Does Britain have a jihadi problem?

[7by7]

Quotes removed to comply with forum software and for clarity; the parts in bold were originally posted by me.

Only UK residents are entitled to full NHS treatment;

it is too easy for immigrants to subsequently bring in parents as residents and then they get free treatment, despite never having paid a penny tax themselves. scams like that are part of the reason the nhs is unnaffordable. i fail to see the reason for such largesse at the taxpayer's expense.

You, and all those of your mates who have made similar comments, obviously know absolutely nothing about the UK immigration rules; particularly how difficult, well nigh impossible, it is to get a settlement visa for an adult dependent relative.

Spend some time in the Visas forum, and have a read of the UK immigration rules.

but the government has tightened up this area.

i'll be happyt if it's more than lip service.

It is, as you would know if you paid any attention to current affairs in the UK.

Maybe you want the UK to return to the dark days when anyone who did not follow the official state religion was at best persecuted

lol. no, but i'd like to see a church in saudi before they can build a mosque in england.

So, as I asked before but you ignored, just because other countries don't have the same freedoms that the UK does, you want those freedoms abolished in the UK?

you do realise that a mosque is not necessary for the practice of islam, don't you? they can pray anywhere, so the lack of a dedicated building makes no difference to their ability to practice their religion, ie they still have religious freedom.

Mathew 18:20 "For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I among them.”

So, using your argument, Christians in Saudi don't need churches.

[dhream]

Ask your mate thaibeachlovers; he raised the issue!

He's not my mate, so why did you feel the need to reply to an off topic post? How about on topic issues such as how you think the Koran and life of the prophet get twisted, or otherwise by UK jihadists? and some suggestions about how to combat it?

I am leaving this topic, but I hope most of you are decent blokes, and all my argument has been all along is for a bit of humanity. And acceptance of what you can't change in the UK i.e don't descend into their totalitarian thinking.

And that while i do agree the west should not bend over backwards for these people, for example, I strongly support France banning a lot of muslim daftness like the full burqua, and quite right! It is France not bloody Saudi!

The UK may have been a 'soft touch' at one point but that is ending.

Lets not forget, we have a a responsibility as 'civilised' people to help others, and we'd hope for the same from our 'neighbours', if say, the UK was nuked, and we had to leave and be refugees in another country.

The Daily Fail paper is on historic record as being a fascist rag before WW2, and not much has changed, there are fascists here posting, they love hate, fear, and hysteria, it's the gate through which they access power, and then use these same terrors to crush us all, like the Jihadists, they are just as dangerous. Even more-so, since they look and act and sound and value much of what we all do, and mount seemingly powerful emotive arguments, based on extrapolating the deeds of Muslim criminals and nutters to whip up even more fear and demoralisation among their own kind. But the remarks often lack any actual facts to back them up, or are so twisted and amplified that they fail to pass rational muster, and that's where it falls apart for the reasonable man.

These are vile men of low human stature, and would take us back to the days of burning at the stake given half the chance. They call reasonable people apologists. Why would any reasonable western person apologise for the insanity that passes for what many muslims call 'law' I have no idea. It simply suits their warped worldview of fear and hate and totalitarianism, so why bother with reality?

Another reason I'm leaving the debate. Also, the standard of 'truth' here is so bad that when somebody actually posted a true story, not outright lies (my own posts were even twisted as a moderator has said, and no i did not go running to any mod, i can handle myself, thanks!)

I refused at first to believe it an actual true story thanks to the other lies and rubbish posted earlier, and if that is the quality of your debate, its just delusional and irrational, see a doctor, seriously.

We will prevail over jihad, they are effective at winding us up, and they swept through Iraq causing a panic, but they are ragtag, and lack cohesion even among themselves. The Iraqi army are likely no more than 'security guards' at this point, with fancy shooters. Most of their elite were dispatched during the invasions over the years. IS are a worry, but they are no Waffen SS, and we will wipe the floor with them.

Immigration is certainly part of the issue here, but it is being used by certain elements to push their hate agenda agenda.

If you clam to be 'superior' to them (not hard really, they are a lot of savages to be quite frank, in the main) then start acting like it. It's annoying to be called 'liberal' just for acting like a human being should, with intelligence and pragmatism and a little compassion.

Since that's the level of debate, good luck to you all, because if you can't find your peace in modern Britain, or leave for pastures new (Thailand etc.) you're going to die sad bitter old men. I'll see you all on the more 'rational' discussion threads. Cheers.

Edited September 24, 2014 by dhream

[7by7]

Maybe not your personal mate, but certainly so in this topic.

Why did you feel the need to comment on an off topic post in such a way as to make it seem that another person had raised the issue?

How about on topic issues such as how you think the Koran and life of the prophet get twisted, or otherwise by UK jihadists? and some suggestions about how to combat it?

I have done so many times; always dismissed by you and your mates as 'apologist, excuses or diversions.'

Really on this thread? must have missed it can you post the links?, the topic is the influence of the Koran and life of the Prophet on UK jihadists and how to combat this threat.

I am tempted to give the same reply I'm given whenever I ask for links to posts where I have been accused of saying something I didn't; i.e. ignore it.

But unlike you many of your mates here, I do try to answer questions put to me.

So, I will link to them.

But only after you answer the question above which you have ignored:

Why did you feel the need to comment on an off topic post in such a way as to make it seem that another person had raised the issue?

[Ulysses G.]

Another reason I'm leaving the debate. Also, the standard of 'truth' here is so bad that when somebody actually posted a true story, not outright lies (my own posts were even twisted as a moderator has said, and no i did not go running to any mod, i can handle myself, thanks!)

I refused at first to believe it an actual true story thanks to the other lies and rubbish posted ealier, and if that is the quality of your debate, its just delusional and irrational, see a doctor, seriously.

Edited September 24, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[jacky54]

So, I will link to them.

Please do so without playing games, in this thread

[jacky54]

you're going to die sad bitter old men.

Well as long as the Jihadist's do not cut our heads off first of course, bye then

[jacky54]

So, I will link to them.

when tomorrow, next week?

[simple1]

Maybe not your personal mate, but certainly so in this topic.

Why did you feel the need to comment on an off topic post in such a way as to make it seem that another person had raised the issue?

How about on topic issues such as how you think the Koran and life of the prophet get twisted, or otherwise by UK jihadists? and some suggestions about how to combat it?

I have done so many times; always dismissed by you and your mates as 'apologist, excuses or diversions.'

Really on this thread? must have missed it can you post the links?, the topic is the influence of the Koran and life of the Prophet on UK jihadists and how to combat this threat.

Rather than constantly trying to attack posters, how about being constructive? A good step in the right direction would be post one original thought from you, the expert on the Koran & Jihadist ideology, that has not been covered ad infinitum in the public domain or on TV.

Edited September 24, 2014 by simple1

[dhream]

you're going to die sad bitter old men.

Well as long as the Jihadist's do not cut our heads off first of course, bye then

Would we notice any difference in your thinking without one? Probably not! byeee!

[jacky54]

Maybe not your personal mate, but certainly so in this topic.

Why did you feel the need to comment on an off topic post in such a way as to make it seem that another person had raised the issue?

How about on topic issues such as how you think the Koran and life of the prophet get twisted, or otherwise by UK jihadists? and some suggestions about how to combat it?

I have done so many times; always dismissed by you and your mates as 'apologist, excuses or diversions.'

Really on this thread? must have missed it can you post the links?, the topic is the influence of the Koran and life of the Prophet on UK jihadists and how to combat this threat.

Rather than constantly trying to attack posters, how about being constructive? A good step in the right direction would be post one original thought from you, the expert on the Koran & Jihadist ideology, that has not been covered ad infinitum in the public domain or on TV.

Asking for supposed links is not 'attacking' a poster. As far as i have seen the only people suggesting measures to combat jihad in the UK have been the anti islamists, no that's not 'haters' just people opposed to it. These included exclusion of hate preaching Imams, closing down Schools and Mosques preaching division and violence, banning of more jihadist groups and other things. About time we heard from the the apologist group, or should I say duo.

Edited September 24, 2014 by jacky54

[dhream]

Another reason I'm leaving the debate. Also, the standard of 'truth' here is so bad that when somebody actually posted a true story, not outright lies (my own posts were even twisted as a moderator has said, and no i did not go running to any mod, i can handle myself, thanks!)

I refused at first to believe it an actual true story thanks to the other lies and rubbish posted ealier, and if that is the quality of your debate, its just delusional and irrational, see a doctor, seriously.

It's the age old boy crying wolf. When a realy shocking true story comes along the impact is lessened or discounted, thanks to constant lies and hysteria that are not based on evidence. You don't need to go overboard with the Muslims, they do a great job on their own. Ironic that when facists do go overboard, theyre too daft to see that their precious credibilty (vital to wage a propaganda campign) drains away.

I see none of you even have the good grace to acknowledge the points we do share with you about Muslim extremists, which is ALL of it! Clearly, you don't even read the points of view of your opponents then. And theres, none so blind as will not see. I'm simply against using the Jihad issue to propagate hatred, there's enough of it coming of them without British folk getting on the bandwagon, you demean our race, and become like them! OK thats the last word, good luck with it all, princesses.

Edited September 24, 2014 by dhream

[transam]

Another reason I'm leaving the debate. Also, the standard of 'truth' here is so bad that when somebody actually posted a true story, not outright lies (my own posts were even twisted as a moderator has said, and no i did not go running to any mod, i can handle myself, thanks!)

I refused at first to believe it an actual true story thanks to the other lies and rubbish posted ealier, and if that is the quality of your debate, its just delusional and irrational, see a doctor, seriously.

It's the age old boy crying wolf. When a realy shocking true story comes along the impact is lessened or discounted, thanks to constant lies and hysteria that are not based on evidence. You don't need to go overboard with the Muslims, they do a great job on their own. Ironic that when facists do go overboard, theyre too daft to see that their precious credibilty (vital to wage a propaganda campign) drains away.

I see none of you even have the good grace to acknowledge the points we do share with you about Muslim extremists, which is ALL of it! Clearly, you don't even read the points of view of your opponents then. And theres, none so blind as will not see. I'm simply against using the Jihad issue to propagate hatred, there's enough of it coming of them without British folk getting on the bandwagon, you demean our race, and become like them! OK thats the last word, good luck with it all, princesses.

Thank gawd for that.......Adios...............

[H1w4yR1da]

Would we notice any difference in your thinking without one? Probably not! byeee!

Not only a liberal but a bitchy one at that.

Good riddance!

OK thats the last word, good luck with it all, princesses.

Are you sure this time?

No more bitchy posts?

Excellent!

So how many more Muslims do we have left on this thread?

Edited September 24, 2014 by H1w4yR1da

[jacky54]

Well the apologists (2 left) seem to be all mouth and no trousers when it comes to what motivates jihad in the UK and how to combat it, tick tock.

[JDGRUEN]

I see this Topic Thread go by when perusing the Forum ... and I wonder - and ponder --- I believe that while the U.K. - England in particular - has a a very real Jihadi problem ... But it is more than that. The more significant problem in England is the "Jihadi Denier Syndrome".... that is - English people - English citizens - and most especially English Politicians who refuse to see the reality of the takeover of their country and culture by Islamist and their common Muslim blind followers.

"Jihadi Denier Syndrome" - Are those afflicted in England who can see direct evidence of the Islamic migratory takeover of their country and culture and yet deny that it is happening - Because it is happening in Slow Motion ... A decade or two and Britain as we know it - will no longer exist ... Britain will become an Islamic controlled state with majority law being Sharia ... BUT -- English Political Leaders and the majority of its citizens are BLIND to the fact..

[Steely Dan]

40% of UK Muslims want Sharia law, which however you dress it up is incompatible with democracy.

40% of 500 people surveyed in a 2006 poll!

Not very representative.

It is also obviously also incompatible with the Universal declaration of human rights, which explains why no Country governed by Sharia has signed up to this declaration.
Really?

Check the list of signatory countries; facts never have been your strong point.

And Taqiyya is certainly yours. As you are no doubt aware, but omit to mention Muslim countries retreated from the implementation of the UNDR and an Islamic declaration of human rights (sic) in 1981. The Cairo declaration, as it became known is Sharia compliant and hence anything but universal. Still the UNDR is under attack in Europe with many jurisdictions deferring to Sharia in order to basically pander to Islamic religious conservatives, as the article below demonstrates.

http://www.rferl.org/content/Islams_Challenges_To_Universal_Human_Rights/1357912.html

Edited September 25, 2014 by Scott

[chuckd]

People have religious freedom in the UK because the UK is a democracy with rights that have been fought for over many centuries.

Perhaps I am confused, but when did the UK change from a Monarchy to a democracy?

Are you serious? If so, your ignorance astounds me.

In case you really are that ignorant, I'll explain.

The UK is a constitutional monarchy; in which the monarch has no real power and has to do what the elected government and Parliament tell her.

Even down to the giving of peerages, knighthoods and other honours; she doesn't choose, she has to give them to whoever the prime Minister tells her to.

The process towards this started a long time ago; one of the first steps being the signing of the Magna Carta in 1215.

How many Democracies have monarchs?

Your continual use of what you might consider biting sarcasm does you no favors. Most people consider that merely bad manners.

1. Constitutional Monarchy:

Variant of monarchy; a system of governance that has a monarch, but one whose powers are limited by law or by a formal constitution, such as that in the United Kingdom.[12][13]"

2. Democracy:

"Rule by a government chosen by election where most of the populace are enfranchised. The key distinction between a democracy and other forms of constitutional government is usually taken to be that the right to vote is not limited by a person's wealth or race (the main qualification for enfranchisement is usually having reached a certain age). A democratic government is, therefore, one supported (at least at the time of the election) by a majority of the populace (provided the election was held fairly). A "majority" may be defined in different ways. There are many "power-sharing" (usually in countries where people mainly identify themselves by race or religion) or "electoral-college" or "constituency" systems where the government is not chosen by a simple one-vote-per-person headcount."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government

[Richard W]

How many Democracies have monarchs?

There are quite a few, even if you exclude countries sharing a monarch with the UK. To name a few secure ones:

UK, Norway, Sweden, Denmark (1 or 3?), Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg

Perhaps less secure:

Spain, Japan

Intermittently:

Thailand

This list is not exhaustive.

[simple1]

Rather than constantly trying to attack posters, how about being constructive? A good step in the right direction would be post one original thought from you, the expert on the Koran & Jihadist ideology, that has not been covered ad infinitum in the public domain or on TV.

Asking for supposed links is not 'attacking' a poster. As far as i have seen the only people suggesting measures to combat jihad in the UK have been the anti islamists, no that's not 'haters' just people opposed to it. These included exclusion of hate preaching Imams, closing down Schools and Mosques preaching division and violence, banning of more jihadist groups and other things. About time we heard from the the apologist group, or should I say duo.

Posts removed to permit reply.

Why do you expect meaningful reply when all you do is repeat the same insult with nothing new to say.

Putting aside the use of force in Iraq / Syria, the only way to contain or minimise the the threat of Jihadist ideology in our homeland societies is via appropriate legislation and education.

[jacky54]

Rather than constantly trying to attack posters, how about being constructive? A good step in the right direction would be post one original thought from you, the expert on the Koran & Jihadist ideology, that has not been covered ad infinitum in the public domain or on TV.

Asking for supposed links is not 'attacking' a poster. As far as i have seen the only people suggesting measures to combat jihad in the UK have been the anti islamists, no that's not 'haters' just people opposed to it. These included exclusion of hate preaching Imams, closing down Schools and Mosques preaching division and violence, banning of more jihadist groups and other things. About time we heard from the the apologist group, or should I say duo.

Posts removed to permit reply.

Why do you expect meaningful reply when all you do is repeat the same insult with nothing new to say.

Putting aside the use of force in Iraq / Syria, the only way to contain or minimise the the threat of Jihadist ideology in our homeland societies is via appropriate legislation and education.

Sorry can you point out the 'insults' apart from accurately describing two as apologists? So are you partly blaming western reaction to the totally evil Isis for UK jihadists? and just what legislation would you like to see to combat this madness in the UK?. Education yes but not the divisive independent Islamic hate Schools, they have to go along with non ofsted inspections. islamic education is not 'appropriate' in a western democracy as they only teach isolation, division and religious supremacy.

[Scott]

I think we can dispense with the discussion of the role of democracy in a monarchy and I think we can dispense with the nasty remarks being made to other posters. The topic is about Jihad and Britain. If you have nothing to add to the topic, then please post elsewhere. There are numerous threads on related issues.

Your cooperation is appreciated in keeping the thread on track.

[submaniac]

You and the other mods have demonstrated a great deal of tolerance on this thread. Good work.

[jacky54]

still waiting for 7x7 links for his ideas about combating UK Jihadists he claims he posted on this thread, must be a long list!

[jacky54]

some good news, one of the worst hate preachers in the UK arrested, at last, que the he is not a real Muslim comments!

BREAKING NEWS: Radical preacher Anjem Choudary is one of nine men arrested by counter-terror police in London on suspicion of encouraging terrorism

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2769098/BREAKING-NEWS-Nine-men-arrested-counter-terror-police-London-suspicion-encouraging-terrorism.html

Edited September 25, 2014 by jacky54

[JockPieandBeans]

I see this Topic Thread go by when perusing the Forum ... and I wonder - and ponder --- I believe that while the U.K. - England in particular - has a a very real Jihadi problem ... But it is more than that. The more significant problem in England is the "Jihadi Denier Syndrome".... that is - English people - English citizens - and most especially English Politicians who refuse to see the reality of the takeover of their country and culture by Islamist and their common Muslim blind followers.

"Jihadi Denier Syndrome" - Are those afflicted in England who can see direct evidence of the Islamic migratory takeover of their country and culture and yet deny that it is happening - Because it is happening in Slow Motion ... A decade or two and Britain as we know it - will no longer exist ... Britain will become an Islamic controlled state with majority law being Sharia ... BUT -- English Political Leaders and the majority of its citizens are BLIND to the fact..

JDGRUEN

It is unfair to lay the blame at the hands of English People / Citizens.

The normal, everyday, down to earth person has been voicing their concerns for over 20 years. To be continually shouted down by every group known to man, including Politicians.

They were branded racists, Islamophobes and all sorts of other nasty names.

This is laid firmly at the door of Politicians.

[JockPieandBeans]

some good news, one of the worst hate preachers in the UK arrested, at last, que the he is not a real Muslim comments!

BREAKING NEWS: Radical preacher Anjem Choudary is one of nine men arrested by counter-terror police in London on suspicion of encouraging terrorism

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2769098/BREAKING-NEWS-Nine-men-arrested-counter-terror-police-London-suspicion-encouraging-terrorism.html

He should have disappeared a long time ago.

Right after his 1st visit to Wootton Bassett would have been the ideal opportunity.

[JDGRUEN]

I see this Topic Thread go by when perusing the Forum ... and I wonder - and ponder --- I believe that while the U.K. - England in particular - has a a very real Jihadi problem ... But it is more than that. The more significant problem in England is the "Jihadi Denier Syndrome".... that is - English people - English citizens - and most especially English Politicians who refuse to see the reality of the takeover of their country and culture by Islamist and their common Muslim blind followers.

"Jihadi Denier Syndrome" - Are those afflicted in England who can see direct evidence of the Islamic migratory takeover of their country and culture and yet deny that it is happening - Because it is happening in Slow Motion ... A decade or two and Britain as we know it - will no longer exist ... Britain will become an Islamic controlled state with majority law being Sharia ... BUT -- English Political Leaders and the majority of its citizens are BLIND to the fact..

JDGRUEN

It is unfair to lay the blame at the hands of English People / Citizens.

The normal, everyday, down to earth person has been voicing their concerns for over 20 years. To be continually shouted down by every group known to man, including Politicians.

They were branded racists, Islamophobes and all sorts of other nasty names.

This is laid firmly at the door of Politicians.

Yes - but same as we Americans who hate the Illegal Alien invasion from Central America - yet while we whine and moan - we do nothing directly about it ... except to complain.

[JockPieandBeans]

I see this Topic Thread go by when perusing the Forum ... and I wonder - and ponder --- I believe that while the U.K. - England in particular - has a a very real Jihadi problem ... But it is more than that. The more significant problem in England is the "Jihadi Denier Syndrome".... that is - English people - English citizens - and most especially English Politicians who refuse to see the reality of the takeover of their country and culture by Islamist and their common Muslim blind followers.

"Jihadi Denier Syndrome" - Are those afflicted in England who can see direct evidence of the Islamic migratory takeover of their country and culture and yet deny that it is happening - Because it is happening in Slow Motion ... A decade or two and Britain as we know it - will no longer exist ... Britain will become an Islamic controlled state with majority law being Sharia ... BUT -- English Political Leaders and the majority of its citizens are BLIND to the fact..

JDGRUEN

It is unfair to lay the blame at the hands of English People / Citizens.

The normal, everyday, down to earth person has been voicing their concerns for over 20 years. To be continually shouted down by every group known to man, including Politicians.

They were branded racists, Islamophobes and all sorts of other nasty names.

This is laid firmly at the door of Politicians.

Yes - but same as we Americans who hate the Illegal Alien invasion from Central America - yet while we whine and moan - we do nothing directly about it ... except to complain.

When you are continually shouted down by all and sundry, for voicing your opinion it does not really leave you a lot of options.

The only effective option, does not really bear thinking about. Finally, for various reasons, British Politicians APPEAR to have woken up to reality.

Can they actually do anything ? Personally, I doubt it. But it would be in their best interest to extract their collective finger, and start doing something.

Doing nothing, is not an option.

[7by7]

still waiting for 7x7 links for his ideas about combating UK Jihadists he claims he posted on this thread, must be a long list!

Two things;

1) As I have a life, family and job I can't spend 24/7 on this forum; unlike, it seems, some people.

2) I will, as soon as you answer my question.

[7by7]

Well the apologists (2 left) seem to be all mouth and no trousers when it comes to what motivates jihad in the UK and how to combat it, tick tock.

Who are these apologists?

I have not seen a single post in this topic or any other from any one apologising for, excusing, justifying or in any other way supporting Islamic extremism, jihadism, terrorism etc.