Koh Tao murder trial rescheduled

[Eirene]

They could very well be soccer shorts [as we call them] However I have never seen any boys wearing belts with them, mine included, as shorts like that have an elasticised waist and if playing sports a belt would get in the way. So if there are belt loops they would be dress shorts, like hot pants? It just seems odd to me for a man to wear tiny shorts with a belt. Now I have seen some wear suspenders and a belt at the same time....stear clear of them.

I agree berybert...they look like underwear with darker waistband.

Well they be a waistband because if you look closer you can see the belt loops.
And if you live in Thailand you would know they are popular down at the bars, with the little skinny kids. Please someone get down to soi cowboy and get some pics of this type of short for comparison.

[AleG]

The photos of the light blue shorts Miller was wearing are on this very thread. But what is one to believe? An unconfirmed written report or actual photographs of the objects found at the crime scene?

David Miller was NOT wearing light blue or any shade of blue shorts the morning of 15th September unless he went back to his room and changed. If that was the case why would there be images of his beige shorts on the beach? Get with the programme, do.

Colour temperature and white balance affect colour perception depending on lighting and camera settings; what in some circumstances may look pale cream in another may look pale blue, so the overall colour balance in an image needs to be taken into account to evaluate things.

You are judging the colour on that footage without knowing the impact artificial lighting has on colour perception.

If you look at the video you posted yourself you'll notice how the colour of David's shorts appears to change from very similar to the top of his shirt when he is walking away under a bright white light to a more beige tone when he is returning, apparently being illuminated by the headlight of the motorbike that passes him by.

Edited January 20, 2015 by AleG

[berybert]

A and B shared a cigarette at some unknown point in time. So it could have been an hour before the murder or a month before the murder. The DNA on the ciggy is of no interest whatsoever then ?

Now you are also saying there is no reason to suspect B was involved in the killings. So you have now discounted A B and C from the murders.

Glad you have seen the light and will now join the fight to find the real killers.

I can see you are trying to be smart, it ain't working.

On top of that you outright lie about what I wrote, are you unaware people can read what you wrote, what I actually wrote and see that you have no qualms whatsoever about lying?

Because there is no way you could take what I wrote and interpret it as "Now you are also saying there is no reason to suspect B was involved in the killings".

Why you insist on embarrassing yourself like this, I have no clue.

I only clear up your writing. You seem unable to say anything without it having at least 3 or 4 different meanings. A bit like you saying you would reply to me no more.

The things some people do to get some attention...

Yes and I'm sure you will carry on doing it.

[greenchair]

On this Youtube video 0.20 secs in you see the football players walking. Could the small shorts being on the beach we have been discussing be football shorts? Can anyone make out the logo on them? Was the guy wearing the number 9 top in the football team?

There were many interesting things in that video.

How do you get stills from a video. ????

[catsanddogs]

Thanks for clearing that up for me Ale...I have been thinking all along that his shorts were beige. There was an early report that they had been taken and blue one's left behind. More misinformation or lost in translation.

David Miller's shorts (light blue) were left at the crime scene. In some photos and CCTV footage they look different, it's due to different white balance from different cameras producing different colour temperatures.

The shorts are on the table attached to the belt . you might need to adjust contrast , heat , saturation to see them for your self .

What I am saying is that there are 2 pair of shorts in the picture. 1 pair to the left, I thought to be beige, but am now told are blue. And 1 pair of short shorts. Black. Under the tshirt. It has a belt too.

post-221615-0-92296800-1421130966_thumb.jpg

post-223227-0-59220500-1419996307-1.jpgDavid's blue/beige with belt.

post-221615-0-92296800-1421130966_thumb-1.jpgblack short shorts. With belt.

They could be cut-offs. (Jeans that have been cut down like lots of women wear).

[catsanddogs]

I agree berybert...they look like underwear with darker waistband.

Well they be a waistband because if you look closer you can see the belt loops.

And if you live in Thailand you would know they are popular down at the bars, with the little skinny kids. Please someone get down to soi cowboy and get some pics of this type of short for comparison.

Looks like belt loops to me too.

[catsanddogs]

The photos of the light blue shorts Miller was wearing are on this very thread. But what is one to believe? An unconfirmed written report or actual photographs of the objects found at the crime scene?

David Miller was NOT wearing light blue or any shade of blue shorts the morning of 15th September unless he went back to his room and changed. If that was the case why would there be images of his beige shorts on the beach? Get with the programme, do.

Colour temperature and white balance affect colour perception depending on lighting and camera settings; what in some circumstances may look pale cream in another may look pale blue, so the overall colour balance in an image needs to be taken into account to evaluate things.

You are judging the colour on that footage without knowing the impact artificial lighting has on colour perception.

If you look at the video you posted yourself you'll notice how the colour of David's shorts appears to change from very similar to the top of his shirt when he is walking away under a bright white light to a more beige tone when he is returning, apparently being illuminated by the headlight of the motorbike that passes him by.

Agree with what you say. BUT length of shorts will not change will they?

[berybert]

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

[catsanddogs]

On this Youtube video 0.20 secs in you see the football players walking. Could the small shorts being on the beach we have been discussing be football shorts? Can anyone make out the logo on them? Was the guy wearing the number 9 top in the football team?

There were many interesting things in that video.

How do you get stills from a video. ????

Best to ask loonodingle. I'm not proficient.

[catsanddogs]

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

And there was another blue pair in some of the photos that were crumpled but maybe they are the same ones as these small blue ones? GC did post a picture of what looked like a naked man standing and holding onto a motorbike a few days ago funnily enough.

Can't find the pics right now of the Asian looking woman with the big guy in peaked cap (the ones the RTP said were Hannah and David as the beginning of investigation) but what was she wearing under that longish white top?

Edited January 20, 2015 by catsanddogs

[Eirene]

You had better ask greenchair where the naked man is. She has pics.

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

[AleG]

Colour temperature and white balance affect colour perception depending on lighting and camera settings; what in some circumstances may look pale cream in another may look pale blue, so the overall colour balance in an image needs to be taken into account to evaluate things.

You are judging the colour on that footage without knowing the impact artificial lighting has on colour perception.

If you look at the video you posted yourself you'll notice how the colour of David's shorts appears to change from very similar to the top of his shirt when he is walking away under a bright white light to a more beige tone when he is returning, apparently being illuminated by the headlight of the motorbike that passes him by.

Agree with what you say. BUT length of shorts will not change will they?

No, lighting conditions and camera white balance settings don't change the size of objects... so?

[AleG]

What I am saying is that there are 2 pair of shorts in the picture. 1 pair to the left, I thought to be beige, but am now told are blue. And 1 pair of short shorts. Black. Under the tshirt. It has a belt too.

post-221615-0-92296800-1421130966_thumb.jpg

post-223227-0-59220500-1419996307-1.jpgDavid's blue/beige with belt.

post-221615-0-92296800-1421130966_thumb-1.jpgblack short shorts. With belt.

They could be cut-offs. (Jeans that have been cut down like lots of women wear).

shorts small blue.jpg

Or it could be Miller's underwear, since they are photographed with Miller's shorts and shirt that's the most obvious conclusion.

[thailandchilli]

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

We have this report also that throws even more confusion into the scene if its true

Burmese embassy representative went to see two boys for more information.: Media interview and answer by embassy official. The Embassy officer said: “The two boys told him that they were swimming at beach near AC Bar and Maya Bar on that night, after 10 or 15 minutes, when they come back to the beach after swimming, they did not find their guitar and cloth on where they left. Somebody may be stolen their cloth and guitar.but on 14 Oct the police bring as evidence their cloth and guitar to the court.

https://crimesontheblog.wordpress.com/tag/koh-tao/

[greenchair]

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

?Finally we are agreed. There are TWO pair of shorts in the picture. Just sayin. None of the 3 were wearing short shorts.

Then if you show flipflop guy is not moa moa then that is 2 people that were at the beach. That are none of the 3b.

It shows that the evidence the police should not be pointed at the b3.

[greenchair]

You had better ask greenchair where the naked man is. She has pics.

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

Look to the left. There he is. Stark naked. Maybe he got his clothes stolen too. Too big for those little shorts though.

Look you can see his stomach rolls.

Think ??was looking for this.

[thailandchilli]

Just looking for some pics of the crime scene on Google and came across this, another incident on this tiny Island committed by a couple of locals according to him:

Man who was glassed in murder island Koh Tao tells of his lucky escape

http://jerseyeveningpost.com/news/2014/09/17/islander-who-was-glassed-in-murder-island-koh-tao-tells-of-his-lucky-escape/

[greenchair]

Just looking for some pics of the crime scene on Google and came across this, another incident on this tiny Island committed by a couple of locals according to him:

Man who was glassed in murder island Koh Tao tells of his lucky escape

http://jerseyeveningpost.com/news/2014/09/17/islander-who-was-glassed-in-murder-island-koh-tao-tells-of-his-lucky-escape/

What I am getting is many true stories, but mixed up and matched to the wrong people.

There was someone hit with a bottle. Just not David.

[boomerangutang]

This thread for most of us is trying to prove the Burmese guys didn't do it. Thailandchilli has just made a great post and all of a sudden Greenchair is back to the shorts. Even showing a picture of a small pair of blue shorts, calling them a small pair of black shorts. And he's off about his jandal again.

And he makes a statement that they could well have done it, just not on their own. Deflecting is what they call it.

I think Greenchair is the latest member of the fab 4 thus making them the fab 5.

I think you're way off base with your comments about GC.

We do not know everything regarding the DNA , but I can tell you this . if they had sex with her in the first place , as the DNA shows , that alone would make them the main suspects.

If it was that clear then it seems strange that the it took several times for the courts to accept this case! Surely matching DNA from the B2 on Hannahs body would be enough for the case to be accepted straight away as the logic of the last part of your sentence implies.

That's why it's imperative for the Brit Coroner to do her job - determine (as best as possible) who matches the DNA found in/on Hannah. Thai cops have done too many obfuscations, in this and other cases, to be trustworthy.

[boomerangutang]

All this discussion about types of shorts and their colors, reflects badly upon the cop (or cops) who were assigned to photograph the items left at the crime scene. Is their equipment inferior or are they bad at taking pics, or both?

If I'd been heading the investigation, I'd have had experts do the following, within hours (or as soon as reasonably possible) of discovering the crime:

>>> cordon-off the crime scene and not allow anyone to enter who is not a professional investigator, and insist they wear rubber gloves and follow proper procedures.

>>> Have DNA taken from victims' bodies by qualified experts.

>>> Thoroughly examine all clues found at crime scene: Hoe, clothing, condom, and whatever else.

>>> take DNA from all 'persons of interest' - which would include: Stingray Man, M, Mon, Nomsod, Mon's cop friend. Anyone who refuses, slap 'em in jail until they comply, or simply take a sample for a DNA test. If unsure how to do it, there are some Americans who could assist (hint: a cig butt, a used spoon, or a drink glass with suffice).

>>> Do full body checks of people of interest, checking for wounds.

>>> confiscate phones, for at least half day, of all person's of interest, including Headman and his wife - to determine phone histories, texts, etc.

>>> check any and all places in vicinity where clothes might be laundered, hidden, buried, or burnt.

>>> confiscate any and all CCTV footage (including the cameras, if need-be) 500 meters from the crime.

>>> thoroughly check speedboat operators.

>>> interview any backpackers (and others) who may have been in the vicinity Sunday night.

>>> kept Sean in custody, to find what he really knows.

.....and a lot more which could/should have been done. But alas, we're stuck with Thai cops to keep bad guys from harming backpacker tourists, so.... that's why we're stuck with such a botched investigation and 1,001 questions which will unlikely be answered.

[IslandLover]

Eirene, on 20 Jan 2015 - 07:59, said:

I would like to point out that in post #1257....the bar scene...the fellow at the bottom right is not the same fellow that did that distasteful photo of himself holding the hoe. The fellow in the bar photo is the same one with the stringray tail ring who apparently left the island right away...was seen on Chumporn?? riding his motor bike and returned to Koh Tao after the Burmese lads where arrested.

Thank you, Eirene, I was going to say the same thing.

[IslandLover]

greenchair, on 20 Jan 2015 - 08:34, said:

Eirene, on 20 Jan 2015 - 07:59, said:

I would like to point out that in post #1257....the bar scene...the fellow at the bottom right is not the same fellow that did that distasteful photo of himself holding the hoe. The fellow in the bar photo is the same one with the stringray tail ring who apparently left the island right away...was seen on Chumporn?? riding his motor bike and returned to Koh Tao after the Burmese lads where arrested.

Thanks for pointing that out.

If you are not busy. Would you mind posting a pic of hoeman and stingray man side by side I am never sure which is which. 1780806_719044454839949_8407066681725319962_n.png stingray

10560376_10152449452722274_3888438221108410521_o-3.jpg in bar

10560376_10152449452722274_3888438221108410521_o-2.jpg in bar. Walking near crime scene

Very easy to tell the difference between them, Greenchair. Stingray Man has a prominent birthmark across his forehead which you can clearly see in photos.

[IslandLover]

Chetzee, on 20 Jan 2015 - 08:57, said:

greenchair, on 20 Jan 2015 - 08:08, said:

berybert, on 20 Jan 2015 - 06:58, said:

This thread for most of us is trying to prove the Burmese guys didn't do it. Thailandchilli has just made a great post and all of a sudden Greenchair is back to the shorts. Even showing a picture of a small pair of blue shorts, calling them a small pair of black shorts. And he's off about his jandal again.

And he makes a statement that they could well have done it, just not on their own. Deflecting is what they call it.

I think Greenchair is the latest member of the fab 4 thus making them the fab 5.

I did not make any such statement that b2 were there. I have said according to the bloody JANDAL left at the beach and these shorts that do not belong to the missing jandal man. It proves that there were 2 people at the beach that is impossible to be any of the 3 boys. Now berybert in his wisdom of the crime sees blue shorts. Which to me is neither here nor there. However, could my friends have a look at the color so I can correct my mistake

post-221615-0-92296800-1421130966_thumb.jpg black

post-221615-0-92296800-1421130966_thumb-1.jpgblack

As david was naked , why should the black shorts be his Speedos , certainly seems to be a Monogram on them .

They look like underpants to me - presumably David's.

[IslandLover]

Eirene, on 20 Jan 2015 - 09:51, said:

This fellow in black is seen at 2:00am...with missing thong/flip flop...[the other one allegedly at crimescene]...not even sure of that as in some photo's it looks like he is wearing both. If so the crime hadn't taken place yet. To me he does not look like Maung Maung nor does he look like the fellow in the bar. I don't think they are even sitting at a table greenchair...looks like everyone is just standing haphazardly around the bar.

What's with all these balloons in the bars? Is there really a place named Chumporn? Chums sharing porn? Around and around we go.....

Edit: Are these the blue shorts then? The ones exchanged for David's better quality shorts as stated in one of the many reports to the media. Well then...who did the other beige one's belong to? Total mind Fuuuk!!!

What's with all these balloons in the bars?

Probably full of laughing gas. Another idiotic craze among young backpackers. Goes with drinking alcohol out of buckets.

[Chetzee]

The usual suspects ..... Oh and a mutual friend who some of you may recognise

[IslandLover]

catsanddogs, on 20 Jan 2015 - 13:26, said:

berybert, on 20 Jan 2015 - 13:23, said:

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

And there was another blue pair in some of the photos that were crumpled but maybe they are the same ones as these small blue ones? GC did post a picture of what looked like a naked man standing and holding onto a motorbike a few days ago funnily enough.

Can't find the pics right now of the Asian looking woman with the big guy in peaked cap (the ones the RTP said were Hannah and David as the beginning of investigation) but what was she wearing under that longish white top?

Can't find the pics right now of the Asian looking woman with the big guy in peaked cap (the ones the RTP said were Hannah and David as the beginning of investigation) but what was she wearing under that longish white top?

Very short, dark coloured shorts.

[catsanddogs]

catsanddogs, on 20 Jan 2015 - 13:26, said:

berybert, on 20 Jan 2015 - 13:23, said:

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

And there was another blue pair in some of the photos that were crumpled but maybe they are the same ones as these small blue ones? GC did post a picture of what looked like a naked man standing and holding onto a motorbike a few days ago funnily enough.

Can't find the pics right now of the Asian looking woman with the big guy in peaked cap (the ones the RTP said were Hannah and David as the beginning of investigation) but what was she wearing under that longish white top?

Can't find the pics right now of the Asian looking woman with the big guy in peaked cap (the ones the RTP said were Hannah and David as the beginning of investigation) but what was she wearing under that longish white top?

Very short, dark coloured shorts.

How can you tell from that pic IL?

[JLCrab]

All this discussion about types of shorts and their colors, reflects badly upon the cop (or cops) who were assigned to photograph the items left at the crime scene. Is their equipment inferior or are they bad at taking pics, or both?

If I'd been heading the investigation, I'd have had experts do the following, within hours (or as soon as reasonably possible) of discovering the crime:

>>> cordon-off the crime scene and not allow anyone to enter who is not a professional investigator, and insist they wear rubber gloves and follow proper procedures.

>>> Have DNA taken from victims' bodies by qualified experts.

>>> Thoroughly examine all clues found at crime scene: Hoe, clothing, condom, and whatever else.

>>> take DNA from all 'persons of interest' - which would include: Stingray Man, M, Mon, Nomsod, Mon's cop friend. Anyone who refuses, slap 'em in jail until they comply, or simply take a sample for a DNA test. If unsure how to do it, there are some Americans who could assist (hint: a cig butt, a used spoon, or a drink glass with suffice).

>>> Do full body checks of people of interest, checking for wounds.

>>> confiscate phones, for at least half day, of all person's of interest, including Headman and his wife - to determine phone histories, texts, etc.

>>> check any and all places in vicinity where clothes might be laundered, hidden, buried, or burnt.

>>> confiscate any and all CCTV footage (including the cameras, if need-be) 500 meters from the crime.

>>> thoroughly check speedboat operators.

>>> interview any backpackers (and others) who may have been in the vicinity Sunday night.

>>> kept Sean in custody, to find what he really knows.

.....and a lot more which could/should have been done. But alas, we're stuck with Thai cops to keep bad guys from harming backpacker tourists, so.... that's why we're stuck with such a botched investigation and 1,001 questions which will unlikely be answered.

When the conventional wisdom said NO ... you dared to dream.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PotxdkKx-tA

[IslandLover]

catsanddogs, on 20 Jan 2015 - 21:32, said:

IslandLover, on 20 Jan 2015 - 19:32, said:

catsanddogs, on 20 Jan 2015 - 13:26, said:catsanddogs, on 20 Jan 2015 - 13:26, said:

berybert, on 20 Jan 2015 - 13:23, said:berybert, on 20 Jan 2015 - 13:23, said:

Ok so what do we have. David's shorts where found on the beach close to his body. We now know there was another paid of shorts close by. These are a black pair that look blue and could be cut down jeans as worn by a woman or a ladyboy.

Do we now start looking for someone who had no shorts on to find the murderer ?

And there was another blue pair in some of the photos that were crumpled but maybe they are the same ones as these small blue ones? GC did post a picture of what looked like a naked man standing and holding onto a motorbike a few days ago funnily enough.

Can't find the pics right now of the Asian looking woman with the big guy in peaked cap (the ones the RTP said were Hannah and David as the beginning of investigation) but what was she wearing under that longish white top?

Can't find the pics right now of the Asian looking woman with the big guy in peaked cap (the ones the RTP said were Hannah and David as the beginning of investigation) but what was she wearing under that longish white top?

Very short, dark coloured shorts.

How can you tell from that pic IL?

That's what my eyes tell me.

[loonodingle]

On this Youtube video 0.20 secs in you see the football players walking. Could the small shorts being on the beach we have been discussing be football shorts? Can anyone make out the logo on them? Was the guy wearing the number 9 top in the football team?

There were many interesting things in that video.

How do you get stills from a video. ????

Best to ask loonodingle. I'm not proficient.

hi sorry been upto my neck in work and stuff....

Hannah's MP will not even consider taking or looking at anything Unless you live in his area. Told me they will just return back to me.... I was going to suggest if it was cash he wouldn't but anyway we know what they are like. Hannahs family will not speak and just want to let her RIP. Don't seem to care about who killed her. They have shut down. If you need still send me the links and i will do them for you if you can't get it to work.

Edited January 21, 2015 by loonodingle