Koh Tao murders: Thai police bureau ignores NHRC summons

[alfalfa19]

I'm fairly convinced that the son had something to do with it at this stage, if I was him and wanted to prove my innocence I would be submitting my DNA to anyone and everyone.

I have a feeling now that this is going to end with Prayuth giving some grovelling apology

I hope so. But if it does reach that point, I think the PM will just blame it on corrupt/stupid underlings, that way he can save face.

[Oziex1]

I'd say the police are running scared right now they never anticipated this and do not know what to do next. There'd be infighting for sure.

Yep,

you go to the NHRC no you, f that you go, not me I have bad back so you have to go, solly have day off today. OK nobody go, no problem they forget soon.

[alfalfa19]

Man this is so obviously an admission of guilt and the x-rays were always going to come back with nothing. They are not exactly stupid enough to leave broken bones or cigarette burns are they, there are may methods of torture that leave no traces but are brutal, and one is mental torture, another is suffocation and I will bet my house the police know every technique in the book.

They are however, very stupid to hide behind this lame excuse of the investigation being in the hands of the prosecutors which now must make them completely shielded from torture accusations. They are completely different things. But i a way I am glad they took the stupidity route on this issue, because they just succeeded in making themselves look not only imbeciles, but as guilty as sin also.

I hope the USA are watching.

Apparently, one method of torture used by RTP in the past has been to put a thick book, such as a telephone directory, on the desired confessor's chest while they lie on the floor. The desired confessor's chest is then hit using something like a baseball bat. No marks, but apparently painful and thus effective.

Another alleged method is to put a plastic bag over the desired confessor's head to make them think they are about to be suffocated.

I think almost everybody would confess to having committed almost anything under those circumstances.

There is also the coca cola torture, but I don't know if it's still in use in Thailand. It also leaves no marks.

[kingalfred]

RTP "a law until their-self" as the phrase goes. "law" having it's own definition in LOS

[Oziex1]

"The judge said the suspects could be detained for up to 84 days."

And when those 84 days pass, another 84 day extension.....they're banking

on the public's short attention span.....BUT, let's NOT forget, lest it happens again!

Keep the pressure on!!

If they were Thai, they would be out on bail already.

I wonder if the Brit police are aware of the various allegations found on social media/TV and so forth? If I could speak to one of the officers I would simply say: Please do not trust the Bib: they are very good at smiling at you whilst stabbing you in the back at the same time.

The Brit police will be aware of everything they need to be aware of, don't worry about them their work what ever the limitations may be will have and is already having a huge impact on this case.

[Jip99]

Man this is so obviously an admission of guilt and the x-rays were always going to come back with nothing. They are not exactly stupid enough to leave broken bones or cigarette burns are they, there are may methods of torture that leave no traces but are brutal, and one is mental torture, another is suffocation and I will bet my house the police know every technique in the book.

They are however, very stupid to hide behind this lame excuse of the investigation being in the hands of the prosecutors which now must make them completely shielded from torture accusations. They are completely different things. But i a way I am glad they took the stupidity route on this issue, because they just succeeded in making themselves look not only imbeciles, but as guilty as sin also.

I hope the USA are watching.

USA........ watching for what ?

[xygote]

I wonder why the NHRC can't call on the banana man/interpreter to give his account ass, apparently he was supposed to have abused the two suspects whilst working as an informal interpreter.

As he is not, supposedly, a member of the RTP (despite him being seen in a polo shirt with some RTP logo during the re-enactment/photo ops), surely he should be able to be grilled/questioned?

[jpeg]

This RTP (NPO) investigation we are told has been completed and is now the domain of the Public Prosecutor. If this be so, why then this piece of reporting quoted in part...

"...However, the NPO told the NHRC that investigation into the case was already in the hands of the public prosecutors and that it needed to seek prior approval from the prosecutors before providing any details on the case to the NHRC".

"Meanwhile, the Koh Samui Court yesterday approved a police request that the suspects' detention be extended by another 12 days, as more time was needed to complete the investigation".

Now which is to be BIB, either you have completed the investigation or you have not? Or is this a case of 'grasping at straws' so as to stitch these two guys up?

Neither. I can tell you from experience there is no 'Law' here. They just make stuff up as they go along. Remember, they're a tribe playing at being a nation.

[dieseldave1951]

However, the NPO told the NHRC that investigation into the case was already in the hands of the public prosecutors and that it needed to seek prior approval from the prosecutors before providing any details on the case to the NHRC.

Meanwhile, the Koh Samui Court yesterday approved a police request that the suspects' detention be extended by another 12 days, as more time was needed to complete the investigation.

Public prosecutors have instructed investigators to gather more information for the third time, and police will work further into the case.

is the RTP and the NPO the same

it does not seem so !! seams that the RTP are trying to hood wink there own masters

ah lets play hide the evidence (what evidence) ?????

that suposed DNA 100% got ya evidence has got to so weak for the prosecutors office to return it three times

i wonder how Pryuth is feeling now and if he rewarded the RTP for a "job well done"

[Baerboxer]

Like some of the Thai locals have already mentioned on social media... ' Nobody ever fight back before.' The police are not used to this and are now certainly making things up as they go along. Even lawyers couldn't get credible alibis out into the public without stuffing up ie. The university photo that was actually a dorm photo. Still shots, not good ones, of video footage. The actual video footage would be a much better alibi but again they probably didn't think there would be to much fuss made. Wrong again.

The police are used to doing as they like, saying what they like, and making their version of the law up as they go along. If you have problems with the police and you know a more senior officer, a phone call makes the problem go away. Different parts of the police seem to squabble regularly.

Public criticism of anything in Thailand has always been a bit taboo - don't challenge authority you won't win mentality. Add to that the propensity for simply lying or saying any load of old cobblers when it suits and the underlying threats and people just accepted the crap.

The developments in information technology has changed that. People did protest, in very big numbers, about what they saw as an unjust government trying grant blanket amnesty. Now people are protesting about inept, corrupt policing. This must be one hell of a shock for the establishment. Regardless of political allegiance, all politicians, civil service and police are used to getting their own way here, being unaccountable and doing as they please. Many many examples.

The initial changes in the police earlier in the year seemed encouraging - now it seems they were simply politically based. Thailand will never have a robust police force whilst officers have to pay to join, buy rank, buy position, buy their own equipment and are paid low salaries with the expectation they can "supplement" them. Thailand will never have a robust justice system whilst that system allows the rich and connected "elite" to avoid prosecution or receive ludicrously light sentences when convicted of serious misdoings. And neither of those 2 will be changed without significant changes to the political environment.

The fact many can simply just choose to not turn up or cooperate with official committees, and even courts, with no consequences, says it all.

[Jack Burton]

It is blatantly obvious what is going on, nobody has ever stood up or questioned the bullying before. The filth had an open field to extort, bully, and engineer criminal charges on the innocent with no consequence. All of a sudden a few questions get asked and guys are being removed from posts, human rights meetings get shunted, interpreters conveniently just disappear after it is found out he can't even speak the language he was meant to be interpreting, the list goes on. When you stand up to a bully they usually shit it as they are not used to someone having the balls to do so, this is the same case.

I know Thailand is third world and is a bed of corruption, but lets be honest for one minute here. That Mon guy was all over a crime scene, a murder scene, with a few of his buddies a few hours after it happened. That isn't third world or the act of a thick village police force, it is a blatant act of making sure the real story doesn't come out and to clean up any mistakes that were left behind.

[Oziex1]

Like some of the Thai locals have already mentioned on social media... ' Nobody ever fight back before.' The police are not used to this and are now certainly making things up as they go along. Even lawyers couldn't get credible alibis out into the public without stuffing up ie. The university photo that was actually a dorm photo. Still shots, not good ones, of video footage. The actual video footage would be a much better alibi but again they probably didn't think there would be to much fuss made. Wrong again.

The police are used to doing as they like, saying what they like, and making their version of the law up as they go along. If you have problems with the police and you know a more senior officer, a phone call makes the problem go away. Different parts of the police seem to squabble regularly.

Public criticism of anything in Thailand has always been a bit taboo - don't challenge authority you won't win mentality. Add to that the propensity for simply lying or saying any load of old cobblers when it suits and the underlying threats and people just accepted the crap.

The developments in information technology has changed that. People did protest, in very big numbers, about what they saw as an unjust government trying grant blanket amnesty. Now people are protesting about inept, corrupt policing. This must be one hell of a shock for the establishment. Regardless of political allegiance, all politicians, civil service and police are used to getting their own way here, being unaccountable and doing as they please. Many many examples.

The initial changes in the police earlier in the year seemed encouraging - now it seems they were simply politically based. Thailand will never have a robust police force whilst officers have to pay to join, buy rank, buy position, buy their own equipment and are paid low salaries with the expectation they can "supplement" them. Thailand will never have a robust justice system whilst that system allows the rich and connected "elite" to avoid prosecution or receive ludicrously light sentences when convicted of serious misdoings. And neither of those 2 will be changed without significant changes to the political environment.

The fact many can simply just choose to not turn up or cooperate with official committees, and even courts, with no consequences, says it all.

Agreed

The thing that amazes me is in my country you get investigated you may get bail, you go to trial you maybe found not guilty, if guilty you go straight to jail. In Thailand you are found guilty and then out on bail?? Laws for the crooks by the crooks.

[SteveFong]

NATIONAL HUMAN RIGHTS COMMISSION

X-ray results on Myanmar suspects show no traces of assaults

BANGKOK: -- Latest X-ray results on the two Koh Tao suspects found no unusual indications, said Dr Nirund Pitakwatchara, National Human Rights Committee (NHRC) member said Monday.

However, the results were not unexpected, he said, as the suspects were arrested on October 1 and the x-ray took place on October 13 and 20, many days later. "Therefore, it is difficult to find anything unusual," he said.

Police yesterday did not show up to meet NHRC members who invited them to discuss about the police investigation into the Kho Tao murders that resulted in arrests of two Myanmar nationals.

Nirand quoted police as saying that they could not meet the commissioners because they have to ask permission from public prosecutors first.

Nirand said police are misunderstanding as his agency did not want to discuss about the details of the case but it has to look into the suspects’ claims that they were violated of human rights and police assaulted them.

The NHRC will invite police again to meet it again on November 3, he said.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/X-ray-results-on-Myanmar-suspects-show-no-traces-o-30246350.html

-- The Nation 2014-10-28

Strange that tis report from 3 hours ago stands uncommented.

Ok let me start.

The NHRC has been bought out now, the X-ray report is false and was contaminated .

why?

all it means is, they didn't break any ribs,

show me how suffocation with a plastic bag shows up on an xray, or the threat of electrocution

these kids were scared beyond imagination, likely while handcuffed and in pain

there is nothing to comment on

[loongdavid]

This RTP (NPO) investigation we are told has been completed and is now the domain of the Public Prosecutor. If this be so, why then this piece of reporting quoted in part...

"...However, the NPO told the NHRC that investigation into the case was already in the hands of the public prosecutors and that it needed to seek prior approval from the prosecutors before providing any details on the case to the NHRC".

"Meanwhile, the Koh Samui Court yesterday approved a police request that the suspects' detention be extended by another 12 days, as more time was needed to complete the investigation".

Now which is to be BIB, either you have completed the investigation or you have not? Or is this a case of 'grasping at straws' so as to stitch these two guys up?

Neither. I can tell you from experience there is no 'Law' here. They just make stuff up as they go along. Remember, they're a tribe playing at being a nation.

I take your point, I see examples of it each and every day, but I think you're being a wee bit harsh with your "tribe" comment particularly as the "tribe" as you succinctly put it is made up of so many diverse and uniquely different peoples. Someone in supreme authority only needs to tell the rest that a great deal of what goes into being a developed country starts with education and discipline.

[Gunna]

"Nirand said police are misunderstanding as his agency did not want to discuss about the details of the case but it has to look into the suspects’ claims that they were violated of human rights and police assaulted them."

Insert the word "deliberately" before "misunderstanding" and you have a more accurate assessment.

Also

"The British team stepped in after word spread that the 'real' culprit in the case might evade the long arm of the law."

should have been written

"The British team stepped in after word spread that the "real' culprit in the case has so far evaded the short arm of the law."

[theoldgit]

One post "Troll Calling" removed, as well as a number of responses.

[theoldgit]

Post in breach of Forum Rues removed.

26) The Bangkok Post and Phuketwan do not allow quotes from their news articles or other material to appear on Thaivisa.com. Neither do they allow links to their publications. Posts from members containing quotes from or links to Bangkok Post or Phuketwan publications will be deleted from the forum.

[12DrinkMore]

There is just an overwhelming impression of a total lack of responsibility by those in the upper echelons of the RTP.

I wonder who in the RTP is going to be hung out to dry when the Met report is made public?

What makes you think it will be made public?

[DaveinAsia]

There are many ways of torturing that leave no trace whatsoever....everybody knows this

X-ray results on Myanmar suspects show no traces of assaults

Edited October 28, 2014 by DaveinAsia

[BangkokHank]

"An informed source, meanwhile, said British police had already started gathering information on the case. The British team stepped in after word spread that the 'real' culprit in the case might evade the long arm of the law."

To me, this is the most significant part of the original article - the fact that a distinction is being made between the accused murderers - and the "real" one. That tells me that the British police know very well who is responsible for the murders. If I were that person, I would be very worried by now.

[Travel Dude]

Someone must know the truth... If the truth is that the Police did a cover up then there is only one option for the "best of the Country". Arrest the Police who screwed up as well as their commanders and their Chiefs. Burn them down in public, give them the blame for the screw up and throw them in jail. Responsibility taken and image of Thailand cleared.

One thing for sure, blaming those poor Burmese scapegoats will not work.

[DaveinAsia]

NHRC is controlled by NCPO and most likely RTP. They have no real power whatsoever and therefor can't be taken seriously in this investigation. As for the copshop from back home that has turned up; does anyone on this forum actually believe that they are going to discredit the official outcome of this investigation? Wake up please. After Cameron met with the good General in Milano suddenly UK cops were allowed to come over to TH. This invitation was only granted with the guarantee that they would comply to the RTP's version of the story. By bringing in the UK cops, who of course are going to comply with the initial RTP version, they will silence all the people with doubts. If the UK cops say its so, it must be so. Somehow Brits here live in the illusion that our cops back home are any better than cops elsewhere. Lol. Those clowns back home have to answer to David Cameron f-f-s . Imagine for a few minutes while I make a coffee

Edited October 28, 2014 by DaveinAsia

[DennisF]

NHRC is controlled by NCPO and most likely RTP. They have no real power whatsoever and therefor can't be taken seriously in this investigation. As for the copshop from back home that has turned up; does anyone on this forum actually believe that they are going to discredit the official outcome of this investigation? Wake up please. After Cameron met with the good General in Milano suddenly UK cops were allowed to come over to TH. This invitation was only granted with the guarantee that they would comply to the RTP's version of the story. By bringing in the UK cops, who of course are going to comply with the initial RTP version, they will silence all the people with doubts. If the UK cops say its so, it must be so. Somehow Brits here live in the illusion that our cops back home are any better than cops elsewhere. Lol. Those clowns back home have to answer to David Cameron f-f-s . Imagine for a few minutes while I make a coffee

Link please or is it worthless guesswork?

Link to where the UK gov said it was prepared to do so and put its own reputation on the line for a 3rd world country that

has no fiscal power, no strategic importance, no political clout and has the reputation of being the whorehouse of Asia.

[Sviss Geez]

Also, it's not very bright: at the very least they could have sent a representative and advised that they needed to seek further advice from prosecutors prior to any detailed information being given/questions answered. Simply not turning up is not going to make this go away.

That's exactly what the NPO did...

"However, the NPO told the NHRC that investigation into the case was already in the hands of the public prosecutors and that it needed to seek prior approval from the prosecutors before providing any details on the case to the NHRC"

[Sviss Geez]

"The judge said the suspects could be detained for up to 84 days."

And when those 84 days pass, another 84 day extension.....they're banking

on the public's short attention span.....BUT, let's NOT forget, lest it happens again!

Keep the pressure on!!

"And when those 84 days pass, another 84 day extension..."

No, after 84 days they have to be indicted or released.

[CNXTim]

Squirm and wriggle - this is not going away.

[Sviss Geez]

Let me see if I got this right??

The police ignores the NHRC summons, because the case is finished and sent to the prosecutors.

The police ask the court to detain the suspects for another 12 days, because they need more time to investigate!

Makes sense, NOT!!

It does makes sense if you quote things correctly.

In the OP the police did not say "...because the case is finished and sent to the prosecutors.", they said that it was in the hands of the prosecutors who have asked the police for more information.

[loongdavid]

NHRC is controlled by NCPO and most likely RTP. They have no real power whatsoever and therefor can't be taken seriously in this investigation. As for the copshop from back home that has turned up; does anyone on this forum actually believe that they are going to discredit the official outcome of this investigation? Wake up please. After Cameron met with the good General in Milano suddenly UK cops were allowed to come over to TH. This invitation was only granted with the guarantee that they would comply to the RTP's version of the story. By bringing in the UK cops, who of course are going to comply with the initial RTP version, they will silence all the people with doubts. If the UK cops say its so, it must be so. Somehow Brits here live in the illusion that our cops back home are any better than cops elsewhere. Lol. Those clowns back home have to answer to David Cameron f-f-s . Imagine for a few minutes while I make a coffee

I too would very much like to read the link from which you are quoting. I am of the opinion that Britain would not under any circumstances agree to sending to Thailand British police observers who have given a "...guarantee that they would comply to the RTP's version of the story". Scotland Yard's credibility would be in tatters if they did this. You are patently incorrect if you say "...who of course are going to comply with the initial RTP version". Furthermore, I cannot agree with your summation reference the British police, their professional integrity is always on the line and they are far ahead of anything in Thailand.

[Sviss Geez]

.......as more time was needed to complete the investigation.

Did I not read a few days ago that the police considered its investigation complete and that it has arrested those guilty of the crime?

The public prosecutor's and the police's understanding of "complete" are different and the prosecutors are the ones who will decide whether to indict.

[wilcopops]

"it will never happen" is a hackneyed phrase that seems to be rolled out she the poster has no real opinion but wants to seem to be well-informed.

in reality Thailand has changed dramatically over the past decade - there are of course always those who think the past was a better place and try to maintain a hold on the ever-slippery status quo.

but the fat that this incident has erupted into both Thai and intentional media is itself "a change".

a grovelling apology? - I'd say that is extremely unlikely but certainly the Thai authorities will be looking for a way out that both appeases critics and saves the police etc from losing face - an exercise in Kraeng Jai is, i'd wager, already being put into action.

on the other if the police just blunder ahead, ignore their critics and repeatedly try to put an incomplete case to the prosecutors, it will end in massive loss of face not just for the RTP but also for the Kingdom.

To use your own words: " the poster has no real opinion, but wants to seem to be well-informed"

As for "krengjai" learn the true meaning of the word, before using it!!

Sorry but I know the meaning - the problem seems to be your inability to comprehend - if you have any criticism of my post PLEASE - why not actually formulate an argument? So far you haven't made a coherent point.

Edited October 28, 2014 by wilcopops