Family of Brits murdered in Thailand say evidence convincing

[AleG]

Pardon me, maybe I suffer from OCD, but am compelled to again list the things which Thai cops either didn't look in to, or looked in to and decided it would implicate the Headman's people (Mon, Nomsod, Stingray man, Mon's cop friend) ....so they trashed it. BTW, Ms Porntip, Thailand's premier forensic investigator, has mentioned the same thing which I've been mentioning several times in these threads: Thai police should not be at the vanguard of crime scene investigations. Police are trained in being police, investigators are trained in investigating crimes. Medical personnel are trained in obtaining and typing DNA. In this case, regular police have been assigned to do many investigative things which are outside their field of expertise. Plus they're objective and discouraged to mention anything which may differ with what their superiors want to see. Anyhow, here's my partial list:

>>> ascertain what weapon(s) killed David.

>>> Take a 2nd, very close look at the hoe, to make sure whether it contains any DNA other than from Hannah's blood.

>>> Thoroughly search for any clues which relate to bloody clothes. Thus far, we're led to believe there were no bloody clothes/shoes outside the crime scene. Check any and all laundry facilities on the island.

>>> Look closely at the CCTV footage. It obviously doesn't show either of the B2. Who is shown? Why does he wear a different color pair of shorts in each video?

>>> The shorts at the crime scene: do they still exist (or been destroyed?). There must be some residual DNA on them.

>>> Nomsod's mother. Haven't heard a peep about her. Does he have one? If so, she must know something.

>>> Phone history. It's very likely all the Headman's people now have new sim cards. However, there must be records of calls from the fateful night.

>>> scenario in the bar prior to the crime that night. It's obvious why police don't make any mention of it, and they don't want us prying in to that.

>>> speedboat operators. There was some mention in the 1st days of the investigation. But again, if cops found anything which might implicate the Headman's people, they're going to stuff it.

>>> full body searches of all suspects, including Headman's people. Unfortunately, it's late now to do so, but there still may be scars. This sounds weird but, a medical expert should look at each man's penis. Why? because nothing will enrage a man as much as having teeth or fingernails damage his willy. There was a fatal eruption of rage that night. What triggered it?

>>> Interview Sean

>>> Nomsod's barber: has he been questioned? Same for his g.f. and other friends in Bkk.

>>> Bank accounts of top brass involved with case. Any unusual activity since crime?

.....the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people.

"...the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people. "

Of course you are leaving out another option, that they did look into all the details and that is why the Burmese men are the suspects.

[boomerangutang]

Pardon me, maybe I suffer from OCD, but am compelled to again list the things which Thai cops either didn't look in to, or looked in to and decided it would implicate the Headman's people (Mon, Nomsod, Stingray man, Mon's cop friend) ....so they trashed it. BTW, Ms Porntip, Thailand's premier forensic investigator, has mentioned the same thing which I've been mentioning several times in these threads: Thai police should not be at the vanguard of crime scene investigations. Police are trained in being police, investigators are trained in investigating crimes. Medical personnel are trained in obtaining and typing DNA. In this case, regular police have been assigned to do many investigative things which are outside their field of expertise. Plus they're objective and discouraged to mention anything which may differ with what their superiors want to see. Anyhow, here's my partial list:

>>> ascertain what weapon(s) killed David.

>>> Take a 2nd, very close look at the hoe, to make sure whether it contains any DNA other than from Hannah's blood.

>>> Thoroughly search for any clues which relate to bloody clothes. Thus far, we're led to believe there were no bloody clothes/shoes outside the crime scene. Check any and all laundry facilities on the island.

>>> Look closely at the CCTV footage. It obviously doesn't show either of the B2. Who is shown? Why does he wear a different color pair of shorts in each video?

>>> The shorts at the crime scene: do they still exist (or been destroyed?). There must be some residual DNA on them.

>>> Nomsod's mother. Haven't heard a peep about her. Does he have one? If so, she must know something.

>>> Phone history. It's very likely all the Headman's people now have new sim cards. However, there must be records of calls from the fateful night.

>>> scenario in the bar prior to the crime that night. It's obvious why police don't make any mention of it, and they don't want us prying in to that.

>>> speedboat operators. There was some mention in the 1st days of the investigation. But again, if cops found anything which might implicate the Headman's people, they're going to stuff it.

>>> full body searches of all suspects, including Headman's people. Unfortunately, it's late now to do so, but there still may be scars. This sounds weird but, a medical expert should look at each man's penis. Why? because nothing will enrage a man as much as having teeth or fingernails damage his willy. There was a fatal eruption of rage that night. What triggered it?

>>> Interview Sean

>>> Nomsod's barber: has he been questioned? Same for his g.f. and other friends in Bkk.

>>> Bank accounts of top brass involved with case. Any unusual activity since crime?

.....the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people.

"...the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people. "

Of course you are leaving out another option, that they did look into all the details and that is why the Burmese men are the suspects.

Police have made many announcements since the crime. Granted, most of them were within the first 2 weeks from the crime date. However, among their announcements, they have not mentioned most of the the items I listed. They're eager to convince the general public of their hoped-for scenarios (B2 are guilty, whilst Headman's people aren't even suspects), yet they avoid mentioning a whole slew of items which could prove useful as evidence. Among other things, it paints authorities as blundering, at best.

[berybert]

3 or 4 people own that island. 3 or 4 bullets would free that island.

[DennisF]

3 or 4 people own that island. 3 or 4 bullets would free that island.

I wondered how long it would be before we got a post like this.

So you think that a bunch of armed vigilantes wandering around the island playing judge jury and executioner would make it safer??

Personally I think vigilantes are the other side of the same coin.

[jaidam]

Should we stop discussing this case for 24 hours out of respect for a future headman of Koh Tao to have his big day entering monkhood in Phangan? Such an auspicious day and here we are bickering over trivialities.

[DennisF]

Should we stop discussing this case for 24 hours out of respect for a future headman of Koh Tao to have his big day entering monkhood in Phangan? Such an auspicious day and here we are bickering over trivialities.

Naaa, lets not do that, he likes the attention.

[berybert]

3 or 4 people own that island. 3 or 4 bullets would free that island.

I wondered how long it would be before we got a post like this.

So you think that a bunch of armed vigilantes wandering around the island playing judge jury and executioner would make it safer??

Personally I think vigilantes are the other side of the same coin.

No it wouldn't make it any safer. Its paradise now so what could ever go wrong ?

The police on the island are doing a great job also, so there would be no need for anyone else to get involved.

[DennisF]

3 or 4 people own that island. 3 or 4 bullets would free that island.

I wondered how long it would be before we got a post like this.

So you think that a bunch of armed vigilantes wandering around the island playing judge jury and executioner would make it safer??

Personally I think vigilantes are the other side of the same coin.

No it wouldn't make it any safer. Its paradise now so what could ever go wrong ?

The police on the island are doing a great job also, so there would be no need for anyone else to get involved.

Sarcasm is not the answer either.

Working for justice in an ethical and honest way is the only answer.

Condoning even more violence on that disgusting and vulgar place is not.

[boomerangutang]

3 or 4 people own that island. 3 or 4 bullets would free that island.

I wondered how long it would be before we got a post like this.

So you think that a bunch of armed vigilantes wandering around the island playing judge jury and executioner would make it safer??

Personally I think vigilantes are the other side of the same coin.

No it wouldn't make it any safer. Its paradise now so what could ever go wrong ?

The police on the island are doing a great job also, so there would be no need for anyone else to get involved.

Taking out (in the mafia sense of the word) head honchos - would only make room for a new set of head honchos. Do you think the replacements will be any more or less decent than their mafia-like daddies? Similar to fixing government, the answer is not just getting newer people in high places, the answer is getting people with a modicum of a moral compass, and a willingness to be decent. It's not enough to know what's right and what's wrong. A person has to have the moral terpitude to buck the social trends, and do right things. ....or 'right action' as a Buddhist would say. Similar to westerners' relation to Christianity: Asians' relation to Buddhism is just going through the motions and saying the words they've been taught at the right times. Asian's exhibit very little of true Buddhism in their every day activities and thoughts.

Ramakrisna, a spiritually enlightened man from early 20th century India, used to say:

"you see the monkeys sitting along the top of the wall. People think they're spiritual because they look calm and meditative. They're just waiting until they see some food dropped by visitors to the temple, then they come charging over to get it."

[z42]

Pardon me, maybe I suffer from OCD, but am compelled to again list the things which Thai cops either didn't look in to, or looked in to and decided it would implicate the Headman's people (Mon, Nomsod, Stingray man, Mon's cop friend) ....so they trashed it. BTW, Ms Porntip, Thailand's premier forensic investigator, has mentioned the same thing which I've been mentioning several times in these threads: Thai police should not be at the vanguard of crime scene investigations. Police are trained in being police, investigators are trained in investigating crimes. Medical personnel are trained in obtaining and typing DNA. In this case, regular police have been assigned to do many investigative things which are outside their field of expertise. Plus they're objective and discouraged to mention anything which may differ with what their superiors want to see. Anyhow, here's my partial list:

>>> ascertain what weapon(s) killed David.

>>> Take a 2nd, very close look at the hoe, to make sure whether it contains any DNA other than from Hannah's blood.

>>> Thoroughly search for any clues which relate to bloody clothes. Thus far, we're led to believe there were no bloody clothes/shoes outside the crime scene. Check any and all laundry facilities on the island.

>>> Look closely at the CCTV footage. It obviously doesn't show either of the B2. Who is shown? Why does he wear a different color pair of shorts in each video?

>>> The shorts at the crime scene: do they still exist (or been destroyed?). There must be some residual DNA on them.

>>> Nomsod's mother. Haven't heard a peep about her. Does he have one? If so, she must know something.

>>> Phone history. It's very likely all the Headman's people now have new sim cards. However, there must be records of calls from the fateful night.

>>> scenario in the bar prior to the crime that night. It's obvious why police don't make any mention of it, and they don't want us prying in to that.

>>> speedboat operators. There was some mention in the 1st days of the investigation. But again, if cops found anything which might implicate the Headman's people, they're going to stuff it.

>>> full body searches of all suspects, including Headman's people. Unfortunately, it's late now to do so, but there still may be scars. This sounds weird but, a medical expert should look at each man's penis. Why? because nothing will enrage a man as much as having teeth or fingernails damage his willy. There was a fatal eruption of rage that night. What triggered it?

>>> Interview Sean

>>> Nomsod's barber: has he been questioned? Same for his g.f. and other friends in Bkk.

>>> Bank accounts of top brass involved with case. Any unusual activity since crime?

.....the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people.

"...the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people. "

Of course you are leaving out another option, that they did look into all the details and that is why the Burmese men are the suspects.

Haha you're joking, right?

Who exactly is the running man if it isn't Nomsod then. I mean come on let's look at the probabilities. There is a man of similar height, build, race and hairstyle. Then there is the nervous tic with the elbow, the same elbow that Nomsod has a nervous tic with. Factor in that he is in the direct vicinity of a blood relative's bar in the early hours of the morning.

What are the odds, it is in the billions that it isn't him. And also you say the police did look into it, and seemed to think the same as I wrote just above. And i especialy think the part where the head cop directly says that the first subject is Mon, ansd the second subject is the son of the headman who has is now in Bangkok and is expected to be picked up anytime now.

But the clincher for me is the quote of the top cop at the time

"He said both suspects were captured by CCTV cameras and the police have gathered enough evidence to implicate them in the murders."

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run

This cop was stood down almost immediately after making this announcement. So I wonder what happened to that CCTV footage and the evidence gathered to implicate them. There 1 minute, and what did the new head cop just bin it and start afresh on his first day? Incredibly fishy stuff but also incredibly naive to make the statement like you just made without any kind of backup. Where is the evidence for the "other option" then AleG?

[thailandchilli]

We all wonder what some of this compelling evidence the prosecution has. I hope its still not the un trusted DNA match as that is too unreliable to to give a safe conviction. I have an idea that some of the evidence they have is the cctv. Which can be easily manipulated and fixed by changing dates/times etc. Lets face it, in the west for cctv to be permissible in a court case it needs to go through a rigorous authentication test before it can be trusted, here in Thailand it seems anything will do.

I believe that there is plenty of tape we have not seen yet, for instance take a look at screen grabs below.

The one with the guy and the phone to me looks as if this could be a different man from the running man?

Lets not forget what the prosecutor said to the RTP, "fix the flaws"!!

Edited December 22, 2014 by thailandchilli

[z42]

Pardon me, maybe I suffer from OCD, but am compelled to again list the things which Thai cops either didn't look in to, or looked in to and decided it would implicate the Headman's people (Mon, Nomsod, Stingray man, Mon's cop friend) ....so they trashed it. BTW, Ms Porntip, Thailand's premier forensic investigator, has mentioned the same thing which I've been mentioning several times in these threads: Thai police should not be at the vanguard of crime scene investigations. Police are trained in being police, investigators are trained in investigating crimes. Medical personnel are trained in obtaining and typing DNA. In this case, regular police have been assigned to do many investigative things which are outside their field of expertise. Plus they're objective and discouraged to mention anything which may differ with what their superiors want to see. Anyhow, here's my partial list:

>>> ascertain what weapon(s) killed David.

>>> Take a 2nd, very close look at the hoe, to make sure whether it contains any DNA other than from Hannah's blood.

>>> Thoroughly search for any clues which relate to bloody clothes. Thus far, we're led to believe there were no bloody clothes/shoes outside the crime scene. Check any and all laundry facilities on the island.

>>> Look closely at the CCTV footage. It obviously doesn't show either of the B2. Who is shown? Why does he wear a different color pair of shorts in each video?

>>> The shorts at the crime scene: do they still exist (or been destroyed?). There must be some residual DNA on them.

>>> Nomsod's mother. Haven't heard a peep about her. Does he have one? If so, she must know something.

>>> Phone history. It's very likely all the Headman's people now have new sim cards. However, there must be records of calls from the fateful night.

>>> scenario in the bar prior to the crime that night. It's obvious why police don't make any mention of it, and they don't want us prying in to that.

>>> speedboat operators. There was some mention in the 1st days of the investigation. But again, if cops found anything which might implicate the Headman's people, they're going to stuff it.

>>> full body searches of all suspects, including Headman's people. Unfortunately, it's late now to do so, but there still may be scars. This sounds weird but, a medical expert should look at each man's penis. Why? because nothing will enrage a man as much as having teeth or fingernails damage his willy. There was a fatal eruption of rage that night. What triggered it?

>>> Interview Sean

>>> Nomsod's barber: has he been questioned? Same for his g.f. and other friends in Bkk.

>>> Bank accounts of top brass involved with case. Any unusual activity since crime?

.....the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people.

"...the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people. "

Of course you are leaving out another option, that they did look into all the details and that is why the Burmese men are the suspects.

Haha you're joking, right?

Who exactly is the running man if it isn't Nomsod then. I mean come on let's look at the probabilities. There is a man of similar height, build, race and hairstyle. Then there is the nervous tic with the elbow, the same elbow that Nomsod has a nervous tic with. Factor in that he is in the direct vicinity of a blood relative's bar in the early hours of the morning.

What are the odds, it is in the billions that it isn't him. And also you say the police did look into it, and seemed to think the same as I wrote just above. And i especialy think the part where the head cop directly says that the first subject is Mon, ansd the second subject is the son of the headman who has is now in Bangkok and is expected to be picked up anytime now.

But the clincher for me is the quote of the top cop at the time

"He said both suspects were captured by CCTV cameras and the police have gathered enough evidence to implicate them in the murders."

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run

This cop was stood down almost immediately after making this announcement. So I wonder what happened to that CCTV footage and the evidence gathered to implicate them. There 1 minute, and what did the new head cop just bin it and start afresh on his first day? Incredibly fishy stuff but also incredibly naive to make the statement like you just made without any kind of backup. Where is the evidence for the "other option" then AleG?

And if you're going to point to this article posted 2 days later then do be diligent enough to read the whole thing. http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/police-now-rule-koh-tao-headmans-son-murder-suspect-turn-foreign-tourists-probe

Pay close attention to this part here.

"Meanwhile on Thursday Pol Maj-Gen Suwat Jaengyodsuk, acting chief investigator of the Metropolitan Police Bureau (MPB), who was sent to help local police investigate the murder, said police had collected 30 DNA samples from migrant workers on the island in a bid to find clues to the murders.

So far more than 200 DNA samples were tested but none matched samples found in the body of Ms Hannah Witheridge, 23, and in a cigarette butt left near the scene".

These boys were tested before the 20th September. http://static.thaivisa.com/forum/uploads/monthly_12_2014/post-222707-0-29886800-1418613273.jpg

Strange how there was no match then. https://www.dvb.no/news/koh-tao-muder-burmese-migrants-cleared-after-dna-tests-burma-myanmar/44236

All I am doing here is merely pointing to the inconsistrencies in police statements, investigations and the current situation. You can't simply say that you trust implicitly the integrity of the RTP because above are just small examples showing inconsistenies. And when people's lives are on the line.

Also there were reports that 3 men confessed. But now only 2 are on trial. Something again hugely amiss. He confessed but is now not in custody while the other 2 that confessed are.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/765351-koh-tao-all-three-migrant-workers-confess-to-rape-and-murder-of-british-tourists/

So many holes, too many. I would love to see somebody explain this all away, but I doubt in court that will happen sadly

[AleG]

"...the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people. "

Of course you are leaving out another option, that they did look into all the details and that is why the Burmese men are the suspects.

Haha you're joking, right?

Who exactly is the running man if it isn't Nomsod then. I mean come on let's look at the probabilities. There is a man of similar height, build, race and hairstyle. Then there is the nervous tic with the elbow, the same elbow that Nomsod has a nervous tic with. Factor in that he is in the direct vicinity of a blood relative's bar in the early hours of the morning.

What are the odds, it is in the billions that it isn't him. And also you say the police did look into it, and seemed to think the same as I wrote just above. And i especialy think the part where the head cop directly says that the first subject is Mon, ansd the second subject is the son of the headman who has is now in Bangkok and is expected to be picked up anytime now.

But the clincher for me is the quote of the top cop at the time

"He said both suspects were captured by CCTV cameras and the police have gathered enough evidence to implicate them in the murders."

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run

This cop was stood down almost immediately after making this announcement. So I wonder what happened to that CCTV footage and the evidence gathered to implicate them. There 1 minute, and what did the new head cop just bin it and start afresh on his first day? Incredibly fishy stuff but also incredibly naive to make the statement like you just made without any kind of backup. Where is the evidence for the "other option" then AleG?

No, I'm not joking, the running man has as much, if not more, of a semblance to one of the accused as Nomsod; as you can see from thailandchill response you never see a comparison with the suspects photos and the CCTV footage when they try to push the "Nomsod did it" theory.

By "elbow tick" you mean that in one CCTV footage you see Nomsod moving his hair and in the Koh Tao footage the suspect reaches across his chest (not up to the head)?If you think that provides a positive match you are just seeing what you want to see.

As for the news article, the police arrested several suspects during the case, you are just fixated in one or two, you don't know on what evidence they based the arrest, and on what further evidence they released.

[z42]

"...the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people. "

Of course you are leaving out another option, that they did look into all the details and that is why the Burmese men are the suspects.

Haha you're joking, right?

Who exactly is the running man if it isn't Nomsod then. I mean come on let's look at the probabilities. There is a man of similar height, build, race and hairstyle. Then there is the nervous tic with the elbow, the same elbow that Nomsod has a nervous tic with. Factor in that he is in the direct vicinity of a blood relative's bar in the early hours of the morning.

What are the odds, it is in the billions that it isn't him. And also you say the police did look into it, and seemed to think the same as I wrote just above. And i especialy think the part where the head cop directly says that the first subject is Mon, ansd the second subject is the son of the headman who has is now in Bangkok and is expected to be picked up anytime now.

But the clincher for me is the quote of the top cop at the time

"He said both suspects were captured by CCTV cameras and the police have gathered enough evidence to implicate them in the murders."

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run

This cop was stood down almost immediately after making this announcement. So I wonder what happened to that CCTV footage and the evidence gathered to implicate them. There 1 minute, and what did the new head cop just bin it and start afresh on his first day? Incredibly fishy stuff but also incredibly naive to make the statement like you just made without any kind of backup. Where is the evidence for the "other option" then AleG?

No, I'm not joking, the running man has as much, if not more, of a semblance to one of the accused as Nomsod; as you can see from thailandchill response you never see a comparison with the suspects photos and the CCTV footage when they try to push the "Nomsod did it" theory.

By "elbow tick" you mean that in one CCTV footage you see Nomsod moving his hair and in the Koh Tao footage the suspect reaches across his chest (not up to the head)?If you think that provides a positive match you are just seeing what you want to see.

As for the news article, the police arrested several suspects during the case, you are just fixated in one or two, you don't know on what evidence they based the arrest, and on what further evidence they released.

Then may I suggest you go to visit an optician. The nervous tic with the left hand that Nomsod does is unmistakeable. And the gait analysis done on CSi also lends more credibility than it being one of the B2. Also there is a height difference of about 5 top 6 inches. Then there is the forward facing sideburns, then there is the more pointed nose that Nomsod and the running man share. Should I go on to talk about the wristband that the suspect didn't have on then but has now.

I am saying unequivocally that there is more CCTV available to prove or disprove he was in Koh Tao from the AC bar. they've either destroyed it (for whatever reason) or don't want to share it (if he isn't there then what is the harm in showing it).

The CCTV from the dorm in BKK is bogus. The furniture is in the wrong place. People who've lived there have said as much. The cops didn't choose to interview these people and corroborate it. That speaks volumes.

As for the arrests they made, how about the ones they released. Notably a guy who confessed to kiling somebody and who they stated has DNA links to the crime scene. Hardly the actions the police would take if he was in fact guilty as he confessed to. The story the cops gave is essentially a giant hole. I can't believe people are buying it while at the same time denouncing others for voicing their concerns. Like i've said these guys are at best looking at 50 years in an absolute hole of a jail cell. Any little steps made to prove beyond any doubt that they did it & mistakes were not made are critical.

There is such a thing as critical thinking. You should definitely try it. And on topic, I am pretty sure the families don't know some of the wider theories and forces at play here. They trust what the brit cops told them, and why shouldn't they. Doesn't mean that it's the truth though does it because we know the UK cops didn't actually have a remit to investigate anything. And from their disclosures so far there has been no mention of them doing so.

[z42]

"...the above is a partial list of what cops either didn't look into, or did look into and didn't like what they saw, because it implicates the Headman's people. "

Of course you are leaving out another option, that they did look into all the details and that is why the Burmese men are the suspects.

Haha you're joking, right?

Who exactly is the running man if it isn't Nomsod then. I mean come on let's look at the probabilities. There is a man of similar height, build, race and hairstyle. Then there is the nervous tic with the elbow, the same elbow that Nomsod has a nervous tic with. Factor in that he is in the direct vicinity of a blood relative's bar in the early hours of the morning.

What are the odds, it is in the billions that it isn't him. And also you say the police did look into it, and seemed to think the same as I wrote just above. And i especialy think the part where the head cop directly says that the first subject is Mon, ansd the second subject is the son of the headman who has is now in Bangkok and is expected to be picked up anytime now.

But the clincher for me is the quote of the top cop at the time

"He said both suspects were captured by CCTV cameras and the police have gathered enough evidence to implicate them in the murders."

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run

This cop was stood down almost immediately after making this announcement. So I wonder what happened to that CCTV footage and the evidence gathered to implicate them. There 1 minute, and what did the new head cop just bin it and start afresh on his first day? Incredibly fishy stuff but also incredibly naive to make the statement like you just made without any kind of backup. Where is the evidence for the "other option" then AleG?

No, I'm not joking, the running man has as much, if not more, of a semblance to one of the accused as Nomsod; as you can see from thailandchill response you never see a comparison with the suspects photos and the CCTV footage when they try to push the "Nomsod did it" theory.

By "elbow tick" you mean that in one CCTV footage you see Nomsod moving his hair and in the Koh Tao footage the suspect reaches across his chest (not up to the head)?If you think that provides a positive match you are just seeing what you want to see.

As for the news article, the police arrested several suspects during the case, you are just fixated in one or two, you don't know on what evidence they based the arrest, and on what further evidence they released.

Then may I suggest you go to visit an optician. The nervous tic with the left hand that Nomsod does is unmistakeable. And the gait analysis done on CSi also lends more credibility than it being one of the B2. Also there is a height difference of about 5 top 6 inches. Then there is the forward facing sideburns, then there is the more pointed nose that Nomsod and the running man share. Should I go on to talk about the wristband that the suspect didn't have on then but has now.

I am saying unequivocally that there is more CCTV available to prove or disprove he was in Koh Tao from the AC bar. they've either destroyed it (for whatever reason) or don't want to share it (if he isn't there then what is the harm in showing it).

The CCTV from the dorm in BKK is bogus. The furniture is in the wrong place. People who've lived there have said as much. The cops didn't choose to interview these people and corroborate it. That speaks volumes.

As for the arrests they made, how about the ones they released. Notably a guy who confessed to kiling somebody and who they stated has DNA links to the crime scene. Hardly the actions the police would take if he was in fact guilty as he confessed to. The story the cops gave is essentially a giant hole. I can't believe people are buying it while at the same time denouncing others for voicing their concerns. Like i've said these guys are at best looking at 50 years in an absolute hole of a jail cell. Any little steps made to prove beyond any doubt that they did it & mistakes were not made are critical.

There is such a thing as critical thinking. You should definitely try it. And on topic, I am pretty sure the families don't know some of the wider theories and forces at play here. They trust what the brit cops told them, and why shouldn't they. Doesn't mean that it's the truth though does it because we know the UK cops didn't actually have a remit to investigate anything. And from their disclosures so far there has been no mention of them doing so.

Here is a breakdown of the tic. Scroll down the page and see it. https://www.veooz.com/news/5HZr9qx.html

As far as I know we can use links from this site

[AleG]

Then may I suggest you go to visit an optician. The nervous tic with the left hand that Nomsod does is unmistakeable. And the gait analysis done on CSi also lends more credibility than it being one of the B2. Also there is a height difference of about 5 top 6 inches. Then there is the forward facing sideburns, then there is the more pointed nose that Nomsod and the running man share. Should I go on to talk about the wristband that the suspect didn't have on then but has now.

I am saying unequivocally that there is more CCTV available to prove or disprove he was in Koh Tao from the AC bar. they've either destroyed it (for whatever reason) or don't want to share it (if he isn't there then what is the harm in showing it).

The CCTV from the dorm in BKK is bogus. The furniture is in the wrong place. People who've lived there have said as much. The cops didn't choose to interview these people and corroborate it. That speaks volumes.

As for the arrests they made, how about the ones they released. Notably a guy who confessed to kiling somebody and who they stated has DNA links to the crime scene. Hardly the actions the police would take if he was in fact guilty as he confessed to. The story the cops gave is essentially a giant hole. I can't believe people are buying it while at the same time denouncing others for voicing their concerns. Like i've said these guys are at best looking at 50 years in an absolute hole of a jail cell. Any little steps made to prove beyond any doubt that they did it & mistakes were not made are critical.

There is such a thing as critical thinking. You should definitely try it. And on topic, I am pretty sure the families don't know some of the wider theories and forces at play here. They trust what the brit cops told them, and why shouldn't they. Doesn't mean that it's the truth though does it because we know the UK cops didn't actually have a remit to investigate anything. And from their disclosures so far there has been no mention of them doing so.

Here is a breakdown of the tic. Scroll down the page and see it. https://www.veooz.com/news/5HZr9qx.html

As far as I know we can use links from this site

And you ask me if I am joking? That's the evidence? A couple hand picked photos compared with a screen grab of a blurry video?

I'm sure if someone would comb through photos of you (or anyone else) and cherry pick ones that show the same general hand position they'll "prove" you have the same tick.

You are just seeing what you want to see, I suggest you take the time to go through this talk to see the traps you are falling into:

Edited December 22, 2014 by AleG

[thailandchilli]

This is a far better read:

From grainy CCTV to a positive ID: Recognising the benefits of surveillance http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/from-grainy-cctv-to-a-positive-id-recognising-the-benefits-of-surveillance-8434644.html

"It has helped solve several crimes in Britain and in Sweden helped convict the killer of foreign minister Anna Lindh in 2003"

The RTP version of this..........thats him...........no its not.............I'm telling you thats him!!...........$$$$$...............nope, definitely not him

[Mooner]

This is a far better read:

From grainy CCTV to a positive ID: Recognising the benefits of surveillance http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/from-grainy-cctv-to-a-positive-id-recognising-the-benefits-of-surveillance-8434644.html

"It has helped solve several crimes in Britain and in Sweden helped convict the killer of foreign minister Anna Lindh in 2003"

The RTP version of this..........thats him...........no its not.............I'm telling you thats him!!...........$$$$$...............nope, definitely not him

Indeed. Gait technology would be useful to use on the running man CCTV footage. Easy to use video technology to compare all suspects!

[thailandchilli]

This is a far better read:

From grainy CCTV to a positive ID: Recognising the benefits of surveillance http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/from-grainy-cctv-to-a-positive-id-recognising-the-benefits-of-surveillance-8434644.html

"It has helped solve several crimes in Britain and in Sweden helped convict the killer of foreign minister Anna Lindh in 2003"

The RTP version of this..........thats him...........no its not.............I'm telling you thats him!!...........$$$$$...............nope, definitely not him

Indeed. Gait technology would be useful to use on the running man CCTV footage. Easy to use video technology to compare all suspects!

yep, but if the RTP did this then it would actually mean they were investigating............something they have shown they are currently incapable of doing, even when they are offered help.

This DNA crap, if its admissible in court then its a complete sham. The UK police's main concern was to get this independently verified, did this happen, no of course not, if the RTP had nothing to hide it they would have jumped at the chance of independent verification organised by the UK to support their case as being fair.

[SiSePuede419]

Ever watch Poirot, Miss Marple, Sherlock Holmes, Monk or Perry Mason?

The evidence is always convincing, until they reveal who the actual murderer is...

[Lozza]

even the CCTV footage from the crime night, which shows Nomsod.

That is your opinion and your opinion, as much as it may hurt your ego, is not a fact or evidence of anything.

It's also the opinion of hundreds of thousands of others who have compared the video footage with photos of Nomsod. And it could be used as evidence against him - even though that would anger the gang of 4, and Thai officials. But rest easy, dude. Even if the B2 are acquitted, none of the Headman's people will be indicted. They're already clear, and will remain so. That's ensured by the Headman and his friends in high places.

"It's also the opinion of hundreds of thousands of others"

When you make up things like that, do you honestly think you sound convincing?

No need to sound convincing. IT IS a fact and far more than a couple of hundred thousands try Millions.

[AleG]

even the CCTV footage from the crime night, which shows Nomsod.

That is your opinion and your opinion, as much as it may hurt your ego, is not a fact or evidence of anything.

It's also the opinion of hundreds of thousands of others who have compared the video footage with photos of Nomsod. And it could be used as evidence against him - even though that would anger the gang of 4, and Thai officials. But rest easy, dude. Even if the B2 are acquitted, none of the Headman's people will be indicted. They're already clear, and will remain so. That's ensured by the Headman and his friends in high places.

"It's also the opinion of hundreds of thousands of others"

When you make up things like that, do you honestly think you sound convincing?

No need to sound convincing. IT IS a fact and far more than a couple of hundred thousands try Millions.

If the defense has the same sort of "facts" as the basis for their case, the two Burmese men are doomed.

[Lozza]

I wonder who the 2 Burmese guys think committed the crime. They must have an opinion as they worked on the island and one at AC bar.

If they're really innocent they would have tried to clear their name and name other suspects. And none of the other Burmese friends at the island have come forward to defend them . Clearly because they believe they are guilty.

Rubbish, the RTP are not interested in talking to the burmese one was released when he alibied for them and others have been sent home under threat. Report what has been published and quit with the B.S. stories.

[Lozza]

Could you please state the source of your statistic that hundreds of thousands of people have a particular opinion.

I am not asking about what is on the CCTV footage, the number of views of the CCTV footage or even who is or is not guilty of this horrible crime. I would just like to test the credibility of your claim as to numbers with a particular opinion and with it your own credibility.

Sure, how about the same press conference where the self-appointed PM puts forth statistics of why pretty young farang women wearing bikinis should not be surprised if they get raped at Thai beach resorts. Or perhaps the same press conference where a top Thai policeman puts forth statistics proving 'No Thais could have done this' - in regard to the KT murders/rape.

I thought PM stated his remarks didn't come out right and apologized. Also, what statistics did he share?

And which top policeman put forth the claim in a press conference, any link you can share?

Why do you need links to everything ? If given a link you will then change its meaning and use it to continue on your merry way.

I suggest for further source and link requests, poster does his own research. Not here to help him along.

[JohnThailandJohn]

Many times it has been stated the police stated it could not have been a Thai who committed this crime. Does anyone have a link to this? I have heard the story evolve to saying it was a politician, that it was stated at a press conference, that it was a top cop, that it was an unnamed office...

I've always assumed it was some proud yet insecure Thai making the statement based on what he thought was inside info (blond hair on phone) but now wonder if there is actually any reliable source to this claim. I certainly cannot find one and each time I ask, the question is just deflected.

[jimmybkk]

There's a bbc reference to the statement here:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-29262496

[jimmybkk]

Khao Sod name the source, and apparently he believed that Europeans were unlikely to have done it too: "The behaviour of the perpetrators is too violent for a Thai or a European to do it," Pol.Maj.Gen. Kiattipong said.

Edit - Oops. forgot to include the link: http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412429700

Edited December 22, 2014 by jimmybkk

[BritTim]

I found this interesting. It gives a little more insight on the defense's progress in lining up witnesses to testify of the B2's behalf:

http://www.elevenmyanmar.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8443

[JLCrab]

I read the linked above report the other day:

“We can’t designate that every witness is important. Their testimony should take affect over the case. If we have that kind of witness ..."

NB: IF

[JohnThailandJohn]

Khao Sod name the source, and apparently he believed that Europeans were unlikely to have done it too: "The behaviour of the perpetrators is too violent for a Thai or a European to do it," Pol.Maj.Gen. Kiattipong said.

Edit - Oops. forgot to include the link: http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412429700

Thanks - first time I had actually seen the quote