See it, want it, take it! acceptable in this culture?

[fatmoose]

As you said "where I am from, it is called thef" but you are in Thailand. And even where I am from, if a mango is hanging over my fence, i wil take it. Heck, if the mango is reachable from my side, I will still take it.

[h90]

As you said "where I am from, it is called thef" but you are in Thailand. And even where I am from, if a mango is hanging over my fence, i wil take it. Heck, if the mango is reachable from my side, I will still take it.

fruits that hanging over your fence are yours in my European country....

[impulse]

Every place I've ever lived, I found life so much easier and richer if I just conformed to the local norms instead of my Puritanical Suburban upbringing.

If that means my stuff goes out on loan, the flipside is I don't have to buy as much stuff because I can borrow the things I only need occasionally.

If that means my veggies are up for grabs and it bothers me, I just won't grow veggies the next year.

Small prices to pay for being genuinely accepted into the community.

Edited August 28, 2014 by impulse

[Briggsy]

OP

In your home country there is the rule of law which is respected to some extent.

Here, the rule of law is subjugated under "informal power", "raw power", "perceived power", call it what you like.

If you were a Thai police colonel, people would not take your fruit, tools, etc. However you are not, so people help themselves. Since it is unlikely that you will ever be perceived as somebody who can exact a toll for their petty thieving, this behaviour will continue. You will have to build a large fence, electrify it and double padlock everything.

[pigeonjake]

we sell our pigs,

we sell our duck eggs

and we sell our chicken eggs,

mama might come for some bananas when they are ready, but i must say most of our surplus goes to our pigs and other animals,

i cant understand some when they say we are lower then the dog in the pecking order,,lol,

my wife and i are equal we both share the work,

she has a uncle who just wont work,,

sometimes mama will come to ours and ill say hang on ill get you a duck to eat, and i allways say dont give that lazy so and so any, they know how i feel about him,he gets nothing, dosnt even come to ours,

i have to work for what ive got, hes younger then me fitter then me so he can work if he wants things,

on here a few years ago there was a thread doing the rounds about steeling from a pond,

well years ago i noticed tracks in the grass coming to our small pond behind our pigs,

so i hung some fishing hooks in the trees on fishing line at head hight,

knocked some nails through some wood and put them in the grass as if they wanted to step over our fence they would tred on them,

then i told my wife ring puey, shes the local village gossip, tell her you have something to show her,

anyway she wouldnt miss the chance to gossip,

when she got here i took her down to our pigs and pond poining out my traps, she looked at me in horor,lol,

i said ive got more hidden ,

well that did the job off she went,, i could just see her telling all that would listen, that big falang who keeps pigs is mad, hes got traps all over his land, mind you by the time she finnished telling i bet ide got land mines,

never saw any tracks again,

abd yes i did take them down was only for show, but it did the job,!!!

[pigeonjake]

and by the way im not tight,

just today ide gone to an old couple of pig farmers who when im away working will help my wife with anything, ide gone to say thank you and take the wife some flower seeds ide brought her,

the old man said his boar had died i said ive got 2 young ones ill give you one, for nothing,

[seajae]

I dont mind lending things as long as I am asked first, also as long as they are returned as soon is they are finished with. I use most things I have bought reasonably regularly, what irritates me is when the family borrow them then simply dont bring them back, I now have a boomerang policy on everything, it has to be returned to where it came from soon as it is not being used or they can never borrow it again. The other problem is the cars and bike, family shows up and just take them, dont ask and then return them with empty fuel tanks when they are finished, totally p*sses me off so when In bought myself a car the first thing I told my wife is that no one is allowed to borrow it at all. I have seen how badly they all drive and do not want my car trashed, mind you one tried to take it but as I have the only set of keys they ended up spitting the dummy and getting dirty about it because they couldnt take it. There is a difference between borrowing things and simply using people, a lot like to use people because they dont want to spend their own money, then there are those that sell something as soon as they borrow it or simply bugger it up totally then give it back and expect you to buy a new one for them to use again. This may be our home now but that doesnt mean we have to be used and abused to live here, respect for other peoples things was drummed into me as a kid and I still believe in it, you want to borrow something you ask and you give it back in the same condition or replace it, end of argument.

[pigeonjake]

i had the same with my chainsaw,

they new i had just bought one,

so cousin suger comes along, nice bloke, can i borrow jakes chainsaw, my wife asked me i said yes hes always been ok with me,

off he went came back 2 days later, started it up, reved it, i said thank you, and i put it in my shed,

i came to use it a couple of days later, it wouldnt of cut butter, the chain was f""ked,

i said to the wife well thats just tought me a lesson and not to expencive, no one borrows anything else,

and thats how its been, if i want something i go and buy it,

if someone does something for me i pay them, i dont like being beholded to anyone so i pay them,

[Munger]

Planted some really expensive sweet corn seeds a few years back. The corn grew very nicely and looked great. One day looking at the corn and thinking its ready and tomorrow I am going to bring the family and start picking. Next day came and 90% of the corn was already gone.... So I picked the remaining and knocked the lot down... Never again grew anything .... Screw them !!!

Found out later that the entire village basically took what they wanted during the night. Seems like if you don't keep an eye on it it is fair game. Most farmers sleep in their fields when the crop is near time for picking.

Could they be "simply borrowing / loaning" your sweet corn ?

[MJP]

If it ain't welded to the floor . . .

[Gecko123]

I'm sorry to say this but almost every time I have seen a foreigner being taken advantage of like this, the Thai wife is taking advantage of the husband as well. The family and neighbors pick up on the wife's exploitative attitude towards the husband, and everyone feels they have tacit permission to jump in on the act.

In the farming community where I've lived for the past 11 years, I can't think of a single story of Thais helping themselves to their neighbor's property without first

asking permission. Mutual assistance and co-operation are indeed part of farming culture (i.e., barn raising), but I think people are deluding themselves if they

think neighbors boorishly helping themselves to their tools and equipment without permission is part of farming culture or tradition.

Edited August 28, 2014 by Gecko123

[benalibina]

I dont mind lending things as long as I am asked first, also as long as they are returned as soon is they are finished with. I use most things I have bought reasonably regularly, what irritates me is when the family borrow them then simply dont bring them back, I now have a boomerang policy on everything, it has to be returned to where it came from soon as it is not being used or they can never borrow it again. The other problem is the cars and bike, family shows up and just take them, dont ask and then return them with empty fuel tanks when they are finished, totally p*sses me off so when In bought myself a car the first thing I told my wife is that no one is allowed to borrow it at all. I have seen how badly they all drive and do not want my car trashed, mind you one tried to take it but as I have the only set of keys they ended up spitting the dummy and getting dirty about it because they couldnt take it. There is a difference between borrowing things and simply using people, a lot like to use people because they dont want to spend their own money, then there are those that sell something as soon as they borrow it or simply bugger it up totally then give it back and expect you to buy a new one for them to use again. This may be our home now but that doesnt mean we have to be used and abused to live here, respect for other peoples things was drummed into me as a kid and I still believe in it, you want to borrow something you ask and you give it back in the same condition or replace it, end of argument.

But but.....according to the people who adapted 100% into the rural way of doing things......you are not accepted by the locals and inlaws because of your behaviour.....

[MJP]

I dont mind lending things as long as I am asked first, also as long as they are returned as soon is they are finished with. I use most things I have bought reasonably regularly, what irritates me is when the family borrow them then simply dont bring them back, I now have a boomerang policy on everything, it has to be returned to where it came from soon as it is not being used or they can never borrow it again. The other problem is the cars and bike, family shows up and just take them, dont ask and then return them with empty fuel tanks when they are finished, totally p*sses me off so when In bought myself a car the first thing I told my wife is that no one is allowed to borrow it at all. I have seen how badly they all drive and do not want my car trashed, mind you one tried to take it but as I have the only set of keys they ended up spitting the dummy and getting dirty about it because they couldnt take it. There is a difference between borrowing things and simply using people, a lot like to use people because they dont want to spend their own money, then there are those that sell something as soon as they borrow it or simply bugger it up totally then give it back and expect you to buy a new one for them to use again. This may be our home now but that doesnt mean we have to be used and abused to live here, respect for other peoples things was drummed into me as a kid and I still believe in it, you want to borrow something you ask and you give it back in the same condition or replace it, end of argument.

But but.....according to the people who adapted 100% into the rural way of doing things......you are not accepted by the locals and inlaws because of your behaviour.....

Where is Kikoman these days?

[benalibina]

I dont mind lending things as long as I am asked first, also as long as they are returned as soon is they are finished with. I use most things I have bought reasonably regularly, what irritates me is when the family borrow them then simply dont bring them back, I now have a boomerang policy on everything, it has to be returned to where it came from soon as it is not being used or they can never borrow it again. The other problem is the cars and bike, family shows up and just take them, dont ask and then return them with empty fuel tanks when they are finished, totally p*sses me off so when In bought myself a car the first thing I told my wife is that no one is allowed to borrow it at all. I have seen how badly they all drive and do not want my car trashed, mind you one tried to take it but as I have the only set of keys they ended up spitting the dummy and getting dirty about it because they couldnt take it. There is a difference between borrowing things and simply using people, a lot like to use people because they dont want to spend their own money, then there are those that sell something as soon as they borrow it or simply bugger it up totally then give it back and expect you to buy a new one for them to use again. This may be our home now but that doesnt mean we have to be used and abused to live here, respect for other peoples things was drummed into me as a kid and I still believe in it, you want to borrow something you ask and you give it back in the same condition or replace it, end of argument.

But but.....according to the people who adapted 100% into the rural way of doing things......you are not accepted by the locals and inlaws because of your behaviour.....

Where is Kikoman these days?

You ask me ?

To be honest.....i miss him....however i can think of a couple of posters who could be his alter ego...just waiting for the confirmation.....burritos spring to mind....

[Pattszero]

I am Thai and I disagree that this is the way we are. It really depends on the person.

I did not have that problem yet. But if I had the same problem as you and I need my tool back, I'll simply explain that I will be much appreciated if they ask before they take it away from me.

Over the ages it was common for Thai farmers to sleep in their fields as crops ripened fearing theft.

One farmer I know of slept in the fields and gathered the crops -

Then spent the rest of the year distributing his excess to the elderly and needy.

When this humble man died 1800 people attended his funeral in a remote village.

He knew he could have slept at home and been left with enough to feed himself and his family.

He slept in the fields for the needy - for the elderly -

He regarded the theft as being from them - not him.

That's what you call a man.

[khunpa]

My experience is, that many Thai-people will test you out and take advantage of you, if you let them get away with it. So they take your stuff and you saying nothing, only makes you look stupid and easy in their eyes. Actually, you will gain their respect once you show that you have limits and require your limits to be respected.

When I e.g. visit my girlfriends family or they visit us, none in her family ever asks me for anything or ever have. I am not expected to "pay up" or in any other way support her family. Why? Because I made it very clear from the start, that I did not want to be taken advantage of (the ATM-farang way) and that I want people around me to respect my values, as I respect theirs.

No Thai I know, would ever take something from me, without first asking permission and that is what normal Thai-people do. (or at least the Thai-people I know - also the ones from the country side.)

The only reason people are doing this to you, is because they do not respect you and because you are letting them take advantage of you. Since you show no limits, then you have put yourself in this situation. Your wife should actually be supporting and helping you on this.

A generous heart, wallet and mindset does unfortunately in most cases bring you only trouble here. Respect comes from showing that you are not just another "Stupid Farang" who can be played with.

Edited August 28, 2014 by khunpa

[benalibina]

I am Thai and I disagree that this is the way we are. It really depends on the person.

I did not have that problem yet. But if I had the same problem as you and I need my tool back, I'll simply explain that I will be much appreciated if they ask before they take it away from me.

Over the ages it was common for Thai farmers to sleep in their fields as crops ripened fearing theft.

One farmer I know of slept in the fields and gathered the crops -

Then spent the rest of the year distributing his excess to the elderly and needy.

When this humble man died 1800 people attended his funeral in a remote village.

He knew he could have slept at home and been left with enough to feed himself and his family.

He slept in the fields for the needy - for the elderly -

He regarded the theft as being from them - not him.

That's what you call a man.

Nice post. It shows however another aspect.....lack of trust in fellow humans....

[David48]

I am Thai and I disagree that this is the way we are. It really depends on the person.

I did not have that problem yet. But if I had the same problem as you and I need my tool back, I'll simply explain that I will be much appreciated if they ask before they take it away from me.

Over the ages it was common for Thai farmers to sleep in their fields as crops ripened fearing theft.

EVERY farmer I know personally who professionally Farm Fish sleeps out by his Ponds for fear of theft.

I could not initially understand the relationship at the Farm when I first went to Thailand and started to live at my gf's Farm.

Despite a comfortable Farmhouse (by Rural Thai standards), he declined to sleep there with his wife (no jokes please) and instead choose instead to guard tend his Ponds.

He sleeps in this ...

Sleeping quarters on the left, toilet in the middle, feed shed on the right.

He showers at the Farm House then goes out to Salsa around 8pm.

Starts work at Sun-up. Comes most times back to the Farm House for breakfast, his day starts again.

He's generous to me with lending tools ... but if I play the Dumb Farang well enough ... often he fixes the object/issue for me.

Hard working guy ... gets my respect.

.

[buhi]

I am Thai and I disagree that this is the way we are. It really depends on the person.

I did not have that problem yet. But if I had the same problem as you and I need my tool back, I'll simply explain that I will be much appreciated if they ask before they take it away from me.

Over the ages it was common for Thai farmers to sleep in their fields as crops ripened fearing theft.

EVERY farmer I know personally who professionally Farm Fish sleeps out by his Ponds for fear of theft.

I could not initially understand the relationship at the Farm when I first went to Thailand and started to live at my gf's Farm.

Despite a comfortable Farmhouse (by Rural Thai standards), he declined to sleep there with his wife (no jokes please) and instead choose instead to guard tend his Ponds.

He sleeps in this ...

Sleeping quarters on the left, toilet in the middle, feed shed on the right.

He showers at the Farm House then goes out to Salsa around 8pm.

Starts work at Sun-up. Comes most times back to the Farm House for breakfast, his day starts again.

He's generous to me with lending tools ... but if I play the Dumb Farang well enough ... often he fixes the object/issue for me.

Hard working guy ... gets my respect.

.

[FireMedic]

I bet if you put a 60kg guard dog out there, things would stop being liberated from your bountiful property. I grew up on citrus land and a person could very easily find themselves shot for stealing oranges...but if they came to the house and asked, they could have all they could carry or load in their car.

[David48]

I bet if you put a 60kg guard dog out there, things would stop being liberated from your bountiful property. I grew up on citrus land and a person could very easily find themselves shot for stealing oranges...but if they came to the house and asked, they could have all they could carry or load in their car.

If you are referring to my post above ... are you proposing that you know more and are better at things then every Thai Farmer I know?

I love it when self professed experts try and tell the Locals that they are better, know the local conditions better then the Thais do.

Just pop on down to the Farming Forum and try that hypothesis on for size ...

One dog ... the Farmers have dog packs ...

Sadly, FireMedic ... you bet wrong.

.

[JLCrab]

Thai method: Poison the 60 kg guard dog night #1; remove the fish night #2

[pigeonjake]

Thai method: Poison the 60 kg guard dog night #1; remove the fish night #2

very sad BUT, thats the way it would be,,,

better my way have some deterents lol

[David48]

Thai method: Poison the 60 kg guard dog night #1; remove the fish night #2

very sad BUT, thats the way it would be,,,

Sad, but often true.

I might have been a bit harsh with my comment above ... but people just don't realise the extent that some people will go to 'share the wealth' ... steal your produce.

Things that work in the West ... don't work here.

The Farming Forum is littered with Folk who have had their Crop/Harvest nicked.

But it's like talking to a wall till people experience for themselves.

.

[krisb]

CharlieH and Halfie summed it up imo.

Sounds like normal village life to me.

My neighbour bought every new tool imaginable to get his house built. 1 year later every tool is borrowed out and he has no idea whos 'borrowed' them.

Long as they don't borrow your wife I suppose.

[easyride]

No two ways about it - theft is theft. Why not ask???

Sorry for this but I'm a Trekkie and the Borg are here....

"as resistance is futile".

[Giddyup99]

Just get a big dog in your yard and that will stop them from entering.

[David48]

Just get a big dog in your yard and that will stop them from entering.

Humm 'yards' ... not so many of them in Thailand once out of the City

'Guard Dog' ... that's a novel idea ... why didn't I think of that ...

[Halfie]

A few other points some other posters touched upon: 1. your wife has pretty much given them the green light 2. If people don't respect you they'll be more likely to take from you (this happens with Thais also 3. Even if you know it is you can't do crap to them. Unfortunately.

[Halfie]

A few other points some other posters touched upon: 1. your wife has pretty much given them the green light 2. If people don't respect you they'll be more likely to take from you (this happens with Thais also 3. Even if you know it is you can't do crap to them. Unfortunately.