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Move to axe 'smart classrooms' needs further debate


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EDITORIAL
Move to axe 'smart classrooms' needs further debate
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- Education is too important to be left in the hands of ministry officials, wider input would be welcome

Thai governments come and go and all of them say that they will something about education and reforming the system. But in the end, as the past has shown, nothing seems to change as students in our public school system don't seem to be any better prepared for higher education or the real world.

The idea of targeting specific trades is logical but, unfortunately, many of our technical schools have turned into battlegrounds between students from rival schools. They beat, stab and shoot one another and few people seem to be able to do anything about this pathetic aspect of our society.

Like the previous government, the current junta has also vowed to make changes that are needed. The junta has allocated the Education Ministry some Bt498.16 billion - a 3.2 per cent increase on last year's budget and 19.5 per cent of the total budget allocation. General Prayuth has made education reform part of his plan to restore political stability.

Like many things for the government, it is a long-term investment. Prayuth has to make sure that whatever foundation his government puts down is sustainable. But unfortunately, education has been a sector that major parties have sought to make short-term political gains.

Such a mindset and attitude should be a thing of the past and only time will tell if this military-run government will have the political courage to do the right thing.

At the centre of the latest debate is the use of information technology, or IT, in schools. The previous government led by Yingluck Shinawatra came up with the One (computer) Tablet Per Child scheme.

Not much thought went into it. Critics said the initiative was part of Yingluck's populist agenda, and it did little in terms of improving the education system or schoolchildren's results. So there was little surprise when it was axed.

Initially, there was talk of the so-called "Smart Classroom". The idea was to equip classrooms with interactive computer software. A typical feature would have included a large interactive screen as a replacement for the chalkboard, and either laptops or tablets for students to use during classes with cloud-computing capabilities. Each smart classroom would have cost at least Bt250,000, depending on its size.

But the National Council for Peace and Order, the ruling junta, decided to scrap the proposal, saying IT would be provided on a basis of needs instead. It noted the need to save money and cater to the different context of each school.

While this move sounds logical, there is nevertheless the need to ensure fairness and equality when it comes to educating our children. Hitting the right balance between the needs of each school and the need for standardisation at the national level is a tough nut to crack. But the junta should open the issue up for wider discussion instead of leaving this to the bureaucrats.

Education is too important to be monopolised by officials at the ministry. On this note, the quality of education and the methodology they employed should also be examined.

Instead of using students' test scores as a benchmark for success, the government should also take into consideration teachers' performances. We can't just place all the blame on the students. Teachers must do their part and they must be held accountable for their performance as well.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/opinion/Move-to-axe-smart-classrooms-needs-further-debate-30242159.html

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-- The Nation 2014-08-31

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Great, more debate just what's needed which means the thorny issue of a positive plan and the even more thorny issue of implementation, given the to be expected resistance, goes on hold and the AEC clock is ticking. The usual ' alright on the night ' attitude isn't going to work this time.

There is an irony in the need for students to be taught to think for themselves, question and challenge etc. as although very necessary it goes against the grain of those in authority who don't like to be challenged in the least and i don't just mean the junta, it's part of Thainess and will be impossible to easily overcome

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"But the National Council for Peace and Order, the ruling junta, decided to scrap the proposal, saying IT would be provided on a basis of needs instead. It noted the need to save money and cater to the different context of each school."

As soon as you contextualise a school and ascertain it is only needs come needs served, then so do you contextualise every child in it, and that is fatal for any educational system. That takes away the right of any Smartchild (copyright 2014 DrLom).

Saving money to cater for the different context of each school ? ... Talk about maintaining the divide, why don't you?

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They are quiet correct in the fact that education is 2 important to leave in the hands of ministry officials, the whole set up is alarming in this day n age, there doesn't seem to be an understanding within the Thai community that education is the yard stick to a modern advanced country, popular opinion subscribes to the elite dumbing down the plebs, this ancient thinking will come back to haunt Thailand , unfortunately Thailand seems to be run from some quarters under the ancient thinking syndrome and lives in the past , experience dictates this conversation will fall on deaf ears. coffee1.gif

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The present government is quite right that a general introduction of IT systems in classrooms would not necessarily solve the low improvement in education that has faced this country for many years. Having technology doesn't mean people get any smarter, just look at us at TV!!! Thai teachers need to know how to use the technology, and that process takes a generation. Western countries have used technology in classrooms since the late 70s and even now the schools in the west are very careful when introducing high cost, high maintenance systems into classrooms. It would seem the current government are facing facts and making fairly sensible decisions. In our social debates, we really should start to look at education in a 30-year or even 60-year perspective because that is what our 'minders' in the west have been doing since the 1930s. By looking at things over a longer time period we will also be able to guard against harmful effects of education on the next generation and so ensure the next generation are truly equipped to be part of Thailand in 2044.

Edited by ontheroof
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The idea of targeting specific trades is logical but, unfortunately, many of our technical schools have turned into battlegrounds between students from rival schools. They beat, stab and shoot one another and few people seem to be able to do anything about this pathetic aspect of our society.

'Aspect'? Sorry, old bean, but that IS your society! The level of education in schools is as mediocre as it is because it is all pervasive. It won't change for decades. You would be better off banning all schools, banning your f'king pathetic television with it and making EVERY single child (and the so-called teachers) read one book a week.
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Budget for education is high but I have seen many schools that would need at least double the budget that they now have so that they can renovate and prepare for the future! I don't remember the exact number but it's somewhere in the ballpark of 1750-2000 schools here in Thailand that don't have electricity, I would like to see those schools getting electricity before they get smart classrooms...

Over the last 3 years teaching here I have seen more than 10 fund raising events where the schools and teachers try to get the parents, villagers and alumni to donate money for some kind of renovation in the school!

In the college I worked before they got 75 million over 3 years to renovate the buildings from MOE, that was enough for basically just painting, new floors, new wiring and new or painted roofs on 25% of the buildings. That college is over 40 years old and this was the first renovation, sure they got some new buildings over the years but 95% of the buildings are 20 years old or more. And also when you got newly renovated buildings it would be nice to get some furniture that is not falling apart from old age. But hey why not just install smart classrooms....

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A good education system doesn't provide good outcomes if the student have no motivation to learn. In my high school days I found it hard to achieve good grades when what was presented to me was often boring or sleep inducing!

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The political adage is:It is the Economy, stupid

Thai Education adage: It is the Teachers, stupid

I agree reform of education is critical to the future of Thailand. There are few nations that have actually managed to solve the conundrum of what schools are actually for..certainly not the US and UK. It is all very well for Singapore and Korea to come top in all kinds of tests..but 'education/' I think not. From my experience of having children in Thai schools, the over riding impression is that the teachers do not care a *** they have jobs for life, the banks lend them money for cars and houses because they are civil servants. They have no knowledge of learning methods other than preaching from a blackboard..Prayuth has a big problem!

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The political adage is:It is the Economy, stupid

Thai Education adage: It is the Teachers, stupid

I agree reform of education is critical to the future of Thailand. There are few nations that have actually managed to solve the conundrum of what schools are actually for..certainly not the US and UK. It is all very well for Singapore and Korea to come top in all kinds of tests..but 'education/' I think not. From my experience of having children in Thai schools, the over riding impression is that the teachers do not care a *** they have jobs for life, the banks lend them money for cars and houses because they are civil servants. They have no knowledge of learning methods other than preaching from a blackboard..Prayuth has a big problem!

I do and don't half agree. As for stating that the US and UK don't know what schooling is all about - you can hype secular ethics all you like, but at the end of the day all countries try to base their educational systems on both, unless you can prove me wrong, that is.

As for Thai teachers... of course.. they are 'Ajarn' or 'Kruu' (sic)... as in the equivalent words still used for 'monks'. That is where the ethos needs to be broken, and I don't need to explain why.

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Quote from the Nation Editorial:

"Instead of using students' test scores as a benchmark for success, the government should also take into consideration teachers' performances. We can't just place all the blame on the students. Teachers must do their part and they must be held accountable for their performance as well.

I, and I suspect many people, Thais and foreigners, totally agree there should be regular assessment of teachers actual performance and an assessment of their knowledge of value added teaching theory and methodology and their ability to apply it.

However I find the next comment from the Nation writer to be ridiculous "We can't just place all the blame on the students. Teachers must do their part......"

Certainly students need to be motivated to learn. The responsibility to create and maintain the desire to learn lies IMHO in these areas:

- The overall school environment including quality buildings and equipment, total number of students in the class room, etc.

- Policies (example: 'no student fails' policy does nothing whatever to motivate students to learn and achieve and on a longer-term basis is a negative in terms of building a capable civil society).

- Teaching knowledge / capability and actual teacher performance.

To put it bluntly I'm shocked that the Nation writer says "We can't just place all the blame on the students. Teachers must do their part......"

Further, quote "Instead of using students' test scores as a benchmark......" If overall test scores are used as a benchmark and if overall scores are low or high then there should be some sort of analysis of why (both for low and for high scores). In both cases (law and high) a major input factor must be teaching quality.

Is this part of a new approach by the Nation, which nowadays seems to want to be negative and pessimistic about everything.

Perhaps the Nation writer might like to explain why 'most* of the blame should be put on students but some of the blame on teachers' (Note *most is my interpretation of what the writer is really meaning).

Edited by scorecard
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<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Budget for education is high but I have seen many schools that would need at least double the budget that they now have so that they can renovate and prepare for the future! I don't remember the exact number but it's somewhere in the ballpark of 1750-2000 schools here in Thailand that don't have electricity, I would like to see those schools getting electricity before they get smart classrooms...

Over the last 3 years teaching here I have seen more than 10 fund raising events where the schools and teachers try to get the parents, villagers and alumni to donate money for some kind of renovation in the school!

In the college I worked before they got 75 million over 3 years to renovate the buildings from MOE, that was enough for basically just painting, new floors, new wiring and new or painted roofs on 25% of the buildings. That college is over 40 years old and this was the first renovation, sure they got some new buildings over the years but 95% of the buildings are 20 years old or more. And also when you got newly renovated buildings it would be nice to get some furniture that is not falling apart from old age. But hey why not just install smart classrooms....

"Budget for education is high but I have seen many schools that would need at least double the budget that they now have so that they can renovate and prepare for the future ....."

Many past surveys conducted by several respected Thai organizations list corruption in government agencies as follows:

- Most corrupt agency - police

- Second most corrupt - education

- Third ......

Poor maintenance - here's one example I'm well acquainted with. An old Thai university where the walls of many classrooms have fallen dow, years ago, and students still have classes in these rooms with one or two walls completely fallen down.

At the same uni several years back the dean (he called himself the president) personally designed and built (taxpayers funds of course) a very large new presidents building, (4 or 5 floors) with state of the art IT throughout and very expensive furniture. The building could have been 30 new classrooms.

The icing on the cake - he got extra budget to have a helicopter landing pad installed on the roof of the 'presidents' new building. There are numerous football fields on the said campus and on nearby campuses which could be used for helicopter landing and this is a location which does not have flooding. Numerous large government complex buildings nearby already have on roof / off roof designated and equipped helicopter landing fields.

In reality there is zero chance the presidents helipad will ever be used. Total waste of a lot of taxpayers money.

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Quote from the Nation Editorial:

"Instead of using students' test scores as a benchmark for success, the government should also take into consideration teachers' performances. We can't just place all the blame on the students. Teachers must do their part and they must be held accountable for their performance as well.

I, and I suspect many people, Thais and foreigners, totally agree there should be regular assessment of teachers actual performance and an assessment of their knowledge of value added teaching theory and methodology and their ability to apply it.

However I find the next comment from the Nation writer to be ridiculous "We can't just place all the blame on the students. Teachers must do their part......"

Certainly students need to be motivated to learn. The responsibility create and maintain the desire to learn lies IMHO in these areas:

- The overall school environment including quality buildings and equipment, total number of students in the class room, etc.

- Policies (example: 'no student fails' policy does nothing whatever to motivate students to learn and achieve and on a longer-term basis is a negative in terms of building a capable civil society).

- Teaching knowledge / capability and actual teacher performance.

To put it bluntly I'm shocked that the Nation writer says "We can't just place all the blame on the students. Teachers must do their part......"

Further, quote "Instead of using students' test scores as a benchmark......" If overall test scores are used as a benchmark and if overall scores are low or high then there should be some sort of analysis of why (both for low and for high scores). In both cases (law and high) a major input factor must be teaching quality.

Is this part of a new approach by the Nation, which nowadays seems to want to be negative and pessimistic about everything.

Perhaps the Nation writer might like to explain why 'most* of the blame should be put on students but some of the blame on teachers' (Note *most is my interpretation of what the writer is really meaning).

If a student fails, has the teacher failed the student or the system placing the student within the wrong 'brand'?

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our daughter wants to be a doctor, she is very intelligent and has to go to after school classes to even get a decent education. She is in the only highly regarded class in the southern area, a class of around 30 students that had to sit an exam to qualify, it was for the whole southern area and she qualified in the top half of students. When there is only room for 30 students in the whole southern region of Thailand to be able to learn the harder subjects we have to wonder what sort of pathetic schooling they have here, are thai people considered that dumb that the education department has to make classes teach low education classes for the majority, more likely it makes it easier to give them all pass marks so they do not have to use their own brain to think. What we see happening here is the dumbing down of the people as a whole, by only having a few intelligent people it makes it easier to control the masses, it enables people like thaksin to convince the uneducated that what they are telling them is the truth and is the major cause of disenchantment here. Until such time that education actually does teach the students and requires them to pass exams we will not see an improvement in the way things happen here, education is the answer but corruption/graft is still the over riding factor in it not improving

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Thai governments come and go and all of them say that they will something about education and reforming the system.

Politicians, the majority of whom seem to have had only a briefest of personal encounter with successful educational experiences (George Bush and his No Child Left Behind program come to mind) are probably not best suited to determine what will improve education. Much of what results in success or failure is only remotely connected to what is decided from "on high" anyway and the primary beneficiaries of reform programs are usually those who profit from it financially and/or politically.

Despite all the alleged superiority of western style education, increasing numbers of the PhD students in mathematics and the sciences in the US are foreigners from Asia who went through the "inadequate" third world education systems, many of which institutions still depend on parroting and rote ... both considered to be no-nos in the west.

In 1966, U.S.-born white males received 71 percent of science and engineering PhDs, U.S.-born females earned 6 percent of those degrees, and foreign-born students received 23 percent of those doctorates. By the year 2000, U.S.-born white males received just 35 percent of science and engineering PhDs, while 25 percent of those doctorates were awarded to females and 39 percent to foreign-born students.

http://www.nber.org/digest/jan05/w10554.html

Edited by Suradit69
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our daughter wants to be a doctor, she is very intelligent and has to go to after school classes to even get a decent education. She is in the only highly regarded class in the southern area, a class of around 30 students that had to sit an exam to qualify, it was for the whole southern area and she qualified in the top half of students. When there is only room for 30 students in the whole southern region of Thailand to be able to learn the harder subjects we have to wonder what sort of pathetic schooling they have here, are thai people considered that dumb that the education department has to make classes teach low education classes for the majority, more likely it makes it easier to give them all pass marks so they do not have to use their own brain to think. What we see happening here is the dumbing down of the people as a whole, by only having a few intelligent people it makes it easier to control the masses, it enables people like thaksin to convince the uneducated that what they are telling them is the truth and is the major cause of disenchantment here. Until such time that education actually does teach the students and requires them to pass exams we will not see an improvement in the way things happen here, education is the answer but corruption/graft is still the over riding factor in it not improving

I'm not 100% sure but the director at the first school I worked in told me that the students there where lucky. He said that normally 1 or 2 students a year managed to pass the exams to start studying for MD from that school and usually only 3-4 from the entire province got accepted!

I know it's hard and they need to do a good job but I think it would be better if they could accept more MD students as it seems to be a shortage of MDs in all government hospitals!

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Reform in reverse gear. Nothing new to take something away and promise it to replace it with something better, only to then not to implement what was promised. Why not cut the defence budget with 20% as AV suggested and used that funds to improve the education system? The only war Thailand is fighting is with it self.

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"But the National Council for Peace and Order, the ruling junta, decided to scrap the proposal, saying IT would be provided on a basis of needs instead. It noted the need to save money and cater to the different context of each school."

As soon as you contextualise a school and ascertain it is only needs come needs served, then so do you contextualise every child in it, and that is fatal for any educational system. That takes away the right of any Smartchild (copyright 2014 DrLom).

Saving money to cater for the different context of each school ? ... Talk about maintaining the divide, why don't you?

Are you advocating smart class rooms for all the schools including the ones with no electricity?sad.png

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<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Budget for education is high but I have seen many schools that would need at least double the budget that they now have so that they can renovate and prepare for the future! I don't remember the exact number but it's somewhere in the ballpark of 1750-2000 schools here in Thailand that don't have electricity, I would like to see those schools getting electricity before they get smart classrooms...

Over the last 3 years teaching here I have seen more than 10 fund raising events where the schools and teachers try to get the parents, villagers and alumni to donate money for some kind of renovation in the school!

In the college I worked before they got 75 million over 3 years to renovate the buildings from MOE, that was enough for basically just painting, new floors, new wiring and new or painted roofs on 25% of the buildings. That college is over 40 years old and this was the first renovation, sure they got some new buildings over the years but 95% of the buildings are 20 years old or more. And also when you got newly renovated buildings it would be nice to get some furniture that is not falling apart from old age. But hey why not just install smart classrooms....

"Budget for education is high but I have seen many schools that would need at least double the budget that they now have so that they can renovate and prepare for the future ....."

Many past surveys conducted by several respected Thai organizations list corruption in government agencies as follows:

- Most corrupt agency - police

- Second most corrupt - education

- Third ......

Poor maintenance - here's one example I'm well acquainted with. An old Thai university where the walls of many classrooms have fallen dow, years ago, and students still have classes in these rooms with one or two walls completely fallen down.

At the same uni several years back the dean (he called himself the president) personally designed and built (taxpayers funds of course) a very large new presidents building, (4 or 5 floors) with state of the art IT throughout and very expensive furniture. The building could have been 30 new classrooms.

The icing on the cake - he got extra budget to have a helicopter landing pad installed on the roof of the 'presidents' new building. There are numerous football fields on the said campus and on nearby campuses which could be used for helicopter landing and this is a location which does not have flooding. Numerous large government complex buildings nearby already have on roof / off roof designated and equipped helicopter landing fields.

In reality there is zero chance the presidents helipad will ever be used. Total waste of a lot of taxpayers money.

Another excellent post which highlights yet another major failing, accountability or rather the lack thereof.

Such a criminal waste of resources should not only be questioned it should result in disciplinary if not criminal action but the culture has been settled in for generations of those and such as those of PWD - Plunder Without Danger.

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The present government is quite right that a general introduction of IT systems in classrooms would not necessarily solve the low improvement in education that has faced this country for many years. Having technology doesn't mean people get any smarter, just look at us at TV!!! Thai teachers need to know how to use the technology, and that process takes a generation. Western countries have used technology in classrooms since the late 70s and even now the schools in the west are very careful when introducing high cost, high maintenance systems into classrooms. It would seem the current government are facing facts and making fairly sensible decisions. In our social debates, we really should start to look at education in a 30-year or even 60-year perspective because that is what our 'minders' in the west have been doing since the 1930s. By looking at things over a longer time period we will also be able to guard against harmful effects of education on the next generation and so ensure the next generation are truly equipped to be part of Thailand in 2044.

It is unfair to use the west as a example. Even in British Columbia Canada where I come from they did not use the same system from school district to school district. The results showed different levels of education in between them.

The States are no better some states have much higher levels of education than others.

Each state has it's own program in which their are different school districts each one having a different program.

Over all they do come up with a higher degree of education due to the fact that most of them do not pass you on if you are not qualified to be graduated and the colleges in particular you must do the work to get the degrtee.

Such is not the case here in Thailand. who you know and how much money you are willing to pay rule the day.

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Changing schoolchildren's thought processes would be a good start. Encouraged to challenge, have an opinion and think outwardly, would be a good start. Now is the good General likely to foster that approach to anything in Thailand, be it education or anything else?

I think this headline gives you the answer:

Military junta to revise school curricula to stimulate greater patriotism and love of establishment

(http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/military-junta-revise-school-curricula-stimulate-greater-patriotism-love-establishment/)

Edited by fab4
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our daughter wants to be a doctor, she is very intelligent and has to go to after school classes to even get a decent education. She is in the only highly regarded class in the southern area, a class of around 30 students that had to sit an exam to qualify, it was for the whole southern area and she qualified in the top half of students. When there is only room for 30 students in the whole southern region of Thailand to be able to learn the harder subjects we have to wonder what sort of pathetic schooling they have here, are thai people considered that dumb that the education department has to make classes teach low education classes for the majority, more likely it makes it easier to give them all pass marks so they do not have to use their own brain to think. What we see happening here is the dumbing down of the people as a whole, by only having a few intelligent people it makes it easier to control the masses, it enables people like thaksin to convince the uneducated that what they are telling them is the truth and is the major cause of disenchantment here. Until such time that education actually does teach the students and requires them to pass exams we will not see an improvement in the way things happen here, education is the answer but corruption/graft is still the over riding factor in it not improving

I'm not 100% sure but the director at the first school I worked in told me that the students there where lucky. He said that normally 1 or 2 students a year managed to pass the exams to start studying for MD from that school and usually only 3-4 from the entire province got accepted!

I know it's hard and they need to do a good job but I think it would be better if they could accept more MD students as it seems to be a shortage of MDs in all government hospitals!

to be accepted into the university to become a doctor there are certain subjects that need to be studied but there is only one class in the whole of the south that actually has those subjects. This is the problem, instead of teaching all students subjects needed for better further education they restrict it, the reason being is that even the teachers are not smart enough to teach the required subjects. This is due entirely to the education system in Thailand, there needs to be a huge improvement and we would probably see an improvement in a lot of things if students had to do real tests and pass to be able to advance.When the govt deliberately keeps people uneducated there is always going to be a problem, until we see teachers made to do their jobs and students made to pass exams there will never be a smart Thailand.

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A huge chunk of the Thai education syllabus which is centrally determined by the Ministry of Education is focused on behavioural teaching. This is then exponentially increased by the schools who place further weight on behaviour, obedience, the school hierarchy and loyalty to those above you. The whole system of teaching is highly didactic. There is little opportunity to kids to think for themselves.

In my opinion, this is a reflection of the society.

I urge anyone who is interested to learn to read Thai and read the material that is used in Thai schools. You will be surprised at the focus on moral and behavioural teaching and the prescribed way the kids are taught to live their lives. e.g. Ever heard a Thai insisting that everyone should shower upon getting up and shower before bed? Yes, because it's there in the school syllabus. There are countless other examples.

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Well there has been a lot said and some very pointed hints laid out.

The way I see it in a nutshell is that the corruption at the top must go. The amount of money that is spent on every thing else but teaching is out of hand.

The teachers should all be taught how to teach. To inspire thinking in the students. No student pass a grade unless they have done the necessary work to pass in to the next grade. The ability to reason and use logic must be taught.

I have a friend teaching English here. They have a Major in English. They took the required TEFL class as required by law. They told me it was the hardest thing they had ever done. It was easy to know the subject but that had nothing to do with the ability to impart that knowledge in a manner that the students could understand.

Teachers today for the most part have no idea of how to teach they talk and every body is expected to learn from that. At the end of the year every one passes. (save face) that applies to the student and the teacher. After all we can't have people thinking they are poor teachers. To turn out decent teachers it will require colleges to learn how to teach them. The whole thing will require a three college generation project. It will be the teachers graduating at least ten years from now really qualified to teach. I will allow that there are some who it comes natural to and in fact there are some in the present system but this is a minority of them.

As for teaching with technology it is my belief that should be applied late second grade at the earliest. Make them learn to think and reason first. Then give them a machine to help them out. I favor the smart class room with decent equipment not that cheap vote buying junk Yingluck used to get elected with. The cost would more than likely demand waiting for third grade to introduce it.

This also should be the case in schools with out electricity. That will force the government to even the playing field. Some thing the previous government was willing to leave alone and so far the present government has not commented on. The one in my opinion good thing they have mentioned is shortening the school hours.

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