Thailand's Yingluck faces trial and political ruin

[winstonc]

Yingluck said on her facebook page "i have not done anything wrong at all".

So all the lying, false promises, inflammatory foreign speeches and zero attendance records for rice meetings were completely kosher then. Alright.

She deserves to be locked up. Any normal person would be. 1 law should be applicable to all after all

There is nothing she has done that is criminal in nature She may have not attended meeting but that is not criminal. In inflammatory speeches do not rise to breaking the law.

False promises Well if it was criminal to give false promises you would half to lock up every politician around the world Again not criminal .

I am not a supporter of Yingluck but I really despise people who want to lynch someone because then are breathing.

We had this type of mentality in the deep south in the United States back in the 50s ans 60s and a lot of innocent folks where hanged or found dead because it it

I would suggest its time for you to grow up and smell the coffee .

It is a sad day in a democracy that someone is found guilty before ever going to court for a proper defense. Not a lynch mob mentality

she allowed criminality to continue and as head of the government is she absovled of any responsibilty..and were in thailand not the deep south 50 years ago..

[jayboy]

Some people here may Harbor hatreds and accuse her of being an evil decietful person , and feel the judicial process ahead will be balanced and Just.

Others will see a bias and difficult process where the verdict is pre- ordained to be Guilty.

Either way it's likely the outcome for her will not be nice.

YS came to Australia and was very warmly received and respected.

Australia bans all the current Thai government from setting foot in this country.

America had its leader meet here in Bangkok for a state dinner and she seemed thrilled to host Obama.

She isn't perceived unfavourably in the international community.

Depmestically , she is adored and her inner workings not in question.

With that said it would be foolish for the Miliatry with such a smelly political dead fish around its neck , in the form of both article 44 , The charter , and human rights abuses diminishing its reputation .

Sanctions , would cripple the military and their ability to govern.

She has indeed friends in high places , they ought to remember that.

A master stroke on her part could be to simply walk into the America Embassy and seek their help.

What would a military government do?

Entering the grounds of a United States Embassy isn't exactly a smart move.

The reality is the Americans recognise the judicial in Thailand to be questionable given recent rulings and the article 44 position.

It would certainly make for the Chinese to advice going in and getting her.

While the Americans would make it an issue if they did.

Certainly , it's unlikely Obama would hand her over .

Getting her out would be a case of US operations .

That would be backed by the entire free world .

They made an error either way.

If she turns up goes through a long process until she is eventually jailed .

The fuse will be ignited and the grim times ahead start without pretence.

And whose side do you think Washington will be on?

This quiet and peace is about to end beginning with this trial .

Grow up - this is the real world. Adored domestically by all those paid to do so perhaps. How many turned up to those "war drum" meetings that were supposed to show the huge support for her?

You really think the world sees her as a good PM. 5555. Obama hasn't really cared diddly squat. Sure calls for returns to democracy, along with the EU and hypocritical Aussies (Wasn't their FM here this month? Did she pay a call on the disgraced former female PM?). Her brother's PR machine do try hard though.

Yet, not one, I repeat not one, government has actually supported by name Yingluck, PTP or her criminal brother and called for their return, Not even his mates in Cambodia and Zimbabwe. Why do you think that is?

Because there is no attachment to one individual.Yingluck was respected worldwide when PM not because of her personal qualities (though her charm helped) but because she represented a government freely elected by the Thai people.In contrast the current government has an appalling reputation and the self appointed Prime Minister would sell his grandmother for a hundredth of the access and respect Yingluck achieved.But in his case also the chilly reception is nothing personal (though not helped by his ludicrous persona), just a distaste of what he stands for.

[winstonc]

She should have done a runner when she had the chance.....

Why? She's done nothing wrong. Like the Myanmar lady, she'd rather go to jail than betray her principles. Good look madam.

are you even sober...how dare you compare this vegetable with the lady from myanmar

[tbthailand]

That would have to be the biggest load of bias garbage that AFP have ever produced.

For a start only18 % of poor farmers qualified for the scheme.

The scheme has left rice farmers deeper in debt than they have ever been.

The protests were not about the rice pledging scheme they were over the amnesty bill and the rampant corruption within the PT Govt.

From there on it gets worse and worse.

The corrupt and those negligent in the their duty to the country and people they pledge to serve must be shown that they are accountable to the law of the land.

Bringing Yingluck and those around her to account for the rice pledging scheme is only the first step in this and it must be carried on to show those who would enter politics in the future that they can and will be held accountable for their actions or inactions.

You say this about AFP all the time you're about as predictable as the Sunday junta polls ?

Did it occur to you the reason for that predictability is because he's right?

AFP are tosspots who are either too lazy to bother with the facts, serve their own or someone else's agenda, or simply incompetent.

Do you think all those protests, millions on the street were sparked off by the rice scheme then?

Did it occur to you the reason for that predictability is because he's right?

ah, those crazy French - we never trusted them!

[JAG]

I'd love to know the political leanings of the posters on here. I mean there home country political leanings.

I bet the anti Thaksin lot are all Republicans or Tories or other right wingers and the pro Thaksin lot Democrats or Lib Dems or left wingers.

In other words everyone has a bias which crosses over to their Thai opinions without any real knowledge of what actually happened - just regurgitated factoids depending which right or keft wing literature they read.

Well between you and me, I'm a fairly liberal Tory, and I suspect I'm considered by many on here a rabid Red Shirt supporter.....I certainly prefer Thaksins faction over the present bunch.

So that kind of spoils your theory!

Sorry.

[LuckyLew]

Even if she is in the sin bin I do not see her brother stopping his political activities, he has a sister and son and a daughter or two. He will be more than happy to send one of them to be the face of his next political party incarnation.

[IamNoone88]

Thereis never any move to recover the Billions lost..........the corrupt get to keep that.

[tbthailand]

This corrupt crooked family gave the poor people a few crumbs of bread

whilst stealing lorry loads of loaves for themselves and their cronies.

Conned the Issan people for decades to get their Vote......simple as that.

actually, the significant change in the distribution of the national budget under Thaksin was real and provided real benefits for the people which is certainly one of the reasons he continued to win their votes ...

On the other hand, his opponents simply pull out an unsubstantiated set of lies about 'conning' the 'gullible, uneducated (sometimes they use 'kwai' or worse) voters (and then pulling out their "Generals") rather than spending time to develop their own political platforms that might then appeal to the people of Thailand so that the opposition parties stood a snow-ball's chance in BKK of winning an election.

[dru2]

I'd love to know the political leanings of the posters on here. I mean there home country political leanings.

I bet the anti Thaksin lot are all Republicans or Tories or other right wingers and the pro Thaksin lot Democrats or Lib Dems or left wingers.

In other words everyone has a bias which crosses over to their Thai opinions without any real knowledge of what actually happened - just regurgitated factoids depending which right or keft wing literature they read.

Quite wrong. I am a committed socialist who despises Thaksin as an arch-capitalist, a murderer and a thief.

[greenchair]

Yingluck is probably one of the only premiers that showed less assets coming out of office than she had going in. There has been no proof that she was corrupt in any way, shape or form. I do believe yingluck did her best.she may have fallen short of people's expectations. But she did make all efforts to do her best under immense pressure.

Shame on the Thai for treating her this way.

[The Deerhunter]

AFP ....Ahahaha

What a load of biased craps...

Biased craps? Really? Surely it presented both sides of the story, published her personal statements on her innocence and explained (by way of qualified commentators) what the "hated un-elected Junta" would be trying to achieve by this court action. I think it was a fair and impartial (un-biased) summation of the situation. The facts and nothing but the facts. Nothing untrue and no surprises. What more could they have said? But, I guess, some people are just never happy if they are not getting their way.

[SaamBaht]

Too bad so called justice will come from another military government tainting any conviction.

[Jim walker]

Oh No she wont go to prison just because a few rich loose cannon yellow shirts elitists did not get a share of the rice subsidy scheme, designed to help the poorest rural communities in Thailand the people who actually slave all day in the rice fields well done Yingluck and good luck at the sham military trial I am sure you will be able to walk the streets with your head held high and your family name intact.

[khaowong1]

"Yingluck herself has defended the controversial rice scheme as one which "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers" in the poor northeast of a country where subsidies to farmers have long been a cornerstone of Thai politics."

"As prime minister I was always honest and served the Thai people, who voted for my government. I have not done anything wrong at all," she wrote in a Facebook statement in February after the charges against her were first announced.

Interesting.

The World Bank disagreed about the scheme delivering much to the farmers. Prove otherwise Yingluck.

This was not a subsidy, but a self financing scheme. Why was it out of the budget Yingluck if it was a subsidy?

Honest - all the lies, the false promises, the false vows, letting a non elected criminal control the country. How is that honesty Yingluck?

Served the people - your record of attending parliament and committees as chair or member was what exactly Yingluck?

Served the Thai people who voted for my government - What about the majority of Thai people who didn't vote for your government? Don't those count Yingluck?

Do you actually know the difference between right and wrong Yingluck? You were removed for breaking the law, you allowed a passport to illegally by issued to your criminal brother and have refused to answer questions on that. Do you consider that breaking the law is not doing something wrong?

She still seems to believe she was/is entitled to do just what she wants, and that's her entitlement because she's a Shin,

Hope she has more to offer as a defense. The "I'm a nice, honest girlie who's never done anything wrong at all" bullshite should be laughed out of court.

Reminds me of the Clintons in the US.. Above the law..

[Andrew65]

Throwing her in the can will really unify the country, and give a sense of closure!

[kennw]

A country in turmoil, farmers as poor as ever, education system defunct, so what is Yinglaks solution - visit 47 countries starting with Montenegro, a similarly corrupt country but willing to give big brother a passport. "I never did anythig wrong" . Think again lady you held the highest office in the land and under your watch the country lost billions, and it has to be paid back by future generations. What an legacy to leave to the youth of Thailand. Shame on you.! Go bathe in your money dont try to use the ordinary people again for your familiy's self enrichment.

[MobileContent]

Yingluck is not accused of corruption but of failing to prevent alleged graft within the programme, which cost billions of dollars and galvanised the protests that eventually felled her elected government leading to last May's coup.

I wonder if the generals one day will face the courts if they are unable to prevent graft in their policies. I doubt it as the generals are above the law since the first coup and will keep that status-quo. Shame on Thailand for selective punishments. Billions have been lost in the rice scam but much more was lost in tourism, the exports are down the toilets and the military inaction in the deep South.

I looked the security briefing on the PM meet the people last Friday. The security was about human smuggling, political issues and given land to the poor farmers in the North. Not one mention of the deep South. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to understand what is going on in this country but it is just a matter of time before this country is going to explode.

(DELETED)

[rubl]

Yingluck is probably one of the only premiers that showed less assets coming out of office than she had going in. There has been no proof that she was corrupt in any way, shape or form. I do believe yingluck did her best.she may have fallen short of people's expectations. But she did make all efforts to do her best under immense pressure.

Shame on the Thai for treating her this way.

In 2013 it was even reported that on the negative side there was a debt of 30 million she had borrowed from her brother.

Anyway, shame some use anything to distract from the topic. As if Ms. Yingluck's personel fortune as she reported has anything to with her self-financing RPPS losing 700 billion Baht, or she stating to have been incharge while now trying to plead innocence.

[stopthegreed]

I doubt that she will be phazed at all by her political life being ruined.

Seize the family's assets (the whole family) and distribute them evenly amongst the people they were supposed to help.

Tough Love.

I beleive her assets alone are around 64 million baht.

hahaha, 64 million, treble that. Her assets grew by 140% while she was in office.

Its really quite simple, make her explain and prove where this new found money came from !!!

[Songlaw]

Some people here may Harbor hatreds and accuse her of being an evil decietful person , and feel the judicial process ahead will be balanced and Just.

Others will see a bias and difficult process where the verdict is pre- ordained to be Guilty.

Either way it's likely the outcome for her will not be nice.

YS came to Australia and was very warmly received and respected.

Australia bans all the current Thai government from setting foot in this country.

America had its leader meet here in Bangkok for a state dinner and she seemed thrilled to host Obama.

She isn't perceived unfavourably in the international community.

Depmestically , she is adored and her inner workings not in question.

With that said it would be foolish for the Miliatry with such a smelly political dead fish around its neck , in the form of both article 44 , The charter , and human rights abuses diminishing its reputation .

Sanctions , would cripple the military and their ability to govern.

She has indeed friends in high places , they ought to remember that.

A master stroke on her part could be to simply walk into the America Embassy and seek their help.

What would a military government do?

Entering the grounds of a United States Embassy isn't exactly a smart move.

The reality is the Americans recognise the judicial in Thailand to be questionable given recent rulings and the article 44 position.

It would certainly make for the Chinese to advice going in and getting her.

While the Americans would make it an issue if they did.

Certainly , it's unlikely Obama would hand her over .

Getting her out would be a case of US operations .

That would be backed by the entire free world .

They made an error either way.

If she turns up goes through a long process until she is eventually jailed .

The fuse will be ignited and the grim times ahead start without pretence.

And whose side do you think Washington will be on?

This quiet and peace is about to end beginning with this trial .

The many faceted elephant in the room. Spot on.

[Baerboxer]

Yingluck said on her facebook page "i have not done anything wrong at all".

So all the lying, false promises, inflammatory foreign speeches and zero attendance records for rice meetings were completely kosher then. Alright.

She deserves to be locked up. Any normal person would be. 1 law should be applicable to all after all

There is nothing she has done that is criminal in nature She may have not attended meetings but that is not criminal. Now as far as inflammatory speeches are concerned , they do not rise to breaking the law.

False promises? Well if it was criminal to give false promises you would half to lock up every politician around the world. Again not criminal .

I am not a supporter of Yingluck but I really despise people who want to lynch someone because then are breathing.

We had this type of mentality in the deep south in the United States back in the 50s ans 60s and a lot of innocent folks where hanged or found dead because of it.

I would suggest its time for you to grow up and smell the coffee .

It is a sad day in a democracy that someone is found guilty before ever going to court for a proper defense. Not a lynch mob mentality.

If mentality you are similar to all Thais I will say that you are very far away from democracy and do not understand its nature.

In a true democracy there are others that you may disagree with but just because you disagree with them does not mean you lynch then to shut them up

I a true democracy everyone and I mean everyone has a right to free speech and say what they believe. In your cause you want to lock everyone up you do not agree with

That is truly sad

Moving someone from their job without following the correct process, purely to get a relative into a senior key position, illegally issuing a new passport to a criminal fugitive (who happens to be her brother), allowing her criminal brother to run the cabinet, appoint the ministers and change them, dictate policy and make the decisions.

You don't think any of that might be considered a tad criminal? That's before we get to her negligence.

[rubl]

Too bad so called justice will come from another military government tainting any conviction.

Too bad everybody and his dog already seems to have made up their mind that 'obviously' Ms. Yingluck is either guilty or will just be sentences for the fun of it.

Never let facts influence your opinion.

[rubl]

Throwing her in the can will really unify the country, and give a sense of closure!

Justice can be tough, can't it

[Baerboxer]

Oh No she wont go to prison just because a few rich loose cannon yellow shirts elitists did not get a share of the rice subsidy scheme, designed to help the poorest rural communities in Thailand the people who actually slave all day in the rice fields well done Yingluck and good luck at the sham military trial I am sure you will be able to walk the streets with your head held high and your family name intact.

You think you know more than the World b_Bank Jim?

Please share the information that makes you think differently to them Jim. Please show the proof of what you say. No one but PTP say the poor farmers received much.

Or have you been at brother Johnnie's produce again?

[NCC1701A]

she is so cute but she looks like she is gaining weight. i hope she is not eating too much because she is depressed. if she goes to prison i am going to visit her and strike up a prison romance, maybe we can get married while she is still in the pokey.

[Baerboxer]

Yingluck is probably one of the only premiers that showed less assets coming out of office than she had going in. There has been no proof that she was corrupt in any way, shape or form. I do believe yingluck did her best.she may have fallen short of people's expectations. But she did make all efforts to do her best under immense pressure.

Shame on the Thai for treating her this way.

How can you really write such tripe? Have you no conscience?

Did her best - she lied, never turned up to rice scheme meetings, rarely turned up to parliament, refused to obey the law, refused to answer the ombudsman and worst of all, allowed her criminal fugitive brother to run the government, despite her oaths.

If that;s doing her best, I'd hate to see her worst.

[heybruce]

"She is accused of criminal negligence over a populist but economically disastrous rice subsidy scheme..."

Does the junta really want to establish this precedent? After all, there are military commanders in the south that allowed dozens of illegal migrant prisons to operate in the areas they were supposed to be guarding. That seems pretty negligent to me.

[northernjohn]

I'd love to know the political leanings of the posters on here. I mean there home country political leanings.

I bet the anti Thaksin lot are all Republicans or Tories or other right wingers and the pro Thaksin lot Democrats or Lib Dems or left wingers.

In other words everyone has a bias which crosses over to their Thai opinions without any real knowledge of what actually happened - just regurgitated factoids depending which right or keft wing literature they read.

Sorry Charlie I am a Democrat and defiantly anti Thaksin Shinawatra. for sure the brain dead Republicans would be for him. Also the ones who are in to corruption no matter what party does it. Make no mistake about it there are posters on Thai Visa who have and some still are making big money off of the corrupt practices brought in and the ones that were already here when Thaksin took over and started to fine tune them.

[phantomfiddler]

I would assume that the entire scheme was devised by "Big Bruv", and when she is found guilty bail should be posted corresponding with the amount of money lost. Then we shall see the true colours of "big Bruv". According to a few articles I read, his fortunes increased 400% while she was in power, an amount that I think would be highly unlikely to achieve for us mere mortals

[northernjohn]

If they (the army) wants to achieve their goal of ridding the Shins from Thai politics, they'll have to play this one very carefully. She has a great deal of support in the northeast, and many farmers (with some justification) see her as a victim of the Bangkok elite, including the banks that refused to put money up to support the pledging programme just before the coup (and who magically found the money after the coup). My gf's family 'sold' into the scheme and had to wait a long time to get their payment. No-one I've met in the village blames Yingluck for what went down. Regardless of what the TV mob believes, I'm convinced that a majority of Isan farmers believe that Yingluck was sincere in her efforts to support them and that she cannot be held responsible for the corruption of the 'players in the middle'. Therefore, punishing her with a jail sentence would--as the article says--make a martyr out of her and create more problems than it solves. The smartest move for the army would be to have her found guilty and sentenced, but in a show of mercy and reconciliation, not carry out the sentence. A life-time ban from politics would keep her on the sidelines.

However, the Shin family also operates at a symbolic level. They represent the first time in Thai history where the poor farmers actually had a voice in the halls of power. Even if you subscribe to the cynical belief that the Shins 'exploited the gullible masses to seize power', it does not change the facts on the ground: their were now people in Bangkok talking about the interests of the farmers and trying to meet those interests. It doesn't have to be a Shin. Get rid of the Shins and another leader espousing the same goals and values will simply step up. Can't put that genie back in the bottle...

Well I certainly agree with you on the handling of Yingluck. It was criminal letting them get away with it. But to imprison her would bring in more problems and go directly against the efforts to unite the country. I would find her guilty and just ban her from politics for life.

As for the banks not financing her that was a set up from the word go. The PTP stole all the money and when the farmers got irate they stepped down knowing that they would be a caretaker government and that banks could not loan to a caretaker government.

I don't think they want to put the Genie back in the bottle they just want an honest one.

Makes no difference who gets into power or if the current government stays in power at an honest election which I believe they will do their best to hold. Thailand is for ever changed and as you said they can not put the genie back in the bottle. One just hopes the Pendulum does not swing to far the other way.