Thai generals push for 'golden era' when elite held sway

[ourmanflint]

If the uneducated sit back and allow the educated to continue to rule them, then this is exactly what they deserve.

You get the government you deserve. If they don't like it, they can change it.

FTFY!

[Benmart]

I prefer to keep my own house in order and let Thais take care of a Thai matter.

[chainarong]

I have said it before and I will say it again , this junta are making up for lost time, anyone say's differently certainly do not know the Generals and Elite of Thailand , are dangerous times in store for Thailand, possibly as soon as the population pull their fingers out scratch their groins and realize all that was achieved all those years ago by the students was all in vain , once again they have been taken for a ride, the question is, will the students have the stomach to take on such a task again , I think not , Thai students are like everywhere else , soft in the belly.

[fatjack]

I prefer to keep my own house in order and let Thais take care of a Thai matter.

This philosophy worked wonders in the 1930's, Hitler certainly appreciated it.

[Eric Loh]

I've repeatedly argued on this forum over the last 10 years that Thailand should follow Singaporean example rather than the Western one. A healthy democracy in a complex society requires informed and engaged citizenry (US presents a good example what happens in a democracy when the majority of the electorate stop participating or caring). Otherwise the democratic ritual is all too easy to hijack with enough money and propaganda. Shinawatras have demonstrated that splendidly.

At this point in its history Thailand needs an enlightened dictatorship that installs a government of technocrats who are charged to execute a difficult long term strategy to bring the country out of the third world status.

Here's a quote from Wikipedia's history of Singapore:

"Facing severe unemployment and a housing crisis, Singapore embarked on a modernization programme beginning in the late 1960s through the 1970s that focused on establishing a manufacturing industry, developing large public housing estates and investing heavily on public education. Since independence, Singapore's economy has grown by an average of nine percent each year.[clarification needed] By the 1990s, the country had become one of the world's most prosperous nations, with a highly developed free market economy, strong international trading links, and the highest per capita gross domestic product in Asia outside of Japan.

After gaining independence abruptly, Singapore faced a future filled with uncertainties. The Konfrontasi was on-going and the conservative UMNO faction strongly opposed the separation; Singapore faced the dangers of attack by the Indonesian military and forcible re-integration into the Malaysia Federation on unfavorable terms. Much of the international media was skeptical of prospects for Singapore's survival. Besides the issue of sovereignty, the pressing problems were unemployment, housing, education, and the lack of natural resources and land.[53] Unemployment was ranging between 1012%, threatening to trigger civil unrest.

The Economic Development Board had been set up in 1961 to formulate and implement national economic strategies, focusing on promoting Singapore's manufacturing sector.[56] Industrial estates were set up, especially in Jurong, and foreign investment was attracted to the country with tax incentives. The industrialization transformed the manufacturing sector to one that produced higher value-added goods and achieved greater revenue. The service industry also grew at this time, driven by demand for services by ships calling at the port and increasing commerce. This progress helped to alleviate the unemployment crisis. Singapore also attracted big oil companies like Shell and Esso to establish oil refineries in Singapore which, by the mid-1970s, became the third largest oil-refining centre in the world.[53] The government invested heavily in an education system that adopted English as the language of instruction and emphasised practical training to develop a competent workforce well suited for the industry."

This is very recent history and sounds a lot worse than the current situation in Thailand. But look where they are right now. Singapore's success required a long term vision and discipline to pursue that vision over decades. Lee Kuan Yew and his PAP party created a de-facto single party system which alowed them to focus on the big picture rather than being distracted by political pandering and self-defeating populism. Industrialization, infrastructure, education, housing, foreign investment, rule of law all have been accomplished since 1965.

Of course Singapore is a much smaller place, on the other hand Thailand has abundance of natural resources, pretty good infrastructure, and many other advantages. More importantly Thai nationalism runs strong at all levels of Thai society. This is a perfect lever to create public commitment to the grand vision that the government should create and execute. It is doable with enough will and foresight. Whether the generals have either is much more important for the future of the country.

Good post. Just want to add that while Lee Kuan Yew was indeed a great leader, we must not forget that he had equally very capable ministers that collectively turned Singapore to what it is today. No one leader can lead a nation. He must have good men around him that can contribute. Lesson for Prayuth. Two outstanding ministers of the early era was deputy PM Toh Chin Chye and Finance Minister Goh Keng Swee, the architect of Singapore economic success.

Another point of importance is that for any leader to be successful, he must have the people behind him. Lee's party PAP was a novice back in 1959 but he sold his policies and campaigned for the people to trust him as their leader. He won by a landslide and kept his promises to the people with his policies and successes. Without the people's mandate, he will not be successful in turning Singapore around. Another lesson for Prayuth.

[DaveinAsia]

Democracy in Thailand? Never had it, never will!

It doesn't exist anywhere. What we have 'back home' can hardly be called democracy. Being allowed to cast one's vote means absolutely nothing when the choice that we have is to find the lesser of 2 or 3 evils. Once they are voted in they don't give a rats backside about the electorate. It's all a sham and anyone who is awake will have to agree. Elections/democracy were actually invented to keep the masses quiet. Give them the feeling that they can choose and that they have freedom and they will be easier to control. The only system that would make any sense and that we could actually call democratic would be a direct democracy, where people can vote for all new policies/laws/etc

[MrWorldwide]

I had begun to wonder if writers working in Thailand were permitted to name 'the other General', and arguably one of the most powerful men in Thailand regardless of who is running the country at any given time. That's the news article I want to read, not something about amendments to the constitution. Whatever the written laws here, it all comes down to enforcement and then its a case of 'he who has the biggest gun wins', as evidenced by regular military coups over the last 50 or so years, but the Council has a superpower that still trumps any weapons cache in Thailand.

[fgmr]

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I'm guessing that the PM is not planning a trip to the USA or Europe any time soon. He can visit his intellectual brother in Zimbabwe, better hurry up as he is on borrowed time.

The "intellectual brother" has been on borrowed time for the last 20 years, Long enough to give anyone heart.

[AZBill]

So much for democracy! I'd say nice try Thailand but it wasn't. Back to the tribal days.

[paymaster]

What a story the writer has concocted. Surely the "appointment" of the senate needs a little more explanation than the one line the writer has graced us with. Under what structure can the "ruling elite" make these appointments to the entire Senate? Did the writer mean to say a part elected and part appointed Senate? There is a sensationalism to this story that seems to avoid the whole truth.

[soalbundy]

Democracy in Thailand? Never had it, never will!

It doesn't exist anywhere. What we have 'back home' can hardly be called democracy. Being allowed to cast one's vote means absolutely nothing when the choice that we have is to find the lesser of 2 or 3 evils. Once they are voted in they don't give a rats backside about the electorate. It's all a sham and anyone who is awake will have to agree. Elections/democracy were actually invented to keep the masses quiet. Give them the feeling that they can choose and that they have freedom and they will be easier to control. The only system that would make any sense and that we could actually call democratic would be a direct democracy, where people can vote for all new policies/laws/etc

I agree, as someone once said ''If voting could change anything they would make it illegal''

[Johnny S]

A new Thai constitution being drafted by the ruling junta is a throwback to an era when a royalist and military elite had a stranglehold on politics, analysts and politicians say, warning of dire consequences for democracy.

To all the junta lovers/ anti election posters here, please read the above twice and reconsider your support to the Thai elite!!

Your are supporting people and a system belonging in a long gone century!!

And cut your "but Yingluck" BS.

but Yingluck.......................

What democracy are you referring to JOC?

Democracy never existed in Thailand and I very much doubt that it will ever exist.

At least an effort is being made now to bring Thailand to a more civilized world with less corruption and better police force.

Ideals are for the masses, reality and common sense applies more to the right thinking person.

A more civilised Thailand with less corruption and a better police force ?

Ah yes, that would be the other Thailand, you know the one in the parallel universe.

Others might call that alternate Thailand ....Vietnam

Costas, what makes you believe Democracy never existed in Thailand? The 65,000,000 voters might disagree with you.

Democracy according to the disgruntled farangs never existed, because their views of democracy was different to what Thais see as democracy.

If Thailand is such a basket case, why are you living here?

65,000,000 voters .... really ? Dont think children have right to vote

[monkeycountry]

A new Thai constitution being drafted by the ruling junta is a throwback to an era when a royalist and military elite had a stranglehold on politics, analysts and politicians say, warning of dire consequences for democracy.

To all the junta lovers/ anti election posters here, please read the above twice and reconsider your support to the Thai elite!!

Your are supporting people and a system belonging in a long gone century!!

And cut your "but Yingluck" BS.

Democracy is not a goal in itself, and in a country where most politicians are corrupt criminals and many if not most of the voters are like children, democracy may not be the best form of government yet.

[city]

When the constitution is signed.

The real changes will begin.

Mark my words.

The real sh1t will hit the fan

[soalbundy]

When the constitution is signed.

The real changes will begin.

Mark my words.

The real sh1t will hit the fan

Get in the beer and crisps, i'm here to see the walloping,not take part in it.

[city]

I have said this from the very beginning.

This always was a reactionary move by the elite to grab back power from the people.

They live in another world.

They couldn't care a sh#t about the Thai people.

The greedy avaricious elite.

They believe they were born to rule.

As we all know, these types of government systems always end up with a violent revolution against them.

And so it will come here too.

I am glad, but do not want, the fact that this period of Thai 'not so glorious; history will end in bloodshed. I really feel that if we had, just one protest, similar to the events in Tunisia then the Asia Spring would be upon us. Any volunteers for immolation

[city]

If the peasants sit back and allow the elite to continue to rule them, then this is exactly what they deserve.

You get the government you deserve. If they don't like it, they can change it.

Summed it up. The thais have to grow a pair and stop accepting their lot. It will come to that but I fear there is a lot of growing to do before they reach flashpoint

[lapd]

So many whiners here. Really unbelievable that someone would choose to move to another country and then sit in front of their computers in their concrete box whining about it.

Really ruins this board imho. There is nothing of value that these serial whiners contribute to the discussion.

[bkkcanuck8]

A new Thai constitution being drafted by the ruling junta is a throwback to an era when a royalist and military elite had a stranglehold on politics, analysts and politicians say, warning of dire consequences for democracy.

To all the junta lovers/ anti election posters here, please read the above twice and reconsider your support to the Thai elite!!

Your are supporting people and a system belonging in a long gone century!!

And cut your "but Yingluck" BS.

Democracy is not a goal in itself, and in a country where most politicians are corrupt criminals and many if not most of the voters are like children, democracy may not be the best form of government yet.

Politicians are not the only corrupt criminals. The two professions that are preferred for girls to marry are police and military - because that is where the money is. The money is there because of corruption.

It is extremely rare to have rule of law in any country other than in democratic countries.... Why? Because people above the law are not beholden to the law..... This is the direction that Thailand seems to be going. For most of the last century the military has been above the law. The elite in Thailand are above the law -- as demonstrated over and over again where people or their children have a get out of jail free card -- where criminal actions is swept away for those that are above the law. When all people are not subject to the law equally, it creates divisions within the society.

Democracy did not make the country corrupt -- it existed long before any democratic government and is a byproduct of an older feudal system... a system that it seems is viewed as the golden era. So the view is that democracy is not the best form of government because of corruption, and Thailand has to be moved back to a golden era which is where corruption originates, so that it can be managed into a non-corrupt nation by those know better....

Does someone else not see the flaw in this logic?

Edited March 29, 2015 by bkkcanuck8

[think twice act once]

Please guys get your heads out of the clouds!! Who are we as westerners to tell the east how to do things?? Have any of you been in the villagers in the north east when politicians go from house to house paying people for their votes? Democracy is good in theory but it has its limits. Sometimes a culture needs a more conservative leadership. Popularity votes opens doors to corruption. American policies and idealism haven't been working when pushed on other cultures.I think democracy even struggles in western countries.....any way just a thought

[soalbundy]

So many whiners here. Really unbelievable that someone would choose to move to another country and then sit in front of their computers in their concrete box whining about it.

Really ruins this board imho. There is nothing of value that these serial whiners contribute to the discussion.

They are opinions from people who for the most part have lived here for many years and have financial and emotional stakes in this country but very little rights, no need for you to start whining about people making their opinions, formed by years of observation, known.

[soalbundy]

Please guys get your heads out of the clouds!! Who are we as westerners to tell the east how to do things?? Have any of you been in the villagers in the north east when politicians go from house to house paying people for their votes? Democracy is good in theory but it has its limits. Sometimes a culture needs a more conservative leadership. Popularity votes opens doors to corruption. American policies and idealism haven't been working when pushed on other cultures.I think democracy even struggles in western countries.....any way just a thought

We don't tell anybody what to do because we don't have the right to do so but we may express our thoughts on certain matters amongst ourselves. I live in a village in the North-East. Politician don't come door to door paying for votes,that would be too obvious, the pay out is usually in the village square outside the shop, since they all pay out my wife collects from all the candidates and votes for who she wants to.

[think twice act once]

Mine too soulbundy

[kennw]

Think twice act once is correct about vote buying in the NE villages. Its is called "barkiing dog night"buy the villagers because of the strangers with clip boards and envelopes going from house to house. And yes they are warmly welcomed. Party policies ? forget it, what is the size of the envelope?

[kennw]

Think twice act once is correct about vote buying in the NE villages. Its is called "barkiing dog night"buy the villagers because of the strangers with clip boards and envelopes going from house to house. And yes they are warmly welcomed. Party policies ? forget it, what is the size of the envelope?

[think twice act once]

Exactly kennw

[heybruce]

Think twice act once is correct about vote buying in the NE villages. Its is called "barkiing dog night"buy the villagers because of the strangers with clip boards and envelopes going from house to house. And yes they are warmly welcomed. Party policies ? forget it, what is the size of the envelope?

No election in any country is perfect, but they don't have to be, they simply have to reflect the will of the majority. The 2011 election was monitored by ANFREL and the results declared legitimate. Only anti-democrats declare the junta legitimate.

[HappyinNE]

Clearly, this article was written by someone who does not understand Thailand.

Yes, in other countries water will always flow downhill.

But Thailand is special.

Is that why Bangkok never has enough water? It all flows from Bangkok to the north in the rainy season!

[Traveller45]

A loud and rousing YES BY ALL MEANS to that intention. And it would be even better if somebody could show me how we could introduce the same in EUROPE again. Democracy is nice when you come out of a HITLERite dictatorship, but it has only downs as compared to a traditional structure of elders and land owners such as it was, for example, in historic GREECE (not todays'), in ROME and other such places, extremely performant in their days, not to forget ENGLAND...

[peecee]

The elite always yearn for the old establishment. I'm sure King John felt outraged when the barons imposed Magna Carta on him in 1215, he was certainly very quick to run to the Pope for an annulment! However political power had started to run down towards the populace.

Move on another 500yrs and in England only landowners could vote and power passed down through their eldest son. Wages were breadline, workers were abused and their health care was an irrelevance.

Another hundred years saw the emergence among much bloodshed of trade unions and the vote trickled down to most men. Kick on another hundred and women started to have a political voice.

The result of all this "progress" is the elite no longer oppress the people; who have proper health care and a minimum wage. The Union (of GB) in my opinion still has to move towards a living wage but when I look at Thailand and how it is governed I'm glad we don't have a "King John" anymore, I just hope it doesn't take Thailand another 800yrs to see the light!