US Paypal -> Bangkok Bank vs. NY Branch ACH fees ?

[Pib]

Are you sure they all have no "cash advance" fee; I don't see that in the small print for the 'platinum signature'

https://www.penfed.org/VPS_Benefits_Guide/

says nothing, perhaps, it's not an "advance", if you pay it immediately for their purposes, though, I guess I prefer the 'promise card' explicitly saying so.

Review post #64 again... the info is clearly in the Summary of Terms (PDF) for each card... be sure to review that doc on each card... that's where it says no cash advance fee. Sent from my Onda V971 tablet

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Chubby, what Pib has recounted above is correct.

1. Re the credit card cash advance and then payment into the credit card account, when you do that via the PFCU online banking system, the actual money arriving may take a couple days, but PFCU credits the payment to the credit card account on the day you ordered the transfer. So it effectively becomes same day.

2. Re the no cash advance fee feature of PFCU's credit cards, each PFCU credit card has its own Adobe Acrobat terms and conditions PDF document that spells out all the details, including interest rates, fees, etc. You can download/view each document for each different card on the PFCU credit cards webpage.

[chubby]

are penfed credit cards unique in not charging for cash advances? i asked cap one visa card and they said it's $10.00 , then immediately they begin charging interest, i'm wondering if anyone has done the cap one card cash advance, or has another card in mind besides penfed's cards, thx

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I don't know of any Cap One credit cards that don't have cash advance fees. Most U.S. credit cards do have cash advance fees, so that's certainly the norm. But I suspect there may be a few other exceptions out there.

One I'm aware of is the State Department Federal Credit Union's Visa Platinum credit card. According to the credit card disclosures on their webpage, they do not charge any advance fee for bank counter advances (which is what Pib is doing), but they will charge a $3 fee for ATM cash advances. And of course, like PFCU, they also will charge interest if you don't cover the advance. But their card also has NO foreign currency fee.

https://www.sdfcu.org/emv-creditcards

Remember, PFCU for their credit cards will start charging interest as well at the point you draw down the funds -- unless you do as Pib is doing, and that's to do a simultaneous transfer of an equal amount of funds INTO the credit card account to offset the advance.

A lot of the different credit card disclosures I've seen lately have a double charge for cash advances. They all pretty much will charge interest on any cash advance amount starting with the date it is taken. But most will also charge an advance fee of 3-5% of the amount you withdraw, and often that's set as a minimum of at least $10 no matter how small your advance might be. So those cards are going to charge you their X%/$10 minimum fee, even if you immediately cover the amount of the advance.

Fortunately, PFCU doesn't do the X%/$10 min fee for their credit card cash advances.

Edited June 6, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Pib]

are penfed credit cards unique in not charging for cash advances? i asked cap one visa card and they said it's $10.00 , then immediately they begin charging interest, i'm wondering if anyone has done the cap one card cash advance, or has another card in mind besides penfed's cards, thx

Done a cash advance 4 times now at a Bangkok Bank branch using my CapOne credit card--no cash advance fee charged by CapOne. Then logged onto my CapOne account same day and made a credit card payment to completely offset the cash advance and prevent any interest charge due to the cash advance. Cash advance amount allowed per day/transaction is $2,000 (approx Bt64K) which I've been doing. Total cash amount allowed is your line of credit on the card. So, get a cash advance today up to $2,000 and go do it again tomorrow if desired...and go the next day...etc...etc...etc...right up to you hit your line of credit limit if desired. No fees of any kind charged...you get the Visa/Mastercard exchange rate with no foreign transaction fee applied...no fee charged by the Thai bank either. Summary: PenFed credit cards do not charge a cash advance (one of the few who don't) or foreign transaction fee.

Sent from my Samsung S4

[Jeffrey346]

BKK's fees are much lower than Paypal's fees. PP will charge you 2.5% plus give you a lower exchange rate. BKK will charge a flat $5.00 + B200 and whatever the TT rate is at the time of transfer. You are much better off with BKK

Here are my experiences. I use PayPal all the time for sending money to the US with no problems and do not mind the fee since the receipient gets the money in their account (so they have informed me) within 1-2 business days. However, using PayPal to transfer money into my Bangkok Bank account will take up to 10 business days, which PayPal does not bother to advise you until you complain having not received the money quickly, so never use them coming this direction. So have money sent to me via SWIFT wire transfer, which cost $50 fee with a better exchange rate than PayPal. Cost more but guaranteed to be in my account within 2 business days.

Why pay $50. when you can use BKK NY for $5. and have it in your account in 3 working days.

[chubby]

so Pib, your last post said "capone" but then your summary said PFCU ?

CapOne CC; told me what Tallguy said, $10/per ; via their securemessage system, which of course, could very well be a wrong answer fwiw .....

[Pib]

so Pib, your last post said "capone" but then your summary said PFCU ?

CapOne CC; told me what Tallguy said, $10/per ; via their securemessage system, which of course, could very well be a wrong answer fwiw .....

Yea...my bad...too early in the morning...had CapOne on the brain. Where ever I say CapOne in my above post I should have said PFCU.

Sent from my Samsung S4

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Most if not all of the Cap One credit cards I've seen have a 3% (min. $10) cash advance fee. So they're not quite so bad as some of the other big banks that are at 5% (min $10) for credit card cash advances. And of course, Cap One's more familiar credit cards don't charge any foreign currency fee, also unlike most of the big card issuers (Citi, Chase, BofA, with two exceptions) etc etc.

I've always wondered, but don't know for sure, because I've never done it... But if someone were to do a counter cash advance using a typical U.S. credit card other than PenFed or Cap one, presumably, they'd get hit first with the 3-5% ($10 min.) cash advance fee, and then have an additional 3% or higher foreign currency conversion fee tacked on as well. You might very well be paying an 8% or higher surcharge on your withdrawal, and that's before figuring in any interest accrual. Ouch!

[Pib]

Most if not all of the Cap One credit cards I've seen have a 3% (min. $10) cash advance fee. So they're not quite so bad as some of the other big banks that are at 5% (min $10) for credit card cash advances. And of course, Cap One's more familiar credit cards don't charge any foreign currency fee, also unlike most of the big card issuers (Citi, Chase, BofA, with two exceptions) etc etc.

I've always wondered, but don't know for sure, because I've never done it... But if someone were to do a counter cash advance using a typical U.S. credit card other than PenFed or Cap one, presumably, they'd get hit first with the 3-5% ($10 min.) cash advance fee, and then have an additional 3% or higher foreign currency conversion fee tacked on as well. You might very well be paying an 8% or higher surcharge on your withdrawal, and that's before figuring in any interest accrual. Ouch!

And unfortunately some people are surely doing just that....cash cows for banksters.

[chubby]

do you have >1 PFCU credit card, or see any point in it? I now have a promise card, noticed it also seems to have chip technology, which should be a good thing .......

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Anytime I've had renewals of my credit cards lately, where possible, I've requested the new card be chip-embedded. PFCU is one of those institutions that's already given their members the choice of switching to the chip-embedded credit cards even prior to the regular card re-issuance cycle.

As for numbers of cards, I'd say it's prudent to have more than one card that has the features you want and use/need. Whether that's PFCU only or some combination of PFCU or other card issuers is strictly a matter of preferences and use style.

Having a combination of cards like the PFCU Promise, which has no fees for most things, but also no rewards, combined with a cash rewards card like Cap One's Quicksilver (or similar) or BofA's travel and cash rewards cards -- all of which have no FCF -- seems like a good balance and combination.

[chubby]

I wasn't aware that there were many cards at all, that were now chip/PIN, only seen two, happen to know if the Quicksilver has that option?

from what I gather, with the death of Aeon, cash advances are how folks are accessing cash now? other than direct BBL NYC transfers ?

so, maybe I could get the other PFCU Pib has, as I have the promise now......

Edited June 8, 2014 by chubby

[Pib]

I wasn't aware that there were many cards at all, that were now chip/PIN, only seen two, happen to know if the Quicksilver has that option?

from what I gather, with the death of Aeon, cash advances are how folks are accessing cash now? other than direct BBL NYC transfers ?

so, maybe I could get the other PFCU Pib has, as I have the promise now......

PenFed has around 6 different Visa and American Express credit cards, all of which do not have a cash advance or foreign transaction fee. Which card you want ends up boiling down to the differences in benefits, like whether cash reward or points reward, interest rates, etc. Personally, I want "cash rewards" as earning "points" towards travel or overpriced products don't tickle me.

Since I think you have CapOne credit card that pays 1.5% cash back, then maybe you would want the PFCU Defender card that also pays 1.5% cash back. The Promise card you got does not have any rewards program, cash or points....its big selling points is pretty no fees incurred for things like late payment, spending over credit limit, no penalty APR, etc....but it seems to me anyone having at least fair financial management capability wouldn't incur such fees anyway. So for me, the Promise card didn't turn me on as I'm into "cash back" and like to think I would never be in the position of incurring credit card payment late fees, etc--I've got a unblemished record so far in my lifetime.

As mentioned, I want cash back rewards. Since I had a couple of CapOne cards that provide 1.5% cash back (use to be 2% on one of them before they adjusted it down to 1.5%) and since I have a vehicle here in Thailand, do a lot of driving around, and spend a good amount of money on fuel each month I figured I would get the PFCU Cash Platinum Rewards Visa Plus Card which pays 5% (five) cash back for "gas purchases paid at the pump (i.e., where you slide you card into the pump to pay for the fuel)." They also have the Standard version that pay 3% cash back on fuel purchases. When I got the card it also had a small 0.25% cash back reward on everything else but that went away last year...only the 3/5% cash back for pay-at-pump fuel purchase now apply.

Now I knew Thai fuel stations "do not" do the pay-at-the-pump thing yet (but TallGuy did PM me a few months ago with a link to a PTT news story where they are installing a few pay-at-pump/self service" pumps at some stations as a test), but I figured if the card does end of giving me 5% cash back for my Thailand fuel purchases then I would be setting in tall cotton. When I tested the card at my local That fuel station, the service station attendants used the POS machine just like inside a store, and I didn't get any cash back on the purchase--but I was fully expecting this since it was not true pay-at-the-pump transaction where you slide your card into the pump.. However, but, once/if PTT does install some self service/pay-at-the-pump fuel pumps on a wide scale (Thailand will get around to that sooner or later) and when I buy gas in the U.S. at self service/pay-at-the-pump stations I'll be getting 5% cash back on my fuel purchase. This particular card is considered one of the best, or the best, cash back cards for fuel purchases in the U.S. Note: PTT/Thai fuel stations will probably mess of my dream of getting 5% cash back by only allowing certain cards/maybe just their card and/or apply a Bt150-180 foreign card fee like Thai ATMs do...will have to wait and see what happens.

As mentioned, there is Standard and Plus version of the card...the Standard pays 3% and the Plus 5% and the Standard comes with a annual fee of $25 but the Plus with no annual fee if you meet one of eight qualifying conditions...the easiest condition to meet is just opening a PFCU Money Market account ($25 minumum balance) to get Plus card which pays 5% cash back on fuel and has no annual card fee.

Yeap, as I mentioned in an earlier post and this post, all of the PFCU cards have no cash advance or foreign transaction fee....which one to pick just boils down to picking the one which has a rewards programs, other benefits, etc., that you would prefer to have.

Edited June 9, 2014 by Pib

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

One of the other advantages of the PFCU Promise card, other than the absence of fees, is AFAIK it tends to have a lower interest rate on any recurring balances than their other cards. Even if I don't carry a recurring balance, I like to have the option of one or two cards that have a lower interest rate, in case I ever need/want them. I believe my Promise card rate right now is under 9% APR.

BTW, as for chipped credit cards, I did notice that the BofA Travel Rewards card, one of perhaps only 2 credit cards BofA offers that have NO foreign currency fee along with their similar Cash Rewards card, now also is coming in a chipped variety. The Cash Rewards card not. But the Travel Rewards card has... Don't ask me why the difference, other than BofA apparently feels having a chipped card is more advantageous to "travelers."

Edited June 9, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[chubby]

So, Tallguy you "ask" for chip/PIN cards, but doesn't mean you have many? eg. the COne Quicksilver Visa, does not have Chip/PIN, correct?

back to my OP question: is there anything BUT Western Union to transfer a small amount of money to a friend , that makes sense ? WU ripped me off last time , major

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Chubby, re your questions above.

My Cap One credit cards have not offered the chip function as yet. And in looking at the Cap One website for Quicksilver, it shows a photo image of the card, and that image doesn't show any chip.

--------------------------------------

As for sending money, the answer is going to be based on HOW MUCH you want to send per time (which I don't believe you've ever mentioned above). Clearly, a free ACH to BKK Bank New York and then onward to your Bangkok Bank account is going to be the most economical for larger amounts.

But for smaller amounts, the equation might or might not be different. So you need to get out your calculator and do the math, and/or also use the payment modeling functions on the Moneygram or other similar services to calculate their fees.

Start with the amount you want to send, and then:

--for Paypal, they have a website for modeling the cost of using them for sending funds internationally. They appear to have a 50 cent fee if you're sending funds from a linked U.S. bank account or your Paypal balance.

Re exchange rates, Paypal says they factor a 2.5% fee into any transaction involving a foreign currency exchange via their quoted exchange rate. They appear to be showing a 31.50 exchange rate for sending Thai baht right now. But I'm no expert on using Paypal, or what happens with them if you choose to send in U.S. $ vs. Thai baht.

Here’s how we set our exchange rate:

• We receive a wholesale rate quote from our bank twice a day and add 2.5% to determine the retail foreign exchange rate to apply to transactions that involve a currency conversion.
• Our currency exchange rates are competitive with conversion rates used by banks and by currency exchanges.
• When you withdraw money from your PayPal account to your local bank account, we automatically convert the money into the local currency at the time of the withdrawal request.

https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=xpt/Marketing_CommandDriven/general/International_Money_Transfer-outside&user_locale.x=en_US&change_locale.x=1&country.x=US&country=US&locale.x=en_US&pagetype=inside&bn_r=o

--for BKK Bank New York, figure their sliding scale NY handling fee (or free for amounts under $50) plus 0.25% fee on the receiving end, minimum 200 baht. (Once the funds are in your BKK Bank account, presumably you could billpay or transfer to the Thai account of your friend).

BKK Bank's website lists their daily buying TT exchange rate for USD:

http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/WebServices/Rates/Pages/FX_Rates.aspx

--for Moneygram, they have a cost estimator function on their website that allows you to model the exact amount you want to send.

https://www.moneygram.com/wps/portal/moneygramonline/home/estimator?LC=en-GB

FWIW, I just used that, and it showed a lousy exchange rate of 31.1045. MC right now is showing a rate of 32.1795 by comparison. BKK Bank is showing 32.24 for their buying TT rate.

For $100, MoneyGram also charges a $9.99 flat rate fee. For $1000, they charge a flat $16 fee.

Start with the amount you want to send, and do the math.

Edited June 16, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Langsuan Man]

Chubby, re your questions above.

My Cap One credit cards have not offered the chip function as yet. And in looking at the Cap One website for Quicksilver, it shows a photo image of the card, and that image doesn't show any chip.

Just received the new "Quicksilver" and it definitely does not have a chip and to be perfectly honest with you it is the thinnest credit card that I have. I have serious doubts about it's life expectancy. Unless they are using some special space age plastic I can't see it lasting long enough to reach it's expiration date

[Pib]

Chubby, re your questions above.

My Cap One credit cards have not offered the chip function as yet. And in looking at the Cap One website for Quicksilver, it shows a photo image of the card, and that image doesn't show any chip.

Just received the new "Quicksilver" and it definitely does not have a chip and to be perfectly honest with you it is the thinnest credit card that I have. I have serious doubts about it's life expectancy. Unless they are using some special space age plastic I can't see it lasting long enough to reach it's expiration date

Just don't use it in attempting to jimmy door looks and it should last through its expiration date.

My QuickSilver card which I got 6-12 months ago is the same thickness as all my other credit/debit cards from other companies....it lives in my billfold, gets used almost everyday, and hasn't broke yet. It's still in fine condition, but maybe the brand new ones like you just got are indeed different.

[chubby]

re: the BBL costs, I don't think I would ACH via BBL NYC to a third party. I think I'm scared off of paypal, most thai people i'm meeting, don't seem to have a clue how to receive paypal money.

I'm just looking to transfer $100 w/o paying 10%, so, anyway .......

is there any rhyme/reason to how to interconnect PFCU/Schwab/360, other than Schwab doesn't allow direct connections w/o the paperwork to the checking side

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

re: the BBL costs, I don't think I would ACH via BBL NYC to a third party. I think I'm scared off of paypal, most thai people i'm meeting, don't seem to have a clue how to receive paypal money.

I'm just looking to transfer $100 w/o paying 10%, so, anyway .......

is there any rhyme/reason to how to interconnect PFCU/Schwab/360, other than Schwab doesn't allow direct connections w/o the paperwork to the checking side

Another option: If you're planning the monthly payments to the GF to be recurring, do a BKKB New York transfer to your Thailand account of $1200 once a year, or even $600 for 6 months, and then do a monthly xfer using online banking from your BKK Bank account to the GF's account.

If things don't work out and you cease the monthly payments, then you still have a small balance in your BKKB local account to use for your own expenses for your next trip or stay in Thailand.

--------------------------------

I don't know what you mean about "interconnecting" PFCU, Schwab and Cap One. It's easy. Just link the PFCU and Cap One 360 accounts to a Schwab brokerage account using Schwab online banking, which is done entirely online, and then use Schwab online banking to move funds into those accounts or pull money out of them.

On the Schwab end, their online banking also allows you to move funds back and forth between their brokerage and checking accounts, either same or next day, depending on the time you place the transfer request.

You could also do the linking on the PFCU and Cap One 360 ends in their online banking setups. But since Schwab allows both push and pull transfers with external linked accounts, there's no particular reason you'd need to.

[Pib]

chubby,"

I have a curiosity question. Since you are now a PFCU member and can use their online banking, when in their Funds Transfer area are you limited to $50/day "PFCU initiated" (sending or pulling) ACH transfers like I how I described I was for my first 6 months with PFCU...and it just wasn't me as I googled the issued and found other folks complaining about the same limitation...seemed to be probationary period. Seemed crazy they would even limit "pulls" to $50 which greatly limits a person from loading up/pulling in money to their PFCU account. But after 6 months the limit was automatically raised to $5000/day.

In the Transfer section after you select the "Transfer From" and "Transfer To" fields the following field/words will appear...this is where it talks your daily PFCU initiated transfer limit. By PFCU-initiated I mean you are initiating the Send or Pull transaction on the PFCU online banking.

You can still initiate/send a higher amount by initiating a transfer from your other online accounts like CapOne360, Schwab, etc. This is what I had to do the first month I was with PFCU and had used their credit card a few times and ran up a credit card bill of over $50. Since I couldn't initiate an ACH transfer greater than $50 from the PFCU system and didn't even have $50 in PFCU, I had to ACH transfer money "to" my PFCU account from one of my other bank accounts and then wait for the money to arrive/clear at PFCU...then I just did an "internal" funds transfer to pay the credit card bill.

Yeap, the $50 limitation which may still be in use for new members for 6 months was one of those little details you didn't find out about until joining/using their online banking system. Easy enough to work around but could be just a little surprising if not finding out soon enough especially if you were relying on using PFCU to do ACH transfers for significant amounts of money right after joining.. Kinda like Schwab in how they make it a semi-pain, mail-in paperwork to setup ACH transfer links with their Checking and Savings accounts, but if setting up the links on the Brokerage account it's fast/eas using the trial deposits method.

Regarding how to easily move money between different banks like PFCU/Schwab/CapOne360 just setup the ACH transfer links on "all" accounts...that is for example, setup the links to where you can "initiate" transfers from PFCU, Schwab, and CapOne; don't just setup one of the bank accounts to "push" money to the other accounts...set all of them up to push or send money to your other banks. That way, if for whatever reason you can't initiate a transfer from one of your banks one day you can just logon to your other bank and initiate the Send or Pull transfer. This should protect you from one of Murphy's Laws in being able to do a transfer when needed.

Did my 5th counter withdrawal yesterday using the PFCU credit card...no problems...but I do end up getting the next business day Visa exchange rate since credit cards take a day or two to post versus debit card transactions which are same day. But that's no big deal...all I care about is getting the full Visa exchange rate with no cash advance or foreign transaction fees...and who knows, maybe the next day's rate will be a little better...all depends on the Forex markets. However, but, my first 2 of 5 withdrawals did get the same day Visa rate...guess it all depends on how fast the transaction posts, time of day during the transaction, whether a business day or weekend, etc.

[chubby]

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9248998/Most_U.S._credit_cards_will_have_microchips_by_end_of_2015?source=CTWNLE_nlt_securityissues_2014-06-18

[chubby]

TG: I don't have online banking at BBL, apparently I'm not eligible , with my account type .

• what would be the most common Thai online shopping company? maybe, I could just buy them a gift card
• I'm not familiar with the Moneygram brand, vs. WU, but I noticed before WU just seems to tweak the ex. rates, to whatever they want, maybe there are some generally laws on international arbitrage ? if not, then whatever the upfront fee seems meaningless, if they just get whatever margin they want on the back end ex. rate ....

Pib: yes that $50 is in effect now :

Amount: $
Daily ACH Limit: $50.00
ACH Processed Today: $0.00
Max. Transfer Amt: $50.00

[Pib]

TG: I don't have online banking at BBL, apparently I'm not eligible , with my account type .

• what would be the most common Thai online shopping company? maybe, I could just buy them a gift card
• I'm not familiar with the Moneygram brand, vs. WU, but I noticed before WU just seems to tweak the ex. rates, to whatever they want, maybe there are some generally laws on international arbitrage ? if not, then whatever the upfront fee seems meaningless, if they just get whatever margin they want on the back end ex. rate ....

Pib: yes that $50 is in effect now :

Amount: $

Daily ACH Limit: $50.00

ACH Processed Today: $0.00

Max. Transfer Amt: $50.00

.

I still don't understand PFCU's policy regarding the online ACH $50 limit for the first 6 months of membership...it's like being on probation to "pull" money in or "send" money out over $50. Instead if a person wants to transfer money "into" their PFCU accounts from outside the PFCU you must initiate the Send from one of your other banks. Maybe it's just PFCU approach to try to get people to deposit more money with them while realizing people's patience with a pain-in-the-ass policy don't last too long even when combined with other good policies/products like their credit cards.

To get significant amounts of money into your PFCU via ibanking you need to like send the money from your Cap360 account to your PFCU shares/money market account and wait for it to arrive/clear. And then if you had a PFCU credit card bill to pay you couldn't Send money directly to the PFCU credit card account, instead you need to send it to your PFCU shares/money market account first and then do an internal PFCU transfer from the shares/money market account to the credit card account. A person can always try setting up Bill Pay at one of your other bank accounts like CapOne360 to receive/pay the PFCU bill, but the ebill may not actually arrive. I setup Bill Pay at my USAA bank account for the PFCU credit card but an ebill would never arrive; always had to pay the PFCU bill on the PFCU online account.

So, if you plan to use the PFCU credit card for over $50/month you need to get some money transferred to your PFCU shares/money market account to easily/quickly pay the bill. It's just a pain for the first 6 months; after that your ACH daily limit is automatically raised to $5,000/day. Then you can initiate Send and Pull ACH transaction to other banks up to $5,000/day...like how I'm doing now with my over the counter cash advances here in Thailand I'm able to pay the cash advance in full shortly after getting the cash advance by doing an ACH payment/pull action from one of my other bank accounts and PFCU "immediately" credits your card account as paid which prevents any interest charge...and as you already know the PFCU credit cards have no cash advance or foreign transaction fees. The payment actually occurs before the counter withdrawal transaction posts but after a few days and the counter withdrawal transaction posts both the payment and cash withdrawal reflect the same date...therefore, no interest charge.

[chubby]

why not do the pull to the credit card BEFORE you take the cash advance?

[Pib]

why not do the pull to the credit card BEFORE you take the cash advance?

Because what if when at the bank they refuse to do the cash advance for whatever reason, the card rejects while attempting the transaction, when you get to the bank they are closed, etc.

And I'm not sure at all a person can transfer funds "out" of a credit card account...that is, wanting to reduce the credit condition back to zero balance. Maybe you can with PFCU but I don't want to test it out right now...but even if you could transfer it out I wouldn't want to operate that way. Nope, for me I prefer to make the payment "after" a successful counter withdrawal versus putting the cart before the horse.

Also, I read that some credit card companies don't like a positive balance/credit being on your account for too long...and it can even impact the card working or not like this lady experienced in the UK. Plus, I'm not sure at all but I think there may be a U.S. law/regulation (or maybe just individual bank policy) that requires a bank to refund an positive balance on your credit card account after around 60 to 90 days. Happened to me last year when USAA sent me a refund check for 55 cents due to a positive balance that had been on my USAA credit card for a few months...I had this balance due to the card's cash rewards being paid into it and I hadn't used the card for a few months to use up the credit. Yea, may be best to stay away from having a positive balance on a "regular" credit card for too long (and I don't know how long is too long)...not to be confused with a "prepaid" credit card you charge up with X-amount of money in advance...but I'm really guessing about this.

Plus by leaving the money in my bank account a few extra hours where it earns a little bit of interest I may have earned another 0.0000000001% interest on the money.

Edited June 20, 2014 by Pib

[Bobsuruncle]

are penfed credit cards unique in not charging for cash advances? i asked cap one visa card and they said it's $10.00 , then immediately they begin charging interest, i'm wondering if anyone has done the cap one card cash advance, or has another card in mind besides penfed's cards, thx

Done a cash advance 4 times now at a Bangkok Bank branch using my CapOne credit card--no cash advance fee charged by CapOne. Then logged onto my CapOne account same day and made a credit card payment to completely offset the cash advance and prevent any interest charge due to the cash advance. Cash advance amount allowed per day/transaction is $2,000 (approx Bt64K) which I've been doing. Total cash amount allowed is your line of credit on the card. So, get a cash advance today up to $2,000 and go do it again tomorrow if desired...and go the next day...etc...etc...etc...right up to you hit your line of credit limit if desired. No fees of any kind charged...you get the Visa/Mastercard exchange rate with no foreign transaction fee applied...no fee charged by the Thai bank either. Summary: PenFed credit cards do not charge a cash advance (one of the few who don't) or foreign transaction fee.

Sent from my Samsung S4

Hello Pib,I hope this isn't too old of a thread to ask more questions.

First I want to thank all of you for all of this good information. I have now done several ACH money transfers from my Bank of America account to my Thai Bangkok Bank via the NYC branch with no hassle. I have also acquired a Pen Fed Defender visa and Pen Fed American Express card.

I have tried to do an over the counter cash advance with two different Thai banks (Bangkok Bank and Siam Commercial Bank) with my Pen Fed Visa. But both Thai banks wanted to charge me a 3% fee for the over the counter transaction. But you're saying above that the Thai banks don't charge you a fee. I'm wondering if this is just because I don't live in a tourist type town. I live near Renu Nakhon half way between Mukdahan and Nakhon Phanom. They both suggested that I use the ATM machine which I did successfully and since I went home and logged on to my PenFed account and paid the balance the same day PenFed didn't charge me any fees. The only drawback to using the ATMs are the 180 baht fee they charge and the exchange rate is less than the exchange rate that I got for the same day of my ACH money transfer from Bank of America. Another disadvantage is the maximum-one-time-withdrawal out of the ATM is 25,000 baht. So if I wanted 50,000 baht I'd have to do two withdrawals and pay 360 baht fee.

As mentioned above I accidentally found out that the exchange rate given via the ACH transfer was about 0.14 points better than the visa exchange rate.

So my questions to you, Pib, are: 1) are you still doing the over the counter cash advances with no Thai bank fee? And if so do you live in a tourist town?

And 2) have you found the exchange rate to be different from ACH rates?

Even if the rates are different and it's only 0.14 points, that's only 280 baht out of $2,000 which if done through my B of A to Bangkok bank the 3 day transaction fee from B of A is $3 (108 baht) and the NYC Bangkok Bank charges $10 (359 Baht) and the Thai Bangkok Bank charges 0.25% (180 baht). So the ACH costs around 647 baht whereby the same amount of money via the cash advance with a lower exchange rate is only 280 baht. So you'd still be 367 baht ahead with the lower rate. That's of course if I could find a Thai bank that didn't want to charge me a 3% fee just to give me the money via my visa card over the counter.

[Pib]

Yes, I'm still doing cash advances using my PenFed visa cards and U.S. debit cards. No fees charged by the Thai bank...and as you know PenFed credit cards do not charge a foreign transaction fee or cash advance fee.

Here in western Bangkok I've used a Bangkok Bank branch in a nearby mall using my PenFed credit card....at least a dozen times...approx once every 4 to 6 weeks. But this branch will "not" do a cash advance (a.k.a., counter withdrawal) for a debit card....they just point you to their ATM. The last time I used them was about 6 months ago because a found a Krungsri branch in another mall that's a little closer to me that I visit multiple times per week.

Generally you say "cash advance" when doing a counter withdrawal whether using a debit or credit card. I always have the cash advance just directly deposited into one of my Bangkok Bank accounts since I use my Bangkok Bank ibanking to pay bills and debit card for cash a lot....and I don't want to be walking out the door with a ton of cash right after doing a cash advance/counter withdrawal. None of the card cash advance ever touches my hands....the cash advance transaction is just deposited into my account in a combo type transaction. No Bangkok Bank fees, no DCC transaction, full Visa exchange rate, etc. Or that's the way it was around 6 months ago when I last used them...before I found the closer Krungsri branch that I now use.

Less than 6 months ago a Krungsri Bank branch opened in another nearby mall and since I had a Krungsri account already I had opened at another branch kinda far from me I decided to give this new Krungsri branch a cash advance/counter withdrawal try. Just one of those spur of the moment things. Absolutely no problem doing it with my PenFed credit card. And last month I decided to whip out two cards during the cash advance....my PenFed credit card and Schwab debit card...I wanted to see if they would do a cash advance with the debit card also. Once again, no problem. And once again I just had the money deposited directly into my Krungsri account. No Krungsri Bank fees, no DCC transaction, full Visa exchange rate, etc.

I've only tried Bangkok Bank and Krungsri Bank for cash advances since I had accounts with them. As far as I know you do not have to have an account to do a cash advance.

The Thai bank is still getting a cash disbursement fee through the Visa/Mastercard network "interchange" fee they collect for a manual cash advance/counter disbursement. And I don't mean a fee they collect from you....I mean the interchange fee that your card-issuing bank has to pay the other bank providing the cash. The interchange fee for a cash disbursement works "opposite" to the interchange fee for a card "purchase" where your card-issuing bank collects a fee from the bank/merchant doing the transaction. This particular cash disbursement interchange fee is purely between the two banks "and is completely separate" from any foreign transaction fee/cash advance fee your card-issuing bank may apply and does hit you. This interchange fee will not hit your account...it's purely between the banks...all part of the Visa/Mastercard networks in banks collecting fees from each other for cash and purchases. As we know PenFed does not charge a foreign transaction fee or cash advance fee.

It varies from branch to branch as to if they will do a cash advance. Some will and some will not for a debit card based on what I've read in numerous ThaiVisa posts and my personal experience with the couple of branches I tried with my debit card before I found out this Krungsri branch accepted debit and credit cards for cash advances/counter withdrawals. You are the first one I remember reading where they would not do a credit card. I have heard from several sources that SCB will not do a debit card cash advance at any of their branches based on a HQ SCB policy letter...but they will for a credit card but you only get their DCC rate which is around 3% lower than the Visa/Mastercard rate and posted on their exchange rate webpage.

Regarding the exchange rate comparison between the TT Buying Rate used for income international transfers and the no foreign transaction fee Visa/Mastercard rate when you compare a good number of days I think you will fine that the Visa/Mastercard exchange rate is plus or minus a few stang of the TT Buying Rate. Sometimes the Visa/Mastercard rate is higher than the TT rate; sometimes lower...that's been my experience. Just for example I just went to this webpage that shows your various rates from numerous Thai banks...the "average" TT Buying Rate among Thai banks for today/Sunday is 35.855 while the Visa Global Rate is 35.973 for today/Sunday. Generally based on my previous comparison the Visa rate is generally a hair better than the Mastercard rate on most days...but not all. As for the AmEx exchange rate I couldn't really say for sure but from posts I've read on ThaiVisa and other websites their rate is very, very close to the Visa/Mastercard rate...not to imply "very close" means lower. Once again, I'm talking card network full exchange rate before your card-issuing bank may apply a foreign transaction fee.

It does seem that branches out in the provinces are generally less farang-friendly. By less friendly, I do not mean that the bank personal aren't professional and full of smiles as they generally are; I mean they are just less likely wanting to deal with farangs, farang cards, opening accounts for farangs, etc.

Cheers and Welcome to 2016,

Pib

[Bobsuruncle]

Thank you again,

I'm guessing that I'll have a much better chance of getting a no fee (from Thai bank) credit card cash advance with my Pen Fed card by going to a larger city that has more farang.

Those two links are going to come in very handy as well for the different bank exchange rates and the visa rates.

I really appreciate you sharing your knowledge on this subject.

Cheers and happy 2016!

Richard