Koh Tao murder trial rescheduled

[cdnvic]

I cleaned some of the name calling out of the topic. Any more and the author/s will find themselves without posting rights.

[jspill]

Not sure if posted yet - http://asiancorrespondent.com/127509/not-saving-thailands-face-the-backlash-of-police-corruption-in-the-murders-of-tourists/

Interesting quote from the father of Leo Del Pinto, whose murderer was charged 5 years after the fact. 'A court date would be set, then moved, then set again, we went through years of this before we got to today.'

Edited January 6, 2015 by jspill

[catsanddogs]

GC - what I see from these stills:

Timed stamped 3.38 (side view) someone sitting at side of road and someone through the glass in building behind him. What is this building? Shop/flat?

Time stamped 3.32 (side view) looks like he is carrying something behind his back which could be a hoe or similar.

Time stamped 4.57 (front view) looks like there is a picture of a man on his tee shirt.

Which one is the still which you say he has no sandal on?

Can you give a link to picture of sandal on beach (without showing the pictures of the deceased victims).

He has quite a distinct face which doesn't seem to fit anyone we have been discussing to date.

[greenchair]

GC - what I see from these stills:

Timed stamped 3.38 (side view) someone sitting at side of road and someone through the glass in building behind him. What is this building? Shop/flat?

Time stamped 3.32 (side view) looks like he is carrying something behind his back which could be a hoe or similar.

Time stamped 4.57 (front view) looks like there is a picture of a man on his tee shirt.

Which one is the still which you say he has no sandal on?

Can you give a link to picture of sandal on beach (without showing the pictures of the deceased victims).

He has quite a distinct face which doesn't seem to fit anyone we have been discussing to date.

Is it possible to line them up again according to time sequence and include your picture. We don't need the dna sequence ones.

[berybert]

Looks like you two are now in charge of the investigation. One sees hoes that dont exist the other sees beards that don't exist.

I wish you well in your case, sadly I don't hold out much hope.

[greenchair]

You can see in the first one on chilli

Walking right 2 jandal

Walking left 1 jandal.

The one on the right foot is missing.

[catsanddogs]

GC - what I see from these stills:

Timed stamped 3.38 (side view) someone sitting at side of road and someone through the glass in building behind him. What is this building? Shop/flat?

Time stamped 3.32 (side view) looks like he is carrying something behind his back which could be a hoe or similar.

Time stamped 4.57 (front view) looks like there is a picture of a man on his tee shirt.

Which one is the still which you say he has no sandal on?

Can you give a link to picture of sandal on beach (without showing the pictures of the deceased victims).

He has quite a distinct face which doesn't seem to fit anyone we have been discussing to date.

Is it possible to line them up again according to time sequence and include your picture. We don't need the dna sequence ones.

I saved the pictures and tried to put them up in time order but getting message saying not permitted to upload this kind of file. There is a time difference between when we see him walking at 3.38 and 4.57 of 1 hour 19 mins. In the still time stamped 4.57 (front view) there appears to be a car or van coming down the street behind him. I'm ignoring the sarcasm of the other poster. I think what you have highlighted here is very important considering the timing of the CCTV stills.

[greenchair]

GC - what I see from these stills:

Timed stamped 3.38 (side view) someone sitting at side of road and someone through the glass in building behind him. What is this building? Shop/flat?

Time stamped 3.32 (side view) looks like he is carrying something behind his back which could be a hoe or similar.

Time stamped 4.57 (front view) looks like there is a picture of a man on his tee shirt.

Which one is the still which you say he has no sandal on?

Can you give a link to picture of sandal on beach (without showing the pictures of the deceased victims).

He has quite a distinct face which doesn't seem to fit anyone we have been discussing to date.

Is it possible to line them up again according to time sequence and include your picture. We don't need the dna sequence ones.

I saved the pictures and tried to put them up in time order but getting message saying not permitted to upload this kind of file. There is a time difference between when we see him walking at 3.38 and 4.57 of 1 hour 19 mins. In the still time stamped 4.57 (front view) there appears to be a car or van coming down the street behind him. I'm ignoring the sarcasm of the other poster. I think what you have highlighted here is very important considering the timing of the CCTV stills.

I have break tomorrow I will look then. If you study the pictures you can get important information. They are all over the place. I try to bring them together. To get some information that I want. Do you have anymore pictures like this to add to our list?

[greenchair]

GC - what I see from these stills:

Timed stamped 3.38 (side view) someone sitting at side of road and someone through the glass in building behind him. What is this building? Shop/flat?

Time stamped 3.32 (side view) looks like he is carrying something behind his back which could be a hoe or similar.

Time stamped 4.57 (front view) looks like there is a picture of a man on his tee shirt.

Which one is the still which you say he has no sandal on?

Can you give a link to picture of sandal on beach (without showing the pictures of the deceased victims).

He has quite a distinct face which doesn't seem to fit anyone we have been discussing to date.

Is it possible to line them up again according to time sequence and include your picture. We don't need the dna sequence ones.

I saved the pictures and tried to put them up in time order but getting message saying not permitted to upload this kind of file. There is a time difference between when we see him walking at 3.38 and 4.57 of 1 hour 19 mins. In the still time stamped 4.57 (front view) there appears to be a car or van coming down the street behind him. I'm ignoring the sarcasm of the other poster. I think what you have highlighted here is very important considering the timing of the CCTV stills.

Oh I see what u mean. A van ?

[greenchair]

You see my front view is 23:14 and chezzy front is 4:57.

Wish we could line them up.in order of time. I think you will find it very interesting. They say it is Muang. But it can't be. Line them up and you will see why.

[jimmybkk]

What's a jandal?

[BritTim]

What's a jandal?

I believe it is New Zealand or Australian slang for flip-flops. Anyway, footwear of some type.

[greenchair]

In the 3:38 I can't see anyone on the step or anyone in the window. But in mine. Front view 23:14 I can see someone on the steps but not in the window.

[jimmybkk]

OK, thanks BritTim.

Hmmm... the pics just got removed it looks like, but anyway I think there maybe some misunderstanding about those times. Unless I am mistaken someone has put together a compilation video of all the CCTV footage and the length of the video compilation is 8 minutes and 21(?) seconds long, and where it says 3.38 / 8.21 it means the still was taken from 3 minutes 38 seconds into the 8 minutes and 21 seconds of the compilation video. It's not the time of day that the CCTV was recorded.

[greenchair]

OK, thanks BritTim.

Hmmm... the pics just got removed it looks like, but anyway I think there maybe some misunderstanding about those times. Unless I am mistaken someone has put together a compilation video of all the CCTV footage and the length of the video compilation is 8 minutes and 21(?) seconds long, and where it says 3.38 / 8.21 it means the still was taken from 3 minutes 38 seconds into the 8 minutes and 21 seconds of the compilation video. It's not the time of day that the CCTV was recorded.

Oh. So who stole the pictures then. And why. What are they afraid of us finding out? ????

[thailandchilli]

OK, thanks BritTim.

Hmmm... the pics just got removed it looks like, but anyway I think there maybe some misunderstanding about those times. Unless I am mistaken someone has put together a compilation video of all the CCTV footage and the length of the video compilation is 8 minutes and 21(?) seconds long, and where it says 3.38 / 8.21 it means the still was taken from 3 minutes 38 seconds into the 8 minutes and 21 seconds of the compilation video. It's not the time of day that the CCTV was recorded.

Oh. So who stole the pictures then. And why. What are they afraid of us finding out? ????

Hey, why have they been deleted? Perhaps pm the poster see if he can provide the source

[greenchair]

GC - what I see from these stills:

Timed stamped 3.38 (side view) someone sitting at side of road and someone through the glass in building behind him. What is this building? Shop/flat?

Time stamped 3.32 (side view) looks like he is carrying something behind his back which could be a hoe or similar.

Time stamped 4.57 (front view) looks like there is a picture of a man on his tee shirt.

Which one is the still which you say he has no sandal on?

Can you give a link to picture of sandal on beach (without showing the pictures of the deceased victims).

He has quite a distinct face which doesn't seem to fit anyone we have been discussing to date.

Could you repost those pictures. Somebody sneaked in here and took them.

ALERT ALERT

New investigation

Who stole the pictures from Thai visa ????

[greenchair]

Hey Mr Chetzee, kindly and nicely I am asking did you take the pictures back? ????

[greenchair]

Do you have the pictures chilly?

[thailandchilli]

Do you have the pictures chilly?

The ones I posted are still there in the post http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/787155-koh-tao-murder-trial-rescheduled/?p=8899972

[catsanddogs]

None of this is in date order.

At 7.47pm David and his friend Chris Ware were filmed walking towards the bar. They were then recorded at 12.55am leaving, stopping in a convenience store for a toasted sandwich, before walking back to their bungalow.

In a police interview Mr Ware told officers that David then told him he was going out to get some cigarettes but another friend revealed he went instead to nightclub AC to meet up with Hannah and her friend Emma Madeline. (Daily Mail). Sept 16

The word ‘revealed’ here has connotations - this could be put down to dodgy or inaccurate journalism, but if the above is true then it sounds like David either didn’t want Ware to know where he was going or he simply changed his mind and went to the nightclub. Was Ware present at the nightclub on the morning of 15^th Sept as were other friends?

Images of a migrant worker spotted later on the same CCTV tape are circulated, with police describing the man as a person of interest. (Daily Mail) Sept 16.

How did/do they know the images were of a ‘migrant worker’? Assuming they are talking about ‘running man’ here – that seems to be either a slip of the tongue or the start of media brainwashing.

DNA samples taken from the scene do not match those of any of a reported 12 suspects.

Officers claimed they had 'strong evidence' to link six Burmese workers to the gruesome murders, though no forensic links could be made.

Samples were taken from nine migrant workers and three foreigners including two brothers from Jersey who were friends of David Miller. (Daily Mail) Sept 16.

Could this ‘strong evidence’ be the phone (belonging first to Hannah and then to David) that was supposedly found at their accommodation?

Thai police admit they have 'no idea' who killed David Miller and Hannah Witheridge after failing to link any of 12 suspects to the crime.

They said it was 'difficult to say' whether the pair's killer or killers was still on the island, and then claimed investigations had pointed them to a group seen on the beach playing the guitar and singing 'western songs'. (Daily Mail) Sept 17

The question and answer that we still don’t have clarification on is -were Zaw, Win and Maung among these 12? It wouldn’t take much for the RTP to clarify this and clear up the rumours. Of course the three men will know whether they were tested at this point, as will their lawyers.

A CCTV video of a woman running near the scene is described but not released. Police say it could be of a witness to the double murder, a suspect or of Miss Witheridge herself. (Daily Mail) Sept 20^th

Why hasn’t this video been released? Why haven’t the police said what time this woman was seen running on CCTV? It would be obvious surely to the police if it was Hannah in the video. Police have something big to hide here I think. If not, then they need to prove it.

At 1.26am he (David Miller) is recorded walking from the club, and returns at 1.57am. That is the last time he is seen on camera.

Friends told police that Hannah, from Great Yarmouth, and David, from Jersey, left the club together between 3am and 4am. Their bodies were found at 6am. (Daily Mail) Sept 21.

Mr Chompuchat said he was appealing to any friends of Miss Witheridge, 23, from Hemsby or Mr Miller, 24, from Jersey, who may have information to come forward. "Their friends should know many things about this to prove the true situation," he said. (BBC News) Dec 2

Have these CCTV images of David walking to and from the club been released? I cannot find any relating to these times. Where are the CCTV images of Hannah and David leaving the club together between 3am and 4am? Were the cameras switched off for some reason? Why have Choppers and AC not released their own footage if they have nothing to hide? Is the RTP in receipt of this footage? If Hannah and David’s friends say they left the club together between 3am and 4am then those friends would most likely have been present to witness any altercation if there was one. Best Daily News and Telegraph (16^th Sept) reports that police believe Hannah and David were murdered sometime between 2am and 4am, but clearly it could not have been before 3am if that was the earliest time they left the club. Nothing in any reports from the friends. Nothing to say whether Hannah and David left together in a sea of calm, or in a rage, or were thrown out. Or whether they left together but were accompanied by someone/others.

It was also reported on another social media site that the friend had given the phone to the police with the pass code before returning to the UK. It was in her possession because Hannah had gone out without a handbag and asked her to look after it the posts read.

(Samuit Times)

The last reported photo of Hannah is the one where she is sitting at the table with her friends in Choppers bar. She has her phone and what looks like a purse on the table in front of her. So I am speculating that she may have gone to the beach for a swim or arranged to meet with David for a swim and gave her phone to a friend to look after. She may have chosen to do this because if she was going for a swim she wouldn’t have wanted to leave it lying on the beach. Is it legal for the police to use her passcode to get into her phone without the permission of next of kin? Who knows what they may have found and deleted. Same goes for David’s and possibly McAnna’s phone.

British backpacker Hannah Witheridge was not raped before she was murdered on a beach in Koh Tao, reports from Thailand claim. Early reports said Witheridge may have also been the victim of a rapist before she was killed but, according to the (xxx newspaper) tests performed by the Police Hospital's Institute of Forensic Medicine have revealed she appeared to have engaged in "sexual relations" before her death. Police major general Pornchai Suteerakhun did not, however, rule out an attempted rape but said Witheridge might have fought the perpetrator off. (Yahoo News) Sept 17

So was she or wasn’t she raped? ‘Appeared’ to have engaged in sexual relations? So what it sounds like the police are saying here is that Hannah maybe had sex before she died, which would tie in with their original claim that her and David were possibly attacked whilst in the act on the beach. And also ties in with their claim that the Burmese men saw them and couldn’t resist raping her and killing them both. And then later they found semen from two Asian men inside Hannah which turned out to be that of Zaw and Win.

Police major general Pornchai Suteerakhun did not, however, rule out an attempted rape but said Witheridge might have fought the perpetrator off. The tests, which were conducted in Thai capital Bangkok, also revealed the pair was likely killed with a hoe that was found near to their bodies.

It is suggested David Miller was killed with a blunt piece of metal and not the rusty garden hoe first discovered at the scene and named as a murder weapon. (Daily Mail) Sept 21

Tests revealed that pair was ‘likely’ killed with a hoe? What sort of tests are these if the results come up as ‘likely’. Either they had the results of the tests at this point or they didn’t. We have since heard that both victims were killed with the hoe but that only Hannah’s DNA was on the hoe. We saw in the re-enactment that only a hoe was used to kill the couple. Then there have been reports that another object was used to kill David (a rock, a metal object, s stick) but nothing has been found.

“Really, [the] killer is maybe an English guy,” police Colonel Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Pha Ngan police district that included Koh Tao, said in a text this morning. (News.com.au) Sept 17

Three male Myanmar migrant workers were held for questioning but ruled out of the probe later on Tuesday, southern regional police commander Panya Maman told AFP.

“They were very far from the scene ... it was probably not them,” he said, adding DNA samples had been collected from the men.

Earlier Tuesday, local television showed Thai authorities searching several shacks belonging to Myanmar migrants on Koh Tao. Their mobile phones were seized.

The murdered pair had arrived on the island on Friday, September 12, with separate groups of friends, after attending the full moon party on the nearby island of Koh Phangan on September 9. (news.com.au) Sept 17.

Were the ‘three male Myanmar workers held for questioning’ Maung, Zaw and Win? Maman at this point says it was probably not them (whoever ‘them’ are) – first time I’ve read this.

Suspicious about Thai authorities searching shacks of Myanmar migrants and seizing their phone. A perfect time for someone to plant David’s phone there. The beginning of the ‘strong evidence’ maybe?

Describing the Asian suspect spotted on CCTV, Lt Col Somsak, said: “The man walked back and forth in the area sometimes quite hurriedly during the period it is estimated the victims died, between 2am and 4am. We are in the process of trying to identify this man.” (Telegraph) Sept 16.

I think I read that Mon admitted this man on CCTV was him running after he heard the news of the murders? Which can’t be right because according to media reports the bodies were not discovered until between 5 and 6 am by a resort worker. The footage of the running man is shown to be 3.44am, 4.49am and 4.49am. So why after almost 4 months has this man not yet been identified?

Some phrases from the RTP taken from above news articles:

‘It is suggested’

‘It appears’

‘Difficult to say’

‘Might have’

‘Likely’

‘Could have’

‘May have’

Who could argue that they have not bought the speculation, doubt and disbelief upon themselves during this self-proclaimed ‘perfect investigation’?

The delays in this case are in stark contrast to comments made at the time of the suspects’ initial arrest. Police Chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told journalists then that the police had conducted a “perfect investigation” and a speedy prosecution was expected. But it wasn’t long before the ‘perfect’ case against the Burmese suspects was being questioned by a myriad of observers, including the British Government, the Myanmar [burmese] Government, human rights organizations, Thai officials, and thousands of social media users. (Asian correspondent) Dec 2.

[greenchair]

Do you have the pictures chilly?

The ones I posted are still there in the post http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/787155-koh-tao-murder-trial-rescheduled/?p=8899972

No the other ones. That Chetzee posted. There was a van or a car behind the guy. And some different times and stuff. We were getting near to some interesting information and they disappeared.

Who took them. Are they allowed to do that. Isn't that theft?

[greenchair]

Topcat please repost the pictures

[catsanddogs]

Do you have the pictures chilly?

The ones I posted are still there in the post http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/787155-koh-tao-murder-trial-rescheduled/?p=8899972

T&C - those pictures are not the same as the ones posted earlier with the time stamps of 3.32, 3.38 and 4.57. I saved them but am unable to post them cos of message in a pink box telling me I can't.

[catsanddogs]

Do you have the pictures chilly?

The ones I posted are still there in the post http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/787155-koh-tao-murder-trial-rescheduled/?p=8899972

No the other ones. That Chetzee posted. There was a van or a car behind the guy. And some different times and stuff. We were getting near to some interesting information and they disappeared.

Who took them. Are they allowed to do that. Isn't that theft?

Hopefully Chetzee will respond.

[jimmybkk]

I think Chetzee picked up a ban. All his posts are gone, no?

[greenchair]

Do you have the pictures

?and ?

They have disappeared. Could you repost them

[thailandchilli]

Do you have the pictures chilly?

The ones I posted are still there in the post http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/787155-koh-tao-murder-trial-rescheduled/?p=8899972

T&C - those pictures are not the same as the ones posted earlier with the time stamps of 3.32, 3.38 and 4.57. I saved them but am unable to post them cos of message in a pink box telling me I can't.

Will send you pm

[greenchair]

Do you have the pictures chilly?

The ones I posted are still there in the post http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/787155-koh-tao-murder-trial-rescheduled/?p=8899972

T&C - those pictures are not the same as the ones posted earlier with the time stamps of 3.32, 3.38 and 4.57. I saved them but am unable to post them cos of message in a pink box telling me I can't.

Will send you pm

Can you send me a pm too. What happened to the pictures.

[greenchair]

I think Chetzee picked up a ban. All his posts are gone, no?

No his posts are there, but the pictures are gone. Can't someone pm him or something? ??