Things about Thailand that boggle my mind (1 of a series): Solar Power

[Seligne2]

Thailand washes its dishes in cold water. And takes cold showers. And I can't understand why.

Some context:

In the early 1970s, on my first trip to Japan, while on a train from Kyoto to Shimonoseki, I noticed that every house had a black bladder on the roof. I later learned that their purpose was to provide hot/warm water to the household via passive solar power. Nothing fancy, just fill up the bladder every morning and have warm to hot water in the evening.

Later, in the army, on a training exercise in Greece, while in a semi-permanent Greek Army encampment, our shower water was provided by simple 55-gallon drums, painted flat black, hoisted up on 4 x 4 inch support columns. Fill it up in the morning, have shower water at night. In North America, I copied the design an built two: one in Kentucky, one in British Columbia. Both worked a treat.

I stand here on my balcony in Chiang Mai and overlook thousands of rooftops, each one bathed in sunlight. Not one solar collector in view, not even a 55-gallon drum. How can this be in a country that is awash in sunshine?

[HeijoshinCool]

Forrest Gump knows the answer.

[HooHaa]

lack of government subsidies and little availability ofquality products locally, despite the fact there is quite a bit of stuff manufactured here for export.

i looked into solar when i built my house 8 years ago. the ROI did not justify it. grid was far cheaper even over 25 years.

[Seligne2]

lack of government subsidies and little availability ofquality products locally, despite the fact there is quite a bit of stuff manufactured here for export.

i looked into solar when i built my house 8 years ago. the ROI did not justify it. grid was far cheaper even over 25 years.

Even passive solar was too expensive?

[SoiBiker]

Who wants to take a hot shower in this climate?

[HooHaa]

lack of government subsidies and little availability ofquality products locally, despite the fact there is quite a bit of stuff manufactured here for export.

i looked into solar when i built my house 8 years ago. the ROI did not justify it. grid was far cheaper even over 25 years.

Even passive solar was too expensive?

no, water heater was reasonable and installed.

apologies for skimming the topic, i usually dont reply without fully reading the op. was distracted by a movie.

Edited March 5, 2015 by HooHaa

[sdanielmcev]

Well, for one thing, hot water is only need a couple of months a year.

[Estrada]

I worked with Shell UK on the development of Solar Panels in the 1970s. The payback was 10 years which is too long. If you like having a 55 gallon oil drum on the roof then perhaps you have an acceptable payback. Quite honestly, a simple instantaneous electric shower heater is much better and no chance of legionella.

Thailand does not wash its dishes in cold water, as the ambient temperature is high making the water temperature around 30C. The liguid detergent used for washing dishes, cars etc is designed to be used at low temperature.

Edited March 6, 2015 by Estrada

[IMHO]

There are plenty of vendors for solar hot water in Thailand, and prices aren't too bad - a professional, pressurized system with vacuum tube collectors and insulated tank costs about 39K for 150L, 43K for 200L (plus install).

However, as noted, not everyone uses a lot of hot water in TH, so even at these prices, ROI's still might not work out.

In our house, we have two systems (one used daily in our main house, the other in the guest house used rarely) - payback time for us will be about 5 years. However, if we only used it for our main house, payback time would be only 2-3 years.

We have daughters that like hour long showers though, and a 2 person whirlpool bath that uses a ton of hot water though

Edited March 6, 2015 by IMHO

[IMHO]

I worked with Shell UK on the development of Solar Panels in the 1970s. The payback was 10 years which is too long. If you like having a 55 gallon oil drum on the roof then perhaps you have an acceptable payback. Quite honestly, a simple instantaneous electric shower heater is much better and no chance of legionella.

A proper solar hot water system keeps the water temp at 70c + most of time - so no chance of anything.

[weegee]

Who wants to take a hot shower in this climate?

And you ride heaps of klms on your bike every chance you get??? Boy I am glad i dont sit near you to eat.... (just kidding)

[Estrada]

I worked with Shell UK on the development of Solar Panels in the 1970s. The payback was 10 years which is too long. If you like having a 55 gallon oil drum on the roof then perhaps you have an acceptable payback. Quite honestly, a simple instantaneous electric shower heater is much better and no chance of legionella.

A proper solar hot water system keeps the water temp at 70c + most of time - so no chance of anything.

A proper solar system is expensive and there is no payback in this climate for ordinary house heating. What this climate needs is a cheaper method of cooling by combining high temperature solar heating using mirrors with vapour adsorption chillers. I installed the very first vapour adsorption chiller in Thailand 20 years ago saving a lot of money on cooling.

[IMHO]

It seems we have two different conversations here. There's a big difference between Solar Hot Water, and Solar Power Don't be fooled by the topic title, the OP is talking about water, not electricity

[mcm991]

There are plenty of vendors for solar hot water in Thailand, and prices aren't too bad - a professional, pressurized system with vacuum tube collectors and insulated tank costs about 39K for 150L, 43K for 200L (plus install).

However, as noted, not everyone uses a lot of hot water in TH, so even at these prices, ROI's still might not work out.

In our house, we have two systems (one used daily in our main house, the other in the guest house used rarely) - payback time for us will be about 5 years. However, if we only used it for our main house, payback time would be only 2-3 years.

We have daughters that like hour long showers though, and a 2 person whirlpool bath that uses a ton of hot water though

Please PM me if you know of any companies in the Chiangmai area who sell systems for that price.

I've been quoted almost double that...... mind you I'm looking for a split system.

[kannot]

I worked with Shell UK on the development of Solar Panels in the 1970s. The payback was 10 years which is too long. If you like having a 55 gallon oil drum on the roof then perhaps you have an acceptable payback. Quite honestly, a simple instantaneous electric shower heater is much better and no chance of legionella.

A proper solar hot water system keeps the water temp at 70c + most of time - so no chance of anything.

A proper solar system is expensive and there is no payback in this climate for ordinary house heating. What this climate needs is a cheaper method of cooling by combining high temperature solar heating using mirrors with vapour adsorption chillers. I installed the very first vapour adsorption chiller in Thailand 20 years ago saving a lot of money on cooling.

How effective was it? curious lets say ambient temps outside are 36c what could you get your internal temps down too?

[Seligne2]

Who wants to take a hot shower in this climate?

Don't you want to wash dishes in hot water?

[Seligne2]

It seems we have two different conversations here. There's a big difference between Solar Hot Water, and Solar Power Don't be fooled by the topic title, the OP is talking about water, not electricity

Exactly! My question is about passive solar, not active solar (PV panels, etc.). The latter is expensive and I get that, but passive can be as cheap as putting a bucket out in the sun. Someone earlier said that tap water in Thailand is ~30 degrees C. Not in northern Thailand in the cold season!

[IMHO]

There are plenty of vendors for solar hot water in Thailand, and prices aren't too bad - a professional, pressurized system with vacuum tube collectors and insulated tank costs about 39K for 150L, 43K for 200L (plus install).

However, as noted, not everyone uses a lot of hot water in TH, so even at these prices, ROI's still might not work out.

In our house, we have two systems (one used daily in our main house, the other in the guest house used rarely) - payback time for us will be about 5 years. However, if we only used it for our main house, payback time would be only 2-3 years.

We have daughters that like hour long showers though, and a 2 person whirlpool bath that uses a ton of hot water though

Please PM me if you know of any companies in the Chiangmai area who sell systems for that price.

I've been quoted almost double that...... mind you I'm looking for a split system.

PM Sent.

[IMHO]

Who wants to take a hot shower in this climate?

Don't you want to wash dishes in hot water?

It's funny, our maid has never used hot water for dish washing, or floor washing - up until we installed solar, all sinks were cold only. Now she has tried both using hot water and loves it (especially how the floor dries so quick, so no need to re-mop as people walk around) - but if you had asked her beforehand, the answer surely would have been "no need"

Edited March 6, 2015 by IMHO

[IMHO]

It seems we have two different conversations here. There's a big difference between Solar Hot Water, and Solar Power Don't be fooled by the topic title, the OP is talking about water, not electricity

Exactly! My question is about passive solar, not active solar (PV panels, etc.). The latter is expensive and I get that, but passive can be as cheap as putting a bucket out in the sun. Someone earlier said that tap water in Thailand is ~30 degrees C. Not in northern Thailand in the cold season!

Even just a garden hose in the sun makes hot water ...

The only thing about going passive with the black bucket idea is, you're only going to gravity fed static pressure of course (~1.4 PSI per M). The pressurized system we have can fill our (huge) bath in only a few minutes

Edited March 6, 2015 by IMHO

[yellowboat]

Is it because you now live in an intellectual dessert , a place where ambition goes to die, a place where apathy is the order of the day ? People in Thailand are hard workers, but sadly they feel a bit hopeless.

[neeray]

Bad Kitty nailed it. My fiancé was having many guests at her house for a wedding and had talked about not having hot water for them.

So I bought her an inline heater for the shower prior to the wedding. She had said "I will still shower in cold water". Now, nothing but HOT showers for her.

And me (being a sucky from Canada), when we visit friends who don't have hot water, she boils water and pours it over me. Oh those Thai girls are so caring !

Now I want to get her one for kitchen so she will wash the dishes with HOT water.

[davetrout]

Who wants to take a hot shower in this climate?

l do

[SoiBiker]

Who wants to take a hot shower in this climate?

Don't you want to wash dishes in hot water?

Don't you have a kettle?

[kinmaew]

Because it does not look nice. Can I borrow 100,000 baht to pay for mama's leg operation.

[KamalaRider]

Wash what dishes?

They eat with their fingers and the kao niau pots are made of straws.

Cold shower after a hot day.

But interestingly, me and my wife just came down from a visit to her mum and siblings in Isaarn a few days ago, on our way home to Phuket with car, we passed a solar energy plant, first one I've seen in Thailand.

[LuckyLew]

Thais are used to the cold showers and feel no need to have hot water

With the hot weather year round, no real need for water heaters

So wy spend money on something you do not need and can live without?

[SoiBiker]

Thais are used to the cold showers and feel no need to have hot water

With the hot weather year round, no real need for water heaters

So wy spend money on something you do not need and can live without?

Let's not let logic spoil yet another thread about how backwards the Thai people supposedly are.

[neeray]

If given the option, Thais seem to prefer HOT water.

My fiancé sure did.

But, to each their own.

[Anon999]

Who wants to take a hot shower in this climate?

It is not hot all the year round, at least in Isaan and yes we do have a hot water tank and not just for showers either. How about washing up for instance?