http://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/videos/9891773/Biker-plunges-down-cliff-to-miss-car

What a tosser.

blokes like this basically deserve what they get..

What was he doing crossing the white line? hope the innocent car driver didn't have a coronary

Tosser seems a bit mild to me.

Object fixation, looked at the thing he was trying to avoid. Lucky to walk away.

Sturdy camera to take that beating though.

sturdy guy too to be able to get that beating and stand up right away.

Accidents happen sometime.

yes but it didn't happen in Thailand, did it?

sturdy guy too to be able to get that beating and stand up right away.

Accidents happen sometime.

Sturdy between the ears is all..

ACCIDENT; meaning... an unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally,

This was not an accident by definition..he was a tosser who confused his ambitions with his abilities.

He was way too hot into the corner after passing the other bike and how many warning signs advising of the tighter corner..3 or 4 at least..

His actions alone resulted in a what could easily have been a fatality..nothing unexpected or unintentional there

As he drifted more and more towards the centerline (from 00:10 - 00:12), I would venture that had he known more about countersteering, he could have brought the bike back into his lane earlier.

Having said that, he definitely went into the corner way too hot for his riding ability (I am not in any way saying that I have better riding ability). He also did not brake going into the corner but merely coasted through it (listening to his engine revs).

Whatever, a good thing he did not crash into the car. He would have been hard pressed to survive such an accident and the car occupants could also have been seriously injured.

sturdy guy too to be able to get that beating and stand up right away.

Accidents happen sometime.

Sturdy between the ears is all..

ACCIDENT; meaning... an unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally,

This was not an accident by definition..he was a tosser who confused his ambitions with his abilities.

He was way too hot into the corner after passing the other bike and how many warning signs advising of the tighter corner..3 or 4 at least..

His actions alone resulted in a what could easily have been a fatality..nothing unexpected or unintentional there

I was writing my post at the same time as you.

Yes, I fully agree that he confused his ambitions with his abilities. There were 2/3 warning signs to be exact. In fact, even if not for the car, he might have gone over the cliff in any case as he did not seem to know how to bring the bike back under control.

But it was (for him) an accident. For him, it was both unexpected and unintentional

Way way too fast.

Very lucky idiot.

Thats on the Cat and Fiddle near Buxton.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat_and_Fiddle_Road

Lucky to survive and not doing the image of bikers any good at all.

Happy he didn't hit the car.

If the Rozzers got a hold of that footage he would be done for dangerous driving and banned.

I agree, looks like he would have gone over anyway. Or leave the road in the next bend.

I agree, looks like he would have gone over anyway. Or leave the road in the next bend.

The reason I go for track and instruction days is to know at what speeds to approach different sorts of corners. Tracks have run off areas, ambulances on stand by, recovery vehicles.

We can transfer the knowledge and information that we gain from track days to better improve and increase the safety of our road riding. There is however no accounting for reckless riding and that is only something that can only be gained from experience.

Thats on the Cat and Fiddle near Buxton.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat_and_Fiddle_Road

Lucky to survive and not doing the image of bikers any good at all.

Happy he didn't hit the car.

If the Rozzers got a hold of that footage he would be done for dangerous driving and banned.

Yeh..makes him even more of a tosser, that he released the footage..[one]... because possibly the rozzers could convict him on this evidence alone and [two]....for releasing it at all showing his stupidity and lack of ability for all to see...

EDIT..thanks for the link soihok...great riding road and now all wrapped in cotton wool because of guys like him...

It's a pretty good advertisement for Alpinestars suits/boots and Shoei helmets.

This is a classic example of how you have to train yourself to often act in a counterintuitive manner on a bike (i.e. not slowing down when on the surface it seems like the best course of action)- he didn't get into the corner too hot at all (as far as his bike/speed were concerned- obviously his skills were another matter) but he panicked and rolled off the gas (and probably hit the brakes), which forced him to go too wide- had he stayed on the throttle, he would have made the turn without a problem.

What a fool this rider is. He definitely is riding way harder than his abilities can support. I hope he will learn from the lesson. School of hard knocks. Bike must have been toast after that frame bending session

What was he doing crossing the white line? hope the innocent car driver didn't have a coronary

Tosser seems a bit mild to me.

Unexperienced driver had, fear of more inclined position and than that can happen.

It's a pretty good advertisement for Alpinestars suits/boots and Shoei helmets.

This is a classic example of how you have to train yourself to often act in a counterintuitive manner on a bike (i.e. not slowing down when on the surface it seems like the best course of action)- he didn't get into the corner too hot at all (as far as his bike/speed were concerned- obviously his skills were another matter) but he panicked and rolled off the gas (and probably hit the brakes), which forced him to go too wide- had he stayed on the throttle, he would have made the turn without a problem.

Bizarre....its there for all too see..he went into the corner at a speed above his abilities AKA too hot..this wouldn't have happened otherwise...

^

What's 'bizarre'? Please re-read my post- I said his speed was not 'too hot' in-and-of itself, but rather his skills were another matter- the turn was easy to make at the speed he was riding had he known what he was doing.

Obviously it was a clear case of rider error.

'Too hot' for his abilities and 'too hot' to be easily made are two different things- I'm not denying he screwed up, but rather I'm making an observation of the cause of the accident beyond simply saying he was going too fast for his skills- it wasn't speed that caused him to run wide, but, rather, slowing down at the wrong time (one of Keith Code's favorite 'fear reactions'). Of course if he'd been riding slower it wouldn't have happened, and I'm not arguing that- I'd bet he's a newb who didn't bother to learn anything beyond what it took to pass his motorcycle licensing test.

^

What's 'bizarre'? Please re-read my post- I said his speed was not 'too hot' in-and-of itself, but rather his skills were another matter- the turn was easy to make at the speed he was riding had he known what he was doing.

Obviously it was a clear case of rider error.

'Too hot' for his abilities and 'too hot' to be easily made are two different things- I'm not denying he screwed up, but rather I'm making an observation of the cause of the accident beyond simply saying he was going too fast for his skills.

Yes it was obviously a case of rider error for sure. the cause of this incident was 100% that he was going too fast into the corner for his abilities [too hot] ..nothing else came into it.

'Too hot' for his abilities and 'too hot' to be easily made are two different things'

Ok i'm interested in this..care to enlighten me here on the two differences...

You edited again whilst i was posting ...

^

I edited my previous post before reading your reply, but I'll humor you.

A decent rider could have taken that turn at a higher speed than the rider in the video and easily made it- the rider in the video rode at a speed beyond his limited abilities and crashed- his speed was 'too hot' for his skills, but not 'too hot' for even a marginally skilled rider, hence his speed was not 'too hot' for many riders, but, rather, 'too hot' for him.

It's about context- I could easily make turns at speeds 'too hot' for the rider in the video- Valentino Rossi could make turns in his sleep that would be 'too hot' for me at half his entry speed.

^

I edited my previous post before reading your reply, but I'll humor you.

A decent rider could have taken that turn at a higher speed than the rider in the video and easily made it- the rider in the video rode at a speed beyond his limited abilities and crashed- his speed was 'too hot' for his skills, but not 'too hot' for even a marginally skilled rider, hence his speed was not 'too hot' for many riders, but, rather, 'too hot' for him.

It's about context- I could easily make turns at speeds 'too hot' for the rider in the video- Valentino Rossi could make turns in his sleep that would be 'too hot' for me at half his entry speed.

Good on you..now you admit that what i said was correct...round and round you went,,but now at the end its settled.Well done!

As you said..;'It's about context-"... exactly right again. .in this case the story was about this particular chump so the " too hot for the corner " was only relevant in context of his actions/mistakes alone....not yours or mine or even Rossi...

^

'Admit what you said was correct?' What does that mean? Did I specifically quote your post and say you were wrong?

I was obviously speaking in specific terms in a way that a new rider who might read my post could actually learn something rather than making a general statement/observation about what was shown on the video as some others did (though I'm only forwarding what I learned from 'A Twist of the Wrist II', which is a book every rider should read- at a minimum, they should watch the video and then apply what they learned to their riding as much as possible).

I didn't go 'round and round'- I clarified my point as it escaped you the first time- what I first posted was correct- his speed wasn't 'too hot' to make the corner- his skills were another matter. He was 'too hot' for his ability, and I'm not arguing that point now, nor was I previously- I was making a point.

Imo this shows the difference between real life and racetrack. A racetrack is much wider than one lane of a normal street. So in real life if there is oncoming traffic there is no space for such mistakes. Just ride slower if you don't know the street/corner 100%. The rider was too fast probably because peer pressure (riding buddies, video recording, ...), lack of steering skills and panicking, imo a combination of all. Good nothing bad happened. Good lesson to learn for beginners.

It's a pretty good advertisement for Alpinestars suits/boots and Shoei helmets.

This is a classic example of how you have to train yourself to often act in a counterintuitive manner on a bike (i.e. not slowing down when on the surface it seems like the best course of action)- he didn't get into the corner too hot at all (as far as his bike/speed were concerned- obviously his skills were another matter) but he panicked and rolled off the gas (and probably hit the brakes), which forced him to go too wide- had he stayed on the throttle, he would have made the turn without a problem.

"It's a pretty good advertisement for Alpinestars suits/boots and Shoei helmets."

Shhh..... some posters are adamant that a 500 Bht helment (or even no helmet at all) would be more than sufficient

Imo this shows the difference between real life and racetrack. A racetrack is much wider than one lane of a normal street. So in real life if there is oncoming traffic there is no space for such mistakes. Just ride slower if you don't know the street/corner 100%. The rider was too fast probably because peer pressure (riding buddies, video recording, ...), lack of steering skills and panicking, imo a combination of all. Good nothing bad happened. Good lesson to learn for beginners.

Absolutely- learning to check your ego on a bike is very important.

Every year or so I'll head to SoCal and ride with some friends- a couple are ex-AMA racers, and they just sail off into the distance- there was a time I might have tried to keep up (which would probably end up in disaster, or at the very least my feeling stupid at my inability to do so;)), but now I can just smile and eventually meet up with them at the top/bottom of the mountain or wherever.

It's best to clarify how the ride will go with the other riders before starting out- the 'group dynamic' needs to be worked out to raise everyone's degree of safety.

There's a great article by Nick Ienatsch called 'The Pace'- he updated it last year as a '2.0' edition, but the original is worth reading (or re-reading as many have probably already seen it and taken it to heart):

Nick Ienatsch's article on The Pace

Reprinted as originally published in Motorcyclist, Nov 91.

Racing involves speed, concentration and commitment; the results of a mistake are usually catastrophic because there's little room for error riding at 100 percent. Performance street riding is less intense and further from the absolute limit, but because circumstances are less controlled, mistakes and overagressiveness can be equally catastrophic. Plenty of roadracers have sworn off street riding. "Too dangerous, too many variables and too easy to get carried away with too much speed," track specialists claim. Adrenaline-addled racers find themselves treating the street like the track, and not surprisingly, they get burned by the police, the laws of physics and the cold, harsh realities of an environment not groomed for ten tenths riding. But as many of us know, a swift ride down a favorite road may be the finest way to spend a few free hours with a bike we love. And these few hours are best enjoyed riding at The Pace.

A year after I joined the Motorcyclist staff in 1984, Mitch Boehm was hired. Six months later, The Pace came into being, and we perfected it during the next few months of road testing and weekend fun rides. Now The Pace is part of my life--and a part of the Sunday-morning riding group I frequent. The Pace is a street technique that not only keeps street riders alive, but thoroughly entertained as well.

THE PACE

The Pace focuses on bike control and de-emphasizes outright speed. Full-throttle acceleration and last minute braking aren't part of the program, effectively eliminating the two most common single-bike accident scenarios in sport riding. Cornering momentum is the name of the game, stressing strong, forceful inputs at the handlebar to place the bike correctly at the entrance of the turn and get it flicked in with little wasted time and distance. Since the throttle wasn't slammed open at the exit of the last corner, the next corner doesn't require much, if any, braking. It isn't uncommon to ride with our group and not see a brake light flash all morning.

If the brakes are required, the front lever gets squeezed smoothly, quickly and with a good deal of force to set entrance speed with minimum time. Running in on the brakes is tantamount to running off the road, a confession that you're pushing too hard and not getting your entrance speed set early enough because you stayed on the gas too long. Running The Pace decreases your reliance on the throttle and brakes, the two easiest controls to abuse, and hones your ability to judge cornering speed, which is the most thrilling aspect of performance street riding.

YOUR LANE IS YOUR LIMIT

Crossing the centerline at any time except during a passing maneuver is intolerable, another sign that you're pushing too hard to keep up. Even when you have a clean line of sight through a left-hand kink, stay to the right of the centerline. Staying on the right side of the centerline is much more challenging than simply straightening every slight corner, and when the whole group is committed to this intelligent practice, the temptation to cheat is eliminated through peer pressure and logic. Though street riding shouldn't be described in racing terms, you can think of your lane as the racetrack. Leaving your lane is tantamount to a crash.

Exact bike control has you using every inch of your lane if the circumstances permit it. In corners with a clear line of sight and no oncoming traffic, enter at the far outside of the corner, turn the bike relatively late in the corner to get a late apex at the far inside of your lane and accelerate out, just brushing the far outside of your lane as your bike stands up. Steer your bike forcefully but smoothly to minimize the transition time; don't hammer it down because the chassis will bobble slightly as it settles, possibly carrying you off line. Since you haven't charged in on the brakes, you can get the throttle on early, before the apex, which balances and settles your bike for the drive out.

More often than not, circumstances do not permit the full use of your lane from yellow line to white line and back again. Blind corners, oncoming traffic and gravel on the road are a few criteria that dictate a more conservative approach, so leave yourself a three- or four-foot margin for error, especially at the left side of the lane where errant oncoming traffic could prove fatal. Simply narrow your entrance on a blind right-hander and move your apex into your lane three feet on blind left turns in order to stay free of unseen oncoming traffic hogging the centerline. Because you're running at The Pace and not flat out, your controlled entrances offer additional time to deal with unexpected gravel or other debris in your lane; the outside wheel track is usually the cleanest through a dirty corner since a car weights its outside tires most, scrubbing more dirt off the pavement in the process, so aim for that line.

A GOOD LEADER, WILLING FOLLOWERS

The street is not a racing environment, and it takes humility, self assurance and self control to keep it that way. The leader sets the pace and monitors his mirrors for signs of raggedness in the ranks that follow, such as tucking in on straights, crossing over the yellow line and hanging off the motorcycle in corners. If the leader pulls away, he simply slows his straightaway speed slightly but continues to enjoy the corners, thus closing the ranks but missing none of the fun. The small group of three or four riders I ride with is so harmonious that the pace is identical no matter who's leading. The lead shifts occasionally with a quick hand sign, but there's never a pass for the lead with an ego on the sleeve. Make no mistake, the riding is spirited and quick--in the corners. Anyone with a right arm can hammer down the straights; it's the proficiency in the corners that makes The Pace come alive.

Following distances are relatively lengthy, with the straightaways---taken at more moderate speeds--the perfect opportunity to adjust the gaps. Keeping a good distance serves several purposes, besides being safer. Rock chips are minimized and the highway patrol won't suspect a race is in progress. The Pace's style of not hanging off in corners also reduces the appearance of pushing too hard and adds a degree of maturity and sensibility in the eyes of the public and the law. There's a definite challenge to cornering quickly while sitting sedately on your bike.

New rider indoctrination takes some time because The Pace develops very high cornering speeds and newcomers want to hammer the throttle on exits to make up for what they lose at the entrances. Our group slows drastically when a new rider joins the ranks because our technique of moderate straightaway speeds and no brakes can suck the unaware into a corner too fast, creating the most common single-bike accident. With a new rider learning The Pace behind you, tap your brake lightly well before the turn to alert him and make sure he understands there's no pressure to stay with the group.

There's plenty of ongoing communication during The Pace. A foot off the peg indicates debris on the road, and all slowing or turning intentions are signaled in advance with the left hand and arm. Turn signals are used for direction changes and passing, with a wave of the left hand to thank the cars that move right and make it easy for the motorcyclists to get past. Since you don't have a death grip on the handlebar, you left hand is also free to wave to oncoming riders, a fading courtesy that we'd like to see return. If you're getting the idea The Pace is a relaxing, noncompetitive way to ride with a group, you are right.

RELAX AND FLICK IT

I'd rather spend a Sunday in the mountains riding at The Pace than a Sunday at the racetrack, it is that enjoyable. Countersteering is the name of the game, a smooth forceful steering input at the handlebar relayed to the tires contact patches through a rigid sport-bike frame. Riding at The Pace is certainly what the bike manufacturers had in mind when sport bikes evolved to the street.

But the machine isn't the most important aspect of running The Pace because you can do it on anything capable of getting through a corner. Attitude is The Pace's most important aspect; realizing the friend ahead of you isn't a competotor, respecting his right to lead the group occasionally and giving him credit for his riding skills. You must have the maturity to limlt your straightaway speeds to allow the group to stay in touch and the sense to realize that racetrack tactics such as late braking and full throttle runs to redline will alienate the public and police and possibly introduce you to the unforgiving laws of gravity. When the group arrives at the destination after running The Pace, no one feels outgunned or is left with the feeling he must prove himself on the return run. If you've got something to prove, get on a racetrack.

The racetrack measures your speed with a stopwatch and direct competition, welcoming your agression and gritty resolve to be the best. Performance street riding's only yardstick is the amount of enjoyment gained, not lap times, finishing position or competitors beaten. The differences are huge but not always remembered by riders who haven't discovered The Pace's cornering pureness and group involvement. Hammer on the racetrack. Pace yourself on the street.

Looks like Scotland. What a tosser. If you are going to risk your own life that's fine, don't drive on the wrong side of the road around a blind bend.

I don't look at this guy as an idiot or 'tosser' (if my assumption is correct and he's a newb)- he just didn't realize that it takes more than the ability to twist a throttle to properly and skillfully ride a motorcycle.

I definitely did a few things in my beginning days that make me cringe to think about, and that I'm lucky to have escaped unscathed- it was only when I realized how much I didn't know that I sought guidance and additional training (and I was fortunate enough to have it available). Suddenly, some 'mysteries' became solved, and I improved (without having ever ridden off a cliff:)).

'Glass houses' and all that (at least in my case...)

Yep, the bloke is a tosser. Should not be on a machine that is waaaaaaaaaaay beyond his gray cell capability...............