Koh Tao murder report: Prosecutors seek changes

[Dogmatix]

Not wishing to be disrespectful to the good general but please sir, the prosecutors disagreed with your assessment that the police did a perfect job in investigating the case.

[Dogmatix]

To me there are only 2 outcomes:

1. The 2 Burmese did it, or

2. If they didn't do it, they have been placed close enough to the scene and time such that at 4 AM they would have seen and/or observed commotion to an extent much more than they seem to have revealed.

3. a Thai "Boss" lost face and wanted revenge, got his 2 subordinates to subdue the couple, had his way first (naturally), then allowed his lackeys to have their turns and dispose of the evidence. The Boss's family find out and are horrified, send the Boss to BKK and get others to fabricate "video" and "paper" alibis. Boss's family make secret deals with the K Tao police and with the 2 minions, whilst publicly claiming to forget how to get in contact with the relative. Then miraculously the Boss surfaces (on cue), feigning being too busy studying to look at his phone and to notice the wall-to-wall news.

4. Something completely different.

5. The police version is the gospel truth.

3a -- That girl snubbed me -- no girl has ever snubbed me! -- I know I'll just wait until she is out on the beach at 4 AM and bash her head in then escape on the 6:08 flight and have all the airport surveillance tapes erased -- also pay off those 2 Burmese guys on the beach to never say they witnessed the whole thing. Simple.

I think this scenario has a lot of credibility and something like this was suggested by CSI LA early on.

If correct, the Boss is unlikely to have relied on just recently arrived Burmese workers. He would more likely have been accompanied by some of his own trusted Thai enforcers who may have done dirty work with him or his dad before, since they apparently control the whole island by fear. Perhaps Boss was angry enough at the loss of face that he was the one who grabbed the hoe and started whacking either David or Hannah with it, making the situation escalate out of control from there. Maybe a Thai goon used it. Conspicuous by its absence is any report of finger print evidence from the hoe, so it could have been used by anyone or several might have taken turns. Certainly the technique used on Hannah is different from the more gentlemanly swings used on David, if indeed the hoe was used on him at all. Did all who used it have the presence of mind to use gloves but then just left the hoe where it could be easily found without bothering to even wash off the blood in the sea? I don't think so.

The Burmese may have recruited to help out and allowed to rape a blond woman as their reward. Or maybe not. The DNA evidence linking them is suspect as they passed the DNA screening the first time around.

Edited October 9, 2014 by Dogmatix

[lensta]

Almost every criminal will deny that he committed the crime, especially after talking to a lawyer, so their denial is meaningless.

So is their confession if it was made because of being tortured

[stephen terry]

Andrew Drummond - Koh Tao update relates the latest interview wed Oct 8th with the third Burmese man. I suggest every poster on this thread reads it before commenting or rehashing old news.

[bertty]

"However, both suspects insisted [to me] that they had committed the crimes," said the human-rights commissioner.

Just asking but..........does that statement not sound really strange to you ? I mean insisted ?

"He said they told him they had not used condoms while sexually violating the female victim, contrary to earlier police statements that sperm carrying their DNA was found on the outside of condoms".

Classic!!!! Come on then people, now tell mw that these two Burmese ARE NOT rapists.

Please read this statement of fact several times if you have to - it basically say's that the police evidence is wrong as "they didn't use condoms when they raped her!!!!.

Still think that they are innocent little defenceless darlings???????????

We win the day and are fully vindicated in our beliefs!!! Well done TJT and any others in our camp!!

Oh dear, your carer popped down to the shops and forgot to put you in the padded room again.

Are you going to tell me that they NEVER raped her after they insisted they did to their own people??? No!!! thought not!!

Time to remove your blinkers and admit that you, like so many others on this forum got it so terribly wrong!!!

Anyone out there gonna admit it??

Fortunately I don't wear blinkers.

The only time these boys have spoken to their own people they denied all involvement.

Now please 'cough' and go bore someone else. Thank you.

Edited October 9, 2014 by bertty

[SICHONSTEVE]

Almost every criminal will deny that he committed the crime, especially after talking to a lawyer, so their denial is meaningless.

So is their confession if it was made because of being tortured

Were they being tortured when the admitted rape to their own people, INSISTING that they raped her because they were drunk????

Talking about self-implication of the highest order.

What's wrong with you people, can't you understand anything?? They have ADMITTED raping her for christ's sake, what other evidence is needed?

Wake up will you!!!

[djhotsox]

I will not be satisfied of ever knowing the truth until the one missing piece is added to complete this puzzle and I think more effort should be put into obtaining this missing piece.

Sean. His statement. Find him. I would bet he can piece it all together. If he was completely innocent he wouldn't be so silent. Or would he?

Find Sean and you solve this case.

[Artisi]

"However, both suspects insisted [to me] that they had committed the crimes," said the human-rights commissioner.

Just asking but..........does that statement not sound really strange to you ? I mean insisted ?

Although i Absolutely do not believe these two acted alone.

I would like to believe that these young boys were not involved at all.

Still, people should prepare themselves for the fact that the boys may be in part responsible for some sections of the crime.

That is why i will not contribute to a fund defending them.

Though i would contribute to a fund to pay a private person to investigate the truth of what happened. Namely how david died, since it is not possible for him to have been hit with a hoe. As it had not David dna. And who used the condom, . And the sequence of events how it happened. And who are the other culprits.

I would suggest that the British police forensic team have sufficiently knowledge to ascertain how he died and a full report would already be in the hands of those who will act on it when the time is right. Of course you realise the British police unlike the Thai don't mouth-off all day with bullsh1t stories changeable every day to suit the current situation.

[Toscano]

"However, both suspects insisted [to me] that they had committed the crimes," said the human-rights commissioner.

Just asking but..........does that statement not sound really strange to you ? I mean insisted ?

No it doesn't , because surely what the Human Rights Commissioner was trying to do , was to give them the option to deny the accusatios and charges against them .

Despite some degree of persuasion to the contrary , the accused " insisted "that they had committed the crime .

[SICHONSTEVE]

Still waiting!!!

[Oziex1]

Considering the village chief and his family would be getting kickbacks from allot of the money spent on the Island it would be nice to see it turned into ghost town.

Haven't you heard the 15,000 room accommodation on the Island is 90% full.

The boat traffic to do that over the last few days must have looked like a re enactment of the D Day landing.

[stephen terry]

Still waiting!!!

Andrew Drummond - Koh Tao update relates the latest interview wed Oct 8th with the third Burmese man. I suggest every poster on this thread reads it before commenting or rehashing old news.

[lensta]

"However, both suspects insisted [to me] that they had committed the crimes," said the human-rights commissioner.

Just asking but..........does that statement not sound really strange to you ? I mean insisted ?

"He said they told him they had not used condoms while sexually violating the female victim, contrary to earlier police statements that sperm carrying their DNA was found on the outside of condoms".

Classic!!!! Come on then people, now tell mw that these two Burmese ARE NOT rapists.

Please read this statement of fact several times if you have to - it basically say's that the police evidence is wrong as "they didn't use condoms when they raped her!!!!.

Still think that they are innocent little defenceless darlings???????????

We win the day and are fully vindicated in our beliefs!!! Well done TJT and any others in our camp!!

Oh dear, your carer popped down to the shops and forgot to put you in the padded room again.

Are you going to tell me that they NEVER raped her after they insisted they did to their own people??? No!!! thought not!!

Time to remove your blinkers and admit that you, like so many others on this forum got it so terribly wrong!!!

Anyone out there gonna admit it??

Double post:-((

Edited October 9, 2014 by lensta

[Oziex1]

Almost every criminal will deny that he committed the crime, especially after talking to a lawyer, so their denial is meaningless.

As is their confession

[SICHONSTEVE]

Considering the village chief and his family would be getting kickbacks from allot of the money spent on the Island it would be nice to see it turned into ghost town.

Haven't you heard the 15,000 room accommodation on the Island is 90% full.

The boat traffic to do that over the last few days must have looked like a re enactment of the D Day landing.

It seems that you lot of deniers has succeeded in doing the opposite to what you wanted in turning this (via social media) into a curiosity circus and filled the hotel rooms for the hoteliers.

I'm sure that they welcome your interference as you have made their lives easier in a bad moment!!!

[razer]

If the police and the PM are so sure the evidence and investigation are "excellent" then let an independent body like INTERPOL review the case and publish a statement.

[boomerangutang]

I'd rather see the title: 'prosecutors seek truth' rather than 'prosecutors seek changes'

It rather sounds like prosecutors are saying to police investigators: 'the frame-up doesn't look credible enough. Fill in some of the blanks, so we can wrap this up, get the judges to nod approvingly, execute the Burmese, and tourist money can get back on track for the island.'

[lensta]

Still waiting!!!

"Meanwhile, Parinya Sirisarakarn, a member of the National Human Rights Commission (NHRC), yesterday gave new information about forensic evidence and claims made by the two suspects - Maung Saw and Maung Win - whom he had met.

He said they told him they had not used condoms while sexually violating the female victim, contrary to earlier police statements that sperm carrying their DNA was found on the outside of condoms.

Parinya also said a Rohingya interpreter was used during the police interrogation of the two suspects, who are from Rakhine state, who allegedly bore a grudge against Rohingya people, apart from their different languages.

He added that both suspects bore wounds as a result of what they claimed was "the police not treating them properly".

"However, both suspects insisted [to me] that they had committed the crimes," said the human-rights commissioner."

I believe Parinya Sirisarakarn is Thai not Burmese so how do you come up with "They admitted it to their own people". You are full of sh it!!

[bertty]

Considering the village chief and his family would be getting kickbacks from allot of the money spent on the Island it would be nice to see it turned into ghost town.

Haven't you heard the 15,000 room accommodation on the Island is 90% full.

The boat traffic to do that over the last few days must have looked like a re enactment of the D Day landing.

It seems that you lot of deniers has succeeded in doing the opposite to what you wanted in turning this (via social media) into a curiosity circus and filled the hotel rooms for the hoteliers.

I'm sure that they welcome your interference as you have made their lives easier in a bad moment!!!

Well Oziex1 That went so far over his head it almost hit a plane.

[culicine]

Sounds to me like the interpreter is the one saying they confessed. The interpreter who is possibly being paid by the police to get the confession, the interpreter that both suspects say they are afraid of, the same interpreter that supposedly beat the suspects along with police. Hello????????????????????????????????? Maybe get a different interpreter. That thought ever cross your mind. I think these two are not guilty, and the two guys in Sean Mcana's photos and the son of the chief need to be re-examined. The police don't want to do this because they are protecting their own. CSI LA says a student at the university said the son of the chief didn't show up until the 16th and had bruises and a scratch on his neck. There is 2 minutes of missing cctv footage. The dna of mon and the others needs to be independently verified. It is real easy for the police to get everyone off their ass. Say ok, we will allow an independent dna test to be done on these 2 suspects. And an independent dna test done of all these big guys in koh tao. Nobody with a Thai name can be involved. If they did that we would know the true killer and nobody would question anything. Of course the police won't do this because it would require honesty and common sense, two things they are lacking. This is disgusting.

The interpreter is the local roti vendor lol. So he's also in the pocket of the police no doubt. Lord knows what happened during that interrogation. I would take they confession with a grain of salt and now it looks like the confessions have been retracted. Same as their special witness that is being held - he has also denied knowing what happened to the victims on that night.

[Dogmatix]

I believe that Pancakeman added a little nutella to the story to sweeten it up for his police bosses.

He is an illegal immigrant and must be facing a whacking himself following by confiscation of pancake stall and other assets with deportation at the Ranong crossing point as topping, if the police are not pleased with his performance. He has a right to look unhappy.

Edited October 9, 2014 by Dogmatix

[SICHONSTEVE]

"He said they told him they had not used condoms while sexually violating the female victim, contrary to earlier police statements that sperm carrying their DNA was found on the outside of condoms"

Let me help you complete the sentence:

They insisted that they didn't wear condoms whilst they raped her!!!

Sorry!! just realised, that bit was near the beginning of the sentence - do you not understand what this means?? surely you can't be that ignorant!!

Edited October 9, 2014 by SICHONSTEVE

[bellabenji]

Most criminals deny deny deny. Why did both murder suspects confess so easily.

It goes against what all criminals normally do. Something is definitely amiss.

[Lex Talionis]

The only time these boys have spoken to their own people they denied all involvement.

"Meanwhile, the Myanmar embassy-appointed lawyer for the two men - identified by the Democratic Voice of Burma website as Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun - have told two different media outlets that the suspects confessed to him that they killed the pair - albeit unintentionally and while drunk."

[Dogmatix]

"He said they told him they had not used condoms while sexually violating the female victim, contrary to earlier police statements that sperm carrying their DNA was found on the outside of condoms"

Let me help you complete the sentence:

They insisted that they didn't wear condoms whilst they raped her!!!

How was their DNA supposed to found on the outside of condoms. Did police say they sodomised each other with condoms before raping the victim without them? Where is the other condom?

It is pathetic that local media can print such absolute nonsense in a serious cash where two men might be executed. What did they really say and how did he what they were asked or replied, if Banana Pancake or a similar unqualifed translator was provided as the sole interpreter?

Edited October 9, 2014 by Dogmatix

[SOTIRIOS]

.....speechless......

[Toscano]

I cannot understand any misunderstanding related to a condom being found at the murder scene . The Englishman David may well have used a condom making love to the girl , when they were discovered and both bludgeoned to death . David may have tried to fight off their assailants , but ended up in the sea , apparently drowning .

Rapists would never use a condom ! Thais or men of other ethnicity are likely not to use a condom , because they simply wouldn't have one , couldn't be bothered to buy one .

Young women in Thailand are not too concerned , either don't afford the pill or can't be bothered to buy or take it .

There is no doubt that the sperm of these two men was found in the vagina of the girl , who was very likely already dead at the time .

[testosterone]

not sure, what everyone is waffling about those two clowns.

- they repeatedly confessed to the crime

- they confessed to their lawyer having raped the victim

- they were at the crime scene around the time (they said so, 3rd man=friend said so, know when they came back)

- if anything, then the CCTV-runner looks like one of them (skinny migrant bar worker)

- they never claimed torture, not even to their lawyer "not treated well" (only their friends believed of torture)

- if anyone, then they blamed the pancake man of mistreating - who then further attended every HumanRights-meeting

- we never saw a single pic of any of their torture-wounds, even though the guardian will have seen them

- newspaper should be the first to publish those torture pics, no ?

is everyone around this case retarded ?

Edited October 9, 2014 by testosterone

[Artisi]

Wow a very very interesting report. Nobody saw the kid at uni till the 16th and he had scratches on his arm and neck..... If that's true I don't have words to describe the people from the bottom to the top trying to cover this up. Its just unfathomable... Let's get a journalist to the uni to start investigating these claims to c if anyone can back up this story... Come on you uni students.. Did u see this kid with scratches on his neck and arms. Speak up, its your chance to get rid of the rotten core of this country or at least the start. DNA would be left under Hanna's finger nails. . This needs some very serious looking into....

It would have been looked at in the UK.

[seahorse]

"However, both suspects insisted [to me] that they had committed the crimes," said the human-rights commissioner.

Just asking but..........does that statement not sound really strange to you ? I mean insisted ?

Although i Absolutely do not believe these two acted alone.

I would like to believe that these young boys were not involved at all.

Still, people should prepare themselves for the fact that the boys may be in part responsible for some sections of the crime.

That is why i will not contribute to a fund defending them.

Though i would contribute to a fund to pay a private person to investigate the truth of what happened. Namely how david died, since it is not possible for him to have been hit with a hoe. As it had not David dna. And who used the condom, . And the sequence of events how it happened. And who are the other culprits.

I would suggest that the British police forensic team have sufficiently knowledge to ascertain how he died and a full report would already be in the hands of those who will act on it when the time is right. Of course you realise the British police unlike the Thai don't mouth-off all day with bullsh1t stories changeable every day to suit the current situation.

Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice (1596): "Truth will come to light; murder cannot be hid long; a man's son may, but in the end truth will out."