Manchester City

[mrbojangles]

How long has Tevez been in England and he still needs a translator (poor one at that) at press conferences? Perhaps Sir Alex didn't talk to him much as he didn't like talking to him through a translator all the time...

I've know farang who've lived in Thailand for 20 years or more who can't speak a word of Thai. I hardly see that it's a problem with someone who's only been in England for three years using a translator.

Absolutely. Also, Tevez can understand and speak English alot more than he let's on. The problem is, if your'e in a press conference, the press pick up on every word you say. So sometimes it's best to speak in your native language so as not to drop a clanger.

[EastSaxCol]

How long has Tevez been in England and he still needs a translator (poor one at that) at press conferences? Perhaps Sir Alex didn't talk to him much as he didn't like talking to him through a translator all the time...

I've know farang who've lived in Thailand for 20 years or more who can't speak a word of Thai. I hardly see that it's a problem with someone who's only been in England for three years using a translator.

Absolutely. Also, Tevez can understand and speak English alot more than he let's on. The problem is, if your'e in a press conference, the press pick up on every word you say. So sometimes it's best to speak in your native language so as not to drop a clanger.

Bless him, I lived in Portugal at the same time as Bobby Robson managed Porto. And believe me it'd have been better if he hadn't tried to speak Portuguese.

[EastSaxCol]

... anyway. Back to the circus.

From The Times July 15, 2009

Mark Hughes urges John Terry to take up challenge

Oliver Kay, Football Correspondent

Mark Hughes is confident that John Terry will join Manchester City, tempted by a “new challenge”. Hughes signalled his growing belief yesterday that the Chelsea defender can be lured to the City of Manchester Stadium as the club unveiled Carlos Tévez as their latest signing.

Hughes suggested that the England captain would relish the opportunity to follow Gareth Barry, Tévez and, almost certainly, Emmanuel Adebayor to the world's richest club. If that was not enough, the plan is to make Terry the best-paid player in the Barclays Premier League, with a deal worth more than £200,000 a week.

Well, Mr Chelsea Heart hasn't publicly rejected that move ... fair play, it'd be hilarious if nothing else.

[LeungKen]

( perhaps this should have gone in the gossip thread but thought it might get a better reaction from MrBJ in here... .)

Your not gonna get a bit ken

PS. Is it also true that City are in the running for Beckham ?.

New one on me.

It's probably all B/S, but with your petty cash tin overflowing, one never knows..

http://www.goal.com/en/news/596/exclusive/...targeting-swoop

[bkkjames]

Adebayor passes Man City medical (bbc)

Adebayor almost left Arsenal last summer when AC Milan came calling

Emmanuel Adebayor has passed a medical and will move to Manchester City once his work permit is approved.

The Togo striker, who has spent three-and-a-half seasons at Arsenal, is believed to be valued at £25m.

The 25-year-old, who scored 16 times for the Gunners last season, has also been linked to AC Milan and Chelsea.

City boss Mark Hughes said as Carlos Tevez was unveiled: "There have been discussions and possibly a deal to be done but nothing has been concluded."

Speaking at the press conference to announce the signing of the former Manchester United striker, Hughes admitted that there could be more arrivals at the big-spending club before the start of the season.

"It may well be that opportunities will present themselves. We still have areas we want to strengthen," he said.

City are intent on building a new-look attack and as well as Tevez have also added Paraguayan Roque Santa Cruz to their ranks this summer, having signed Craig Bellamy last season.

The Eastlands outfit are eager to break into the Premier League's top four this coming season and have shown their determination with their close-season spending.

Midfielder Gareth Barry was bought from Aston Villa, and from under the noses of last season's Premier League runners-up Liverpool, for £12m and City paid Blackburn about £18m for Paraguay international forward Santa Cruz.

City completed a deal for Tevez on Tuesday - the Argentine joining after City paid a fee of about £25m to secure his registration from third party ownership after his contract with Premier League champions Manchester United expired.

And if Adebayor also makes the switch to Eastlands, City will have captured players from three of the leading six clubs in the top flight last season.

In Adebayor, City would be buying a player who has scored 62 goals in 142 appearances for Arsenal since he joined the Gunners from Monaco for £7m.

He hit 30 goals in the 2007/08 season but struggled with injuries in the last campaign and also incurred the wrath of some Arsenal fans, who felt the striker lacked commitment.

With the influx of big-name players at Eastlands comes a new challenge for manager Hughes, according to former Manchester City player Dennis Tueart.

He told BBC Radio 5 Live: "The big challenge for managers now is to manage extremely wealthy young men, who do not need to work beyond their football careers.

"How does that affect their psyche and professionalism? These are things that the manager has got to sort out

[Jimjim]

Ya but how often does a foreigner living in Thailand need to speak to the media? Hardly comparable situations. Of course you see many living in Thailand for years and years and not learning the language and I think that's bad as well, but we're talking about a professional footballer here. If you're a retiree or an English teacher with Western bosses or always being told you must speak only in English on campus to set an example you may not learn as much feeling you don't have to do so. But if you're working in a Thai office you can bet you should definitely be learning Thai. That's the situation Tevez finds himself in now. When I was in a Thai office I found it difficult so I started learning the language much better.

All I'm saying is I've heard before that he hasn't put in the effort to learn English too well and this just confirms it for me. Other footballers don't speak perfect English but they are always giving press conferences in English, showing they're making the effort to communicate in the language of the country in which they work.

I don't think it's a big deal, just think it's funny. I'd say the majority of foreign footballers who have played in England for 3 full years are definitely giving press conferences in English. They may not be perfect and make mistakes, but it's understood that they're not native speakers of English.

[EastSaxCol]

Ya but how often does a foreigner living in Thailand need to speak to the media? Hardly comparable situations. Of course you see many living in Thailand for years and years and not learning the language and I think that's bad as well, but we're talking about a professional footballer here. If you're a retiree or an English teacher with Western bosses or always being told you must speak only in English on campus to set an example you may not learn as much feeling you don't have to do so. But if you're working in a Thai office you can bet you should definitely be learning Thai. That's the situation Tevez finds himself in now. When I was in a Thai office I found it difficult so I started learning the language much better.

It is comparable in some ways. Taking aside that many ex-pats are just too lazy to bother and/or too intimidated to learn another language. It's just a fact that some can learn languages easier than others -- I won't go into the reasons here as there's more appropriate places on tv. But it is dependent on which side of the brain that one naturally uses.

Also it's not the case that that teaching English in Thai schools that you use only the target language. At least that's my experience of teaching in one of the top fee paying schools -- the one that Thaksin went to in Chiang Mai. My experiences in the Thai environment was entirely different in that respect to other countries in which I have taught. That was perhaps my major motivation in learning Thai in the first place.

As Mr.BJ suggests, perhaps Tevez feels nervous about saying the wrong thing with his limited English. I don't know, but I get the impression that he would find it difficult in any case. I know that when I have to address a group of people using Thai, I would sooner speak through an interpreter -- and I speak the language to a fair level of upper-intermediate competency.

All I'm saying is I've heard before that he hasn't put in the effort to learn English too well and this just confirms it for me. Other footballers don't speak perfect English but they are always giving press conferences in English, showing they're making the effort to communicate in the language of the country in which they work.

I don't think it's a big deal, just think it's funny. I'd say the majority of foreign footballers who have played in England for 3 full years are definitely giving press conferences in English. They may not be perfect and make mistakes, but it's understood that they're not native speakers of English.

As I've said, some people find it easier than others. My impression is that Tevez may find it very difficult in learning. I don't believe that he doesn't try but there are probably various reasons related to my initial hunch why he doesn't

[MSingh]

Ok, now i will say, City are now officialy exciting me & i don't even support them..

Fingers crossed you'll upset the Apple Cart this Year, left, right & centre & i think you will..

Fingers crossed you will break up the B*stard that is the " Top 4 ".

Fingers crossed you take us as 6 points for granted in both Games & underestimate us.

Fingers crossed you stay aware of who you are & keep your humour.

Good luck City & i reckon that deep down, most Supporters of a non " Top 4 " Club will be thinking the same...

[mrbojangles]

Good luck City & i reckon that deep down, most Supporters of a non " Top 4 " Club will be thinking the same...

Cheers Singhy

[mrbojangles]

From sky sports:-

City potential excites Hughes

Blues boss ready to tackle 'special season'

Manchester City boss admits the air of expectation sweeping around the club has him 'excited'.

The Blues have been busy in the transfer market this summer, looking to put the Abu Dhabi United Group's considerable riches to good use.

Gareth Barry, Roque Santa Cruz and Carlos Tevez have already been snapped up, while Emmanuel Adebayor and John Terry could yet join that trio at Eastlands.

The massive outlay is expected to see City mount a serious challenge for a top four finish in the Premier League next season, and Hughes has revealed that even he has been caught up in the anticipation of what could lie ahead.

"I do get excited," he said.

"There is a real feeling of anticipation for the coming season. There are a lot of things happening, players coming in and changes in and around the club. The first game everyone will see those changes first hand.

"Everybody connected with Manchester City would have to agree that this will be a very special season."

Hughes has publicly announced that he still intends to add further reinforcements to his squad during the transfer window, keen to piece together a side capable of competing in the upper echelons of the English top flight.

Keeping his ever-growing playing staff happy could prove to be a problem as the season progresses, but Hughes insists that issue will pose a welcome headache if the club prove to be successful.

"What I have to do is mould a team that is able to win games successfully and consistently," he added.

[MSingh]

You might like this..

Choose to Support a club from a city you've never been to

Choose to wear **** Grey Shirts, and then blame them when Southampton Stuff you

Choose your own Referee and Assistants

Choose to change the team you support every 10 Years

Choose to forget 1969 to 1993 ever existed

Choose to be Snubbed by every decent player around the world, and then pretend you didnt want them anyway

Choose not knowing the history of your club.

Choose Busby the Blue.

Choose Dennis Law’s backheel.

Choose Sir Bobby Ticket Tout.

Choose staging the World Cup in '66 and being handed a huge sum from the FA to develop your stadium but continue to bang on about City’s ground.

Choose opening the gates at Old Trafford in the 60s after kick off to let people in for free.

Choose forgetting you went 41 years without winning a trophy.

Choose your highest ever attendance being at Maine Road.

Choose that attendance still being lower than City's.

Choose United’s globalism and domination since the late '90s whilst forgetting the past.

Choose an air disaster as a marketing tool.

Choose forgetting about the survivors of ****** and kicking them out of their houses (which you owned) because they could no longer play football.

Choose waiting 22 years to set up a charity match for the families of ******.

Choose milking ****** for 50 years and then getting beat by ickle ciddy on your own soil.

Choose asking AIG to sponsor the ****** memorial.

Choose having statues of two City players outside your ground.

Choose being so obsessed with City that you have a permanent banner dedicated to us on the Stretford End.

Choose paying £28 million for Veron.

Choose 19,000 fans at Old Trafford to watch you play Middlesbrough when you were in Division One but pretend you have loyal support.

Choose the have-to-go-to-all-cup-games-because-you're-forced-to ticket policy.

Choose the USA.

Choose debt.

Choose pricing out your own fans in favour of corporate Londoners.

Choose having your own manager and players criticise your fans.

Choose prawn sandwiches.

Choose not being able to stand.

Choose being outsung by 3,000 travelling away fans each game.

Choose having Mick Hucknall and Eamon Holmes as your celebrity fans.

Choose FC United…if they become successful.

Choose to whinge all summer about clubs tapping up your best player, while you r busy tapping up Spurs’ best player

Choose Kidnap him at the airport while not even having permission to speak to him and then pay other £30Million for the ******

Choose to buy Alan Smith as a forward then when found out to be **** put him in mid-field and call Fergie a 'genius' and call Smith the 'new roy keane'.

Choose to go after Batistuta for 5yrs and him stil wanting nothing to do with you.

Choose to demonstrate about 'No yanks' in a New York Yankee cap.

Choose to complain about a fixture pile-up but go to Asia in your time off.

Choose to cheat.

Choose to agree to the 'respect campaign' but pay no attention to it when you don't get the Throw-in you want.

Choose 10 Goalkeepers in an attempt to replace Schmiechel.

Choose to sing songs about hating Scousers and pretend the granny ******* isnt 1.

Choose a winger that wants to play for Madrid but claim its all 'paper talk'.

Choose to have your players 'injured' for mid-week England matches yet play 90mins the following Saturday.

Choose to complain about away games after Champs League games dispite 1 being 'away' in Manchester.

Choose to mock Leeds fans about the events in Istanbul.

Choose to make airplane signs towards City fans on Derby matches.

Choose to be the only club in the country where every corner results in every fan becoming a Photographer.

Choose to 'watch' united in the pub with your back to the screen, cheer like **** when they score, then ask someone 'who scored that'?

Choose to be the ****** no fan of any other club wants too speak to on holiday

Choose Trafford.

Choose United.

[JacknDanny]

You might like this..

Choose to Support a club from a city you've never been to

Choose to wear **** Grey Shirts, and then blame them when Southampton Stuff you

Choose your own Referee and Assistants

Choose to change the team you support every 10 Years

Choose to forget 1969 to 1993 ever existed

Choose to be Snubbed by every decent player around the world, and then pretend you didnt want them anyway

Choose not knowing the history of your club.

Choose Busby the Blue.

Choose Dennis Law’s backheel.

Choose Sir Bobby Ticket Tout.

Choose staging the World Cup in '66 and being handed a huge sum from the FA to develop your stadium but continue to bang on about City’s ground.

Choose opening the gates at Old Trafford in the 60s after kick off to let people in for free.

Choose forgetting you went 41 years without winning a trophy.

Choose your highest ever attendance being at Maine Road.

Choose that attendance still being lower than City's.

Choose United’s globalism and domination since the late '90s whilst forgetting the past.

Choose an air disaster as a marketing tool.

Choose forgetting about the survivors of ****** and kicking them out of their houses (which you owned) because they could no longer play football.

Choose waiting 22 years to set up a charity match for the families of ******.

Choose milking ****** for 50 years and then getting beat by ickle ciddy on your own soil.

Choose asking AIG to sponsor the ****** memorial.

Choose having statues of two City players outside your ground.

Choose being so obsessed with City that you have a permanent banner dedicated to us on the Stretford End.

Choose paying £28 million for Veron.

Choose 19,000 fans at Old Trafford to watch you play Middlesbrough when you were in Division One but pretend you have loyal support.

Choose the have-to-go-to-all-cup-games-because-you're-forced-to ticket policy.

Choose the USA.

Choose debt.

Choose pricing out your own fans in favour of corporate Londoners.

Choose having your own manager and players criticise your fans.

Choose prawn sandwiches.

Choose not being able to stand.

Choose being outsung by 3,000 travelling away fans each game.

Choose having Mick Hucknall and Eamon Holmes as your celebrity fans.

Choose FC United…if they become successful.

Choose to whinge all summer about clubs tapping up your best player, while you r busy tapping up Spurs’ best player

Choose Kidnap him at the airport while not even having permission to speak to him and then pay other £30Million for the ******

Choose to buy Alan Smith as a forward then when found out to be **** put him in mid-field and call Fergie a 'genius' and call Smith the 'new roy keane'.

Choose to go after Batistuta for 5yrs and him stil wanting nothing to do with you.

Choose to demonstrate about 'No yanks' in a New York Yankee cap.

Choose to complain about a fixture pile-up but go to Asia in your time off.

Choose to cheat.

Choose to agree to the 'respect campaign' but pay no attention to it when you don't get the Throw-in you want.

Choose 10 Goalkeepers in an attempt to replace Schmiechel.

Choose to sing songs about hating Scousers and pretend the granny ******* isnt 1.

Choose a winger that wants to play for Madrid but claim its all 'paper talk'.

Choose to have your players 'injured' for mid-week England matches yet play 90mins the following Saturday.

Choose to complain about away games after Champs League games dispite 1 being 'away' in Manchester.

Choose to mock Leeds fans about the events in Istanbul.

Choose to make airplane signs towards City fans on Derby matches.

Choose to be the only club in the country where every corner results in every fan becoming a Photographer.

Choose to 'watch' united in the pub with your back to the screen, cheer like **** when they score, then ask someone 'who scored that'?

Choose to be the ****** no fan of any other club wants too speak to on holiday

Choose Trafford.

Choose United.

:D

Wait till Mr BOJ sees this.

He'll fall of his camel.

[mrbojangles]

:D

Nice one Singhy

:D

Wait till Mr BOJ sees this.

He'll fall of his camel.

Were's that Arab falling off a Camel emoticon when you need it

[mrbojangles]

Back on me Camel now. Give us another one Singhy

[MSingh]

I tell you what i will say, i have never read such a bunch of sour, misinformed, bitter & lying Posts as i have just read in the Man Ure Thread with regards to Tevez..

Some ( no names mentioned ) are just plain lying &/or writing complete & utter sh*t..

I have NEVER known a Player to get so much attention about leaving that Club as Tevez got last Year with the Protests etc & could believe it as i know, & they do deep down, how <deleted> brilliant he is..

Some Posts on that Thread are a joke..

Trust me Chaps, Carlos Tevez is a WORLD CLASS PLAYER, he's fcukign brilliant & you will love him & any actual Football Supporter that is also a Man Ure Supporter ( without the rose tinted specs ) will tell you the same..

Trust me on that Chaps..

For 36 Games next Year, City are my Team & as i said, i'd love you's to upset all thoe Top 4 B*stards & i pray that you do..

Whether people agree with how you're going about it is irrelevent, if that Sheikh was gonna invest his money in the Prem, i can think of a hel_l of a lot of Clubs that i'm glad it wasn't with & i'm glad it's City who have the chance to do something with it as it could have go as it could have been a lot worse.....

[bkkjames]

I tell you what i will say, i have never read such a bunch of sour, misinformed, bitter & lying Posts as i have just read in the Man Ure Thread with regards to Tevez..

Some ( no names mentioned ) are just plain lying &/or writing complete & utter sh*t..

I have NEVER known a Player to get so much attention about leaving that Club as Tevez got last Year with the Protests etc & could believe it as i know, & they do deep down, how <deleted> brilliant he is..

Some Posts on that Thread are a joke..

Trust me Chaps, Carlos Tevez is a WORLD CLASS PLAYER, he's fcukign brilliant & you will love him & any actual Football Supporter that is also a Man Ure Supporter ( without the rose tinted specs ) will tell you the same..

Trust me on that Chaps..

For 36 Games next Year, City are my Team & as i said, i'd love you's to upset all thoe Top 4 B*stards & i pray that you do..

Whether people agree with how you're going about it is irrelevent, if that Sheikh was gonna invest his money in the Prem, i can think of a hel_l of a lot of Clubs that i'm glad it wasn't with & i'm glad it's City who have the chance to do something with it as it could have go as it could have been a lot worse.....

Singer, just because his name is MR. BJ, doesn't mean if you stick your nose up his ass he will reciprocate.

[rixalex]

Some Posts on that Thread are a joke..

Yes i believe that's the intention. Sometimes people take things just a little too seriously.

Is having a little dig at a player who leaves your club to sign for bitter rivals, and then goes around telling stories to the press dissing the manager not allowed these days then????!!! If so it's news to me....

[MSingh]

Some Posts on that Thread are a joke..

Yes i believe that's the intention. Sometimes people take things just a little too seriously.

Is having a little dig at a player who leaves your club to sign for bitter rivals, and then goes around telling stories to the press dissing the manager not allowed these days then????!!! If so it's news to me....

Of course it's not Rix, & you know i don't mean those Posts ( you know i didn't mean " a joke " in the context you implied )...

Have a read of the last Page on there Mate & tell me again that some of the Posts one there are not ridiculous ??

[MSingh]

I tell you what i will say, i have never read such a bunch of sour, misinformed, bitter & lying Posts as i have just read in the Man Ure Thread with regards to Tevez..

Some ( no names mentioned ) are just plain lying &/or writing complete & utter sh*t..

I have NEVER known a Player to get so much attention about leaving that Club as Tevez got last Year with the Protests etc & could believe it as i know, & they do deep down, how <deleted> brilliant he is..

Some Posts on that Thread are a joke..

Trust me Chaps, Carlos Tevez is a WORLD CLASS PLAYER, he's fcukign brilliant & you will love him & any actual Football Supporter that is also a Man Ure Supporter ( without the rose tinted specs ) will tell you the same..

Trust me on that Chaps..

For 36 Games next Year, City are my Team & as i said, i'd love you's to upset all thoe Top 4 B*stards & i pray that you do..

Whether people agree with how you're going about it is irrelevent, if that Sheikh was gonna invest his money in the Prem, i can think of a hel_l of a lot of Clubs that i'm glad it wasn't with & i'm glad it's City who have the chance to do something with it as it could have go as it could have been a lot worse.....

Singer, just because his name is MR. BJ, doesn't mean if you stick your nose up his ass he will reciprocate.

[rixalex]

Have a read of the last Page on there Mate & tell me again that some of the Posts one there are not ridiculous ??

Just skimmed through that last page to try and see what you are getting at and i'm sorry mate, i don't see it - certainly not in relation to Tevez.

Actually i was more surprised by what wasn't posted on that page than what was - i'm talking about the Man City shirt - thought it would have drawn some sort of a reaction - other seemingly less controversial comments certainly did.

[mrbojangles]

Singer, just because his name is MR. BJ, doesn't mean if you stick your nose up his ass he will reciprocate.

As per usual, you have absolutely nothing constructive to add to this thread. Do us all a favour and <deleted> off back to supporting Ice Hockey will ya

[LeungKen]

I think your lot have just got Lescott BJ

Man City make £15m Lescott swoop

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id...ers&cc=4716

Or maybe it's an almost after I've just reread it.

.

Edited July 17, 2009 by LeungKen

[mrbojangles]

I think Moyes will try and keep him at all costs Ken. However, every player has his price.

[redrus]

I can't believe I've come in here for sanity............ All a bit Marin Gaye elsewhere int forum isn't chaps.

redrus

[mrbojangles]

Your always welcome in here Red

[sanmiguellight]

You think he'll pass a medical being a Klingon and all -

Edited July 17, 2009 by sanmiguellight

[MSingh]

Have a read of the last Page on there Mate & tell me again that some of the Posts one there are not ridiculous ??

Just skimmed through that last page to try and see what you are getting at and i'm sorry mate, i don't see it - certainly not in relation to Tevez.

Actually i was more surprised by what wasn't posted on that page than what was - i'm talking about the Man City shirt - thought it would have drawn some sort of a reaction - other seemingly less controversial comments certainly did.

Ok cool, so that in that case Rix we'll agree to disagree..

[redrus]

MS, the shirt is quite clearly a joke.

I am not upset about Tevez leaving and, am in no way bitter. He could though, have done it with a little more decorum (so could Fergie at times- but he has a record I can stand by though). I know you say "no names mentioned" but, its me that posts most in there so you may aswell say it.

As it says in the thread header though, "all the news and views". I try to post views from other fans sites, official and unofficial, I don't agree with everything I post (from other sources) in there....!

Jasus, I came in here for a bit of piece............ I'm off to the Arsenal thread....

redrussoff

[mrbojangles]

Jasus, I came in here for a bit of piece............ I'm off to the Arsenal thread....

You'll defo get it in there matey. What time do you need waking up

[MSingh]

MS, the shirt is quite clearly a joke.

I am not upset about Tevez leaving and, am in no way bitter. He could though, have done it with a little more decorum (so could Fergie at times- but he has a record I can stand by though). I know you say "no names mentioned" but, its me that posts most in there so you may aswell say it.

As it says in the thread header though, "all the news and views". I try to post views from other fans sites, official and unofficial, I don't agree with everything I post (from other sources) in there....!

Jasus, I came in here for a bit of piece............ I'm off to the Arsenal thread....

redrussoff

I'm not talking about the Shirt Red, come on give me a bit of credit..

Let find a couple of Post s& i'll show you what i mean..

It's only people's opinions obviosuly anyway but in my opinion, their opinion is b*llocks, thats all...

Moment please..

You willf ind your peace & quiet in teh SArsenal thread though, that's for sure..

2 Bob that lot, just like the other N London lot ( i just can't resist )..

Edit : Ok, this was the main Post that i thought was incredibly Sour Grapes etc, especially the highlighted bits..

However, i'm completely aware that everyone's entitled to their own opinion, i just think this particular one is Sour Grapes etc..

Poor old Carlos, 2 miserable years at Old Trafford where he picked up a weekly wage most people dream about , a pocketful of medals he wouldn't have won anywhere else and adored by the fans . What a terrible time he has led. Now to add to that misery we find the manager didnt show enough love for him and didnt even talk to him. After watching Tevez's press conference its no wonder there was not much conversation betwen the two without a translator ever present.

It will be interesting to see where Carlos will sit in the pecking order with 10 strikers currently on the books at City . He has been described by Hughes as one of the worlds greatest strikers, really ?????? I must have been watching a different player for the last 2 years. I did see a good sub ,working his socks off,but spending so much time chasing the play he was very rarely in a position when possession was regained. As a marksman, sorry ,not in world class or anywhere near it.

Edited July 17, 2009 by MSingh