Junta head to hold politicians responsible for their past wrongful management of the country

[pahang]

all great, but only if both sides would be held accountable... which is unlikely to happen I guess.

both sides?

afaik since 2006 there was only one side in government (except about 1 year). Of course the democrats should be accountable, too. Guess who caused the bigger havoc

Not true. At least 4 years since 2006 have seen the rule of the 'other' side - either military or 'Democrats' (parenthesis intended).

In other words, Thaksin and his various proxies have ruled Thailand for 11 of the last 15 years.

[Fat Haggis]

I think secretly, many Readers on ThaiVisa wouldn't mind this happening in their country; power wrested off the major political parties (whose policies are similar and gouge public's funds), and just pass the baton over ... with business as usual ...

And that's what is just amazing...the number of TV members who apparently support totalitarianism. Astounding and not in a good way.

Maybe the words you should be using is Change--clean up-convict-reform-elections.

Isn't it just amazing the overwhelming TVF members are in support of what is happening, and many are tolerating the fact it's the army.

Isn't it amazing you the same few that were shouting down the critics of Shins regime, and shouting for quick elections to solve the problems are at it again finding the fault of the repairers rather than the damagers.

Change? They haven't been able to change in over 40 years and 4 coups later, what makes you think the outcome of this one will be any different?

Oh boy, the overwhelming TVF members? You have canvassed all 16,000 of them to come to this conclusion? Considering that the overwhelming amount of members don't tend to habitually post in the Thai news section, I do wonder where you are perceiving the overwhelming part? Did they run a poll recently? I doubt there's even 1000 regulars who post in the news/political section.. you really do have a way of exaggerating things don't you?

Your last paragraph is more apt to describe the "overwhelming " part, it's the same "regulars" on both sides that participate in the criticism of each side.

I sincerely hope that the next Government does not mirror those in the past 40 years, only time will tell.

[pahang]

So the junta new dictators are going to decide what the law is

The article doesn't say that.

Have a re-read.

[ikke]

all great, but only if both sides would be held accountable... which is unlikely to happen I guess.

both sides?

afaik since 2006 there was only one side in government (except about 1 year). Of course the democrats should be accountable, too. Guess who caused the bigger havoc

Yes both sides, not one year , but 3 year, and that 3 year was economics totally down, and costed a lot of money to the country, so again, yes both sides.

[robblok]

I think secretly, many Readers on ThaiVisa wouldn't mind this happening in their country; power wrested off the major political parties (whose policies are similar and gouge public's funds), and just pass the baton over ... with business as usual ...

And that's what is just amazing...the number of TV members who apparently support totalitarianism. Astounding and not in a good way.

Maybe the words you should be using is Change--clean up-convict-reform-elections.

Isn't it just amazing the overwhelming TVF members are in support of what is happening, and many are tolerating the fact it's the army.

Isn't it amazing you the same few that were shouting down the critics of Shins regime, and shouting for quick elections to solve the problems are at it again finding the fault of the repairers rather than the damagers.

Change? They haven't been able to change in over 40 years and 4 coups later, what makes you think the outcome of this one will be any different?

Oh boy, the overwhelming TVF members? You have canvassed all 16,000 of them to come to this conclusion? Considering that the overwhelming amount of members don't tend to habitually post in the Thai news section, I do wonder where you are perceiving the overwhelming part? Did they run a poll recently? I doubt there's even 1000 regulars who post in the news/political section.. you really do have a way of exaggerating things don't you?

Your last paragraph is more apt to describe the "overwhelming " part, it's the same "regulars" on both sides that participate in the criticism of each side.

I sincerely hope that the next Government does not mirror those in the past 40 years, only time will tell.

I think you are wrong here.. most TVF members that live here and post in the news section agree with him. The majority is anti government

You (though your not bad) and many of your red brethren are a minority. You can see that quite easy in post and likes and such. No poll needed.

We are talking about the active political posters here in the new section. Anyway I had not expected it any different as most here are educated enough to see how evil the PTP was. If this junta makes the same mistake i happily hop over to your side. However the reds darling constantly asked for time to prove herself. Give the Junta the same cutesy.

[Emster23]

I wonder how far this will go? Very slippery slope. Will they get down to village level where school administrator is pocketing money intended for English teachers? The land office managers who can get a deed thru quicker if woman sleeps with him (that proposition happened to my wife)? Seems top to bottom, each and every political stripe has had their hands in the till, which I figure by definition, is "wrongful management".

[Fat Haggis]

You see Rob, you automatically make an assumption that I'm red when making observations of those who oppose(d) the Yingluck administration. I have never stated anywhere that I, if I were a Thai, or had the right to vote, that I'd support the PTP/UDD, if you wish to check up on this, I've always stated that IF I had the rights, I'd vote for Abhisit.. I must be the only Red supporter in the entire Kingdom that would support the Dems !! .. Is there such a thing as a Dem supporting Red?

In all honesty, I've no time for any political party, they're all abysmal, and all with poor track records, just because I find inconsistencies and flaws in peoples opinions, doesn't have to mean I am supporting their opposite view. I happen to believe that the Yingluck Administration was rank rotten..and deserved to go.. what? A "Red" supporter saying the "red government needed to go?" another contradiction to your assumption of which side I have chosen?.

This isn't a football match where you're either a red or a yellow, and there's no in between, that's nonsense, people can participate in debates without having the need, nor the desire to align themselves with any paticular party. I participate as it's educational and stimulating to listen to other peoples opinions, I neither need to agree or disagree with them to share the topic.

Of course there's some staunch pro-government and anti government members here on TVF, me? I don't really take it that seriously, I'm being educated and entertained, having an opinion that differs from mainstream doesn't necessary make you pro or anti

The vast majority of Thais and Farangs outside of TVF were getting on with their lives and going about their daily business, past and present and will do in the future, as if nothing has ever happened, life all over Thailand was quite normal before the coup, in other words they were oblivious to the ongoing turmoil in Bangkok, life was routine and normal, but suddenly the coup happened and they had a curfew imposed on them and that normal life, granted the majority of rural Thais are asleep before the curfew came into effect, so in reality again it didn't really effect them, or change the way in which they went about their work and business.

Do I think the Junta are doing a good job, yes I do, they're seizing the day and General Prayuth deserves a hell of a lot more praise from the "International" community, but I am also of the belief that when you call for transparency and accountability that should also include your own department, and in this case the Army itself. The RTA is full of Generals, who have got where they are through Nepotism and belonging to various "clubs".

If you want to lead the country, do it by example, and open the doors on your own institution and show there's nothing being hidden, no hidden agendas, declare all your assets and earnings, call for transparency and be transparent at the same time. Nobody is perfect, no institution is perfect, and neither is the Army, but they're a damn sight better than what any of the political parties have been able to do over the past 40 years.

[ginjag]

I think secretly, many Readers on ThaiVisa wouldn't mind this happening in their country; power wrested off the major political parties (whose policies are similar and gouge public's funds), and just pass the baton over ... with business as usual ...

And that's what is just amazing...the number of TV members who apparently support totalitarianism. Astounding and not in a good way.

Maybe the words you should be using is Change--clean up-convict-reform-elections.

Isn't it just amazing the overwhelming TVF members are in support of what is happening, and many are tolerating the fact it's the army.

Isn't it amazing you the same few that were shouting down the critics of Shins regime, and shouting for quick elections to solve the problems are at it again finding the fault of the repairers rather than the damagers.

Change? They haven't been able to change in over 40 years and 4 coups later, what makes you think the outcome of this one will be any different?

Oh boy, the overwhelming TVF members? You have canvassed all 16,000 of them to come to this conclusion? Considering that the overwhelming amount of members don't tend to habitually post in the Thai news section, I do wonder where you are perceiving the overwhelming part? Did they run a poll recently? I doubt there's even 1000 regulars who post in the news/political section.. you really do have a way of exaggerating things don't you?

Your last paragraph is more apt to describe the "overwhelming " part, it's the same "regulars" on both sides that participate in the criticism of each side.

I sincerely hope that the next Government does not mirror those in the past 40 years, only time will tell.

No better way to attract you to the keyboard by going overboard, you were baited the same you wanted me to be 1 or 2 days ago.

The overwhelming was posted by the poster diplomatico---didn't you see that.???

You have a poor memory to speak that about the same numbers on each side that criticizes.

Why don't you knock off the 30-40 year rant Today is all important, and what action is taken. I am optimistic --you sound like your in a 40 year time warp--doom and gloom.

lighten up, try to halt the ginjag muck raking

I also am aware that most of the anti army posters are normally only posting on political matters, as they did on the anti gov posters and anti Suthep posters, etc funny how this is when you have a TVF that has so many topics ?? but suppose they are only politically minded and not interested in every day news. freedom of speech. mai pen rai.

just an observation.

[binjalin]

You (though your not bad) and many of your red brethren are a minority. You can see that quite easy in post and likes and such. No poll needed.

We are talking about the active political posters here in the new section. Anyway I had not expected it any different as most here are educated enough to see how evil the PTP was. If this junta makes the same mistake i happily hop over to your side. However the reds darling constantly asked for time to prove herself. Give the Junta the same cutesy.

I think it's fair to say that the majority of farang are more banana coloured than strawberry but that is hardly a recommendation! the Dems had years to reform things yet did nothing then cried when they lost the election

anyway we are where we are

[ginjag]

You see Rob, you automatically make an assumption that I'm red when making observations of those who oppose(d) the Yingluck administration. I have never stated anywhere that I, if I were a Thai, or had the right to vote, that I'd support the PTP/UDD, if you wish to check up on this, I've always stated that IF I had the rights, I'd vote for Abhisit.. I must be the only Red supporter in the entire Kingdom that would support the Dems !! .. Is there such a thing as a Dem supporting Red?

In all honesty, I've no time for any political party, they're all abysmal, and all with poor track records, just because I find inconsistencies and flaws in peoples opinions, doesn't have to mean I am supporting their opposite view. I happen to believe that the Yingluck Administration was rank rotten..and deserved to go.. what? A "Red" supporter saying the "red government needed to go?" another contradiction to your assumption of which side I have chosen?.

This isn't a football match where you're either a red or a yellow, and there's no in between, that's nonsense, people can participate in debates without having the need, nor the desire to align themselves with any paticular party. I participate as it's educational and stimulating to listen to other peoples opinions, I neither need to agree or disagree with them to share the topic.

Of course there's some staunch pro-government and anti government members here on TVF, me? I don't really take it that seriously, I'm being educated and entertained, having an opinion that differs from mainstream doesn't necessary make you pro or anti

The vast majority of Thais and Farangs outside of TVF were getting on with their lives and going about their daily business, past and present and will do in the future, as if nothing has ever happened, life all over Thailand was quite normal before the coup, in other words they were oblivious to the ongoing turmoil in Bangkok, life was routine and normal, but suddenly the coup happened and they had a curfew imposed on them and that normal life, granted the majority of rural Thais are asleep before the curfew came into effect, so in reality again it didn't really effect them, or change the way in which they went about their work and business.

Do I think the Junta are doing a good job, yes I do, they're seizing the day and General Prayuth deserves a hell of a lot more praise from the "International" community, but I am also of the belief that when you call for transparency and accountability that should also include your own department, and in this case the Army itself. The RTA is full of Generals, who have got where they are through Nepotism and belonging to various "clubs".

If you want to lead the country, do it by example, and open the doors on your own institution and show there's nothing being hidden, no hidden agendas, declare all your assets and earnings, call for transparency and be transparent at the same time. Nobody is perfect, no institution is perfect, and neither is the Army, but they're a damn sight better than what any of the political parties have been able to do over the past 40 years.

After all you said in the reply to ROB, I can ask you why was not there an outcry from you everytime the PTP/Yingluck regime slipped up ???

Time after time you were critical of the posters who attacked the government --the same was the case with Suthep protest----as was the case when you called with the red sympathizers for early elections-----surely knowing it would have been a disaster. I also do see a different speaking F Haggis nowadays more praising of the army, and I see most of the Shin clan on here have now forgot the election for democracy rant as they are now realizing is was not on before.

50% +of the PTP supporters on TVF have now vanished ??? run home as they now have not a lot to aim at. The remainder are hanging out slagging the army, as it's near all they have left to hold on to - still wanting to save face.

I think you tried to play down you original feelings and mellowed very much of late.

[lostmebike]

I hear what a lot of you are saying. It is positive that the army are taking a 'transparent' stance on political matters, trying to improve the country both internally and internationally, however, many of us are cynics though (me included) and one can't help but think how things will evolve, sorry devolve when the new government are placed in parliament.

When the time comes and yet again Thailand has a ruling party, is anyone really going to watch them/prevent their temptations whilst distributing from the trough? Is the 'TIT' slogan about to die? Somehow I don't think so but then I am a cynic!

[ginjag]

You (though your not bad) and many of your red brethren are a minority. You can see that quite easy in post and likes and such. No poll needed.

We are talking about the active political posters here in the new section. Anyway I had not expected it any different as most here are educated enough to see how evil the PTP was. If this junta makes the same mistake i happily hop over to your side. However the reds darling constantly asked for time to prove herself. Give the Junta the same cutesy.

I think it's fair to say that the majority of farang are more banana coloured than strawberry but that is hardly a recommendation! the Dems had years to reform things yet did nothing then cried when they lost the election

anyway we are where we are

How many years did the Dems have to make drastic reforms ?? please do not talk kiddish. They cried when they lost the election ??? again same remark.

Ask how many times your godfathers lot been thrown out in the last x number of years and how many Shins have been banned/ or faced court appearances.???

Such a sweet bunch with a 3 year record now never again to be allowed to re occur. Do you wake up in the middle of the night shouting THE DEMS ???

[Crushdepth]

all great, but only if both sides would be held accountable... which is unlikely to happen I guess.

both sides?

afaik since 2006 there was only one side in government (except about 1 year). Of course the democrats should be accountable, too. Guess who caused the bigger havoc

You don't know much about recent history do you? Abhisit was PM from 2008 to 2011 and corruption was worse than ever, especially from his pals in the Bhum Jai Thai party. You can be sure the Democrats and their allies won't be held to account though.

The Bhum Jai is more allied to Taksin and are thieving..... anyway. All evidence is gone and the PTP did nothing when they could. Now only their crimes (recent) can be investigated. Maybe some crimes from the past. God this must hurt al the red lovers so much.

But I for one would not shed a tear for any Democrat caught for corruption. But because they were only short in power and had to give most of the profitable post to Bhum Jai (to form a coalition) there is not much to be found.

I really don't understand the red lovers, I mean PTP had all the chance in the world to go after Democrats if they were corrupt when they were in power. They did not because they could not find anything because not much love lost between the two parties.

But anyway I dont have a problem if they catch a few on my side.. because I dont consider any corrupt official a good guy.

PTP had no power to 'go after' Democrats. You don't much about the legal system do you? That would be the role of the National Anti-Corruption Commission and the courts, who are part of the same establishment as the Democrats and army.

But they did own the police and DSI and weren't above (accidentally) handing snack boxes full of cash to court officials. They were hardly toothless.

[rubl]

I hear what a lot of you are saying. It is positive that the army are taking a 'transparent' stance on political matters, trying to improve the country both internally and internationally, however, many of us are cynics though (me included) and one can't help but think how things will evolve, sorry devolve when the new government are placed in parliament.

When the time comes and yet again Thailand has a ruling party, is anyone really going to watch them/prevent their temptations whilst distributing from the trough? Is the 'TIT' slogan about to die? Somehow I don't think so but then I am a cynic!

Like you I'm a bit cynical in this.

I can already hear the outcries of 'judicial coup' the moment a now really independent watchdog warns a PM or cabinet Minister. The 'but we got a mandate' justification. Etc., etc.

[Fat Haggis]

Utter nonsense, you threw your teddy out of the pram and made the extremely bold "I have been here 35 years" giving off the impression that you seem to have more wisdom than the poster in question, that's why I'm singling you out, and the fact you've been more vocal than most of the other regulars, I asked for your opinions of what made the Yingluck Government worse than any of the other ones you've seen through, when they were rife with the same corruption and abuses of power.. you chose not to reply, which gave me the impression that you're not as "keyed in" as you believe yourself to be.

I don't believe I have ever made claims about "the majority" which you have, on numerous occasions, I have always asked you as to how you came up with that assessment, again, you've never answered directly either.

My memory isn't poor, especially about the amount of people that critisise each various party as I've never made "outlandish" statements that there's no possible way for that to be verified, as I said, there's a very small percentage of TVF members who post regularly on the Political topics, I'd even go as far as saying that it's less than 1% of the overall TVF membership database, which sits at around 16,000 I believe.

If you had stated that the majority of those who post in the news/political section are overall in favour of the coup and are anti shiniwatra you'd get no argument from me.

I don't "bash" you, I ask you direct questions, I happen to agree with a lot of what you're saying, I also disagree with some as well, isn't it a little bit odd that you don't like it when "bashed" but yet it's perfectly acceptable to "bash" Yingluck and her clique? double standards there big time!!

I will lighten up when you stop making outlanddish claims about "majorities" but if I see fault or discrepencies in your post I'll say so, does it mean I think you're a bad person? no not at all, I look at your post count and think "If this guy has 17,000 posts, he must know pretty much what he's talking about ;)" it's the same as Publicus, you're both the Ying and Yang, and in between the two of you, there's a lot of very enlightening and educational stuff.

I doubt there isn't a single member of TVF, who has ties to Thailand, who doesn't want Thailand to be a better place to live or for it to prosper, and flourish. Anyone who doesn't wish to see this shouldn't really be in a Thai forum, if they don't have Thailands best interests in their heart.

[raybal5]

What gives a military dictatorship the right to hold ELECTED politicians, filthy though they may be,'accountable'?

elected ....

yawn

I'm not a lawyer but I'd reckon this document, Martial Law, B.E. 2457 (1914) gives the Thai Army the right to do what they say they will do. And that extends to all criminal actions, regardless if they are politicians, government employees, or in any way involved in corruption.

[Fat Haggis]

After all you said in the reply to ROB, I can ask you why was not there an outcry from you everytime the PTP/Yingluck regime slipped up ???

That's an easy answer, I've wasn't a member of TVF when the Yingluck Regime were running the country into the ground, I joined here after they become a caretaker Government, I then started to do more reading and research about all the various issues, like the rice pledging scam, and the more I read about all sides, the more I became "interested"

Yes absolutely I said that the best way in which to remove Yinglucks authority was through elections, and I'll say it again, if the claims made by so many here that the majority of the Thai people wanted her out, then there's no way that she could win, and she and the PTP would have been removed through one of the democratic processes, but it was never given the chance, again I supported what Suthep was doing about the anti corruption but questioned why he of all people, who has been involved in corruption was championing that cause, I also said many many times that it was right up until they prevented the rights of those who wished to vote, that made me change my views and opinions of his cause, they become more radical and militant.

I don't believe I have ever said that Yingluck was a good PM, or Leader, or that the PTP/UDD were the right choice to follow, you see, I follow, nor support, nor have ever supported either side, as they're not worth it.. I just don't know how many times I've said that if anything, I'd support Abhisit,but all that the you see are the citicisms against the things and the party you follow, when watching a football match, just because I want one team to beat the other, doesn't mean I support either, as perhaps the reasoning for wishing them to be beaten will be good for the team that I DO support will benefit from their rivals dropping points

[Thailand]

Will this include the period(s) when the military were in power also?

[ginjag]

Utter nonsense, you threw your teddy out of the pram and made the extremely bold "I have been here 35 years" giving off the impression that you seem to have more wisdom than the poster in question, that's why I'm singling you out, and the fact you've been more vocal than most of the other regulars, I asked for your opinions of what made the Yingluck Government worse than any of the other ones you've seen through, when they were rife with the same corruption and abuses of power.. you chose not to reply, which gave me the impression that you're not as "keyed in" as you believe yourself to be.

I don't believe I have ever made claims about "the majority" which you have, on numerous occasions, I have always asked you as to how you came up with that assessment, again, you've never answered directly either.

My memory isn't poor, especially about the amount of people that critisise each various party as I've never made "outlandish" statements that there's no possible way for that to be verified, as I said, there's a very small percentage of TVF members who post regularly on the Political topics, I'd even go as far as saying that it's less than 1% of the overall TVF membership database, which sits at around 16,000 I believe.

If you had stated that the majority of those who post in the news/political section are overall in favour of the coup and are anti shiniwatra you'd get no argument from me.

I don't "bash" you, I ask you direct questions, I happen to agree with a lot of what you're saying, I also disagree with some as well, isn't it a little bit odd that you don't like it when "bashed" but yet it's perfectly acceptable to "bash" Yingluck and her clique? double standards there big time!!

I will lighten up when you stop making outlanddish claims about "majorities" but if I see fault or discrepencies in your post I'll say so, does it mean I think you're a bad person? no not at all, I look at your post count and think "If this guy has 17,000 posts, he must know pretty much what he's talking about ;)" it's the same as Publicus, you're both the Ying and Yang, and in between the two of you, there's a lot of very enlightening and educational stuff.

I doubt there isn't a single member of TVF, who has ties to Thailand, who doesn't want Thailand to be a better place to live or for it to prosper, and flourish. Anyone who doesn't wish to see this shouldn't really be in a Thai forum, if they don't have Thailands best interests in their heart.

Just to remind you that my years here mine to relish, not to get involved in a slanging match that you would have created but overlooked that fact.

Pub Fab and the other of the magnificent 7 would have had a field day nit picking at my past knowings of Thailand. It's bad enough now just a word and it's bad army this bad army that, I have now not much time for the "7" brigade.

What they think of me I don't give a damn. critic of lousy government I was constantly slagged off---but now my persistence paid off.

My per cent figures here and there are mere figures of speech -could be 20-1 or 40-2 but a reply was put by another poster giving out some sort of view by the majority of TVF posters here.

Your questions to me are ones you can look up regarding past political termoils and perm them as you wish.

I being bashed when have criticized the PTP---why should I be bashed for that ??? after all it was mostly warranted. NO double standards there. just the truth and it's out in the wash now ???

It was not acceptable to those who could not stomach anyone shouting down the Shins---this is mostly this Magnificent 7 I talk about. Some very well known ones together have vanished.

Finally the DUMMY bit was not called for neither was the 35 year and I think I know more than everyone else ??? and I have been more VOCAL than the others ?? You SINGLING me out

No reply was needed on the question of comparable governments---under Thaksin-Shins-PTP this has been about THE most disaster government ever for hate and internal conflicts they produced, because their plan for Thaksin did not materialize

[soalbundy]

Holding politicians responsible for corruption, yes, all the way. It would be dangerous to hold politicians responsible for mistakes,no one would dare try anything new,would be discouraged from thinking outside the box to solve problems. One would have a house full of timid and apathetic politicians who would be more interested in covering their backs than providing solutions which could back fire. We all make mistakes and politicians aren't a group of geniuses who always know the right answer.

[Skywalker69]

all great, but only if both sides would be held accountable... which is unlikely to happen I guess.

both sides?

afaik since 2006 there was only one side in government (except about 1 year). Of course the democrats should be accountable, too. Guess who caused the bigger havoc

You don't know much about recent history do you? Abhisit was PM from 2008 to 2011 and corruption was worse than ever, especially from his pals in the Bhum Jai Thai party. You can be sure the Democrats and their allies won't be held to account though.

Can you provide us som proof?

[Fat Haggis]

Thanks Ginjag, good post, and I hope my years to come in Thailand are as good as all the years you've been here.

I'm very surprised about you calling the "usual suspects" the "magnificent" 7 ..

[ginjag]

After all you said in the reply to ROB, I can ask you why was not there an outcry from you everytime the PTP/Yingluck regime slipped up ???

That's an easy answer, I've wasn't a member of TVF when the Yingluck Regime were running the country into the ground, I joined here after they become a caretaker Government, I then started to do more reading and research about all the various issues, like the rice pledging scam, and the more I read about all sides, the more I became "interested"

Yes absolutely I said that the best way in which to remove Yinglucks authority was through elections, and I'll say it again, if the claims made by so many here that the majority of the Thai people wanted her out, then there's no way that she could win, and she and the PTP would have been removed through one of the democratic processes, but it was never given the chance, again I supported what Suthep was doing about the anti corruption but questioned why he of all people, who has been involved in corruption was championing that cause, I also said many many times that it was right up until they prevented the rights of those who wished to vote, that made me change my views and opinions of his cause, they become more radical and militant.

I don't believe I have ever said that Yingluck was a good PM, or Leader, or that the PTP/UDD were the right choice to follow, you see, I follow, nor support, nor have ever supported either side, as they're not worth it.. I just don't know how many times I've said that if anything, I'd support Abhisit,but all that the you see are the citicisms against the things and the party you follow, when watching a football match, just because I want one team to beat the other, doesn't mean I support either, as perhaps the reasoning for wishing them to be beaten will be good for the team that I DO support will benefit from their rivals dropping points

2 nd paragraph bothers me to see you put this election thing in print again, as did the magnificent 7.

There was never any best way to remove Yingluck by elections, this is the norm when a government has lost confidence---finished it's term, or a government wanting to cement their standing to call on an a snap election.

NO way did this regime ever earn a snap election, it's record is on paper and that tells us all now.

This was not a normal time to call for an election. it would have served no purpose as it has been proved, now most offences are coming out of the woodwork.

Elections do not automatically bring to government a democratic one. This was the fear and to boot we didn't know who would be able to stand- to vote for.

There are times when elections are ON and times when they are NOT. you do not call them because it's democratically the thing to do, The PTP regime had to go first. sorry but that's how I see it.

If my shop manager was cheating me I would not ask for a vote if he should be retained. Thrown out is the only answer.

[Thailand]

Utter nonsense, you threw your teddy out of the pram and made the extremely bold "I have been here 35 years" giving off the impression that you seem to have more wisdom than the poster in question, that's why I'm singling you out, and the fact you've been more vocal than most of the other regulars, I asked for your opinions of what made the Yingluck Government worse than any of the other ones you've seen through, when they were rife with the same corruption and abuses of power.. you chose not to reply, which gave me the impression that you're not as "keyed in" as you believe yourself to be.

I don't believe I have ever made claims about "the majority" which you have, on numerous occasions, I have always asked you as to how you came up with that assessment, again, you've never answered directly either.

My memory isn't poor, especially about the amount of people that critisise each various party as I've never made "outlandish" statements that there's no possible way for that to be verified, as I said, there's a very small percentage of TVF members who post regularly on the Political topics, I'd even go as far as saying that it's less than 1% of the overall TVF membership database, which sits at around 16,000 I believe.

If you had stated that the majority of those who post in the news/political section are overall in favour of the coup and are anti shiniwatra you'd get no argument from me.

I don't "bash" you, I ask you direct questions, I happen to agree with a lot of what you're saying, I also disagree with some as well, isn't it a little bit odd that you don't like it when "bashed" but yet it's perfectly acceptable to "bash" Yingluck and her clique? double standards there big time!!

I will lighten up when you stop making outlanddish claims about "majorities" but if I see fault or discrepencies in your post I'll say so, does it mean I think you're a bad person? no not at all, I look at your post count and think "If this guy has 17,000 posts, he must know pretty much what he's talking about ;)" it's the same as Publicus, you're both the Ying and Yang, and in between the two of you, there's a lot of very enlightening and educational stuff.

I doubt there isn't a single member of TVF, who has ties to Thailand, who doesn't want Thailand to be a better place to live or for it to prosper, and flourish. Anyone who doesn't wish to see this shouldn't really be in a Thai forum, if they don't have Thailands best interests in their heart.

Just to remind you that my years here mine to relish, not to get involved in a slanging match that you would have created but overlooked that fact.

Pub Fab and the other of the magnificent 7 would have had a field day nit picking at my past knowings of Thailand. It's bad enough now just a word and it's bad army this bad army that, I have now not much time for the "7" brigade.

What they think of me I don't give a damn. critic of lousy government I was constantly slagged off---but now my persistence paid off.

My per cent figures here and there are mere figures of speech -could be 20-1 or 40-2 but a reply was put by another poster giving out some sort of view by the majority of TVF posters here.

Your questions to me are ones you can look up regarding past political termoils and perm them as you wish.

I being bashed when have criticized the PTP---why should I be bashed for that ??? after all it was mostly warranted. NO double standards there. just the truth and it's out in the wash now ???

It was not acceptable to those who could not stomach anyone shouting down the Shins---this is mostly this Magnificent 7 I talk about. Some very well known ones together have vanished.

Finally the DUMMY bit was not called for neither was the 35 year and I think I know more than everyone else ??? and I have been more VOCAL than the others ?? You SINGLING me out

No reply was needed on the question of comparable governments---under Thaksin-Shins-PTP this has been about THE most disaster government ever for hate and internal conflicts they produced, because their plan for Thaksin did not materialize

Quick question I believe you mentioned that you have people post on your behalf when you don't have the time, is that correct?

If so, just wondering if this is one of those posts?

[ginjag]

Utter nonsense, you threw your teddy out of the pram and made the extremely bold "I have been here 35 years" giving off the impression that you seem to have more wisdom than the poster in question, that's why I'm singling you out, and the fact you've been more vocal than most of the other regulars, I asked for your opinions of what made the Yingluck Government worse than any of the other ones you've seen through, when they were rife with the same corruption and abuses of power.. you chose not to reply, which gave me the impression that you're not as "keyed in" as you believe yourself to be.

I don't believe I have ever made claims about "the majority" which you have, on numerous occasions, I have always asked you as to how you came up with that assessment, again, you've never answered directly either.

My memory isn't poor, especially about the amount of people that critisise each various party as I've never made "outlandish" statements that there's no possible way for that to be verified, as I said, there's a very small percentage of TVF members who post regularly on the Political topics, I'd even go as far as saying that it's less than 1% of the overall TVF membership database, which sits at around 16,000 I believe.

If you had stated that the majority of those who post in the news/political section are overall in favour of the coup and are anti shiniwatra you'd get no argument from me.

I don't "bash" you, I ask you direct questions, I happen to agree with a lot of what you're saying, I also disagree with some as well, isn't it a little bit odd that you don't like it when "bashed" but yet it's perfectly acceptable to "bash" Yingluck and her clique? double standards there big time!!

I will lighten up when you stop making outlanddish claims about "majorities" but if I see fault or discrepencies in your post I'll say so, does it mean I think you're a bad person? no not at all, I look at your post count and think "If this guy has 17,000 posts, he must know pretty much what he's talking about ;)" it's the same as Publicus, you're both the Ying and Yang, and in between the two of you, there's a lot of very enlightening and educational stuff.

I doubt there isn't a single member of TVF, who has ties to Thailand, who doesn't want Thailand to be a better place to live or for it to prosper, and flourish. Anyone who doesn't wish to see this shouldn't really be in a Thai forum, if they don't have Thailands best interests in their heart.

Just to remind you that my years here mine to relish, not to get involved in a slanging match that you would have created but overlooked that fact.

Pub Fab and the other of the magnificent 7 would have had a field day nit picking at my past knowings of Thailand. It's bad enough now just a word and it's bad army this bad army that, I have now not much time for the "7" brigade.

What they think of me I don't give a damn. critic of lousy government I was constantly slagged off---but now my persistence paid off.

My per cent figures here and there are mere figures of speech -could be 20-1 or 40-2 but a reply was put by another poster giving out some sort of view by the majority of TVF posters here.

Your questions to me are ones you can look up regarding past political termoils and perm them as you wish.

I being bashed when have criticized the PTP---why should I be bashed for that ??? after all it was mostly warranted. NO double standards there. just the truth and it's out in the wash now ???

It was not acceptable to those who could not stomach anyone shouting down the Shins---this is mostly this Magnificent 7 I talk about. Some very well known ones together have vanished.

Finally the DUMMY bit was not called for neither was the 35 year and I think I know more than everyone else ??? and I have been more VOCAL than the others ?? You SINGLING me out

No reply was needed on the question of comparable governments---under Thaksin-Shins-PTP this has been about THE most disaster government ever for hate and internal conflicts they produced, because their plan for Thaksin did not materialize

Quick question I believe you mentioned that you have people post on your behalf when you don't have the time, is that correct?

If so, just wondering if this is one of those posts?

Did I say for sure--I do have--could have maybe have--others could ????/ which version do you want---print it back the Quote. ???

2 nd question NO.

I have just answered more questions than Yingluck ever did

[Fat Haggis]

After all you said in the reply to ROB, I can ask you why was not there an outcry from you everytime the PTP/Yingluck regime slipped up ???

That's an easy answer, I've wasn't a member of TVF when the Yingluck Regime were running the country into the ground, I joined here after they become a caretaker Government, I then started to do more reading and research about all the various issues, like the rice pledging scam, and the more I read about all sides, the more I became "interested"

Yes absolutely I said that the best way in which to remove Yinglucks authority was through elections, and I'll say it again, if the claims made by so many here that the majority of the Thai people wanted her out, then there's no way that she could win, and she and the PTP would have been removed through one of the democratic processes, but it was never given the chance, again I supported what Suthep was doing about the anti corruption but questioned why he of all people, who has been involved in corruption was championing that cause, I also said many many times that it was right up until they prevented the rights of those who wished to vote, that made me change my views and opinions of his cause, they become more radical and militant.

I don't believe I have ever said that Yingluck was a good PM, or Leader, or that the PTP/UDD were the right choice to follow, you see, I follow, nor support, nor have ever supported either side, as they're not worth it.. I just don't know how many times I've said that if anything, I'd support Abhisit,but all that the you see are the citicisms against the things and the party you follow, when watching a football match, just because I want one team to beat the other, doesn't mean I support either, as perhaps the reasoning for wishing them to be beaten will be good for the team that I DO support will benefit from their rivals dropping points

2 nd paragraph bothers me to see you put this election thing in print again, as did the magnificent 7.

There was never any best way to remove Yingluck by elections, this is the norm when a government has lost confidence---finished it's term, or a government wanting to cement their standing to call on an a snap election.

NO way did this regime ever earn a snap election, it's record is on paper and that tells us all now.

This was not a normal time to call for an election. it would have served no purpose as it has been proved, now most offences are coming out of the woodwork.

Elections do not automatically bring to government a democratic one. This was the fear and to boot we didn't know who would be able to stand- to vote for.

There are times when elections are ON and times when they are NOT. you do not call them because it's democratically the thing to do, The PTP regime had to go first. sorry but that's how I see it.

If my shop manager was cheating me I would not ask for a vote if he should be retained. Thrown out is the only answer.

was, as in past tense, as in there was an opportunity for the country to have voted the PTP out should the July elections have been agreed to go ahead. The July elections nor the February ones were "snap" elections they were within the constitutional time frames for the calling of elections, if anything the Feb ones were actually past the what 90 days laid down in the constitution when Parliament was absolved? A constitution re-written by the last coup was it not?

If I'm reading you correctly, then by not holding elections according to the constitution, then you have supported the removal of her and her party through a judicial/Military Coup all along? ... there's too much emphasis on this word "Democracy" it's been proven time and time and time again that the Western type of democracy role model hasn't worked and does't work in Thailand.

I agree that Elections don't always bring democratic Governments, but that's the peoples choices of who to vote for, but what elections do bring, is a winner and an incumbent party/Government, and again, IF there ever was a "majority" who opposed the PTP, then the ballot box would have ousted them, that's the point, they would have been out, done and dusted, finished, kaput.

The problem was the Democrats wrongly in my opinion refused to participate in the Feb elections, and would probably have done the same if they were held in July, don't forget, all the other parties that were not PTP/UDD/DEMS all registered to have their voices heard too, not 100% sure of the demographics, but that's perhaps 20-25% of the population who in the past voted neither PTP/UDD or the Dems, that's a sizeable part of the population to consider.

Where we differ is that I'm of the belief that IF indeed the majority of those who didn't vote PTP/UDD all voted, it still wouldn't have been enough to allow the Democrats into power, and that's what this is all about, it's not just about getting the PTP/UDD out, it's being able to have the oppositions come together to form the majority and win enough seats in the lower house in which to be able to form a Government. This is the problem when you have multiparty factions vying for Governments, and I'm just not convinced that between the Democrats and the other non PTP parties and the the disenfranchised PTP supporters who were turning their backs on their old party that there was a large enough majority to win, and as sure as there's shit in a dog, nobody in opposition was going to allow the PTP to stay in power.

There never really was an alternative, as coup was always on the cards, I said as much months ago, I also said leave the Military to run the country completely for 12-24 months, work with the Politicians of all sides and come up between everyone the much needed reformation, and once these plans have been implemented then agree for a General Election, and once the results come in, the Military hand the power back over to the PM elect.

[Thailand]

Utter nonsense, you threw your teddy out of the pram and made the extremely bold "I have been here 35 years" giving off the impression that you seem to have more wisdom than the poster in question, that's why I'm singling you out, and the fact you've been more vocal than most of the other regulars, I asked for your opinions of what made the Yingluck Government worse than any of the other ones you've seen through, when they were rife with the same corruption and abuses of power.. you chose not to reply, which gave me the impression that you're not as "keyed in" as you believe yourself to be.

I don't believe I have ever made claims about "the majority" which you have, on numerous occasions, I have always asked you as to how you came up with that assessment, again, you've never answered directly either.

My memory isn't poor, especially about the amount of people that critisise each various party as I've never made "outlandish" statements that there's no possible way for that to be verified, as I said, there's a very small percentage of TVF members who post regularly on the Political topics, I'd even go as far as saying that it's less than 1% of the overall TVF membership database, which sits at around 16,000 I believe.

If you had stated that the majority of those who post in the news/political section are overall in favour of the coup and are anti shiniwatra you'd get no argument from me.

I don't "bash" you, I ask you direct questions, I happen to agree with a lot of what you're saying, I also disagree with some as well, isn't it a little bit odd that you don't like it when "bashed" but yet it's perfectly acceptable to "bash" Yingluck and her clique? double standards there big time!!

I will lighten up when you stop making outlanddish claims about "majorities" but if I see fault or discrepencies in your post I'll say so, does it mean I think you're a bad person? no not at all, I look at your post count and think "If this guy has 17,000 posts, he must know pretty much what he's talking about ;)" it's the same as Publicus, you're both the Ying and Yang, and in between the two of you, there's a lot of very enlightening and educational stuff.

I doubt there isn't a single member of TVF, who has ties to Thailand, who doesn't want Thailand to be a better place to live or for it to prosper, and flourish. Anyone who doesn't wish to see this shouldn't really be in a Thai forum, if they don't have Thailands best interests in their heart.

Just to remind you that my years here mine to relish, not to get involved in a slanging match that you would have created but overlooked that fact.

Pub Fab and the other of the magnificent 7 would have had a field day nit picking at my past knowings of Thailand. It's bad enough now just a word and it's bad army this bad army that, I have now not much time for the "7" brigade.

What they think of me I don't give a damn. critic of lousy government I was constantly slagged off---but now my persistence paid off.

My per cent figures here and there are mere figures of speech -could be 20-1 or 40-2 but a reply was put by another poster giving out some sort of view by the majority of TVF posters here.

Your questions to me are ones you can look up regarding past political termoils and perm them as you wish.

I being bashed when have criticized the PTP---why should I be bashed for that ??? after all it was mostly warranted. NO double standards there. just the truth and it's out in the wash now ???

It was not acceptable to those who could not stomach anyone shouting down the Shins---this is mostly this Magnificent 7 I talk about. Some very well known ones together have vanished.

Finally the DUMMY bit was not called for neither was the 35 year and I think I know more than everyone else ??? and I have been more VOCAL than the others ?? You SINGLING me out

No reply was needed on the question of comparable governments---under Thaksin-Shins-PTP this has been about THE most disaster government ever for hate and internal conflicts they produced, because their plan for Thaksin did not materialize

Quick question I believe you mentioned that you have people post on your behalf when you don't have the time, is that correct?

If so, just wondering if this is one of those posts?

Did I say for sure--I do have--could have maybe have--others could ????/ which version do you want---print it back the Quote. ???

2 nd question NO.

I have just answered more questions than Yingluck ever did

Mind boggling and that you do actually have other people to post for you, it's a wind up isn't it?

if you actually do have tell them to brush up on their punctuation etc.

[winstonc]

Thanks Ginjag, good post, and I hope my years to come in Thailand are as good as all the years you've been here.

I'm very surprised about you calling the "usual suspects" the "magnificent" 7 ..

the magnificent 7..half have disappeared/banned/using a different avatar..remember pipkins..they were/are trolls/..never a decent argument between them..posting in denial of being permenantly wrong is wrong..at least you can argue the toss and dont mind being corrected haggis..your the kind of poster needed here..keep your head down over there lad..

[Fat Haggis]

Thanks Winstonc, I don't mind at all being "educated' and have stuff pointed out to me, how do you learn without asking questions, and asking the difficult ones too?

I want to learn, I want to know all the good stuff and the bad stuff as it helps me understand the situations better, and I rely on the Ginjags of the forum to provide this, warts and all, I prefer to keep an open mind, and listen to all sides, and if I have to form opinions I do so based on what I find, I'd love to have been an investigative journalist, I'm not afraid to ask the difficult questions either.

My bosses have a love hate relationship with me, I'm good at my job, I get results and the clients are always singing my praises, but I'm not afraid to tell the "grown ups" as we call them, the ground truth, I don't ever believe in glossing over the cracks, I've never been the one to toe the party line entirely, just because the rest of the herd do, I've asked the questions that guys are too scared to, who when all together whinge and moan like <deleted>, and say they'll do this that or the other, but when push comes to shove and the big cheeses come down and ask "hows things on the ground" they clamp like <deleted> oysters!! Me, I can't help myself, I'll tell them the truth, and then I'll have a go at the blokes for talking shit and not backing it up, the truth always hurts, in love life and politics.

Thailand has a chance now to progress, everyone should be getting behind that effort, focus on what can be achieved now, and the future will be easier to deal with.

Without the valuable input and contributions from many TVF members, we'd all be sitting in a dark room, making shit up, afraid to go anywhere, or say anything, I love this forum, it's a valuable learning place for those who wish to know more about an awesome country!!

[MaxYakov]

Great let's hope that he doesn't forget the obscene budgets that the army have received year after year just do they don't stage a coup

< snipped >

Have a source for your assertion?

You can try this for starters:

Trading Economics Thailand Military Expenditures (% of GDP) 1990 - 2012

From above link:

BTW, that would be the Royal Thai Armed Forces (as opposed to "the army")

Edited June 10, 2014 by MaxYakov