Lottery vendors threaten to rally in Bangkok

[bkkjames]

If the want to completely automate the system and keep the vendors satisfied, supply the vendors with hand-held devices.

These hand-held devices would offer the same facilities of a vending machine, be connected to a network and have receipt printer attached.

Cheers.

Sorry, makes too much sense to work here. Lets aim lower. Give then an abacus and a notepad.

[Sviss Geez]

Dear lottery-vendors.

Maybe it is time to get a real job??

Most of the vendors are able bodied people between 25 and 45!!

Selling lottery tickets is a real job for them. What would you, in your infinite wisdom, suggest they do as an alternative?

[Sviss Geez]

This lottery should have been outlawed, Another goverment scam.

It would be really good to see your explanation as to how it's a scam. As with every lottery, worldwide, hopeful people buy tickets and some of them win, sometimes tens of millions of baht.

Edited March 21, 2015 by Sviss Geez

[EyesWideOpen]

This is the land of scams, where nearly everything seems to be a cheat.

I will assume the same for the lottery here. Am amazed that anyone

buys a ticket.....

A lottery was fixed in America. Insider people injected white paint

in the flying lottery balls making some of them a bit heavier.

They then placed bets on combinations of the lighter non

injected balls. Now if they could try to get away with that in America,

what in god's name do you think is going on here??

Edited March 21, 2015 by EyesWideOpen

[Sviss Geez]

Dear lottery-vendors.

Maybe it is time to get a real job??

Most of the vendors are able bodied people between 25 and 45!!

Dear lottery-vendors.

Please help JOC to read English.

Wang Saphung district is known to have the largest number of small scale lottery vendors in Thailand. Many of its residents have their part-time jobs as lottery sellers, especially during times of economic trouble.

Dear lottery-vendors.

Please help Costas to understand the country, he is living in.

All lottery sellers in Hua Hin are from upcountry, mostly from Loei. (maybe even the Wang Saphung district?). They live here full time in rented houses and been doing so for years. So no part time workers here!! And all of them are able bodied people.

So why are they here? Probably because the profits from their "job" is to good to turn down!!

By now you should be aware, that it is part of Thainess to complain about economic hardship no matter how many millions you have in the bank.................

"Probably because the profits from their "job" is to good to turn down!!"

Isn't that why everyone has a job, to make "profits" called wages, what's bloody wrong with that? If you work, or worked, as I'm sure you do or did, why did you do it, to not make money?

And what's your obsession with reference to disabled and able-bodied, being disabled isn't a prerequisite to sell lottery tickets.

Edited March 21, 2015 by Sviss Geez

[Sviss Geez]

scrap the whole system and go digital like the real world. This set up is a scam. sell digital tickets from convenience stores etc. and take the corruption out of the system instantly.

Another one who won't be able to explain why the lottery is a scam.

[Pib]

This is not the first time the govt has tried to automate lottery tickets via selling them at stores...each and every time the outcry from the current lottery vendors, be them-able bodied or disabled like the OP describes, resulted in the govt back-tracking, trying to save face, and then letting things continue on as is. There will probably be a "ditto" to this most recent govt effort.

[Sviss Geez]

This is the land of scams, where nearly everything seems to be a cheat.

I will assume the same for the lottery here. Am amazed that anyone

buys a ticket.....

A lottery was fixed in America. Insider people injected white paint

in the flying lottery balls making some of them a bit heavier.

They then placed bets on combinations of the lighter non

injected balls. Now if they could try to get away with that in America,

what in god's name do you think is going on here??

The reason people buy tickets, surprise, surprise, is because people win prizes. I know a number of people who have won prizes, including myself on one occasion.

"Now if they could try to get away with that in America, what in god's name do you think is going on here??"

What does that nonsense mean?

[Anthony5]

The problem is greed pure and simple.

Greed, in Thailand? You must be misinformed.

[Stan42]

I am convinced that the real culprit behind all of this is the mega empire known as 7-11.

[JOC]

This is the land of scams, where nearly everything seems to be a cheat.

I will assume the same for the lottery here. Am amazed that anyone

buys a ticket.....

A lottery was fixed in America. Insider people injected white paint

in the flying lottery balls making some of them a bit heavier.

They then placed bets on combinations of the lighter non

injected balls. Now if they could try to get away with that in America,

what in god's name do you think is going on here??

The reason people buy tickets, surprise, surprise, is because people win prizes. I know a number of people who have won prizes, including myself on one occasion.

"Now if they could try to get away with that in America, what in god's name do you think is going on here??"

What does that nonsense mean?

Mr. Sviss Geez.

Have you ever considered replying to the topic on hand instead of your endless attacks on other posters?

[JOC]

I am convinced that the real culprit behind all of this is the mega empire known as 7-11.

So it is the pesky capitalists from CP-All (owner of 7-11 Thailand) who are behind the overpricing +50% done by the lottery vendors from Loei??

Makes sense.............................

[kurce]

Thai lottery in a nutshell....

Each unit sold consists of 1 million tickets @ 40 baht. Each unit offers 14,168 prizes totaling 23 million baht.

In addition to this there are 2 bonuses prizes on the 1st prize 6 digit number based on unit sales between 01 - 30 and 51 - 70. You need to have both the 6 digit number and the 2 digit unit number. Last draw these were 30 million baht and 22 million baht respectively.

So if 50 million tickets (50 units) are sold each draw at a wholesale price of (just a guess) 30 baht..... 350 million baht less the 2 bonus prizes and associated costs per draw.

Certainly is a nice revenue stream for the government.

BTW you have a 1.4168% chance of winning a prize

Cheers.

Edited March 21, 2015 by kurce

[Orac]

Simple solution to problem Register all vendors and issue permits to buy and sell lottery tickets directly from GLO. Dump middleman period. Then vendors can't say tickets cost to much and up the price. all unsold tickets returned To GLO get refund of costs. This way vendors don't need middleman for tickets. what they earn is based on commission from sales. IE: ticket face value 80 baht there costs 75 baht so 5 baht profit per ticket. If caught selling over face value loss of permit and can't apply for new permit for 2 years.plus 10,000 baht fine, also when selling tickets must display permit with there picture on it.

The problem with refunding money on unsold tickets would be that only losing tickets would be cashed back in. Imagine the value of one of these permits if it allowed you to get a large number of tickets and then claim refunds on the losing tickets after the draw while claiming prizes on winning tickets. It would be very difficult to refund costs on unsold tickets before the draw took place.

Please explain.

You either bring the lottery ticket back to the GLO office and get your money back, or you don't bring it back before the draw and you don't get your money back.

Where exactly is it becoming very difficult?

The lottery ticket sellers are suppose to be disabled though, as we all know, a lot of them are not. For them to return tickets before the draw takes place would involve thousands of them turning up at the GLO office just before the draw which would be a logistical nightmare. Even if they set up loads satellite GLO offices all over the country it would still be hugely difficult to administer and the potential for fraud would be massive.

[digibum]

Dear lottery-vendors.

Maybe it is time to get a real job??

Most of the vendors are able bodied people between 25 and 45!!

Selling lottery tickets is a real job for them. What would you, in your infinite wisdom, suggest they do as an alternative?

You are aware that Thailand operates at full employment, no? Actually having labor freed up from jobs like this would create some slack in the job market.

One of Thailand's problem is the whole full employment target they set. If everyone has a job, no matter how low paying or how trivial, everyone is somewhat happy. That means that 5 people have to be involved in checking you out at the department store or that it takes three security guards to man the gate in front of my apartment.

Full employment means low wages for everyone. If you keep the cost of labor down low enough businesses will over hire because they can afford to. As long as all of the jobs require no skills, the cost is basically minimum wage (if that in some cases). And minimum wage is kept low enough so that businesses can absorb all of the excess labor.

It would be much better if Thailand actually had some unemployment because then it would increase competition for jobs. That would mean people would actually learn a trade rather than bouncing around from one unskilled labor job to the next. And once you put pressure on wages, people earn more, and you increase domestic spending which lowers your dependence on exports, which typically produce lots of low paying jobs.

Other countries have gone through the same cycle but Thailand, in terms of GDP, is probably one of the most prosperous countries that has yet to shift from an export economy to more of a domestic demand economy.

[MaiChai]

I think the answer is: nothing stays the same forever. Technology can make it much more convenient for people. More convenient means more tickets can be sold. How about the government having multiple lottery games, rather than just one? Also the ability to buy tickets online? Lots of scope to improve the Thai lottery and yet the ticket vendors will hold it back?

[djjamie]

This is the land of scams, where nearly everything seems to be a cheat.

I will assume the same for the lottery here. Am amazed that anyone

buys a ticket.....

A lottery was fixed in America. Insider people injected white paint

in the flying lottery balls making some of them a bit heavier.

They then placed bets on combinations of the lighter non

injected balls. Now if they could try to get away with that in America,

what in god's name do you think is going on here??

The reason people buy tickets, surprise, surprise, is because people win prizes. I know a number of people who have won prizes, including myself on one occasion.

"Now if they could try to get away with that in America, what in god's name do you think is going on here??"

What does that nonsense mean?

Mr. Sviss Geez.

Have you ever considered replying to the topic on hand instead of your endless attacks on other posters?

WOW.

Do you even remember what you said to me yesterday and today?

HINT…..It was an attack of a poster…That poster being me.

You truly represent a UDD supporter…..

[Briggsy]

So Thai,

On the one hand, ranks of unskilled, overpaid vendors trying to bully the government to remain using an antiquated early 20th century system.

On the other, corrupt, unelected military families trying to scheme a way of wrenching vast lottery profits off a few families that remain entrenched at the top of the selling pyramid.

Under all, a brainless populace that continues to buy tickets way over face value in a lottery that pays way under the international average and is fixed as well.

There is no hope.

[jacko45k]

Nah, sorry guys.

I still like the sound of buying them for 80 baht from the 7-11, rather than have you tap me on the shoulder as my Tom Yam is half way between bowl and my mouth at the restaurant.

After all, won't this be ultimately better for the customers, and likely increase sales?

[Pib]

You are aware that Thailand operates at full employment, no? Actually having labor freed up from jobs like this would create some slack in the job market.

One of Thailand's problem is the whole full employment target they set. If everyone has a job, no matter how low paying or how trivial, everyone is somewhat happy. That means that 5 people have to be involved in checking you out at the department store or that it takes three security guards to man the gate in front of my apartment.

Full employment means low wages for everyone. If you keep the cost of labor down low enough businesses will over hire because they can afford to. As long as all of the jobs require no skills, the cost is basically minimum wage (if that in some cases). And minimum wage is kept low enough so that businesses can absorb all of the excess labor.

It would be much better if Thailand actually had some unemployment because then it would increase competition for jobs. That would mean people would actually learn a trade rather than bouncing around from one unskilled labor job to the next. And once you put pressure on wages, people earn more, and you increase domestic spending which lowers your dependence on exports, which typically produce lots of low paying jobs.

Other countries have gone through the same cycle but Thailand, in terms of GDP, is probably one of the most prosperous countries that has yet to shift from an export economy to more of a domestic demand economy.

Just to add to above, full employment (less than 1% according to govt stats) in Thailand is really because of the huge number of people working in the informal workforce...that is, they work for themselves selling from noodles carts, vegetable/fish/etc at markets, able-bodied or disabled folks selling lottery tickets, temporary/odd jobs day laborers, etc., because they can't find a job anywhere else.

The informal workforce is very large in Thailand because Thailand don't have enough good paying white or blue collar jobs. If/when those folks who currently sell lottery tickets are put out of business because lottery ticket machines in convenience stores those folks will just try to find another informal workforce job somewhere--maybe selling noodles from a cart...or small stuff along the soi sidewalk. Or they will slip back into the big pool of folks who have just given up trying to find a job.

Easy for the govt to brag full employment when the informal work sector keeps people from going to the local labor office to sign-up as unemployed, looking for a job, etc.

[EyesWideOpen]

This is the land of scams, where nearly everything seems to be a cheat.

I will assume the same for the lottery here. Am amazed that anyone

buys a ticket.....

A lottery was fixed in America. Insider people injected white paint

in the flying lottery balls making some of them a bit heavier.

They then placed bets on combinations of the lighter non

injected balls. Now if they could try to get away with that in America,

what in god's name do you think is going on here??

The reason people buy tickets, surprise, surprise, is because people win prizes. I know a number of people who have won prizes, including myself on one occasion.

"Now if they could try to get away with that in America, what in god's name do you think is going on here??"

What does that nonsense mean?

Mr. Sviss Geez.

Have you ever considered replying to the topic on hand instead of your endless attacks on other posters?

Haha Joc, that felt more like a tap on my shoulder with a feather instead of an attack... :-)

So no need for me to unleash the dogs of war upon him. Can see now why he has such a poor reputation on TV. State intelligent positions here, or refute positions of others.

Although he does look a bit silly claiming he won a prize, when a farang cannot win on a lottery ticket. Unless.......he cheated the system and had his Thai wife / significant other pick up his winnings.

Edited March 22, 2015 by EyesWideOpen

[96tehtarp]

Political rallies are currently forbidden in Thailand, under martial law. I believe threatening to hold a political rally is also forbidden.

[Freed1948]

^^^^ 2 above

That's not true.

I've won multi last 2 and last 3 numbers.

On one occasion I collected 80,00 baht on a ticket at the Government Lottery Office.

All done with only having to present the ticket and my Passport.

Edited March 22, 2015 by Freed1948

[96tehtarp]

^^^^ 2 above

That's not true.

I've won multi last 2 and last 3 numbers.

On one occasion I collected 80,00 baht on a ticket at the Government Lottery Office.

All done with only having to present the ticket and my Passport.

I'm glad to hear you won. However, this is the reality for most lottery gamblers.

[ttthailand]

The problem is greed pure and simple.

I agree 100%. Between the middleman and the seller they are splitting 20 to 40 baht depending on location. They should sell for 80 baht !!! Totally broken system just like everything else in this country.

[Benmart]

This lottery should have been outlawed, Another goverment scam.

While at it, outlaw sugary soft drinks, salted snack foods, deep fried meats, sunglasses, flip-flops, extra-marital affairs, blowing one's nose in public, etc. LOL.

No one is forced to buy lottery tickets and those that do, do so without my nose in their business.

[digibum]

Easy for the govt to brag full employment when the informal work sector keeps people from going to the local labor office to sign-up as unemployed, looking for a job, etc.

The main goal of full employment is to prevent an overthrow of the existing power structure.

The reality is that having people walk around selling lottery tickets is both inefficient and silly in today's age. They could put all of this stuff online (and available via apps) and cut out 7-11 if they wanted to (but they won't because preying on those too poor to afford smartphones or the internet is the goal of lotteries). Instead, it's all done manually, at a higher cost, just so the government can keep enough people making just enough money that they don't start rioting in the streets or demanding real jobs.

Thailand has been forced into a very uncomfortable situation in the last few decades. As the world evolves around Thailand they're forced to either keep up or fall behind. Keeping up involves making changes that expose some uncomfortable truths. Thailand simply can't afford to remain an export based economy. They need to stimulate domestic demand and the only way to do that is to raise the standard of living of everyone.

Unfortunately, Thailand's answer was to raise domestic demand without a corresponding increase in wages. In the last five years, debt to GDP has risen from 60% to 85%. And that's just the official debt ratio. When you factor in loan sharks, I don't think it's unreasonable to estimate a debt to GDP ratio of over 100% of GDP.

In other words, when the government loosened up credit and encouraged people to buy houses and cars and whatever else they could, the benefits floated right up to the already wealthy. The 70% of the population that is self-employed (i.e. working in informal work sector) didn't see any of the benefits. Sure, you can raise the minimum wage to 300 baht per day but that really only applies to the 30% of the work sector that has an employer. And it was a rather modest increase anyway. Certainly not enough to put anyone on a path to the middle-class.

Sadly, they may not turn the corner soon enough. Many economists (outside of Thailand, obviously) are already warning that Thailand is headed into a deflationary period.

Analysts are less sanguine. After the data, ANZ published a note titled `Thailand: The return of deflation', and said there is a significant risk that the inflation rate will breach the lower end of the central bank's target of 1%. Barclays estimates inflation is likely to remain negative for much of the first half, and lowered its 2015 average forecast to 0.2%. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-02-04/it-isn-t-deflation-until-we-say-so

Thailand needs to scrap the fully employed model and carefully begin moving people from the informal labor force to the regular labor force where they can create upward wage pressure. Yes, that will mean that people will actually unemployed but instead of the government buying submarines and financing trains from China they need to start building up some real social services to help people.

The other upside of doing this is that children will now have an incentive to actually pay attention in school. If there's actual competition for jobs and they pay well, parents are more likely to encourage their children to get a good education. Right now, there's no point. The wealthy are assured jobs and the poor are most likely going to end up in the informal economy where education isn't a requirement.

That's a model where everyone wins . . . except the current power structure who would have to quit choking the goose laying the golden eggs.

[digibum]

This lottery should have been outlawed, Another goverment scam.

While at it, outlaw sugary soft drinks, salted snack foods, deep fried meats, sunglasses, flip-flops, extra-marital affairs, blowing one's nose in public, etc. LOL.

No one is forced to buy lottery tickets and those that do, do so without my nose in their business.

I'm the last person to advocate a nanny state but lotteries do prey on the poorest people in all societies. Everywhere lotteries exist, the vast majority of the buyers of tickets are people who can least afford to.

In the US, the only way they got them past the public was to claim that the money would go for education or other worthy causes. But as soon as the state got the money, they cut the budgets for education essentially finding a way to rob Peter to pay Paul. Less money ended up going to schools and the government just sucked in more cash from the poorest segment of the population.

And, I'm not an anti-gambling person either. If you can afford it, go for it. I was actually very intrigued by Samak's proposal to build casino resorts in Thailand if they could find a way to keep locals from losing their paychecks there.

[mikiea]

So revolution comes from an unexpected corner!

lol

evolution is at work here . the vendors have scammed their way into a lose/lose point of no return .....pity the poor grand-moms , they will have to return to the food stalls for 12 hour shifts again . their slacker sons & gran sons can resume protesting the loss of of jobs . huh...... not their jobs , but grannies job . what a fine bunch they are .

[recycled]

Yeah! you tell those insignificant little sons and daughters of bitches Mr PM that they can't tell you what to do, who do they think they are anyway, closet media. You tell them if they don't do as you say you will ban all lotteries in Thailand. That will show them. Sorry, what was that General? Oh! they don't need to worry yet, it still in the draft stage and you will let them know as soon as have have passed the law; you know like we are doing with all the other non important stuff like the Charter. But isn't it a bit late PM? Why all the questions farang, I feel like punching you.