Brand New BMW 320i - needs new gearbox after 1 week.

[FiestyFarang]

As they have not given you a reply yet, are you not being premature?

[mortenaa]

BMW and Mercedes way overpriced here due to the import tax. Cannot understand why anyone buys here especially a Farang. Wasted your money...should have bought an Accord or a Camry for less than half the price of your German rubbish!!!

Most BMW and Mercedes are assembled in Thailand. They are higher taxed because of more equipment, and often more powerful engines.

Honda Accord TECH 1.8MB (225nm/174hp) - 3 year warranty, no service

BMW 320i 2.65MB (270nm/184hp) - 5 years warranty, free maintance and repair

Waste of money? After owning a Toyota, then Honda, I moved to BMW, and never looked back. If you enjoy driving, the choice is simple

[soalbundy]

Um, it all seems rather strange.

The only way I can see that engine coolant could get into the transmission is if somebody accidentally poured coolant into the transmission oil filler, mistaking it for the coolant reservoir.

Otherwise, there's no physical connection between the engine cooling system and the transmission that would allow the coolant to get there. And I know of no design that has engine coolant linked in anyway to the internals of a transmission.

If the above scenario is a possibility, I'd be keeping rather quiet about demands from BMW as they may suggest any warranty is void if somebody poured coolant into the transmission.

BMW don't make the gearboxes,they come from a firm called GF i think. If your car was serviced by a BMW dealer then they are liable. GF certainly wouldn't come up with a new gearbox if misuse is proved ie. filled up with coolant,that would be down to the dealer. In Germany if the bodywork has been compromised by the factory (slight dent,repaired then sprayed over) you can expect a new car(German law in Germany) what happens if the dealer is at fault i don't know.Engine coolant CAN"T get into the gearbox unless purposely poured in. I worked for BMW in Germany for 40 years,they are a good quality car and they do take great pride in their product. If all else fails a detailed letter to BMW Munich can bring results.

[FiestyFarang]

The 320i has an auto-box from ZF. It's very reliable, and BMW uses it on all models now. Even on some of the M-models.

The 320i is assembled in Thailand. So my guess it's something wrong happened in the assembly line.

I would demand a new car as well. Actually If you don't want get the feedback you want from your dealer, I would head over to BMW at the 4 seasons in Wireless Road, and have a chat with them.

I bought a few cars from Bmw Thailand, and had a great experience with both quality and service.

If the 320i is assembled in Thailand why are they so expensive in Thailand.

[derekwyoung]

Hi I dont know if this will help : I was a small garage owner in london . I owned 2 *735i's one had some auto trans problems and I took it out and rebuilt it the transmition I can tel you that the transmition fluid was cooled in a radiater that was part of a double radiator the other half of which was the engine coolent?This was 15 years ago so cant realy coment on a new machien

[I knew this would happen]

There is nothing you can do as you have taken delivery unless you are protected with "Lemon Law" in certain countries. The usual practice by manufacturers is that they would offer to replace a "brand new" gearbox for your car without any charges and to pacify you further, a courtesy would come along too. From my past experience, BMW always has this gearbox issues regardless of which models. Well, if you like the brand so be it. Best of Luck!

NO! BMW is not known for serious gearbox problems. Right now I´m really worried that they begin to fk. up their engines, the main reason for BMW in the past. Timing chain problems, injector problems and the new 2.0 liter turbos have yet to prove that they are anyhow reliable, after 100K km+ cracks have been found in the blocks.

Edited February 25, 2014 by I knew this would happen

[Dogbreath]

All BMWs are rear wheel drive. There have been some four wheel drive models, but never a front wheel drive.

I have know idea if the OP's car is front wheel drive. If it is not, then the water thing is something I don't understand. Perhaps he is being fobbed off. Sounds like it. BUT, modern stuff is out of my domain, perhaps there is some sort of trans water cooling, I don't know. BL transverse engines and trans used the same oil, they were one, if a head gasket went then water went into the gearbox and sump.

[seedy]

the transmition fluid was cooled in a radiater that was part of a double radiator the other half of which was the engine coolent?

Very common practice in N America too. Liquid to liquid heat exchanger installed in the lower part of the engine cooling radiator.

[Sayonarax]

Shit happens!

A new gearbox will not make the car a fixed up car!

Generally you have not the right to ask for a new car and somehow it seems the dealer was treating you well. You have a loan car for free...what's the problem?

Even your car is only a few days old, the moment you drive it out of the gate of the dealer it lost a lot of worth...so it is not so easy as you would like it!

Just check your warranty regulations...

No, shit just doesn't happen.. try reading consumer laws before you make silly claims.

[richard_smith237]

Gotta love that German quality! Buy a Honda .

Amen, BMW stands for "Buy a Matching Wrecker." A friend in the car biz went through 5 transmissions in his 7 series Beemer and BMW refused to honor their warranty after the third, so he was out of pocket for the last two. Anybody that buys a BMW needs their wallet examined, not to mention their head. That said, not all German autos should be held as equally shoddy. It isn't a German things, it is a QC thing, or the lack of it.

It seems there are a few jealous haters who can't afford a BMW product, their comments only shine light on their envy, though they'd never admit it and argue to the contrary. If any of these posters had a choice between a Free BMW and a Free Honda or Toyota I wonder how many would not choose the BMW.... be honest now... those knocking BMW products - if prices were the same would you choose the non-German equivalents ?

No mechanical or electrical product has a 100% record.

BMW is a premium brand, but not only that, their cars are premium products. Drive a Toyota or Honda before or after driving a BWM or Merc and you will tell the difference (subjective I know) - but when being completely non-bias (if it were possible a blindfold test) the difference is readily identifiable.

That said: When spending such money on any vehicle it shouldn't fail. The immediate and only appropriate response from BMW would be to offer a replacement car or a full refund.

A couple of years ago I had a premium car (not BMW) fail on me after 2 hrs - I was ok with them trying to troubleshoot the problem under warranty, however, after a few days the garage was still unable to source the issue, I requested and received a full refund. This was a grey import too.

[sotsira]

Um, it all seems rather strange.

The only way I can see that engine coolant could get into the transmission is if somebody accidentally poured coolant into the transmission oil filler, mistaking it for the coolant reservoir.

Otherwise, there's no physical connection between the engine cooling system and the transmission that would allow the coolant to get there. And I know of no design that has engine coolant linked in anyway to the internals of a transmission.

If the above scenario is a possibility, I'd be keeping rather quiet about demands from BMW as they may suggest any warranty is void if somebody poured coolant into the transmission.

BMW don't make the gearboxes,they come from a firm called GF i think. If your car was serviced by a BMW dealer then they are liable. GF certainly wouldn't come up with a new gearbox if misuse is proved ie. filled up with coolant,that would be down to the dealer. In Germany if the bodywork has been compromised by the factory (slight dent,repaired then sprayed over) you can expect a new car(German law in Germany) what happens if the dealer is at fault i don't know.Engine coolant CAN"T get into the gearbox unless purposely poured in. I worked for BMW in Germany for 40 years,they are a good quality car and they do take great pride in their product. If all else fails a detailed letter to BMW Munich can bring results.

You worked for BMW for 40 years and you didn't know that there gearbox's come from a firm

called ZF.

You are also unaware that BMW's have a water cooled transmission oil cooler incorporated in the

radiator that also cools the engine. THAT is where the two coolants can mix together when a leak

develops between the two coolers.

[mortenaa]

The 320i has an auto-box from ZF. It's very reliable, and BMW uses it on all models now. Even on some of the M-models.

The 320i is assembled in Thailand. So my guess it's something wrong happened in the assembly line.

I would demand a new car as well. Actually If you don't want get the feedback you want from your dealer, I would head over to BMW at the 4 seasons in Wireless Road, and have a chat with them.

I bought a few cars from Bmw Thailand, and had a great experience with both quality and service.

If the 320i is assembled in Thailand why are they so expensive in Thailand.

I already answered that in another post. If you choose to import your own BMW (i know people who have done it), you are faced with the same tax-regime. Its material, equipment, accessories, weight etc. You may save a few bucks, but loose out on the warranty.

[fredKroket]

I also have a new model 320i and have had to write to BMW Germany to inform them how disatisfied I've been with the car. Firstly the car blew an oxygen sensor due to me accelerating away from a junction, just as the automatic stop/start kicked in. From then on the car would just judder as if it was a fuel problem, which is what the dealer tried to tell me it was even after they emptied the tank and refilled it. I was told the replacement part would be two weeks, but it took almost 6.

Not a problem with the car but I needed a replacement fog light due to a stone hitting it, was told 2 weeks and waited 6. The level of stock BMW holds should include such basic parts as a fog light, which are no doubt having to be replaced regularly due to the condition of Thai roads and stone chips.

The second problem with the car was part of the suspension buckled on both sides and had to be replaced, it was dealt with quickly and efficiently but still it was off the road causing me inconvenience for my work without a courtesey car.

The third issue was the most serious I feel and could've potentially been very dangerous. I was on a dual carriageway after taking my son to school doing around 133-140kph when suddenly the power just dropped and my speed went down quickly. Had I been overtaking a car with a car coming towards me there was no power to take evasive action, very dangerous with no prior warning there was a problem. An error showed up on the screen Drivetrain Problem, drive slowly. I now understand that this is known as 'limp home mode', which is designed to save the car from any potential engine damage. I just would've expected a warning before the power being cut. This time the dealer kindly arranged for the car to be collected from my office rather than me wasting a whole morning. I was then informed that the problem was an oil sensor, which I find to be a poor excuse for cutting the power so severely. Thankfully this was repaired the same day and 'touch wood' the car has been fine for the last few weeks.

I wrote to BMW Germany and told them a 320i is probably no better than a taxi in Germany, but when you pay 70,000 euro for a car in Thailand you expect it to run properly and for the dealer to hold basic stock items, rather than ordering them from Germany and having them containerised to save on costs. I owned a Toyota Camry Hybrid before and didn't have one days trouble with it for almost 4 years, not one problem. I drove it hard the same as I do the BMW, the roads inThailand still have potholes and bumps everywhere, so nothing has changed except what I see as poor quality manufacturing from BMW.

I'm also still awaiting an email or apology from BMW, but it's been over one month now and still I've heard nothing.

Edited February 25, 2014 by fredKroket

[sotsira]

Um, it all seems rather strange.

The only way I can see that engine coolant could get into the transmission is if somebody accidentally poured coolant into the transmission oil filler, mistaking it for the coolant reservoir.

Otherwise, there's no physical connection between the engine cooling system and the transmission that would allow the coolant to get there. And I know of no design that has engine coolant linked in anyway to the internals of a transmission.

If the above scenario is a possibility, I'd be keeping rather quiet about demands from BMW as they may suggest any warranty is void if somebody poured coolant into the transmission.

BMW don't make the gearboxes,they come from a firm called GF i think. If your car was serviced by a BMW dealer then they are liable. GF certainly wouldn't come up with a new gearbox if misuse is proved ie. filled up with coolant,that would be down to the dealer. In Germany if the bodywork has been compromised by the factory (slight dent,repaired then sprayed over) you can expect a new car(German law in Germany) what happens if the dealer is at fault i don't know.Engine coolant CAN"T get into the gearbox unless purposely poured in. I worked for BMW in Germany for 40 years,they are a good quality car and they do take great pride in their product. If all else fails a detailed letter to BMW Munich can bring results.

You worked for BMW for 40 yrs and didn't know that the gearbox's are made by ZF.

And that engine coolant CAN get into the gearbox through the water cooled transmission oil cooler which is integrated with the engine's radiator.

Also for your knowledge you can't pour fluid into the BMW auto transmission's, from under the bonnet, it is pumped in from beneath the car, from a filling plug located on the side of the gearbox casing.

[Woodsie888]

I also have a new model 320i and have had to write to BMW Germany to inform them how disatisfied I've been with the car. Firstly the car blew an oxygen sensor due to me accelerating away from a junction, just as the automatic stop/start kicked in. From then on the car would just judder as if it was a fuel problem, which is what the dealer tried to tell me it was even after they emptied the tank and refilled it. I was told the replacement part would be two weeks, but it took almost 6.

Not a problem with the car but I needed a replacement fog light due to a stone hitting it, was told 2 weeks and waited 6. The level of stock BMW holds should include such basic parts as a fog light, which are no doubt having to be replaced regularly due to the condition of Thai roads and stone chips.

The second problem with the car was part of the suspension buckled on both sides and had to be replaced, it was dealt with quickly and efficiently but still it was off the road causing me inconvenience for my work without a courtesey car.

The third issue was the most serious I feel and could've potentially been very dangerous. I was on a dual carriageway after taking my son to school doing around 133-140kph when suddenly the power just dropped and my speed went down quickly. Had I been overtaking a car with a car coming towards me there was no power to take evasive action, very dangerous with no prior warning there was a problem. An error showed up on the screen Drivetrain Problem, drive slowly. I now understand that this is known as 'limp home mode', which is designed to save the car from any potential engine damage. I just would've expected a warning before the power being cut. This time the dealer kindly arranged for the car to be collected from my office rather than me wasting a whole morning. I was then informed that the problem was an oil sensor, which I find to be a poor excuse for cutting the power so severely. Thankfully this was repaired the same day and 'touch wood' the car has been fine for the last few weeks.

I wrote to BMW Germany and told them a 320i is probably no better than a taxi in Germany, but when you pay 70,000 euro for a car in Thailand you expect it to run properly and for the dealer to hold basic stock items, rather than ordering them from Germany and having them containerised to save on costs. I owned a Toyota Camry Hybrid before and didn't have one days trouble with it for almost 4 years, not one problem. I drove it hard the same as I do the BMW, the roads inThailand still have potholes and bumps everywhere, so nothing has changed except what I see as poor quality manufacturing from BMW.

I'm also still awaiting an email or apology from BMW, but it's been over one month now and still I've heard nothing.

My 320d did exactly the same as yours on the highway and I complained about it for 6 months before they finally replaced the transmission due to a faulty ECU which is actually in the transmission itself. Mine would go into limp home mode immediately after using the kick down to overtake.

I waited 2 months for the new transmission to arrive.

I changed from the selling dealer to German Motors thereafter and have nothing but praise for their service department.

[donmuang37]

First of all, I don't believe it has a transverse engine because it is rear wheel drive. Second, what type of transmission does it have? If it is a manual shift, I could not understand how engine coolant could get into the tranny as there is no connection to the cooling system with any manual transmission that I've seen. (A new design?) As for automatics, the transmission fluid needs cooling. Some transmission fluid coolers are air cooled below the radiator while others are integrated into the radiator. In the second type it is possible for water to get into the tranny in the event of a leak.

But find it curious that BMW service told you to "top it off" because the coolant in modern cars is a specific blend designed as anti-corrosive. So it would be incredible for them to tell you to top it off with plain water (of unknown quality) or with some product from a local car shop (definitely of unknown quality)! I'm sure they use BMW coolant part number XXXX.

Are you a troll?

[thailandbeachisland]

Seems like these BWM always have more problems than Benz ? Benz seem a lot more reliable ?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/527147-water-splash-stops-new-bmw-320d/

Edited February 25, 2014 by thailandbeachisland

[Dogbreath]

Having owned a BMW 745 and two 3 Series, I can only say they are the best cars to drive and I have been driving for nearly 60 years. If you check with the various auto rating websites, you will find that BMW has some problem areas. I have experienced many electrical problems (BMW Achilles heel IMO) and some mechanical the worst being a timing belt failure on my wife's gently driven 325ic after the warranty expired. Very expensive repair. Given a choice I would still buy a new or lightly used BMW still under full warranty. You may spend a bit more time in the shop than with Toyota or Honda but IMO it's worth it because the driving experience is so much better. I hope you get full satisfaction from BMW or the dealer, but whatever you do, DO NOT KEEP THE CAR BEYOND THE WARRANTY PERIOD! To do otherwise could be financially painful. For driving in Thailand, my first pick would be the Toyota Fortuner for reasons of ruggedness, serviceability, and safety, but that's for another thread.

Transmission oil coolers do fail even when new. I had a brand new ( not remanufactured) Perkins diesel and gearbox installed in my boat a few years back and the trans cooler sprung a leak in the first 20 hours of use turning the oil to sludge and necessitating a rebuild. Worked fine thereafter.

[jackflash]

Some bad advice here as usual. Complete B/S in fact.

Many cars have a transmission cooler, and once in a while something will go wrong.

Certainly if the oils is polluted with coolant it will fatally damage the gearbox bearings.

By replacing the entire gearbox they are taking the responsible path. At least they are not trying to repair it!

I see no problem with having a new gearbox fitted. At least you will know the fault has gone.

Wanting a new car seem ludicrous. Like a spoilt brat stamping his foot and bellowing because he has broken his toy.

As someone said earlier, "shit happens"

[inzman]

My co-worker bought a new BMW 320 in America. He was so proud. About a year later he called and asked for some advice, he needed brakes in the front. He was quoted $2800 from BMW, I told him I just had front brakes on my Honda accord, $60. He was so upset! About 2 months later he came in with his new Honda civic, never been happier. Two best days of a BMW owners life, when you buy it and when you sell it!

[Ace of Pop]

My Father managed to wreck everything he bought,he reconed they were all crap. My Uncle made them Tumble Over, and my Mother had an old BMW 2002 saloon that was indestructabe.Recon ill stay with a boring Civic,and extra Leo Tinnies.

[thailandbeachisland]

Shit happens!

A new gearbox will not make the car a fixed up car!

Generally you have not the right to ask for a new car and somehow it seems the dealer was treating you well. You have a loan car for free...what's the problem?

Even your car is only a few days old, the moment you drive it out of the gate of the dealer it lost a lot of worth...so it is not so easy as you would like it!

Just check your warranty regulations...

Understand what you mean but it it anyway unacceptable to hear when someone just spent 4 millions for a new car !

I would inform the media from all over the world and check if BMW likes advertising...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HztrU54DRQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HztrU54DRQ

Edited February 25, 2014 by thailandbeachisland

[mortenaa]

My co-worker bought a new BMW 320 in America. He was so proud. About a year later he called and asked for some advice, he needed brakes in the front. He was quoted $2800 from BMW, I told him I just had front brakes on my Honda accord, $60. He was so upset! About 2 months later he came in with his new Honda civic, never been happier. Two best days of a BMW owners life, when you buy it and when you sell it!

Utter BS.

http://www.autowyse.com/bmw_3_series_service/cost_to_replace_3_series_brakes.html

[thailandbeachisland]

BMW and Mercedes way overpriced here due to the import tax. Cannot understand why anyone buys here especially a Farang. Wasted your money...should have bought an Accord or a Camry for less than half the price of your German rubbish!!!

...and die cheap as you are born cheap !

[stevenl]

BMW and Mercedes way overpriced here due to the import tax. Cannot understand why anyone buys here especially a Farang. Wasted your money...should have bought an Accord or a Camry for less than half the price of your German rubbish!!!

...and die cheap as you are born cheap !

Wow, you really have an issue with BMW. Would be much better to just post your issues in stead of keep posting snipes at the brand in different threads.

[I knew this would happen]

My co-worker bought a new BMW 320 in America. He was so proud. About a year later he called and asked for some advice, he needed brakes in the front. He was quoted $2800 from BMW, I told him I just had front brakes on my Honda accord, $60. He was so upset! About 2 months later he came in with his new Honda civic, never been happier. Two best days of a BMW owners life, when you buy it and when you sell it!

2800$ and 60$ dollars. Before you post such figures you should verify what exactly was damaged or should have been fixed and not just compare some random numbers.

A complete set of rear and front brakes (discs, pads and work included) will be about 600€ in Germany. 2800$ dollar is either a ripp off or something else was damaged, but after one year that has to be in warranty cover anyway. Dealer prices are crazy though, gotta admit that.

60$ for your "brakes" you mean brake pads only, with labour? Chinese ones? The cost of discs and pads for a Civic or a 3Series are not very different if you buy it from any spare part store.

[mortenaa]

My co-worker bought a new BMW 320 in America. He was so proud. About a year later he called and asked for some advice, he needed brakes in the front. He was quoted $2800 from BMW, I told him I just had front brakes on my Honda accord, $60. He was so upset! About 2 months later he came in with his new Honda civic, never been happier. Two best days of a BMW owners life, when you buy it and when you sell it!

Utter BS.

http://www.autowyse.com/bmw_3_series_service/cost_to_replace_3_series_brakes.html

Many workshops do not use genuine parts. There are very big companies that sell pattern parts at a fraction of the cost for all big buck European rides. I used all pattern parts on my Volvo for years.

As I am aware of, and the link I provided will show you the different prices for OEM parts or copy brands. Actually sometimes the price don't differ that much. I had to replace the generator on my M3, and the copies were more expensive than OEM

[mortenaa]

Very little to go wrong in an alternator, usually just the regulator, the occasional bearing which causes more damage. Nice easy money business to "re-condition" them.

If I had the time or the skills, I would love to fiddle with it. I was surprised it failed in the first place. Could be that I replaced my pulleys to under-drive pulleys. I'm not sure..

[pedro01]

Glad you guys aren't on the politics board....

We all choose a car for different reasons, no need to rag on people for making a different choice, lads.

[MMarlow]

I recon its the Engine,you mentioned the gearbox clonk after the water top up,so somethings lost in translation perhaps.. Why do posters bother mentioning another brand, totally irelevant. Never had that with my 100Bht Truck.

"Why do posters bother mentioning another brand, totally irelevant. Never had that with my 100Bht Truck."

Was that a 100(?) baht BMW truck? Obviously not. Or are you just mentioning another "totally irrelevant" non-BMW brand so that you can berate yourself also?