Police address criticisms over Koh Tao arrest of Myanmar suspects

[catweazle]

Paper and words are cheap, as cheap as the police officers in charge are. A bunch of morons stumbling around at the crime scene along with civilians (possibly the murderer - owner of AC Bar), pretending to not know what is going on, overlooking facts like the shallow stab wounds on David's head and shoulders, letting a key witness (Sean) who has similar stab wounds on his arms and a guitar full of blood run without further investigation about the death threats he received from the AC Bar owner and his police friend (photo from behind 7Eleven counter), waterboarding and "cooking" confessions out of two Burmese tiny men, who neither would have the strength nor the body height to take out David in a fist fight, overlooking possible motives like loss of face or hate crime/crime of passion, letting the foreign friends of the victims leave on day one without proper investigation, chasing wrong leads, pushing the accused through the reenactment like string puppets, telling them where to stand, where to go, how to hit, etc... and now possibly switching DNA swabs and whatever need to be done or what evidence needs to be disposed of to mold the case around the two young patsies... What a disgusting travesty this is! I hope the whole world will finally wake up to the fact that law enforcement in Thailand along with justice is just a big brown pile of $#!te that can be bought and told what to say and do by lowlife mafiosi and influential Hi So business people.

Almost forgot... and how "boring" would this investigation have been without the senseless and insensitive remark in front of cameras of the beloved leader of this nation, saying that foreigners themselves are at fault if they look beautiful and wear sexy dresses... later not having the spine to say sorry personally in front of cameras, but sending an errand-boy to to it for him.

The whole case is the lowest and most digusting lapse I have ever witnessed within 23 years in the "land of smiles"...

Edited October 6, 2014 by catweazle

[ebean001]

the thais did not have sophisticated DNA testing. They had the USA FBI do it to obtain the enthicity of the men. The British also have the DNA. Forget any switching. Way too complicated way too costly if caught - even the possiblility of life in prison for someone to play with this DNA. Maybe they made mistakes but they caught them.

This is not a huge island. The police are limited in what they know, etc. If I was at all critical of the police - which I am not - I would think the leasson learned is a need for the country to have an expert crime scene team. In western countries thay have these people. They would have flown immediately to the scene and taken over. It is too diificult and too expensive to have high level investiagtors on all the small islands and small towns for any country.

[Baerboxer]

They wouldn't allow no independent investigation, to make the authorities look inept in the eyes of Thailand, if not in front of the whole world? The police have also tampered with evidence and could set-it-up to point to the ones in custody anyway, before independent investigators would arrive. The Brits. need to force their way in, to do an alternate study unexpectedly. They should of came in right-off the bat. At the very least, an independant moderator should of come in from the start

Force their way in - on what legal basis would that be then?

One country cannot tell another country their police will come and take over a case. It's incredible the number of posters on here who think Britain can just tell the Thai authorities how it's going to be.

Did the FBI, US Marshals, Interpol, CIA or anyone else demand to take over any case where and American has been killed, like the poor guy stabbed to death in front of his family by musicians on some island.

No of course not. The British government's position is as stated by their Ambassador on instruction from the FCO.

I might not like or agree with it, but it is what it is.

[TTom911]

Paper and words are cheap, as cheap as the police officers in charge are. A bunch of morons stumbling around at the crime scene along with civilians (possibly the murderer - owner of AC Bar), pretending to not know what is going on, overlooking facts like the shallow stab wounds on David's head and shoulders, letting a key witness (Sean) who has similar stab wounds on his arms and a guitar full of blood run without further investigation about the death threats he received from the AC Bar owner and his police friend (photo from behind 7Eleven counter), waterboarding and "cooking" confessions out of two Burmese tiny men, who neither would have the strength nor the body height to take out David in a fist fight, overlooking possible motives like loss of face or hate crime/crime of passion, letting the foreign friends of the victims leave on day one without proper investigation, chasing wrong leads, pushing the accused through the reenactment like string puppets, telling them where to stand, where to go, how to hit, etc... and now possibly switching DNA swabs and whatever need to be done or what evidence needs to be disposed of to mold the case around the two young patsies... What a disgusting travesty this is! I hope the whole world will finally wake up to the fact that law enforcement in Thailand along with justice is just a big brown pile of $#!te that can be bought and told what to say and do by lowlife mafiosi and influential Hi So business people.

Welcome to "The Land of Smiles"... What an UGLY face...

[culicine]

Do the RTP not realise how much blood would be flying around as these brutal attacks were taking place? The perpetrators would have it all over themselves and their clothes, but the police don't seem to have found any trace of blood on anything but the hoe.

Does anyone else find this rather curious?

Yes I do. Where's that Sean guy and his guitare? Do the RTP have blood splatter analysts? Are you a Dexter fan?

Within 3 weeks Dexter would have had this sorted to everyone's satisfaction

[culicine]

the thais did not have sophisticated DNA testing. They had the USA FBI do it to obtain the enthicity of the men. The British also have the DNA. Forget any switching. Way too complicated way too costly if caught - even the possiblility of life in prison for someone to play with this DNA. Maybe they made mistakes but they caught them.

This is not a huge island. The police are limited in what they know, etc. If I was at all critical of the police - which I am not - I would think the leasson learned is a need for the country to have an expert crime scene team. In western countries thay have these people. They would have flown immediately to the scene and taken over. It is too diificult and too expensive to have high level investiagtors on all the small islands and small towns for any country.

The FBI didn't do anything involved with this case. The original samples were tested in Singapore to determine ethnicity.

[ParadiseLost]

maybe if they allowed an independent dna test to be performed we might believe them but as long as they keep sticking to their current "we did nothing wrong" testaments we all know its simply a cover up for their pathetic attempts to satisfy their "no thai did this" statement and the total unprofessional way they investigated it along with the way they allowed suspects to muddy the waters.

What they need to do is allow an agency from outside Thailand to go over the so called evidence as well as check the supposed dna samples taken from the local "mafia" and to take fresh dna samples for the supposed killers. This needs to be above board and not the current corrupt crap we are seeing.

Agree totally with the sentiments but would a UK, US ,Australian, Canadian etc police force allow another countries police/agency to come in and conduct their own tests ? I would suggest no way.

One day someone will research and write a book on unsolved murders and stitching some unfortunates for all the murders in Thailand,will be a mighty thick book.

Can see this investigation going the same way as so many have before. The best police force money can buy.

I beg to differ - police agencies from different countries have been working together for many years.

Here's a fine example!

[SupermarineS6B]

Truly a bizarre and sad situation........ To solve one crime by commiting another.......... And i thought i'd seen it all.......

[bigjules007]

Truly a bizarre and sad situation........ To solve one crime by commiting another.......... And i thought i'd seen it all.......

Welcome to Thailand

[StealthEnergiser]

Police address criticisms over arrest of Myanmar suspects.

The headline is misleading. Although they may have addressed some of the other criticisms elsewhere, this article deals only with the confusion over the mobile phone. It is not clear whether the confusion came from police or journalists but The Nation (and others) reported on 4 Oct that the two told police that they had raped the woman and killed her, before stealing her mobile phone and other belongings, and destroyed the unit at the back of their living quarters. If this really were the case, a revision to the confessions would need to be arranged but that shouldn't be a problem.

Looking at one of the crime scene photographs, there is something that could be a phone next the articles of clothing on the beach in the foreground but the resolution is not high enough to say for sure exactly what it is.

looks like a phone not sure what else it could be.

[johnj]

All my Thai friends that are not rich influential, mafia or RTP's. Non of them believe that these Burmese guys committed these murders, more to the point, why has some of the influential Thais on Kao Toh, refused to give DNA? if they've done nothing wrong, why aren't they interested in giving DNA., to clear their good names. What a joke.!

[rickirs]

"investigators would tomorrow sign a document confirming that the DNA samples given by the two Myanmar men matched those found on the victim’s body."

How about a certified document signed by a qualified forensic DNA Analyst who actually examined the DNA samples along with copies of all his notes? AND a certified document by another qualified forensic DNA analyst who completes a thorough technical review of the case from start to finish. A policeman saying, "Yep, we have a match - trust me" should not be enough to convict someone of 1st degree murder.

The timeline for DNA testing for a single sample takes up to 60 hours if its it related to a murder. Yet the authorities said they took hundreds of samples from suspects and from an insecured crime scene. The inappropriate removal of DNA alone, especially from the victim, can invalidate the whole DNA testing process. Rather than rewarding this debacle of a 19th century police investigation, General Prayuth should be bringing in some of the world's most renowned forensic DNA analysts to protect the credibility of the government to correctly investigate murder. But the authorites refused such assistance when offered. What was the fear?

[BV70]

There can't be an independent investigation, DNA review, or whatever as the crime occurred under Thai jurisdiction. The only way another crime agency can legally get involved is if officially invited to by the Thai authorities.

[TTom911]

the thais did not have sophisticated DNA testing. They had the USA FBI do it to obtain the enthicity of the men. The British also have the DNA. Forget any switching. Way too complicated way too costly if caught - even the possiblility of life in prison for someone to play with this DNA. Maybe they made mistakes but they caught them.

This is not a huge island. The police are limited in what they know, etc. If I was at all critical of the police - which I am not - I would think the leasson learned is a need for the country to have an expert crime scene team. In western countries thay have these people. They would have flown immediately to the scene and taken over. It is too diificult and too expensive to have high level investiagtors on all the small islands and small towns for any country.

the sad point is they THEY ARE NOT INTERESTED in applying any reliable procedures and techniques here! They WANT to be able to mess around at discretion and the last they want is "transparency" which would come with such changes. That's also why they will not want to involve externals. Pride is just a cheap "plaster term", they just want to be able to corrupt any diligent process without anyone catching them. Plain and simple. And unless there would be financial repercussions from tourists and businesses turning their back on Thailand, that will not change in a million years.

[traveller 2020]

Wonder what Seam Mcann really knows ??? He's gone very quiet ? Why ? Anyone think as that he was interviewed by police the next morning and still very much under the influence of something ?? Must of been a pretty wild party , plenty of nasty , incorrectly produced ? drugs available on KT ? Wonder if he went on a bender ? perhaps did some things he wasnt aware of , and thawed out later the next morning then panicked and hid until he could leave , OK he was supposed to have been checked out by the local RTP and cleared , hmmm wonder if his family had made some contribution to access his sudden departure , its happened after people are under the influence and gone off the rails , wonder if he was involved ???

[AGareth2]

There can't be an independent investigation, DNA review, or whatever as the crime occurred under Thai jurisdiction. The only way another crime agency can legally get involved is if officially invited to by the Thai authorities.

the good general has said the dna matches

end

[SjaakNL2013]

I don't know why people keep going on about these phones.

More curiously is why davids DNA is confirmed not on the hoe that is said to be the murder weapon.

The police said right from the start, the hoe was not the weapon used on David.

Now, they insist it was.

Second curiosity is , there is not a scrap of DNA or evidence putting David and Hannah physically together in any way shape or form.

As they would have everyone believe in the re-enactment.

Forget about the phones.

DNA on the hoe is the question.

I agree that the DNA is important. It's the key to the solution of this double murder case. But in this case the RTP have the key, the lock and the locksmith to manipulate till all fit. This make this all so sad and place the RTP in the key role of this operation.

[nonb]

I really want to see those two burmeses play guitar and sing along in English

[traveller 2020]

umm a Bangkok taxi driver recently told me during the Suthep protests ,Thaksin and Suthep same same , everyone in Thailand the same , corruption , before Thailand NO corruption , about 100 years ago !

I think everyone reading this post and everyone else on this planet knows this is the truth !

[apetley]

Police address criticisms over arrest of Myanmar suspects.

The headline is misleading. Although they may have addressed some of the other criticisms elsewhere, this article deals only with the confusion over the mobile phone. It is not clear whether the confusion came from police or journalists but The Nation (and others) reported on 4 Oct that the two told police that they had raped the woman and killed her, before stealing her mobile phone and other belongings, and destroyed the unit at the back of their living quarters. If this really were the case, a revision to the confessions would need to be arranged but that shouldn't be a problem.

Looking at one of the crime scene photographs, there is something that could be a phone next the articles of clothing on the beach in the foreground but the resolution is not high enough to say for sure exactly what it is.

I'm seeing nothing but a belt.

[JohnThailandJohn]

They got the guys and now they will have their day in court. Videos, Witnesses, Confession, physical evidence and DNA. The suspects have lawyers who will be able to take their DNA again and compare it to that originally taken from the crime scene and analyzed in Thailand and Singapore.

It really is pathetic that faux internet forensic experts are going on with tiny bits of information, early police theories and imperfect reporting to come up with the most idiotic theories and then passing these off as plausible by pretending other facts don't exist.

The UK will not ask to become part of the investigation no matter how many people sign an internet petition. Like the rest of this nonsense, this is just not the way things work.

Most of you are no interested in justice, you just don't like who it turned out to be because you want to blame a Thai (specifically a rich one simply because he is rich) while others are angry and distrust the police. Get over it, the case is now going to be in the courts hands and it is so highly unlikely all the evidence including DNA (which can be verified again) are all a set-up.

While the police without doubt made mistakes it is just idiotic the way some our pretending. The want transparency but they can;t handle even receiving a little info. OMFG, so the police didn't know who did this originally and focused their attention on numerous suspects until landing on these two whose DNA matched ... this is the way many investigations go around the world. You take reports as gold when it suites your need for a conspiracy but even the most uninformed of those of us in Thailand know the press is crap and things are lost in translation.

The DNA matches and we all know as well as the police it can be verified again and again as long as the two suspects bodies are around. So go off on idiotic phone and unmissing video BS to make yourself feel better but it just comes off as desperate and illogical and dishonest.

Edited October 6, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[NCFC]

1. They found the men first day, and questioned and released though they said they were close to the victims singing, why not they tested the DNA of these men on the same day, instead of chasing the scared farang men running away from Kho-Tao after the murder happened ?

2. How the verified DNA report, the samples from Victims body on the 8th and samples from the men on 15th. Who is the witness for this ? Police alone cannot give witness. Doctors and medical staff should witness the proof.

For 20 years, Thai Police have bad reputation from Saudi theft and murder incident. More than saving the tourism by pointing some scapegoat victims, they should come up with real truth to make sure Thailand is having a fair judicial system.

I feel sorry for the migrant staff here, they work for low salaries on maid/labor visa and no other benefits they can get except spending their money here. Please show some mercy on them rather than using them and making them scape goats!

Do you think the police keep DNA testing equipment on Koh Tao? I expect they had to ship in everything, including, DNA forensic experts from Bangkok.

[mango66]

Good that the police cleared that up.

So that's one conspiracy you guys cross off your list after about 1000 posts.

Now let's move onto the DNA.

It's stands for national dyslexics association you know.

Anyway the noose is getting tighter around these scumbags necks as more will revealed in the days ahead.

Even perry mason would get these guys off.

YOU FORGOT TO COUNT;

ZTHE POLICE HAVE STILL 3 IN THEIR POCKETS

( from the 3 myanmar boys where they confirmed the murder

in their sms send each other )

But that will shown only, if DNA will be found fake !

[JohnThailandJohn]

Police address criticisms over arrest of Myanmar suspects.

The headline is misleading. Although they may have addressed some of the other criticisms elsewhere, this article deals only with the confusion over the mobile phone. It is not clear whether the confusion came from police or journalists but The Nation (and others) reported on 4 Oct that the two told police that they had raped the woman and killed her, before stealing her mobile phone and other belongings, and destroyed the unit at the back of their living quarters. If this really were the case, a revision to the confessions would need to be arranged but that shouldn't be a problem.

Looking at one of the crime scene photographs, there is something that could be a phone next the articles of clothing on the beach in the foreground but the resolution is not high enough to say for sure exactly what it is.

I'm seeing nothing but a belt.

Conspiracy people see what they want to see while ignoring facts. They also cannot accept when they are wrong. They just won;t let go of the phone conspiracy even though each time they are proved wrong they take it to a new level including now basing their findings on unclear photos.

What would be funny if not sad is they spent days before comparing a picture of Hannah's phone at the pub with the phone police stated the receieved of hers the next day and allowed the press to photograph. Of course these were the same phones but then they wanted to believe this was the same phone police found at the suspects. Their theory was the big bad police with so much experience in corruption would take this phone, the showed early on after the deaths, and would plant it at the suspects weeks later ... and the motive of course is to protect a rich kid who was in Bangkok the day of the murderers and whom their is not reason to believe was involved. Oh, and if not him then somebody in his family.

Nobody knows if he gave DNA (despite his not being there) but although the father initially publicly refused he also publicly stated two days later he had no problem with it. More insane is these conspiracy people don;t believe the DNA results now and would simply say the DNA was faked with the rich kids ... So, why even make an issue? Why, because it distracts from the facts and reality.

Edited October 6, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[ChrisY1]

lets hope and pray that the british government get seriously involved.

No other government will get involved.........do you really think they care after the British High Commissioner gave such praise to the RTP......?

C'mon.....culprits found....confessions received.....re-enactment went as planned (albeit bizarre)......it's over!

But I'm angry like everyone else here!

[AGareth2]

Wonder what Seam Mcann really knows ??? He's gone very quiet ? Why ? Anyone think as that he was interviewed by police the next morning and still very much under the influence of something ?? Must of been a pretty wild party , plenty of nasty , incorrectly produced ? drugs available on KT ? Wonder if he went on a bender ? perhaps did some things he wasnt aware of , and thawed out later the next morning then panicked and hid until he could leave , OK he was supposed to have been checked out by the local RTP and cleared , hmmm wonder if his family had made some contribution to access his sudden departure , its happened after people are under the influence and gone off the rails , wonder if he was involved ???

looked out of it to me

seems he was still hallucinating

maybe he is in rehab?

[TTom911]

They got the guys and now they will have their day in court. Videos, Witnesses, Confession, physical evidence and DNA. The suspects have lawyers who will be able to take their DNA again and compare it to that originally taken from the crime scene and analyzed in Thailand and Singapore.

It really is pathetic that faux internet forensic experts are going on with tiny bits of information, early police theories and imperfect reporting to come up with the most idiotic theories and then passing these off as plausible by pretending other facts don't exist.

The UK will not ask to become part of the investigation no matter how many people sign an internet petition. Like the rest of this nonsense, this is just not the way things work.

Most of you are no interested in justice, you just don't like who it turned out to be because you want to blame a Thai (specifically a rich one simply because he is rich) while others are angry and distrust the police. Get over it, the case is now going to be in the courts hands and it is so highly unlikely all the evidence including DNA (which can be verified again) are all a set-up.

While the police without doubt made mistakes it is just idiotic the way some our pretending. The want transparency but they can;t handle even receiving a little info. OMFG, so the police didn't know who did this originally and focused their attention on numerous suspects until landing on these two whose DNA matched ... this is the way many investigations go around the world. You take reports as gold when it suites your need for a conspiracy but even the most uninformed of those of us in Thailand know the press is crap and things are lost in translation.

The DNA matches and we all know as well as the police it can be verified again and again as long as the two suspects bodies are around. So go off on idiotic phone and unmissing video BS to make yourself feel better but it just comes off as desperate and illogical and dishonest.

you left your brain on the kitchen counter, my friend... waste of time to reply further

[Briandajew]

So 'addressing the criticisms' actual means just changing the story they gave out previously because they had been caught out.

It seems that these idiots think that they can just spout their usual claptrap and everyone is going to just accept it - Maybe this time they will actually wake up and see that this time they have gone too far. They are ending up like rabbits eyes in the headlights given their incompetence in handling this case. I honestly think that they could not believe that anyone would actually question their story.

This time these fools in brown have drawn the international community and their outrage right down on them, scrutinizing their pathetic sad joke of an investigation.

I hope people here are signing that petition at Change.org requesting intervention from the UK Government, last time I looked they had over 12000 sign ups.

This needs to be investigated correctly for the sake of those two kids and their families. I have never seen such garbage from what is supposed to be the enforcers of the law as I have in this debacle.

It is absolutely fantastic to see that so many people here are not just going to roll over and accept this travesty as an investigation, those in charge of this investigation should be hanging their heads in shame. I have never seen such a disgraceful display over these past few weeks by the people charged to uphold the law of this country they are a disgrace.

[manhood]

After this case of demonstrating the incompetence, the criminal strucutures in the police work and the police by itself nobody never ever can believe anything in that kind of way and work of police!

Sure we anyway not believe into the police at all! But now its much more out in the world and in other countries they can see what is going on here and sure start thinking about Thailand: what kind of country is that?!???! Want to be democratic and well organized and handled by goverment!

Thailand is far far from that!

Smileing Thailand has lost its smile ong time already!

[sweatalot]

There can't be an independent investigation, DNA review, or whatever as the crime occurred under Thai jurisdiction. The only way another crime agency can legally get involved is if officially invited to by the Thai authorities.

I think you are right.

But if everything was right in this case it would be a relief for the Thai police to invite an independent agency.

And then the case would be closed and stay closed