Lawyers want DNA tested by UK police

[louse1953]

Meanwhile, tourists continue to flock to Koh Tao under the watchful eye of tourist police and volunteers. The number of tourists is not high but it is still the low season, with strong ocean currents and monsoon rains.

Meanwhile.... this is the funniest part.Blaming lack of tourists on the time of year, monsoon and currents..... OK.

But even if they were actually 'flocking back'..... It's like rubbing tourist's noses in it..... 'HAHAHA.... but ya still coming back eh suckers.'

Well,they are.

[AGareth2]

Hopefully this will happen but I have my doubts.

As for my countries Ambo to Thailand, he should be sacked for his disgraceful comment last week, calling the RTP investigation 'exemplary'.

quote please

[louse1953]

Some people seem oblivious to the fact that thailand is a member of the United Nations which has a number of tools available which can be used to persuade thailand to co-operate.

The IMF probably being the most important one to a developing nation.

Remember,the IMF is not my father.

[wabothai]

Mr. Kent it is better to keep silent. You have already lost your face.

[anon7867763]

The IMF is an organization which -- along with the World Bank and IBRD -- is separate from the UN.

Wrong

Specialized agencies

Main article: List of specialized agencies of the United Nations

The UN Charter stipulates that each primary organ of the UN can establish various specialized agencies to fulfill its duties.^[87] Some of the best-known agencies are the International Atomic Energy Agency, the Food and Agriculture Organization, UNESCO (United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization), the World Bank, and the World Health Organization (WHO). The UN performs most of its humanitarian work through these agencies. Examples include mass vaccination programmes (through WHO), the avoidance of famine and malnutrition (through the work of the WFP), and the protection of vulnerable and displaced people (for example, by UNHCR).^[88]

^Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations

Half wrong , the IMF is not there

Always best to read before you make statements I find.

[phuketandsee]

Some people seem oblivious to the fact that thailand is a member of the United Nations which has a number of tools available which can be used to persuade thailand to co-operate.

The IMF probably being the most important one to a developing nation.

This is not a developing nation. This case has clearly proved that. If anything, it is going backwards.

[KamalaRider]

It's the only way. Forget what's happened.

Hannah's body was sent directly to the UK. You can bet your bippy that the UK took DNA samples from her cavities. They have the DNA of the rapist(s).

Now all they need is verified swabs from the accused to compare and I'll bet my bippy they don't match.

Yes, they have this DNA, for sure. We can trust them

Since lawyers are calling for Burmese against expertise they can easily compare.

And I bet the hat of my ancestor that DNA match.

It seems to me impossible that the Thai police have lied about the DNA. Too big, too random, too risky. This would obviously be a conspiracy by idiots.

Contrary to overall racist and contemptuous opinions posted here I do not feel the conspiracy and I think that Thais are not idiots.

I have been there myself where your at, couldn't for my life believe some Thais are that stupid, but the longer I have lived here, the more I'm baffled over how stupid they think we are.

[wackybacky]

Hopefully this will happen but I have my doubts.

As for my countries Ambo to Thailand, he should be sacked for his disgraceful comment last week, calling the RTP investigation 'exemplary'.

Follow the story.

He already denied making that statement, it was just another RTP lie.

Yes, that was Somsat that came out with that one... gushing to the Thai media that there is no cover up and Mr Kent has already congratulated us on an 'exemplary investigation'.

Next day on Mark Kent's twitter feed..... 'No I didn't'.

But even if he did.... Isn't it a bit child like to go out in public and brag he was given these thanks?... I mean, it's a bit like one of my kids when you congratulate them, they beam with pleasure and can't wait to run off and tell someone.

Now he looks a complete burk....... Somebody needs to remind him that 'self praise..... is no praise at all'.

[Dogmatix]

The police are saying they haven't been informed of the retraction of the confession which still stands as far as they are concerned but they say it is unnecessary for their case because they have ample evidence from CCTV,DNA, new witnesses (after their first star witness recanted), the mobile phone etc.

Seems to me that the only incontrovertible piece of evidence they might have is the DNA. Even if the suspects are convicted on the basis of the DNA people at home and abroad will be convinced it was an unsound conviction, unless the DNA results are independently verified abroad. Few people doubt that the police would 'fix' DNA results to suit their chosen scapegoats. Prayuth said in Burma that police would never to set up scape goats in a big case, even though they have done it before

Prayuth needs to take a statesmanlike decision and order a new independent investigation with DNA testing in the UK and a human rights probe into the torture allegations. Otherwise this issue will dog him for the rest of his premiership and might even be the thing that brings him down, given the high expectations for police reform created by the coup.

[Phuketboy]

well lets see if the Junta will allow it.

Would be interesting if they allowed the Brits to investigate and they then asked if they could DNA test 'you know who. '

Now that would be interesting.

Never going to happen.

If past cases are anything to go by the Burmese will get off on corruption of evidence thus saving face with Burma and the real killers will remain at large.

It would be easy for the Brits to check the DNA of the accused with that which was found in the victim. The Junta can't stop it. The brits have the bodies back in the UK and the lawyers have access to the accused. Even if the Junta stops the lawyers from having access to the accused they can get DNA from the family. All they need is a hair from a hairbrush or anything that the accused has used.

[wabothai]

So if the lawyers find evidence that the boys are not guilty what is yhe police going to do? They must pay....

[wackybacky]

Meanwhile, tourists continue to flock to Koh Tao under the watchful eye of tourist police and volunteers. The number of tourists is not high but it is still the low season, with strong ocean currents and monsoon rains.

Meanwhile.... this is the funniest part.Blaming lack of tourists on the time of year, monsoon and currents..... OK.

But even if they were actually 'flocking back'..... It's like rubbing tourist's noses in it..... 'HAHAHA.... but ya still coming back eh suckers.'

Well,they are.

Not according to a girl on my skype who used to sell webspace for me to dive companies on Tao... She says quite the opposite, if fact she says it has been nice that the island has not attracted anywhere near the amount of 'freaks' (her words not mine) that normally comes over for the full moon party.

According to her, it is very quiet there, and she loves it. Why would she lie?.. what does she gain from that?

Why would Thais say the opposite in another report?.... Now that's a horse of a different colour... But YOU continue to take the Thai lead and I will stick with my own beliefs based on facts, logic and common sense.

[Equalizer]

Y in every report do they have to somewhere mention flocking tourists... Weird stuff. Mark Kent to little to late.... Let the justice process take its course.... What's that, suicide by days end. Sadly I fear their is no DNA to even be re tested. Release all the CCTV footage for a start. The airport CCTV footage would b handy also....

Dont understand what you are saying. Both the murder victims will have had tissue samples taken in the UK. Both the accused are alive. All the UK police need is a mouth swab from these two guys, not a lot to ask.

[Dogmatix]

In a related development, British Ambassador to Thailand Mark Kent urged Thai social media users not to spread disturbing photos relating to the case or passport photos and details of the victims, saying their families had already suffered a lot. He made the request via his Thai-language blog on Friday. He also urged the Thai mainstream mass media not to prejudge the accused and let the justice process run its course.

I suppose Kent feels he has to be seen to be doing something in response to Hannah's family complaining about the graphics pictures on the internet. But he doesn't dare point the finger at the police who are known to sell crime scene and morgue photographs and, in this case, allowed access to the crime scene to tourists and the general public, not to mention local mafia types who are regarded as suspects by just about everyone apart from the police. In the videos from the crime scene many people were seen taking souvenir pictures of the bodies with iPads and phones but there was no sign of a professional forensic photographer with proper equipment. In addition, the single worst thing that has happened to prejudge the accused is the police re-enactment circus, a practice they claimed to have stopped not so long ago in the face of public outrage. The horrible reality is that the publication of the crime scene photographs has created an awareness of the sheer brutality of the crimes and increased the anger of the Thai public that their police force appears to be trying to arrange a cover-up to benefit local patrons.

Edited October 12, 2014 by Dogmatix

[wabothai]

The police apparently has no idea about the power and knowledge of the social media. They are not used to looking beyond Thai borders.

[Dogmatix]

well lets see if the Junta will allow it.

Would be interesting if they allowed the Brits to investigate and they then asked if they could DNA test 'you know who. '

Now that would be interesting.

Never going to happen.

If past cases are anything to go by the Burmese will get off on corruption of evidence thus saving face with Burma and the real killers will remain at large.

It would be easy for the Brits to check the DNA of the accused with that which was found in the victim. The Junta can't stop it. The brits have the bodies back in the UK and the lawyers have access to the accused. Even if the Junta stops the lawyers from having access to the accused they can get DNA from the family. All they need is a hair from a hairbrush or anything that the accused has used.

Interesting point. The court doesn't have to admit it as evidence but the lawyers might be able to arrange it, assuming the Thai police pathologies didn't carefully clean all traces from the bodies (highly likely) and the UK pathologist took samples, which I am sure they would have, if traces were still there.

[Dogmatix]

well lets see if the Junta will allow it.

Would be interesting if they allowed the Brits to investigate and they then asked if they could DNA test 'you know who. '

Now that would be interesting.

Never going to happen.

If past cases are anything to go by the Burmese will get off on corruption of evidence thus saving face with Burma and the real killers will remain at large.

It would be easy for the Brits to check the DNA of the accused with that which was found in the victim. The Junta can't stop it. The brits have the bodies back in the UK and the lawyers have access to the accused. Even if the Junta stops the lawyers from having access to the accused they can get DNA from the family. All they need is a hair from a hairbrush or anything that the accused has used.

Interesting point. The court doesn't have to admit it as evidence but the lawyers might be able to arrange it, assuming the Thai police pathologies didn't carefully clean all traces from the bodies (highly likely) and the UK pathologist took samples, which I am sure they would have, if traces were still there.

[ScotBkk]

This is really good news. It would end all the speculations if UK test the DNA from everyone involved. If the Burmese really did it , it would probably come as a shock for the rest of the world and clear RTP . So if RTP really wants to clear their name this is the only way. If they refuse , well this could very well be a coverup.

Don't you mean DEFO ???

[loonodingle]

I seem to remember at one point the police saying they where seeking 2 people who had gone to bangkok. They refused to reveal the names at first. Then this Nomsod lad was named. So why was he a suspect In the first place. It was from witness statements. So why after a few grainy pic's and a very weak alibi do they leave him out.

[dieseldave1951]

lies covering lies covering lies covering lies just who do you belive now ambassadors, media, thai police, (ops no we know about them) thai politicians, (ops same applies) just WHO?????

Hopefully this will happen but I have my doubts.

As for my countries Ambo to Thailand, he should be sacked for his disgraceful comment last week, calling the RTP investigation 'exemplary'.

Follow the story.

He already denied making that statement, it was just another RTP lie.

[wackybacky]

Would be interesting if they allowed the Brits to investigate and they then asked if they could DNA test 'you know who. '

Now that would be interesting.

Never going to happen.

If past cases are anything to go by the Burmese will get off on corruption of evidence thus saving face with Burma and the real killers will remain at large.

It would be easy for the Brits to check the DNA of the accused with that which was found in the victim. The Junta can't stop it. The brits have the bodies back in the UK and the lawyers have access to the accused. Even if the Junta stops the lawyers from having access to the accused they can get DNA from the family. All they need is a hair from a hairbrush or anything that the accused has used.

I agree... It is incredibly easy to get this DNA test done. Especially on request from the Myanmar Embassy Lawyer.

Does Prayuth and his RTP cronies really want to start putting up obstacles to prevent it?

I can only think now that the only reaction will be to say... sure, WE will collect the samples from the suspects for you and you can test them. But seeing as a suspected cover up is in play, that won't be acceptable by the lawyers or the UK police.

So what to do?..... Because should the UK officially announce that these samples in fact do not match with the suspects in custody... Then the entire evidence will lose its credibility as it proves there is a stitch up going on and the entire police case crumbles, and questions will be asked and action will be demanded to be taken against the police investigators.

[DennisF]

And it's impossible a Thai bar girl would ask a farang for money for her sick father, if her father wasn't really sick?

Please do not compare bar girls with the RTP. Decent Thais despise bar girls.

This is not something you should joke about,

Define decent.

Many of these girls do what they do because they have no choice. Walk a mile in their shoes.

Despicable is a person who judges others.

[ScotBkk]

But then why does Sean McAnna have similar injuries to those received by David?

The two Burmese kids and tiny and have supposedly beaten up David who is strongly built and 6ft 3 (190cm) tall Hannah much taller than them also. So the beat up rape, kill and drag body to the sea yet they the tiny Burmese kids have not a single mark on their bodies?

Mean while class mates of nomsot (who refuses to take DNA test) claim to have seen scratches on his neck while he attended class the following morning in Bangkok.

This was not just a spur of the moment occasion where violence got out of hand.

This was a premeditated assassination by an uncontrolled enraged person/persons that became an overkill situation. They, with some profane and overindulged exertion that seemed to go farther than would be necessary to achieve its goal. Thus, or more so, with the capability to obliterate a target with a greater degree of effort than was required.

In passing, they don't look capable nor was they even compos mentis (not of sound mind - DRUNK) at the time or so we've been told ....

[richusa]

They kicked out the FBI........surely all evidence mucked up.

[changnaam]

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When the cctv footage was inspected, I recall mention that 60 cameras would be checked. If there were any showing 'unwanted' suspects they would by now be destroyed. The small bits of footage released included one where 2 minutes was removed.

It should be requested by the Myanmar lawyers that a list of all cctv cameras be provided, and all previously inspected - original - footage be released into evidence. If there are any missing it would be further evidence of tampering.

DNA testing has almost certainly been compromised, so it should indeed be necessary to take fresh samples from anyone present at the crime scene that morning - to exclude them from suspicion.

Something is niggling at the back of my mind; wasn't mention made of a 70% DNA match? I can't seem to find where that originated, and doubt the percentage aspect but have heard of partial match. Was this pursued at all?

Perhaps the bar owners did provide samples and there was a partial match. That is when the son was suddenly a 'person of interest' (they put it a bit stronger than that...) and the veil came down.

I still don't understand the argument of this 'missing 2 minutes' of CCTV coverage.

As far as I am aware, this was released as a review, with several sections clipped as there was nothing to bore the viewers with, ie, nothing relevant to the enquiry.

Someone along the line has speculated that this has been a deliberate attempt to conceal the identity of a third party and this has caused wildfire amongst the social media circuits.

Of course, I could be absolutely wrong about that. As could the social media.

If you look at the cctv of the guy which was going back and forward in only shorts. The first part of the clip he walks from left to right, then there is 2 minutes cut out and he is walking right to left. Look in the far left of the screen there is a shadow just going off the edge of the screen. It is obvious there are one or two people in front of him.

Why was it so important that this was not seen?

[ParadiseLost]

SEAN MCANNA holds the key!

What happened after this is also not clear, but we do know he fled the island & Thailand with lightspeed. Of course he was threatened by Mon & Co about his involvement, knowledge and LOYALTY going forward.

One point - he waited an entire week before the 7-11 incident. It is very unlikely anyone was hunting for him during this time as there are so few places to hide. My guess - he was under someone's protection, until he became a liability.

Someone must have a photo with him in it, dated 9 - 15 September - somewhere. His right forearm would be the thing to look for.

[changnaam]

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When the cctv footage was inspected, I recall mention that 60 cameras would be checked. If there were any showing 'unwanted' suspects they would by now be destroyed. The small bits of footage released included one where 2 minutes was removed.

It should be requested by the Myanmar lawyers that a list of all cctv cameras be provided, and all previously inspected - original - footage be released into evidence. If there are any missing it would be further evidence of tampering.

DNA testing has almost certainly been compromised, so it should indeed be necessary to take fresh samples from anyone present at the crime scene that morning - to exclude them from suspicion.

Something is niggling at the back of my mind; wasn't mention made of a 70% DNA match? I can't seem to find where that originated, and doubt the percentage aspect but have heard of partial match. Was this pursued at all?

Perhaps the bar owners did provide samples and there was a partial match. That is when the son was suddenly a 'person of interest' (they put it a bit stronger than that...) and the veil came down.

I still don't understand the argument of this 'missing 2 minutes' of CCTV coverage.

As far as I am aware, this was released as a review, with several sections clipped as there was nothing to bore the viewers with, ie, nothing relevant to the enquiry.

Someone along the line has speculated that this has been a deliberate attempt to conceal the identity of a third party and this has caused wildfire amongst the social media circuits.

Of course, I could be absolutely wrong about that. As could the social media.

If you look at the cctv of the guy which was going back and forward in only shorts. The first part of the clip he walks from left to right, then there is 2 minutes cut out and he is walking right to left. Look in the far left of the screen there is a shadow just going off the edge of the screen. It is obvious there are one or two people in front of him.

Why was it so important that this was not seen?

[changnaam]

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When the cctv footage was inspected, I recall mention that 60 cameras would be checked. If there were any showing 'unwanted' suspects they would by now be destroyed. The small bits of footage released included one where 2 minutes was removed.

It should be requested by the Myanmar lawyers that a list of all cctv cameras be provided, and all previously inspected - original - footage be released into evidence. If there are any missing it would be further evidence of tampering.

DNA testing has almost certainly been compromised, so it should indeed be necessary to take fresh samples from anyone present at the crime scene that morning - to exclude them from suspicion.

Something is niggling at the back of my mind; wasn't mention made of a 70% DNA match? I can't seem to find where that originated, and doubt the percentage aspect but have heard of partial match. Was this pursued at all?

Perhaps the bar owners did provide samples and there was a partial match. That is when the son was suddenly a 'person of interest' (they put it a bit stronger than that...) and the veil came down.

I still don't understand the argument of this 'missing 2 minutes' of CCTV coverage.

As far as I am aware, this was released as a review, with several sections clipped as there was nothing to bore the viewers with, ie, nothing relevant to the enquiry.

Someone along the line has speculated that this has been a deliberate attempt to conceal the identity of a third party and this has caused wildfire amongst the social media circuits.

Of course, I could be absolutely wrong about that. As could the social media.

If you look at the cctv of the guy which was going back and forward in only shorts. The first part of the clip he walks from left to right, then there is 2 minutes cut out and he is walking right to left. Look in the far left of the screen there is a shadow just going off the edge of the screen. It is obvious there are one or two people in front of him.

Why was it so important that this was not seen?

[GOLDBUGGY]

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The NHRC, meanwhile, is sending a team to examine the crime scene.

Why does this not imbue me with a warm glow of confidence? They are Thai after-all. Thailand is still under martial law and top brass have already declared the murderers can't be Thai.

The investigators were Thai officialdom
The forensics were done by Thai officialdom
NomSod, who should be a prime suspect is Thai and so is his lawyer
The forced admission of guilt was in the presence of officialdom with no attorneys present.
The claim of matching DNA (scapegoats and victim) was announced by Thai officialdom
The prosecutors are Thai
The judges will be Thai

....now we hear Thai NHRC is going to investigate.

Before the Burmese scapegoats had attorneys, it was like a couple small immigrants vs the Thai national football team. Now, it's a bit better. It's a couple of small guys with one or two added players vs the Thai national football team. And guess which team the ref is leaning strongly towards?

And the crime was committed in Thailand. ho would you expect to head up this investigation? China?

I hope the ref isn't leaning towards anything other than the truth.

Who says these guys are innocent? Just because after a team of lawyers showed up they changed there minds, and now everyone and their dog believe they are innocent?

Go On!

I would like to see a Team of Lawyers come rushing and show up for your case.

Unless of course it has world wide attention, like this one does.

And knowing this, now these Lawyers can become High Profile Lawyers, which later can charge High Profile Fees.

[draftvader]

That would be the most Thai answer. The British answer will be

on a hire motorbike riding to Sairee Beach

More seriously though there might be enough pressure back home with an election for somebody to vacation in Koh Tao and pick up something that the family have handled. It wouldn't be admissible but would be enough to form the basis of political pressure to do things properly. It might be that the government is unwilling to exercise any pressure without the knowledge that they are right.

Breaking the Thai law himself by NOT wearing a helmet. There is also a helmet law in the UK. Stupid man.

Looks like a B200 fine there plus the farang factor, lets call it a round B500.

You're forgetting the B5,000 for the scratch on the mirror!