Parents say their sons are innocent but beaten to confess

[spidermike007]

We want the truth!!

Until then... BOYCOT KOH TAO!

Yes, and i say boycott Koh Tao for life. For the principal of it. To deny the criminal families their additional millions. To make a statement, and to provide David and Hannah some solidarity. It is a small price to pay. Tell everyone you know why it is best to avoid this crime infested, drug infested sewer of an island. I am never going back. Never.

You are right like I posted a similar idea before, but to appeal for a boycott to ppl who having blown a big part of their brain with drugs and alc already is just like you blow an ox in the horn.

The PM lost his chance to solve this case quick. Honesty, dignity etc. are for all corrupt bastards just words, the only thing what counts for them is money. Get them on their weakest point, evacute this island until the real truth come out.

I would make a bet not more a 1 week the real truth come out, there is to much money to loose.

The PM lost a lot more than a chance to solve this quickly. This was a historic opportunity for him to demonstrate not only to the entire Thai population, but to the entire world that he was sincere about tackling some of Thailand's most fundamental problems. He could have made such a loud and clear statement that he was genuinely interested in rooting out the rot in Thai society. Instead the statement he made was one of indifference, and one that affirmed his lack of interest in making any real or lasting changes, and his unwillingness to tackle the status quo, or to go after the corrupt with power and money. What a shame. Well, at least the world knows what they are dealing with. One might be able to use the expression "an army without a cause". As they used to say, "the jig is up".

[JLCrab]

From the above: Well, at least the world knows what they are dealing with. Are you speaking for yourself or the world?

[concernedintheUS]

Is it normal in Thailand to have women in pink hats and businessmen trample all over a crime scene? How can any DNA evidence be considered?? I didn't realize how many people were prancing about a scene of a double murder... it's really a shame the local police didn't do a better job of securing the scene and calling in actual forensic teams to process the entire area before letting random citizens prance about. It's no wonder so many are taking to becoming arm chair detectives on social media...they see how many random citizens got to process / destroy a crime scene, so why should they not do the same from afar?

[Lozza]

Look at those simple people. Have they brought up their sons to become rapists and murderers??

I refuse to believe it.

Please keep posting, so the two guys (together with Hannah and David) are never forgotten!!

I was so happy to see the parents faces after the visit all relaxed and smiling. Going into that prison would be torture I couldn't do it- fear of the unknown, god bless them all..

[kcirtapyelrah]

Keep cranking up the pressure for transparency and justice in this case.

It aint gonna happen. Transparency is not in the Thai dictionary.

This is not the first case such as this and it aint gonna be the last.

Why so pessimistic?

I think we (the international public and the internet) can make a difference.

And we should

Don't listen to those who want to talk us out of this - they don't want a better reality

Divide and conquer.

[BritTim]

Is it normal in Thailand to have women in pink hats and businessmen trample all over a crime scene? How can any DNA evidence be considered?? I didn't realize how many people were prancing about a scene of a double murder... it's really a shame the local police didn't do a better job of securing the scene and calling in actual forensic teams to process the entire area before letting random citizens prance about. It's no wonder so many are taking to becoming arm chair detectives on social media...they see how many random citizens got to process / destroy a crime scene, so why should they not do the same from afar?

Until the arrival of police from outside the island, the local police were just following orders from those who usually run affairs on the island.

[StealthEnergiser]

If anybody has not seen it there is a photo or screen grab on CSILA facebook of a person not thai defending Mr Mon and he is not happy what Sean Mcanna has said and he says he knows the owner of in touch resort Mr Mon for 20 years and he is one of the most decent honest individuals on the island.

Even even talks about staff at ac bar beinng DNA tested.

The photo / screen grab has sept 22 on the heading may take a bit of finding but its there.

Mr Mon is the one that was on the crime scene when it was roped off.

Edited October 28, 2014 by StealthEnergiser

[changnaam]

At least with all the international coverage, the parents are getting access, and the boys are still alive.

Long may it continue.

[spidermike007]

Koh Tao murders: ‘Thai police threatened to burn my son alive’

KOH Samui: -- The father of one of the detained suspects in the Koh Tao murder case has told DVB that at their family reunion this afternoon, his son told him that he and his friend confessed to rape and murder only after Thai interrogators threatened to kill them, and that they did not commit the alleged crimes.

Htun Htun Htike, the father of Win Zaw Htun, said, “My son and his friend [Zaw Lin] told me that they were subjected to physical torture by the Thai police and their translator.

“The interrogators told them to confess to the crime, and threatened to cut off their limbs, put them in a bag, and dump them in a river if they did not.

“The police also threatened to tie the two boys to a tire, pour petrol on it, and set it alight,” he told DVB’s Aye Nai in an exclusive interview on Friday.

Read More: https://www.dvb.no/news/koh-tao-murders-thai-police-threatened-to-burn-my-son-alive-burma-myanmar-thailand-koh-samui/45369

--DVB 2014-10-25

Of course they were either tortured, or threatened. Whatever it takes to put us in a position where we do not have to charge the real perpetrators of this crime. Whatever it takes. We do not want to go after a super rich family. They have too much influence. They know everybody, after all. We do not pursue criminals with connections, money, and influence. We never have. 18 coups, hundreds of so called reforms later, and we still only pursue criminals without money, and without connections. Even the general himself told us this is the agenda of the new government. Go after the little guys. Leave the big guns alone. Do not rock the boat, on any level. Do not upset the status quo, on any level. Make the people think there are big changes going on, but do not arrest anybody who is a serious guy.

[jdinasia]

Koh Tao murders: ‘Thai police threatened to burn my son alive’

KOH Samui: -- The father of one of the detained suspects in the Koh Tao murder case has told DVB that at their family reunion this afternoon, his son told him that he and his friend confessed to rape and murder only after Thai interrogators threatened to kill them, and that they did not commit the alleged crimes.

Htun Htun Htike, the father of Win Zaw Htun, said, “My son and his friend [Zaw Lin] told me that they were subjected to physical torture by the Thai police and their translator.

“The interrogators told them to confess to the crime, and threatened to cut off their limbs, put them in a bag, and dump them in a river if they did not.

“The police also threatened to tie the two boys to a tire, pour petrol on it, and set it alight,” he told DVB’s Aye Nai in an exclusive interview on Friday.

Read More: https://www.dvb.no/news/koh-tao-murders-thai-police-threatened-to-burn-my-son-alive-burma-myanmar-thailand-koh-samui/45369

--DVB 2014-10-25

Of course they were either tortured, or threatened. Whatever it takes to put us in a position where we do not have to charge the real perpetrators of this crime. Whatever it takes. We do not want to go after a super rich family. They have too much influence. They know everybody, after all. We do not pursue criminals with connections, money, and influence. We never have. 18 coups, hundreds of so called reforms later, and we still only pursue criminals without money, and without connections. Even the general himself told us this is the agenda of the new government. Go after the little guys. Leave the big guns alone. Do not rock the boat, on any level. Do not upset the status quo, on any level. Make the people think there are big changes going on, but do not arrest anybody who is a serious guy.

Or they were told. "we have the proof, the other guy with you says you did it, we have your DNA. Confess and you will get life in prison and a chance to get out sometime. Don't Confess and you will get the death penalty."

[Si Thea01]

We want the truth!!

Until then... BOYCOT KOH TAO!

You're absolutely right everyone should boycott Thailand until the truth is revealed. That should go for all the expats ... time they stopped moaning about things and took action by leaving.

A little over the top, don't you think? By the way, do you live here? If you do when will you follow your own advise and if not why not? If you don't live here, then what's your point?

[greenchair]

Every corner I turn.

Every page I turn over.

There is mon staring back.

This must be very difficult for all the parents.

[greenchair]

I see the other place has quite rightly been closed. Along with all of our hard work investigations.

This is more on topic and gives us opportunity to discuss the innocence of these 2 young men . I am sure the parents will be grateful to us for not allowing their sons to be forgotten.

????

[JLCrab]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

[jdinasia]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

[berybert]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

If the evidence is conclusive then I don't think anyone will be unhappy about it.

Unlike you not many here believe the evidence. Far to many inconsistencies.

There is a man who has claimed he was beaten and forced to confess to being a rapist by the RTP. He is innocent.

The latest of many. Can you not understand why people have doubt ?

[draftvader]

Comment on moderation removed.

Please read this before posting

Contrary to the beliefs of some we do not have "influential" members posting in these threads. We simply have a set of forum rules. They are here.

We have a responsibility to ensure that ThaiVisa is able to remain in circulation in the country that we operate in. Primarily this is Thailand. If you break these rules and we don't deal with it then the very real consequence is that ThaiVisa forum will be unavailable for debate of this kind. That would be self-defeating for this topic.

The "other" thread was closed due to an increasing number of posts that broke a large number of forum rules in a matter of a few hours. We could have gone back and removed them all and still have received criticism. The choice was made by a moderator to close that thread and a discussion has taken place in which the majority have agreed that is a good idea considering the direction it was moving in. This thread is another opportunity to discuss.

Let me reiterate some basic forum rules. Any violations WILL be met with posting suspensions without any warning from this point onwards.

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These are just the forum rules that applied to the last few pages of the recently closed thread. PLEASE refrain from violating them on this thread. It is important that this debate is able to be continued.

[Artisi]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

Your comments may well be how the outcome plays out, unfortunately it doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty as charged.

[jdinasia]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

If the evidence is conclusive then I don't think anyone will be unhappy about it.

Unlike you not many here believe the evidence. Far to many inconsistencies.

There is a man who has claimed he was beaten and forced to confess to being a rapist by the RTP. He is innocent.

The latest of many. Can you not understand why people have doubt ?

Totally unrelated cases, but he was cleared by DNA.

We will see the evidence in court. The newspapers are not evidence. The trial is what matters now. Constant speculation until the trial is counter productive.

[JLCrab]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

Your comments may well be how the outcome plays out, unfortunately it doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty as charged.

Conversely, even if the 2 accused are responsible for the crimes, the evidence and the prosecution may be so inconclusive that the 2 cannot be convicted of the charges beyond any reasonable doubt.

Edited February 26, 2015 by JLCrab

[jdinasia]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

Your comments may well be how the outcome plays out, unfortunately it doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty as charged.

Conclusive is conclusive.

I am willing to see how the trial turns out.

[berybert]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

If the evidence is conclusive then I don't think anyone will be unhappy about it.

Unlike you not many here believe the evidence. Far to many inconsistencies.

There is a man who has claimed he was beaten and forced to confess to being a rapist by the RTP. He is innocent.

The latest of many. Can you not understand why people have doubt ?

Totally unrelated cases, but he was cleared by DNA.

We will see the evidence in court. The newspapers are not evidence. The trial is what matters now. Constant speculation until the trial is counter productive.

Of course it was totally unrelated I didn't say it wasn't.

He was cleared because he wasn't guilty. Beating someone up and forcing them to admit to a crime doesn't make them guilty.

[Artisi]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

Your comments may well be how the outcome plays out, unfortunately it doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty as charged.

Conclusive is conclusive.

I am willing to see how the trial turns out.

A flat earth was once conclusive and still believed by many which doesn't make it a fact.

[jdinasia]

Earlier in this topic, posts contain the words "real perpetrator", "real culprit", and "real killer". The 2 accused will be on trial this summer for these crimes. It is the job of the defense to show that the evidence to convict their clients is insufficient to allow a decision beyond reasonable doubt. In order to do this, it is not necessary to prove that another person or persons were responsible for the crime.

That is the stuff of Perry Mason.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

Your comments may well be how the outcome plays out, unfortunately it doesn't necessarily mean they are guilty as charged.

Conclusive is conclusive.

I am willing to see how the trial turns out.

A flat earth was once conclusive and still believed by many which doesn't make it a fact.

No, a flat earth was speculated. As soon as there was science it was proven not to be flat. You do make the point for me that even when it is proven that some will ignore the proof.

The trial will be interesting. Edited February 26, 2015 by draftvader
Cleaning up quotes

[scorecard]

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some heavy accusations being made elsewhere

What do you mean?

[scorecard]

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If the evidence is conclusive then I don't think anyone will be unhappy about it.

I doubt that people will refrain from defamation, but who knows.

There's going to be a trial. I expect the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers to be convicted. I expect the evidence to be conclusive. Finally, I expect some people to be unhappy about it.

Unlike you not many here believe the evidence. Far to many inconsistencies.

There is a man who has claimed he was beaten and forced to confess to being a rapist by the RTP. He is innocent.

The latest of many. Can you not understand why people have doubt ?

Another point, I have difficulty to see how there could be a fair trial when all and sundry were allowed to trample all over the crime scene, it took weeks to get any forensic police / forensic experts to the scene, the police changed the investigators several times, the prosecutors seem to be relying to some extent on a cigarette butt, given that all and sundry were allowed to trample the crime scene for many days, should there be doubt whether the cigarette butt was there immediately after the murders were committed or did the cig. butt 'arrive' some time later, perhaps cast aside by a later sightseer? And the local head man was allowed to basically supervise the police investigations and at the same time he threatened anybody who tried to mention his son. And there seems to be unanswered questions in regard to the so called 'evidence' that the son was in Bangkok.

Edited February 26, 2015 by scorecard

[draftvader]

That didn't take long. Not one of the rules that was specified but still a forum rule. Short holiday for 1 poster for flaming.

7) You will respect fellow members and post in a civil manner. No personal attacks, hateful or insulting towards other members, (flaming) Stalking of members on either the forum or via PM will not be allowed.

Please respect the forum rules. I am serious that we want threads to remain open.

Please be civil.

[JLCrab]

Another point, I have difficulty to see how there could be a fair trial ... Well, that is your opinion to which you are entitled. However, that ultimately will rest upon the opinion of the judge or judges who will be responsible for the trial.

[Scott]

Continuing an off-topic discussion is not permitted.

//CLOSED//