Koh Tao: Trial opens for 2 accused of killing British tourists

[smokie36]

jtj.JPG

I recommend to do this if you want peace and quiet from utter ridiculous comments.

Great idea!........... Now for the rest of the Glee club!

Have you seen this......http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run

posted just 10 minutes ago......

And the follow up article. http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run Mafia connections came into play by then..

btw the forensic scientist is brilliant and a complete pitbull. She'll really hurt the prosecution case

What prosecution case? They haven't managed to offer anything so far that can be described as solid evidence.

Quite disturbing actually.

[balo]

Nice to hear from Ms Pontip in that video, post #5284. She's saying what I've been saying for months. All we, the general public, have to go on re; DNA is what top brass police announce. Nothing else. Thai police top brass have a thick agenda of shielding the Headman's people, and everything they do and say points at that.

Brit officials could help clear up some of the DNA mess, but thus far they've been as useful as a parking meter on Venus.

I don't really see her backing off her statement at this point, I doubted her before but she's already said publicly she doesn't trust the results from the police alone. It's looking like the B2 may be cleared but chances of the actual killers being found are slim with little international support.

That is the most likely outcome of this case.

B2 guilty or not , will be set free if no new evidence appear in court.

Then the speculations will continue to run until someone speaks out and that will probably never happen.

[stickylies]

Now to the problem. If Nomsod was in anyway involved, as suggested by Thais all over Thailand ( they understand this better than we do ) then there is no way in the world he could be arrested, because one of his own family is the the main overseer and director of the total investigation. In another country Mon would have to declare conflict of interest and remove himself from this case, but we are not in another country. It is under Mon's supervision that witnesses have been intimidated, interpreters threatened, prisoners tortured and the defense team harrassed on the courthouse steps. I wonder why?

Behold!!! The most important phrase in this very topic sofar: they (the thai) understand this better than we do

There is a hell of a lot at stake here people, and Thailand's rulers have proven in the past that STAKES are often way more important than justice or truth. Farang no understaaaaaaaaaand... Tsjing tsjing!

[berybert]

3 sets of DNA, 2 suspects on trial, why is the Investigation concluded without the 3rd person also on trial? So a 3rd person who hasn't been identified, or found, could very well be the actual killer..

Yet again incorrect! I am with the B2 camp but if we don't get our facts right we will assist the prosecution. 2 strains of DNA found in 3 places on Hannah's body.

I will stand corrected on this, although I do recall reading here on TVF there was 3 separate DNA's,2 from Semen samples and the cigarette butt, allegedly matched the accused,but wasn't there a 2nd set of DNA found on the same cigarette butt? Which is very odd, as Hannah did NOT smoke according to her friends and family.

However, as I said, I'm more than happy to stand corrected.

At one point I believe it was reported her DNA was on the cigarette too (not sure if that is still being claimed/reported) but realize she would not have needed to smoke or touch the cigarette to have her DNA be transferred to it.

Are you saying they shared an after murder ciggy ?

[berybert]

PMSL again ! JTJ " I know it is hard when in conspiracy mode to understand fact from fiction " .

so how are you getting along with the Panya news article .. that will prove he was on the move prior to 15 sept . or is that another fact from fiction issue ?

He's hoping you'll forget!

I actually find it amusing. The conspiracy theory that Panya, who cleared all the people folks here suspect were involved, was transferred Oct 1 as planned with MANY other police officials on what is the yearly shuffle of police bosses. This is the guy under whose management of the case drew international criticism and announced the impending arrests of the two defendants but now conspiracy folks want to believe he was running the case well and that is why he was transferred despite the fact the October transfers are decided a month in advance and the promotions require royal approval. This is one of those very comical conspiracy theories were all sense of reality is ignored.

I find it rather amusing you used a story 5 years out of date to try and prove your story. I am sure if anyone who believes the Burmeses to be innocent had done something similar to prove a point you would be screaming "conspiracy"

[JohnThailandJohn]

PMSL again ! JTJ " I know it is hard when in conspiracy mode to understand fact from fiction " .

so how are you getting along with the Panya news article .. that will prove he was on the move prior to 15 sept . or is that another fact from fiction issue ?

He's hoping you'll forget!

I actually find it amusing. The conspiracy theory that Panya, who cleared all the people folks here suspect were involved, was transferred Oct 1 as planned with MANY other police officials on what is the yearly shuffle of police bosses. This is the guy under whose management of the case drew international criticism and announced the impending arrests of the two defendants but now conspiracy folks want to believe he was running the case well and that is why he was transferred despite the fact the October transfers are decided a month in advance and the promotions require royal approval. This is one of those very comical conspiracy theories were all sense of reality is ignored.

I find it rather amusing you used a story 5 years out of date to try and prove your story.

Yup, made a mistake and didn't look at the year and only the month but yet you still don't seem to comprehend these promotions and transfers are planned in advance and take place in August despite even showing 5 years ago that was the protocol and the top ones are generally published in advance too ... just like this guys was 5-years ago in October and announced in September. But please feel free to continue the game. While a bit obnoxious in a childish way, it is amusing and clear confirmation of how far people will go to avoid accepting reality and the obvious and use and attack others to help with the distraction.

[JohnThailandJohn]

Yet again incorrect! I am with the B2 camp but if we don't get our facts right we will assist the prosecution. 2 strains of DNA found in 3 places on Hannah's body.

I will stand corrected on this, although I do recall reading here on TVF there was 3 separate DNA's,2 from Semen samples and the cigarette butt, allegedly matched the accused,but wasn't there a 2nd set of DNA found on the same cigarette butt? Which is very odd, as Hannah did NOT smoke according to her friends and family.

However, as I said, I'm more than happy to stand corrected.

At one point I believe it was reported her DNA was on the cigarette too (not sure if that is still being claimed/reported) but realize she would not have needed to smoke or touch the cigarette to have her DNA be transferred to it.

Are you saying they shared an after murder ciggy ?

I didn't say or speculate anything like that

Edited July 27, 2015 by JohnThailandJohn

[Chetzee]

PMSL again ! JTJ " I know it is hard when in conspiracy mode to understand fact from fiction " .

so how are you getting along with the Panya news article .. that will prove he was on the move prior to 15 sept . or is that another fact from fiction issue ?

He's hoping you'll forget!

I actually find it amusing. The conspiracy theory that Panya, who cleared all the people folks here suspect were involved, was transferred Oct 1 as planned with MANY other police officials on what is the yearly shuffle of police bosses. This is the guy under whose management of the case drew international criticism and announced the impending arrests of the two defendants but now conspiracy folks want to believe he was running the case well and that is why he was transferred despite the fact the October transfers are decided a month in advance and the promotions require royal approval. This is one of those very comical conspiracy theories were all sense of reality is ignored.

I find it rather amusing you used a story 5 years out of date to try and prove your story. I am sure if anyone who believes the Burmeses to be innocent had done something similar to prove a point you would be screaming "conspiracy"

tjt , you may find it amusing , but for many here we are more than a little concerned that Panya , who as you suggest was all at sea with this in the first few days , who then seems to get a serious lead , one that he anounces to the worlds assembled press , and is then sidelined.

I have no idea why he was so conviced to announce that Mon and NS were in the frame , but there it is ,in print on TV on social media .

Within a few short hours he is sidelined never to be heard of again ......

is it any wonder that ppl suspect some sort of change of heart from a higher authority , in a bid to offer protection to that family .

added to which they have done nothing to try and extracate themselves from the insinuations , and rumour out on the web .

you can take it from me that a couple of still from a student appartment building , and a charde of dna testing do nothing to allieviate suspision .

as such some of the mud thrown at NS has stuck ..... and i suspect it's gonna take a lot of shifting now regardless of the outcome of this case at court .

Edited July 27, 2015 by Chetzee

[berybert]

At one point I believe it was reported her DNA was on the cigarette too (not sure if that is still being claimed/reported) but realize she would not have needed to smoke or touch the cigarette to have her DNA be transferred to it.

Are you saying they shared an after murder ciggy ?

I didn't say or speculate anything like that

Do tell us how her DNA could have been found on the ciggy if she didn't touch or smoke it.

[JohnThailandJohn]

PMSL again ! JTJ " I know it is hard when in conspiracy mode to understand fact from fiction " .

so how are you getting along with the Panya news article .. that will prove he was on the move prior to 15 sept . or is that another fact from fiction issue ?

He's hoping you'll forget!

I actually find it amusing. The conspiracy theory that Panya, who cleared all the people folks here suspect were involved, was transferred Oct 1 as planned with MANY other police officials on what is the yearly shuffle of police bosses. This is the guy under whose management of the case drew international criticism and announced the impending arrests of the two defendants but now conspiracy folks want to believe he was running the case well and that is why he was transferred despite the fact the October transfers are decided a month in advance and the promotions require royal approval. This is one of those very comical conspiracy theories were all sense of reality is ignored.

JTJ

You may be right , but the original question still remains unanswered

Not to me it isn;t and that is all that matters. If people wish to remain ignorant over something so obvious and that happens regularly with pattern and process then so be it. If the question is unanswered then uncover the answer on your own if you don't believe me ... either way it has been answered and always has for me. Just like some of the other conspiracy theories here, this one has just gotten too stupid to address any further.

[loonodingle]

Does anyone know why they couldn't use the police station to conduct the interviews and reverted to a "Safe House" and what is a Safe House. Safe from Screams being heard?

Perhaps it was having major construction carried out at the time??

Just wondering as we had Ali'G JD GB and JTJ around at the moment and between them I am sure we can get a definitive answer

PiggiesMightFly.jpg

Lots of people mad at those responsible for this crime. Not unheard of for locals to swarm a police station when word gets out they have those responsible (why they had them in bullet proof vests and helmets while they reenacted the murders) but then again could have just been a private place where they wanted to possibly use some unconventional methods to get the truth out what they saw as two murdering rapists (animals). Bottom line, doesn't really mean anything to me except the confession "to police" should not hold weight but then again shouldn't in my opinion if they retracted it for any reason. Even if it was recorded, we clearly see a pattern on this thread of not believing video if it goes against what people want to believe. So if they retracted so be it, throw out the confession they gave to the police and let the other evidence including the DNA be used against them.

LOL...... PMSL.. Unconventional methods hey... what was it then T and scones..

And despite the vests I didnt see anyone exhibit a single act of violence towards the accused. Thats unlike Thais as u may well know.

No I would say I just tinkled on your fire and put it out.. lol.. really read what u just said... ayeee god give me strength.

Actually there have been numerous times defendants have been attacked while doing reenactments especially when it comes to these types of horrible crimes. Each time it happens there are demands the police stop doing these reenactments, at least announcing them in advance.

Exactly............. now u r seeing the story. Its normal to attack as the Thais feel it is necessary......... However they didn't. Not 1 stone or one person spitting or shouting.......Zilchhhhhh nil. zero

[GOLDBUGGY]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

NS is being harassed on the Internet through sites like Facebook and you expect him to make his phone call records public, so they can all see the phone numbers he called to all his friends and family, so now they can harass them to?

To hire a lawyer to get a court order (or otherwise) to have CCTV Footage of his accommodations in Bangkok for September 15th, documents proving he was at the Uni that day, and having his DNA taken for testing, after he was already cleared from any wrong doing and was not required by law to do this, yet you call this doing nothing to prove his innocents?

I am sure his lawyer advised him what to do next, which I am also sure he knows more about this then we do. But if I was his Lawyer I would advise him to keep a low profile and let this all blow over. This is because even if he did everything you suggested, there is always going to be people who do not believe he did not commit these murders no matter what, and just like many people here after he has been cleared over 10 months ago.

NS now doesn't even have a private life and can't even go and fulfill his obligation as a Buddhist by being a Monk without the whole world knowing about it. I would call this ruining his life because it would sure ruin mine. , ,

[Chetzee]

NS now doesn't even have a private life and can't even go and fulfill his obligation as a Buddhist by being a Monk without the whole world knowing about it. I would call this ruining his life because it would sure ruin mine. , ,

hey ho ... shit happens !

you really do talk some *hite , the way you waffle on here make me think you don't have a life to ruin ....

[JohnThailandJohn]

Actually there have been numerous times defendants have been attacked while doing reenactments especially when it comes to these types of horrible crimes. Each time it happens there are demands the police stop doing these reenactments, at least announcing them in advance.

Exactly............. now u r seeing the story. Its normal to attack as the Thais feel it is necessary......... However they didn't. Not 1 stone or one person spitting or shouting.......Zilchhhhhh nil. zero

I am not sure what you are trying to say. The only thing I take away from the is that sometimes people act badly and sometimes they don't along with the fact that taking security precautions often deter people from acting badly. Now doubt there would be a lot of leaders around the world killed if they didn't have the security in place they do to deter people from acting against them, especially emotionally charged individuals who might otherwise not give pause if security was lax.

[GOLDBUGGY]

NS now doesn't even have a private life and can't even go and fulfill his obligation as a Buddhist by being a Monk without the whole world knowing about it. I would call this ruining his life because it would sure ruin mine. , ,

hey ho ... shit happens !

you really do talk some *hite , the way you waffle on here make me think you don't have a life to ruin ....

Stalking me are you? And you say I have nothing better to do with my life. (Ha!Ha!Ha!)

Well, just like this case you know absolutely nothing about me.

In all fairness I don't know anything about you except you are belligerent. Why can't you ask a question in a civil manner? Oh Yeah! I forgot. You didn't even ask a question. You just attacked me because I don't fit into your little gang and you are still trying to earn your first strip above Buck Private. .

Well Sonny Boy, I am entitled to voice my honest opinion here just like you. That is if you had one that is. If you don't like it don't read it. It give me too much feeling of power knowing I am controlling you and forcing you to read what I wrote.

[JohnThailandJohn]

At one point I believe it was reported her DNA was on the cigarette too (not sure if that is still being claimed/reported) but realize she would not have needed to smoke or touch the cigarette to have her DNA be transferred to it.

Are you saying they shared an after murder ciggy ?

I didn't say or speculate anything like that

Do tell us how her DNA could have been found on the ciggy if she didn't touch or smoke it.

You are kidding right? Are you one of the people criticizing DNA collections and talking about contamination and stuff but you don't know about transfer? If her DNA was in the cigarette, as widely reported early on, there are so many plausible and likely ways her DNA was on the cigarette beyond her smoking it. The DNA could have come from the suspects fingers or lips that had her DNA (blood, skin cells, saliva or cellular material found in sweat). If this was true, there would likely not be enough DNA to retest for her DNA on the butt but the DNA should still be available for testing because they should/would have used PCR testing to replicate the DNA on the butt being it would have been a small amount while also allowing to keep the replicated samples for further testing if needed .... which jives with what police said they have.

Were you one of the people that also was going on and on about DNA on the outside of the condemn but not the inside and it being proof of a setup? Yet, we find out through reported testimony that the DNA on the condom was a drop of blood that could have gotten on there a number of ways including from splatter to being dripped or touched to possibly others.

The problem with people making up theories and playing internet detective is when you don;t know all the facts is ... people don't know all the facts but draw conclusion based on theories that were based on a guess. Nothing wrong with speculating and having theories but what goes on online is mostly people drawing facts from stuff they don;t know and not seeing the difference between a plausible theory and one based on complete BS.

Edited July 27, 2015 by JohnThailandJohn

[loonodingle]

Actually there have been numerous times defendants have been attacked while doing reenactments especially when it comes to these types of horrible crimes. Each time it happens there are demands the police stop doing these reenactments, at least announcing them in advance.

Exactly............. now u r seeing the story. Its normal to attack as the Thais feel it is necessary......... However they didn't. Not 1 stone or one person spitting or shouting.......Zilchhhhhh nil. zero

I am not sure what you are trying to say. The only thing I take away from the is that sometimes people act badly and sometimes they don't along with the fact that taking security precautions often deter people from acting badly. Now doubt there would be a lot of leaders around the world killed if they didn't have the security in place they do to deter people from acting against them, especially emotionally charged individuals who might otherwise not give pause if security was lax.

You know what I am saying.

Your excuse for the Safe House and Your claim they would have been attacked. The lack of any response from the locals only goes to reinforce the belief they know otherwise about the 2 tragic deaths of David and Hannah.

I genuinely don't have a 100% opinion as to if they had zero input to any of the events that day but at each and every turn the case against the B2 being the only people who involved seems to fall away.

[GOLDBUGGY]

Actually there have been numerous times defendants have been attacked while doing reenactments especially when it comes to these types of horrible crimes. Each time it happens there are demands the police stop doing these reenactments, at least announcing them in advance.

Exactly............. now u r seeing the story. Its normal to attack as the Thais feel it is necessary......... However they didn't. Not 1 stone or one person spitting or shouting.......Zilchhhhhh nil. zero

I am not sure what you are trying to say. The only thing I take away from the is that sometimes people act badly and sometimes they don't along with the fact that taking security precautions often deter people from acting badly. Now doubt there would be a lot of leaders around the world killed if they didn't have the security in place they do to deter people from acting against them, especially emotionally charged individuals who might otherwise not give pause if security was lax.

You know what I am saying.

Your excuse for the Safe House and Your claim they would have been attacked. The lack of any response from the locals only goes to reinforce the belief they know otherwise about the 2 tragic deaths of David and Hannah.

I genuinely don't have a 100% opinion as to if they had zero input to any of the events that day but at each and every turn the case against the B2 being the only people who involved seems to fall away.

Excuse me loon but I am just trying to follow this link and want to be sure I have your opinion straight.

Are you saying that since the murders and the arrest of the 2 accused, 2 weeks later, where tourism their dropped off like a rock during this period, effecting the livelihood of everyone on the Island who depends on that, all showed up for this reenactment because they all know who really did this, and your proof is nobody threw a rock at them when they were in Body Armor, surrounded by Police, and several Police Officers in the crowd?

[JohnThailandJohn]

Actually there have been numerous times defendants have been attacked while doing reenactments especially when it comes to these types of horrible crimes. Each time it happens there are demands the police stop doing these reenactments, at least announcing them in advance.

Exactly............. now u r seeing the story. Its normal to attack as the Thais feel it is necessary......... However they didn't. Not 1 stone or one person spitting or shouting.......Zilchhhhhh nil. zero

I am not sure what you are trying to say. The only thing I take away from the is that sometimes people act badly and sometimes they don't along with the fact that taking security precautions often deter people from acting badly. Now doubt there would be a lot of leaders around the world killed if they didn't have the security in place they do to deter people from acting against them, especially emotionally charged individuals who might otherwise not give pause if security was lax.

You know what I am saying.

Your excuse for the Safe House and Your claim they would have been attacked. The lack of any response from the locals only goes to reinforce the belief they know otherwise about the 2 tragic deaths of David and Hannah.

I genuinely don't have a 100% opinion as to if they had zero input to any of the events that day but at each and every turn the case against the B2 being the only people who involved seems to fall away.

No that was not my excuse for the safe house. I have no idea why they used a safe house and provided two possible scenarios making clear I didnlt know the answer to the question posed by YOU to me. That was one with the other being they wanted to have a place where they could use less than legal means to get the truth out of people they believed were responsible for the murders and rape. Below is a recap?

Q: Just wondering as we had Ali'G JD GB and JTJ around at the moment and between them I am sure we can get a definitive answer whistling.gif

attachicon.gifPiggiesMightFly.jpg

My Reply: Lots of people mad at those responsible for this crime. Not unheard of for locals to swarm a police station when word gets out they have those responsible (why they had them in bullet proof vests and helmets while they reenacted the murders) but then again could have just been a private place where they wanted to possibly use some unconventional methods to get the truth out what they saw as two murdering rapists (animals). Bottom line, doesn't really mean anything to me except the confession "to police" should not hold weight but then again shouldn't in my opinion if they retracted it for any reason. Even if it was recorded, we clearly see a pattern on this thread of not believing video if it goes against what people want to believe. So if they retracted so be it, throw out the confession they gave to the police and let the other evidence including the DNA be used against them.

You ask me a question assuming I will answer in a way that you can drive home a point (that is not based on fact in the least bit) but I don;t respond they way you think but you go on to pretend I did so you can make some point that really isn;t a point but nonsense trying to show the reason the suspects weren;t attack is because they are believed to be innocent. Do you realize how far fetched and baseless this point is? The crowds turning on suspects does happen but it is not normal or common and they police prepared for this to discourage anybody from acting out by having a HUGE presence there and outfitting the two with some bit of protection. Your logic is like saying somebody who doesn;t rob a 711 means they don;t need money.

Are you not seeing this same pattern thourghout this thread when it comes to people's theories? The pattern is really the stuff is made up and based on no credible or plausible facts and all about emotion and proving right despite how illogical the theory is. Sticking with it is just as important despite overwhelming evidence and unrealistic demands to be shown the theory is wrong .... just like going on with the kid in Bangkok who is not on trial but it is expected he should provide he is innocent despite video camera evidence and phone records and being at university in Bangkok or the fact he volunteered to provide DNA after cops never asked because they confirmed he was in Bangkok.

[JohnThailandJohn]

You know what I am saying.

Your excuse for the Safe House and Your claim they would have been attacked. The lack of any response from the locals only goes to reinforce the belief they know otherwise about the 2 tragic deaths of David and Hannah.

I genuinely don't have a 100% opinion as to if they had zero input to any of the events that day but at each and every turn the case against the B2 being the only people who involved seems to fall away.

Excuse me loon but I am just trying to follow this link and want to be sure I have your opinion straight.

Are you saying that since the murders and the arrest of the 2 accused, 2 weeks later, where tourism their dropped off like a rock during this period, effecting the livelihood of everyone on the Island who depends on that, all showed up for this reenactment because they all know who really did this, and your proof is nobody threw a rock at them when they were in Body Armor, surrounded by Police, and several Police Officers in the crowd?

Its a fact that's all it is Gobby. Undeniable fact. Another piece to a very Jigsaw.

As for Proof that's YOUR words not mine and another Example of Gobby taking a twist to enhance his agenda

What is proof??????? Proof of what???

Please explain the conclusion you have come up with that the two were not attacked while being heavily guarded by armed police. I think I understand but it is just beyond belief if I am understanding what you are saying.

And if I am right in what you are trying to say as well as your logic, then you must now think them guilty based on this article ....

KOH TAO: -- About 200 policemen were deployed to guard two Myanmar suspects during a reenactment of their alleged murder of two British tourists.

About 1,000 residents of Koh Tao turned up to look at the suspects during the reenactment at 11 am. Police had to stand surrounding the suspects to guard them.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/765467-murder-reenactment-200-policemen-deployed-to-guard-two-myanmar-men-on-koh-tao/

Edited July 27, 2015 by JohnThailandJohn

[loonodingle]

You know what I am saying.

Your excuse for the Safe House and Your claim they would have been attacked. The lack of any response from the locals only goes to reinforce the belief they know otherwise about the 2 tragic deaths of David and Hannah.

I genuinely don't have a 100% opinion as to if they had zero input to any of the events that day but at each and every turn the case against the B2 being the only people who involved seems to fall away.

No that was not my excuse for the safe house. I have no idea why they used a safe house and provided two possible scenarios making clear I didnlt know the answer to the question posed by YOU to me. That was one with the other being they wanted to have a place where they could use less than legal means to get the truth out of people they believed were responsible for the murders and rape. Below is a recap?

Q: Just wondering as we had Ali'G JD GB and JTJ around at the moment and between them I am sure we can get a definitive answer whistling.gif

attachicon.gifPiggiesMightFly.jpg

My Reply: Lots of people mad at those responsible for this crime. Not unheard of for locals to swarm a police station when word gets out they have those responsible (why they had them in bullet proof vests and helmets while they reenacted the murders) but then again could have just been a private place where they wanted to possibly use some unconventional methods to get the truth out what they saw as two murdering rapists (animals). Bottom line, doesn't really mean anything to me except the confession "to police" should not hold weight but then again shouldn't in my opinion if they retracted it for any reason. Even if it was recorded, we clearly see a pattern on this thread of not believing video if it goes against what people want to believe. So if they retracted so be it, throw out the confession they gave to the police and let the other evidence including the DNA be used against them.

You ask me a question assuming I will answer in a way that you can drive home a point (that is not based on fact in the least bit) but I don;t respond they way you think but you go on to pretend I did so you can make some point that really isn;t a point but nonsense trying to show the reason the suspects weren;t attack is because they are believed to be innocent. Do you realize how far fetched and baseless this point is? The crowds turning on suspects does happen but it is not normal or common and they police prepared for this to discourage anybody from acting out by having a HUGE presence there and outfitting the two with some bit of protection. Your logic is like saying somebody who doesn;t rob a 711 means they don;t need money.

Are you not seeing this same pattern thourghout this thread when it comes to people's theories? The pattern is really the stuff is made up and based on no credible or plausible facts and all about emotion and proving right despite how illogical the theory is. Sticking with it is just as important despite overwhelming evidence and unrealistic demands to be shown the theory is wrong .... just like going on with the kid in Bangkok who is not on trial but it is expected he should provide he is innocent despite video camera evidence and phone records and being at university in Bangkok or the fact he volunteered to provide DNA after cops never asked because they confirmed he was in Bangkok.

Bahhhh...Bahhhhh...

If you had it your way you would just agree with the police and had the needle into the B2 already. Job Done. You wouldn't look or listen or reason anything would you.

I don't care who they sentence to death the B2 or whoever as long as its the correct people. In fact I would do the job for them. I would go one further and take out a couple of generations of the same family just to make a point if this is what you do then this is what is going to happen to you and your loved ones.

Everything people do has a reason. As everything they don't do they don't do for a reason. Like interviews or checking evidence. When u boil the whole subject down it falls woefully short so far however lets wait and see what comes out going forward as I think we are going to get some revelations. And don't dispute that as u will look a fool if they do and u will have to eat your words.

Just watch and wait

[Lozza]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

Now a glass bottle? And you know they have retracted their statements right?

Since when do glass bottles make knife shaped stab wounds?

It was said to be a broken wine bottle, if so it would be similar to a knife wound

[loonodingle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR_jC_K4aQM

Edited July 27, 2015 by loonodingle

[JohnThailandJohn]

Don't keep writing the word Proof JTJ.. that's your M8 Gobby using that word.

You are correct, you didn't say "proof" in that context now that I read what you replied instead of just your post. My apologies for that but still think the conclusion you appear to have drawn about the suspects not being attacked is far fetched. However, it is a far cry from saying it is proof.

[rockingrobin]

OK genuine replies only

Does anybody recall or know when and how the allegations of an altercation in a bar between one of the victims and a thai first materialised

[Lozza]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

The translator and his background

Myanmar Muslim roti seller who acted as a translator for the Myanmar suspects after their arrest arrest . He is from Yangon and has lived in Thailand for 18 years. He also acts as a volunteer volunteer Meaning: someone who is not paid for the work that they do

• and what makes anyone convinced that this mans testimony is true and not a total fabrication, well the crime scene should verify what he said

Maung readily admitted that he was with the two and that they had bought beer at the 7-11. From his information, police then detained Zaw Rin. Win, however, had fled to Surat Thani where he was eventually detained.

• First I heard that one that Win had fled

The suspects suspects Meaning: a person who is thought to have committed a crime Thai clothes showed no signs of blood since it had been washed, the translator said.

• it is not easy to remove blood stains from clothing better to just burn them

• so it was a wine bottle used on David and glass from the wine bottle is all over the sand and was tested for fingerprints and DNA from both the victim and the accused.........right ?, and then the Hoe was used on David and meanwhile the same Hoe was being used on Hannah further up the beach

• then they (I assume) both carried the body of David to the water, ever tried lifting a limp body twice your weight and size and if he was dragged across the sand there would be very clear evidence of that -

Maung Maung told the lawyer that when he returned home at 5am, he found the two suspects sleeping and nothing seemed suspicious.

• this is all down to who you believe so is a pointless exercise in even posting

"They said they didn't do it, that the Thai police [along with their Myanmar-Thai translator] beat them until they confessed to something they didn't do. They're pleading with the Myanmar government to look into the case and find out the truth. They were a really pitiful sight. Their bodies had all sorts of bruises. I have already reported all that I have seen today to my government."

Johnthiajohn, you have been very selective in your posting

again not saying guilty or innocent but so far all of the above is just hearsay until it can be backed up with solid verifiable evidence

If I claimed I saw you on the beach that night at 4am with a Hoe in your hand, I think you would want more than just my say so - right ? and upon inspection of my bank account I had suddenly become 30m baht richer

keep the feet for dancing

oh and anyone know the location of Maung Maung, it was reported that he is in Thai police custody being held as a witness for the prosecution but was also reported as residing at the Burmese Embassy.

Based on his alleged witness statement he would be key to the prosecution case, but then again maybe he is going to be a defence witness and claim he didn't say what was quoted by the reliable roti interpreter or had turned down a massive bribe and decided to tell the truth .....speculation of course

I did hear he was at the Embassy. I can't seem to work out why Maung Maung was released. Are the RTP just taking his word for it saying he left and went to the GF house and returned home at 5 am or have they got his movements on CCTV. Something's not right here..

[Nigeone]

You know what I am saying.

Your excuse for the Safe House and Your claim they would have been attacked. The lack of any response from the locals only goes to reinforce the belief they know otherwise about the 2 tragic deaths of David and Hannah.

I genuinely don't have a 100% opinion as to if they had zero input to any of the events that day but at each and every turn the case against the B2 being the only people who involved seems to fall away.

No that was not my excuse for the safe house. I have no idea why they used a safe house and provided two possible scenarios making clear I didnlt know the answer to the question posed by YOU to me. That was one with the other being they wanted to have a place where they could use less than legal means to get the truth out of people they believed were responsible for the murders and rape. Below is a recap?

Q: Just wondering as we had Ali'G JD GB and JTJ around at the moment and between them I am sure we can get a definitive answer whistling.gif

attachicon.gifPiggiesMightFly.jpg

My Reply: Lots of people mad at those responsible for this crime. Not unheard of for locals to swarm a police station when word gets out they have those responsible (why they had them in bullet proof vests and helmets while they reenacted the murders) but then again could have just been a private place where they wanted to possibly use some unconventional methods to get the truth out what they saw as two murdering rapists (animals). Bottom line, doesn't really mean anything to me except the confession "to police" should not hold weight but then again shouldn't in my opinion if they retracted it for any reason. Even if it was recorded, we clearly see a pattern on this thread of not believing video if it goes against what people want to believe. So if they retracted so be it, throw out the confession they gave to the police and let the other evidence including the DNA be used against them.

You ask me a question assuming I will answer in a way that you can drive home a point (that is not based on fact in the least bit) but I don;t respond they way you think but you go on to pretend I did so you can make some point that really isn;t a point but nonsense trying to show the reason the suspects weren;t attack is because they are believed to be innocent. Do you realize how far fetched and baseless this point is? The crowds turning on suspects does happen but it is not normal or common and they police prepared for this to discourage anybody from acting out by having a HUGE presence there and outfitting the two with some bit of protection. Your logic is like saying somebody who doesn;t rob a 711 means they don;t need money.

Are you not seeing this same pattern thourghout this thread when it comes to people's theories? The pattern is really the stuff is made up and based on no credible or plausible facts and all about emotion and proving right despite how illogical the theory is. Sticking with it is just as important despite overwhelming evidence and unrealistic demands to be shown the theory is wrong .... just like going on with the kid in Bangkok who is not on trial but it is expected he should provide he is innocent despite video camera evidence and phone records and being at university in Bangkok or the fact he volunteered to provide DNA after cops never asked because they confirmed he was in Bangkok.

Bahhhh...Bahhhhh...

If you had it your way you would just agree with the police and had the needle into the B2 already. Job Done. You wouldn't look or listen or reason anything would you.

I don't care who they sentence to death the B2 or whoever as long as its the correct people. In fact I would do the job for them. I would go one further and take out a couple of generations of the same family just to make a point if this is what you do then this is what is going to happen to you and your loved ones.

Everything people do has a reason. As everything they don't do they don't do for a reason. Like interviews or checking evidence. When u boil the whole subject down it falls woefully short so far however lets wait and see what comes out going forward as I think we are going to get some revelations. And don't dispute that as u will look a fool if they do and u will have to eat your words.

Just watch and wait

Careful loonodingle you run the risk of JTJ,GB etc not engaging with you ! I had quite a run in with them all last week as I wouldn't put with there theory's etc and now they stay away rather than answering my questions and having to agree. They are very good and well orchestrated particularly JTJ but it hasn't gone unnoticed by everyone. While like you I'm not really concerned who is found guilty as long as it's the right people and that goes for everyone in here I would say. But to try and defend what's gone on up to now with never ending repetitive nonsense is not in any way credible and questions the motives for doing so. As I have said, and yes repetively , there is nothing happened in the prosecution case up to now in 6 days of court to remotely suggest the B2 did it and what's come across is the whole issue has been a mess from day one.

I think the case was summed up when questions were put to the investigating officer and he didn't know where evidence was, why particular issues hadn't been addressed and didn't know where DNA was. He was the investigating officer, the driving force behind the investigation. He should know everything there is to know about procedures that had taken place or not and whereabouts of all issues of the case. Fine detail okay it would be unreasonable to know but basic reference and information and how it was arrived at he should certainly know. I'm sorry, and again I will say this, regardless of who has done this crime the RTP have been shown up to be incompetent at best and corrupt at worse. They really haven't a clue how to investigate a crime of this magnitude. Mind you they haven't had much practice have they !!

Edited July 27, 2015 by Nigeone

[bruceybonus]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

Now a glass bottle? And you know they have retracted their statements right?

Since when do glass bottles make knife shaped stab wounds?

It was said to be a broken wine bottle, if so it would be similar to a knife wound

Don't be so obtuse. The difference between a knife wound and a broken bottle is like night and day. Have you seen the wounds? I have and they are knife/puncture wounds. They are 100& not broken bottle wounds. When a bottle breaks it is jagged, the wounds are clean punctures to the skin.

You are another poster who should be banned for baiting as you are obviously a troll

[loonodingle]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11138636/Koh-Tao-murders-Thai-police-make-suspects-reconstruct-murder-of-British-tourists-David-Miller-and-Hannah-Witheridge.html

Col Kissana Phathanacharoen, a commander involved in the investigation, defended the crime scene reconstruction as an opportunity "to get a sense of what happened" to supplement the DNA tests and gathering forensic and CCTV evidence.

"We have also received useful information from the locals," he said.

But with hundreds of onlookers the scene did little to shore up confidence in Thai police methods. Indeed the suspects appeared to be taking stage directions from the police on how to carry out the re-enactment.

One police chief said the quick resolution of the case would result in a speedy recovery of tourism numbers on the island. Jaktip Chaijinda, the deputy head of national police, said:

"Today the case should be finished because we want to clear this case up as soon as possible so that our tourism industry can bounce back."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2786777/Family-murdered-backpacker-Hannah-Witheridge-plead-right-people-face-justice-murder-case-against-two-migrants-chaos.html#ixzz3h8dqzVUy

Last week, police said the Burmese men had admitted to killing the tourists and DNA found on Witheridge matched samples taken from the suspect - but the arrests by the police have since been thrown in to doubt.

And today, the family of 23-year-old Hannah Witheridge, from Great Yarmouth, also hinted at their concerns over the investigation.

In a statement released ahead of her funeral tomorrow, the family said: 'The past three weeks have been unimaginably difficult and there are no words that can adequately describe the heartache and despair that our family is experiencing.

'As we continue with our plans for our beautiful Hannah’s "party", our thoughts are with David Miller’s family who are suffering the same indescribable agony.

'As a family we hope that the right people are found and brought to justice.'

Thailand's top forensic expert added her voice to the criticism today, accusing police of failing to involve a forensic pathologist in the initial investigation.

'A case of two murdered people certainly needs a forensic physician,' Khunying Porntip Rojanasunan, head of Thailand's Central Institute of Forensic Science, was quoted as saying by the Bangkok Post.

Aung Myo Thant, who has been described as a lawyer with connections to the Burmese embassy in Bangkok, met the accused men on Monday and, in interviews with Thai and Burmese media, said they claimed to have been beaten and threatened with electrocution in order to confess.

The pair have been in police custody since October 1 and confessed shortly after that.

The lawyer was quoted in the Bangkok Post as saying: 'They told me that they were on the beach that night drinking and singing songs.

'They said they didn't do it, that the Thai police beat them until they confessed to something they didn't do.

'They're pleading with the Myanmar government to look into the case and find out the truth.

'They were a really pitiful sight. Their bodies had all sorts of bruises.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2786777/Family-murdered-backpacker-Hannah-Witheridge-plead-right-people-face-justice-murder-case-against-two-migrants-chaos.html#ixzz3h8dqzVUy

[Nigeone]

At one point I believe it was reported her DNA was on the cigarette too (not sure if that is still being claimed/reported) but realize she would not have needed to smoke or touch the cigarette to have her DNA be transferred to it.

Are you saying they shared an after murder ciggy ?

I didn't say or speculate anything like that

Do tell us how her DNA could have been found on the ciggy if she didn't touch or smoke it.

You are kidding right? Are you one of the people criticizing DNA collections and talking about contamination and stuff but you don't know about transfer? If her DNA was in the cigarette, as widely reported early on, there are so many plausible and likely ways her DNA was on the cigarette beyond her smoking it. The DNA could have come from the suspects fingers or lips that had her DNA (blood, skin cells, saliva or cellular material found in sweat). If this was true, there would likely not be enough DNA to retest for her DNA on the butt but the DNA should still be available for testing because they should/would have used PCR testing to replicate the DNA on the butt being it would have been a small amount while also allowing to keep the replicated samples for further testing if needed .... which jives with what police said they have.

Were you one of the people that also was going on and on about DNA on the outside of the condemn but not the inside and it being proof of a setup? Yet, we find out through reported testimony that the DNA on the condom was a drop of blood that could have gotten on there a number of ways including from splatter to being dripped or touched to possibly others.

The problem with people making up theories and playing internet detective is when you don;t know all the facts is ... people don't know all the facts but draw conclusion based on theories that were based on a guess. Nothing wrong with speculating and having theories but what goes on online is mostly people drawing facts from stuff they don;t know and not seeing the difference between a plausible theory and one based on complete BS.

You know I don't believe this JTJ but I actually agree with the first part of your post. However you shoot yourself in the foot as that's the very reason why many posters have brought to attention the procedures applied in this case. The whole case from the start has been compromised by contaminated crime scene be it not preventing unnecessary movement around the crime scene and moving the clothes and not tagging and bagging them separately. There's many more examples but to spare the people in here from viewing to many repeats I won't mention it now. That's not in any way shape of form a conspiracy theory just a fact!! Pictures don't lie but as you say reporting can !