SURVEY: Should Foreigners be Allowed to own Property?

[impulse]

The same law as for Thai who buy an apartment a house or land in Europe England or USA etc .....

Just reciprocity no more not less.

The problem with "reciprocity" is that Thailand does not have a real estate tax.

A Thai can buy properties back home, but that means they have to pay real estate taxes every year.

If I were able to buy a property in Thailand, I don't have to pay real estate taxes.

Be careful what you wish for. True "reciprocity" can't happen until Thailand implements real estate taxes. And what a can of worms that will open.

If they did impose real estate taxes, think of the effect on millions of Thais that are barely scraping by. And all the squealing from the expats here whose wives own their land, and now they suddenly have to pay a tax they didn't have to pay last year.

Or, they can charge real estate taxes only on foreigners, but I can only imagine the squealing that would cause.

Reciprocity sounds great, but it's not that simple.

Edited May 18, 2015 by impulse

[jdinasia]

My wife owns 3 investment properties in Australia 100% and not 49% (land and buildings) but I am forbidden from investing in Thailand. There should be laws that if a farang is banned in Thailand then Thais should be banned overseas. Won't happen tho as other countries welcome foreign investment no matter how small.

You can enter Thailand without a visa. Thais cannot enter Australia without a visa.

Different countries.

[ThaiUser]

Foreigners should be allowed to own property in Thailand.

What property do you think foreigners cannot own?

House, no problem.

Condo, no problem (not more than 49% foreign ownership in the building allowing)

When somebody builds a house, they can own it themselves 100%.

The law as it stays at the moment disadvantages foreigners and gives us Thais more rights and that is the problem. A condo or apartment (an expression for it) is not really the same like owing land and being in control of it.

If you build a house and are married and that relationship turns bad look at the legal process and see what happens to your property rights you think you might have. It happened to a friend of my husband that thought he owned the house he did build.

Certainly there needs to be a link between owing property and the visa status of people (permanent resident visa) that would ensure they are treated by the law as if they were Thai citizens.

[Beetlejuice]

My wife owns 3 investment properties in Australia 100% and not 49% (land and buildings) but I am forbidden from investing in Thailand. There should be laws that if a farang is banned in Thailand then Thais should be banned overseas. Won't happen tho as other countries welcome foreign investment no matter how small.

Total nonsense. I will try to explain in ways that even you may understand.

Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses and in fact the BOI encourages foreign investment into the country, only they insist that foreign investors are required to fit a certain criteria and invest a substantial amount that sways the benefits in favour of the Thai people.

Thailand is not interested in farangs of little wealth buying and solely owning real estate at bargain prices (if compared to the equivalent in their home countries) that are of no benefit to the country whatsoever. Permitting farangs to freely own land and real estate in Thailand would be a disaster for the country. It would encourage land and property speculators, dodgy company ownerships, land wars, marriages of convenience and group buying in order to get into the property markets and the mass buying of land in the poorer regions that would have the affect of increasing land prices substantially whereas the working class Thais would not be able to compete. Then it would involve the purchasing of agricultural lands and evolving into the ownerships of whole land and housing developments, the list goes on and on.

We cannot equate the social and economic structure of Thailand with that of the west and therefore Thailand must place limits with conditions on what foreigners may own in Thailand for reasons I have mentioned above.

[Jimbo1964]

Thai's are allowed to buy property, land and 100% ownership of businesses without restriction. Therefore if Thai's can do it in other countries then foreigners should be allowed the same rights in Thailand.

[simon43]

Here if you lease the land for 50 years you must re-register your lease every three years , or the Thai owner you leased it from can sell it.

That is not correct.

- The maximum land lease term (for Thais and non-Thais) is 30 years, (with some rare exceptions AFAIK for industrial land ==> 50 years).

- If the original lease is correctly registered at the land office, then no re-register is required.

Your friend needs to check if he correctly registred his lease at the start

[steve73]

All very well being able to own the house, but of little real security if you cannot own (or at least in some way control) the land it sits on.

I think this rather archaic "split-deal" stems from the fact that so many of the traditional houses were constructed of wood and could relatively easily be dismantled and moved. Not a good idea to try this if you have a modern concrete construction....!

Although I voted for #4, I'm actually rasonably happy with the status quo, and a 30 (+30) year lease suits me fine... gives me the security I need now, yet allows "Thailand" to reacquire its value when I no longer have any need of anything... And in the meantime, I'd be happy to have any remaining lease term bought out if the price were right.

[DLang]

Perhaps a single family home if lived in by the owner. No investment or commercial property.

Agree...Thats all thats needed, for retirement or to provide for the wife...

So why not buy one?

You can own it yourself 100%.

[angiolo]

Well , of course you could buy one in G/f name . Only she will dump you and have a free house. I rent rent No problem no worries no need to buy keep my money in my bank . Can do a runner if I get in trouble here . Buying in this problem country is sheer madness ..D o not consider it

No stress no bother you are in charge of your destiny not a Thai person.

[DavisH]

Chinese Thai bought it all already.............

What's worse is that they don't even realise it The most vehement Thai opposers to foreign ownership are...you guessed it...Chinese Thais!

[DLang]

Well , of course you could buy one in G/f name .

No, you can buy one in your name.... You don't even need a GF.

This massive myth that you are not allowed to own a house here really is bizarrely ingrained.

Rent land on 30 year lease.

Have a prefabricated house or lovely wooden one built to your liking, the older style wooden ones are lovely. You own it 100%, nobody else. If you ever want to move it, it is not difficult to do and many of the companies list this on their sales info, something like 20% of the cost of the house to move it at a future date if you wish.

Or build a typical Western style house that you own 100%, but is a bit more difficult to move should you wish.

People really need to stop listening to barstools and bargirls.

Edited May 18, 2015 by DLang

[ThaiUser]

My wife owns 3 investment properties in Australia 100% and not 49% (land and buildings) but I am forbidden from investing in Thailand. There should be laws that if a farang is banned in Thailand then Thais should be banned overseas. Won't happen tho as other countries welcome foreign investment no matter how small.

Total nonsense. I will try to explain in ways that even you may understand.

Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses and in fact the BOI encourages foreign investment into the country, only they insist that foreign investors are required to fit a certain criteria and invest a substantial amount that sways the benefits in favour of the Thai people.

Thailand is not interested in farangs of little wealth buying and solely owning real estate at bargain prices (if compared to the equivalent in their home countries) that are of no benefit to the country whatsoever. Permitting farangs to freely own land and real estate in Thailand would be a disaster for the country. It would encourage land and property speculators, dodgy company ownerships, land wars, marriages of convenience and group buying in order to get into the property markets and the mass buying of land in the poorer regions that would have the affect of increasing land prices substantially whereas the working class Thais would not be able to compete. Then it would involve the purchasing of agricultural lands and evolving into the ownerships of whole land and housing developments, the list goes on and on.

We cannot equate the social and economic structure of Thailand with that of the west and therefore Thailand must place limits with conditions on what foreigners may own in Thailand for reasons I have mentioned above.

Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses and in fact the BOI encourages foreign investment into the country, only they insist that foreign investors are required to fit a certain criteria and invest a substantial amount that sways the benefits in favour of the Thai people.

Is that not a contradiction to apply certain criteria to foreigners that are not applied if you are Thai when looking at the first part of your sentence that states that “Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses”?

[Beetlejuice]

My wife owns 3 investment properties in Australia 100% and not 49% (land and buildings) but I am forbidden from investing in Thailand. There should be laws that if a farang is banned in Thailand then Thais should be banned overseas. Won't happen tho as other countries welcome foreign investment no matter how small.

Total nonsense. I will try to explain in ways that even you may understand.

Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses and in fact the BOI encourages foreign investment into the country, only they insist that foreign investors are required to fit a certain criteria and invest a substantial amount that sways the benefits in favour of the Thai people.

Thailand is not interested in farangs of little wealth buying and solely owning real estate at bargain prices (if compared to the equivalent in their home countries) that are of no benefit to the country whatsoever. Permitting farangs to freely own land and real estate in Thailand would be a disaster for the country. It would encourage land and property speculators, dodgy company ownerships, land wars, marriages of convenience and group buying in order to get into the property markets and the mass buying of land in the poorer regions that would have the affect of increasing land prices substantially whereas the working class Thais would not be able to compete. Then it would involve the purchasing of agricultural lands and evolving into the ownerships of whole land and housing developments, the list goes on and on.

We cannot equate the social and economic structure of Thailand with that of the west and therefore Thailand must place limits with conditions on what foreigners may own in Thailand for reasons I have mentioned above.

Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses and in fact the BOI encourages foreign investment into the country, only they insist that foreign investors are required to fit a certain criteria and invest a substantial amount that sways the benefits in favour of the Thai people.

Is that not a contradiction to apply certain criteria to foreigners that are not applied if you are Thai when looking at the first part of your sentence that states that “Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses”?

Can`t be bothered. NEXT.

[DLang]

Chinese Thai bought it all already.............

What's worse is that they don't even realise it The most vehement Thai opposers to foreign ownership are...you guessed it...Chinese Thais!

Well the largest land owner in Thailand was born in America and grew up in Europe.

[ThaiUser]

My wife owns 3 investment properties in Australia 100% and not 49% (land and buildings) but I am forbidden from investing in Thailand. There should be laws that if a farang is banned in Thailand then Thais should be banned overseas. Won't happen tho as other countries welcome foreign investment no matter how small.

Total nonsense. I will try to explain in ways that even you may understand.

Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses and in fact the BOI encourages foreign investment into the country, only they insist that foreign investors are required to fit a certain criteria and invest a substantial amount that sways the benefits in favour of the Thai people.

Thailand is not interested in farangs of little wealth buying and solely owning real estate at bargain prices (if compared to the equivalent in their home countries) that are of no benefit to the country whatsoever. Permitting farangs to freely own land and real estate in Thailand would be a disaster for the country. It would encourage land and property speculators, dodgy company ownerships, land wars, marriages of convenience and group buying in order to get into the property markets and the mass buying of land in the poorer regions that would have the affect of increasing land prices substantially whereas the working class Thais would not be able to compete. Then it would involve the purchasing of agricultural lands and evolving into the ownerships of whole land and housing developments, the list goes on and on.

We cannot equate the social and economic structure of Thailand with that of the west and therefore Thailand must place limits with conditions on what foreigners may own in Thailand for reasons I have mentioned above.

Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses and in fact the BOI encourages foreign investment into the country, only they insist that foreign investors are required to fit a certain criteria and invest a substantial amount that sways the benefits in favour of the Thai people.

Is that not a contradiction to apply certain criteria to foreigners that are not applied if you are Thai when looking at the first part of your sentence that states that “Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses”?

Can`t be bothered. NEXT.

I like your style – very convincing!

[micmichd]

Thai's are allowed to buy property, land and 100% ownership of businesses without restriction. Therefore if Thai's can do it in other countries then foreigners should be allowed the same rights in Thailand.

Do Farangs grant immigrants unlimited access to their labour markets?

Do Farangs grant Thais a one-month stay without a visa?

Not to mention all the other barriers that Farangs set up for Thais if they want to travel Europe (written invitation etc)

[Time Traveller]

Total nonsense. I will try to explain in ways that even you may understand.

Farangs are not forbidden from investing in Thailand, they can purchase land and real estate, buy stocks and shares, own businesses and in fact the BOI encourages foreign investment into the country, only they insist that foreign investors are required to fit a certain criteria and invest a substantial amount that sways the benefits in favour of the Thai people.

Thailand is not interested in farangs of little wealth buying and solely owning real estate at bargain prices (if compared to the equivalent in their home countries) that are of no benefit to the country whatsoever. Permitting farangs to freely own land and real estate in Thailand would be a disaster for the country. It would encourage land and property speculators, dodgy company ownerships, land wars, marriages of convenience and group buying in order to get into the property markets and the mass buying of land in the poorer regions that would have the affect of increasing land prices substantially whereas the working class Thais would not be able to compete. Then it would involve the purchasing of agricultural lands and evolving into the ownerships of whole land and housing developments, the list goes on and on.

That is the dumbest thing I've ever read. You want the poor land owning thais to stay poor because if their property rises in value. then other much poorer thais - who currently can't afford to buy land even at these low prices - won't be able to buy it a higher prices. (In case you don't comprehend how numbers work, if I can't afford to buy something costing $1million. What would I care if it cost $2million or $5million? It's still not afforrdable no matter how much more expensive it's priced at.)

In fact, the higher land prices would put more money into the pockets of thai people who could use that to start businesses that employ the poor landless thais. But this is part of the conspiracy of the ruling class, to keep the majority of the population poor. First step is to make them afraid, use the foreigners as scapegoats. Then the elite can rely on their indentured servitude.

But I don't really understand the rantings of the paranoid TV posters. Foreigners already are allowed to buy 1 rai of thai land under ministerial approval with the condition that they invest at least 40 million baht in Thailand.

Edited May 18, 2015 by Time Traveller

[Guest]

Well , of course you could buy one in G/f name . Only she will dump you and have a free house. I rent rent No problem no worries no need to buy keep my money in my bank . Can do a runner if I get in trouble here . Buying in this problem country is sheer madness ..D o not consider it

No stress no bother you are in charge of your destiny not a Thai person.

While you and I agree 100% that the freedom and lack of worry that comes with renting is a much better deal than buying .. that applies to ... everywhere .. and is not Thailand specific. This is a thread about owning land in Thailand, and you have erred .. since a foreigner CAN own a house or condo .. just not the land it is built upon.

I agree with you. sometimes I look up at those suit cases and just smile .. thinking, I can top them off, hail a cab, and later that day, be on a plane to "Next Adventure, Next Life"

Buy land and a house?? .. not you or me .. but for some folks .. that works. I understand they want to own the land .. but that is never going to happen in the Kingdom. Not now, not ever.

[Your Thainess]

Unfortunately for foreigners to openly own land you will have to change the national anthem as a section of it is rendered variously as saying:

Nation of the people; belonging to the Thais in every respect. Land of Thailand belongs to the Thais. Every inch of Thailand belongs to the Thais.

Many Thai people consider it is their nationalistic duty not to cede the land of Thailand either to foreign nations or to foreigners.

The main reason for not allowing foreign land ownership--and I agree with it--is that if it were possible, Thais wouldn't be able to restrain themselves from selling off every last square meter of the country. Some people just find cash irresistible.

[impulse]

In the past 20 years properties in Thailand have nearly doubled in cost. In some rural areas a rai of rice paddies is 1 million baht. Farmers would make more money using their land as a parking lot than growing rice.

Just a point of information, for a property to double in value in 20 years, all it has to do is appreciate at a 3.5% annual rate. (compounded annually)

So if the land hasn't been put to some economic use during those 20 years, it's not a great investment. Nor does it represent much of a benefit for the community.

[ronwparker]

yes

[Time Traveller]

In the past 20 years properties in Thailand have nearly doubled in cost. In some rural areas a rai of rice paddies is 1 million baht. Farmers would make more money using their land as a parking lot than growing rice.

Just a point of information, for a property to double in value in 20 years, all it has to do is appreciate at a 3.5% annual rate. (compounded annually)

So if the land hasn't been put to some economic use during those 20 years, it's not a great investment. Nor does it represent much of a benefit for the community.

Unfair. You're just using logic to prove that land has very little utility unless it's used for some kind of economic purpose.

No wonder the thais are afraid of foreigners.

[Unwisemonkey]

Allowing foreigners to have a true vested interest in the country can only be beneficial in the long run. The government will yield more in property taxes Thai's can demand better social welfare programs through that funding source, Infrastructure projects can be funded... the quality of life will go up over all. There are simply too many benefits that outweigh any nationalistic fears.

[Beetlejuice]

Unfortunately for foreigners to openly own land you will have to change the national anthem as a section of it is rendered variously as saying:

Nation of the people; belonging to the Thais in every respect. Land of Thailand belongs to the Thais. Every inch of Thailand belongs to the Thais.

Many Thai people consider it is their nationalistic duty not to cede the land of Thailand either to foreign nations or to foreigners.

The main reason for not allowing foreign land ownership--and I agree with it--is that if it were possible, Thais wouldn't be able to restrain themselves from selling off every last square meter of the country. Some people just find cash irresistible.

The most common sense post so far.

Going back two generations here in Thailand, Thais had no idea how much the value of land would appreciate in the future. When parents died and the land was inherited by their children and land values began to increase, many could not resist selling it, the take the money and run and why wait to see what happens tomorrow philosophy.

Of course this resulted in the younger generations of Thais having no legacy from their families, only the more savvy among them realised the potential of owning land especially in the inner city areas and are now sitting on a fortune,

[MikeTexas]

I'm considering starting a few businesses in Thailand but the 49% rule is making me sit back and think long and hard on my investment. I feel I'm offering jobs and a boost to the economy that would, with any luck last for decades. Why should I invest in projects where the returns are automatically reduced by half? The option is to take a fraction of the cost, lease a condo, and just hang out and travel. (as boring as that sounds. Plan A offers several jobs, Plan B offers 1 or 2. I can understand why TH doesn't want it's lands to be devoured by foreigners but I can also see the need for compromise in this area as well.

[impulse]

I'm considering starting a few businesses in Thailand but the 49% rule is making me sit back and think long and hard on my investment. I feel I'm offering jobs and a boost to the economy that would, with any luck last for decades. Why should I invest in projects where the returns are automatically reduced by half? The option is to take a fraction of the cost, lease a condo, and just hang out and travel. (as boring as that sounds. Plan A offers several jobs, Plan B offers 1 or 2. I can understand why TH doesn't want it's lands to be devoured by foreigners but I can also see the need for compromise in this area as well.

I hear you. But why wouldn't you get some legal help, incorporate in Hong Kong (or Texas) and have your Thai based entity just be a distribution or manufacturing arm. In other words, the Thais would own 51% of a miniscule little division of your HK or US based company. The home office still calls the shots and if the Thais don't cooperate, you close down that branch and start again with different Thais.

I'd also point out that you won't be giving them 51%, they have to pay for it- in cash, in real estate, or in kind. (Unless your business plan is a dog, in which case they won't- but what does that tell you?)

You think Thais own 51% of Toyota or Siemens or GE? Stop listening to the naysayers and talk to folks that actually operate here- quite successfully. Then get with an attorney to set it up.

[lostoday]

I'm considering starting a few businesses in Thailand but the 49% rule is making me sit back and think long and hard on my investment. I feel I'm offering jobs and a boost to the economy that would, with any luck last for decades. Why should I invest in projects where the returns are automatically reduced by half? The option is to take a fraction of the cost, lease a condo, and just hang out and travel. (as boring as that sounds. Plan A offers several jobs, Plan B offers 1 or 2. I can understand why TH doesn't want it's lands to be devoured by foreigners but I can also see the need for compromise in this area as well.

I hear you. But why wouldn't you get some legal help, incorporate in Hong Kong (or Texas) and have your Thai based entity just be a distribution or manufacturing arm. In other words, the Thais would own 51% of a miniscule little division of your HK or US based company. The home office still calls the shots and if the Thais don't cooperate, you close down that branch and start again with different Thais.

I'd also point out that you won't be giving them 51%, they have to pay for it- in cash, in real estate, or in kind. (Unless your business plan is a dog, in which case they won't- but what does that tell you?)

You think Thais own 51% of Toyota or Siemens or GE? Stop listening to the naysayers and talk to folks that actually operate here- quite successfully. Then get with an attorney to set it up.

If he doesn't know the advantage Americans have in Thailand whatever happens to him is poetic justice. Moral of the story is do your homework.

[angiolo]

Well , of course you could buy one in G/f name . Only she will dump you and have a free house. I rent rent No problem no worries no need to buy keep my money in my bank . Can do a runner if I get in trouble here . Buying in this problem country is sheer madness ..D o not consider it

No stress no bother you are in charge of your destiny not a Thai person.

While you and I agree 100% that the freedom and lack of worry that comes with renting is a much better deal than buying .. that applies to ... everywhere .. and is not Thailand specific. This is a thread about owning land in Thailand, and you have erred .. since a foreigner CAN own a house or condo .. just not the land it is built upon.

I agree with you. sometimes I look up at those suit cases and just smile .. thinking, I can top them off, hail a cab, and later that day, be on a plane to "Next Adventure, Next Life"

Buy land and a house?? .. not you or me .. but for some folks .. that works. I understand they want to own the land .. but that is never going to happen in the Kingdom. Not now, not ever.

Oh but I do own houses , several , but in the uk I am amazed how much rent the AGENTS get for me

[angiolo]

I rent a bungalow in Mae Sai . Three large bedrooms. Very large lounge Garden and kitchen.. All for 5,000 Baht a month . I get more than that for a single room in the UK. .About 250 pounds . I do not want to buy a CONDO in Thailand . No way...no way . No reason to ,in fact in my humble opinion ,quite stupid. LIVE TO RIDE

[brucegoniners]

Absolutely!

I've lived here 14 years, own a condo and rent a house.

We'd like to buy a house and that would inject money into the Thai economy, as all of the foreigners who wish to buy property and homes would.

However the Thais are still in the dark ages on the subject, thinking foreigners will own their country.

I can go to Cambodia, Vietnam and many other Asian countries and buy, but not in the place I call home.

Sad.