Thai commander welcomes new submarine centre, despite lack of subs

[Snig27]

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Surreal.

Maybe the military could store their GT200 detectors there?

Or use the blimp for ballast!

No corruption here for sure!

Indeed. One suspects the sort of nefarious behaviour that led to all of these is not up for "reform" in the current thinking. The military's history of craven misuse of public funds dwarfs most other government agencies over the years.

[Emster23]

"If you build it, they will come"

something along the lines of a cargo cult, I dare say....

[ezzra]

It goes like this: were are we going to do with general/admiral/ air wing commander Somchai?

Got it...will get them submarine/aircraft carries/of airship to they have something to command...

Sure why not, just add the submarine command to the aircraft carrier and the Airship

balloon and other useless items the Thai army just love to buy,

[tomyummer]

Maybe it's a smart move to set up training first to see if the Thais are good enough to have a sub in the first place? Classic.

[Ricardo]

if you have a good memory, you might remember few years back, the army did purchase for 50 millions dollars

a dirigible airship. They wanted to use it in south thailand to track down terrorist....

The balloon did never fly once, let be honest the army are like the rest of the country.... completely crooked.

"The balloon did never fly once"

On the contrary, IIRC it was flown for a visit by Yingluck (?) & other poo-yais, but the payload was too heavy, so it bounced and embarassed its military operators.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/604958-thai-armys-airship-crashes-hurts-four/

That articles also gives the cost as having been a slightly-more-modest B350-million, or about US$11-12-million.

[Ricardo]

Orbital Space Command Center. Why not?

Definitely necessary, to support the informal Isaan Rocketeers Brigade, an irregular military formation who hold annual exercises !

[Morakot]

Well judging by Germany's last performance in a war using subs.. would one really go there for top advice? Cheap, cheap comes to mind.

You may not know but Germany is currently leading developer and user of some of the most advanced non-nuclear submarines with air-independent propulsion systems.

Edited July 10, 2014 by Morakot

[soalbundy]

"I think [that having submarines] are necessary because it makes our navy more dynamic and it will be useful for self-defence in the Gulf [of Thailand]," said Panu Punyavirocha, commander of Thailand's submarine unit.

Sounds like an answer from a beauty pageant.

The navy also plans to send officers for training in Germany to gain knowledge about modern submarine warfare.

Well, there you go.

I wonder what language they are going to be taught in,considering their poor English language skills perhaps German ? or is this just going to be a jolly around the beer gardens......oops, i just disclosed a navy secret .

[alfalfa19]

In a way, I can see his point. After all, a submarine has to cost many millions of dollars. At the standard 30% of bribes and graft involved, there are no doubt a few people at the top of the food chain who stand to get very rich.

[soalbundy]

They don't need submarines,the average Thai is good at diving anyway,especially when it comes to facing up to the truth

[HUAHIN62]

Another illustration of what happens when there is no checks and balances inplace.

[kleelof]

Needed for self-defense against who?

[monkeycountry]

The submarine center was likely built in order to push through the purchase of actual submarines. The navy commander will eventually use a bit of Thai logic and say that now that they have already built the center, they have to buy submarines too, otherwise building the center would have been a waste of money. My bet is the submarines, if purchased, will be purchased from some country willing to pay the good commander a nice "commission".

Oh, and since the gulf of Thailand is less than 80 meters deep, around 40 meters most places, a 15 meter tall submarine will not be able to dive at all, as it will be at risk of hitting the bottom whenever it does. Further, even if it does manage to dive, it will still be easily visible as there will only be a few meters of water above the submarine, so it will be a sitting duck for any ship or aircraft hunting it.

Edited July 10, 2014 by monkeycountry

[EyesWideOpen]

Needed for self-defense against who?

Good question.

Burma > Cannot control their own war lords , unlikely to attack neighboring country

Laos> Already taken over by China, has no real army anyway

Cambodia> Dictator there has own problems controlling an unhappy population.

Could not withstand foreign war adventurism...

Malaysia> Doing great economically, no need to step into shit by attacking a neighbor.

I would truly love to see a Thai commander at a microphone, while asking for funding

for more useless toys, speak about where the threat is coming from to justify the toys.

Would be a battle to keep a straight face. And speaking of useless toys, after the

navy got egg on their face with their aircraft carrier that sits at the dock year round,

I am amazed they have the balls to ask for more toys.

Would be fun for news organization to go back through the archives , and today

publish the reasons the navy gave back then as to why buying the aircraft carrier

was so important. But I may have to wait a while on that one.... :-)

Edited July 10, 2014 by EyesWideOpen

[Don Aleman]

hew, glad that's done and now to begin work on the Thai space problem. That is the space between their ears !

[kleelof]

Needed for self-defense against who?

Good question.

Burma > Cannot control their own war lords , unlikely to attack neighboring country

Laos> Already taken over by China, has no real army anyway

Cambodia> Dictator there has own problems controlling an unhappy population.

Could not withstand foreign war adventurism...

Malaysia> Doing great economically, no need to step into shit by attacking a neighbor.

I would truly love to see a Thai commander at a microphone, while asking for funding

for more useless toys, speak about where the threat is coming from to justify the toys.

Would be a battle to keep a straight face. And speaking of useless toys, after the

navy got egg on their face with their aircraft carrier that sits at the dock year round,

I am amazed they have the balls to ask for more toys.

Would be fun for news organization to go back through the archives , and today

publish the reasons the navy gave back then as to why buying the aircraft carrier

was so important. But I may have to wait a while on that one.... :-)

No doubt they would just borrow something from US politicians when they go begging for military money:

"Today, the world is more dangerous than ever. Threats can come in any shape or form. We must be prepared for any eventuality."

Any eventuality, that is, except peace.

[klauskunkel]

How to get a submarine for Thailand?

1. Trade rice for sub, anyone?

2. Put up cutout of submarine at submarine center, charge money to take pictures, buy submarine

3. Promise to America: We get rid of slavery, if you give us a sub

[joepattaya1961]

So the new Ocean Marina is a fact then?

[wabothai]

May be a secret deal with the US to service their subs. Then again if the waters are not deep enough....incredible story !

[siampolee]

One can just imagine those old white sweater boys wandering around Soi Cowboy on Submariner training missions with their Thai counterparts and reporting their depths and positions at midnight.

Edited July 10, 2014 by siampolee

[Baerboxer]

Well judging by Germany's last performance in a war using subs.. would one really go there for top advice? Cheap, cheap comes to mind.

I love paradoxes... a sub centre without a sub.... next will be zoos without animals... damned Thailand beat me to it already.

You need to research more about the battles and convoys in the Atlantic in WW1 and WW2 before making silly comments.

Germany was the pioneer of submarine warfare and the battles to get the life line convoys through in both wars was a much more close run thing that you present.

Thankfully Britain captured the German Navy's enigma machine and broke its codes; and the development of asdic and anti-submarine warfare improved things. Otherwise the outcome could have been very different, especially if Doenitz had got his way and increased the number of submarines.

Since WW2 the German navy has been very restricted. This forced the development of small submarines and patrol boats for coastal defense.

So actually, choosing Germany with its history of submarine warfare is a pretty good choice when thinking of small coastal defense submarine tactics.

Problem is, as the German's might tell them, the water has to be deep enough!

Edited July 10, 2014 by Baerboxer

[kleelof]

May be a secret deal with the US to service their subs. Then again if the waters are not deep enough....incredible story !

It's possible. The waters are deep enough for a sub. Just not deep enough for a sub to be effective. Subs prefer VERY deep waters where it is difficult for ships to identify them. The Gulf of Thailand just isn't deep enough for this. Any approaching force would probably be able to track the thing as it patrolled the coast.

A secret deal with the US to service subs would be really funny. Considering the US now has to keep any joint military ventures quiet so the folks back there don't get upset.

[PJcm]

'Dive, dive dive'

'Er, there's no water there sir'

Das boot

[ginjag]

Well judging by Germany's last performance in a war using subs.. would one really go there for top advice? Cheap, cheap comes to mind.

I love paradoxes... a sub centre without a sub.... next will be zoos without animals... damned Thailand beat me to it already.

You need to research more about the battles and convoys in the Atlantic in WW1 and WW2 before making silly comments.

Germany was the pioneer of submarine warfare and the battles to get the life line convoys through in both wars was a much more close run thing that you present.

Thankfully Britain captured the German Navy's enigma machine and broke its codes; and the development of asdic and anti-submarine warfare improved things. Otherwise the outcome could have been very different, especially if Doenitz had got his way and increased the number of submarines.

Since WW2 the German navy has been very restricted. This forced the development of small submarines and patrol boats for coastal defense.

So actually, choosing Germany with its history of submarine warfare is a pretty good choice when thinking of small coastal defense submarine tactics.

Problem is, as the German's might tell them, the water has to be deep enough!

Also to add there is no choice, even if Germany has the experience. Where is the threat to come from ??? Burma, Malaysia Indonesia Singapore ???

Complete waste of time even considering the Sub subject.

Get half a dozen carrier aircraft, vertical or other, and use the carrier on pact Asian/USA practice. forget the subs-- maybe fast patrol boats, to monitor shipping/illegal fishing/immigrants, air sea rescue OR ???

[Basil B]

Maybe the UK will be interested in leasing it if Scotland goes independent

What a thought, R'n'R while the sub is in for service.

[soalbundy]

Not deep enough? you lack fantasy, dredging baby,dredging, with some good will we could get the gulf down to a 100 meters or more

[Traveller45]

Well judging by Germany's last performance in a war using subs.. would one really go there for top advice? Cheap, cheap comes to mind.

I love paradoxes... a sub centre without a sub.... next will be zoos without animals... damned Thailand beat me to it already.

Yes and no. As far as submarine technology goes, Germany is industry leader, also by exports. Some of those customers must know what they are doing. As far as the fortunes of war, many other factors come into play, and arguably you cannot fight maritime warfare using only submarines. Does Thailand need submarines? A good question. Cannot answer. Suffice it to say that skills and abilities need to be developed with a Navy, this is definitely not just about the Gulf of Thailand.

[Carrerakiss]

A timely reminder that the Thai armed forces are not perfect. One might suspect corruption, but probably is not allowed to say it. One might also suspect incompetence, and perhaps might be allowed to say it. This is an example of one or the other, or both.

Fortunately the actual submarine purchase is still a plan at this point, the money on the rest of the gear is already lost. Hopefully the powers that be will ask the Navy to reexamine their plans.

Of course it brings back memories of the aircraft carrier debacle. And I personally find it hard to forget Tai Bak when people were trussed up and thrown in the back of lorries like logs, resulting in a significant number of deaths. Nobody ever prosecuted for the latter.

So cleaning up beaches, taxi mafias etc is to be applauded. It's also possible for the big J to look closer to home if they wish to do so.

[soalbundy]

A timely reminder that the Thai armed forces are not perfect. One might suspect corruption, but probably is not allowed to say it. One might also suspect incompetence, and perhaps might be allowed to say it. This is an example of one or the other, or both.

Fortunately the actual submarine purchase is still a plan at this point, the money on the rest of the gear is already lost. Hopefully the powers that be will ask the Navy to reexamine their plans.

Of course it brings back memories of the aircraft carrier debacle. And I personally find it hard to forget Tai Bak when people were trussed up and thrown in the back of lorries like logs, resulting in a significant number of deaths. Nobody ever prosecuted for the latter.

So cleaning up beaches, taxi mafias etc is to be applauded. It's also possible for the big J to look closer to home if they wish to do so.

They won't want to do that,could open a can of very big worms.

[baboon]

Needed for self-defense against who?

Swaziland, Trinidad, Cuba, Turkmenistan... The list is endless, my friend..?