Koh Tao: Prosecutors unfazed by retraction of confession in British tourists' killing

[The Deerhunter]

In their situation, this has to be the stock reply. No surprises.

[templedog]

If the thai police do not cooperate, as we all suspect, that will be the main conclusion in the British police report.

So the upshot will be another nail in the coffin for the reputation of Thailand. I know many posters like to claim Thailand is such a strong and successful country that it doesn't matter what anyone thinks of them. You are welcome to your opinions, everyone has opinions, just like everyone has certain bodily orifices. I have an opinion too, which is that reputation always matters and that Thailand needs the world a lot more than the world needs Thailand and the country will certainly pay a price for being considered backward, corrupt, disrespectful, dishonest, not deserving of trust and respect and not welcome within the circle of countries thought to be civilised and developed.

There are of course many countries that behave in a unacceptable manner. I am sure North Korea also thinks they are better than the rest of the world. The price they pay is misery. I am sure Putin thinks he is the master of the universe and Russia will be the number one world power....but just look at the Ruble and the plunging price of oil...both signs that his strategy of sending his Neanderthal thugs in to terrorize his neighbors is backfiring pretty badly. If Thailand wants to join the league of failed and disrespected nations then they will also pay a price.

Hi Paddy, in spite of the fact that your argument is somewhat weakened by one unsavoury comment about other people's opinions (comparing them with bodily orifices indicates how little you respect them, and what's a discussion worth if there's no mutual respect?), you do have a point and I do agree with that point ie that reputations are highly significant especially in a day and age that focus so much on image, communication and hearsay.

I think you're right about Russia too, and in the long run Putin's arrogance will not serve his country, no more than Hitler's or Franco's or Pinochet's served theirs.

However, one thing must be kept in mind. You speak as if the whole world was as focused as 'we' TVF members are on these Koh Tao murders and the way they're 'handled' by the local police force. The British press, understandably and rightly, cover the story and seem to do their best not to let things rest as long as the situation reeks of manipulation.

But what about bout the rest of the Western world ? I've been talking on social networks with friends from various parts of Europe and I regret to say that they seem to know very little, if anything, about this case. Every country is normally focusing on its own issues and when it comes to planning a holiday, it seems that most people's perspective, if they know about the murders (and I repeat they often don't), is "well, gruesome murders happen everywhere, including in our own country, so why should we change our plans?".

One more thing, to anyone who starts claiming that 'Thailand should be punished' and suggest a massive boycott, it kind of reminds me of the not so ancient times when after a long siege, the 'victorious' troops would finally enter the city and kill everyone including children, women and seniors, on the grounds that they were on the bad side right from the start.

I do not want to 'punish Thailand' or any other country for that matter, because a country is a concept, and you can't punish a concept, but you do end up hurting real people who have nothing to do with those who are causing the uproar. If anything the majority of Thais are already suffering from the extreme arrogance of the rich and powerful in this country, and a boycott would affect everyone, not just the bad guys. Methinks the latter would actually be the least affected.

You're right,, punishing the economy as a whole usually benefits those at the tops.. because they have margins they can afford to play with.. while those at the bottom go bankrupt and sell themselves for nothing to those at the top... That's why the recent economic crisis 2008 made the elite even richer! They are winning on our so called economic crisises because they can afford to invest in the crisis .. Eg they get to buy the entire market for a bargain

You're right,, punishing the economy as a whole usually benefits those at the tops.. because they have margins they can afford to play with.. while those at the bottom go bankrupt and sell themselves for nothing to those at the top... That's why the recent economic crisis 2008 made the elite even richer! They are winning on our so called economic crisises because they can afford to invest in the crisis .. Eg they get to buy the entire market for a bargain

This is exactly what happened during The Great Depression in the USA. EXACTLY....it was planned...know your history....know the history of the RTP...CORRUPT.

[Smurkster]

These so called "prosecutors" are a disgrace to the profession of prosecuting lawyer....

[templedog]

Getting kind of sick the extent some are going to in order to defend the suspects who very likely brutally murdered two innocent lives. Time to stop this nonsense with the conspiracy crap and let the case play out ... they have good lawyers and have both the UK and Myanmar officials who will be observing the case and evidence presented.

It has just gotten to the point of being sick the extent some are going to in either making BS up or just coming up with ridiculous theories and speculation based on ignorance about the facts of the case and born out of personal issues and feelings.

Just pathetic some of the things said by folks who don't have a clue about the case or how the process of observation works or even the circumstances that one country would allow (ask) another country help in an investigation (as Thailand has and will continue to do when needed).

JTJ.

Nice to see you've reared your ugly head again. Personally, I think irregardless of this case one should be looking towards you, to see if you really exist given that your criticisms are to such a degree, one suspects your either a red herring employed to throw the occasional cog in the works or some sick psychotic individual

Psycho.png

Yeah....I'd like to know why JTJ is so confident that "the suspects who very likely brutally murdered two innocent lives" actually are guilty.

Remind you of anyone? Maybe,.....the ....I dunno....the .....RTP? JTJ is a troll, and is his nonsense is rebutted EVERY single time.....what a douche.

[jdinasia]

They will not unofficially either.

I do expect them to see the DNA results. They will not be able to independently verify results.

I do expect them to meet the suspects.

Not much else they can do other than look at photos.

There is no way a 'JD' could be that naive. Those in the know are aware that the British police have been investigating on their own for weeks now. They keep a very low profile. They won't tip their hand so early on. There is a deliberate attempt by a certain group of posters to cast negativity on everything and everyone who dosen't see things their way (or their boss's way).

Hmmmm can you explain the ramifications of the Geneva convention governing consular relations? Or perhaps the UK policy on foreign murder, manslaughter and infanticide?

[Fatty123]

A certain student must have friends in high places. Forget the Headman. I'm talking waaaaaayyyy higher (think Surat Thani)

[templedog]

They will not unofficially either.

I do expect them to see the DNA results. They will not be able to independently verify results.

I do expect them to meet the suspects.

Not much else they can do other than look at photos.

There is no way a 'JD' could be that naive. Those in the know are aware that the British police have been investigating on their own for weeks now. They keep a very low profile. They won't tip their hand so early on. There is a deliberate attempt by a certain group of posters to cast negativity on everything and everyone who dosen't see things their way (or their boss's way).

Hmmmm can you explain the ramifications of the Geneva convention governing consular relations? Or perhaps the UK policy on foreign murder, manslaughter and infanticide?

Can you? Or did you mean, the Vienna Convention?

http://www.supremecourt.ge/files/upload-file/pdf/act38.pdf

Edited October 23, 2014 by templedog

[Johnsen]

I'm going to put my faith in the good retired general now PM. I believe he is waiting for the police to completely hang themselves so he can come in and make sweeping changes. All those involved in the investigation will be removed from their positions or jailed, some influential islanders will be jailed the Burmese boys will be released and the good general will be a hero to the Thai people and citizens all around the world...

[phuketandsee]

A certain student must have friends in high places. Forget the Headman. I'm talking waaaaaayyyy higher (think Surat Thani)

I doubt it stops there

[Robert2006]

Getting kind of sick the extent some are going to in order to defend the suspects who very likely brutally murdered two innocent lives. Time to stop this nonsense with the conspiracy crap and let the case play out ... they have good lawyers and have both the UK and Myanmar officials who will be observing the case and evidence presented.

It has just gotten to the point of being sick the extent some are going to in either making BS up or just coming up with ridiculous theories and speculation based on ignorance about the facts of the case and born out of personal issues and feelings.

Just pathetic some of the things said by folks who don't have a clue about the case or how the process of observation works or even the circumstances that one country would allow (ask) another country help in an investigation (as Thailand has and will continue to do when needed).

People that have lived in Thailand a long time have had experiences with the Thai police or have known people that have had experiences. The reason no one believes the police is they are almost universally corrupt. It comes down to one thing with the Thai police, money, period.

The UK and Myanmar lawyers won’t help get to the truth. Did you read the sentence at the end of the article, “Mr. Thawatchai said that Thai police will be able to answer every doubt raised but no outside authorities can send their people to work on this case as Thai laws do not permit such a scenario”. The Thai police have no intention of allowing outside authorities look at the evidence, how blatantly transparent. This is why so many have legitimate concerns.

[templedog]

I'm going to put my faith in the good retired general now PM. I believe he is waiting for the police to completely hang themselves so he can come in and make sweeping changes. All those involved in the investigation will be removed from their positions or jailed, some influential islanders will be jailed the Burmese boys will be released and the good general will be a hero to the Thai people and citizens all around the world...

I adore your sarcasm!! Reminds me of Stanley Kubrick's film, Dr. Strangelove.

[MaxLee]

I'm going to put my faith in the good retired general now PM. I believe he is waiting for the police to completely hang themselves so he can come in and make sweeping changes. All those involved in the investigation will be removed from their positions or jailed, some influential islanders will be jailed the Burmese boys will be released and the good general will be a hero to the Thai people and citizens all around the world...

You get the wrong idea, why would our dear PM aka former General risk to make an "important" tourism destination lose face?

He made up his propaganda mind already with the local police force already, don't you get it?

He couldn't care less, when lives of 2 innocent poor Burmese go to waste. His objective is to bring happiness to Thai people ONLY, kappiche???

Edited October 23, 2014 by MaxLee

[CBR650]

A certain student must have friends in high places. Forget the Headman. I'm talking waaaaaayyyy higher (think Surat Thani)

And the arrogance of the well-connected.

Suthep Declines Court Summons Over Killing of Japanese Reporter

These people and their families are untouchable in this land. Thinking that one would be held accountable for the violent rape and destruction of two farangs.

Dreamland.

Welcome to Thailand.

[hobz]

I'm outa here.....can't bang heads with JDIA or JTJ anymore as I am reminded of an old proverb....One has to wonder who the real fool is when you argue with a fool in public.

If you go up to Manage ignore prefs you can ignore certain users,, I will add jdinasia etc to that list now... There's a rule how to handle trolls... don't feed them.

[kcirtapyelrah]

All hopes are that the Brits got their own DNA samples and this would put the lives of two Burmese out of danger if they are really innocent, but it's as far as this case will go. The real killers will never be catched.

Never say never, the truth will be known. I cannot believe for one moment that the British with their technology won't have DNA samples, and I can't imagine that independent DNA samples of the accused won't be obtained and I can't imagine that the victims families will ever let it rest until they are truly satisfied that justice has been done. All that is required for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

[Strangebrew]

Karma is a b-tch has a nasty habit of popping up when you least expect it maybe a dark soi And wham hits you over the head. Maybe lose brick falls and that's all folks sleep well.

[JohnThailandJohn]

Yes, their DNA was already matched and confirmed to have been the same as the semen from the crime scene. So they are not being asked for DNA samples again by authorities but of course their lawyers are welcome to get new samples.

Yes, their DNA was already matched and confirmed to have been the same as the semen from the crime scene

I must have missed this very important point. I've only ever read that the BIB said they have a DNA match, not that it matches the semen from the crime scene (shouldn't it be the semen "recovered" from the victim's orifice?)

Could you kindly post a link to this, JTJ? I tried searching but in vain......

There will be no reply by jtj to this post

If you keep your eyese close hard enough, no conspiracy is impossible. And by the way since everyone knows the semen DNA matched that on the cigarette then a match to one is the same as a match to the other .... please use your brain.

“The two [DNA] samples matched the semen found in the deceased,” said Pol.Maj.Gen. Manu Mekmok, commander of Office of Police Forensic Science. He said the DNA test results were finalised at around 8 am this morning. http://www.samuitimes.com/police-say-forensic-tests-implicate-2-burmese-koh-tao-murder/

PHUKET: A police source has confirmed that DNA samples from two of three detained Myanmar workers matches the DNA extracted from semen found on the body of British tourist Hannah Witheridge http://www.phuketgazette.net/thailand-news/Myanmar-workers-DNA-matches-semen-found-Koh/36077#sthash.gzshsYMC.dpuf

On Friday, Police Commissioner Gen. Somyot Poompanmuang told CNN that DNA in semen taken from Witheridge matched samples taken from the two men.

http://fijione.tv/burmese-men-confess-to-killing-british-tourists-on-koh-tao-thai-police-say/

[CapFarmer]

Just wonder why the cops do not want to catch the real killers?

A family related DNA test done by all residents of koh tao would reveal the killer and or what family the killer comes from,.

Uncles,brothers sisters cousins all have a match with the killer DNA...

It really easy cause Koh tao is a small island surely the killer has family members there. ....

Civil liberties?

Is this the same Civil liberties being applied to 2 Burmese guys currently being threatened with the death penalty, or is that a different set of Civil liberties only applied to other than Thai's ?

Yes, their DNA was already matched and confirmed to have been the same as the semen from the crime scene. So they are not being asked for DNA samples again by authorities but of course their lawyers are welcome to get new samples.

The police have made so many contradictory statements concerning the DNA that the only thing that is reasonably sure is that the police say they DNA evidence. I don't think anyone that is not associated with the case can make an accurate statement about the description of what that DNA evidence is nor what is was matched against. I have seen police reports and interviews describing evidence of DNA from more than two victims, but then the police explained that evidence away with some half concocted story. The only conclusion that any reasonable person can draw about this case is that, as reported by Time, Mirror, etc..., it is a farce of an investigation.

[TheCruncher]

Anything but actually answer the real question huh. You stand to lose more than anyone else who has posted on here if this all goes tits up.

You are a frightened little bunny trying to reassure yourself with every post you make.

I have such a feeling that this forum gone be very quiet after the UK investigators have made their report public.

Oh wait, I hear it coming already..................The UK investigators were whore mongers, they were paid of, they sent newbies, they had no knowledge, they are forced to agree with the RTP.

[sambum]

"When asked about international concerns over the investigation, Mr. Thawatchai said that Thai police will be able to answer every doubt raised but no outside authorities can send their people to work on this case as Thai laws do not permit such a scenario."

The answers the BIB give to every doubt is the cause of international concern.

As to what Thai laws allow, you might want to check with the PM about that, as Burmese and UK police are coming over/already here to look at the case.

There is "working on the case" and "observing" - 2 very different kettles of fish!

[hobz]

Yes, their DNA was already matched and confirmed to have been the same as the semen from the crime scene. So they are not being asked for DNA samples again by authorities but of course their lawyers are welcome to get new samples.

Yes, their DNA was already matched and confirmed to have been the same as the semen from the crime scene

I must have missed this very important point. I've only ever read that the BIB said they have a DNA match, not that it matches the semen from the crime scene (shouldn't it be the semen "recovered" from the victim's orifice?)

Could you kindly post a link to this, JTJ? I tried searching but in vain......

There will be no reply by jtj to this post

If you keep your eyese close hard enough, no conspiracy is impossible. And by the way since everyone knows the semen DNA matched that on the cigarette then a match to one is the same as a match to the other .... please use your brain.

“The two [DNA] samples matched the semen found in the deceased,” said Pol.Maj.Gen. Manu Mekmok, commander of Office of Police Forensic Science. He said the DNA test results were finalised at around 8 am this morning. http://www.samuitimes.com/police-say-forensic-tests-implicate-2-burmese-koh-tao-murder/

PHUKET: A police source has confirmed that DNA samples from two of three detained Myanmar workers matches the DNA extracted from semen found on the body of British tourist Hannah Witheridge http://www.phuketgazette.net/thailand-news/Myanmar-workers-DNA-matches-semen-found-Koh/36077#sthash.gzshsYMC.dpuf

On Friday, Police Commissioner Gen. Somyot Poompanmuang told CNN that DNA in semen taken from Witheridge matched samples taken from the two men.

http://fijione.tv/burmese-men-confess-to-killing-british-tourists-on-koh-tao-thai-police-say/

Why they didn't match the first time they got tested before they got arrested...?

[Local farang]

If the DNA taken from Hannah matches the DNA frm the suspects and is verified by scotland yard....add that to the statement from the suspects burmese room mate and friend that he they gave him Davids phone but then smashed it up when it wouldnt work and threw it in the jungle outside the room they shared with the suspects...then weld the shackles on and wait for the executioner !

Any lawyer with half a brain will tell any suspect to retract their confession, and say it was done under duress. People remember they re-enacted the crime that matched forensic science so despite what they say they knew something about the circumstances!!

This case will be a media circus because it hangs on to the death penalty. If both suspects DNA dont match then let them go simple !!

[jdinasia]

Anything but actually answer the real question huh. You stand to lose more than anyone else who has posted on here if this all goes tits up.

You are a frightened little bunny trying to reassure yourself with every post you make.

I have such a feeling that this forum gone be very quiet after the UK investigators have made their report public.

Oh wait, I hear it coming already..................The UK investigators were whore mongers, they were paid of, they sent newbies, they had no knowledge, they are forced to agree with the RTP.

The UK observers will not be making it public. The embassy or FO may, and they are probably obligated to give it to the Thai government.

[JohnThailandJohn]

Yes, their DNA was already matched and confirmed to have been the same as the semen from the crime scene

I must have missed this very important point. I've only ever read that the BIB said they have a DNA match, not that it matches the semen from the crime scene (shouldn't it be the semen "recovered" from the victim's orifice?)

Could you kindly post a link to this, JTJ? I tried searching but in vain......

There will be no reply by jtj to this post

If you keep your eyese close hard enough, no conspiracy is impossible. And by the way since everyone knows the semen DNA matched that on the cigarette then a match to one is the same as a match to the other .... please use your brain.

The two [DNA] samples matched the semen found in the deceased, [/size]said [/size]Pol.Maj.Gen. Manu Mekmok, commander of Office of Police Forensic Science. He said the DNA test results were finalised at around 8 am this morning. http://www.samuitimes.com/police-say-forensic-tests-implicate-2-burmese-koh-tao-murder/[/size]

PHUKET: A police source has confirmed that DNA samples from two of three detained Myanmar workers matches the DNA extracted from semen found on the body of British tourist Hannah Witheridge http://www.phuketgazette.net/thailand-news/Myanmar-workers-DNA-matches-semen-found-Koh/36077#sthash.gzshsYMC.dpuf[/size]

On Friday, Police Commissioner Gen. Somyot Poompanmuang told CNN that DNA in semen taken from Witheridge matched samples taken from the two men.[/size]

http://fijione.tv/burmese-men-confess-to-killing-british-tourists-on-koh-tao-thai-police-say/

Why they didn't match the first time they got tested before they got arrested...?

If you read the news or even this thread it is explained numerous times why their dna was never compared originally.

They collected hundreds of samples and had a very big back log and were moving the dna of those they suspected and were questioning to the top ... no conspiracy just a very logical explanation as had been reported in the news for those who didn't close their eyes to all but what is posted on Facebook.

[kcirtapyelrah]

Getting kind of sick the extent some are going to in order to defend the suspects who very likely brutally murdered two innocent lives. Time to stop this nonsense with the conspiracy crap and let the case play out ... they have good lawyers and have both the UK and Myanmar officials who will be observing the case and evidence presented.

It has just gotten to the point of being sick the extent some are going to in either making BS up or just coming up with ridiculous theories and speculation based on ignorance about the facts of the case and born out of personal issues and feelings.

Just pathetic some of the things said by folks who don't have a clue about the case or how the process of observation works or even the circumstances that one country would allow (ask) another country help in an investigation (as Thailand has and will continue to do when needed).

People that have lived in Thailand a long time have had experiences with the Thai police or have known people that have had experiences. The reason no one believes the police is they are almost universally corrupt. It comes down to one thing with the Thai police, money, period.

The UK and Myanmar lawyers won’t help get to the truth. Did you read the sentence at the end of the article, “Mr. Thawatchai said that Thai police will be able to answer every doubt raised but no outside authorities can send their people to work on this case as Thai laws do not permit such a scenario”. The Thai police have no intention of allowing outside authorities look at the evidence, how blatantly transparent. This is why so many have legitimate concerns.

Your bilkers must be supe rglued to your face John.

[smokie36]

Confessions are recanted in every country. It doesn't mean the confession is gone. It means the judges will weigh the confessions against the recantation.

Please see JLCrab's posts on what the UK police can do.

A recanted confession would be entirely inadmissible in any civilised justice system.

What a joke.

[JohnThailandJohn]

Confessions are recanted in every country. It doesn't mean the confession is gone. It means the judges will weigh the confessions against the recantation.

Please see JLCrab's posts on what the UK police can do.

A recanted confession would be entirely inadmissible in any civilised justice system.

What a joke.

Are you making a joke or are you really this uninformed. Nowhere that I can think of would a recanted confession not be allowed in as evidence since it is. If a judge believes the confession was obtained illegally then that is a different story but a recanted confession is and should be brought up at a trial.

Since it is usually difficult to prove if a confession was obtained illegally then it is up to the defense to explain why their suspected confessed to a crime they did not do ... such as being scared, beaten or threatened. This is all every day stuff in court rooms around the globe.

Edited October 23, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[hobz]

There will be no reply by jtj to this post

If you keep your eyese close hard enough, no conspiracy is impossible. And by the way since everyone knows the semen DNA matched that on the cigarette then a match to one is the same as a match to the other .... please use your brain.

The two [DNA] samples matched the semen found in the deceased, [/size]said [/size]Pol.Maj.Gen. Manu Mekmok, commander of Office of Police Forensic Science. He said the DNA test results were finalised at around 8 am this morning. http://www.samuitimes.com/police-say-forensic-tests-implicate-2-burmese-koh-tao-murder/[/size]

PHUKET: A police source has confirmed that DNA samples from two of three detained Myanmar workers matches the DNA extracted from semen found on the body of British tourist Hannah Witheridge http://www.phuketgazette.net/thailand-news/Myanmar-workers-DNA-matches-semen-found-Koh/36077#sthash.gzshsYMC.dpuf[/size]

On Friday, Police Commissioner Gen. Somyot Poompanmuang told CNN that DNA in semen taken from Witheridge matched samples taken from the two men.[/size]

http://fijione.tv/burmese-men-confess-to-killing-british-tourists-on-koh-tao-thai-police-say/

Why they didn't match the first time they got tested before they got arrested...?

If you read the news or even this thread it is explained numerous times why their dna was never compared originally.

They collected hundreds of samples and had a very big back log and were moving the dna of those they suspected and were questioning to the top ... no conspiracy just a very logical explanation as had been reported in the news for those who didn't close their eyes to all but what is posted on Facebook.

I thought I had read everything, but obviously I must have missed that. Please excuse me.

Do you also know how the 3 suspects had dark shorts/pants but the man running on CCTV had not? Who is the man running on CCTV according to police now? One of the scapegoats? Or some random runner that never was identified and wasn't involved in the crime? Maybe i missed that explanation too.

Also I may have missed the explanation for the blonde hairs (asian hair dyed blonde) found on Hannahs body? None of the scapegoats captured on CCTV on a motorbike the same night had blonde hair.. Whats the official explanation for that?

[transam]

Seems we have a couple of BiB posters here............OK, numnuts, farangs die on holiday for many reasons all over the world every year, BUT, the UK in this case is sending detectives from Scotland Yard to sort/look at stuff.

Why is that JTJ and JD.........Why is that.....????

[stephen terry]

Yes, their DNA was already matched and confirmed to have been the same as the semen from the crime scene. So they are not being asked for DNA samples again by authorities but of course their lawyers are welcome to get new samples.

Yes, their DNA was already matched and confirmed to have been the same as the semen from the crime scene

I must have missed this very important point. I've only ever read that the BIB said they have a DNA match, not that it matches the semen from the crime scene (shouldn't it be the semen "recovered" from the victim's orifice?)

Could you kindly post a link to this, JTJ? I tried searching but in vain......

There will be no reply by jtj to this post

If you keep your eyese close hard enough, no conspiracy is impossible. And by the way since everyone knows the semen DNA matched that on the cigarette then a match to one is the same as a match to the other .... please use your brain.

“The two [DNA] samples matched the semen found in the deceased,” said Pol.Maj.Gen. Manu Mekmok, commander of Office of Police Forensic Science. He said the DNA test results were finalised at around 8 am this morning. http://www.samuitimes.com/police-say-forensic-tests-implicate-2-burmese-koh-tao-murder/

PHUKET: A police source has confirmed that DNA samples from two of three detained Myanmar workers matches the DNA extracted from semen found on the body of British tourist Hannah Witheridge http://www.phuketgazette.net/thailand-news/Myanmar-workers-DNA-matches-semen-found-Koh/36077#sthash.gzshsYMC.dpuf

On Friday, Police Commissioner Gen. Somyot Poompanmuang told CNN that DNA in semen taken from Witheridge matched samples taken from the two men.

http://fijione.tv/burmese-men-confess-to-killing-british-tourists-on-koh-tao-thai-police-say/

This is old history. Did it ever cross your mind that this could also be a conspiracy orchestrated by the RTP? I ask this question because I want to know if you have ever watched the so-called re-enactment which was illegally directed by the RTP?