Call for Muslim army in Australia

[smotherb]

Deport.

Not familiar with the laws there but I don't think any country can "deport" citizens almost by definition of the word deport. I assume a large portion of Australian Muslims are full citizens.

They may be citizens,but they are not Australians

If they are not citizens, they are not Australians.

[H1w4yR1da]

I hope the anti halal mob walk or ride their bike to work and row themselves to Thailand.

I hope they have given up eating meat too given about 90% of meat in oz is halal certified (I must admit my local butcher told me that over Christmas but he had no issue with the way it was slaughtered at least in oz and said it made no didference to the quality of the meat).

You're missing a huge point about halal as usual. It's nothing to do with the 'quality of the meat'.

It's not just the way it's slaughtered but the infringement of indigenous cultures.

Non-muslims haven't demanded halal meat so why are they secretly being given it.

Also the costs of halal certification gives rise to the issue of what happens to these funds. There's strong suspicion that a lot of the money is financing terrorism, which is understandable and totally logical considering numerous and continual Islamic terrorist attacks against civilians and unarmed soldiers in both the middle-east and civilized western countries.

Edited January 20, 2015 by H1w4yR1da

[masuk]

The Muslim mayor of the Dutch city of Rotterdam has told Muslims who turn their back on freedom to “pack your If bags” and “<deleted> off”, live on television.

Ahmed Aboutaleb told NewsHour of his anger at the refusal of a number of Muslims to adapt to their new surroundings, which he said he has done after living in Holland since 1976.

“It is incomprehensible that you can turn against freedom… But if you don’t like freedom, for heaven’s sake pack your bags and leave,” he said.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/01/muslim-mayor-of-rotterdam-if-you-dont-like-freedom-leave

[rickirs]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Terrorism laws may fail here. But what about sedition? I'm sure Australia has sedition laws, and if so, they should use them to the hilt.

Seems covered - Section 24 defines seditious words as words expressive of a seditious intention, and specifies that any person who, with the intention of causing violence or creating public disorder or a public disturbance, writes, prints, utters or publishes any seditious words shall be guilty of an indictable offence punishable by imprisonment for 3 years.

[maidee]

put them all on a boat, one way, to the south pole ?

there they can ask allah or whatever puppet to keep them warm & feeded

[neverdie]

put them all on a boat, one way, to the south pole ?

there they can ask allah or whatever puppet to keep them warm & feeded

It's fed.

Anyway, good idea, except let's send them to the North Pole, South is too close to gods country, Australia.

[Doc46]

This is interesting and managed to make a few of us lefties wake up. She nails it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ry3NzkAOo3s

Now there is a woman speaking straight to the point....well done for her...Thats the way many now see this.

I like this Lady We could do with some of her positive thinking here.

[neverdie]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-01-20/police-terror-threat-level-raised-to-high/6027806

[Jay Sata]

Move the lot of them who want to raise a Muslim army to Kalgoorlie and let them preach in the town around 8.00pm on a Friday night.

I am sure some of the gold miners will persuade them it is not such a good idea.

[arjunadawn]

Deport.

Not familiar with the laws there but I don't think any country can "deport" citizens almost by definition of the word deport. I assume a large portion of Australian Muslims are full citizens.

Not so sure about AU law but the call to create a standing army on the sovereign territory of any state can easily be construed as insurgency and sedition. I am uncertain if treason applies, but surely if this is not handled politically, the law should be clear about calls for a separate army in any nation state. Not sure you could deport citizens for this but let them have their army in jail.

[arjunadawn]

I think this is as good a place as any to edit a mistake I have made previously.

All the places in the world where Shar'ia is not supreme are titled dar al harb- House of War. Why? Because jihad is the single motivating blueprint for islam and less jihad- jihad of battle, must be waged until...

the dar al islam- House of Submission is established.

Previously, I confused myself referring to the dar al islam as the dar al salam (Peace). Whats the difference and why does correcting my error matter?

Salam means peace. It is a linguistic error- totally- that Islam means peace; Islam=Submission. This mistake is accepted and tolerated by islam because it is not negative, but it is not true. Islam means Submission. The House of War exists throughout the globe until sharia is everywhere and then the House of Submission is in place (not the House of Peace as I had previously erred).

Greater Jihad is ostensibly the individual jihad, not unlike the Christian Ephesians. Lesser Jihad is jihad warring on the battlefield of life, not spirit. Lesser Jihad is in actuality greater jihad. This is how islam has spread for 1400 years.

The call to stand up a muslim army is one more fractured effort to act upon the fields of the House of War. This is exactly how the days ahead will appear- fractured, disparate, unconnected islamic announcements, demands, acts of war. But the fact is, they are all very deeply connected and they will collate into regional and then supra regional islamic alliances, much like we see happening with the IS caliphate and seemingly disparate other islamic armies. The goal is singular, unimpeachable, and not negotiable- the total annihilation or submission of every living creature on earth to islam. In observation you may note all muslims are not like this; perhaps. But Islam is like this.

[samran]

I hope the anti halal mob walk or ride their bike to work and row themselves to Thailand.

I hope they have given up eating meat too given about 90% of meat in oz is halal certified (I must admit my local butcher told me that over Christmas but he had no issue with the way it was slaughtered at least in oz and said it made no didference to the quality of the meat).

You're missing a huge point about halal as usual. It's nothing to do with the 'quality of the meat'.

It's not just the way it's slaughtered but the infringement of indigenous cultures.

Non-muslims haven't demanded halal meat so why are they secretly being given it.

Also the costs of halal certification gives rise to the issue of what happens to these funds. There's strong suspicion that a lot of the money is financing terrorism, which is understandable and totally logical considering numerous and continual Islamic terrorist attacks against civilians and unarmed soldiers in both the middle-east and civilized western countries.

I think petro dollars dolled out to a plethora of Saudi princes are more likely source of funding for the terrorists, don't you?

As for the halal thing, well its happening in oz, funds are no doubt monitored by the authorities. So unless you have proof, as opposed to guilt by association which is your modus operandi, why not show us all?

As for blaming anyone, why not just blame the producers who are trying to tap and export market?

Always amazed that the thai visa keyboard warriors are suddenly afraid of a vodoo prayer said at the moment of slaughter.

As for the cost argument of halal being passed on to consumers, it's just economic illiterates who come to that conclusion.

Basic economics says that if you increase production (eg say by tapping new export markets) the cost of producing an extra unit of that good goes down, not up.

But the fortress Australia/little Britain types would much rather consumers and fellow citizens have their food sourced at a higher priced smaller procuders cause their fear of a voodoo prayer means that a huge export market is cut off. Exuse the pun...

Edited January 20, 2015 by samran

[geetee]

It's not, in my opinion at least, anything to do with said "voodoo" rather it is about being held to ransom to conform with hellbloodylell in order to secure a sale. Economics 101 I know, you wanna make a sale you comply, simple. Buuut, how many other mobs demand that your meat have said voodoo over it...pretty sure you Poms don't, none of my mixed faith or atheist Seppo mates, nor Tiddlywink friends demand same etc etc.

I flatly refuse to buy anything that I know is hellbloodylell approved but it's a double edged sword since I genuinely try to support local business.

Back to this call for bloody arms by this ratbag mob, our govt needs to shut this &lt;deleted&gt; down fast. I don't give a flying toss where they are from, I do not consider them Australian, as someone mentioned earlier, they may be citizens but they sure they hell aren't Aussie. Geez, bloody Lakemba, where the hell are those Hornets with bunker busting bloody missiles when you want one!

[arjunadawn]

I hope the anti halal mob walk or ride their bike to work and row themselves to Thailand.

I hope they have given up eating meat too given about 90% of meat in oz is halal certified (I must admit my local butcher told me that over Christmas but he had no issue with the way it was slaughtered at least in oz and said it made no didference to the quality of the meat).

You're missing a huge point about halal as usual. It's nothing to do with the 'quality of the meat'.

It's not just the way it's slaughtered but the infringement of indigenous cultures.

Non-muslims haven't demanded halal meat so why are they secretly being given it.

Also the costs of halal certification gives rise to the issue of what happens to these funds. There's strong suspicion that a lot of the money is financing terrorism, which is understandable and totally logical considering numerous and continual Islamic terrorist attacks against civilians and unarmed soldiers in both the middle-east and civilized western countries.

I think petro dollars dolled out to a plethora of Saudi princes are more likely source of funding for the terrorists, don't you?

As for the halal thing, well its happening in oz, funds are no doubt monitored by the authorities. So unless you have proof, as opposed to guilt by association which is your modus operandi, why not show us all?

As for blaming anyone, why not just blame the producers who are trying to tap and export market?

Always amazed that the thai visa keyboard warriors are suddenly afraid of a vodoo prayer said at the moment of slaughter.

As for the cost argument of halal being passed on to consumers, it's just economic illiterates who come to that conclusion.

Basic economics says that if you increase production (eg say by tapping new export markets) the cost of producing an extra unit of that good goes down, not up.

But the fortress Australia/little Britain types would much rather consumers and fellow citizens have their food sourced at a higher priced smaller procuders cause their fear of a voodoo prayer means that a huge export market is cut off. Exuse the pun...

Funding comes through all manner of muslim banking.

Meat producers generally don't mind halal meat because it is simply cheaper to slaughter animals the barbaric way, slice their throat upside down. Thus, a segment of the population who requests it are pleased, and a majority who don't protest it are ignorant. Economics aside, the advent of less brutal ways of slaughtering animals evolved with the contemporary western world as a near stewardship issue of being at the top of the food chain and somewhat limiting pain to sentient animals. Halal slaughter is horrific. It is regressive, not accommodating. Moreover, for those that believe that which is wrought on earth is duplicated in heaven, the notion of islamic prayers upon an animal's death is truly, deeply offensive. The motivation may be economics, the result is dhimnitude.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies removed.

[Fatty123]

The Muslim mayor of the Dutch city of Rotterdam has told Muslims who turn their back on freedom to “pack your If bags” and “<deleted> off”, live on television.

Ahmed Aboutaleb told NewsHour of his anger at the refusal of a number of Muslims to adapt to their new surroundings, which he said he has done after living in Holland since 1976.

“It is incomprehensible that you can turn against freedom… But if you don’t like freedom, for heaven’s sake pack your bags and leave,” he said.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/01/muslim-mayor-of-rotterdam-if-you-dont-like-freedom-leave

Hopefully, he's the first of many Muslim figureheads to come out with a comment like that. Well done that man

[arjunadawn]

Funding comes through all manner of muslim banking.

Meat producers generally don't mind halal meat because it is simply cheaper to slaughter animals the barbaric way, slice their throat upside down. Thus, a segment of the population who requests it are pleased, and a majority who don't protest it are ignorant. Economics aside, the advent of less brutal ways of slaughtering animals evolved with the contemporary western world as a near stewardship issue of being at the top of the food chain and somewhat limiting pain to sentient animals. Halal slaughter is horrific. It is regressive, not accommodating. Moreover, for those that believe that which is wrought on earth is duplicated in heaven, the notion of islamic prayers upon an animal's death is truly, deeply offensive. The motivation may be economics, the result is dhimnitude.

You read about slaughtering in some book or on some website devoted to the War on Halal? Have been slaughtering my own meat since childhood. Father taught me. Brother in Law still does it. We are talking about Australia here. Not everyone lives on Bondi Beach and shops at Coles. Slicing the throat is the way to do it. What alternative do you suggest? Bore the animal to death with anti-muslim polemic? Slaughtering an animal for food is not a task to take delight in. You do it as quickly and unemotionally as possible. No need to say any words. That some people do is up to them. Makes no difference to the taste of the meat.

Economics is entirely the reason businesses take account of dietary practices. Australia's geographic location has meant that businesses becoming aware of Halal is a decades old phenomenon. Your characterisation of this as cowardice and servility is excessive.

Isn't it just possible someone comes close to your dazzling intellect without reading a book to create their newest malleable nature?

I made it clear that economics drives the train on this issue. I made it clear that it is more cost effective for producers to do away with complex and novel ways to kill animals- do it quickly, package and send to market. For a post filled with considerable sarcasm and direct insult, my position differs little from yours.

I said nothing regarding cowardice. I do not believe this drives the engine of this issue- money does (for the producers). I do believe the end result will be viewed by muslims as one more example of dhimmi status for those around them; of this I have little doubt.

Lets recap:

You presume my knowledge is based on some odd book you cite.

Your relevant experience killing animals makes you an expert on the broader implications of islam, sharia, dhimmitude, hirjah, and how this particular issue impacts this theology.

You suggest I am out of touch, shopping at Cole's and live on Bondi Beach; or at least people with my perspective are.

Your position finds it incredulous that consecrating an animal to any particular god is meaningless, and therefore an invalid position; "makes no difference to the taste of the meat" demonstrates your profound inability to grasp that aspect of this issue in any regard.

In conclusion, everything you said could have been said better absent the ad hominen attacks or innuendo. You have a lifetime of experience regarding this issue and that is a remarkable point of view. Your position is not made stronger unless you make mine weaker. Your position differs little from mine. Your position is not made stronger by making me personally appear weaker.

[khaowong1]

It wouldn't surprise me if this nutjob is a Muslim version of either the pastor of Westboro Baptist Church, who will never have a following other than a small group of other nutters, or a small-time televangelist just trying to get some tithes.

Nevertheless, he needs to be charged and gaoled.

That particular pastor died last year.. They've been pretty quiet since then. Hint, hint.

[arjunadawn]

I rarely... very rarely impugn a poster unless in response! However, if I may, I would like to remove everything else between our posts except one single issue- the "ridiculous war on halal." I object to islamic practices being normalized under any guise. If a producer wants to profit off a unique market, then do so. But if a christian mother wants hamburger for dinner she should have every confidence it is not halal.

No problem at all with your proposal.

I interpret your scenario that the Christian mother would be having her religious beliefs and practices infringed because the meat in the hamburger was Halal. Since I don't really know exactly what goes into Halal certification, I have to go on the information from posters on this forum, which is a frightening prospect. I have read that Halal involves a method of slaughter and some prayers or recitation during or associated with the act.

I was not being flippant when I claimed that the taste of the meat is no different between Halal and otherwise. So as an atheist, I don't care if someone said any words over the meat. But you specify a Christian woman, so I go with this. If this is an issue for her, then she has to exercise some diligence in her purchases. Australia's labelling laws are quite good so I imagine that such diligence would enable her to make informed purchasing choices. So then we come to the idea of non Halal hamburger meat being completely unavailable. I honestly cannot see that happening in Australia. The Christian woman's choices have to be respected in a multicultural society. She can join other like minded people to ensure her dietary preferences are not infringed, just like the case with Halal food and Kosher food and Vegan food etc.

I think the instances claimed on TVF of Halal takeover of schools and indigenous Brit kids not being able to eat ham are apocrypha. I believe that most if not all cases would not bear scrutiny in terms of looking behind the superficiality of the headline. There will be context to all cases which would be understandable.

With regards to the scenario you describe, I agree with you but believe that such a situation would not arise without remedies being available.

I use the words ridiculous purposefully. I just can't really believe we have to take this seriously in the 'what do we do about muslims' debate. There are surely far more serious issues to address. Australia was long an agricultural economy, specifically sheep and has a long experience of exporting to the middle east. I remember as a young lad watching shows on the export of live sheep; live because they had to be killed a certain way in the middle east. Slaughtering in Australia and exporting th meat is to me more humane that shoving a mob of sheep into a ship for weeks. Definitely would not like to crew those ships. It also is a more value added approach. Halal Certification is a serious issue for Australia and as I have tried to show, one with a long history so to have it thrown around in the current hysteria is a problem. It should not be a cause celebre for the nattering mob to attack each other I think.

I think your post is reasonable and intelligent. I am not christian either. You took that example and worked it out reasonably. If what you say is true regarding labeling, then yes, vote choice with wallet. Agreed! I have, however, read various pieces over time regarding the insinuation of halal foods for British schoolchildren. I did not have the sense that this was an urban myth or such.

I am far more concerned than you regarding the slippery slope of religious accommodation, and the manner it may insinuate into a host society.

[GentlemanJim]

I commend everyone to watch a brilliant British film called 'Four Lions', which accurately shows the level of intelligence of the majority of Islamic Terrorists. If you can understand the Yorkshire dialect you will laugh...a LOT! and then the ironic ending. Just brilliant, not to be missed.

[BestBitterPhuket]

Deport.

Not familiar with the laws there but I don't think any country can "deport" citizens almost by definition of the word deport. I assume a large portion of Australian Muslims are full citizens.

Many of them are Arabs with Australian passports. Not citizens.

[simple1]

Deport.

Not familiar with the laws there but I don't think any country can "deport" citizens almost by definition of the word deport. I assume a large portion of Australian Muslims are full citizens.

Many of them are Arabs with Australian passports. Not citizens.

Ridiculous statement. If they have Oz passport they're an Oz citizen

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed. This is not about the live animal export ban under the labor government, nor is it about the slaughtering methods of animals.

[casualbiker]

Deport.

Not familiar with the laws there but I don't think any country can "deport" citizens almost by definition of the word deport. I assume a large portion of Australian Muslims are full citizens.

If it's like the UK, then it depends on how they acquired citizenship. If naturalized for instance, the Home Secretary can revoke the award of citizenship if deemed appropriate.

I guess the issue is many of these militants are second, third generation. That's what is really frightening the indoctrination and hatred being instilled in the younger people, born and bred with the benefits of living in the West.

Aussie, like the UK, has tough laws that effectively disarm citizens unlike the US so the burden to protect falls on law enforcement and security personnel.

" Aussie, like the UK, has tough laws that effectively disarm citizens unlike the US so the burden to protect falls on law enforcement and security personnel"

Which is good as that's their job it's what they are trained for.. easy access to weapons goes two ways!

[dragonfly94]

Deport.

Not familiar with the laws there but I don't think any country can "deport" citizens almost by definition of the word deport. I assume a large portion of Australian Muslims are full citizens.

Many of them are Arabs with Australian passports. Not citizens.

Ridiculous statement. If they have Oz passport they're an Oz citizen

But regard themselves as Muslim 1st and Australian somewhere around 3rd or 4th. Many are only Australian for the passport and the benefits of it.

[simple1]

Not familiar with the laws there but I don't think any country can "deport" citizens almost by definition of the word deport. I assume a large portion of Australian Muslims are full citizens.

Many of them are Arabs with Australian passports. Not citizens.

Ridiculous statement. If they have Oz passport they're an Oz citizen

But regard themselves as Muslim 1st and Australian somewhere around 3rd or 4th. Many are only Australian for the passport and the benefits of it.

Post removed to enable response.

Only your opinion with no proof. I personally know Muslim Australians, not on welfare and so on, who are very proud to call Australia home.

[dragonfly94]

Edited January 22, 2015 by dragonfly94

[simple1]

yep this guy and associates ended up being convicted terrorism charges, some up to 25 years prison. Unfortunately there are some with similar inclinations, but Oz law and security forces will get on top on these issues. Abusers of the welfare system are being targeted, the huge majority being 'true blue Ozzies'. I assume you are Australian, if so you will know the recently retired head of security forces publicly stated ASIO receives a great deal of assistance from the Muslim community who will be calling "Australia home".

Getting back to the topic, hopefully the group will soon be banned (as it is in a number of Muslim majority countries) and leaders removed from Oz / jailed.

[JockPieandBeans]

I, and others, have been castigated for our viewpoint, regarding Islam / Muslims being incompatible with western values. No names, no packdrills, you know who you are.

A little video, of what the Religion of Peace and Tolerance brought to the streets of Sydney today.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=467_1422162878

This was apparently over a video that was posted on youtube.

Only around 500,000 and its ugly head is now well above the parapet.

[dragonfly94]

Interesting Vid, were these violent Islamic protesters moderates or not?, kind of hard to tell! I'm sure our resident apologist will be able to make a good excuse up for this scum.