French man found hanged in Koh Tao with his hands tied behind his back – foul play suspected

[Willy Eckerslike]

What im asking myself atm is why do it outside the bungalow in broad daylight around lunchtime effectively in public and not in it with total privacy as one might expect ?

If you wanted to be sure of success then you may tie your hands behind your back first to avoid backing out. Then again if you wanted to be sure why do it outside on the balcony where anyone could walk past, see and help. Youd think privacy would assure more chance of success rather than in public and in broad daylight at lunchtime....

If however as is common with attempted suicides he was wishing to be found by someone first why would he have tied his hands in the first place ? all very strange.

Thats assuming of course its a suicide. If its not then hanging someone in full view in public would send a very very strong message, especially in Thailand.

Not forgetting the wounds around the neck and the 5cm lacerations on the elbow and wrist.............could the latter be defensive wounds??

[TPI]

These Cambodians are really sneaky fellows!

[greenchair]

the problem for me is that some people have claimed in the past that this is the way they were to die

yes, I was thinking the same. Witness to the 2 Brits murder almost met his end in the same way. Any connection ?

Right down to the shoelaces!!!

The mother question is. ..

Was he the frenchman in Police custody. Without being deflector ted? by Sean story. ? are everywhere. ?

[JohnThailandJohn]

Interestingly enough it is not uncommon for people to tie their hands behind their back before hanging themselves -- some also tape or cover their mouths. It is a way to make sure they go through with the act and don't try to free themselves or scream out.

While it is true that some suicides try to secure their hands in case of a desire to struggle/survive/change their mins, this is invariably done with the strong, plastic ties with the locking mechanism ( ie, with some planning and forethought of the consequences). Never heard of it being done with what appears to be knots of some intricacy as per the photograph.

You've never heard of that being done because -- surprise, surprise, Please be seated -- JTJ is clueless regarding reality.

How much less embarrassing it would be if some people just even did the tiniest of research before making absolutely incorrect statements that show a complete ignorance of a topic. Shoot, don't even have to do work, just challenge somebody to provide credible links instead of making uninformed and embarrassingly incorrect statements.

Numerous very credible links on this thread by a number of posters to show just how clueless the above responses are but I have a feeling it doesn't matter as some people would rather be emotional than informed or speak intelligently on a subject.

[JohnThailandJohn]

What im asking myself atm is why do it outside the bungalow in broad daylight around lunchtime effectively in public and not in it with total privacy as one might expect ?

Wonder why you are not wondering what would be more bizarre is committing a murder in broad daylight around lunchtime effectively in public and not in private as one might expect a person committing murderer would do.

Actually kind of common for suicide victims to want their bodies discovered and common also for those with some doubts to do it in a place where they might be discovered quickly and possibly saved. If this guy did commit suicide it clearly seems he had some reservations between the attempts to cut himself and the need to tie his hands.

Im not even going to speculate about murder just doing it hands tied but also outside in public seems very conflicting in intentions is all.

Assuming suicide, you need to first realize people are not thinking like a normal person. And very simply there may have been nothing to hang from inside. Not sure of the exact content of the note but sounds like he left a note as most suicide hanging victims do. The wounds on the arm would much more likely be attempts than defensive wounds unless that was all it took for him to allow somebody to string him up outside. There really is nothing that has so far been stated to make this seem like an out of the ordinary suicide. I'm assuming since he was not discovered for hours, it actually wasn't as right open as you may want to believe. An autopsy needs to be done to confirm but again, so far seems like a fairly typical suicide if there is such a thing.

[gemguy]

Hmmmmmm...I think we all know what will evolve if this incident is pressed upon the police and people pressure the police or demand the police solve the mystery.

It would be best recommended that anyone in the immediate area leave, as soon or possible, for fear of being falsely accused and used as a scapegoat for the police.

Cheers

[abitmiffed]

Let the investigation take it's course. Thailand is not rife with serial killers or gangsters, most of them come here on the plane.

Wow are you kidding?

[Tchooptip]

To all the foreigners visiting or living here in Thailand just please be careful not to bump-heads w the locals.I grew up here and I've visited almost all places in TH(part of my job too).I can speak Thai and honestly I never had a prob w them but then again I'm Southeast Asian too.They just don't like foreigners who disrespect them in their own country no matter who they are or what they are.

Just please avoid getting in a fight w them.That's the first rule to keep in mind when coming here.

Just please avoid getting in fight, should be the first rule to keep in mind ...eveywhere

[Jungle Jim]

Thailand is well known for the easiest place in the world for criminals to hide. Pattaya is one fine example.

Let the investigation take it's course. Thailand is not rife with serial killers or gangsters, most of them come here on the plane.

Wow are you kidding?

[slipperylobster]

e

Of course it is possible he is actually French, but Dimitri is normally a Russian name, isn't it?

It appears that it was the door that was called Dmitri:

"The door to the man’s bungalow, later identified at Dmitri........"

Who or What was later identified at (as?) "Dimitri"?

of course.........."The door to the man's bungalow"!

Any other questions?

Perhaps the man's name was.......Dimitri La Porte

Edited January 4, 2015 by slipperylobster

[slipperylobster]

"Dimitri:" could have been the son of an immigrant...or a French Foreign Legion recruit who finished his tour of duty....

Plenty of non French named individuals live in France, nowadays.

[Prbkk]

Interestingly enough it is not uncommon for people to tie their hands behind their back before hanging themselves -- some also tape or cover their mouths. It is a way to make sure they go through with the act and don't try to free themselves or scream out.

While it is true that some suicides try to secure their hands in case of a desire to struggle/survive/change their mins, this is invariably done with the strong, plastic ties with the locking mechanism ( ie, with some planning and forethought of the consequences). Never heard of it being done with what appears to be knots of some intricacy as per the photograph.

You've never heard of that being done because -- surprise, surprise, Please be seated -- JTJ is clueless regarding reality.

How much less embarrassing it would be if some people just even did the tiniest of research before making absolutely incorrect statements that show a complete ignorance of a topic. Shoot, don't even have to do work, just challenge somebody to provide credible links instead of making uninformed and embarrassingly incorrect statements.

Numerous very credible links on this thread by a number of posters to show just how clueless the above responses are but I have a feeling it doesn't matter as some people would rather be emotional than informed or speak intelligently on a subject.

Not remotely embarrassing. Those cited in the study bear absolutely no resemblance to the knots in this case. None.

If this is a suicide, so be it but it is right to question and to be suspicious because everything else that has come off that island is highly suspect. The embarrassment here is your continued denial that this is the case, whatever your motives.

[srchino]

Just steered another group of 6 friends away from Koh Tao and the Gulf of Death, that's almost 20 since the two Britons were murdered. I hope you all are doing the same.

[Equalizer]

It is possible to commit suicide with your hands tied behind your back, however it is more difficult to tie your own hands behind your back.

[AGareth2]

is anything of note being said on French language websites?

[aimbc]

I think it's nearly impossible to step into the noose after tying your hands in the back. We can all agree that the rope is of a nylon make. If it was hanging down from the ceiling, it would be nearly impossible to slip your head through it, as there would be no shape at all. So the person must have slipped it on first and then proceeded to tie the knot on his wrist and stepped through to position his arm to the back.

But to step thorough while wearing a sarong, it's quite a feat, but I am sure if you try, it would be possible. Not sure how tight the sarong was on him our how long it was. It doesn't leave much room to bend your knees. The chances of losing balance is quite high.

Looking at the link for hand behind the back suicide that many people posted, it seems very plausible. But what seems to be consistent in most of these cases, are the height in which they apparently jumped to their death. This could be because they would be able to slip the noose over their head first and have ample rope length to allow them to get their hands to the back.

But as I can see from the pics, it doesn't appear to have that much type play as the person was hanging from the ceiling.

I don't see with that little rope play and wearing a sarong, one can step through ones arm.

But it not impossible what a human being is capable of doing. Possible, the person has a degree of flexibility. If it was me, it would be very hard and nearly impossible. But with all the past cases, it would be very easy to do if they jump from a high place.

[Bocking]

It's been a big year for bad news on Koh Tao. Obviously the ongoing case of Hannah and David has received much media attention, but other cases less so. On New Year's Day 2014, 25 y/o Englishman Nick Pearson tragically lost his life on Koh Tao. Declared an 'Accidental Death' by RTP, Nick's parents were unsatisfied with their swift and seemingly uninvestigated conclusion. An independent inquiry, I believe, is now proceeding in England.

Thoughts with the families of those lost RIP

Edited January 4, 2015 by Bocking

[greenchair]

It's been a big year for bad news on Koh Tao. Obviously the ongoing case of Hannah and David has received much media attention, but other cases less so. On New Year's Day 2014, 25 y/o Englishman Nick Pearson tragically lost his life on Koh Tao. Declared an 'Accidental Death' by RTP, Nick's parents were unsatisfied with their swift and seemingly uninvestigated conclusion. An independent inquiry, I believe, is now proceeding in England.

Thoughts with the families of those lost RIP

Maybe they can get together with the french,and Swiss. The family of the diver who recently was called a suicide I am talking about. Sure there a couple more I missed too

[BoristheBlade]

Here we go again.

When are the authorities going to clean up the excrement on that island?

How many murders does it take?

General, that island is out of control, or are you happy it's that way?

Edited January 4, 2015 by BoristheBlade

[kiwikeith]

"... the body of a 29 year old French murder suicide Koh Tao man was found hanging from the ceiling of his rented bungalow."

The prevalent official police theory is that two Burmese men escaped from jail, hanged the victim and snuck back into their cells without anyone noticing.

Correct he may have been a witness and as they enjoy it so much in jail they had to make sure he would not testify.

[siampolee]

Now another coincidence is the fact that one of the more prominent persons concerned in this matter and its investigation has just returned to the island clad in cloth of a brilliant hue as opposed to those he was wearing on the night of the murders.

That clothing of a brilliant hue in Thai society at all levels tends to make one untouchable and also puts one above suspicion too as well as allowing free movement as well as access to anywhere without question.

Now is it not strange that shortly after the return of a person in a change of clothing that might well make the wearer both justice proof and bullet proof a 'suicide'' of a Frenchman occurs.

Considering the comment that a ''Frenchman'' had valuable evidence concerning the murders of Hannah and David, I and I am sure I am not alone in my thoughts find it all rather odd , strange or even convenient for some that this Frenchman committed suicide.

Strange that Sean should speak about a suggestion he would end up hanging himself (possibly with assistance) yet he seems to have escaped that action, yet this Frenchman seems to have gone down the road to eternity in the fashion that Sean described was offered to him.

You have to hang Mr. A. He is 5 ft. 10½ in. in height and weighs I2 st. 2 lbs. 6 oz. I dwt. His neck from the Sterno-Cleido-Mastoid to the Sterno-Hyoid measures 6 ¾ ins. The neck is strong and 17 ins. in diameter. Calculate to three points of decimals the drop necessary to hang this man thoroughly, without risk of giving pain to onlookers. Also give the diameter and quality of the rope you would employ, in terms of pounds avoirdupois of strain.

http://www.christiebooks.com/ChristieBooksWP/2014/05/a-handbook-on-hanging-by-charles-duff-part-1/

http://www.capitalpunishmentuk.org/hanging2.html

Edited January 4, 2015 by siampolee

[mrtoad]

There is something rather dodgy about any Koh Death RTP activities. Why was it initially classed as a suicide, and now as suspicious? What forensic experts have examined the scene? Lots of other questions to.

It's common knowledge that Hannah and David's crime scene was contaminated and that the correct forensic procedures did not happen.

Has a certain person just returned to the island?

[Emster23]

"Koh Tao: will remain in your memory as long as you live"......

[HooHaa]

Can we be spared photos of the deceased.... if they have not already been posted to facebook, that would be an improvement. Does anyone know if his next of kin has been notified and the name of the deceased.

And while i'm making requests, someone slap the reporter how is this a murder suicide??? Is there another corpse or evidence this person snuffed out another life shortly before their own??

I agree. Please don't post images of this poor chap hanging.

I will allow the image of the tied wrists but nothing more than that. Other mods may feel even this is too much and may remove these too.

How can we conduct our investigations with no pictures ??

You don't conduct investigations. Here we discuss reputable news sources only.

yes, but stickboy has not weighed in yet

[FrankJos]

Things happen in a a destination with approx 1 mio tourists per year and a lot of them are so far off the would be at risk even in their own countries

Rest in peace to anyone who lost or took his life

I think we should gossip more about what happen at other destination too

Just to keep it interesting perhaps

[JohnThailandJohn]

While it is true that some suicides try to secure their hands in case of a desire to struggle/survive/change their mins, this is invariably done with the strong, plastic ties with the locking mechanism ( ie, with some planning and forethought of the consequences). Never heard of it being done with what appears to be knots of some intricacy as per the photograph.

You've never heard of that being done because -- surprise, surprise, Please be seated -- JTJ is clueless regarding reality.

How much less embarrassing it would be if some people just even did the tiniest of research before making absolutely incorrect statements that show a complete ignorance of a topic. Shoot, don't even have to do work, just challenge somebody to provide credible links instead of making uninformed and embarrassingly incorrect statements.

Numerous very credible links on this thread by a number of posters to show just how clueless the above responses are but I have a feeling it doesn't matter as some people would rather be emotional than informed or speak intelligently on a subject.

Not remotely embarrassing. Those cited in the study bear absolutely no resemblance to the knots in this case. None.

If this is a suicide, so be it but it is right to question and to be suspicious because everything else that has come off that island is highly suspect. The embarrassment here is your continued denial that this is the case, whatever your motives.

And even more embarrassing ... you do realize what you wrote is right above and that you have no clue of what types of knots were used let alone how many given there is just a low res blown up image of a partial wrist to go on when it comes to the knot(s). Absolutely nothing wrong with questioning or even speculating given we don't know all the facts yet but something wrong with stating things as fact that are both incorrect and then going on to double down and reinvent what you said rather than just learning or admitting a simple mistake.

Precautions Taken to Avoid Abandoning the Act of Hanging and Reducing Pain in Suicidal Hanging Cases

http://www.academia....l_Hanging_Cases

COMMON MEANS OF SUICIDE

http://www.indmedica...&action=article

[Soutpeel]

The most common way to avoid getting caught for murder is to try to make it look like a suicide.

Simply not true.

How many murders you committed JohnJohn to make such a definitive statement ?

[greenchair]

Things happen in a a destination with approx 1 mio tourists per year and a lot of them are so far off the would be at risk even in their own countries

Rest in peace to anyone who lost or took his life

I think we should gossip more about what happen at other destination too

Just to keep it interesting perhaps

Fess up aleg.we know it's you in disguise ? deflectin?

[BritTim]

I think it's nearly impossible to step into the noose after tying your hands in the back. We can all agree that the rope is of a nylon make. If it was hanging down from the ceiling, it would be nearly impossible to slip your head through it, as there would be no shape at all. So the person must have slipped it on first and then proceeded to tie the knot on his wrist and stepped through to position his arm to the back.

But to step thorough while wearing a sarong, it's quite a feat, but I am sure if you try, it would be possible. Not sure how tight the sarong was on him our how long it was. It doesn't leave much room to bend your knees. The chances of losing balance is quite high.

Looking at the link for hand behind the back suicide that many people posted, it seems very plausible. But what seems to be consistent in most of these cases, are the height in which they apparently jumped to their death. This could be because they would be able to slip the noose over their head first and have ample rope length to allow them to get their hands to the back.

But as I can see from the pics, it doesn't appear to have that much type play as the person was hanging from the ceiling.

I don't see with that little rope play and wearing a sarong, one can step through ones arm.

But it not impossible what a human being is capable of doing. Possible, the person has a degree of flexibility. If it was me, it would be very hard and nearly impossible. But with all the past cases, it would be very easy to do if they jump from a high place.

I think it's nearly impossible to step into the noose after tying your hands in the back. We can all agree that the rope is of a nylon make. If it was hanging down from the ceiling, it would be nearly impossible to slip your head through it, as there would be no shape at all.

It would only be possible with a creative solution, which I think should leave signs behind. You could do something like using a week thread tied to the noose to hold it open in a preset position. This would allow you to put your head through and the weak thread would then break when you jumped. The problem I have with such an idea is that anyone clever enough to devise this would also have been clever enough to arrange for the knot to be at the side of the neck where it causes death more quickly and efficiently. Perhaps, Dmitri was in a confused but creative state and this really was suicide.

[greenchair]

There is something rather dodgy about any Koh Death RTP activities. Why was it initially classed as a suicide, and now as suspicious? What forensic experts have examined the scene? Lots of other questions to.

It's common knowledge that Hannah and David's crime scene was contaminated and that the correct forensic procedures did not happen.

Has a certain person just returned to the island?

And why is this not in any newspapers. ?very suspicious