EXPATRIATE ID CARD ... DIY...

[Boycie]

I read nearly a few years ago that there is Non Thai ID card for permanent residents and migrants.

Maybe in the future, the amphur offices will also be able to offer the service, to all long term residents.

[sustento]

but it works in other countries. Similar to a Thai DL ... if Thailand issued a long stay Expatriate Alien Card (not for short term tourists)... it could have a ID number that could be verified by computer entry into an online database... The BiB figures out fake Thai DLs - or do they?

and therein is a question... does it work in other countries ?, but which ones actually issue ID cards to people who are on 1 years approvals on visa's/extensions ?

I can see this in other countries for people who are working in that country for a period of time, but all other visa/extension groups ?

As regards the ID number/ on line data base thing, again nice idea, but if you get stopped in the street, not much access to an on line data base is there ?.... however having the PP on you or copy is almost instananeous proof

The point is being missed ... I have posted several clarifications

I think you're missing the point. As far as Thai Immigration is concerned you already have a perfectly good form of identification - your passport.

It is the only document that you possess which shows your current visa status.

An ID card wouldn't do that unless it was re-issued every time your visa status changed.

They really aren't concerned whether you lose it or have it stolen. That's your problem and it seems to me unlikely that they'd want to spend the money to set up yet another computerised system to allow for those few who are unfortunate enough to misplace theirs.

[noahvail]

Just take your passport to a copy shop and have them copy your photo page and latest extension stamp or visa have it reduced to business card/ credit card size, have it laminated. Photo page on one side and visa info on the back. Also very cheap to get done.

We all need to be aware that when you get a document copied, the copy machine scans the document into memory and then prints out from that memory. The information in memory is stored until it is bumped out of the memory, which could be many hundreds of pages. So giving this information to one of the dodgy shops on Kho San road (not that you said that, pmarlin) is tantamount to leaving your passport with them so they can make a fake. Copiers are so ubiquitous in our everyday lives that we tend to forget this.

[JDGRUEN]

but it works in other countries. Similar to a Thai DL ... if Thailand issued a long stay Expatriate Alien Card (not for short term tourists)... it could have a ID number that could be verified by computer entry into an online database... The BiB figures out fake Thai DLs - or do they?

and therein is a question... does it work in other countries ?, but which ones actually issue ID cards to people who are on 1 years approvals on visa's/extensions ?

I can see this in other countries for people who are working in that country for a period of time, but all other visa/extension groups ?

As regards the ID number/ on line data base thing, again nice idea, but if you get stopped in the street, not much access to an on line data base is there ?.... however having the PP on you or copy is almost instananeous proof

The point is being missed ... I have posted several clarifications

I think you're missing the point. As far as Thai Immigration is concerned you already have a perfectly good form of identification - your passport.

It is the only document that you possess which shows your current visa status.

An ID card wouldn't do that unless it was re-issued every time your visa status changed.

They really aren't concerned whether you lose it or have it stolen. That's your problem and it seems to me unlikely that they'd want to spend the money to set up yet another computerised system to allow for those few who are unfortunate enough to misplace theirs.

Other countries have such cards and find them useful - one is a close neighbor of Thailand... And as a lead in to my OP ... the Thai Immigration Deputy Commander in Bkk stated that a Thai DL and photocopies of the Passport/Visa would do for initial ID... I was only proposing a DIY Expatriate (Alien) ID Card as an adjunct to the 'other' forms of allowed ID ... My idea was proposed mainly to bring the concept to the attention of Thai Immigration Authorities ... who just might decide it is a good idea and take it on - as other countries have done. And - as stated - I proposed a DIY method to do it yourself - update your card as needed. One fellow suggested using a Word Template -- good idea.

Edited August 1, 2014 by JDGRUEN

[DrTuner]

it seems to me unlikely that they'd want to spend the money to set up yet another computerised system to allow for those few who are unfortunate enough to misplace theirs.

That would be a wrong way to approach it. What immigration (and the entire government) needs is an integrated system and this card could easily be a part of it. If they ever do start a project, I hope this one finds itself into the use cases.

[DrTuner]

I read nearly a few years ago that there is Non Thai ID card for permanent residents and migrants.

Maybe in the future, the amphur offices will also be able to offer the service, to all long term residents.

Google bangkok post and "Thai to the bone" and you'll find a photo with pink ID card. Those are the ones. I can't give the direct link since it's against forum rules, but that search will get you there.

I already have a Thai ID number beginning with 6, reserved for temporaries and illegals. I got it when I applied for the yellow Thabian Baan, meaning I am now registered in the Thai ID system. They also needed the names of my mom&dad for it, so I guess they too are somewhere in the database now.

Edited August 1, 2014 by DrTuner

[smedly]

Just take your passport to a copy shop and have them copy your photo page and latest extension stamp or visa have it reduced to business card/ credit card size, have it laminated. Photo page on one side and visa info on the back. Also very cheap to get done.

and this is no different than me carrying the said photos in my wallet or on my Phone, the problem with photos is that they can be doctored and edited to look and show whatever you want.

Remember that the Thai authorities will be checking you out because they suspect you are breaking the law in some way

IMO there will never be a replacement for your original passport being produced in person when requested unless the thai authorities want to invest in a complex IT system of finger printing and cross reference which would be made available to all agencies with terminals at police stations etc, do any of you have an idea of the costs involved, perhaps at some point in the future this would be possible

For now "the only document that 100% validates - who - what and when - whilst you are in Thailand is your original passport along with you in person"

My idea was not presented as a replacement for a real passport, Rather just as a Thai DL or copies of a Passport relevant pages are not replacements... but temporary adjuncts - that in many cases would suffice. And as stated a my idea would hopefully be a stimulus for Thai Immigration Authorities to issue as safe, simple and secure card that keeps one from risking compromise of their passport.

I fully understand that and I am not trying to put anyone off from carrying copies of the relevant pages as I do in my phone, but if my gut feel is correct and my prediction is correct on several other threads over the past few weeks - then the next phase of this crackdown (which started over a year ago in our home countries) will be active spot checks of peoples visa status and proactive programs to hunt people down

IMO if you are stopped and asked to show your visa status nothing will be accepted except your passport and in person and if you are not carrying it you will have to either task someone to go get it or you will be accompanied by an official to your residence to produce it

Lets put it this way, if I was on overstay or committing some other infringement that required me to hide from authorities and was stopped and then given the opportunity to go and bring my documents to a police station - do you really think I would comply and if I was carrying photo copies of pages of my passport do you think they would be authentic

This is the reality of the situation and it is really quite simple to understand

PS - I don't carry my passport with me unless I am travelling away from my residence but I have full access to it if I need to show it by having someone bring it to me after a short phone call, there are other options like having a friend jump on a taxi and going and getting it for you if you need it - 15 mins and you have it in your hand

Edited August 1, 2014 by smedly

[DrTuner]

Phuket Gazette apparently allows linking, so here goes:

http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket-news/Phuket-begins-registering-illegal-migrant-workers/31272

That's fresh, BTW. Date of article is 22 July 2014.

I want me one of those

Edited August 1, 2014 by DrTuner

[Misterwhisper]

Not a bad idea.... initially.

Problem is: What prevents a person from keying in a false name, address, passport number, etc.? There ARE foreign crooks out there who would just looooove to get their hands on an ID card to hide their true identity. And that would defy the purpose, wouldn't it?

[JDGRUEN]

Phuket Gazette apparently allows linking, so here goes:

http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket-news/Phuket-begins-registering-illegal-migrant-workers/31272

That's fresh, BTW. Date of article is 22 July 2014.

I want me one of those

Yes -- interesting ... if Thailand wants these kinds of workers and allows issuance of ID cards to help make them legal ... then a similar card could be issued to Expats... or is anyone suggesting that we become third class citizens behind illegal workers... ? So issuance of ID cards can be done and is being done... Except legitimate LEGAL long stay Expats - here in Thailand on various kinds of legally acquired visas and extensions of stay ... who are required to produce a passport if an initial Thai DL and / or photocopies of the passport and relevant pages is not good enough...

Third Class Aliens Expats are... it seems.

Face it folks - a Legally Issued ID card referencing essential valid Passport and Visa info is a reasonable concept to ask to be available to Expats ... The real passport would always have to be produced -- but in many cases with a ID Card - it would never rise to that occasion. And the real passport could be kept - safely locked up - to be brought out for travel outside Thailand...

[Boycie]

I ask for one (pink ID card) when i applied for the Yellow tabian baan book but my amphur office told me that "the computer says no".

[uptheos]

Phuket Gazette apparently allows linking, so here goes:

http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket-news/Phuket-begins-registering-illegal-migrant-workers/31272

That's fresh, BTW. Date of article is 22 July 2014.

I want me one of those

Yes -- interesting ... if Thailand wants these kinds of workers and allows issuance of ID cards to help make them legal ... then a similar card could be issued to Expats... or is anyone suggesting that we become third class citizens behind illegal workers... ? So issuance of ID cards can be done and is being done... Except legitimate LEGAL long stay Expats - here in Thailand on various kinds of legally acquired visas and extensions of stay ... who are required to produce a passport if an initial Thai DL and / or photocopies of the passport and relevant pages is not good enough...

Third Class Aliens Expats are... it seems.

Face it folks - a Legally Issued ID card referencing essential valid Passport and Visa info is a reasonable concept to ask to be available to Expats ... The real passport would always have to be produced -- but in many cases with a ID Card - it would never rise to that occasion. And the real passport could be kept - safely locked up - to be brought out for travel outside Thailand...

Actually sounds like a good idea

Gotta start somewhere and who knows what will happen?

I think you should present your idea to the head of immigration and report back.

[JDGRUEN]

Phuket Gazette apparently allows linking, so here goes:

http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket-news/Phuket-begins-registering-illegal-migrant-workers/31272

That's fresh, BTW. Date of article is 22 July 2014.

I want me one of those

Yes -- interesting ... if Thailand wants these kinds of workers and allows issuance of ID cards to help make them legal ... then a similar card could be issued to Expats... or is anyone suggesting that we become third class citizens behind illegal workers... ? So issuance of ID cards can be done and is being done... Except legitimate LEGAL long stay Expats - here in Thailand on various kinds of legally acquired visas and extensions of stay ... who are required to produce a passport if an initial Thai DL and / or photocopies of the passport and relevant pages is not good enough...

Third Class Aliens Expats are... it seems.

Face it folks - a Legally Issued ID card referencing essential valid Passport and Visa info is a reasonable concept to ask to be available to Expats ... The real passport would always have to be produced -- but in many cases with a ID Card - it would never rise to that occasion. And the real passport could be kept - safely locked up - to be brought out for travel outside Thailand...

Actually sounds like a good idea

Gotta start somewhere and who knows what will happen?

I think you should present your idea to the head of immigration and report back.

Well I would - if there was a chance in hell - he would even give me an appointment... So I am pursuing a sideways - backdoor approach -- BROACH THE SUBJECT... by having hundreds of Expats sport such a DIY Card. It would gain attention without endangering anyone ... The card would be informative to any BiB or Army Checkpoint ,,, And if there was an official one issued by Thai Immigration ... then all the better.

[Jip99]

Mildly interesting - and at least you have got your post count up.

Beyond that you are

[smedly]

Lets be practical here

First of all a card like this could be easily forged so to be in any way useful it would have to be a key element of a system that all agencies have access too otherwise it's just a piece of plastic, as stated earlier in this thread I don't believe a system like this exists so it would have to be developed and maintained

One of the biggest challenges any law enforcement agency has is accurately identifying an individual this is the case even in the west especially involving foreigners - it all comes back to one thing, having the person and their passport together and then verified to make sure it is authentic - ok this is taking it to an extreme, Thailand is only interested by and large of identifying someone with the document they entered the country with, they can pursue a more thorough check if they are not satisfied but generally for 99% of us this is enough

Lets not forget there is a thriving black market for stolen passports in Thailand

[Bpuumike]

 

Expatriate (Alien) Residing in Thailand...

I really want Thai Immigration to do it ... and I know they wouldn't really accept it in lieu of proper ID - Thai DL and copy of P.P. but while waiting for Thai immigration to take on this concept -- one would have a handy dandy reference of dates and numbers for issuance of Passport and Visa... plus can every one of us spell out - if we had to our soi address and get it exactly correct from memory?... Old timers probably can - but I move around a lot...

Actually some years back, immigration was going to do just this, I remember reading it on TV, but as with a lot Thailand cunning bureaucratic plans, they typically fall by the wayside over time, but one suspects with the current crack down's, impending finger printing a Thai airports etc, one suspects it will only be a matter of time before this comes a reality in Thailand.

The tricky part for them is as your only on a year turn about a time it will get quite labour intensive trying to issue this annually, I suppose its possible they could issue some sort of card to WP holders, same as a Thai DL, as provided your in the same job, your WP number doesnt change over the years

however I would see a relcutance to issue these with visa status, dates of extension etc as a "legal ID" and rely on this as form of offical "document", as it will create a whole new industry on Khao San road in fake ID cards and we will be back to having to produce a passport anyway.

So although a nice idea in principle, can also see a few pitfalls to this cunning plan

It is something of an oxymoron that we can have a 5 year DL but only ever a 1 year visa/extension validity.

[smileplur]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

but it works in other countries. Similar to a Thai DL ... if Thailand issued a long stay Expatriate Alien Card (not for short term tourists)... it could have a ID number that could be verified by computer entry into an online database... The BiB figures out fake Thai DLs - or do they?

and therein is a question... does it work in other countries ?, but which ones actually issue ID cards to people who are on 1 years approvals on visa's/extensions ?

I can see this in other countries for people who are working in that country for a period of time, but all other visa/extension groups ?

As regards the ID number/ on line data base thing, again nice idea, but if you get stopped in the street, not much access to an on line data base is there ?.... however having the PP on you or copy is almost instananeous proof

;Indeed, other countries do it. When I lived in South Korea, we were issued with an Alien Registration Card. Everyone had one. I am sure it is still the same. In my year there, I was never asked for identification by the authorites; however, this was all we had to carry. We certainly didn't need to carry our passports. We didn't do any silly reporting. The ARC was linked with the immigration database, and a cop could instantly reference the number to check your visa status and personal details. They look like this:

It's not exactly rocket science! I am sure Thailand could produce something similar if they wanted to. This would be a much more effective way of sorting this issue out. It would require a bit of work to execute

[AYJAYDEE]

too easy for anyone to fake

[wow64]

Just take a picture on your phone of your Passport photo page and stamp page. Job done.

Work Permit too.. why over complicate it.

Or carry your Thai Drivers license. Look now there is a reason to get one.

[AYJAYDEE]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

but it works in other countries. Similar to a Thai DL ... if Thailand issued a long stay Expatriate Alien Card (not for short term tourists)... it could have a ID number that could be verified by computer entry into an online database... The BiB figures out fake Thai DLs - or do they?

and therein is a question... does it work in other countries ?, but which ones actually issue ID cards to people who are on 1 years approvals on visa's/extensions ?

I can see this in other countries for people who are working in that country for a period of time, but all other visa/extension groups ?

As regards the ID number/ on line data base thing, again nice idea, but if you get stopped in the street, not much access to an on line data base is there ?.... however having the PP on you or copy is almost instananeous proof

;Indeed, other countries do it. When I lived in South Korea, we were issued with an Alien Registration Card. Everyone had one. I am sure it is still the same. In my year there, I was never asked for identification by the authorites; however, this was all we had to carry. We certainly didn't need to carry our passports. We didn't do any silly reporting. The ARC was linked with the immigration database, and a cop could instantly reference the number to check your visa status and personal details. They look like this:

It's not exactly rocket science! I am sure Thailand could produce something similar if they wanted to. This would be a much more effective way of sorting this issue out. It would require a bit of work to execute

did u have to renew visas? your card was up todate at all times.folks living in thailand are not resident aliens, they are temporary residents and their status changes often due to reporting and extensions. there is absolutely no incentive for thailand to do this. what do they gain?

[AGareth2]

I don't think they care about our "problem"

[Soutpeel]

Phuket Gazette apparently allows linking, so here goes:

http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket-news/Phuket-begins-registering-illegal-migrant-workers/31272

That's fresh, BTW. Date of article is 22 July 2014.

I want me one of those

Yes -- interesting ... if Thailand wants these kinds of workers and allows issuance of ID cards to help make them legal ... then a similar card could be issued to Expats... or is anyone suggesting that we become third class citizens behind illegal workers... ? So issuance of ID cards can be done and is being done... Except legitimate LEGAL long stay Expats - here in Thailand on various kinds of legally acquired visas and extensions of stay ... who are required to produce a passport if an initial Thai DL and / or photocopies of the passport and relevant pages is not good enough...

Third Class Aliens Expats are... it seems.

Face it folks - a Legally Issued ID card referencing essential valid Passport and Visa info is a reasonable concept to ask to be available to Expats ... The real passport would always have to be produced -- but in many cases with a ID Card - it would never rise to that occasion. And the real passport could be kept - safely locked up - to be brought out for travel outside Thailand...

Well strictly speaking "expats" in Thailand in a 1 year turn around, even on WP's (which includes myself BTW) have "no class" in Thailand, We are not legal residents ie PR

I really dont know why people try and infer some form of legal residence status to long term "expats" in Thailand, we dont have have any, we are temporary residents thats all and the sooner people start understanding this the better.

[sumrit]

Just take a picture on your phone of your Passport photo page and stamp page. Job done.

Work Permit too.. why over complicate it.

Or carry your Thai Drivers license. Look now there is a reason to get one.

Easy to fiddle/fake.

What's to stop somebody taking a picture of their own photo page along with somebody else's extension of stay page etc?

They would only get caught if the police were suspicious and insisted on seeing the original passport.

[OJAS]

Immigration could get machines like what they use to make DL's.

Input the info in the computer, take photo, print on plastic card.

Update yearly the same time you do your extension.

The cost of the extension and ID card could be put on the same receipt.

Immigration already input the info into their computer and take your mug shot at annual extension of stay time in any event. However, I suspect that the final stage (print on plastic card) might prove easier said than done in view of the potential for fraud to which others have referred. I suspect that the security features which the card would need to include in order to minimise the fraud risk might make it prohibitively expensive - especially if it has to be renewed each year.

[chrisinth]

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Just take your passport to a copy shop and have them copy your photo page and latest extension stamp or visa have it reduced to business card/ credit card size, have it laminated. Photo page on one side and visa info on the back. Also very cheap to get done.

We all need to be aware that when you get a document copied, the copy machine scans the document into memory and then prints out from that memory. The information in memory is stored until it is bumped out of the memory, which could be many hundreds of pages. So giving this information to one of the dodgy shops on Kho San road (not that you said that, pmarlin) is tantamount to leaving your passport with them so they can make a fake. Copiers are so ubiquitous in our everyday lives that we tend to forget this.

Overlooked information by the masses, utilized by authorities and people with criminal agendas.

The above is a very valid point to those that have no thought or understanding where they make copies of their most private documents................

Not scaremongering, fact.

[pmarlin]

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Just take your passport to a copy shop and have them copy your photo page and latest extension stamp or visa have it reduced to business card/ credit card size, have it laminated. Photo page on one side and visa info on the back. Also very cheap to get done.

We all need to be aware that when you get a document copied, the copy machine scans the document into memory and then prints out from that memory. The information in memory is stored until it is bumped out of the memory, which could be many hundreds of pages. So giving this information to one of the dodgy shops on Kho San road (not that you said that, pmarlin) is tantamount to leaving your passport with them so they can make a fake. Copiers are so ubiquitous in our everyday lives that we tend to forget this.

Overlooked information by the masses, utilized by authorities and people with criminal agendas.

The above is a very valid point to those that have no thought or understanding where they make copies of their most private documents................

Not scaremongering, fact.

Check into a hotel, visit a hospital, open a bank account, set up your utilities for a condo, rent a condo. they all make a copy of your passport. You don't have an option.

[noahvail]

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Just take your passport to a copy shop and have them copy your photo page and latest extension stamp or visa have it reduced to business card/ credit card size, have it laminated. Photo page on one side and visa info on the back. Also very cheap to get done.

We all need to be aware that when you get a document copied, the copy machine scans the document into memory and then prints out from that memory. The information in memory is stored until it is bumped out of the memory, which could be many hundreds of pages. So giving this information to one of the dodgy shops on Kho San road (not that you said that, pmarlin) is tantamount to leaving your passport with them so they can make a fake. Copiers are so ubiquitous in our everyday lives that we tend to forget this.

Overlooked information by the masses, utilized by authorities and people with criminal agendas.

The above is a very valid point to those that have no thought or understanding where they make copies of their most private documents................

Not scaremongering, fact.

Check into a hotel, visit a hospital, open a bank account, set up your utilities for a condo, rent a condo. they all make a copy of your passport. You don't have an option.

All of what you say is true, of course. For reputable establishments, you generally don't have to worry, unless they have a rogue employee, which would be unusual. But I would go way out of my way to avoid the dodgy copy shops on Kho San road or even those across from the embassies. I usually make my copies at home from my all-in-one printer, that way I have control not only of the documents but also the memory, which I can erase.

[alocacoc]

It's not only about Kao San Road or create false documents based on copies. There are marketplaces on the net, where vendors sells copies of passports, utility bills, birth certifications and so on. With these documents criminals are able to open bank accounts, brokerage accounts, online casino accounts and so on to - for instance - transfer and laundering black money.

Edited August 2, 2014 by alocacoc

[chrisinth]

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Just take your passport to a copy shop and have them copy your photo page and latest extension stamp or visa have it reduced to business card/ credit card size, have it laminated. Photo page on one side and visa info on the back. Also very cheap to get done.

We all need to be aware that when you get a document copied, the copy machine scans the document into memory and then prints out from that memory. The information in memory is stored until it is bumped out of the memory, which could be many hundreds of pages. So giving this information to one of the dodgy shops on Kho San road (not that you said that, pmarlin) is tantamount to leaving your passport with them so they can make a fake. Copiers are so ubiquitous in our everyday lives that we tend to forget this.

Overlooked information by the masses, utilized by authorities and people with criminal agendas.

The above is a very valid point to those that have no thought or understanding where they make copies of their most private documents................

Not scaremongering, fact.

Check into a hotel, visit a hospital, open a bank account, set up your utilities for a condo, rent a condo. they all make a copy of your passport. You don't have an option.

This is of course true. Where nothing in life is a given, it would be hard to doubt the intentions of the people in the examples above. In fact doubtful they could retrieve the data from the printer memory,

But K. "Somchai's" corner shop where anything can be copied for 5 baht a sheet could be another matter entirely.

[noahvail]

Life is life, Thailand is Thailand, and there are very few guarantees anywhere in this world. So, you do the best you can to protect yourself without becoming paranoid about things. As the logo on my wife's cap says, "Act calmly and think logically."