Missing Malaysia Airlines jet carrying 239 triggers Southeast Asia search

[Overandout]

http://www.roomeetimes.com/wp-content/uploads/165.jpgThe imagery, which was progressively captured by satellites passing over the area, has not yet been released to the media.Credit: http://www.roomeetimes.com/plane-searchers-investigate-debris-found-on-indian-ocean.html

I thought I'd read that the water at that point was extremely deep?

So how come a huge piece of metal would be visible just beneath the surface?

I'm nt saying that the "bits" are nothing to do with the plane, but that image enhancement looks a bit... optimistic...

[3NUMBAS]

if there was a raging fire they could have done a belly flop in fairly near the coast water like the belly flop in the hudson river if things got desperate .the fire on board idea is flawed ,all the theories are flawed as they dont hold water in the final analysis ,theres always a mind bending discrepancy in the theory .

[3NUMBAS]

photo of search boat here

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/20/mh370-poor-conditions-hamper-search-debris-indian-ocean?google_editors_picks=true

[Skint]

http://www.roomeetimes.com/wp-content/uploads/165.jpgThe imagery, which was progressively captured by satellites passing over the area, has not yet been released to the media.Credit: http://www.roomeetimes.com/plane-searchers-investigate-debris-found-on-indian-ocean.html

I thought I'd read that the water at that point was extremely deep?

So how come a huge piece of metal would be visible just beneath the surface?

I'm nt saying that the "bits" are nothing to do with the plane, but that image enhancement looks a bit... optimistic...

Could be a storage container of some sort or a piece of boat I reckon there is tons of stuff floating around, a real nightmare and a lot of people under pressure if they find the plane in that area it will be nothing shirt of a miracle.

[harrry]

Well I guess that explanation too justifies the lead-time it took to review carefully the radar data images by Thailand before also releasing the information. I'm also missing my goat.

This is a big situation. A lot of countries have put forth a lot of effort to find this plane. To some extend it's going to be a coup for the country that finally finds it. I don't think that's why they are helping, but it will be a good-will coup.

There were 14 nationalities on the flight, including Australians.

My guess is that there are a lot of countries looking at a lot of images to see if they have missed anything.

Lets not forget it is a tragedy fo say 2000 people. The nearly three hundred who died on the plane and their families who have lost loved ones.

[MK1]

There is still one country yet to clarify whether or not MH370 was observed on primary or secondary radar passing over or going around their country heading south at supposable low altitude and that is Indonesia.

Unless Indonesia confirms they had an unidentified or indentified aircraft as in the missing MH370, then the puzzle still remains incomplete and unfortunately an ongoing wild goose chase for search & rescue countries since Indonesia is widely known to have sensitive airspace as in Aceh & Sumatra.

Edited March 20, 2014 by MK1

[khaosai]

There is still one country yet to clarify whether or not MH370 was observed on primary or secondary radar passing over or going around their country heading south at supposable low altitude and that is Indonesia.

Unless Indonesia confirms they had an unidentified or indentified aircraft as in the missing MH370, then the puzzle still remains incomplete and unfortunately an ongoing wild goose chase for search & rescue countries since Indonesia is widely known to have sensitive airspace as in Aceh & Sumatra.

Hi,

I wonder if the initial route west would have been to ensure prior to turning south that it would remain undetected. I don't know anything about the military radar in the Aceh region, but generally primary radar is very limited in range. Then again you have the Southern Nicobar Islands. I am not aware of any civilian radar in this area, however there may be an Indian military radar instillation.

[NeverSure]

http://www.roomeetimes.com/wp-content/uploads/165.jpg The imagery, which was progressively captured by satellites passing over the area, has not yet been released to the media. Credit: http://www.roomeetimes.com/plane-searchers-investigate-debris-found-on-indian-ocean.html

That picture is several days old, not in the area they are searching, and has been debunked. It is all over the media and old news.

THIS is what is being hunted for off Australia. Posted about an hour ago by Reuters.

Edited March 20, 2014 by NeverSure

[MK1]

There is still one country yet to clarify whether or not MH370 was observed on primary or secondary radar passing over or going around their country heading south at supposable low altitude and that is Indonesia.

Unless Indonesia confirms they had an unidentified or indentified aircraft as in the missing MH370, then the puzzle still remains incomplete and unfortunately an ongoing wild goose chase for search & rescue countries since Indonesia is widely known to have sensitive airspace as in Aceh & Sumatra.

Hi,

I wonder if the initial route west would have been to ensure prior to turning south that it would remain undetected. I don't know anything about the military radar in the Aceh region, but generally primary radar is very limited in range. Then again you have the Southern Nicobar Islands. I am not aware of any civilian radar in this area, however there may be an Indian military radar instillation.

Then someone on board must have continued to consciously take evasive action to avoid detection at numerous way points by zig zaging around Indonesia but this was not suggested previously since the deliberate flight path corridor, supposable by Malay authorities, was either NW or SW directions.

Edited March 20, 2014 by MK1

[3NUMBAS]

could be parts of wings as by then no fuel would have emptied the tanks and dont they use inert gas to prevent fires ?or empty fuel tanks just giving some buoyancy .most of the wing is just a tank .we assume a slow glide when the fuel ran out not a plummet ,thats if anyone was at the controls by then..

Edited March 20, 2014 by 3NUMBAS

[MJP]

Anybody else feel the World suddenly got bigger?

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[boomerangutang]

It looks as though the pilot, who apparently pre-programmed the strange route, had done a very slick job of making his plane virtually disappear. If that was his intention, he nearly succeeded. Granted, it's speculation on my part, but consider this: A pilot, for whatever reason, plans to commit suicide and take the plane and all its passengers/crew with him. He wants to do it in a way which makes investigation impossible.

It's similar to scenarios where people commit suicide, while wanting it to be as incognito (or as undetectable) as possible. It would be interesting to read/hear about all his correspondence for the months prior to this sad event - ....to gauge his mind-set.

[Carmine6]

http://www.roomeetimes.com/wp-content/uploads/165.jpgThe imagery, which was progressively captured by satellites passing over the area, has not yet been released to the media.Credit: http://www.roomeetimes.com/plane-searchers-investigate-debris-found-on-indian-ocean.html

I thought I'd read that the water at that point was extremely deep?

So how come a huge piece of metal would be visible just beneath the surface?

I'm nt saying that the "bits" are nothing to do with the plane, but that image enhancement looks a bit... optimistic...

I agree with your view on the photos. They were a bit disappointing to have made such significant announcements about. Though there does appear to be something surrounded by lots of smaller things floating nearby that are similar in appearance in the different color renderings. Hopefully they have seen so much stuff in the photos that the appearance of these is telling them they are new, man made items floating around. I assume there's not a lot of fairly noticeable items floating around that in that area so far at sea.

On the floating part. They pick aluminum and other metals like that because of the strength to weight qualities. Same for the other materials that go into there, from the seating to the rest of the interior that's attached to the frame. I also think there's a fair amount of honeycomb structure in the wall panels and things. Plus, this plane would have had basically empty fuel tanks which would be very buoyant, barring gaping holes. And any other trapped air pockets would of course help. So as long as there was enough buoyant stuff attached to or trapped inside the sections, it could stay up for some time.

[boomerangutang]

With all the conspiracy theories that abound, this is the simplest and most straightforward answer I've seen so far: http://www.wired.com/autopia/2014/03/mh370-electrical-fire/

Thanks for the link. I read it and the responses to it. His theory has some plausibility, but still doesn't account for the pre-programmed route, going in opposite direction of the planned route to China.

[NeverSure]

No one knows what direction it went after it turned just short of Vietnam. Remember, we are being told by the experts with satellites that it either went N. toward China, or S. toward Australia.

Yet we are being told that it flew for several hours after it turned. (puzzled look on face.) We are being told that it had as much as 7.5 hours of fuel on board. That's almost 4,000 miles at cruising altitude.

That's enough range to fly right over the top of Australia (not that it wouldn't be detected,) or to reach Somalia, Pakistan, Iran...

I still say there is at least some chance that the plane is on the ground in a terrorist friendly country.

The satellite picture of the object they are searching for off Australia is anything but definitive. It could be anything. These pictures of it were released by Reuters a couple of hours ago and they aren't the same old ones being posted above which have been debunked.

Here is what they are looking for off Australia right now, and I don't see an airplane or a debris field in there.

Edited March 20, 2014 by NeverSure

[Songhua]

A theory - assuming the sightings in the Indian Ocean are found to be MH370.

Consider if the final destination for the aircraft had been predetermined.

The area being searched (which has been outlined definitely - by the NTSB I believe - for a number of days now) is very coincidentally about 180 degrees mirrored to, and about equidistant from KL as a line drawn from KL to Beijing.

IMO the zig-zagging and changes of course & altitude might have been designed to burn off fuel (whilst avoiding as much radar or detection as possible) to a location where the controller of the aircraft was able to determine the necessary amount of fuel was remaining, set a heading to their predetermined point and possibly engage autopilot.

A saddening thought but, if the claims of having earlier in the flight ascended to an altitude where hypoxia occurs are correct, the passengers were already long incapacitated.

Might it bet possible that someone in some desperate frame of mind could devise a plan to end up as far away as possible from where they considered anybody would be likely to look for them?

Edited March 20, 2014 by Songhua

[NanLaew]

The initial media spin was 'found something!' when in reality, the satellite imagery is now (almost) 5 days old, the sea conditions are bad and the water is very deep. Although it does 'best fit' the arc of travel from the Inmarsat engine 'ping' data AND the endurance of the flight based on fuel load, it also seem a bit of a grandstand by the Aussie PM.

I would hope that to fully validate this 'find', the Aussie's (or whoever is now analyzing the imagery) are working BACKWARDS through the satellite data to see where this debris came from. It may help them define the drift that has occurred in the past 4-5 days and, if it is indeed the wreckage from the flight, they could possibly pinpoint any point of impact.

[wooloomooloo]

I still say there is at least some chance that the plane is on the ground in a terrorist friendly country.

I earlier considered the possible consequences a country would suffer if found to have sponsored and/or provided refuge to a hijacked MH370. Even worse if any, or all, of the Chinese nationals were murdered. I couldn't envisage China engaging in dialogue, just a whole lot of pain to come.

I can't envisage a country stupid enough to hijack a planeload of Chinese either. If they have and are discovered, I'll buy a four-pack and watch the fireworks live on Sky. Would certainly be interesting.

[Carmine6]

The initial media spin was 'found something!' when in reality, the satellite imagery is now (almost) 5 days old, the sea conditions are bad and the water is very deep. Although it does 'best fit' the arc of travel from the Inmarsat engine 'ping' data AND the endurance of the flight based on fuel load, it also seem a bit of a grandstand by the Aussie PM.

I would hope that to fully validate this 'find', the Aussie's (or whoever is now analyzing the imagery) are working BACKWARDS through the satellite data to see where this debris came from. It may help them define the drift that has occurred in the past 4-5 days and, if it is indeed the wreckage from the flight, they could possibly pinpoint any point of impact.

The media certainly haven't done a good job with this situation, though they constantly pat themselves on the back for their efforts. As if the story would go away, but for their constant reporting. Many "facts" have just been some random journalist putting out a story, and then when that story is refuted by someone who would know, it became a "contradiction". Like when Rolls Royce backed the Malaysian claim that no engine data was received after the loss of contact, it was a "contradiction" to what the WSJ reported. But the WSJ never reported that engine data was received, it reported satellite pings and had mentioned that the reason for the satellite pings was the reporting system that reports the engine data. Even yesterday I saw a talking head say engine data reported for 8 hours as a fact.

I went to bed last night after the satellite photos were released and I believe a search aircraft had come back without finding anything. I was surprised the Australian PM got into the mix over such skimpy photographic evidence. But there seemed to be lots of information they weren't reporting that gave them confidence about it.

This morning the articles were saying "Debris from missing plane found" and similar things. It was disturbing that nothing had changed while I was asleep, yet two pieces of debris spotted had morphed into debris from plane found.

I hope there are a lot more reasons they believe this is something significant. Seems like US analysts had plotted an expected location where the plane would end up on the southern route, which roughly matches up with where these photos were taken, accounting for drift. Seems like confirmation bias to then make such a big deal of it without other information.

[wooloomooloo]

This morning the articles were saying "Debris from missing plane found" and similar things. It was disturbing that nothing had changed while I was asleep, yet two pieces of debris spotted had morphed into debris from plane found.

Nothing like that in UK media. Just 'best lead' reporting.

Don't believe everything you read.

[NeverSure]

I still say there is at least some chance that the plane is on the ground in a terrorist friendly country.

I earlier considered the possible consequences a country would suffer if found to have sponsored and/or provided refuge to a hijacked MH370. Even worse if any, or all, of the Chinese nationals were murdered. I couldn't envisage China engaging in dialogue, just a whole lot of pain to come.

I can't envisage a country stupid enough to hijack a planeload of Chinese either. If they have and are discovered, I'll buy a four-pack and watch the fireworks live on Sky. Would certainly be interesting.

You're probably right. Now consider Pakistan. I don't think they are afraid of China. They sure aren't afraid of India.

Pakistan is divided into at least 3 competing groups, counting that no man's land to the North which may be controlled by Al Qaeda.

Pakistan has a good military and ICBM's with nukes capable of hitting China.

I think the more sober leaders in Pakistan would decry such a hijacking, but they really don't control every corner of the country. Sunni, Shia, Al Qaeda, Taliban... Who runs that joint, anyway?

[webfact]

MISSING MH370
No confirmation images of debris pertain to MH370
The Straits Times
Asia News Network

KUALA LUMPUR: -- Every effort is being made to locate missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 but the "credible" sighting of possible wreckage was yet to be confirmed, acting Malaysian Transport Minister Hishammuddin Tun Hussein said yesterday.

The search for the missing plane entered its 13th day yesterday and efforts were redirected to a location some 2,500 kilometres southwest of Perth after Australia said two objects - one estimated at 24 metres long - had been spotted in the southern Indian Ocean.

It could take up to 48 hours to confirm that debris spotted by satellite belonged to Flight MH370, an expert said.

Michael Daniel, a retired US Federal Aviation Administration official, told Singapore's The Straits Times: "If they have a strong feeling or indication that the debris belongs to the aircraft, one of the first things authorities will do is drop sonar buoys in the water."

Search planes dispatched

Daniel said: "If the black box is there, the buoys should be able to pick up the signals. This could take up to 48 hours, but it all depends on how near or far the ships and other assets are" from the site.

At a daily press briefing in Malaysia, Hishammuddin said Prime Minister Najib Razak had received a call from his Australian counterpart Tony Abbott yesterday morning to brief him on the latest findings. He said the sighting, while credible, was yet to be confirmed as MH370.

A high-level team was set to leave for Beijing last night to help the Chinese families of missing passengers, Hishammuddin added.

Describing it as the "best lead we have", Australian Maritime Safety Authority official John Young told a press briefing in Canberra that the objects were "bobbing up and down over the surface".

Australia has sent four search aircraft - including one each from the US and New Zealand - and two ships to the area where the debris was located, while a merchant ship has also been asked to go there.

It takes four hours for an aircraft flying out of Perth to reach the location. Abbott told Parliament the images represented "new and credible information" but stressed that the link with Flight MH370 had still to be confirmed.

Families of the passengers aboard the plane were to be briefed on the latest findings last night by Malaysia investigators.

Selamat Omar, the father of Malaysian engineer and MH370 passenger Khairul Selamat, told The Straits Times: "We are still waiting for verification from the authorities. If it's really MH370, we will accept that fate."

Wen Wancheng, whose son was a passenger on the flight, said in Beijing: "My son is still alive. I don't believe the news."


-- The Nation 2014-03-21

[LennyW]

http://www.roomeetimes.com/wp-content/uploads/165.jpgThe imagery, which was progressively captured by satellites passing over the area, has not yet been released to the media.Credit: http://www.roomeetimes.com/plane-searchers-investigate-debris-found-on-indian-ocean.html

I thought I'd read that the water at that point was extremely deep?

So how come a huge piece of metal would be visible just beneath the surface?

I'm nt saying that the "bits" are nothing to do with the plane, but that image enhancement looks a bit... optimistic...

I agree with your view on the photos. They were a bit disappointing to have made such significant announcements about. Though there does appear to be something surrounded by lots of smaller things floating nearby that are similar in appearance in the different color renderings. Hopefully they have seen so much stuff in the photos that the appearance of these is telling them they are new, man made items floating around. I assume there's not a lot of fairly noticeable items floating around that in that area so far at sea.

On the floating part. They pick aluminum and other metals like that because of the strength to weight qualities. Same for the other materials that go into there, from the seating to the rest of the interior that's attached to the frame. I also think there's a fair amount of honeycomb structure in the wall panels and things. Plus, this plane would have had basically empty fuel tanks which would be very buoyant, barring gaping holes. And any other trapped air pockets would of course help. So as long as there was enough buoyant stuff attached to or trapped inside the sections, it could stay up for some time.

But the wings each have a RR Trent engine strapped to them, weighing in at 5 to 6 tonnes, i am sure that would soon pull a wing to the depths.

[coma]

With all the conspiracy theories that abound, this is the simplest and most straightforward answer I've seen so far:

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2014/03/mh370-electrical-fire/

With apologies to those who have been following the news and seen this already.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-echochambers-26640114

This theory is well flawed dude.

So it seems. Yet still no real explanation as yet.

As i said b4. A fuel dump would have been conducted

[skippybangkok]

But the wings each have a RR Trent engine strapped to them, weighing in at 5 to 6 tonnes, i am sure that would soon pull a wing to the depths.

But they have sheer bolts ... If the engine hit the water but airframe still progressing forward , they would sheer off.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

[boomerangutang]

A lot of posts dis the messenger (the press corps) but I see the press doing an ok job overall. It's an intriguing mystery, and little bits of tangible evidence comes forth. So what if there are conspiracy and other theories floated around. It's like gossip on a global scale. It's human nature to gossip. No one knows for sure, but perhaps one of the speculative scenarios will be proved true. From what I've heard, I stick with my initial gut reaction: The pilot deliberately chose the most hard-to-trace place to ditch the plane, thereby killing himself and all on board. I believe his plan was entwined with his Muslim beliefs - not much different than a prior Egypt Air tragedy out of NYC.

[Farma]

But the wings each have a RR Trent engine strapped to them, weighing in at 5 to 6 tonnes, i am sure that would soon pull a wing to the depths.

But they have sheer bolts ... If the engine hit the water but airframe still progressing forward , they would sheer off.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

Agree

I've been on the recovery team for 2 hard land based crashes plus seen numerous recovered crashed aircraft. Even internal jet engines get ripped out of the fuselage and flung away from the crash site. Other heavy items like wheels with brake units do the same.

[MK1]

Did WorldView-2 find lost jet?

The Age -21/03/2014

Ben Grubb

http://www.theage.com.au/technology/technology-news/the-satellite-that-may-have-found-missing-malaysia-airlines-flight-mh370-20140321-3575p.html

Edited March 21, 2014 by MK1

[Tywais]

Post removed with no link contributing the source of information and fair use copyright issues.

[skippybangkok]

I think the principle is its better to have an engine ripped off rather than a wing

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app