Thailand's Yingluck faces trial and political ruin

[rubl]

That would have to be the biggest load of bias garbage that AFP have ever produced.

For a start only18 % of poor farmers qualified for the scheme.

The scheme has left rice farmers deeper in debt than they have ever been.

The protests were not about the rice pledging scheme they were over the amnesty bill and the rampant corruption within the PT Govt.

From there on it gets worse and worse.

The corrupt and those negligent in the their duty to the country and people they pledge to serve must be shown that they are accountable to the law of the land.

Bringing Yingluck and those around her to account for the rice pledging scheme is only the first step in this and it must be carried on to show those who would enter politics in the future that they can and will be held accountable for their actions or inactions.

The crazies have started foaming at the mouth because unaccountably a fair minded report sets out the facts.

The great insulter is back.

Please tell me where I am wrong.

For a start ; were the protests over the rice scheme ?

Next ; do you believe that there should not be a message sent to future politicians that they should do their job honestly ?

The best possible message to politicians not doing their job properly is to vote them out of office.

Now if only Thailand had a functioning democracy, but all the talk about let's have an election only seems to suggest that not to be the case.

[rubl]

"...But the criminal case could see her jailed for up to a decade, an outcome that could ruin any chance of an imminent political comeback if and when the military eventually hand back power..."

Putting someone in prison because they did a bad job in a political office or even possibly negligent is way over-the-top. More importantly, if they do convict her and actually send her to jail then everyone talking about "reconciliation" has been lying through their teeth. More and more it is apparent this government is run by the Bangkok elite (there are NO neutral parties involved here) and they are doing everything in their power to stamp out the Pheu Thai/UDD parties so the Bangkok elite will win the next election in a landslide.

For one the trial still has to start, for another Ms. Yingluck will get all opportunity to prove her innocence. Who knows she may even came with the administration on the RPPS to show how self-sufficient the scheme was.

BTW 'Bangkok elite'? Doesn't a larger part of them come from upcountry and only reside in Bangkok like in other countries the elite likes to reside where the action is ? What about 'non-Bangkok elite'? Not that any of that has anything to do with the case.

[rubl]

Some people here may Harbor hatreds and accuse her of being an evil decietful person , and feel the judicial process ahead will be balanced and Just.

Others will see a bias and difficult process where the verdict is pre- ordained to be Guilty.

Either way it's likely the outcome for her will not be nice.

... ...

While the Americans would make it an issue if they did.

Certainly , it's unlikely Obama would hand her over .

Getting her out would be a case of US operations .

That would be backed by the entire free world .

They made an error either way.

If she turns up goes through a long process until she is eventually jailed .

The fuse will be ignited and the grim times ahead start without pretence.

And whose side do you think Washington will be on?

This quiet and peace is about to end beginning with this trial .

Ms. Yingluck only lost 700 billion Baht on her self-financing RPPS. That's something Americans can understand of course. That's to be expected from politicians, the lying and so. You don't impeach someone for that. It's not as if Ms. Yingluck accepted the attention of an impressible young assistant while in office. Now that would justify near global condemnation of course.

[Sparkles]

Political ruin...you mean she had a political future? purely a fill in until big brother made his next move.Poor old Mr Yingluck never gets a mention and where's Chalerm when you need some intelligent imput ?

[SOTIRIOS]

...the farmers that never got paid.....???

...the farmers that lost their farms....???

...the farmers that committed suicide...???

...be specific Madam.....

[aripengu]

Game of Thrones....new episode!

[Sydebolle]

Placing her behind bars makes her a martyr in the eyes of some.
Letting her go free queries the dethroning of May 22nd last year.

If you ask me, some people got nicely painted into a very tiny corner here - we will see ;-)

[Lovekorat]

Now look.......no one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle.......even if they do say the name........

[robblok]

It's just a witch hunt for being on the wrong side. Like Stanley Weiss said in his recent article: "When 190 of 200 legislators in the military-stacked assembly later voted to impeach Yingluck for "dereliction of duty" over the rice subsidy -- which the analyst David Merkel dryly notes is "akin to impeaching a U.S. president over an ethanol subsidy, pork barrel spending, or a dairy program" -- Yingluck rightly declared, "Democracy has died in Thailand today, along with the rule of law."

Thailand is a police state so this kind of thing happens.

The problem is and most red supporters don't get it.

This was proclaimed as self financing, NO money was set aside int he budget. Else it was a subsidy and you would be right it would be foolish to charge her.

Now they did not put money aside in the budget claiming it would cost nothing. When the Democrats, Worldbank, IMF and others said it was going to cost money she ignored them. When accounting showed that it was costing money she intimidated the person who came out with these figures. We all know now that it cost loads of money 700BILLION with none of it budgeted.

So yes that is dereliction of duty.

Then now it has become clear that 2 of her underlings did fake G2G deals.. buying rice cheap from the government claiming to be a chinese company. Then reselling it to the government for the higher price (rice never left the warehhouse). This is corruption and fraud.. by her underlings.. She should have stopped stuff like that as she chaired it if it can be proven she knew too then she should be convicted for it.

In no civilized country int he world will they accept it to have a vote buying program in outside of the budget costing billions and accepting it as normal. No matter how much the red supporters want it.

If you know something is costing money and your not budgeting for it knowingly.. it is at the least dereliction of duty in all civilized countries. but this went further.. the people coming out with data that it cost money were ignored or intimidated.

[gamini]

That would have to be the biggest load of bias garbage that AFP have ever produced.

For a start only18 % of poor farmers qualified for the scheme.

The scheme has left rice farmers deeper in debt than they have ever been.

The protests were not about the rice pledging scheme they were over the amnesty bill and the rampant corruption within the PT Govt.

From there on it gets worse and worse.

The corrupt and those negligent in the their duty to the country and people they pledge to serve must be shown that they are accountable to the law of the land.

Bringing Yingluck and those around her to account for the rice pledging scheme is only the first step in this and it must be carried on to show those who would enter politics in the future that they can and will be held accountable for their actions or inactions.

You say this about AFP all the time you're about as predictable as the Sunday junta polls ?

Robby is right. AFP never mentions that PT never won a single seat in the whole of the southern part of Thailand . The Shinnawatas were despised by the poor people there. It never mentions how they won thier seats in the North East. APF just rants on "ad nausean" about PT having won all the elections.

[keskeseksa]

"Pavin Chachavalpongpun, a Thai politics expert at Kyoto University in Japan, said convicting Yingluck risked enraging the Shinawatra's "Red Shirt" support base, who have largely remained quiescent since the coup."

Pavin is a Red Shirt spokesman, or whatever is left of them, so his rants don't mean anything.

"Putting her in jail may unnecessarily resurrect the Red Shirts and force them to come out and fight against the NCPO," he said, referring to the junta's official name, the National Council for Peace and Order.

Apart from the militant faction and a few leaders, the Red Shirt is a thing of the past. I don't think Thaksin is prepared to spend his money unless there are results, and now he won't be able to make a move with PM Prayut in charge.

[elgordo38]

I doubt that she will be phazed at all by her political life being ruined.

Seize the family's assets (the whole family) and distribute them evenly amongst the people they were supposed to help.

Tough Love.

I beleive her assets alone are around 64 million baht.

There is no telling how much money her brother deposited in offshore accounts for her for doing his bidding and for her share of the skim from the rice scheme. 64 million is probably chicken feed compared to that.

2015-02-04

"Her declaration stated that she and her son had Bt615 million in assets and some Bt30 million in liabilities, based on the money she owes her brother.

She did not include the assets of her unregistered partner in the declaration."

http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/yinglucks-assets-grew-450000-after-stint-mp

I still think 20 million US dollars is low. Don't they own half of Chiang Mai. I know they have large holdings close to where I live. I wonder what odds the bookies are giving that she will be found innocent. Any takers out there in TV land?

[Robby nz]

That would have to be the biggest load of bias garbage that AFP have ever produced.

For a start only18 % of poor farmers qualified for the scheme.

The scheme has left rice farmers deeper in debt than they have ever been.

The protests were not about the rice pledging scheme they were over the amnesty bill and the rampant corruption within the PT Govt.

From there on it gets worse and worse.

The corrupt and those negligent in the their duty to the country and people they pledge to serve must be shown that they are accountable to the law of the land.

Bringing Yingluck and those around her to account for the rice pledging scheme is only the first step in this and it must be carried on to show those who would enter politics in the future that they can and will be held accountable for their actions or inactions.

The crazies have started foaming at the mouth because unaccountably a fair minded report sets out the facts.

The great insulter is back.

Please tell me where I am wrong.

For a start ; were the protests over the rice scheme ?

Next ; do you believe that there should not be a message sent to future politicians that they should do their job honestly ?

The best possible message to politicians not doing their job properly is to vote them out of office.

So you do know what I posted is correct.

There may come a time when waiting for an election is to late to save a country from a corrupt Govt.

Consider if the people had not come out and protested and the amnesty bill had been passed.

Thaksin and all the other politicians would have been forgiven all their crimes and corruption, don't forget the NACC saying the bill would have forgiven over 25,000 cases of corruption they already had on their books.

All the corruption within the rice scheme, land encroachment, the top cop who has now been jailed, even the human trafficking up to the time of the bill being passed would never have seen the light of day. All those involved would have been free to keep the proceeds of their corruption and carry on as before... untouchable.

The rice scheme would have carried on till the end of the parliamentary term and as we now know the extent of the losses that scheme incurred in its time it can be reasoned that more loss would have accumulated at the same rate.

The 2.2 trillion out of budget loan would have been approved and obtained and who knows how it would have been spent for being out of budget there would have been no accountability. One of the ministers let slip that some was earmarked to pay for the losses to the rice pledging scheme so some would have gone to cover the loss there.

There was also the 350billion that was supposed to be for flood protection work, nobody seems to know whether they actually got that while in office, if they did where did it go, if not then they would have got that as well.....out of budget, again no accountability.

Thaksin would have been back free of his conviction and all the other charges now awaiting him, to the welcome of you and his other supporters, as his 5 year ban from politics had expired he would have taken over his party after someone resigned from a safe seat due to health reasons (a la ugly sister) and a by-election was held, a cabinet post and rapid rise to deputy then MP.

The 40 or so that were called political prisoners would have been freed with great fanfare and compensated lavishly, the red ones that is, this as a cover for the real purpose of the bill.

Things would have carried on as before with friends and relatives put in positions to consolidate power.

Given these consequences of the PT Govt being allowed to continue and the ultimate uncertainty of an election ever being held the people who came out and protested the amnesty bill did this country a great favor.

[elgordo38]

It's all so simple for the Thaksin haters.............

Bit like EU immigration policy, the rules of VAT and who got Diana.

Why do a vociferous few on here, have such vehement hatred for Thaksin and the Thai electorate ??

Sincere question.

Are you really that stupid that you think anyone who hates Thaksin also hates the Thai electorate ?

Sincere question................(sarc)

""Democracy is just a tool, not our goal." I loved this quote could be the mantra for the US Fed and all its allied Central bankers around the planet.

[wowfactor10]

In the new charter what does it say about upcoming coups?

[EnglishJohn]

For me, the most significant point about this is that Thaksin put his sister into the role of PM then cynically used her to distract attention while his cronies plundered as much as they could from the nation's wealth.

Willingly or not, he put her in the position of having to commit gross negligence whilst holding the highest public office in the land.

What a class act. She would slap his face for it if she wasn't so empty-headed.

[ronwparker]

She will never be ruined as Taksin spirited so much money offshore the he bribed officials to let him go to the Bejing Olympics and is happty having huge amounts of cash -he conned theRed Shirts -gave them a few crums but the Rice scheme has lost the country huge amuntss of money.

He lives a life of a Billionaire based in Dubai-he will sub his sister for sure.

She wasjust his puppet with a pretty face.

[northernjohn]

_{She deserves life but I hope she gets no time as it would turn her into a martyr and raise up the red shirt rabble again. Like it or not Thailand has a chance at unity now and jail time for her would ruin it. Some times you just have to bite the bullet to achieve a goal. Ban her for life from politics. she would probably appreciate it. I doubt very highly she appreciated looking like a fool to the whole world. Sad part is her brother set her up and then threw her under the bus.}

_{She is just a stand in for the real criminal her brother who should be in a high security prison here in Thailand along with convicted drug dealers.}

[English 1]

This corrupt crooked family gave the poor people a few crumbs of bread

whilst stealing lorry loads of loaves for themselves and their cronies.

Conned the Issan people for decades to get their Vote......simple as that.

Edited May 18, 2015 by metisdead
Bold font removed, again.

[saltandpepper]

AFP ....Ahahaha

What a load of biased craps...

Could you actually say what the bias is? ...or is it just because YOU don't agree with it?

Of course I disagree Sherlock! And I am not alone.....

And if you don't see the bias, none of my explanation will show you the light, because you won't want to see it.....

[aslimversgwm]

I'd love to know the political leanings of the posters on here. I mean there home country political leanings.

I bet the anti Thaksin lot are all Republicans or Tories or other right wingers and the pro Thaksin lot Democrats or Lib Dems or left wingers.

In other words everyone has a bias which crosses over to their Thai opinions without any real knowledge of what actually happened - just regurgitated factoids depending which right or keft wing literature they read.

[robblok]

it is called a subsidy.. all governments use this vehicle.. mostly for companies.. was it badly managed.. probably... it is government..

The General illegal PM also declared many subsidies.. massive contracts with china ... no competition... same same crapola

Run Yingluck Run

Its only a subsidy if you allocate money in your budget for it, if you call it self financing and don't allocate money for it (because your budget is strained already) and you refuse to allocate budget for it when the IMF, Worldbank, Democrats and varies other parties have told you it cost money (and it did 700billion) and you refuse to allocate money in your budget (because there is no money and it would mean cutting other programs) then its not a subsidy.

Then it is dereliction of duty at the least and maybe even criminal.

[Docno]

If they (the army) wants to achieve their goal of ridding the Shins from Thai politics, they'll have to play this one very carefully. She has a great deal of support in the northeast, and many farmers (with some justification) see her as a victim of the Bangkok elite, including the banks that refused to put money up to support the pledging programme just before the coup (and who magically found the money after the coup). My gf's family 'sold' into the scheme and had to wait a long time to get their payment. No-one I've met in the village blames Yingluck for what went down. Regardless of what the TV mob believes, I'm convinced that a majority of Isan farmers believe that Yingluck was sincere in her efforts to support them and that she cannot be held responsible for the corruption of the 'players in the middle'. Therefore, punishing her with a jail sentence would--as the article says--make a martyr out of her and create more problems than it solves. The smartest move for the army would be to have her found guilty and sentenced, but in a show of mercy and reconciliation, not carry out the sentence. A life-time ban from politics would keep her on the sidelines.

However, the Shin family also operates at a symbolic level. They represent the first time in Thai history where the poor farmers actually had a voice in the halls of power. Even if you subscribe to the cynical belief that the Shins 'exploited the gullible masses to seize power', it does not change the facts on the ground: their were now people in Bangkok talking about the interests of the farmers and trying to meet those interests. It doesn't have to be a Shin. Get rid of the Shins and another leader espousing the same goals and values will simply step up. Can't put that genie back in the bottle...

[chilli42]

I am no fan of the Shinawatra mischief makers but if this standard were applied rigourously to Thai governments of the past, the jails would be filled to bursting. I guess they are eager to find a legal way to put the final nail in that coffin.

[jesimps]

She should have done a runner when she had the chance.....

Why? She's done nothing wrong. Like the Myanmar lady, she'd rather go to jail than betray her principles. Good look madam.

[saltandpepper]

She should have done a runner when she had the chance.....

Why? She's done nothing wrong. Like the Myanmar lady, she'd rather go to jail than betray her principles. Good look madam.

To compare her with the Myanmar lady as you put it, is ridiculous......NOTHING can bring YL anywhere near HSSK except the fact that they are both females...

[rebelplatoon]

Although they did ravage state coffers by handing out money to their constituents in exchange for their support, putting her in jail would not be very diplomatic. Not a good idea.

[Docno]

Currently reading a book on the assassination of Caesar. He was a 'member' of the populares, back when being a populist was not a derogatory term and simply meant to promote the interests of the people. He stood in opposition--and went to war with--the optimares (or 'Best Men'), the elite that wanted to control the Senate to protect the interests of the old, wealthy families (the patricians). Like Thaksin, the populares leaders were wealthy, but it was new wealth so they were still considered plebians and they were looked down upon the old-wealth patricians. Lot's of parallels with the Thai situation, including wheat schemes. In Rome's case, the conflict lasted almost a century and led to civil wars and uprisings and ended only when Caesar, a populare himself, became dictator, was assassinated, and an imperial structure emerged under Augustus. These sorts of things don't fade quickly...

[realenglish1]

Yingluck said on her facebook page "i have not done anything wrong at all".

So all the lying, false promises, inflammatory foreign speeches and zero attendance records for rice meetings were completely kosher then. Alright.

She deserves to be locked up. Any normal person would be. 1 law should be applicable to all after all

There is nothing she has done that is criminal in nature She may have not attended meetings but that is not criminal. Now as far as inflammatory speeches are concerned , they do not rise to breaking the law.

False promises? Well if it was criminal to give false promises you would half to lock up every politician around the world. Again not criminal .

I am not a supporter of Yingluck but I really despise people who want to lynch someone because then are breathing.

We had this type of mentality in the deep south in the United States back in the 50s ans 60s and a lot of innocent folks where hanged or found dead because of it.

I would suggest its time for you to grow up and smell the coffee .

It is a sad day in a democracy that someone is found guilty before ever going to court for a proper defense. Not a lynch mob mentality.

If mentality you are similar to all Thais I will say that you are very far away from democracy and do not understand its nature.

In a true democracy there are others that you may disagree with but just because you disagree with them does not mean you lynch then to shut them up

I a true democracy everyone and I mean everyone has a right to free speech and say what they believe. In your cause you want to lock everyone up you do not agree with

That is truly sad

Edited May 17, 2015 by realenglish1

[winstonc]

It's just a witch hunt for being on the wrong side. Like Stanley Weiss said in his recent article: "When 190 of 200 legislators in the military-stacked assembly later voted to impeach Yingluck for "dereliction of duty" over the rice subsidy -- which the analyst David Merkel dryly notes is "akin to impeaching a U.S. president over an ethanol subsidy, pork barrel spending, or a dairy program" -- Yingluck rightly declared, "Democracy has died in Thailand today, along with the rule of law."

Thailand is a police state so this kind of thing happens.

and when was it a true democracy brains..and the rule of law when charlem was letting protesters be killed ..i await your next .thrilling post...being a dog brown nosing is right up your frankey valley ..