More than 50 Israeli reservists refuse to fight

[Ulysses G.]

If you were run into the desert in 1947 without warning, you'd have some strong feeling against your oppressors.

The Arabs had been attacking the Jews since the early 1900s and they declared war on Israel - not the other way around. The Arabs had plenty of warning and they were the aggressors. You need to read some history, that is not on loony anti-Semitic blogs.  

[uptheos]

 

 

 

Generational change . .. . here's to future without war. . 

I think at this point you're talking about a generation that isn't born yet. Hamas propagandizes from very early:

 

 

3 referring to the 3 Israeli boys that were murdered

 

 

Hamas doesn't need to work very hard on anti-Israeli feelings in Gaza. Prisoner-of-war type of enclave with three lots of atrocities is actually helping Hamas and creating more and more fighters.

 

They are more concerned with the murder of hundreds of their fellow civilians on top of the thousands in the previous two genocidal attacks. Israel never seems to learn.

 

 

On the contrary. A good hawk would know, the best way to continue war is to continue killing.

When you're in the business of creating weapons, as the Israelis do, what use is a weapon without somewhere to use it.

 

When you have nothing in your country worth exporting, create the only business worth buying.

 

The tomatoes are among the finest in the world. Maybe they should lob these into Gaza and teach Hamas a lesson....or perhaps a few Zucchini's the next time rockets start coming. If that doesn't work, I suggest a strongly worded letter, accompanied by some avocado's.

Edited July 24, 2014 by uptheos

[khunken]

 

Hamas ordered nothing

Balderdash. They called on civilians to act as human shields. What savages.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXZEzbT0H1s

 

 

We've had this piece of propaganda ad infinitum and it's a lie to say they 'called' for human shields. They agreed with people using themselves to try and prevent their houses and livlihood being destroyed by the bloodthirsty (i.e savage) Israeli terrorists.

 

You are a fine example of 'humanity' defending the bombing of civilians without the slightest trace of compassion for the hundreds (and thousands before) indiscriminately murdered. Israel must be proud of you and your fellow cowardly keyboard 'warriors'.

[khunken]

 

If you were run into the desert in 1947 without warning, you'd have some strong feeling against your oppressors.

The Arabs had been attacking the Jews since the early 1900s and they declared war on Israel - not the other way around. The Arabs had plenty of warning and they were the aggressors. You need to read some history, that is not on loony anti-Semitic blogs.  

 

 

More lies. Israel was founded on terrorism in 1948. There have been a number of Arab-Israeli wars, the last one being started by Israel (not in the propaganda book I'd guess). You seem be the one to lack historical knowledge.

 

Now you bring up the anti-Semitism issue which is greatly enhanced by Israel's genocidal policies against the Palestinians. It is not something I support but many people don't understand that Judaism, Zionism and Israeli-sm are not one and the same thing.

 

The first is a religion, the second basically a land-grabbing religious distortion and the third pure genocidal terrorism by the leaders, not all Israelis.

 

Presumably you follow wacky Zionist sites or does your propaganda come directly from Israel?.

[khunken]

 

 

 

 

I think at this point you're talking about a generation that isn't born yet. Hamas propagandizes from very early:

 

 

3 referring to the 3 Israeli boys that were murdered

 

 

Hamas doesn't need to work very hard on anti-Israeli feelings in Gaza. Prisoner-of-war type of enclave with three lots of atrocities is actually helping Hamas and creating more and more fighters.

 

They are more concerned with the murder of hundreds of their fellow civilians on top of the thousands in the previous two genocidal attacks. Israel never seems to learn.

 

 

On the contrary. A good hawk would know, the best way to continue war is to continue killing.

When you're in the business of creating weapons, as the Israelis do, what use is a weapon without somewhere to use it.

 

When you have nothing in your country worth exporting, create the only business worth buying.

 

The tomatoes are among the finest in the world. Maybe they should lob these into Gaza and teach Hamas a lesson....or perhaps a few Zucchini's the next time rockets start coming. If that doesn't work, I suggest a strongly worded letter, accompanied by some avocado's.

 

 

You forgot the oranges. Plus the odd olive stolen from what's left of the mostly destroyed olive groves.

 

[Jay Sata]

The UK opposition leader,himself a jew, has said the following in the New Statesman.

 

 

We oppose the Israeli incursion into Gaza

So there we have it.

 

 

 

Firming up his stance on this is a significant move, because he has hitherto been quite ambivelant and unclear about his attitude towards Israel, and even when referring to his own Jewish heritage.

The war that Israel is waging will gaining them no friends but making lots of enemies.

[Maggusoil]

When the supporter/ bloggers/ posters reduce bloodshed and military bullying to conversations about vegetables (khunken), 

you know how dislocated their intelligence has become.

Jewish humour has its place, but not in Israel.

 

Jews like the Chinese, live all over the world peacefully, except in Israel. If the Israelis were really serious about assimilation it would have 

happened by now. Let us repeat. War is money. This is a military agenda. Not a human one.

[Jingthing]

Israeli Jews in the world's only Jewish nation state would be assimilating into what exactly? I really don't get that comment. Unless you're talking about hummus. 

 

There was a sign at a pro-Israel rally in London:

More Hummus!
Less Hamas!

 

 

Edited July 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[Ulysses G.]

We've had this piece of propaganda ad infinitum and it's a lie to say they 'called' for human shields.

What do you not understand about, "We call on people to adopt this tactic". That is a direct quote.  

Edited July 24, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[japsportscarmad]

That about sums it up really.

[japsportscarmad]

I guess we should respect his view of Arab aggression, after all that must be why today a UN compound was shelled by the IDF in view of the threat posed and the Israelis only hitting Hamas targets, obviously the UN were firing rockets into Israel as well??? Or could it possibly be that it's just a blanket bombing. O and one of the 67 air raid shelters he talked about was in the compound. Hmmmmm

[Thorgal]

If you were run into the desert in 1947 without warning, you'd have some strong feeling against your oppressors.

The Arabs had been attacking the Jews since the early 1900s and they declared war on Israel - not the other way around. The Arabs had plenty of warning and they were the aggressors. You need to read some history, that is not on loony anti-Semitic blogs.  

Remember Sabra and Shatila for your next history lesson !


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand Edited July 24, 2014 by Thorgal

[Ulysses G.]

 

 

If you were run into the desert in 1947 without warning, you'd have some strong feeling against your oppressors.

The Arabs had been attacking the Jews since the early 1900s and they declared war on Israel - not the other way around. The Arabs had plenty of warning and they were the aggressors. You need to read some history, that is not on loony anti-Semitic blogs.

 

Remember Sabra and Shatila for your next history lesson !

 

 

You mean in 1982? That was many decades after the Arabs started this mess.

[Thorgal]

 

 

If you were run into the desert in 1947 without warning, you'd have some strong feeling against your oppressors.

The Arabs had been attacking the Jews since the early 1900s and they declared war on Israel - not the other way around. The Arabs had plenty of warning and they were the aggressors. You need to read some history, that is not on loony anti-Semitic blogs.
 

Remember Sabra and Shatila for your next history lesson !
 

 
You mean in 1982? That was many decades after the Arabs started this mess.

Oh, and when did they started 'this mess' ?

Don't give me a Google or pro Israeli-CNN answer please like you did in all your previous posts...

Only the truth will set you free !


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand Edited July 24, 2014 by Thorgal

[joecoolfrog]

I was in Israel in 1982/3 shortly after the Sabra/Shatila massacres and there were very many Israelies calling for peace.Not at all unusual at that time to see soldiers marching with other anti war protesters.
I was far more optimistic of a solution at that time than I am now , far too many zealots on both sides pulling the strings , as ever it is largely the innocent who will pay the price.

[joecoolfrog]

Thorgal
I shouldnt bother with Ulysses if I were you , his take on history is highly selective and I suspect straight from Conservapedia. I am broadly Pro Israeli but one needs to take a balanced view , bigotry is never a good thing.

[Ulysses G.]

"Bigoted" because I don't agree with you? That sounds pretty bigoted to me.  
Thanks for telling me about Conservapedia though. I've never heard of it before and it sounds interesting. It is about the only useful thing that I've ever seen you post.

Edited July 24, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[Tywais]

Off topic and duplicate posts removed.

[spidermike007]

This is just the tip of what most Jews know and think, but the voice of the Jewish majority are silenced by the powerful Political Zionist (as opposed to Religious Zionist) minority. We need to help the Jewish people liberate themselves from the Political Zionists who are bringing nothing but hatred and condemnation upon them.
 
People like Naomi Wolf, Gideon Levy are more famous examples of Jews who speak their minds - I'm hopeful that there are many more who will come forward now that the Zionist Genocide Machine is out 'mowing the lawn"
 
Jewish !=  Zionist

Yes. I am Jewish, and I cannot even discuss my opposing views with my Jewish friends in the US, without them doubting my "loyalty". I am called a Jew hater, and anti Zionist, and whatever other labels they can think of. Talk about thin skinned! Since when is dialogue discouraged? No dissent allowed? If I am sympathizing with the oppression of the Palestinians, I am somehow branded a traitor? I am starting the think this reeks of fascism, or something far more heinous. It certainly does not resemble anything related to a democratic point of view, nor an open, free debate of the merits. Israel tries to silence anyone speaking out against the party line.


Spidermike
Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[Wat dee]

 

as for the original post, great news perhaps slowly but surely an anti.war and anti miltary group will gain strength and will eventually hold.enuf power to change things in Isreal.

 

 

 

another insightful comment NOT.  

 

what you fail to understand is that while there are some who refuse to serve in Gaza or the west Bank. These same people would pick  up arms if Israel was seriously threatened by the Arabs. 

 

In Israel everyone is a soldier.

 

There is a difference between murdering civilians and protecting your country. 

[joecoolfrog]

Ulysses
Plenty of biggots spouting anti Israel propaganda, they are equally as culpable as you , nothing to do with my agreement or otherwise.
If you want to be taken seriously then educate yourself , learn both sides of the story , dont just parrot cherry picked articles that fit your agenda.
I disagree with many people but still respect their views if well formed and articulate . Nothing well formed or articulate about cribbing from a couple of propaganda pieces.
In my time in Israel I never once met ordinary jew tell me ' it was all the arabs fault ' . Im sorry if it offends you but only a zealot or a fool would say something so simplistic.

[Wat dee]

 

We've had this piece of propaganda ad infinitum and it's a lie to say they 'called' for human shields.

What do you not understand about, "We call on people to adopt this tactic". That is a direct quote.  

 

No wonder why there's plenty of material for Hamas.

[joecoolfrog]

After what has just occured at the UN school I think there will now be a lot more Israelis protesing , also intensive pressure on Israel from the US administration.
Appalling loss of life , massive propaganda boost for Hamas , fillup for every Anti Western Islamist group worldwide and for the Ultras in Israel who dont want peace at any cost.
Its an absolute tragedy and surely a sign that things must change , everybody has to learn to get along with each other.

[Jay Sata]

After what has just occured at the UN school I think there will now be a lot more Israelis protesing , also intensive pressure on Israel from the US administration.
Appalling loss of life , massive propaganda boost for Hamas , fillup for every Anti Western Islamist group worldwide and for the Ultras in Israel who dont want peace at any cost.
Its an absolute tragedy and surely a sign that things must change , everybody has to learn to get along with each other.

I quite agree.

 

No need to troll with long winded diatribe as other appear to do here.

 

Israel will be judged by its results and the terrible human disaster it has inflicted on innocent people.

 

As to a solution the answer is easy.

 

We need to boycott all goods from Israel and the occupied territories.

 

All supermarket chains should be faced with those pictures so consumers can choose if they source produce from Israel.

[Jingthing]

What do you propose to do about Hamas? You've got a plan for Israel. What about Hamas? Unless the Israel demonizers share the exact same goals as Hamas ... which of course many do. 

 

This PR hit against Israel has been a big part of the Hamas plan for years. It is working for them but what's the endgame. But what's the result? An Israel even less willing to talk to Hamas than before. The idea that the Palestinians can solve their problems without cooperating with Israel, and playing the international PR game only, is a dead end. 

Edited July 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[hawker9000]

 

 

 

 

I think at this point you're talking about a generation that isn't born yet. Hamas propagandizes from very early:

 

 

3 referring to the 3 Israeli boys that were murdered

 

 

Hamas doesn't need to work very hard on anti-Israeli feelings in Gaza. Prisoner-of-war type of enclave with three lots of atrocities is actually helping Hamas and creating more and more fighters.

 

They are more concerned with the murder of hundreds of their fellow civilians on top of the thousands in the previous two genocidal attacks. Israel never seems to learn.

 

 

They are more concerned with the murder of hundreds of their fellow civilians

 

That's why Hamas use their civilians as Human shields.  Obviously you missed that part, in order to make such a comment! Helps if you know what you are talking about.

 

 

 

Sick 'smiley'.

 

You are yet again spouting Israeli propaganda which you have filled TV threads with. I have no time for those who blame victims for being blown to bits with nowhere to go. Contemptuous.

 

 

 

Oh, I see.  So Hamas is NOT using Palestinian civilians as human shields (according to you).  NOT putting missile & arms caches in schools, hospitals and mosques, and firing them from heavily populated civilian areas.  And I guess that UN report yesterday (rockets in a UN support center) was of course also false.   In fact, Hamas is NOT a terrorist organization committed to the destruction of the Israeli state at all, and hasn't been firing rockets into Israel.  ALL of this just "Israeli propaganda".  Thanks for clearing that up.  Just some supporting info please (you know, just a formality - I'm sure you can provide references or links, preferably not from hamas.com...). 

 

 

 

[Jingthing]

Don't blame Hamas as they could easily be replaced by an even more radical organisation.

 

The problem is Israel either accepting a two state solution or better still a new one state nation from the Jordan to the sea.

 

Of course this would have to be a secular nation which Zionists could never accept.

You don't think the Arab world has enough majority Arab nations?

 

One small Jewish majority nation on the entire planet. It already exists. Perhaps Israel demonizers and forces like Hamas would be much better off if they just ACCEPT that.

[Jay Sata]

 

Don't blame Hamas as they could easily be replaced by an even more radical organisation.

 

The problem is Israel either accepting a two state solution or better still a new one state nation from the Jordan to the sea.

 

Of course this would have to be a secular nation which Zionists could never accept.

You don't think the Arab world has enough majority Arab nations?

 

One small Jewish majority nation on the entire planet. It already exists. Perhaps Israel demonizers and forces like Hamas would be much better off if they just ACCEPT that.

 

Well of course there are lots of minority nations on this planet who have managed to live in peace and harmony.

 

However Israel was born from a minority religion and the guilt the western nations felt after WW2.

 

Roma gypsies,gay people and a substantial number of physical and mentally deficient people also suffered a terrible death in the holocaust but do not regurgitate it on a daily basis to make the world feel guilty.

 

This current conflict is born from the death of three immigrant so called settler hitchhikers who were murdered trying to get home in the occupied West Bank where according to the UN they had no right to be there.

[Jingthing]

 

 

Don't blame Hamas as they could easily be replaced by an even more radical organisation.

 

The problem is Israel either accepting a two state solution or better still a new one state nation from the Jordan to the sea.

 

Of course this would have to be a secular nation which Zionists could never accept.

You don't think the Arab world has enough majority Arab nations?

 

One small Jewish majority nation on the entire planet. It already exists. Perhaps Israel demonizers and forces like Hamas would be much better off if they just ACCEPT that.

 

Well of course there are lots of minority nations on this planet who have managed to live in peace and harmony.

 

However Israel was born from a minority religion and the guilt the western nations felt after WW2.

 

Roma gypsies,gay people and a substantial number of physical and mentally deficient people also suffered a terrible death in the holocaust but do not regurgitate it on a daily basis to make the world feel guilty.

 

This current conflict is born from the death of three immigrant so called settler hitchhikers who were murdered trying to get home in the occupied West Bank where according to the UN they had no right to be there.

 

I almost can't believe what I just read. You actually consider the argument that gay people or handicapped don't have their own nation state (and of course don't want one because the idea is ABSURD) to be a credible argument against the legitimacy of Israel? There is no point in rebutting such a ridiculous POV. It is better to let is stand on it's own to just stew.

 

As far as the Jews, the Zionist movement well predates the holocaust as I reckon you well know. I suppose you also know that Jews have been persecuted for thousands of years well before the holocaust. Of course there is a lot more to the story of the Jews than persecution, but that is an integral part of the story, whether you might find it grating or not.

 

Can you imagine in your fine intellect why a people who have experienced what the Jews have for thousands of years might be attracted to a political movement of self determination -- yes, ZIONISM? Yes, finally a nation where they AREN'T the small minority?

 

I know it's a dirty word to Israel demonizers. Too bad about that. 

 

 

As far as Roma people, they have shown no ambition to have their own state that I am aware of. Considering the state of Roma people in the world today, maybe they should have had such ambitions.

Edited July 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[japsportscarmad]

How can you have a country established on the basis of some alleged sightings of god or what not years ago, most of the crap can be discounted straight away the flood the ark the rest goes on, Perhaps there should be a Star Trek country or a Palestinian country wow there's a thought a Palestinian state Wow sounds like a runner.