Immigration Confirms The End Of Border Runs From Oct 1, 2006

[Big Dogster]

Amen to that, popshirt

[LaoPo]

I cannot really comment on the USA, but getting a tourist visa for Schengen via the Dutch Embassy in Bangkok was really easy. I got my Lao boyfriend a 90 days tourist visa a couple of weeks ago, it was approved and put in his passport the same day we applied. No hassles whatsoever. And of course this visa is valid for all Schengen countries, and contrary to Thailand, he doesn't have to leave the schengen area (like people have to do on multiple entry tourist visa after 60 days in Thailand). He can just stay 90 days. Of course after this 90 days, he cannot return to the schengen area for 90 days.

That is really unheard of.....I suppose you speak the truth, otherwise I simply wouldn't believe this story as I know the Dutch Embassies, especially in the Far East, are really 'BIG trouble' giving out Tourist-Visa.

In most cases they first consult the (IND) Immigration-authorities in The Netherlands before handing out a tourist visa.

Again: UNBELIEVABLE!.....

LaoPo

[Big Dogster]

So... 65,000 people in 2004, and some of these won't be coming in on visa on arrivals either, so actually the real number is lower again. So therefore, by my own criteria, not a big deal.

Probably no major impact on Thailand's income from tourism, but can be a major impact on other areas, even from the Thai perpective.

Take the fact that most foreign teachers in Thailand are working illegally. I assume most of them are doing the monthly visa runs.

What will that do to English Teaching in Thailand?

Thailand doesn't need to learn English, it's back to the stoneage

[sjaak327]

I cannot really comment on the USA, but getting a tourist visa for Schengen via the Dutch Embassy in Bangkok was really easy. I got my Lao boyfriend a 90 days tourist visa a couple of weeks ago, it was approved and put in his passport the same day we applied. No hassles whatsoever. And of course this visa is valid for all Schengen countries, and contrary to Thailand, he doesn't have to leave the schengen area (like people have to do on multiple entry tourist visa after 60 days in Thailand). He can just stay 90 days. Of course after this 90 days, he cannot return to the schengen area for 90 days.

That is really unheard of.....I suppose you speak the truth, otherwise I simply wouldn't believe this story as I know the Dutch Embassies, especially in the Far East, are really 'BIG trouble' giving out Tourist-Visa.

In most cases they first consult the (IND) Immigration-authorities in The Netherlands before handing out a tourist visa.

Again: UNBELIEVABLE!.....

LaoPo

Trust me, It is true. As I said, visa was dated and put in the passport the same day we applied !

Of course if they have to consult the IND, it will take a lot longer. But I'm guessing that the embassy at Soi Thongson, can decide on a tourist visa, without consulting the IND.

Actually the women who helped us, said simply, call tomorrow and you'll know if the visa is granted. That's what I did, I called the next day, and was told that we could collect the passport the next day (that can only be done between 8 and 8.30 in the morning).

[beammeup]

So... 65,000 people in 2004, and some of these won't be coming in on visa on arrivals either, so actually the real number is lower again. So therefore, by my own criteria, not a big deal.

Probably no major impact on Thailand's income from tourism, but can be a major impact on other areas, even from the Thai perpective.

Take the fact that most foreign teachers in Thailand are working illegally. I assume most of them are doing the monthly visa runs.

What will that do to English Teaching in Thailand?

Thailand doesn't need to learn English, it's back to the stoneage

Most of the english speaking people who would like to raise there kids to speak english will be leaving shortly so there woun't be any need for english teachers.

[LaoPo]

I cannot really comment on the USA, but getting a tourist visa for Schengen via the Dutch Embassy in Bangkok was really easy. I got my Lao boyfriend a 90 days tourist visa a couple of weeks ago, it was approved and put in his passport the same day we applied. No hassles whatsoever. And of course this visa is valid for all Schengen countries, and contrary to Thailand, he doesn't have to leave the schengen area (like people have to do on multiple entry tourist visa after 60 days in Thailand). He can just stay 90 days. Of course after this 90 days, he cannot return to the schengen area for 90 days.

That is really unheard of.....I suppose you speak the truth, otherwise I simply wouldn't believe this story as I know the Dutch Embassies, especially in the Far East, are really 'BIG trouble' giving out Tourist-Visa.

In most cases they first consult the (IND) Immigration-authorities in The Netherlands before handing out a tourist visa.

Again: UNBELIEVABLE!.....

LaoPo

Trust me, It is true. As I said, visa was dated and put in the passport the same day we applied !

Of course if they have to consult the IND, it will take a lot longer. But I'm guessing that the embassy at Soi Thongson, can decide on a tourist visa, without consulting the IND.

Actually the women who helped us, said simply, call tomorrow and you'll know if the visa is granted. That's what I did, I called the next day, and was told that we could collect the passport the next day (that can only be done between 8 and 8.30 in the morning).

You have been very lucky!

Didn't they even ask for 'proof' of income or other kind of assets of your boyfriend?

I'm still amazed to tell you the truth...

But, wish you good luck and have a nice stay in 'our' Schengen countries!

LaoPo

[sjaak327]

You have been very lucky!

Didn't they even ask for 'proof' of income or other kind of assets of your boyfriend?

I'm still amazed to tell you the truth...

But, wish you good luck and have a nice stay in 'our' Schengen countries!

LaoPo

Of course I needed to show proof of income, invitation letter legalised by the city council, but of course I prepared all of that documentation before we applied for the visa.

I presume I was lucky, but I also did my homework so to speak.

Actually if I would apply for a provisional stay, that would probably not be so easy. But again if that hurdle is taken, then of course my boyfriend can become a proper citizen, without the need to cross the border like in Thailand, he can own property and land, unlike Thailand. He can even work.

What I'm saying is that for sure in Europe you can become a normal citizen, with normal rights much more easier then in Thailand. Something to think about I would say.

[Maestro]

I'm just wondering, why you say it doesn't apply if it is not 90 days in a row. I mean, I read this as limiting an alien to three entries within a 90 day period, regardless of duration of stay.

George, whom you might call ThaiVisa’s official liaison man with the Immigration Bureau, called Immigration and obtained confirmation: the change in policy means “no more border hopping totalling more than 90 days in a row”

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Maestro

[sjaak327]

I'm just wondering, why you say it doesn't apply if it is not 90 days in a row. I mean, I read this as limiting an alien to three entries within a 90 day period, regardless of duration of stay.

George, whom you might call ThaiVisa’s official liaison man with the Immigration Bureau, called Immigration and obtained confirmation: the change in policy means “no more border hopping totalling more than 90 days in a row”

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Maestro

Right, so an easy way around this would be to do a visa run, and return the next day instead of the same day. We might get "border run guesthouses" in the neighboring countries

[cclub75]

George, whom you might call ThaiVisa’s official liaison man with the Immigration Bureau, called Immigration and obtained confirmation: the change in policy means “no more border hopping totalling more than 90 days in a row”

You sound very assertive.

So it would mean that 90 % of the all thread is pointless.

If it's really "in a row", then it's mean the target is only the people who make visa run "in the same day".

It means that if people do 30+30+30 days stamps (the meaning of "in a row"), and then go outside Thailand for 2 days and then enter Thailand again it will be OK. And then they can continue 30+30+30 + 2 outside etc.

I'm sorry, but I know that Immigration is probably not the most clever administration in Thailand, but if you are right, it would add insult to injury !

Edited September 11, 2006 by cclub75

[lingyai]

I'm just wondering, why you say it doesn't apply if it is not 90 days in a row. I mean, I read this as limiting an alien to three entries within a 90 day period, regardless of duration of stay.

George, whom you might call ThaiVisa’s official liaison man with the Immigration Bureau, called Immigration and obtained confirmation: the change in policy means “no more border hopping totalling more than 90 days in a row”

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Maestro

Well if this was true it would mean all one would have to do is pend one day outside every 89 days which seems a little to simple.

[Maestro]

Nope Pal, that's too logical and what is done in civilized countries. Why do something so sensible here. Oh wait, some people are saying that Thailand is enacting policies to be more like other countries

You are right: what you probably call civilised countries, USA, UK, etc., are much stricter in granting entry to tourists. Read the forum “Visas and migration to other countries”, when you have time. Or for a quick primer, read post #497 in this thread.

It is a question of cost effectiveness, you see. It costs less to control entry into the country than to ferret out and deport illegal workers. And as post #497 shows, your civilised countries sometimes go too far and disallow visas to bona-fide tourists.

It is also a question of reasonableness. Let’s say you are legally working in a Thai company. How would you like monthly police raids requesting all persons on the premises to show their identification documents and foreign employees their work permits?

The Thai authorities, it seems, are more reasonable than you give them credit for.

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Maestro

[lung]

It means that if people do 30+30+30 days stamps (the meaning of "in a row"), and then go outside Thailand for 2 days and then enter Thailand again it will be OK. And then they can continue 30+30+30 + 2 outside etc.

2 days or 3 month out of LOS ?

[Maestro]

It means that if people do 30+30+30 days stamps (the meaning of "in a row"), and then go outside Thailand for 2 days and then enter Thailand again it will be OK. And then they can continue 30+30+30 + 2 outside etc.

Did you go and read post #380?

That confirmation means confirmation of the news report in post #1 of this thread.

From October, tourists from the designated countries can still enter Thailand without visas and stay for up to 30 days, but their entry stamps will be renewable twice at most for a maximum stay of 90 days.

Tourists who stayed for 90 days must leave the kingdom for at least 90 days before being permitted to re-enter Thailand, Suwat said.

And you are right: all speculation after post #380 about the real meaning of this statement was wasted.

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Maestro

[Maestro]

33 pages

For me, this post of yours is on page 13. Do you want to know the trick?

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Maestro

[cclub75]

That confirmation means confirmation of the news report in post #1 of this thread.

Tourists who stayed for 90 days must leave the kingdom for at least 90 days before being permitted to

Oops. Autant pour moi.

I forgot this one.

OK. So now it's clear : 90 days inside, followed by 90 days outside.

But.... but... let say... if someone stay 60 days (2 stamps in "a row"), and then leave the country for 2 day, and then come back. What could happen ?

?

I think we are going nuts with this story.

[beats]

This thread is unstoppable

[Maestro]

What about the rich Singaporeans and Hongkies who have Sailboats moored in Phuket they will only be able to fly over and sail 3 times a year. Oh well so much for Thailand being the sailing hub of Asia. Back to Langkawi AGAIN!!!

I doubt very much that these tourists stay in Thailand for 90 days at a time using three back-to-back visa-exempt 30-day entries.

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Maestro

[Eureka]

Doesn't take long to put your passport in a fedex bag and call for a pickup.

???????????

i dont understand you ! post my passport thats illegal isnt it ?

When you are in a foreign country you are not supposed to hand you passport to anyone other than an official government representative.

However, this requirement does not exsist within the boundries of the issuing country.

Simply put, get the Visa from the Thai Embassy in your home country before you leave.

[blue eyes]

I really do not see a problem here.If you are a true tourist no problem.If you are a true worker no problem.If you are a true retiere no problem.The problem is only if you do not get the proper visa and permites and lie to stay in the Kingdom.Do not like the rules oh well,mai pen rai.

[beammeup]

What about the rich Singaporeans and Hongkies who have Sailboats moored in Phuket they will only be able to fly over and sail 3 times a year. Oh well so much for Thailand being the sailing hub of Asia. Back to Langkawi AGAIN!!!

I doubt very much that these tourists stay in Thailand for 90 days at a time using three back-to-back visa-exempt 30-day entries.

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Maestro

Its not clear but it looks like 3X 30 day stamps are allowed then out for 90 days. I dont see back to back anywere. They may only stay for a week or a weekend but they still use up a 30 day stamp. I cant see a boarder officer adding up your days???? I hope I am wrong.

[Maestro]

But.... but... let say... if someone stay 60 days (2 stamps in "a row"), and then leave the country for 2 day, and then come back. What could happen ?

?

I think we are going nuts with this story.

You’re so right about the nuts

I guess that in such a situation the idea of “the spirit of the policy” would come into play. If you are a bona-fide tourist and can reasonably demonstrate it, I am quite sure that you will have no problem. Of course, providing this proof might not be easy at the point of entry, you might not have all the appropriate documents with you, and in such case on your fourth entry you might be allowed entry with a stamp saying that you must report to the immigration office within 24 hours (excluding non-working days, of course), where you then can state your case.

In case you think that I am making this up: I once had such a stamp in my passport, eons ago (1973), when the Thai consulate in Manila had given me an Immigrant Visa, apparently by mistake, instead of a Non-immigrant Visa. Fortunately, I had my Thai employer sort it out for me. Come to think of it, I still don’t understand why they did not let that Immigrant Visa stand: the quota of 50 per year for my nationality never gets used up. Actually, the mistake probably was not with the consulate in Manila; I believe the Ministry of Foreign Affairs had authorised the issuance of that particular visa.

---------------

Maestro

Edited September 11, 2006 by maestro

[beammeup]

Untill we get more information... details... a lot of us will be a bit nutty

[Tuschno]

The Los Angeles Thai Consulate is still issuing $50 usd double entry tourist visas as of this week.

Is it possible that Thai Immigration is encouraging travelers to obtain their visas in their home country (more reliable, local checks and balances)?

Maybe 1 of October the immigration will accompany an English translation for these new "tightened entry regulations" with detail.

[kiakaha]

I really do not see a problem here.If you are a true tourist no problem.If you are a true worker no problem.If you are a true retiere no problem.The problem is only if you do not get the proper visa and permites and lie to stay in the Kingdom.Do not like the rules oh well,mai pen rai.

Exactly.

Thai Immigration makes plenty of provisions for long stay in the form of many different categories of Non Immigrant Visas.

If you've been a visa runner for a long time and you haven't had the the foresight to properly organise your immigration situation during that time, then you only have yourself to blame for your predicament.

Stop blaming others and instead look at your own failings,learn from them and invoke action NOW rather than moaning about it.

[beammeup]

The Los Angeles Thai Consulate is still issuing $50 usd double entry tourist visas as of this week.

Is it possible that Thai Immigration is encouraging travelers to obtain their visas in their home country (more reliable, local checks and balances)?

Maybe 1 of October the immigration will accompany an English translation for these new "tightened entry regulations" with detail.

How long did it take you to get that visa in the states? I will be in NYC in a couple of weeks and may need to apply for one there.

[Tuschno]

The Los Angeles Thai Consulate is still issuing $50 usd double entry tourist visas as of this week.

Is it possible that Thai Immigration is encouraging travelers to obtain their visas in their home country (more reliable, local checks and balances)?

Maybe 1 of October the immigration will accompany an English translation for these new "tightened entry regulations" with detail.

How long did it take you to get that visa in the states? I will be in NYC in a couple of weeks and may need to apply for one there.

The usual 24 hours.

[Indifferent]

In case you think that I am making this up: I once had such a stamp in my passport, eons ago (1973), when the Thai consulate in Manila had given me an Immigrant Visa, apparently by mistake, instead of a Non-immigrant Visa. Fortunately, I had my Thai employer sort it out for me. Come to think of it, I still don’t understand why they did not let that Immigrant Visa stand: the quota of 50 per year for my nationality never gets used up. Actually, the mistake probably was not with the consulate in Manila; I believe the Ministry of Foreign Affairs had authorised the issuance of that particular visa.

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Maestro

I have only had to go accross the border once so far but they forgot to change the date on the cancelling stamp (from the day before). When I got to Laos, they wouldn't let me in because I had an incorrect stamp. They also wouldn't let me take the bus back because I couldn't go to the exit side so I had to walk back.

Back on the Thai side, they just laughed, made me hang around for 20 mins whilst they processed some other people and sent me back over (took 3 secs to redo the stamp). And I have a business visa!

I'm not very impressed with a lot of things in Thailand so far.

[SNGLIFE]

The Change/Enforcement is NOT about long-stayers

This is clearly about catching fugitives. Please recall the two very recent high profile cases which reinforced Thailand's negative reputation:

1. An American fugitive was able to remain in Thailand by worknig as a teacher.

2. A British fugitive was caught only because he did a border run from Malaysia to Thailand.

In case #2, the system worked because Malaysia enforces its immigration laws. I am sure this was embarrassing to Thailand, and the US and UK likely both put pressure on Thailand to enforce/modify the existing laws.

Does it affect "innocent good guys"? Yes. Including myself. I do not work in Thailand - I work a contract abroad for a few months (take my family along) and live here between contracts (with my family). They are Thai citizens and I am not. Sometimes my downtime is longer than 3 months and the visa runs have worked well for me for years. So now, I would either need to get a married visa and pay taxes to Thailand even though I SHOULD NOT have to, or work more often.

However, we recently decided (prior to learning about this news) to return to my country for good and will be leaving this sorry country very shortly. This past year was the last straw, and this law change is just salt. I am a strong believer in "if you don't like it, get the hel_l out".

Cya!

[JimsKnight]

I'm married to a Thai but so what. It doesn't get you much does it. I mean you can get a 90 visa from the get go extended for one month thereafter but then what?

The way I read it is that this will only affect those who enter on VOA. Those who have O/B visas are not affected.. what does everyone else think.. am I right ?

totster

You are correct Toaster.

Yes, the crackdown on O and B non-immigrant visas is not slated to begin until November 1st.

Really!? Which bar did you hear that gem in?