that they likely use the same low rate for debit card cash advances.

Bottom line: I'd never do a credit card cash advance with Siam Commercial. And if I was advising others planning to use debit cards, I'd advise them to be very cautious about the exchange rate used, and see what they're getting before pulling any large amounts.

BTW, if you can, please post the details of your debit card cash advance at SCB here (what day/time, baht received and U.S. $ amount charged, if your home bank charges any foreign currency fees for use abroad) so we can see how your rate compares with the MasterCard network rate.

I don't think SCB would have charged you any fee per se... But what they probably did do is give you a bad exchange rate that reflects them taking their cut of your proceeds.

In terms of having specially low exchange rates for cash advances, I can't say SCB is alone in doing that. But it's certainly not the norm among Thai bank companies...at least, not right now.

Edited February 21, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Pib]

Folks, this is my experience of today, Feb. 21 at a SCB ( SIAM COMMERCIAL BANK ) in Chonburi city. I took my USA debit card with a MC logo to the counter and told them I would like to make a cash withdrawal. They said how much. I said 3000. She said you mean a cash advance. Yes. The girl asked for my passport. As she did that, the girl next to her told her in Thai it has to be 5000 up. I said ok and asked if there were any fees. The one who said in Thai 5000 up told the girl 3%. So I guess they already figured out how to get the minimum 150 B charged at the ATM's. I suppose it will be a bank by bank, branch by branch decision, but seems like this will be the norm soon if not already. Just no way around the withdrawal fee unless you got a card that reimburses all fees and does not charge anything on their end. Of course, some others from other countries still claim their cards are not charged the withdrawal fee at ATM'S. Anyhow, good luck to all.

Sounds like they may have been offering you their Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) rate which is usually in 3 to 4% lower than the TT Buying Rate & Visa or MC rates. DCC bad, very bad for the customer; DCC good, very good for the bank/merchant.

Edit: after looking at the SCB links TallGuy gave at little closer it appears their credit card cash advance rate is just a little better (not much) than SCB's DCC rate. Oh said another way, SCB's credit card exchange rates suck.

Edited February 21, 2014 by Pib

[paz]

I don't think SCB would have charged you any fee per se... But what they probably did do is give you a bad exchange rate that reflects them taking their cut of your proceeds.

I'm not sure about that. Just like any somchai shops applies 3% fee on card purcahase(note I'm not saying credit or debit, just "card"), they enter 10,300 Bt for a 10,000 bill.

Similarly the bank, once realizes that foreigners are trying to circument their gouging, could enter an higher amount on the POS terminal and say you have accepted the fee. Outrageous, but no unbeliviable.

[Pib]

I don't think SCB would have charged you any fee per se... But what they probably did do is give you a bad exchange rate that reflects them taking their cut of your proceeds.

I'm not sure about that. Just like any somchai shops applies 3% fee on card purcahase(note I'm not saying credit or debit, just "card"), they enter 10,300 Bt for a 10,000 bill.

Similarly the bank, once realizes that foreigners are trying to circument their gouging, could enter an higher amount on the POS terminal and say you have accepted the fee. Outrageous, but no unbeliviable.

It appears to be flat fee of 3% for a cash advance. Take a look at fee #3 on this SCB Fee Schedule. It says a 3% of cash withdrawn. So, a Bt5,000 withdrawal would cost you Bt150...a Bt15,000 withdrawal would cost you Bt450, and a Bt50,000 like I did at a Bangkok Bank branch last week for free and got the Visa exchange rate would cost you Bt1,500 at SCB. Ouch!!!!! Me thinks you don't want to do a cash advance at SCB.

[oncebefore]

Pib, that is correct. They were going to charge me 3% on top of my withdrawal. Nothing about the DCC rate. I didn't do it. I went there to see what would happen. Don't know if I will try any other banks. If any others have no charge, I believe it won't be long before they all do. Just no escaping it for most. Their greed will always prevail.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Pib, I believe the SCB fees chart you posted above related to SCB's own credit card and its fees, not to cash advances done with other bank's cards. Note the 20% interest reference just above the 3% fee reference.

I don't doubt the transaction would have been a bad one... But I still suspect it would have been bad through a bad exchange rate, not a flat fee AND a bad exchange rate. SCB has no reported history of charging flat fees on counter withdrawals with foreign cards.

SCB's history in this area is of allowing much higher withdrawal amounts than most other banks, which farangs tend to think is a good thing. But the downside is they tend to have these kinds of terrible exchange rates -- the price customers pay for their "generosity."

But, all in all, any way you cut it, SCB is likely an AVOID when it comes to counter withdrawals -- unless someone can prove our information is wrong.

Edited February 21, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Pib]

Although that link/cut and paste I gave above does apply to SCB's credit card, based on the 3% fee they wanted to charge oncebefore on his foreign card for a cash advance maybe SC charges that 3% fee for cash advances given on any credit or debit card. If the 3% fee is good enough for a SCB-issued card cash advance then maybe the bank's executives/fee setting gods feel it should be good enough for all card cash advances.

Or, maybe we just had a confused SCB teller at the branch oncebefore tried... but in his case two tellers were involved. In my years of banking at Thai banks more than once have I questioned what a bank rep was telling me (usually a really young looking one) and maybe showed them a page print from their own web site , the young rep asks another senior rep, gets the correct info, and then magically what I thought was correct is correct....maybe we were just having a Thai-English communications disconnect earlier.

Maybe oncebefore could try another SCB branch if easy/available and see what happens...see if the next SCB branch says the same thing.

Sent from my Onda V971 tablet

Edited February 22, 2014 by Pib

[smedly]

I'll go visit Lady AEON ATM today, slide my PenFed credit card in and see if she wants to charge me 150 baht....

To paraphrase the famous anthropologist Margaret Mead:

Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can find every possible means of avoiding having to pay 150b to Thai banks every time they need to withdraw funds from their home bank accounts.

No shit!!! I've never seen a topic so beaten to death.

When you add the fees being charged by many overseas banks for currency conversion, I don't view the 150 baht per 20K impost (the maximum allowable withdrawal on many ATMs) as trivial. If we were discussing the cheapest place to get a Singha, I could understand your attitude - as it stands, no-one is holding a gun to your head and demanding that you participate in this thread. If thine eye offendeth thee ....

added to that I for one spend a lot of time these days trying to squeeze an extra 1-2% on my savings/invested money only to have 4-5% taken off me every time I try to actually use my money so for me it's important as a matter of principle to find the cheapest way to get my hands on my hard earned cash when in Thailand

[smedly]

quick question

I noticed on an earlier post that someone mentioned that these over the counter cash withdrawals (as opposed to ATM) are treated the same as a purchase transaction

The reason I ask is that my CC has a daily limit of 1000euro for purchase and 250euro for ATM so will doing a counter withdrawal allow me to take up to 1000euro per day - not that I would but I'd like the option of more than 250euro or approx. 11k baht

Anybody know the answer to this - Thx

[smedly]

You're talking about carrying money in flight from home countries. But, even if someone wanted to do that with its varied risks, it doesn't account for the many folks here who don't or aren't traveling back to the their home countries.

also there are limits on how much cash you are allowed to legally carry - the UK is 5k sterling

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

quick question

I noticed on an earlier post that someone mentioned that these over the counter cash withdrawals (as opposed to ATM) are treated the same as a purchase transaction

The reason I ask is that my CC has a daily limit of 1000euro for purchase and 250euro for ATM so will doing a counter withdrawal allow me to take up to 1000euro per day - not that I would but I'd like the option of more than 250euro or approx. 11k baht

Anybody know the answer to this - Thx

Smedly, it probably is going to depend on your credit card issuer.

The issue is how Thai bank counter cash advances using foreign credit cards (as opposd to ATM credit card cash advances) are going to get coded by your home country bank. Pib mentioned, I believe, that it looked like his U.S. credit card cash advance initially was showing up as a purchase at the U.S. end, but I don't recall if he ever confirmed that was the final result.

Particularly as regards to credit card cash advances here, we're treading into an area that most of us never even considered before. BTW, make sure you're aware if your card issuer has any foreign currency fees or separate fees for any cash advances.

Edited February 23, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[smedly]

quick question

I noticed on an earlier post that someone mentioned that these over the counter cash withdrawals (as opposed to ATM) are treated the same as a purchase transaction

The reason I ask is that my CC has a daily limit of 1000euro for purchase and 250euro for ATM so will doing a counter withdrawal allow me to take up to 1000euro per day - not that I would but I'd like the option of more than 250euro or approx. 11k baht

Anybody know the answer to this - Thx

Smedly, it probably is going to depend on your credit card issuer.

The issue is how Thai bank counter cash advances using foreign credit cards (as opposd to ATM credit card cash advances) are going to get coded by your home country bank. Pib mentioned, I believe, that it looked like his U.S. credit card cash advance initially was showing up as a purchase at the U.S. end, but I don't recall if he ever confirmed that was the final result.

Particularly as regards to credit card cash advances here, we're treading into an area that most of us never even considered before. BTW, make sure you're aware if your card issuer has any foreign currency fees or separate fees for any cash advances.

Yes I knew I read that in a post but couldn't find it again, I know about the fees - in the UK it is very difficult to find "if any" a CC or DC that doesn't have fees cash withdrawals and XE, penalties, I can understand accounts providing service for the military waiving such charges

Edited February 23, 2014 by smedly

[Pib]

Smedly, it probably is going to depend on your credit card issuer.

The issue is how Thai bank counter cash advances using foreign credit cards (as opposd to ATM credit card cash advances) are going to get coded by your home country bank. Pib mentioned, I believe, that it looked like his U.S. credit card cash advance initially was showing up as a purchase at the U.S. end, but I don't recall if he ever confirmed that was the final result.

Particularly as regards to credit card cash advances here, we're treading into an area that most of us never even considered before. BTW, make sure you're aware if your card issuer has any foreign currency fees or separate fees for any cash advances.

Never did confirm how the transaction ended up appearing to PenFed. Before the transaction posted I did call PenFed to check on an unrelated banking issue and after resolving that issue the rep said is there anything else I can help you with and I said Yea, I made a cash advance of approx $XXXX using credit card the other day but it's not showing up on my account yet....can you see it? He said he would check his "live system." A few seconds later said he could see it but it appeared to be a purchase-type transaction. But the way he said purchase-type transaction it seemed he wasn't really sure...maybe outside his area of expertise as I had been calling about a banking issue and not a credit card issue.

The next day/a Monday the transaction posted to my account and it just showed date of transaction, posting date, description of who & where the transaction occcurred, a 17 digit alpha/numeric Reference Number which looked like a random top secret nuclear missile launch code (that same reference number was probably on my receipt but I didn't check since I put the receipt in the safe with the card), and the amount of the transaction. No "type of transaction" coding anywhere because the customer's PenFed ibanking just don't show that info. Preaching to the choir I know when saying it varies amount banks as to what & how they show info on their ibanking system, but I'm sure the transaction came through with enough coding to fill a 5 gallon bucket but it's just not displayed to the customer; only available for the bank to see as needed. Since I had already made an payment covering the incoming cash advance to result in zero interest being charged--and plan to do the same in the future--I haven't had a need to call PenFed again about something and maybe ask then just out of curiosity how the transaction arrived...as a cash advance which it was or as a purchase transaction. But my gut tells me it probably was coded as a cash advance. Plus, the amount of cash advance I'm authorized equals my full credit line which is not the norm based on all my other credit card accounts since most credit card accounts only allow a portion of the total credit line to be used as a cash advance as you mentioned earlier.

[smedly]

actually it could well be categorised as a purchase type transaction or rather more accurately "not an ATM type transaction" - my card issuer specifically states ATM limit of 250euro not cash limit