Immigration boss confirms the Out-In visa run is dead

[Soutpeel]

Ed visas are almost always illegally obtained to circumvent immigration laws. Either they pony up more cash or they'll have to go the journey as well.

only "illegal" if someone doesn't attend the classes, which I believe is 4 hours a week, if your attending classes you have done nothing wrong, and if that nets you a long term visa so be it....if your complying with the conditions of your Ed visa eg your not working etc...then whats the problem ?

[duanebigsby]

The black list threat seems pretty horrible if it's just based on their "opinion" about a person. I can see that in case of an arrest and evidence proven. Imagine if it happened to you and it wasn't true especially if you are settled with lots of property here. This kind of hard core tactic should be really troubling to ALL foreigners here, no matter how totally legit you think you are. You might think this isn't about you, but to immigration you're just another SUSPECT, and don't forget that.

You should see how arbitrarily Americans treat Canadians crossing the border.

Makes Thailand look like downright friendly.

[aguy30]

So now the "scum bags and criminals that are making a dishonest life here" can just switch to ED visas and MAYBE sit in in a little hole in the wall langauge school for 4 hours a week and be "legal". Absolutely rediculous to be able to get an ED visa for Thai language in those "schools". Why not have ED visas for studying bar beer architecture or perhaps beach chair alignment techniques? There could be advanced courses in motorcycle taxi stand operations. How about courses in Thai street food cooking and selling? A school for sampling local and imported beers would be a winner for profit making and make as much sense.

The ED visa is a legal loophole to evade normal visa requirements and it is making hole in the wall (ED visa mill) Thai language school operators a fortune. Only 4 hours of class required per week is unbelievable. ED visas should be limited to REAL universities with real education and subjects. I hope Immigration has the ED visa in its crackdown plans.

Absolute tosh! Schools operating illegally should be investigated - which is fine. Why should schools not be able to offer course other than Thai? What about dive schools? Cooking schools? Asian finance courses? All of which are available and legitimate here. All schools have to be certificated and licensed by the MoE - including cooking schools!

In the UK there are language schools, but there are also many other educational establishments that sell a wide range of courses - and most are not universities. The same the world over.

The elephant in the room is that the "scumbags and criminals" you mention will always be able to stay, at worse they can overstay. Visa and entry hurdles does little to affect them - and does not filter out illegal workers (why would it?) - it merely pisses off people that are trying to find legal ways of staying, or that a between visas awaiting flights or paperwork (and that happens a lot more than some realise!) - and will force more to overstay if anything!

If they want everyone to be legal, make it easier for those that have to resort to such methods (even temporarily) to do so legally, and make some money out of it in to the bargain. The rest is just xenophobic penis displays from he of the op report.

Dive schools, cooking classes, Asian Finance courses (whatever they are) and cooking schools should also be eliminated from ED visa availability in preference to real education.

PS: You forgot Mui Thai classes.

Why? Because you say so? Why damage legitimate Thai business offering legitimate educational classes. Reasons pls.

Btw Asian Finance courses are courses on finance/business with specific reference to the region - they run them also in Singapore but are more expensive of course.

Yes, because I said so. That should be good enough for you.

[Soutpeel]

one of the UK immigration officials smiled and said 'welcome home' to her. Perhaps British people are just more welcoming than Thai people....

Or of course he may have just been sarcastic, in a "nudge nudge wink wink" monty python sort of way.

[philw]

I hope they have more luck with the finger scanners than the had here in Cambodia.

They started scanning a couple of years ago. All 10 fingers of tourists that hardly speak any English, by guys that hardly speak a word of English. Huge frustration, much shouting, enormous queues.

Result: the scanners are still there but haven't been used for a year

Don't worry, Thailand will be buying the new, improved, executive GT2000 scanner model.

Works perfect if you live through the experience.

[paz]

Why? Because you say so? Why damage legitimate Thai business offering legitimate educational classes. Reasons pls.

Btw Asian Finance courses are courses on finance/business with specific reference to the region - they run them also in Singapore but are more expensive of course.

Yes, because I said so. That should be good enough for you.

Say it all, sometime in real life you got what you deserved with these answers, didn't you ?

[duanebigsby]

Ed visas are almost always illegally obtained to circumvent immigration laws. Either they pony up more cash or they'll have to go the journey as well.

only "illegal" if someone doesn't attend the classes, which I believe is 4 hours a week, if your attending classes you have done nothing wrong, and if that nets you a long term visa so be it....if your complying with the conditions of your Ed visa eg your not working etc...then whats the problem ?

I agree with you Mr Soutpeel. If this is a loophole, run-around , what a wonderful one it is. If people would follow the rules.

why not learn Thai and do the lessons. Take advantage of this loophole and do something useful for yourself.

[inthepink]

one of the UK immigration officials smiled and said 'welcome home' to her. Perhaps British people are just more welcoming than Thai people....

Or of course he may have just been sarcastic, in a "nudge nudge wink wink" monty python sort of way.

Always look on the bright side of life, I say. No, I don't believe he was being sarcastic.

[CTO]

Malaysia and Indonesia do finger scanning,

Indonesia it's kinda funny, I asked today, why they have scanners but I've only been scanned once?

"That;s because we only scan you on your first time into Indonesia, once we have your fingerprints we don't need to scan you again"

Hmmmm - so you don't need to know if my fingerprints don't match the original owner of the passport . . . . . . .

[wolf5370]

does earning money via the internet count as illegal working? ..

Yes.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

So does breathing - "expending energy, whether paid or not"

[wolf5370]

Dive schools, cooking classes, Asian Finance courses (whatever they are) and cooking schools should also be eliminated from ED visa availability in preference to real education.

PS: You forgot Mui Thai classes.

Why? Because you say so? Why damage legitimate Thai business offering legitimate educational classes. Reasons pls.

Btw Asian Finance courses are courses on finance/business with specific reference to the region - they run them also in Singapore but are more expensive of course.

Yes, because I said so. That should be good enough for you.

So no reasons then - sure good enough for me - can now completely ignore your views as you self invalidated them.

[thaibeachlovers]

Another confusing article - many references to tourist visas rather than visa exempt arrivals. Are they now saying that even on a double entry tourist visa you are not allowed to do an 'in-out'?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Does this quote from the OP help you understand ?

“Out-in visa runs will still be possible but they have to show a credible tourism plan and give details of their accommodation to the officials.

“Thirty days should be enough for a normal tourist. If they really want to travel around the country for more than 30 days, then they must show us a plausible plan. If officers are suspicious, then they will carry out checks."

It's rubbish. Backpackers make it up as they go along, and the cheap accommodation they use is found when they get to a place. Often, cheap places aren't on the internet at all. Not all tourists are wealthy enough to be able to book places on the internet, and how else would you be able to book if you had never been to a place before and didn't know where to stay?

The official obviously doesn't understand that the backpacker of today is the flashpacker of tomorrow. Anyway, who does he think he is to judge what is or isn't long enough?

< If officers are suspicious, then they will carry out checks.> Where are they going to check up on a gap year student- Interpol??????? The mind boggles.

[duanebigsby]

I've seen many posts here now,.......

Your incredibly long rant about Thai rules is duly noted. The posters assuming criminal behavior, probably off base.

Are you circumnavigating the rules? Absolutely. Whether you agree with them or not, they are the rules. The back to back border runs, multiple tourist visas etc. you may think that they were legal but they were always like a tax loophole. Take advantage until someone sees the problem. The Thai officials are just clamping down on people looking for loopholes like yourself.

[inthepink]

Another confusing article - many references to tourist visas rather than visa exempt arrivals. Are they now saying that even on a double entry tourist visa you are not allowed to do an 'in-out'?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Does this quote from the OP help you understand ?

“Out-in visa runs will still be possible but they have to show a credible tourism plan and give details of their accommodation to the officials.

“Thirty days should be enough for a normal tourist. If they really want to travel around the country for more than 30 days, then they must show us a plausible plan. If officers are suspicious, then they will carry out checks."

It's rubbish. Backpackers make it up as they go along, and the cheap accommodation they use is found when they get to a place. Often, cheap places aren't on the internet at all. Not all tourists are wealthy enough to be able to book places on the internet, and how else would you be able to book if you had never been to a place before and didn't know where to stay?

The official obviously doesn't understand that the backpacker of today is the flashpacker of tomorrow. Anyway, who does he think he is to judge what is or isn't long enough?

< If officers are suspicious, then they will carry out checks.> Where are they going to check up on a gap year student- Interpol??????? The mind boggles.

Who does he think he is? The immigration boss.....

[BestBitterPhuket]

The bottom line is immigration are tightening things up and it really is about time. They are putting an end to people abusing the system. If you have a valid reason to be here you will have the correct visa. People who dont meet the criteria for visas have no valid reason - this is very common throughout the world.

----

Does a phillipina lady with a letter of contract with a state school have such a "valid reason"? Schools are notorious for not providing the papers needed for a work permit. I wonder if the boss of immigration actually spoke to the boss of education about this ?

Probably no planning involved. Just government trying to increase it's depleted popularity by showing they are tough in foreigners. Probably didn't speak to the Minister if Education, Minister of Trade and Industry, Minister of Tourism, Minister of Foreign Affairs and Minister of Finance. If foreigners work in Thailand, it is because they are needed. It doesn't matter if they have a stamp or not. If someone is willing to pay their salary, they are needed. And with 1% unemployment, it is not as like they are taking the locals jobs.

[LivinLOS]

Never to come back again, wow people really need to start getting the correct visas then or say bye bye to thai !

Yes, that is absolutely right. ED visa will become very popular now. Just in case anybody needs help with their visas please contact Walen School or PM me.

don't you mean if anybody wants to study thai language (at a respectable educational establishment that provides the appropriate visas for its students) they should contact you??!!...

One thing is for sure.. No matter what my visa class, or need for a visa, or desire to learn thai.. The one place I would never go to is Walen, simply because of the spammy way the operator uses the forums.

Some people need a netiquette lesson and to realize that you can lose a target audience that way.

[thaibeachlovers]

I hope they have more luck with the finger scanners than the had here in Cambodia.

They started scanning a couple of years ago. All 10 fingers of tourists that hardly speak any English, by guys that hardly speak a word of English. Huge frustration, much shouting, enormous queues.

Result: the scanners are still there but haven't been used for a year

Don't worry, Thailand will be buying the new, improved, executive GT2000 scanner model.

Works perfect if you live through the experience.

Fire engines comes to mind, LOL.

[John1thru10]

Hello everyone,been a member of this forum for years read regularly but never post,until now

I flew from swampy to london yesterday after spending 14 days there and am returning to Thailand this Friday for another 14 days, i also spent another 21 days in thailand over the last 3 months and will spend another 14 days in june,I am a tourist always stay in hotels that i book before arrival, Ipick up the 30 day Visa Exemption Rule stamp at airport,have no business interests in thailand.In august when the airport rules take effect is are my pattern of visits likely to fall foul to the new rule change?

Here's my recent experience, flying in to Bangkok from Warsaw, US passport: I just spent 7 months out of Thailand. I have no criminal record, or anything like that. Several years ago I had a short (1 month) overstay in Thailand, paid the fee at that time, and was told I was welcome back to Thailand. It had been so long ago, and no trouble ever since, that I'd almost forgotten about it.

When I arrived at Sawanabhumi on May 9 (again, after being out for 7 months) I was shocked to find myself receiving the most intense grilling I've ever seen in Thailand. The woman kept asking (and very rudely at that) 'Why you come here!'. I was trying to explain (and honestly) that I never work in Thailand, pointing out that I hadn't been inside Asia anywhere for over half a year, etc. She kept asking 'Why you come here!', and had no interest in hearing an answer. Then, she located the small mark saying I had once overstayed (again, years ago, and not long), and started repeating 'You overstayed! Why you overstay!' She almost didn't let me in, and it was so different from anything I'd experienced before.

Then, that same day they issued news about the 'crackdown', and I read post even from frist timers being denied re-entrance at land borders, and being stranded there.

So, my experience (which some here don't want to accept) is that dates out aren't really the thing, in reality. They 'say' that it's about time outside of Thailand making things ok, and not 'back to back' - but the 'spirit' of the law is to start giving a hard time to people entering, as long as they've been here before enough times. Ignore the mean posters saying 'good riddance' and 'about time' - it's a new political spirit in Thailand at this time, and one should be careful; particularly with the announcement today that one can be more easily 'blacklisted' at an officers discretion. Myself and a lot of friends are going to start avoiding Thailand for a while. I fear, Ed visas and retirement visas will be next, so the people laughing and saying 'good riddance' to others here may be crying soon, themselves.

[Charlie1]

SP....sorry for the confusion. I use to have a WP when I was based in our BKK office, I no longer have one as I am on rotation work from another district. When I got my WP I had to relinquish my married visa (not sure why?)..So ever since I been coming in a on a tourist visa every 40 days or so..

Sounds like you were sold a bad one - no reason you can't have a WP on a non-imm O for marriage visa or extension.

Sounds like you were sold a bad one as well - If you apply for a work permit as a journalist and have a non-imm-O for marriage, you do have to switch to a non-imm M and give up your marriage-visa.

[dotpoom]

The black list threat seems pretty horrible if it's just based on their "opinion" about a person. I can see that in case of an arrest and evidence proven. Imagine if it happened to you and it wasn't true especially if you are settled with lots of property here. This kind of hard core tactic should be really troubling to ALL foreigners here, no matter how totally legit you think you are. You might think this isn't about you, but to immigration you're just another SUSPECT, and don't forget that.

If you had lots of property here why would you be dependant on the border runs every 30 days....before you invested wouldn't you at least make sure you had a correct visa.

[thaibeachlovers]

Another confusing article - many references to tourist visas rather than visa exempt arrivals. Are they now saying that even on a double entry tourist visa you are not allowed to do an 'in-out'?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Does this quote from the OP help you understand ?

“Out-in visa runs will still be possible but they have to show a credible tourism plan and give details of their accommodation to the officials.

“Thirty days should be enough for a normal tourist. If they really want to travel around the country for more than 30 days, then they must show us a plausible plan. If officers are suspicious, then they will carry out checks."

It's rubbish. Backpackers make it up as they go along, and the cheap accommodation they use is found when they get to a place. Often, cheap places aren't on the internet at all. Not all tourists are wealthy enough to be able to book places on the internet, and how else would you be able to book if you had never been to a place before and didn't know where to stay?

The official obviously doesn't understand that the backpacker of today is the flashpacker of tomorrow. Anyway, who does he think he is to judge what is or isn't long enough?

< If officers are suspicious, then they will carry out checks.> Where are they going to check up on a gap year student- Interpol??????? The mind boggles.

Who does he think he is? The immigration boss.....

And did he consult with the politician responsible for tourism, the tourism boss, the head of the hotels association, the industry boss etc etc to see if they agreed, or did he just decide to be a little dictator and to hell with everyone else?

In a real democracy, heads of departments don't make it up without input from politicians, and given the political situation at the moment I doubt the politicians think it's a great time to be upsetting yet another apple cart.

[John1thru10]

Let hear the voice of a native, won't you?

First thing first, please feel free to leave, to cancel holidays, to whatever you would do for your own good.

Personally, I don't care about tourist industry, I don't care about tourists at all. And not just me, but a large amount of Thai people don't care about you people stay or leave.

Not many people, who are native Thai in so-call tourist industry get money.

If you look closely, you'll find out that those workers in the industry are NOT Thai. And they have never paid tax.

So, feel free to leave anytime. Nothing will effect our income.

Thank you for exposing your personal view, the one of a clearly nationalistic ignorant bigot. Fortunately not all Thais think like you, and facts are clearly not like you say.

I will not say that you're highly xenophobic, because I'm afraid you would take that as a compliment.

Be the way, foreign tourism (and many more industries) workers that pay no taxes that you mentioned are actually the ones that are exploited on a daily basis by your co-citizens to increase their profit to the expense of people with basically no rights.

Good to see you are not worried about "your income" being affected, as that probably the true bottom line in your life.

o

Believe me, a lot of Thai think like me, phobic or not... They just don't speak english.

Thai people never speak their minds. Remember that. But I'm here and voicing their voices.

Being a bigot, is nothing to be proud of, regardless of where you are. If you don't enjoy the stereotypes about Thai's being 'dishonest' (which I don't believe it true, usually) then you shouldn't be bigoted yourself. Be an example of something good, don't brag about your bad qualities.

[virtualtraveller]

I think he sounded quite reasonable and clear, better than normal. You can't disagree. Frankly, if you're staying indefinitely then sign up for a Thai course, may as well learn, it works out cheaper than 12 visa runs. Shorter visits then get a tourist visa.

[LivinLOS]

As much as I agree with the move for immigration reform, is it wise now to do this when the tourist industry is crippled from the months of political instability in Bangkok? Hundreds of thousands of people from all over the world are canceling their holidays, do they really want to run off the people who are left in this country spending money?

Do you not think immigration at last wants to clean stuff up ?

Personally I think they are doing it all wrong. They should be using man power to go to businesses with farangs behind bar counters and farang birds doing stuff and look at their permission to be here. If they are go go dancing, serving beer on an ED visa they should be dispatched to an airport. Really easy if the will is there.

Exactly, you want to police the crime, go after those who are committing the crime, dont go at a blanket ban that effects people who are doing nothing wrong..

If someone is doing repeated visa exempt entries, like oil workers etc, demand to see source of funds remitted to Thailand.. Ensure that money isnt being earnt here on the side.

Its so simple to actually use the labor laws for labor violations.

[Soutpeel]

In a real democracy, heads of departments don't make it up without input from politicians,

you have obviously never lived in the UK then...

[inthepink]

Who does he think he is? The immigration boss.....

And did he consult with the politician responsible for tourism, the tourism boss, the head of the hotels association, the industry boss etc etc to see if they agreed, or did he just decide to be a little dictator and to hell with everyone else?

In a real democracy, heads of departments don't make it up without input from politicians, and given the political situation at the moment I doubt the politicians think it's a great time to be upsetting yet another apple cart.

No idea who he consulted. It's none of my business is it? I just thought it was stupid to ask who does he think he is, deciding how long visitors can stay in Thailand. He's the head of immigration, if he can't decide then who can?

[ebonykap]

I've yet to meet any Ferang in 25 years on an Ed Visa who has a clue about Thai language apart from Bargirl Stuff they picked up. Just a Visa get out imo.... Perhaps Mac is just a fine Trader, who knows the Rouges that spoil it for Him. .

You haven't met me.

I am in my third year at a Thai language school. My Thai is slowly improving, but I find it very difficult. I have never missed a class. Yes, I am using this visa for a prolongued stay until i decide to retire here, and if I do so I will have a reasonable understanding of Thai. I have the strong belief that if you intend to make a foreign country your home, you should be able to speak the language. By the way, paasaa Thai korng khun bpen yang ngai baang na khrab?

[thaibeachlovers]

I've seen many posts here now, usually seeming to come from older gentlemen on retirement visas, that 'proper visas are easy to get' - along with some very biased assumptions that one is either working illegally, or somehow up to 'no good' or 'undesirable'. 'Good riddance', and emoticons of laughing hysterically at someone else's heartache are common on this board. And cruel. For many people who this sudden change will affect, it is entirely unhelpful and inhumane to use it as a chance to feel superior to others, and make biased, negative assumptions about anyone who is not exactly like oneself. Further, being deleted for standing up to those people, or attempting to corect outdated written laws with real-life experiences, and being reminded of 'forum rules' whereby one cannot speak rudely to other posters, while ignoring the purposeful cruelty and original bigotry of many of those posts, is less than forthright on the behalf of some moderators.

Here is the reality of this situation, which (perhaps understandably in some cases) many people here on retirement or other type of visas simply do not understand.

Firstly for myself, I work in Europe and America, exclusively (ie, never EVER in SE Asia) - and about 4-6 months out of the year. No, it is not a desk job. Nor one for which there is a check box on a visa form. Nor does it offer 'retirement benefits'. Nor does it mean I am a wealthy gad-about, for whom it would be so 'easy' to simply go jetting around the world in search of other consulates. Not being wealthy, does not mean a person is a 'bum', either. I am a 49 year old touring artist and performer, and a decent, honest person. I am not 'milking the system', doing anything illegal in Thialand, or taking anything away from anyone. I deeply resent the implications on the part of many older posters here, that one is a criminal simply for not being in their exact situations.

When I first came to Thailand, 5 years ago now, I was ACTIVELY ENCOURAGED by officials to get numerous long-term tourist visas. in FACT, they were offered FREE, for the first year and a half, and then changed to a small fee. Back to back was very officially considered no problem whatsoever, and was openly encouraged by officials at immigration, along with a hearty smile, and a 'Welcome to Thailand!' That wasn't corruption, or 'paying someone off', it was the official system in Thailand. This can HARDLY be rightly called 'criminal' now suddenly, simply because the political climate has changed. Or because someone else has less than admirable intentions themselves.

Secondly, starting about 2 years ago, the ability to get another tourist visa began to change dramatically. When people here post 'it's easy', they are not aware of the realities on the ground, and are quoting official (outdated) statements from a website. 2.5 years ago now, Vientienne made it impossible to receive a tourist visa if one had others in their passport before, REGARDLESS OF HOW LONG AGO, and this then progressively spread to all other consulates in the other neighboring countries. While it OFFICIALLY says 'back to back', what I've found from my own experience (as well as confirmed by those officiating these things) is that the ACTUAL dates on these long expired visas were of no importance. A tourist visa from 5 years ago, was considered 'recent', after only a quick flip through by an official: NOT a careful reviewing of dates. The same will now undoubtedly apply to visa extensions , and exemptions of all types.

For example: on May 9, I returned (via Moscow, via Warsaw) to Bangkok, after being away from Thailand for SEVEN MONTHS. That's 7 months out, to make it clear again To my surprise, the official at border control grilled me in an extremely rude manner, as if I were surely up to no good, and apparently almost didn't let me in. I could have easily explained to her what my work is (well outside of Thailand), that I never (ever) try to work in Thailand, that I have a long history of paying rent and bills in a community that loves me. I don't even drink, for heavens sake. But she had no interest in hearing about that. Only kept asking 'what are you doing in Thailand!'. I could have explained easily about my work outside of Thailand, and if she had looked carefully could see that I'd been gone for a good while. An explanation and actual time outside of Thailand (and each year, for that matter), she had no interest in hearing about. It was as if suddenly I'd been purposely trying to do something wrong, simply because the political mood has changed, and that simply isn't the case.

And this is what truly worries me about this new zeitgeist: It's not the letter of the law, it's the spirit of it. If one can be well out of Asia for 7 months, with a full ability to show employment outside of Asia, no criminal record whatsoever, no bad intentions - and in fact, following the rules that were originally laid out for visitors over years before, and trying their best to keep up with changes and simply get by, and suddenly be treated as if one were a Russian mob member here to do their worst, without any chance to explain themselves - then that is going to affect a LOT of decent people, who in fact have been trying to follow the rules and simply be a part of the communities they've come to be a part of.

People here keep citing other countries as being difficult to enter, so why not the same. In fact, I can enter Europe for 3 months without question. No - this is not in reality about 'law breakers' in any legitimate way. Even though they certainly exist. This is a knee jerk reaction of xenophobia. And on this forum, it is a chance for those of an older generation to show their anger at others, calling them 'criminals' and such terms, when those people turn to this forum for answers. I would suggest that moderators follow the letter of their own rules, and delete such comments as those, and not just those which attempt to stand up to them.

Nothing new there. TV has long been populated with "dog in the manger" types that think because they are rich and can get a non O visa anyone that can't is a ner do well.

[LivinLOS]

The black list threat seems pretty horrible if it's just based on their "opinion" about a person. I can see that in case of an arrest and evidence proven. Imagine if it happened to you and it wasn't true especially if you are settled with lots of property here. This kind of hard core tactic should be really troubling to ALL foreigners here, no matter how totally legit you think you are. You might think this isn't about you, but to immigration you're just another SUSPECT, and don't forget that.

---------------

Blacklisting and forever banning some of the out-and-out criminals can only be a good thing.

I see several people bleating about being "respectable", owning property, etc -- If they are such pillars of society they will have no problem in getting a triple-entry tourist visa from their home country, which can be made valid for over a year using the immigration office in Thailand to get the extensions, etc.

But what happens if u r respectable, owning property etc., with a triple entry tourist Visa, which I use, to come every Winter? If they now start asking questions on re-entry at the border and u tell the truth about staying at property u own or rent with your 'girlfriend', or even renting a property alone, can they legitimately say: "Well that means u r not a tourist then", and refuse re-entry. Is it legal for a 'tourist' to rent a property in Thailand.? Are we, to be safe, going to have to be dishonest and give a false itinery or hotel address?

Tourists can rent villas or apartments for sure, which is actually better for you. You can have the owner provide you a receipt or letter for your rental paid, the duration etc. flight tickets in and out. Problem will be your first comment…..if you own a property then they will want to know how and see the deeds. Lets just hope you didn't buy it through a shell company with nominee thai share holders…..because thats illegal now too and you risk losing the property to the state.

With respect, on what authority can you say "for sure"?.... least of all in Thailand where nothing is for sure.

I dont own, I rent.

Exactly.. The bangkok post article listed a Korean man who was denied entry as a tourist simply for being married.. The logic being if your married you cant be a tourist ???

[thailandist]

The black list threat seems pretty horrible if it's just based on their "opinion" about a person. I can see that in case of an arrest and evidence proven. Imagine if it happened to you and it wasn't true especially if you are settled with lots of property here. This kind of hard core tactic should be really troubling to ALL foreigners here, no matter how totally legit you think you are. You might think this isn't about you, but to immigration you're just another SUSPECT, and don't forget that.

If someone has property here I'm guessing they are not going to be foolish enough to run around on a tourist visa.