Thai Doesn't mean Free

[Johnniey]

I'm tired of people telling me that the Thai in Thailand means free, or Thailand means land of the free.

Can any of the experts here explain that the spelling is different.

[cooked]

Who cares?

[Johnniey]

Who cares?

Me obviously. Stay away from the THAI forum you idiot.,

Edited March 15, 2015 by Johnniey

[Seligne2]

This is from Wikipedia Thailand for what it is worth:

The word Thai (ไทย) is not, as commonly believed,^{[citation needed]} derived from the word Thai (ไท) meaning "independence" in the Thai language; it is, however, the name of an ethnic group from the central plains (the Thai people).^{[citation needed]} A famous Thai scholar argued that Thai (ไท) simply means "people" or "human being" since his investigation shows that in some rural areas the word "Thai" was used instead of the usual Thai word "khon" (คน) for people.^[23]

[cooked]

Who cares?

Me obviously. Stay away from the THAI forum you idiot.,

This has been gone over many times, you idiot. You can also google it, you idiot.

[Johpa]

A famous Thai scholar argued that Thai simply means "people" or "human being" since his investigation shows that in some rural areas the word "Thai" was used instead of the usual Thai word "khon"

In the rather rural area up north where I maintain a home, referring to someone as "Thai" implies a native speaker of Central Thai and not a northerner, not "one of us". I believe some people in Isaan use it for a similar meaning. I suspect this is the usage the hapless Thai academic encountered. I have never heard it used as a generic synonym for "khon". If ever used as such, one would expect to find cognates in other neighboring Tai languages.

[Derek M]

Thailand’s name in the Thai language is Prathet Thai, which means “Land of the Free.”

[Baa_Mango]

I thought as kinda explained above >> the name was changed from "SIAM" to Thailand ie.. Land of the People .. kinda makes sense if you think of it like that, although again this is just guesswork on my part. citation needed.

[Johnniey]

Who cares?

Me obviously. Stay away from the THAI forum you idiot.,

This has been gone over many times, you idiot. You can also google it, you idiot.

That's now 2 totally useless posts - congratulations. Another newbie trying to increase his postcount?

[Johnniey]

Thailand’s name in the Thai language is Prathet Thai, which means “Land of the Free.”

Actually, I usually hear Thai refer to their country as Muang Thai.

And the original meaning of Thai or Tai is people(human) so Thailand means "land of the people" not "land of the free"

Edited March 17, 2015 by Johnniey

[rak sa_ngop]

In the Laos language if you say you are 'thai Vientiane' it means you are a person from Vientiane.

And there is a main street in Vientiane named 'sam saen thai' meaning 300,000 people.

[Aforek]

Thailand’s name in the Thai language is Prathet Thai, which means “Land of the Free.”

Actually, I usually hear Thai refer to their country as Muang Thai.

And the original meaning of Thai or Tai is people(human) so Thailand means "land of the people" not "land of the free"

Meuang thai is in the every day spoken language, prathet thai is the official name, used in speeches, radio, newspapers ...

[MaeJoMTB]

(guey teow) Pad Thai = People's fried noodles.

It certainly doesn't mean free fried noodles.

Edited March 17, 2015 by MaeJoMTB

[irishsmile]

Who cares?

Me obviously. Stay away from the THAI forum you idiot.,

Lol I love the way people are really civil with one another on TV, gives me so much laughs!

[Johpa]

And there is a main street in Vientiane named 'sam saen thai' meaning 300,000 people.

Now there is an example of a cognate that would give credence that the word 'Thai' once had a meaning close to 'khon'.

[AyG]

I'm tired of people telling me that the Thai in Thailand means free, or Thailand means land of the free.

Can any of the experts here explain that the spelling is different.

Except the spelling isn't different. One dictionary [LEXiTRON] gives the following definitions for ไทย

(1) freedom, ความมีอิสระในตัว, ความไม่เป็นทาส

(2) ชื่อประเทศและชนชาติที่อยู่ในเอเชียตะวันออกเฉียงใต้

[Aforek]

New se-ed's english-thai thai -english dictionary gives this definition for " ไทย" : ( dictionary written by Thai people )

name: Thai, Thailand, Siamese, Siam; freedom, independance, liberty

adjective :free, independent

thai-language .com says that as an adjective , ไทย means " free, liberated "

as AyG says, spelling is not different

[AyG]

The spelling is curious. There is only a handful of single syllable Thai words that start with sara ai maimalai and end with (a seemingly redundant) yor yak. I can only think of ไทย, ไตรย and ไลย.

One explanation I've read is that Pali doesn't have the diphthong /aj/, so this sound is written in two parts. When such words are written in Thai script the result is, in the case of Thai, เทยฺย.

So, "Thai" appears to have first been borrowed into Pali, and then borrowed into Thai. What I haven't been able to find out, though, is what เทยฺย means in Pali, and from which language it was borrowed.

Any experts out there with answers?

[Seligne2]

The spelling is curious. There is only a handful of single syllable Thai words that start with sara ai maimalai and end with (a seemingly redundant) yor yak. I can only think of ไทย, ไตรย and ไลย.

One explanation I've read is that Pali doesn't have the diphthong /aj/, so this sound is written in two parts. When such words are written in Thai script the result is, in the case of Thai, เทยฺย.

So, "Thai" appears to have first been borrowed into Pali, and then borrowed into Thai. What I haven't been able to find out, though, is what เทยฺย means in Pali, and from which language it was borrowed.

Any experts out there with answers?

AyG, you're about the best expert we got!

[Sawan Chan 7]

The spelling is curious. There is only a handful of single syllable Thai words that start with sara ai maimalai and end with (a seemingly redundant) yor yak. I can only think of ไทย, ไตรย and ไลย.

One explanation I've read is that Pali doesn't have the diphthong /aj/, so this sound is written in two parts. When such words are written in Thai script the result is, in the case of Thai, เทยฺย.

So, "Thai" appears to have first been borrowed into Pali, and then borrowed into Thai. What I haven't been able to find out, though, is what เทยฺย means in Pali, and from which language it was borrowed.

Any experts out there with answers?

AyG, you're about the best expert we got!

Where are Richard W, Rikker, Nerranam, or D. Houston?

[Sawan Chan 7]

(guey teow) Pad Thai = People's fried noodles.

It certainly doesn't mean free fried noodles.

How do you spell Pad Thai?

[Neeranam]

http://th.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E0%B8%84%E0%B8%A7%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%A1%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%9B%E0%B9%87%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%82%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%87%E0%B8%84%E0%B8%B3%E0%B8%AA%E0%B8%A2%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%A1_%E0%B9%84%E0%B8%97%E0%B8%A2,_%E0%B8%A5%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%A7_%E0%B9%81%E0%B8%A5%E0%B8%B0%E0%B8%82%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%A1_%E0%B9%81%E0%B8%A5%E0%B8%B0%E0%B8%A5%E0%B8%B1%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A9%E0%B8%93%E0%B8%B0%E0%B8%97%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%87%E0%B8%AA%E0%B8%B1%E0%B8%87%E0%B8%84%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%82%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%87%E0%B8%8A%E0%B8%B7%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%8A%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%8A%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%95%E0%B8%B4

[White Christmas13]

Who cares?

Me obviously. Stay away from the THAI forum you idiot.,

Lol I love the way people are really civil with one another on TV, gives me so much laughs!

It does not give me any laughs at all those people should be given a suspension to learn manners

[Neeranam]

Who cares?

Me obviously. Stay away from the THAI forum you idiot.,

This has been gone over many times, you idiot. You can also google it, you idiot.

Do you have any links cooked? This forum is for asking questions, seems a fair enough OP to me.

[MaeJoMTB]

(guey teow) Pad Thai = People's fried noodles.

It certainly doesn't mean free fried noodles.

How do you spell Pad Thai?

originally ผัดไท but modern spelling has about 50/50 ผัดไท/ผัดไทย

If you ask a young Thai person, they spell it the new way.

If you ask a literate Thai person over age 40, they will spell it the old way.

(I still spell it the old way ผัดไท)

The general Field Marshal who originally invented the dish (circa 1940) named it as the people's new food staple, to allow the Thai government more rice to export.

From wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pad_Thai

"As Prime Minister of Thailand between 1938 to 1944 and from 1948 to 1957, Phibun hoped to westernize the country. In 1939, he supported the change of name of the country from Siam to Thailand. At the time, wheat noodles were very popular in Thailand, but Plaek Phibunsongkhram sought to eliminate Chinese influence. His government promoted rice noodles and helped to establish the identity of Thailand. As a result, a new noodle named sen chan was created. The noodle is suitable to be stir-fried in a pan, and this Thai noodle was called pad thai. The meats and vegetables in pad thai are similar to food prepared by the Cantonese and Tae Chiew (Chao Zhou in Mandarin) from Guangdong province of China. However, the flavors and textures are pure Thai.

Pad thai was made popular in Thailand during World War II. Pad thai has since become one of Thailand's national dishes. Today, some food vendors add pork-chops to enhance the taste (although the original recipe did not contain pork because the government perception that pork was a Chinese meat). Some food vendors still use the original recipe. It is a fast, delicious and nutritious dish, and has become popular in many countries around the world."

And here (FM introduced the Thai greeting 'sawadee', and changed the country from Siam to Thailand at the same time)

http://highheelgourmet.com/2012/07/17/padthai-trilogy-whats-not/

Edited March 18, 2015 by MaeJoMTB

[AyG]

originally ผัดไท but modern spelling has about 50/50 ผัดไท/ผัดไทย

If you ask a young Thai person, they spell it the new way.

If you ask a literate Thai person over age 40, they will spell it the old way.

(I still spell it the old way ผัดไท)

I very much doubt the old way was ผัดไท. Plaek was an ardent promoter of all things Thai, despite being of Chinese descent. He wanted a new national dish, so what is more natural than naming the dish after the country and its people - ไทย? Of course, if you have any evidence to back up your assertion, I'd be fascinated.

According to Wikipedia: ผัดไท เป็นตัวสะกดผิดที่พบได้บ่อย [My rough translation: Phat Thai (without the final yor yak) is incorrect, yet frequently encountered.] Source: http://th.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E0%B8%9C%E0%B8%B1%E0%B8%94%E0%B9%84%E0%B8%97%E0%B8%A2

[MaeJoMTB]

originally ผัดไท but modern spelling has about 50/50 ผัดไท/ผัดไทย

If you ask a young Thai person, they spell it the new way.

If you ask a literate Thai person over age 40, they will spell it the old way.

(I still spell it the old way ผัดไท)

I very much doubt the old way was ผัดไท. Plaek was an ardent promoter of all things Thai, despite being of Chinese descent. He wanted a new national dish, so what is more natural than naming the dish after the country and its people - ไทย? Of course, if you have any evidence to back up your assertion, I'd be fascinated.

According to Wikipedia: ผัดไท เป็นตัวสะกดผิดที่พบได้บ่อย [My rough translation: Phat Thai (without the final yor yak) is incorrect, yet frequently encountered.] Source: http://th.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E0%B8%9C%E0%B8%B1%E0%B8%94%E0%B9%84%E0%B8%97%E0%B8%A2

The internet is written by young people.

I can only repeat older literate Thais spell it the old way. They mostly don't use the internet.

Edited March 18, 2015 by MaeJoMTB

[AyG]

originally ผัดไท but modern spelling has about 50/50 ผัดไท/ผัดไทย

If you ask a young Thai person, they spell it the new way.

If you ask a literate Thai person over age 40, they will spell it the old way.

(I still spell it the old way ผัดไท)

I very much doubt the old way was ผัดไท. Plaek was an ardent promoter of all things Thai, despite being of Chinese descent. He wanted a new national dish, so what is more natural than naming the dish after the country and its people - ไทย? Of course, if you have any evidence to back up your assertion, I'd be fascinated.

According to Wikipedia: ผัดไท เป็นตัวสะกดผิดที่พบได้บ่อย [My rough translation: Phat Thai (without the final yor yak) is incorrect, yet frequently encountered.] Source: http://th.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E0%B8%9C%E0%B8%B1%E0%B8%94%E0%B9%84%E0%B8%97%E0%B8%A2

The internet is written by young people.

I can only repeat older literate Thais spell it the old way. They mostly don't use the internet.

I find it hard to think of a more educated of aged Thai gentlemen who are not particularly familiar with the Internet than the committee that prepares the Royal Institute Dictionary. When I scan that highly esteemed tome I read:

ผัดไทย น. อาหารคาวอย่างหนึ่ง ใช้ก๋วยเตี๋ยวเส้นเล็กผัดกับเครื่องปรุงมีน้ำมะขามเปียก เต้าหู้เหลืองหัวไช้โป๊ กุ้งแห้งหรือกุ้งสด ใบกุยช่าย ถั่วงอก เป็นต้น

They don't have any problem with the correct spelling. All the evidence I've seen points to ผัดไท being just plain wrong.

[Richard W]

One explanation I've read is that Pali doesn't have the diphthong /aj/, so this sound is written in two parts. When such words are written in Thai script the result is, in the case of Thai, เทยฺย.

So, "Thai" appears to have first been borrowed into Pali, and then borrowed into Thai. What I haven't been able to find out, though, is what เทยฺย means in Pali, and from which language it was borrowed.

It's more than likely to have been borrowed from Thai, and probably borrowed into the Pali of Thailand. However, we are only really talking about a Pali spelling habit appearing in Thai.

[wprime]

The spelling is curious. There is only a handful of single syllable Thai words that start with sara ai maimalai and end with (a seemingly redundant) yor yak. I can only think of ไทย, ไตรย and ไลย.

One explanation I've read is that Pali doesn't have the diphthong /aj/, so this sound is written in two parts. When such words are written in Thai script the result is, in the case of Thai, เทยฺย.

So, "Thai" appears to have first been borrowed into Pali, and then borrowed into Thai. What I haven't been able to find out, though, is what เทยฺย means in Pali, and from which language it was borrowed.

Any experts out there with answers?

The ย was added later so I doubt it has any indication of the word root. If I recall correctly it was added simply to differentiate it from ไท. I can find references as early as 1835 calling Siam เมืองไท, e.g. this trial coin from 1835: http://thailand.coinvalues.asia/Thailand/King_Rama_III/Elephant_Type/