Does Britain have a jihadi problem?

[CBR250]

The Muslim Council of Britain have regularly condemned extremists; including Anjem Choudary.

Oh dear you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf peace, have you never heard of taqiya? Muslims are allowed to lie when they are in a minority to promote their cause and to smooth things over. Why have you brought Jews into this thread, it has nothing to do with them. From the religion of 'peace'.com site

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances,taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.

And there is a third form to deal with non-believers, called ISIS, that's when they don't need to lie to anyone anymore....555555 (j/k)

And you think this topic of beheadings and murder of innocents is funny? You are one sick puppy.

Edited August 30, 2014 by CBR250

[chuckd]

We may get a chance to see exactly how effective this Muslim Council of Britain is in real practice.

King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia made a rather dire prediction that may have impacts on many of us.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Saudi king warns West will be jihadists' next target

AFP

Jeddah (Saudi Arabia) (AFP) - King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia has warned that the West will be the next target of the jihadists sweeping through Syria and Iraq, unless there is "rapid" action.

"If we ignore them, I am sure they will reach Europe in a month and America in another month," he said in remarks quoted on Saturday by Asharq al-Awsat daily and Saudi-backed Al-Arabiya television station.

"Terrorism knows no border and its danger could affect several countries outside the Middle East," said the king who was speaking at a welcoming ceremony on Friday for new ambassadors, including a new envoy from Saudi ally the United States.

Entire article here: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://news.yahoo.com/saudi-king-warns-west-jihadists-next-target-093701543.html

[MJP]

We may get a chance to see exactly how effective this Muslim Council of Britain is in real practice.

King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia made a rather dire prediction that may have impacts on many of us.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Saudi king warns West will be jihadists' next target

AFP

Jeddah (Saudi Arabia) (AFP) - King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia has warned that the West will be the next target of the jihadists sweeping through Syria and Iraq, unless there is "rapid" action.

"If we ignore them, I am sure they will reach Europe in a month and America in another month," he said in remarks quoted on Saturday by Asharq al-Awsat daily and Saudi-backed Al-Arabiya television station.

"Terrorism knows no border and its danger could affect several countries outside the Middle East," said the king who was speaking at a welcoming ceremony on Friday for new ambassadors, including a new envoy from Saudi ally the United States.

Entire article here: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://news.yahoo.com/saudi-king-warns-west-jihadists-next-target-093701543.html

I think what he's really saying is within a month IS will be sweeping through Saudi Arabia and him and his own bunch of thieving murderous scum will be high tailing out of there. Probably to the safety of Chelsea.

[dr_lucas]

The Muslim Council of Britain have regularly condemned extremists; including Anjem Choudary.

Oh dear you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf peace, have you never heard of taqiya? Muslims are allowed to lie when they are in a minority to promote their cause and to smooth things over. Why have you brought Jews into this thread, it has nothing to do with them. From the religion of 'peace'.com site

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances,taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.

And there is a third form to deal with non-believers, called ISIS, that's when they don't need to lie to anyone anymore....555555 (j/k)

And you think this topic of beheadings and murder of innocents is funny? You are one sick puppy.

The beheading and murder of innocents is sickening. So is your twist & flame attempt.

Edited August 30, 2014 by dr_lucas

[dr_lucas]

The Muslim Council of Britain have regularly condemned extremists; including Anjem Choudary.

Oh dear you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf peace, have you never heard of taqiya? Muslims are allowed to lie when they are in a minority to promote their cause and to smooth things over. Why have you brought Jews into this thread, it has nothing to do with them. From the religion of 'peace'.com site

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances,taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.

Actually, the western culture teaches the use of lying to "smooth over differences" and practices a variety of approved forms of lying as well. Ever heard of "the little white lie"? And what is the acceptable answer when your wife asks "Does my bum look too big in this"? Or, more seriously, what does the physician say when confronted by the question:"So, is it terminal doc? How long have I got?"

Clearly your post infers that you are indeed a knowledgeable student of Islam - and as I am not, perhaps you would be so kind as to refer me to the section of the Quran where it says lying is approved under those circumstances that:

"typically .. advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them".

This seems very odd to me, however in deference to your scholarship, I will of course scrutinise the source you provide with care.

What does the Quran got to do with his post? None of these terms is mentioned in the Quran, yet these are well known Islamic terms.

If you want to educate yourself, Google instead of patronizing.

[dr_lucas]

The face of Islammism in the UK,have the Muslim council routinely spoken out against this man?, what are your views 7x7 and simple1? let me guess, he's not a real Muslim and the majority of Muslims disagree with him. Well a lot of them do and he wants to ban gays, the Queen, booze, gambling, pornography, and pop music,sounds like a lot of fun!

@Jacky54, I'd like to point out that while there are indeed extremists everywhere, you must bear in mind that there are also peace loving, good people in every religion, including Islam.

Nobody should generalize. I know you didn't, but it's important to remember this.

Personally, I think religions should not be part of this world in the 21st century. Radical religious beliefs cause nothing but problems everywhere.

We are all born equal, despite what anyone else wants to believe.

[CBR250]

Actually, the western culture teaches the use of lying to "smooth over differences" and practices a variety of approved forms of lying as well. Ever heard of "the little white lie"? And what is the acceptable answer when your wife asks "Does my bum look too big in this"? Or, more seriously, what does the physician say when confronted by the question:"So, is it terminal doc? How long have I got?"

Oh dear you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf peace, have you never heard of taqiya? Muslims are allowed to lie when they are in a minority to promote their cause and to smooth things over. Why have you brought Jews into this thread, it has nothing to do with them. From the religion of 'peace'.com site

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances,taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.

Clearly your post infers that you are indeed a knowledgeable student of Islam - and as I am not, perhaps you would be so kind as to refer me to the section of the Quran where it says lying is approved under those circumstances that:

"typically .. advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them".

This seems very odd to me, however in deference to your scholarship, I will of course scrutinise the source you provide with care.

What does the Quran got to do with his post? None of these terms is mentioned in the Quran, yet these are well known Islamic terms.

If you want to educate yourself, Google instead of patronizing.

Not in the Quran? But I can find it on Google????

Well, that means your "source" is in the same category as an article somewhere between the pictures in Playboy.

[Scott]

Defamatory posts deleted,

[CBR250]

And there is a third form to deal with non-believers, called ISIS, that's when they don't need to lie to anyone anymore....555555 (j/k)

And you think this topic of beheadings and murder of innocents is funny? You are one sick puppy.

The beheading and murder of innocents is sickening. So is your twist & flame attempt.

No twist. No flame. If you look back, it was you who wrote "555555" on a thread that concerns barbaric behaviours including beheadings and murder. I offered an observation that is a valid response to your attempt to trivialise this topic. I believe many people on TV will find your attempt at humour pathetic.

Edited August 30, 2014 by CBR250

[dr_lucas]

And there is a third form to deal with non-believers, called ISIS, that's when they don't need to lie to anyone anymore....555555 (j/k)

And you think this topic of beheadings and murder of innocents is funny? You are one sick puppy.

The beheading and murder of innocents is sickening. So is your twist & flame attempt.

No twist. No flame. If you look back, it was you who wrote "555555" on a thread that concerns barbaric behaviours including beheadings and murder. I offered an observation that is a valid response to your attempt to trivialise this topic. I believe many people on TV will find your attempt at humour pathetic.

Yes, Twist & Flame. After all, you are always looking for an opportunity.

There is something called "black humor" in the world. Maybe you have never heard of it, or your fragile heart easily gets "offended" by it, but it exists.

Watch out, it is very common and while some people may dislike it, others do like it.

[dr_lucas]

Actually, the western culture teaches the use of lying to "smooth over differences" and practices a variety of approved forms of lying as well. Ever heard of "the little white lie"? And what is the acceptable answer when your wife asks "Does my bum look too big in this"? Or, more seriously, what does the physician say when confronted by the question:"So, is it terminal doc? How long have I got?"

Oh dear you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf peace, have you never heard of taqiya? Muslims are allowed to lie when they are in a minority to promote their cause and to smooth things over. Why have you brought Jews into this thread, it has nothing to do with them. From the religion of 'peace'.com site

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances,taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.

Clearly your post infers that you are indeed a knowledgeable student of Islam - and as I am not, perhaps you would be so kind as to refer me to the section of the Quran where it says lying is approved under those circumstances that:

"typically .. advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them".

This seems very odd to me, however in deference to your scholarship, I will of course scrutinise the source you provide with care.

What does the Quran got to do with his post? None of these terms is mentioned in the Quran, yet these are well known Islamic terms.

If you want to educate yourself, Google instead of patronizing.

Not in the Quran? But I can find it on Google????

Well, that means your "source" is in the same category as an article somewhere between the pictures in Playboy.

So from your post am I to understand that:

- Searching for information in Google equals Playboy articles.

- The Quran is the only thing Muslims follow

Correct?

[simple1]

Even an apologist like Cameron now admits Islamic Jihad in the UK is a major threat, simple1 and 7x7 seem to think this is all wrong and just prejudice, and 'hate'.

Again false accusations. Not once have I said the presence of Islamic extremists in the UK are not a threat to UK national security; in fact I have agreed they are. Not once have I indicated I believe the policies of HM Govt and the security forces response to identified Islamic extremists and their supporters are "wrong and just prejudice, and 'hate'. I believe the same applies to 7x7 within this topic.

I suppose it's too much to expect a retraction. I would assume those who 'like' your inflamatory, false accusations will not 'like' your apology.

Edited August 30, 2014 by simple1

[thaibeachlovers]

Does Britain have a jihad problem? Doesn't nearly every single place on earth have a jihad problem?

Not in the same way that Britain has.

Britain has joined with the EU and no longer controls is sovereign borders nor does it make immigration policy. The wackos can waltz in, get benefits, fail to assimilate, and it's actually perfectly legal for them to do it.

Next they start demanding that Britain change for them rather than the other way around. They manage to lay a guilt trip on anyone who criticizes them.

The Jihadists are dangerous. They will increasingly put Britain in danger, yet it's improper to speak out against all of it.

The British nationals are helpless to stop it. They have their PC government favoring outsiders, EU rules to follow, and the citizens aren't armed, if it comes to that. They have become completely impotent against a growing threat.

I still think Britain is the greatest country on Earth, for several reasons. It has been in all of modern history.

I just can't believe they'd let it come to this and I hope they can find reverse gear.

The wacko's NS are the grandchildren of the immigrants the UK imported to run the woolen and cotton mills in the north of England in the 1950's/1960's, in exchange for their labor we allowed them to become citizens and the law at that time and subsequently allowed them to bring their families over to join them.

The UK textile industry became so reliant on Indian and Pakistani labor that during the 1965 war between those two countries, 80% of the workforce went back home to fight for their respective countries, the woolen and cotton industry almost ground to a halt as a result.

Despite the country's reliance on that labor force, immigrants were always treated as second class citizens, today they have built city wide communities and their grandchildren have not forgotten the past and they continue to be treated as second class citizens.

This is not a European Parliament issue, this is a legacy UK issue that has come back to haunt.

I know these things because my father owned a textile mill in Batley, as a young lad I would sometimes join dad on his Saturday morning visit to the mill where he would, I'm ashamed to say, bark at the immigrant workforce, the disrespect was plain to see and it's still there amongst many people in much of the UK.

Mosha, am I right or not?

Like the Saudis or not, their "guest worker" policy is sane, unlike the western models that allow overseas workers to gain citizenship after a few years and bring their entire family over, including elderly parents that, despite never paying a penny into the economy in tax, become entitled to free health service ( eg NHS ), and benefits costing the country millions in money.

The Saudis, being sensible people, allow "guest workers" to only be in the country as long as they have a job, and when retired or the job finishes they go back to their own country.

[Steely Dan]

Actually, the western culture teaches the use of lying to "smooth over differences" and practices a variety of approved forms of lying as well. Ever heard of "the little white lie"? And what is the acceptable answer when your wife asks "Does my bum look too big in this"? Or, more seriously, what does the physician say when confronted by the question:"So, is it terminal doc? How long have I got?"

Oh dear you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf peace, have you never heard of taqiya? Muslims are allowed to lie when they are in a minority to promote their cause and to smooth things over. Why have you brought Jews into this thread, it has nothing to do with them. From the religion of 'peace'.com site

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances,taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.

Clearly your post infers that you are indeed a knowledgeable student of Islam - and as I am not, perhaps you would be so kind as to refer me to the section of the Quran where it says lying is approved under those circumstances that:

"typically .. advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them".

This seems very odd to me, however in deference to your scholarship, I will of course scrutinise the source you provide with care.

What does the Quran got to do with his post? None of these terms is mentioned in the Quran, yet these are well known Islamic terms.

If you want to educate yourself, Google instead of patronizing.

Not in the Quran? But I can find it on Google????

Well, that means your "source" is in the same category as an article somewhere between the pictures in Playboy.

So from your post am I to understand that:

- Searching for information in Google equals Playboy articles.

- The Quran is the only thing Muslims follow

Correct?

Aren't you forgetting Mein Kampf and The protocols of the Elders of Zion?

Surah 3:28 by the way.

http://www.answeringmuslims.com/2011/09/no-taqiyya-in-islam.html

Edited August 31, 2014 by Steely Dan

[thaibeachlovers]

Actually, the western culture teaches the use of lying to "smooth over differences" and practices a variety of approved forms of lying as well. Ever heard of "the little white lie"? And what is the acceptable answer when your wife asks "Does my bum look too big in this"? Or, more seriously, what does the physician say when confronted by the question:"So, is it terminal doc? How long have I got?"

Oh dear you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf peace, have you never heard of taqiya? Muslims are allowed to lie when they are in a minority to promote their cause and to smooth things over. Why have you brought Jews into this thread, it has nothing to do with them. From the religion of 'peace'.com site

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances,taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.

Clearly your post infers that you are indeed a knowledgeable student of Islam - and as I am not, perhaps you would be so kind as to refer me to the section of the Quran where it says lying is approved under those circumstances that:

"typically .. advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them".

This seems very odd to me, however in deference to your scholarship, I will of course scrutinise the source you provide with care.

What does the Quran got to do with his post? None of these terms is mentioned in the Quran, yet these are well known Islamic terms.

If you want to educate yourself, Google instead of patronizing.

Not in the Quran? But I can find it on Google????

Well, that means your "source" is in the same category as an article somewhere between the pictures in Playboy.

So from your post am I to understand that:

- Searching for information in Google equals Playboy articles.

- The Quran is the only thing Muslims follow

Correct?

It is unfortunate that Muslims don't only follow the Koran. The hadiths were written by the usual crowd of religious men seeking to impose their beliefs on the people and justify whatever they chose to believe, just as the Bible can be interpreted to mean anything you want it to.

It is from the hadiths that the extremists find the justification for all their evil deeds.

The Saudi religious police even found something in the hadiths to stop women driving motorcars, even though cars were not even thought of back then, and one of the Prophet's wives was a camel owner/ driver.

[7by7]

Actually, the western culture teaches the use of lying to "smooth over differences" and practices a variety of approved forms of lying as well. Ever heard of "the little white lie"? And what is the acceptable answer when your wife asks "Does my bum look too big in this"? Or, more seriously, what does the physician say when confronted by the question:"So, is it terminal doc? How long have I got?"

Oh dear you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf peace, have you never heard of taqiya? Muslims are allowed to lie when they are in a minority to promote their cause and to smooth things over. Why have you brought Jews into this thread, it has nothing to do with them. From the religion of 'peace'.com site

Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."

There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances,taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.

Clearly your post infers that you are indeed a knowledgeable student of Islam - and as I am not, perhaps you would be so kind as to refer me to the section of the Quran where it says lying is approved under those circumstances that:

"typically .. advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them".

This seems very odd to me, however in deference to your scholarship, I will of course scrutinise the source you provide with care.

What does the Quran got to do with his post? None of these terms is mentioned in the Quran, yet these are well known Islamic terms.

If you want to educate yourself, Google instead of patronizing.

Not in the Quran? But I can find it on Google????

Well, that means your "source" is in the same category as an article somewhere between the pictures in Playboy.

So from your post am I to understand that:

- Searching for information in Google equals Playboy articles.

- The Quran is the only thing Muslims follow

Correct?

To be fair, CBR250, the original post did name the source, though no link was provided. He said "From the religion of 'peace'.com site," which is a well known Islamaphobic site; as reading their 'about us' page will show.

So, like you, I would like to be told where in Islamic writings that quote originated.

[simple1]

What does the Quran got to do with his post? None of these terms is mentioned in the Quran, yet these are well known Islamic terms.

If you want to educate yourself, Google instead of patronizing.

Not in the Quran? But I can find it on Google????

Well, that means your "source" is in the same category as an article somewhere between the pictures in Playboy.

So from your post am I to understand that:

- Searching for information in Google equals Playboy articles.

- The Quran is the only thing Muslims follow

Correct?

To be fair, CBR250, the original post did name the source, though no link was provided. He said "From the religion of 'peace'.com site," which is a well known Islamaphobic site; as reading their 'about us' page will show.

So, like you, I would like to be told where in Islamic writings that quote originated.

Post removed to enable reply.

Think you will find the history and background of 'Taqiyya' at the URL below is a fair summation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taqiyya

EDIT: Is the practice of Taqiyya actually utilised by the large majority of UK Muslims, doubtful. By the conservative / extremist elements? Doesn't sound as though they adher to Taqiyya as they are constantly quoted & loud and clear on their objectives.

Edited August 31, 2014 by simple1

[jacky54]

Muslims do not follow Wikipedia, they follow the Koran and Hadiths Some non wikky scripture showing that lying and lying by omission are part of the Islamic faith, when they are addressing non believers you cannot believe a word they say

The Qur'an:

Qur'an (16:106) - Establishes that there are circumstances that can "compel" a Muslim to tell a lie.

Qur'an (3:28) - This verse tells Muslims not to take those outside the faith as friends, unless it is to "guard themselves."

Qur'an (9:3) - "...Allah and His Messenger are free from liability to the idolaters..." The dissolution of oaths with the pagans who remained at Mecca following its capture. They did nothing wrong, but were evicted anyway.

Qur'an (40:28) - A man is introduced as a believer, but one who must "hide his faith" among those who are not believers.

Qur'an (2:225) - "Allah will not call you to account for thoughtlessness in your oaths, but for the intention in your hearts" The context of this remark is marriage, which explains why Sharia allows spouses to lie to each other for the greater good.

Qur'an (66:2) - "Allah has already ordained for you, (O men), the dissolution of your oaths"

Qur'an (3:54) - "And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers." The Arabic word used here for scheme (or plot) ismakara, which literally means 'deceit'. If Allah is supremely deceitful toward unbelievers, then there is little basis for denying that Muslims are allowed to do the same. (See also 8:30 and 10:21)

Taken collectively these verses are interpreted to mean that there are circumstances when a Muslim may be "compelled" to deceive others for a greater purpose.

Edited August 31, 2014 by jacky54

[ABCer]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krvCQbzPKiI

I wonder how many of our respected TV members had the time, patience and willingness to watch the two quoted videos.

The thoughts of Great men, petty men and my mini-poodle on the Arab-Israeli conflict might become much clearer.

Do yourself a favor, look at the facts. Leave your testosterone and adrenalin levels out of the session.

After this you can come back here and repeat all your mumblings.

Big thankyou to Kalserud.

Edited August 31, 2014 by ABCer

[jacky54]

Taqiyya for dummies:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYJiFOZkev0

[CBR250]

To be fair, CBR250, the original post did name the source, though no link was provided. He said "From the religion of 'peace'.com site," which is a well known Islamaphobic site; as reading their 'about us' page will show.

So, like you, I would like to be told where in Islamic writings that quote originated.

Post removed to enable reply.

Think you will find the history and background of 'Taqiyya' at the URL below is a fair summation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taqiyya

EDIT: Is the practice of Taqiyya actually utilised by the large majority of UK Muslims, doubtful. By the conservative / extremist elements? Doesn't sound as though they adher to Taqiyya as they are constantly quoted & loud and clear on their objectives.

OK. So we are clear that "taqiyya" is simply a term that was developed by some unknown Imam in some early historical epoch. It is not found in the Quran. It is not central to Islam. The morality of lies, when and where they are acceptable, is pretty much a point of discussion in all religions. Lying about one's own religion was important to survival during the Spanish Inquisition, when then main targets for torture and killing were both Muslims and Jews. I am sure there would be a few Rabbinical utterances somewhere - based on this historical era - that allow Jews to lie about their beleifs without feeling they have breached the moral code of their religion.

And, to ice the mud-cake, Jacky54 implies that the term "taqiyya" is evidence of the warlike ways of Muslims. He (or she) says: "..you will be telling us next Islam is a religion pf (sic) peace, have you never heard of taqiya?" (Source: The World According to Jacky54, Post #240). So, if I had heard of the taqiyya I would then know for sure that all Muslims are warmongerers, eh Jacky? Irrefutable logic indeed.

And just to be painstakingly clear that post #240 is the result of too many centrefolds, the term "taqiyya" has absolutely nothing to do with the fantasy claim that Muslims are instructed to lie to "advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them" as Jacky54 so weirdly asserts.

[jacky54]

To be fair, CBR250, the original post did name the source, though no link was provided. He said "From the religion of 'peace'.com site," which is a well known Islamaphobic site; as reading their 'about us' page will show.

So, like you, I would like to be told where in Islamic writings that quote originated.

Post removed to enable reply.

Think you will find the history and background of 'Taqiyya' at the URL below is a fair summation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taqiyya

EDIT: Is the practice of Taqiyya actually utilised by the large majority of UK Muslims, doubtful. By the conservative / extremist elements? Doesn't sound as though they adher to Taqiyya as they are constantly quoted & loud and clear on their objectives.

OK. So we are clear that "taqiyya" is simply a term that was developed by some unknown Imam in some early historical epoch. It is not found in the Quran. It is not central to Islam. o weirdly asserts.

Why cos it says so on wikipeadia that Muslims edit themselves to put Islam in a better light, they even lie on that.

Edited August 31, 2014 by jacky54

[CBR250]

Taken collectively these verses are interpreted to mean that there are circumstances when a Muslim may be "compelled" to deceive others for a greater purpose.

Yes, and these circumstances are made quite clear. The greater purpose is when a Muslim must renounce his/her faith to save his/her life. I have no doubt that this guidance would have been very helpful during the Spanish Inquisition when the Catholics were busily killing "heretics", Muslims and Jews.

This then is far removed from your implication that this is intended to justify warfare.

[jacky54]

Good article on the problem by a British Muslim

What links UK jihadis and Rotherham sex abusers? Mosques failing to give them moral leadership says LORD AHMED

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2738704/What-links-UK-jihadis-Rotherham-sex-abusers-Mosques-failing-moral-leadership-says-LORD-AHMED.html

Edited August 31, 2014 by jacky54

[transam]

Good article on the problem by a British Muslim

What links UK jihadis and Rotherham sex abusers? Mosques failing to give them moral leadership says LORD AHMED

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2738704/What-links-UK-jihadis-Rotherham-sex-abusers-Mosques-failing-moral-leadership-says-LORD-AHMED.html

Been blocked...

[boomerangutang]

We may get a chance to see exactly how effective this Muslim Council of Britain is in real practice.

King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia made a rather dire prediction that may have impacts on many of us.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Saudi king warns West will be jihadists' next target

AFP

Jeddah (Saudi Arabia) (AFP) - King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia has warned that the West will be the next target of the jihadists sweeping through Syria and Iraq, unless there is "rapid" action.

"If we ignore them, I am sure they will reach Europe in a month and America in another month," he said in remarks quoted on Saturday by Asharq al-Awsat daily and Saudi-backed Al-Arabiya television station.

"Terrorism knows no border and its danger could affect several countries outside the Middle East," said the king who was speaking at a welcoming ceremony on Friday for new ambassadors, including a new envoy from Saudi ally the United States.

Entire article here: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://news.yahoo.com/saudi-king-warns-west-jihadists-next-target-093701543.html

The King wants westerners to do the dirty work of fighting his enemies. There are on-going demonstrations in London and NYC and elsewhere - claiming westerners should quit jumping in feet first to battles. Then, weeks later, many of the same demonstrators say westerners should immediately get involved and bomb the bad guys. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

The lion's share of the world's armed conflicts involve Muslims. As if that's not bad enough (from the Allah sanctioned 'religion of peace') they want westerners, with their superior weapons and expendable soldiers, to jump in the fray and do the dirty work they can't do for themselves. Libya, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, .....those are just a smattering of the most recent conflict zones.

Now they're spreading like mildew to countries which have democracy, freedom of speech and generous welfare programs. The same countries which their brothers and fathers loudly proclaimed were INFIDELS, HEATHEN, SATAN for generations. If there's a pox on the world, it's in the form of Muslim extremists.

There are also endless troubles in Africa, but at least they're not AS AVIDLY trying to export troubles to western countries.

[jacky54]

Good article on the problem by a British Muslim

What links UK jihadis and Rotherham sex abusers? Mosques failing to give them moral leadership says LORD AHMED

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2738704/What-links-UK-jihadis-Rotherham-sex-abusers-Mosques-failing-moral-leadership-says-LORD-AHMED.html

Been blocked...

Not blocked on a phone on a PC use zenmate on chrome

[Ulysses G.]

Muslims do not follow Wikipedia, they follow the Koran and Hadiths Some non wikky scripture showing that lying and lying by omission are part of the Islamic faith, when they are addressing non believers you cannot believe a word they say

The Qur'an:

Qur'an (16:106) - Establishes that there are circumstances that can "compel" a Muslim to tell a lie.

Qur'an (3:28) - This verse tells Muslims not to take those outside the faith as friends, unless it is to "guard themselves."

Qur'an (9:3) - "...Allah and His Messenger are free from liability to the idolaters..." The dissolution of oaths with the pagans who remained at Mecca following its capture. They did nothing wrong, but were evicted anyway.

Qur'an (40:28) - A man is introduced as a believer, but one who must "hide his faith" among those who are not believers.

Qur'an (2:225) - "Allah will not call you to account for thoughtlessness in your oaths, but for the intention in your hearts" The context of this remark is marriage, which explains why Sharia allows spouses to lie to each other for the greater good.

Qur'an (66:2) - "Allah has already ordained for you, (O men), the dissolution of your oaths"

Qur'an (3:54) - "And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers." The Arabic word used here for scheme (or plot) ismakara, which literally means 'deceit'. If Allah is supremely deceitful toward unbelievers, then there is little basis for denying that Muslims are allowed to do the same. (See also 8:30 and 10:21)

Taken collectively these verses are interpreted to mean that there are circumstances when a Muslim may be "compelled" to deceive others for a greater purpose.

All you have to do is listen to the apologists for radical Islam trying to justify their sins. They don't even try to tell the truth.

[CBR250]

Good article on the problem by a British Muslim

What links UK jihadis and Rotherham sex abusers? Mosques failing to give them moral leadership says LORD AHMED

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2738704/What-links-UK-jihadis-Rotherham-sex-abusers-Mosques-failing-moral-leadership-says-LORD-AHMED.html

Good article??? The Daily Mail???

Lord preserve us....... next we'll be referred to the National Front for their objective and cogent analyses.

[JockPieandBeans]

@ Jacky54

So you make a big thing out of living in an immigrant community so know all about them not integrating, how many Muslims in Woking then? not really a Luton, Leicester or Bradford is it?. No they might not have taken up arms but according to the koran they will burn in hell for not doing so.

So close, you should have said Reading instead of Woking

Or maybe Aylesbury or Slough

Edited August 31, 2014 by JockPieandBeans