Bandido chief stranded in Thailand after Australian govt refuses to renew visa

[giddyup]

Righty-o then. By the way what's Master at Arms? I don't keep my head in the sand, quite the opposite, i don't believe sensationalist press with bad journalism. Not very headline grabbing is it when a motorcycle club member comes home from a proper day's work to help change his child's nappies. Much better is rape, pillage, bite heads off chickens and drug deal/manufacture.I don't believe all that governments tell us. War in Vietnam because of those so bad commies and the "domino effect", all of SEA will fall. Well it did'nt but it cost the lives of 50k Americans and millions of Vietnamese. We are not or at war in Laos. How many million tons of ordnance? There are WMD in Iraq, Saddam has them, honest. Yeah right, and now look at the mess. Believe all that the press and governments spew out and want you to believe, because i don't and never have.

As for guilty by association, do not even get me started. How far have we fallen in freedom in the West? I had very very good friends in Germany in the early 80's do 5 years time, with no parole for exactly that. No crime, just guilty of association. Pathetic and disgusting.

Hey, I answered your question, I don't need a lecture on all the evils in the world. If you think this scumbag is squeaky clean and sings in the church choir, you're free to believe it. If I belonged to the KKK would you be justified in thinking I was a racist? I wonder how far your tolerance will extend once we reach a point of total anarchy. Will you then reflect that maybe we should have done a bit more with reigning in the bad guys before they took over?

Edited May 21, 2015 by giddyup

[ozzydom]

Righty-o then. By the way what's Master at Arms? I don't keep my head in the sand, quite the opposite, i don't believe sensationalist press with bad journalism. Not very headline grabbing is it when a motorcycle club member comes home from a proper day's work to help change his child's nappies. Much better is rape, pillage, bite heads off chickens and drug deal/manufacture.I don't believe all that governments tell us. War in Vietnam because of those so bad commies and the "domino effect", all of SEA will fall. Well it did'nt but it cost the lives of 50k Americans and millions of Vietnamese. We are not or at war in Laos. How many million tons of ordnance? There are WMD in Iraq, Saddam has them, honest. Yeah right, and now look at the mess. Believe all that the press and governments spew out and want you to believe, because i don't and never have.

As for guilty by association, do not even get me started. How far have we fallen in freedom in the West? I had very very good friends in Germany in the early 80's do 5 years time, with no parole for exactly that. No crime, just guilty of association. Pathetic and disgusting.

Hey, I answered your question, I don't need a lecture on all the evils in the world. If you think this scumbag is squeaky clean and sings in the church choir, you're free to believe it. If I belonged to the KKK would you be justified in thinking I was a racist? I wonder how far your tolerance will extend once we reach a point of total anarchy. Will you then reflect that maybe we should have done a bit more with reigning in the bad guys before they took over?

SERGEANT AT ARMS

The sergeant at arms is basically the club's “policeman” although most would not like to be referred to in this way! He enforces club procedures and maintains order at club meetings. The sergeant is in charge of security at club's events and he is responsible for “back ups” (attacks on rivals). The sergeant looks after the club's firearms and other weapons.

The sergeant at arms is sometimes known as the “master of arms”, (although “sergeant at arms” has become much more common). The sergeant wears a military style sergeant’s badge.

[thaiguzzi]

Righty-o then. By the way what's Master at Arms? I don't keep my head in the sand, quite the opposite, i don't believe sensationalist press with bad journalism. Not very headline grabbing is it when a motorcycle club member comes home from a proper day's work to help change his child's nappies. Much better is rape, pillage, bite heads off chickens and drug deal/manufacture.I don't believe all that governments tell us. War in Vietnam because of those so bad commies and the "domino effect", all of SEA will fall. Well it did'nt but it cost the lives of 50k Americans and millions of Vietnamese. We are not or at war in Laos. How many million tons of ordnance? There are WMD in Iraq, Saddam has them, honest. Yeah right, and now look at the mess. Believe all that the press and governments spew out and want you to believe, because i don't and never have.

As for guilty by association, do not even get me started. How far have we fallen in freedom in the West? I had very very good friends in Germany in the early 80's do 5 years time, with no parole for exactly that. No crime, just guilty of association. Pathetic and disgusting.

Hey, I answered your question, I don't need a lecture on all the evils in the world. If you think this scumbag is squeaky clean and sings in the church choir, you're free to believe it. If I belonged to the KKK would you be justified in thinking I was a racist? I wonder how far your tolerance will extend once we reach a point of total anarchy. Will you then reflect that maybe we should have done a bit more with reigning in the bad guys before they took over?

No, you did'nt. Your proof is guilt by association. Only. My point was don't believe everything in the press or what governments tell us is the "right" thing. Being a member of the KKK means you believe in White Supremacy, and you are a racist. Being a member of the Bandidos MC means you ride a motorcycle and like the brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle. It does not mean you are a criminal.

Now, back in the 70's and 80's the Federal Government of the USA tried the RICO act against the Hells Angels in California. The first case cost the government over 5 million dollars, a lot of money back then. Both cases failed, and all subsequent criminal organisation cases against them have failed. Now why is that?

# Good lawyers?

# Crap prosecution?

# Or just that, maybe, they were NOT a criminal organisation.

Lets go more recent. Last year in Australia, 700 various police raided 110 properties belonging to 70 members of a motorcycle club. 10 were charged with 100 illegal items, weapons, drugs, stolen whatevers. That means 60 were not charged. That to me signifies that those 70 were not part of a criminal organisation, but 10 were up to no good. If it was a criminal organisation, surely we would have seen 70 arrests. N'est pas?

Let's take a look at the AVERAGE outlaw motorcycle club (note the word club, not what the government wants us to say - "gang" - sounds nastier, right) charter's membership;

say there are 12 members. Employment would be broken down thus;

# 2 x mechanics, cars or bikes or buses or trucks.

# 1 x truck driver.

# 1 x bike shop owner/operator (may employ the above mechanics).

# 1 x nightclub security doorman.

# 1 x restaurant/nightclub owner/operator (may employ the above doorman).

# 1 x carpenter.

# 1 x construction worker.

# 1 x tattooist or tattoo shop owner.

# 1 x unemployed, claiming welfare for whatever.

# 1 x drug dealer.

# 1 x other naughty boy into whatever, selling the above's drugs, stealing vehicles, whatever.

As long as hard drugs ie heroin or crack cocaine are not used or peddled, kiddie fiddling or porn is not dealt in, LE, it is of no concern what your profession is to other members, be it legit or not.

Now 2, maybe 3 of the above are up to no good. Maybe one of the mechanics loans the drug dealer some money for a bigger drug deal. Maybe the drug dealer sells drugs to the restaurant owner.

But, i can guarantee you that the above is NOT organised crime between 12 people, and that motorcycle clubs do not work as a complete organised crime gang. It just does'nt happen. There are no orders from the top "officers" down to the "soldiers" to go out and become criminals for monetary gain. It just does not work like that. And hence no court in any country can prove otherwise. Do not believe all that sensasionalist documentary crap on the television about biker gangs. Or SOA.

[thaiguzzi]

Righty-o then. By the way what's Master at Arms? I don't keep my head in the sand, quite the opposite, i don't believe sensationalist press with bad journalism. Not very headline grabbing is it when a motorcycle club member comes home from a proper day's work to help change his child's nappies. Much better is rape, pillage, bite heads off chickens and drug deal/manufacture.I don't believe all that governments tell us. War in Vietnam because of those so bad commies and the "domino effect", all of SEA will fall. Well it did'nt but it cost the lives of 50k Americans and millions of Vietnamese. We are not or at war in Laos. How many million tons of ordnance? There are WMD in Iraq, Saddam has them, honest. Yeah right, and now look at the mess. Believe all that the press and governments spew out and want you to believe, because i don't and never have.

As for guilty by association, do not even get me started. How far have we fallen in freedom in the West? I had very very good friends in Germany in the early 80's do 5 years time, with no parole for exactly that. No crime, just guilty of association. Pathetic and disgusting.

Hey, I answered your question, I don't need a lecture on all the evils in the world. If you think this scumbag is squeaky clean and sings in the church choir, you're free to believe it. If I belonged to the KKK would you be justified in thinking I was a racist? I wonder how far your tolerance will extend once we reach a point of total anarchy. Will you then reflect that maybe we should have done a bit more with reigning in the bad guys before they took over?

SERGEANT AT ARMS

The sergeant at arms is basically the club's “policeman” although most would not like to be referred to in this way! He enforces club procedures and maintains order at club meetings. The sergeant is in charge of security at club's events and he is responsible for “back ups” (attacks on rivals). The sergeant looks after the club's firearms and other weapons.

The sergeant at arms is sometimes known as the “master of arms”, (although “sergeant at arms” has become much more common). The sergeant wears a military style sergeant’s badge.

Nice quote from whichever book you read it in. Except i've never, ever seen a military style sergeant's badge on a SOA in a proper 1% MC.

[giddyup]

Being a member of the Bandidos MC means you ride a motorcycle and like the brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle. It does not mean you are a criminal.

Yes it does, it means you are a criminal by association. I don't know why you can't grasp that, it's really not that complex. You can't belong to a criminal organisation, and this is what it is, and be squeaky clean. If you see it differently, your choice, but quite honestly I'm sick of arguing the point on it. The Australian government acted perfectly within their rights and threw out some trash, you want to defend these a-holes as being nothing more than fun-loving motorcycle enthusiasts, all I can say is you're deluded.

"The Bandidos Motorcycle Club, also known as the Bandido Nation, is a "one-percenter" motorcycle club^[1][2][3] and organized crime syndicate with a worldwide membership. The club was formed in 1966 by Don Chambers in Texas. Its motto is "We are the people our parents warned us about." It is estimated to have 2,400 members in 210 chapters, located in 22 countries. The club considers itself to be an outlaw motorcycle club. The Federal Bureau of Investigation and the Criminal Intelligence Service Canada have named the Bandidos an "outlaw motorcycle gang".^[4]

Edited May 21, 2015 by giddyup

[thaiguzzi]

I'm sick of arguing the point with people who have no first hand knowledge of MC clubs and can only quote Wiki-garbage passed on down by people with an agenda. No, i cannot grasp guilty by association. I grew up in the West, not N. Korea or Russia. And the points i made about criminal organisations, average membership of MC clubs, lack of successful worldwide court cases as clubs rather than individuals has gone completely over your head. Believe the FBI and CIA and federal governments all you like, i don't.

[giddyup]

I'm sick of arguing the point with people who have no first hand knowledge of MC clubs and can only quote Wiki-garbage passed on down by people with an agenda. No, i cannot grasp guilty by association. I grew up in the West, not N. Korea or Russia. And the points i made about criminal organisations, average membership of MC clubs, lack of successful worldwide court cases as clubs rather than individuals has gone completely over your head. Believe the FBI and CIA and federal governments all you like, i don't.

It wouldn't matter how much evidence was presented to you , you still wouldn't accept the facts. All sources are biased according to you. Perhaps you need to leave your conspiracy theory world and join the real world.

Edited May 21, 2015 by giddyup

[sambum]

Australia is in persecution mode now with new laws whereby you can be criminalised just for being in a 'motorbike gang' regardless of whether you actually did anything wrong. People are getting harassed by police just for having a motorbike. One guy recently went to put fuel in his Harley at a local petrol station and 21 police cars showed up to harrass him, he wasn't in a gang and didn't do anything. He said this happens almost daily now.

Where did you get this information from

21 police cars to harass 1 guy on a motorbike? 2 things spring to mind here - drink and "Chinese Whispers"

[thaiguzzi]

The fact is, this man is according to the Australian Government, guilty by association. You, nor they have presented any factual evidence of criminality by this said man. Being tattooed and a member of an MC does not make a criminal, nor an undesirable. Spewing forth racial hate speeches by a Moslem Immam in downtown London does.

[Time Traveller]

I'm sick of arguing the point with people who have no first hand knowledge of MC clubs and can only quote Wiki-garbage passed on down by people with an agenda. No, i cannot grasp guilty by association. I grew up in the West, not N. Korea or Russia. .

Obviously you didn't grow up in Australia. It is a law there. Anti-consorting. Google it.

Australia doesn't have the civil liberties like other countries such as the US have.

So quit crying and telling us that all the biker gangsters are really angels doing Gods work. I can't understand why you would care one way or another unless you yourself is in the same situation..

Edited May 21, 2015 by Time Traveller

[samran]

So no evidence this guy has done something wrong other than be a member of an MC Club and using the excuse that refusal is based on his alleged charachter because he is in an MC club what an ignorant and bigoted approach

If he was committing crimes where there is proof OK no problem but when there is NO EVIDENCE of that then it is just a sad reflection on Australia and as for all you saddo's that are prepared to hang a guy because of the way he looks or your bigoted views on Bikers and Biker clubs well I wont say what I really want since i am coming off a months holiday already.

You dont even know the guy but are happy to have him removed from his family and kids on nothing more than made up crap.

Funny, one of Thai Visa's leading members of the hang'em high crew has a soft spot for criminal bikers.

Fortunately australian immigration law carries with it what is know as a 'character test'. The minister has ultimate discretion. He can not like your breath and ban you.

The cretin probably came over to oz as a young child 10 pound pom. Failed to ever naturalise - and this is the result.

Howis that, an immigrant who never bothered to fit into being defended by the red neck mob on TV.

Oh the irony....

[samran]

The fact is, this man is according to the Australian Government, guilty by association. You, nor they have presented any factual evidence of criminality by this said man. Being tattooed and a member of an MC does not make a criminal, nor an undesirable. Spewing forth racial hate speeches by a Moslem Immam in downtown London does.

Yes cause bikie crews are well known outposts of religious and racial tolerance...and we'll known for their acceptance of outsiders.

So if I started parading around in his particular clubs kit and got one of their tats? I wonder what would happen? Lawful and charitable acceptance I bet...

Edited May 21, 2015 by samran

[sambum]

Being a member of the Bandidos MC means you ride a motorcycle and like the brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle. It does not mean you are a criminal.

Yes it does, it means you are a criminal by association. I don't know why you can't grasp that, it's really not that complex. You can't belong to a criminal organisation, and this is what it is, and be squeaky clean. If you see it differently, your choice, but quite honestly I'm sick of arguing the point on it. The Australian government acted perfectly within their rights and threw out some trash, you want to defend these a-holes as being nothing more than fun-loving motorcycle enthusiasts, all I can say is you're deluded.

"The Bandidos Motorcycle Club, also known as the Bandido Nation, is a "one-percenter" motorcycle club^[1][2][3] and organized crime syndicate with a worldwide membership. The club was formed in 1966 by Don Chambers in Texas. Its motto is "We are the people our parents warned us about." It is estimated to have 2,400 members in 210 chapters, located in 22 countries. The club considers itself to be an outlaw motorcycle club. The Federal Bureau of Investigation and the Criminal Intelligence Service Canada have named the Bandidos an "outlaw motorcycle gang".^[4]

I posted the same information on Post #368, and it's obvious that some people can not get their head round the fact that The Bandidos Motorcycle Club IS an "organised crime syndicate with a worldwide membership", an "outlaw motorcycle gang" (according to the CIA and the FBI) and people do NOT join a club like that for the "brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle"! And sorry to have to repeat myself, and repeat your post Giddyup, but some people just don't want to see it, and won't see it, no matter what evidence you present to them.

Everybody else - you, me, the FBI, the CIA, the Australian Government, and no doubt other governments and reputable organisations are wrong, and the Bandidos are just a friendly bunch of guys who like nothing better than a spin out in the country with their mates and everybody has a simply spiffing time, don't you know?

[Time Traveller]

Are the guys wife and kids Aussy citizens....?

If the guy ain't a citizen and is KNOWN to be involved in stuff, is on Aussy RADAR then they have every right to deny entry back to Auss, one less to spend tax payers money on.

I don't know HIS story, was he employed, paid taxes etc..Any one know...?

He was a Bandido, yes, he had a job flipping burgers at Burger King. Part-time he bashed people and helped manufacture and distribute speed.

Proof? Re the bashing people and drugs bit. I mean real proof he personally did those things. Thought so. You, and all the rest, inc the Federal Australian Government have no proof he personally is a criminal. Just an "undesirable" in today's Nanny Conformist state.

You really are failing to see the forest for the trees. The fact he had no criminal record is not relevent. Why would any sensible government waste millions of dollars of taxpayer money throught the courts just to convict a foreigner when he was already outside the country and you had the power to prevent them from coming back? It was the easiest cheapest solution to get rid of an organized crime figure.

If you think he was innocent, then show me another burger flipper that got banned from the country?

[sambum]

One less pom can't be too bad !

Don't forget your roots, cobber! Besides, it sounds like you could do with getting rid of a few of his Aussie chums as well, old chap!

Quite a few of the less intelligent may still believe that Australia is largely British, but that all started to change in the 60s when large scale migration was sought from elsewhere.

Australia now is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet.

An Australian's roots could very easily have been germinated anywhere on Earth.

Now, less than 10% were born in the Old Blighted. Many Brits cling to their roots and refuse to take up Australian Citizenship, which is one of the reasons a high proportion of deported crims come from there.

It's good to be able to send a few back, wish we could start with Londoner, Tony Abbott!

Chum.

" large scale migration was sought from elsewhere."

Nice to know that you welcome everybody with open arms - perhaps you could take in some Rohingya Muslims as it seems nobody else wants them.

Cobber.

[sambum]

One less pom can't be too bad !

Don't forget your roots, cobber! Besides, it sounds like you could do with getting rid of a few of his Aussie chums as well, old chap!

Quite a few of the less intelligent may still believe that Australia is largely British, but that all started to change in the 60s when large scale migration was sought from elsewhere.

Australia now is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet.

An Australian's roots could very easily have been germinated anywhere on Earth.

Now, less than 10% were born in the Old Blighted. Many Brits cling to their roots and refuse to take up Australian Citizenship, which is one of the reasons a high proportion of deported crims come from there.

It's good to be able to send a few back, wish we could start with Londoner, Tony Abbott!

Chum.

" large scale migration was sought from elsewhere."

"Australia now is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet."

Seems like you welcome everybody with open arms - perhaps you might like to take in some Rohingya Muslims as it seems nobody else wants them.

Cobber.

Edited May 21, 2015 by sambum

[giddyup]

One less pom can't be too bad !

Don't forget your roots, cobber! Besides, it sounds like you could do with getting rid of a few of his Aussie chums as well, old chap!

Quite a few of the less intelligent may still believe that Australia is largely British, but that all started to change in the 60s when large scale migration was sought from elsewhere.

Australia now is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet.

An Australian's roots could very easily have been germinated anywhere on Earth.

Now, less than 10% were born in the Old Blighted. Many Brits cling to their roots and refuse to take up Australian Citizenship, which is one of the reasons a high proportion of deported crims come from there.

It's good to be able to send a few back, wish we could start with Londoner, Tony Abbott!

Chum.

" large scale migration was sought from elsewhere."

Nice to know that you welcome everybody with open arms - perhaps you could take in some Rohingya Muslims as it seems nobody else wants them.

Cobber.

I don't see any muslim countries welcoming them with open arms and yet they are their muslim brothers and sisters. Strange that.

[giddyup]

Being a member of the Bandidos MC means you ride a motorcycle and like the brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle. It does not mean you are a criminal.

Yes it does, it means you are a criminal by association. I don't know why you can't grasp that, it's really not that complex. You can't belong to a criminal organisation, and this is what it is, and be squeaky clean. If you see it differently, your choice, but quite honestly I'm sick of arguing the point on it. The Australian government acted perfectly within their rights and threw out some trash, you want to defend these a-holes as being nothing more than fun-loving motorcycle enthusiasts, all I can say is you're deluded.

"The Bandidos Motorcycle Club, also known as the Bandido Nation, is a "one-percenter" motorcycle club^[1][2][3] and organized crime syndicate with a worldwide membership. The club was formed in 1966 by Don Chambers in Texas. Its motto is "We are the people our parents warned us about." It is estimated to have 2,400 members in 210 chapters, located in 22 countries. The club considers itself to be an outlaw motorcycle club. The Federal Bureau of Investigation and the Criminal Intelligence Service Canada have named the Bandidos an "outlaw motorcycle gang".^[4]

I posted the same information on Post #368, and it's obvious that some people can not get their head round the fact that The Bandidos Motorcycle Club IS an "organised crime syndicate with a worldwide membership", an "outlaw motorcycle gang" (according to the CIA and the FBI) and people do NOT join a club like that for the "brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle"! And sorry to have to repeat myself, and repeat your post Giddyup, but some people just don't want to see it, and won't see it, no matter what evidence you present to them.

Everybody else - you, me, the FBI, the CIA, the Australian Government, and no doubt other governments and reputable organisations are wrong, and the Bandidos are just a friendly bunch of guys who like nothing better than a spin out in the country with their mates and everybody has a simply spiffing time, don't you know?

Thaiguzzi is a conspiracy theorist. According to him Wikipedia, the FBI, or any source that calls the Bandidos a criminal enterprise is lying. He thinks they are nothing but enthusiastic motorcyclists who have been badly maligned.

Edited May 21, 2015 by giddyup

[Si Thea01]

Righty-o then. By the way what's Master at Arms? I don't keep my head in the sand, quite the opposite, i don't believe sensationalist press with bad journalism. Not very headline grabbing is it when a motorcycle club member comes home from a proper day's work to help change his child's nappies. Much better is rape, pillage, bite heads off chickens and drug deal/manufacture.I don't believe all that governments tell us. War in Vietnam because of those so bad commies and the "domino effect", all of SEA will fall. Well it did'nt but it cost the lives of 50k Americans and millions of Vietnamese. We are not or at war in Laos. How many million tons of ordnance? There are WMD in Iraq, Saddam has them, honest. Yeah right, and now look at the mess. Believe all that the press and governments spew out and want you to believe, because i don't and never have.

As for guilty by association, do not even get me started. How far have we fallen in freedom in the West? I had very very good friends in Germany in the early 80's do 5 years time, with no parole for exactly that. No crime, just guilty of association. Pathetic and disgusting.

Hey, I answered your question, I don't need a lecture on all the evils in the world. If you think this scumbag is squeaky clean and sings in the church choir, you're free to believe it. If I belonged to the KKK would you be justified in thinking I was a racist? I wonder how far your tolerance will extend once we reach a point of total anarchy. Will you then reflect that maybe we should have done a bit more with reigning in the bad guys before they took over?

No, you did'nt. Your proof is guilt by association. Only. My point was don't believe everything in the press or what governments tell us is the "right" thing. Being a member of the KKK means you believe in White Supremacy, and you are a racist. Being a member of the Bandidos MC means you ride a motorcycle and like the brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle. It does not mean you are a criminal.

Now, back in the 70's and 80's the Federal Government of the USA tried the RICO act against the Hells Angels in California. The first case cost the government over 5 million dollars, a lot of money back then. Both cases failed, and all subsequent criminal organisation cases against them have failed. Now why is that?

# Good lawyers?

# Crap prosecution?

# Or just that, maybe, they were NOT a criminal organisation.

Lets go more recent. Last year in Australia, 700 various police raided 110 properties belonging to 70 members of a motorcycle club. 10 were charged with 100 illegal items, weapons, drugs, stolen whatevers. That means 60 were not charged. That to me signifies that those 70 were not part of a criminal organisation, but 10 were up to no good. If it was a criminal organisation, surely we would have seen 70 arrests. N'est pas?

Let's take a look at the AVERAGE outlaw motorcycle club (note the word club, not what the government wants us to say - "gang" - sounds nastier, right) charter's membership;

say there are 12 members. Employment would be broken down thus;

# 2 x mechanics, cars or bikes or buses or trucks.

# 1 x truck driver.

# 1 x bike shop owner/operator (may employ the above mechanics).

# 1 x nightclub security doorman.

# 1 x restaurant/nightclub owner/operator (may employ the above doorman).

# 1 x carpenter.

# 1 x construction worker.

# 1 x tattooist or tattoo shop owner.

# 1 x unemployed, claiming welfare for whatever.

# 1 x drug dealer.

# 1 x other naughty boy into whatever, selling the above's drugs, stealing vehicles, whatever.

As long as hard drugs ie heroin or crack cocaine are not used or peddled, kiddie fiddling or porn is not dealt in, LE, it is of no concern what your profession is to other members, be it legit or not.

Now 2, maybe 3 of the above are up to no good. Maybe one of the mechanics loans the drug dealer some money for a bigger drug deal. Maybe the drug dealer sells drugs to the restaurant owner.

But, i can guarantee you that the above is NOT organised crime between 12 people, and that motorcycle clubs do not work as a complete organised crime gang. It just does'nt happen. There are no orders from the top "officers" down to the "soldiers" to go out and become criminals for monetary gain. It just does not work like that. And hence no court in any country can prove otherwise. Do not believe all that sensasionalist documentary crap on the television about biker gangs. Or SOA.

What is your position within the club, PR Officer. Who are you kidding about being a member of the Bandidos means riding a motorcycle and liking the brotherhood/camaraderie lifestyle. So they are Genteel people, misunderstood and are not a threat to anyone. If you believe that then you are off in fairyland. These groups hide behind these images so why are you proffering this BS. They're in it for the ego, status and money that can be earned from criminal activity. Nothing more, nothing less. They are violent and anti-social and will threaten, intimidate and mistreat the general public, police or any others who get in their way.

Guilt by association. Lets look at this. Now, obviously you would agree that as members of a club, gang, or whatever you want to call it, they're in an association and because of their alleged liking the brotherhood/camaraderie lifestyle, as you put it, then would you agree that they'd be an exceptionally close nit group? So, being a member and not committing any offences, one would, despite this, be viewed as being involved in whatever criminal activity was being carried out. Hence the term, "Guilty by Association." In addition, by their closeness, and knowing what is going on, they are being complicit in any criminal activity undertaken. Remember, you are judged by the company you keep

Now for the Bandidos. Formed in 1983, in Australia, after a rift between various Comanchero Chapters. In September 1984, the Milperra Massacre occurred, a shoot out in a hotel car park, the result, 7 dead, including a 14 year old innocent female. Being a Bandidos' member means just riding a motorcycle and liking the brotherhood and camaraderie? Are you sure of this?

A brief history for you. Formed in Texas in 1966, more than 200 Chapters worldwide, about 30 in Australia. The club has international, national, and local chapters. Each has the offices of president, vice president, secretary and sergeant-at-arms. The US-based international president, oversees international expansion and governs the organisation overall. So far, what you have posted does not stack up, does it?

There has been many police raids over the years where amphetamines, heroin, AK 47 and shotguns have been confiscated. There have been murders, the shutting down of drug labs, etc., etc., I could go on an one but I won't, however, if you post, do so factually and not with the hoo hah you have now. Another snippet for you, they also associate with the Mongols Motorcycle Club, who now have Chapters in every state of Australia and are considered, by US authorities to be the most dangerous and violent biker gang in the USA. If you took time to check, then you would see that there have been numerous convictions recorded, not as you are now allegeding.

[malt25]

The fact is, this man is according to the Australian Government, guilty by association. You, nor they have presented any factual evidence of criminality by this said man. Being tattooed and a member of an MC does not make a criminal, nor an undesirable. Spewing forth racial hate speeches by a Moslem Immam in downtown London does.

Sorry, I beg to differ. The Australian immigration department, and it would appear the majority of thinking Australians DO consider him to be UNDESIRABLE.

When will the likes of you get your head around the fact that you don't have to have a criminal record to be denied entry to a country. I accept you don't like it or agree with it. There's heaps of rules & laws & regulations in both Thailand & Australia that I don't like or agree with. But, if I wish to live in either country I do have to accept them, like them or not.

He has been classed as an undesirable by the appropriate Australian authority. If he wishes he can appeal, he probably will. His case will progress through the system, as it should. Until then, the immigration system is working as it's been designed to. I accept & respect your right to your opinion, but having said opinion isn't going to change a thing.

[giddyup]

One less pom can't be too bad !

Don't forget your roots, cobber! Besides, it sounds like you could do with getting rid of a few of his Aussie chums as well, old chap!

Quite a few of the less intelligent may still believe that Australia is largely British, but that all started to change in the 60s when large scale migration was sought from elsewhere.

Australia now is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet.

An Australian's roots could very easily have been germinated anywhere on Earth.

Now, less than 10% were born in the Old Blighted. Many Brits cling to their roots and refuse to take up Australian Citizenship, which is one of the reasons a high proportion of deported crims come from there.

It's good to be able to send a few back, wish we could start with Londoner, Tony Abbott!

Chum.

" large scale migration was sought from elsewhere."

"Australia now is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet."

Seems like you welcome everybody with open arms - perhaps you might like to take in some Rohingya Muslims as it seems nobody else wants them.

Cobber.

What about Brunei? They're muslim and a very rich country, only 420,000 population, surely they'd have plenty of room.

[Don Mega]

Australia is in persecution mode now with new laws whereby you can be criminalised just for being in a 'motorbike gang' regardless of whether you actually did anything wrong. People are getting harassed by police just for having a motorbike. One guy recently went to put fuel in his Harley at a local petrol station and 21 police cars showed up to harrass him, he wasn't in a gang and didn't do anything. He said this happens almost daily now.

Where did you get this information from

21 police cars to harass 1 guy on a motorbike? 2 things spring to mind here - drink and "Chinese Whispers"

Yeah was not 21 police cars (I assume this is the incident in question) but it was still way over the top.. but is typical of how it is now in Queensland.

[sambum]

In reply to giddyup Post #567 dated today:-

I've suggested already that the Middle East would be an ideal location as it is really their spiritual homeland, but as yet all those Muslim countries are keeping quiet on the subject. In the meantime, maybe skippy and old croc will do what they can to facilitate them entry to "one of the most ethnically diverse countries on the planet"? I am sure that probably Birmingham UK might be able to provide some more Muslims if they so wish, as Australia seems to have an awful lot of undeveloped land. (They'd probably appreciate the warmer climate!)

But first of all old croc would probably have to persuade Australian PM Tony Abbott to pass some legislation before shipping him back off to London! :-

"'Nope, nope, nope': Tony Abbott says Australia will not resettle refugees in migrant crisis"

Edited May 21, 2015 by sambum

[thaiguzzi]

Righty-o then. By the way what's Master at Arms? I don't keep my head in the sand, quite the opposite, i don't believe sensationalist press with bad journalism. Not very headline grabbing is it when a motorcycle club member comes home from a proper day's work to help change his child's nappies. Much better is rape, pillage, bite heads off chickens and drug deal/manufacture.I don't believe all that governments tell us. War in Vietnam because of those so bad commies and the "domino effect", all of SEA will fall. Well it did'nt but it cost the lives of 50k Americans and millions of Vietnamese. We are not or at war in Laos. How many million tons of ordnance? There are WMD in Iraq, Saddam has them, honest. Yeah right, and now look at the mess. Believe all that the press and governments spew out and want you to believe, because i don't and never have.

As for guilty by association, do not even get me started. How far have we fallen in freedom in the West? I had very very good friends in Germany in the early 80's do 5 years time, with no parole for exactly that. No crime, just guilty of association. Pathetic and disgusting.

Hey, I answered your question, I don't need a lecture on all the evils in the world. If you think this scumbag is squeaky clean and sings in the church choir, you're free to believe it. If I belonged to the KKK would you be justified in thinking I was a racist? I wonder how far your tolerance will extend once we reach a point of total anarchy. Will you then reflect that maybe we should have done a bit more with reigning in the bad guys before they took over?

No, you did'nt. Your proof is guilt by association. Only. My point was don't believe everything in the press or what governments tell us is the "right" thing. Being a member of the KKK means you believe in White Supremacy, and you are a racist. Being a member of the Bandidos MC means you ride a motorcycle and like the brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle. It does not mean you are a criminal.

Now, back in the 70's and 80's the Federal Government of the USA tried the RICO act against the Hells Angels in California. The first case cost the government over 5 million dollars, a lot of money back then. Both cases failed, and all subsequent criminal organisation cases against them have failed. Now why is that?

# Good lawyers?

# Crap prosecution?

# Or just that, maybe, they were NOT a criminal organisation.

Lets go more recent. Last year in Australia, 700 various police raided 110 properties belonging to 70 members of a motorcycle club. 10 were charged with 100 illegal items, weapons, drugs, stolen whatevers. That means 60 were not charged. That to me signifies that those 70 were not part of a criminal organisation, but 10 were up to no good. If it was a criminal organisation, surely we would have seen 70 arrests. N'est pas?

Let's take a look at the AVERAGE outlaw motorcycle club (note the word club, not what the government wants us to say - "gang" - sounds nastier, right) charter's membership;

say there are 12 members. Employment would be broken down thus;

# 2 x mechanics, cars or bikes or buses or trucks.

# 1 x truck driver.

# 1 x bike shop owner/operator (may employ the above mechanics).

# 1 x nightclub security doorman.

# 1 x restaurant/nightclub owner/operator (may employ the above doorman).

# 1 x carpenter.

# 1 x construction worker.

# 1 x tattooist or tattoo shop owner.

# 1 x unemployed, claiming welfare for whatever.

# 1 x drug dealer.

# 1 x other naughty boy into whatever, selling the above's drugs, stealing vehicles, whatever.

As long as hard drugs ie heroin or crack cocaine are not used or peddled, kiddie fiddling or porn is not dealt in, LE, it is of no concern what your profession is to other members, be it legit or not.

Now 2, maybe 3 of the above are up to no good. Maybe one of the mechanics loans the drug dealer some money for a bigger drug deal. Maybe the drug dealer sells drugs to the restaurant owner.

But, i can guarantee you that the above is NOT organised crime between 12 people, and that motorcycle clubs do not work as a complete organised crime gang. It just does'nt happen. There are no orders from the top "officers" down to the "soldiers" to go out and become criminals for monetary gain. It just does not work like that. And hence no court in any country can prove otherwise. Do not believe all that sensasionalist documentary crap on the television about biker gangs. Or SOA.

What is your position within the club, PR Officer. Who are you kidding about being a member of the Bandidos means riding a motorcycle and liking the brotherhood/camaraderie lifestyle. So they are Genteel people, misunderstood and are not a threat to anyone. If you believe that then you are off in fairyland. These groups hide behind these images so why are you proffering this BS. They're in it for the ego, status and money that can be earned from criminal activity. Nothing more, nothing less. They are violent and anti-social and will threaten, intimidate and mistreat the general public, police or any others who get in their way.

Guilt by association. Lets look at this. Now, obviously you would agree that as members of a club, gang, or whatever you want to call it, they're in an association and because of their alleged liking the brotherhood/camaraderie lifestyle, as you put it, then would you agree that they'd be an exceptionally close nit group? So, being a member and not committing any offences, one would, despite this, be viewed as being involved in whatever criminal activity was being carried out. Hence the term, "Guilty by Association." In addition, by their closeness, and knowing what is going on, they are being complicit in any criminal activity undertaken. Remember, you are judged by the company you keep

Now for the Bandidos. Formed in 1983, in Australia, after a rift between various Comanchero Chapters. In September 1984, the Milperra Massacre occurred, a shoot out in a hotel car park, the result, 7 dead, including a 14 year old innocent female. Being a Bandidos' member means just riding a motorcycle and liking the brotherhood and camaraderie? Are you sure of this?

A brief history for you. Formed in Texas in 1966, more than 200 Chapters worldwide, about 30 in Australia. The club has international, national, and local chapters. Each has the offices of president, vice president, secretary and sergeant-at-arms. The US-based international president, oversees international expansion and governs the organisation overall. So far, what you have posted does not stack up, does it?

There has been many police raids over the years where amphetamines, heroin, AK 47 and shotguns have been confiscated. There have been murders, the shutting down of drug labs, etc., etc., I could go on an one but I won't, however, if you post, do so factually and not with the hoo hah you have now. Another snippet for you, they also associate with the Mongols Motorcycle Club, who now have Chapters in every state of Australia and are considered, by US authorities to be the most dangerous and violent biker gang in the USA. If you took time to check, then you would see that there have been numerous convictions recorded, not as you are now allegeding.

1. I aint got nothing to do with the Bandidos.

2. I lived the"outlaw motorcycle club" lifestyle from the age of 19 to 41. Hence i know what i'm talking about.

3. Quoting stuff from Wiki and watching television documentaries does not make one an expert.

4. Yes individuals have done some very naughty things, some even illegal, and been caught, killed, jailed, whatever, but where are the complete club crim organisation take downs? The whole club being caught as an organisation?

Have a nice day.

[thaiguzzi]

The fact is, this man is according to the Australian Government, guilty by association. You, nor they have presented any factual evidence of criminality by this said man. Being tattooed and a member of an MC does not make a criminal, nor an undesirable. Spewing forth racial hate speeches by a Moslem Immam in downtown London does.

Yes cause bikie crews are well known outposts of religious and racial tolerance...and we'll known for their acceptance of outsiders.

So if I started parading around in his particular clubs kit and got one of their tats? I wonder what would happen? Lawful and charitable acceptance I bet...

Its pretty obvious. You'd get a deserved stomping.

[Richard W]

What has either of those two things got to do with anything? The dummy never got Australian citizenship, his visa was refused on the fact he belongs to a major criminal enterprise. His wife and children are free to join him anywhere he's accepted. Australia has just thrown out some trash. End of.

There's a British law that says that a dual national can lose British citizenship if so doing is conducive to the public good. (Whether it means what it says has not been tested in court, but it has been successfully used in severer cases.) Perhaps he didn't realise that Australian citizenship would have protected him. As has been pointed out, he'd also have been protected by the right to a family life if Britain and Australia were reversed.

Unless his wife is also British, and we haven't heard that she is, she basically can't join him in the UK unless he gets a job earning £18,600 a year or he has substantial cash savings and can risk exposing them to government actions. She may also face character issues.

Why should his family have their whole life disrupted because of a presumption.

He has not been convicted of anything.

To treat someone like this who has been resident for 24 years is wrong.

If he has done something then prosecute, convict, then expel.

Very few of the people stripped of British citizenship were convicted of anything relevant beforehand - or since.

[Jay Sata]

A few basic points.

He is not an Australian citizen.

He lived in Oz on a visa.

Anyone anywhere residing on a visa is at risk of it not being renewed.

Hence his current problem.

The Thai goverment can expel hundreds of thousands of farangs who exist on the whim of an immigration officer or a clampdown on not complying with visa rules.

He is highlighted on the press radar now so can expect to be leaving Thailand any day soon for a nice UK winter.

[samran]

The fact is, this man is according to the Australian Government, guilty by association. You, nor they have presented any factual evidence of criminality by this said man. Being tattooed and a member of an MC does not make a criminal, nor an undesirable. Spewing forth racial hate speeches by a Moslem Immam in downtown London does.

Yes cause bikie crews are well known outposts of religious and racial tolerance...and we'll known for their acceptance of outsiders.

So if I started parading around in his particular clubs kit and got one of their tats? I wonder what would happen? Lawful and charitable acceptance I bet...

Its pretty obvious. You'd get a deserved stomping.

Ha ha. A bikie apologist in our midst!

Why would a stomping be deserved? What were you saying about hate speech?

Edited May 21, 2015 by samran

[Don Mega]

The fact is, this man is according to the Australian Government, guilty by association. You, nor they have presented any factual evidence of criminality by this said man. Being tattooed and a member of an MC does not make a criminal, nor an undesirable. Spewing forth racial hate speeches by a Moslem Immam in downtown London does.

No factual evidence of any criminal activity is actually required, there mere fact he is one of them is enough.

[Si Thea01]

Righty-o then. By the way what's Master at Arms? I don't keep my head in the sand, quite the opposite, i don't believe sensationalist press with bad journalism. Not very headline grabbing is it when a motorcycle club member comes home from a proper day's work to help change his child's nappies. Much better is rape, pillage, bite heads off chickens and drug deal/manufacture.I don't believe all that governments tell us. War in Vietnam because of those so bad commies and the "domino effect", all of SEA will fall. Well it did'nt but it cost the lives of 50k Americans and millions of Vietnamese. We are not or at war in Laos. How many million tons of ordnance? There are WMD in Iraq, Saddam has them, honest. Yeah right, and now look at the mess. Believe all that the press and governments spew out and want you to believe, because i don't and never have.

As for guilty by association, do not even get me started. How far have we fallen in freedom in the West? I had very very good friends in Germany in the early 80's do 5 years time, with no parole for exactly that. No crime, just guilty of association. Pathetic and disgusting.

Hey, I answered your question, I don't need a lecture on all the evils in the world. If you think this scumbag is squeaky clean and sings in the church choir, you're free to believe it. If I belonged to the KKK would you be justified in thinking I was a racist? I wonder how far your tolerance will extend once we reach a point of total anarchy. Will you then reflect that maybe we should have done a bit more with reigning in the bad guys before they took over?

No, you did'nt. Your proof is guilt by association. Only. My point was don't believe everything in the press or what governments tell us is the "right" thing. Being a member of the KKK means you believe in White Supremacy, and you are a racist. Being a member of the Bandidos MC means you ride a motorcycle and like the brotherhood/camaraderie of that lifestyle. It does not mean you are a criminal.

Now, back in the 70's and 80's the Federal Government of the USA tried the RICO act against the Hells Angels in California. The first case cost the government over 5 million dollars, a lot of money back then. Both cases failed, and all subsequent criminal organisation cases against them have failed. Now why is that?

# Good lawyers?

# Crap prosecution?

# Or just that, maybe, they were NOT a criminal organisation.

Lets go more recent. Last year in Australia, 700 various police raided 110 properties belonging to 70 members of a motorcycle club. 10 were charged with 100 illegal items, weapons, drugs, stolen whatevers. That means 60 were not charged. That to me signifies that those 70 were not part of a criminal organisation, but 10 were up to no good. If it was a criminal organisation, surely we would have seen 70 arrests. N'est pas?

Let's take a look at the AVERAGE outlaw motorcycle club (note the word club, not what the government wants us to say - "gang" - sounds nastier, right) charter's membership;

say there are 12 members. Employment would be broken down thus;

# 2 x mechanics, cars or bikes or buses or trucks.

# 1 x truck driver.

# 1 x bike shop owner/operator (may employ the above mechanics).

# 1 x nightclub security doorman.

# 1 x restaurant/nightclub owner/operator (may employ the above doorman).

# 1 x carpenter.

# 1 x construction worker.

# 1 x tattooist or tattoo shop owner.

# 1 x unemployed, claiming welfare for whatever.

# 1 x drug dealer.

# 1 x other naughty boy into whatever, selling the above's drugs, stealing vehicles, whatever.

As long as hard drugs ie heroin or crack cocaine are not used or peddled, kiddie fiddling or porn is not dealt in, LE, it is of no concern what your profession is to other members, be it legit or not.

Now 2, maybe 3 of the above are up to no good. Maybe one of the mechanics loans the drug dealer some money for a bigger drug deal. Maybe the drug dealer sells drugs to the restaurant owner.

But, i can guarantee you that the above is NOT organised crime between 12 people, and that motorcycle clubs do not work as a complete organised crime gang. It just does'nt happen. There are no orders from the top "officers" down to the "soldiers" to go out and become criminals for monetary gain. It just does not work like that. And hence no court in any country can prove otherwise. Do not believe all that sensasionalist documentary crap on the television about biker gangs. Or SOA.

What is your position within the club, PR Officer. Who are you kidding about being a member of the Bandidos means riding a motorcycle and liking the brotherhood/camaraderie lifestyle. So they are Genteel people, misunderstood and are not a threat to anyone. If you believe that then you are off in fairyland. These groups hide behind these images so why are you proffering this BS. They're in it for the ego, status and money that can be earned from criminal activity. Nothing more, nothing less. They are violent and anti-social and will threaten, intimidate and mistreat the general public, police or any others who get in their way.

Guilt by association. Lets look at this. Now, obviously you would agree that as members of a club, gang, or whatever you want to call it, they're in an association and because of their alleged liking the brotherhood/camaraderie lifestyle, as you put it, then would you agree that they'd be an exceptionally close nit group? So, being a member and not committing any offences, one would, despite this, be viewed as being involved in whatever criminal activity was being carried out. Hence the term, "Guilty by Association." In addition, by their closeness, and knowing what is going on, they are being complicit in any criminal activity undertaken. Remember, you are judged by the company you keep

Now for the Bandidos. Formed in 1983, in Australia, after a rift between various Comanchero Chapters. In September 1984, the Milperra Massacre occurred, a shoot out in a hotel car park, the result, 7 dead, including a 14 year old innocent female. Being a Bandidos' member means just riding a motorcycle and liking the brotherhood and camaraderie? Are you sure of this?

A brief history for you. Formed in Texas in 1966, more than 200 Chapters worldwide, about 30 in Australia. The club has international, national, and local chapters. Each has the offices of president, vice president, secretary and sergeant-at-arms. The US-based international president, oversees international expansion and governs the organisation overall. So far, what you have posted does not stack up, does it?

There has been many police raids over the years where amphetamines, heroin, AK 47 and shotguns have been confiscated. There have been murders, the shutting down of drug labs, etc., etc., I could go on an one but I won't, however, if you post, do so factually and not with the hoo hah you have now. Another snippet for you, they also associate with the Mongols Motorcycle Club, who now have Chapters in every state of Australia and are considered, by US authorities to be the most dangerous and violent biker gang in the USA. If you took time to check, then you would see that there have been numerous convictions recorded, not as you are now allegeding.

1. I aint got nothing to do with the Bandidos.

2. I lived the"outlaw motorcycle club" lifestyle from the age of 19 to 41. Hence i know what i'm talking about.

3. Quoting stuff from Wiki and watching television documentaries does not make one an expert.

4. Yes individuals have done some very naughty things, some even illegal, and been caught, killed, jailed, whatever, but where are the complete club crim organisation take downs? The whole club being caught as an organisation?

Have a nice day.

At least you're straight and have admitted to an association, even if not with the Bandidos, which was obvious from your post. Your might have lived the life, and sound intelligent, so why are you continuing to proffer and hide behind these good guy images. If you continue pronouncing this mantra, then in the long term you will believe the propaganda and continue with these misguided beliefs.

No, no documentaries but I was a police officer at the time of the Milperra Massacre, although not involved. Also, in 30 odd years of law enforcement I have my fair share of dealings with your so called clubs, and have met members that were amiable and quite likeable scallywags, despite their histories. Others I wouldn't feed. And believe me, those that I've had dealings with had substantial criminal histories, and yes, there were guys in those clubs who did not have a criminal record, maybe through luck rather than good management.

No, not an expert but if appears that in presenting something that one has knowledge of, combined with a some online research, causes you some discomfort. Is it because it highlights something that goes against what you are articulating or are you running with the hares and hunting with the hounds? You have a nice day also.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Si Thea01