Official stamp by MOE on Thongsook BA TESOL Degree

[brucetefl]

This was subject to a great deal of debate a year ago. In some earlier posts I describe the process of creating a degree at a Thai University. As I described earlier, once the University Board of Directors has approved a degree the university can begin promoting and operating that degree. The degree is then submitted to the Ministry of Education and eventually, possibly after some suggested changes, the Ministry of Education returns the degree with an official stamp. Honestly I did not know they returned it, sent a letter or just informed the university by phone. Now I know.

Thongsook College BA TESOL received our stamped copy from the Ministry of education about one month ago. Anyone interested in seeing the picture of the degree with stamp can do so at:

I am open to sincere and polite discussion on the matter.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Scott

[aidenai]

I am open to sincere and polite discussion on the matter.

Can you explain the readers of this forum what the stamp actually says?

[brucetefl]

I actually did not ask.

I am open to sincere and polite discussion on the matter.

Can you explain the readers of this forum what the stamp actually says?

[brucetefl]

Apparently it says:

"Commission on Higher Education take note of approval of this course as of 23 December 2556"

I am open to sincere and polite discussion on the matter.

Can you explain the readers of this forum what the stamp actually says?

[Scott]

The link has been edited out since it is a link to a commercial site, which is not permitted.

[brucetefl]

Sorry.

here is just the image if that is ok.

[SailingHome]

Congratulations! Thongsook is a highly respected college who's batchelor degrees are accepted for Harvard, Stanford, and other Ivy League schools' masters programs. This is a very good win for Thongsook getting Bruce on board.

Love him or hate him, looks like many earlier posters were wrong.

[brucetefl]

Thanks for the kind words, Sailinghome, but you do overstate things just a bit. Thongsook, today, is a small, quiet, middle-of-the-road Thai university. But give us some time and we aim to change that.

And ANY degree from a university in Thailand that is recognized by the MOE can lead to graduate study in the US or UK. Nothing special there.

Edited March 25, 2014 by brucetefl

[aidenai]

Congratulations! Thongsook is a highly respected college who's batchelor degrees are accepted for Harvard, Stanford, and other Ivy League schools' masters programs. This is a very good win for Thongsook getting Bruce on board.

Love him or hate him, looks like many earlier posters were wrong.

Guess you and your fellow-students must be happy then after being almost two year in the dark.

[phosphorescent]

Congratulations! Thongsook is a highly respected college who's batchelor degrees are accepted for Harvard, Stanford, and other Ivy League schools' masters programs. This is a very good win for Thongsook getting Bruce on board.

Love him or hate him, looks like many earlier posters were wrong.

Guess you and your fellow-students must be happy then after being almost two year in the dark.

Nobody was ever in the dark. The president of Thongsook herself has always assured the students of the validity of this degree and it was known all along that this paper would arrive before the the first batch of students graduate which is still well over a year away.

Edited March 25, 2014 by phosphorescent

[sirchai]

Congratulations! Thongsook is a highly respected college who's batchelor degrees are accepted for Harvard, Stanford, and other Ivy League schools' masters programs. This is a very good win for Thongsook getting Bruce on board.

Love him or hate him, looks like many earlier posters were wrong.

Guess you and your fellow-students must be happy then after being almost two year in the dark.

Nobody was ever in the dark. The president of Thongsook herself has always assured the students of the validity of this degree and it was known all along that this paper would arrive before the the first batch of students graduate which is still well over a year away.

Dear Sir/Madam,

Please see attached file I'd received from a friend who works at the OHEC in Bangkok.

The college was actually already accepted/approved in September last year, please scroll down to the last page.

But it wasn't accredited "well over a year ago", using your own words.

Thus on the other hand leaves various questions,as the "first batch" of students seem to have graduated in something that wasn't even approved beforehand.

OHEC_Booklet4.pdf

[phosphorescent]

Congratulations! Thongsook is a highly respected college who's batchelor degrees are accepted for Harvard, Stanford, and other Ivy League schools' masters programs. This is a very good win for Thongsook getting Bruce on board.

Love him or hate him, looks like many earlier posters were wrong.

Guess you and your fellow-students must be happy then after being almost two year in the dark.

Nobody was ever in the dark. The president of Thongsook herself has always assured the students of the validity of this degree and it was known all along that this paper would arrive before the the first batch of students graduate which is still well over a year away.

Dear Sir/Madam,

Please see attached file I'd received from a friend who works at the OHEC in Bangkok.

The college was actually already accepted/approved in September last year, please scroll down to the last page.

But it wasn't accredited "well over a year ago", using your own words.

Thus on the other hand leaves various questions,as the "first batch" of students seem to have graduated in something that wasn't even approved beforehand.

It's obvious that you either didn't read my post carefully or don't yet fully grasp the English language. Either way, good luck with the which hunt.

Edited March 25, 2014 by phosphorescent

[brucetefl]

Thongsook College became accredited by the MOE in 1995.

[Scott]

Continued off-topic posting will result in suspensions. No leeway will be granted.

[fifthcolumn]

The current rules appear to be that a B/MA is required in Education, period. I have seen many posts of laments, persons with degrees from great schools washed out because they have Lingustics and Language Aquisition printed on their sheepskin.

That says TESOL and is nothing more than a glorified CELTA program.

Approved MOE...like every TEFL and Thai language school on Thailand.

Whats the stamp supposed to do lol?

Edited March 26, 2014 by fifthcolumn

[brucetefl]

Wow.

So a full 120-credit degree is the same as a CELTA?

Exactly what planet are you from?

Wow.

By the way show me a TEFL course approved by the MOE in Thailand. There are EXACTLY three that have been approved, the rest are just English schools that have been approved that offer TEFL courses on the side.

Its NOT a B. Ed. But it is a degree. Just as students of our degree many of our students are already getting work permits through their schools. Don't ask me how because I just do not know.

And with the degree and a Diploma in education you can be fully qualified. That is assuming the TCT do not change the rules again (very likely to happen).

Wow.

The current rules appear to be that a B/MA is required in Education, period. I have seen many posts of laments, persons with degrees from great schools washed out because they have Lingustics and Language Aquisition printed on their sheepskin.

That says TESOL and is nothing more than a glorified CELTA program.

Approved MOE...like every TEFL and Thai language school on Thailand.

Whats the stamp supposed to do lol?

Edited March 27, 2014 by brucetefl

[brucetefl]

And what time is it?

Because they change every 15 minutes or so.

And "appear to be" is crucial since TCT seem to be as transparent as mud. As I mentioned in my earlier post, we have had a few dozen students of our BA request letters confirming their enrollment because, according to them, just the letter will allow them to get a Work Permit through their school.

The current rules appear to be that a B/MA is required in Education,

[im fine and you]

Good to see some development, and that program should be expanded to other unis.

I guess all the trolling is "why is he able to do this and not me?".

[fifthcolumn]

OK so bit hyperbolic. But if you had a BA I would rather have a CELTA from ECC than this thing.

Like I said, it does not meet the minimum requirement per the TCT leak a few months back. Even a degree from Chula is woethless outside Thailand so what am I missing? That diploma won't be worth the paper it's written on in the west.

Why don't you do a BA Ed? That's what everyone is after here.

You never did explain why the stamp was so special and the distinction between this course's MOE approval and say...Text and Talk.

Thanks

[brucetefl]

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OK so bit hyperbolic. But if you had a BA I would rather have a CELTA from ECC than this thing.

Like I said, it does not meet the minimum requirement per the TCT leak a few months back. Even a degree from Chula is woethless outside Thailand so what am I missing? That diploma won't be worth the paper it's written on in the west.

Why don't you do a BA Ed? That's what everyone is after here.


You never did explain why the stamp was so special and the distinction between this course's MOE approval and say...Text and Talk.

Thanks

I think you are missing the basic point here.

If you already have a degree, DO NOT TAKE THE BA TESOL. Will it provide you with useful information? Of course it will, but its a full degree, simply unnecessary for people who already have a degree.

But in order to begin teaching in Thailand you need a degree. This is a degree.

Taking a four-week CELTA or variant will not meet his requirement.

Its not everything. it is not a B. Ed, because a B. Ed would increase the time required to 5 years. Many will complete this degree in 3. Better to get a Masters, in my opinion.

ANd the difference in the stamp...

One is the Stamp of the Council of Higher Education, verifying a full, four year degree for an institute of Higher Education in Thailand.

The other would be a stamp from 15/2 Nonformal Education, the same organization that approves hair dressers and drivers schools. Its kind of a big difference.

by the way, I think you underestimate the usefulness of the degree back home. Thai students go on to study masters and PhD's all over the world on the strength of their Thai degrees. And if a job requires a degree, you can answer affirmatively.

Edited March 27, 2014 by brucetefl

[fifthcolumn]

If it is not a BA in Education it is worthless. While the TCT may change its mind tomorrow and this diploma is as good as a money tree in the garden of Babel - today it is DOA. You do anyone a disservice signing them up for this thing.

I don't understand why a Bachelors need take five years unless it also has some sort of addl certification and is as good as a full professional BA + teaching certification in the west.

Bachelor Arts in the US are four years. Hence the coloquial, four year colleges.

So what if it takes five years if it is a proper degree.

My 3rd post on this matter and you still have not clarified the significance of the stamp and why this school more than some dodgy school teaching say...Thai language approved by MOE is any different.

Honestly, and I am seriously not trying to be beligerent, this is not of any financial benefit as it currently sits with TCT.

For what its worth, I have bern waiting for over six months for something to be announced from TCT. I have delayed taking a TEFL for months as I do not eant to gamble 1500us when the latest announcement states that TCT is very close to making in writ, no BA Ed no job.

Scott seems to think one can still do the waiver route and I am going for that without the training. Just go job hunting, why not? What is to lose? I have a BA and 2yrs but that was moons ago.

Finally, you stated basically - if you have a degree you are gold. You don't need another BA. But I disagree, lots of people are very worried and will do snother BA if thats what it tskes to stay on.

I'm old school. I want a traditional subject as well. History, English, Fine Arts, Liberal Arts, even Education - any major that is 100 years old as for as Arts degrees go. But that is me.

TESOL degree strikes me as quite narrow and I honesty question its academic rigor both as a major and especially it being offered by a mid level school (for Thailand no less).

Again, it does not meet todays apparent standard, no idea why anyone should do this ghing unless its for mental masturbation.

But that's just me

[brucetefl]

If I have not already made myself very clear on every point you are simply trying, purposefully, not to understand.

I CERTAINLY did not say that "if you have a degree you are gold."

[Scott]

I am not sure, but I believe this program was set up to help those who teachers who didn't have a degree but wanted to teach. I believe it is scheduled to work around the academic year. I don't know much about the actual program but I do know two students who are in the program and at least one of them also works as a teacher.

[fifthcolumn]

Dude -

I am not here to troll. I think it is you that havr not understood my points (as a potential consumer/student).

You have not addressed three key issues: Stamp, why your MOE is more important than Somchai Language Shack and with the anmouncement of the TCT more strict standards requiring a BA in Ed why someone should nother with this thing. It is very simple.

I have read three accounts recently of licence apps being turned down because it does not state Education in the major. Fact.

Why do you keep going on trying to peg me as some village idiot. These are very valid wuestions none of which you have addressed despite me asking in every post.

I would post the official link but its to bkkpost, so I cannot.

And for what its worth, I would rather have a degree from top 3 Thai unis or none at all. I would rather have online degree from a state college in US than anything less and still maybe rather have online degree to even Chula if I wasn't certain I was going to be here my lifetime. Certain.

I think its a hard sell for jobs paying 20-30k a month + attendant hassles.

No idea where this diploma wiuld get you outside Thailand. Even inside with Thailands no fail policy.

I'm done here. Good luck with your TEFL course.

[brucetefl]

There are many routes to getting a teachers license in Thailand. And this is true for the new standards as well as the old. You can take exams and get Distance Learning diplomas or online masters degrees. But before you can do any of those YOU NEED A DEGREE. Any degree. Because if you go out and get a Diploma in Education and still have no degree you will be denied a Teachers License. Same goes for a Masters Degree, although few (if any) MA programs would accept someone without having... a degree,

Its also possible to go out and get a B. Ed. But that is likely to be very time consuming and extremely expensive. B ED are not available by Distance Learning (that I have seen). Going "back home" to get one is not something most people want to do and most cannot afford it.

On the other hand some of these other options are available. But you need that degree. having a degree makes taking those final steps to get a teachers license more easily attainable and far more affordable.

And it needs to be a degree that teachers in Thailand can afford. Maybe something like 3,000 baht per month.

And they cannot afford it if they cannot continue working. So a flexible schedule that allows them to attend during holidays is an attractive option, especially for those not living in Bangkok.

Once teachers have this degree they have a lot more options. Getting a TESOL certificate is not going to do it. Thats a joke.

Its not for everyone, but many people have found it to be a valuable option.

And all of this is pretty obvious to people who have even a basic knowledge of the TCT, which you apparently have.

Edited March 28, 2014 by brucetefl

[tingtong]

http://www.iis.ru.ac.th/English_Program/Teacher_Qualification/diploma_in_teaching_profession.htm

IF i read all correctly, this might be a possible way? AFTER having a degree ( of any kind, what doesnt exclude a BA TESOL)?

[brucetefl]

Application Requirements

1. Having earned a Bachelor Degree or higher in any field from an accredited university.

Or Fifthcolumn can try using his TEFL cert. Same thing!

http://www.iis.ru.ac.th/English_Program/Teacher_Qualification/diploma_in_teaching_profession.htm

IF i read all correctly, this might be a possible way? AFTER having a degree ( of any kind, what doesnt exclude a BA TESOL)?

[tingtong]

Just what I thought then.

If this collage is accredited by Thai MOE, that better be enough to be accepted by another Thai university.

The linked course is 8 months ( part time), guess could be a viable way also for those with BA already.

[brucetefl]

Yes this looks like an excellent option. What are the fees?

[fifthcolumn]

OK I got it. Your degree as it sits with the TCT will not get you a licence but you can then go for a Masters of Education somewhere outside the country and then return to get your licence. You are offering a cheap way to obtain a B? In TESOL.

You are continually evasive and dismissive of what appears to be more of a requirement coming than less a requirement coming - namely, no BA Ed, no licence and very possibly no four years of waivers. It is quite possible all this is fully in place by the time you get your "project" into a "saleable" state, let alone by the time the poor sod completes the program.

You never addressed the importance of a stamp nor MOE approval. But it is all most clear now.

Review the title of YOUR thread Bruce - what is the significsnce of said stamp?

Would not have bothered again but for your passive aggressive slights. Please tell me you don't plan on teaching this as well.

Edited March 28, 2014 by fifthcolumn