Koh Tao: Trial opens for 2 accused of killing British tourists

[Munson]

It's obvious the truth won't come out in court, but it could in a newspaper.

If I was a journalist I'd be finding someone with access to phone location and call data, and finding out who the key players and suspects were calling/texting just after the time of the crime, and where from.

[JohnThailandJohn]

JTJ, Balo, Goldbuggy,Sviss Geez. Do you have an opinion on this?

If David was laid with Hannah when he was struck on the head with the blunt end of a Thai garden Hoe would some of his blood splashed onto Hannah's body? If you are in agreement that that is more than possible and very probable. Why was there no DNA from David discovered on Hannah's body.

I apologies to the family for asking in such a graphic way but I feel strongly that if theses murders were carried out in the way they are described by the prosecution there would have to have been DNA evidence and feel sure the prosecution would have shown this.

If he was , its impossible for us to know the facts here. You're guess is as good as mine.

I haven't seen a police report or lab report or heard court testimony that said none of David's DNA was found on Hannah.

I have also not seen a police report or lab report or heard court testimony that says David was killed while on top of Hannah, running away or while skinning dipping or a plethora of other possible positions.

If If why why question for those not involved are a game (lets play internet detective) and doesn't yield any answers except for those who believe they can derive facts in the case that are based on things they don't know or have not been shared publicly.

[fish fingers]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

[catsanddogs]

JTJ, Balo, Goldbuggy,Sviss Geez. Do you have an opinion on this?

If David was laid with Hannah when he was struck on the head with the blunt end of a Thai garden Hoe would some of his blood splashed onto Hannah's body? If you are in agreement that that is more than possible and very probable. Why was there no DNA from David discovered on Hannah's body.

I apologies to the family for asking in such a graphic way but I feel strongly that if theses murders were carried out in the way they are described by the prosecution there would have to have been DNA evidence and feel sure the prosecution would have shown this.

If he was , its impossible for us to know the facts here. You're guess is as good as mine.

I haven't seen a police report or lab report or heard court testimony that said none of David's DNA was found on Hannah.

I have also not seen a police report or lab report or heard court testimony that says David was killed while on top of Hannah, running away or while skinning dipping or a plethora of other possible positions.

If If why why question for those not involved are a game (lets play internet detective) and doesn't yield any answers except for those who believe they can derive facts in the case that are based on things they don't know or have not been shared publicly.

"It has become clearer and clearer that it is quite likely David was stepping in to help a girl who was in trouble. That would be absolutely in his character."

Said Ian Miller, David's father.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/09/22/david-miller-hannah-withe_n_5859862.html

So even if his DNA was found on Hannah Witheridge it doesn't equal that they were in an intimate situation. But what difference does it make because the RTP have lost, used up, finished DNA conveniently. The perfect job as they said.

BTW - what police and lab reports have you seen then? Could you share them here?

[JohnThailandJohn]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

[catsanddogs]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime.

No doubt the headman does carry a lot of weight. Worry is a big burden. The rest of your post is hilarious.

[bunglebag]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

I'm not accusing anyone here. I just want to query what I consider to be a possible error in your statement. What is the whole bunch of credible evidence that shows he could not have been on the island on that night? The time on the cctv stills from the uni that were shown would theoretically give someone time to fly back the next morning as I understand it?

[BritTim]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

I'm not accusing anyone here. I just want to query what I consider to be a possible error in your statement. What is the whole bunch of credible evidence that shows he could not have been on the island on that night? The time on the cctv stills from the uni that were shown would theoretically give someone time to fly back the next morning as I understand it?

The arguments surrounding the CCTV from Nomsod's room are complex. Thai journalists viewed what was purported to be the complete CCTV footage from the early hours of September 15 morning until Nomsod was seen leaving, purportedly to go to the university. If the CCTV had not been tampered with, it is strong evidence that Nomsod is in the clear. Reliable sources have shown a number of ways the CCTV could be falsified that would be difficult to detect. There have been claims that the furniture in the CCTV was wrong for the morning of September 15. That, if true, would prove the CCTV false and be extremely damning. Given the amount of attention this case generally, and the CCTV in particular, has received, I am confident multiple journalists would have investigated the furniture claims. No one, as far as I know, has convincingly proven the misplaced/missing/excess furniture hypothesis convincingly.

[BritTim]

It's obvious the truth won't come out in court, but it could in a newspaper.

If I was a journalist I'd be finding someone with access to phone location and call data, and finding out who the key players and suspects were calling/texting just after the time of the crime, and where from.

There are journalists who might risk that to collect background information. Most would not. It would be highly illegal. Anything found in this manner could not directly used.

[catsanddogs]

It's obvious the truth won't come out in court, but it could in a newspaper.

If I was a journalist I'd be finding someone with access to phone location and call data, and finding out who the key players and suspects were calling/texting just after the time of the crime, and where from.

There are journalists who might risk that to collect background information. Most would not. It would be highly illegal. Anything found in this manner could not directly used.

Not directly used - but could be leaked.

[Nigeone]

Just to throw into the mix: When asked his views Sean MCMystery said words to the effect :

"Check which 3 people did not come to work at the *** bar the next day."

It was at this time there was much speculation about 2 bouncers at this bar, one referred to as 'shark tooth ring.'

Reports stated that they both left the island that day.

Very little has been said about them since.

Just a reminder.

Where are they now I wonder?

Shark tooth man returned after the B2 were arrested, he's also got form, been accused of rape before by a HiSo Thai model, cant post that as its in Thai

Who is shark tooth guy? Chappie who posed with the hoe? or someone else?

Shark tooth man, different to the hoe guy

and this is the hoe guy. Aon Kohtao ( Facebook name )Aon-Koh-Tao.jpg

I would love it really love it to get these Koa Tao gangsters in a big room with some of Britains finest..I don't care, SAS, Royal Marines ,Para's or whoever. If only to beat the S*** out them and show them how hard there not! And hopefully and I think likely get the admission out them for this crime and I'm sure so many more. One can dream can't you! And when there finished with them perhaps they could on to the jet ski scum. If only!!

A pipe dream yes but you all get the point!!

[bunglebag]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

I'm not accusing anyone here. I just want to query what I consider to be a possible error in your statement. What is the whole bunch of credible evidence that shows he could not have been on the island on that night? The time on the cctv stills from the uni that were shown would theoretically give someone time to fly back the next morning as I understand it?

The arguments surrounding the CCTV from Nomsod's room are complex. Thai journalists viewed what was purported to be the complete CCTV footage from the early hours of September 15 morning until Nomsod was seen leaving, purportedly to go to the university. If the CCTV had not been tampered with, it is strong evidence that Nomsod is in the clear. Reliable sources have shown a number of ways the CCTV could be falsified that would be difficult to detect. There have been claims that the furniture in the CCTV was wrong for the morning of September 15. That, if true, would prove the CCTV false and be extremely damning. Given the amount of attention this case generally, and the CCTV in particular, has received, I am confident multiple journalists would have investigated the furniture claims. No one, as far as I know, has convincingly proven the misplaced/missing/excess furniture hypothesis convincingly.

Would you agree that it's odd that if they had cctv from early hours of 15th then why did the lawyer not show that as proof rather than the later time (9.30am) which did not fully clear his client? or have I misunderstood and the earlier hours didn't show him.

And why is it 'strong' evidence that he is in the clear if it is feasible to travel to the location of that cctv within the required timeframe?

Again, I'm not pointing the finger here - just wanting to understand how this is this is considered a valid, unquestionable alibi

[Nigeone]

There is next to no chance that the families follow the twisted, regurgitated nonsense that is posted here, don't worry about that aspect. Why would they?

Well if it was my relative and I was spending alot of time stuck in hotels waiting around I'd probably want to dig for as much info as possible regardless. They don't know Thailand and how the system works like we do. So maybe there is a family member reading this thread.

Everyone here is in agreement and would like to see the right people arrested- most here think the family are are being led a merry dance by the authorities. I can't imagine how that would feel, when you'd start to realise whats going on. Who do you trust then??

I wouldn't be sure that the actual direct family's would be reading on here but I'm sure people connected as in friends etc will be.. I know If I had a friend involved in something like this I would be tearing my hair out if only to be able to support the family. And look how much input has come from all us on here despite us not having any direct connection .No this crime has inflamed so many people in so many countries along with mainstream news in lots of countries. As I commented before I've been surprised how much coverage it has got in the UK ,pleasantly I,might say if you can use that would in this situation. Despite the trauma the poor family's must be going through they are educated and know what's right and wrong.This break in the court case will be terrible for them as it just drags out everything but I'm sure they will have thought over the farce of the first 3 days and will have been coming to thoughts of perhaps there's something wrong with this 'perfect case'. Whatever there thinking my heart goes out to them.

[JohnThailandJohn]

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

I'm not accusing anyone here. I just want to query what I consider to be a possible error in your statement. What is the whole bunch of credible evidence that shows he could not have been on the island on that night? The time on the cctv stills from the uni that were shown would theoretically give someone time to fly back the next morning as I understand it?

The arguments surrounding the CCTV from Nomsod's room are complex. Thai journalists viewed what was purported to be the complete CCTV footage from the early hours of September 15 morning until Nomsod was seen leaving, purportedly to go to the university. If the CCTV had not been tampered with, it is strong evidence that Nomsod is in the clear. Reliable sources have shown a number of ways the CCTV could be falsified that would be difficult to detect. There have been claims that the furniture in the CCTV was wrong for the morning of September 15. That, if true, would prove the CCTV false and be extremely damning. Given the amount of attention this case generally, and the CCTV in particular, has received, I am confident multiple journalists would have investigated the furniture claims. No one, as far as I know, has convincingly proven the misplaced/missing/excess furniture hypothesis convincingly.

Would you agree that it's odd that if they had cctv from early hours of 15th then why did the lawyer not show that as proof rather than the later time (9.30am) which did not fully clear his client? or have I misunderstood and the earlier hours didn't show him.

And why is it 'strong' evidence that he is in the clear if it is feasible to travel to the location of that cctv within the required timeframe?

Again, I'm not pointing the finger here - just wanting to understand how this is this is considered a valid, unquestionable alibi

The real question is why go on and on about this kid? Do you think he left at 9:30 with the intent to go murder two random people on the beach and therefore used a fake ID to board a plane and then arrange to get back in time for exams at University?

There is NOTHING linking this kid to the murders. As I recall his DNA was collected from at least three different labs involved in testing of DNA from the crime scene.

All this nonsense because because of people's personal issues. This kid and his family along with many others were investigated early on and rumors and false leads were disproven and even after they caught the two suspects in custody, the kid and his lawyers took issues to show he wasn't involved because of ignorant rumor spreading social media detectives. 10 Million other people in Bangkok who could have done it and has just as much means and motive as him but of course he should be suspected because of unreal expectations he hasn't proven beyond an unreal expectation that he is innocent ... all because his father carries wait on this tiny island.

[Nigeone]

JTJ, Balo, Goldbuggy,Sviss Geez. Do you have an opinion on this?

If David was laid with Hannah when he was struck on the head with the blunt end of a Thai garden Hoe would some of his blood splashed onto Hannah's body? If you are in agreement that that is more than possible and very probable. Why was there no DNA from David discovered on Hannah's body.

I apologies to the family for asking in such a graphic way but I feel strongly that if theses murders were carried out in the way they are described by the prosecution there would have to have been DNA evidence and feel sure the prosecution would have shown this.

If he was , its impossible for us to know the facts here. You're guess is as good as mine.

I haven't seen a police report or lab report or heard court testimony that said none of David's DNA was found on Hannah.

I have also not seen a police report or lab report or heard court testimony that says David was killed while on top of Hannah, running away or while skinning dipping or a plethora of other possible positions.

If If why why question for those not involved are a game (lets play internet detective) and doesn't yield any answers except for those who believe they can derive facts in the case that are based on things they don't know or have not been shared publicly.

JTJ. I've stayed away from you for obvious reasons as most posters on here will know why that is but this gets my goat!

Your very right you haven't seen this that or lots of things to do with this crime and do you know why!!

I'll give you a clue! This crime and investigation,evidence and everything involved with it from the moment that phone call was made after approx a week has been arranged,manipulated and what ever other words you want to add by the RTP completely to there dreamed up imagination! That's why nothing fits and sad for them there not clever enough to have carried it out as has been proven in the first 3 days of trial.You have to be a very very good lier to tie everything together and keep a pretence up of this magnitude for any length of time and the big mistake was they thinking that this was another crime to conviently sweep under the carpet to protect the elite! Scum (mafia) on that Island.

There being found out daily by the power of the media,forums like this and CSI and the brave efforts of Andy Hall and his team.And make no mistake he's one brave dude! The sooner you and your mates with obvious vested interests in this case smell the coffee the better is going to be for all concerned .Because make no mistake this fight is not going away! And I've said before I believe the UK media scent a massive story and are not going to go away...

[Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere]

The Cops are lucky it wasn't John Gotties Daughter.say no more........

Worse than that, cops are lucky it wasn't any Thai Visa Forum member's son or daughter.

[mistephenso]

The real question is why go on and on about this kid? Do you think he left at 9:30 with the intent to go murder two random people on the beach and therefore used a fake ID to board a plane and then arrange to get back in time for exams at University?

There is NOTHING linking this kid to the murders. As I recall his DNA was collected from at least three different labs involved in testing of DNA from the crime scene.

All this nonsense because because of people's personal issues. This kid and his family along with many others were investigated early on and rumors and false leads were disproven and even after they caught the two suspects in custody, the kid and his lawyers took issues to show he wasn't involved because of ignorant rumor spreading social media detectives. 10 Million other people in Bangkok who could have done it and has just as much means and motive as him but of course he should be suspected because of unreal expectations he hasn't proven beyond an unreal expectation that he is innocent ... all because his father carries wait on this tiny island.

The problem is, that no-one (i.e. the RTP) feels it necessary to check where he actually was and attempt to match his DNA to those found at the murder scene (or check plane manifests) and bring that forward to use as evidence/alibi - if he had nothing to hide, why not give himself up and allow tests to be carried out and explain exactly what he was doing at the time under oath...!?

The next thing we'll probably see, is that all 'foreign' reporters will be excluded from court; Thai media will flood in and let us all know that some kind of miraculous evidence has been found that foreigners are not privy to, then the case will be wrapped up!

And all because his father carries 'weight' somewhere in the Thai halls of power (including Koh Tao)....

[Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere]

The family said something to the effect that they weren't going to judge the judicial process and go with the flow. There have been many families of murdered tourist who have done the same thing. Going with the flow in Thailand will get you to nowhere. You have to be relentless on their asses.

[BritTim]

I'm not accusing anyone here. I just want to query what I consider to be a possible error in your statement. What is the whole bunch of credible evidence that shows he could not have been on the island on that night? The time on the cctv stills from the uni that were shown would theoretically give someone time to fly back the next morning as I understand it?

The arguments surrounding the CCTV from Nomsod's room are complex. Thai journalists viewed what was purported to be the complete CCTV footage from the early hours of September 15 morning until Nomsod was seen leaving, purportedly to go to the university. If the CCTV had not been tampered with, it is strong evidence that Nomsod is in the clear. Reliable sources have shown a number of ways the CCTV could be falsified that would be difficult to detect. There have been claims that the furniture in the CCTV was wrong for the morning of September 15. That, if true, would prove the CCTV false and be extremely damning. Given the amount of attention this case generally, and the CCTV in particular, has received, I am confident multiple journalists would have investigated the furniture claims. No one, as far as I know, has convincingly proven the misplaced/missing/excess furniture hypothesis convincingly.

Would you agree that it's odd that if they had cctv from early hours of 15th then why did the lawyer not show that as proof rather than the later time (9.30am) which did not fully clear his client? or have I misunderstood and the earlier hours didn't show him.

And why is it 'strong' evidence that he is in the clear if it is feasible to travel to the location of that cctv within the required timeframe?

Again, I'm not pointing the finger here - just wanting to understand how this is this is considered a valid, unquestionable alibi

The lawyer showed a CCTV still of Nomsod purportedly leaving his room at around 9:00 am. Journalists were subsequently allowed to view full CCTV which, if genuine, shows he did not enter or leave his room between 2:00 am and when he left. It may be fake, but it is pretty strong exoneration if genuine. I do not think Nomsod scaled the outside of the building at 7:00 am in the morning to get to hos room while avoiding CCTV cameras.

[GOLDBUGGY]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

Plus Nomsod had his DNA Tested and proved it did not match with Hannah's, which has cleared several other suspects in the past, including other Migrant Workers. .

[Nigeone]

The real question is why go on and on about this kid? Do you think he left at 9:30 with the intent to go murder two random people on the beach and therefore used a fake ID to board a plane and then arrange to get back in time for exams at University?

There is NOTHING linking this kid to the murders. As I recall his DNA was collected from at least three different labs involved in testing of DNA from the crime scene.

All this nonsense because because of people's personal issues. This kid and his family along with many others were investigated early on and rumors and false leads were disproven and even after they caught the two suspects in custody, the kid and his lawyers took issues to show he wasn't involved because of ignorant rumor spreading social media detectives. 10 Million other people in Bangkok who could have done it and has just as much means and motive as him but of course he should be suspected because of unreal expectations he hasn't proven beyond an unreal expectation that he is innocent ... all because his father carries wait on this tiny island.

The problem is, that no-one (i.e. the RTP) feels it necessary to check where he actually was and attempt to match his DNA to those found at the murder scene (or check plane manifests) and bring that forward to use as evidence/alibi - if he had nothing to hide, why not give himself up and allow tests to be carried out and explain exactly what he was doing at the time under oath...!?

The next thing we'll probably see, is that all 'foreign' reporters will be excluded from court; Thai media will flood in and let us all know that some kind of miraculous evidence has been found that foreigners are not privy to, then the case will be wrapped up!

And all because his father carries 'weight' somewhere in the Thai halls of power (including Koh Tao)....

Yes your right and as I mentioned above it doesn't fit in with there plan of this crime. Also there not allowed to dig in the obvious direction are they because it's going to open a massive can of worms which was the obvious point of this whole exercise framing the B2 from the start. The problem I see is getting Nomsad involved in the trial as he's not on trial or a suspect, in the RTP eyes that is, so there's no reason for him to be involved sadly. Someone will bubble him and his mates though one of these days and don't be surprised if it's one of the UK Sunday papers that pay some money

[Les Quennevais]

Since these murders occurred on 15th September, I have read every article/forum/blog about the situation including, I believe, every post on TV and I would like to say something. First I would like to acknowledge that corruption goes on everywhere and murders happen everywhere, but I want to say something about this particular crime and the people in charge of this particular so called investigation.

It goes without saying that the people who committed these murders are depraved scum.

The people who have investigated these murders and certain other people in authority who have allowed things to proceed as they have, in my opinion, are the lowest of the low, they have no moral compass they are disgusting slime and a blight on the planet.

I hope I have not broken any forum rules....apologies if so.

[Nigeone]

The amount of people stating about DNA tests done by RTP are missing the point. Let's clear this up! The RTP stated that they had there DNA tested and it didn't match...And we all believe whatever the RTP say don't we.. They also said that DNA samples went to Singapore and that's been discounted now. They also said they couldn't do DNA test for a week as they needed to go to Bangkok. They then tested Nomsad and cleared him in 24 hours . No there liars and not very good ones at that. Plain to see!!

[fritzzz25]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

No news agency reported that I used the toilet today, however I did three times thus far....... Unless you are Nomsod's personal assistant and are with him 24-7/365, you have no credible evidence that he WASN'T there.

[IslandLover]

nomsod.jpg

It reads Nomsod Keedo.

His other name is Do (Doh) or Dodo - sounds a lot like Keedo, don't you think?

[simonuk]

The irony here is that as Thailand looks to save face at all costs it is in fact becoming the laughing stock of the world.

[GOLDBUGGY]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

I'm not accusing anyone here. I just want to query what I consider to be a possible error in your statement. What is the whole bunch of credible evidence that shows he could not have been on the island on that night? The time on the cctv stills from the uni that were shown would theoretically give someone time to fly back the next morning as I understand it?

The arguments surrounding the CCTV from Nomsod's room are complex. Thai journalists viewed what was purported to be the complete CCTV footage from the early hours of September 15 morning until Nomsod was seen leaving, purportedly to go to the university. If the CCTV had not been tampered with, it is strong evidence that Nomsod is in the clear. Reliable sources have shown a number of ways the CCTV could be falsified that would be difficult to detect. There have been claims that the furniture in the CCTV was wrong for the morning of September 15. That, if true, would prove the CCTV false and be extremely damning. Given the amount of attention this case generally, and the CCTV in particular, has received, I am confident multiple journalists would have investigated the furniture claims. No one, as far as I know, has convincingly proven the misplaced/missing/excess furniture hypothesis convincingly.

So even if everything you have said about this CCTV is true, and I am not saying it is, then what have you proved? That he was on an Island along with 2,000 other people on the night of the rapes and murders? That he lied to the press? Which for all you know if he did he may have had a good reason to, as maybe he did not want his girlfriend to find out he was there that weekend. Have you ever lied to your Wife or Girlfriend? Does this make you a rapist and murderer?

You have no proof he was on the island and what he told the Police as you were not there. What we all know for sure is Nomsod went in for DNA Testing and he was cleared of all suspicion based on the fact it did not match with the DNA they got from Hannah. The same way which cleared many other Migrant Workers who were tested, and other suspects of this crime, including a Fast Boat Operator, a Football Team, and his Uncle and Father.

How many times here have I heard that money talks in Thailand? Nomsod was a Rich Kid! Do you think having all this money he could not find a date? That he could not afford to pay for it with a Russian Woman, and many others like this in Bangkok, if he wanted to? Personally I think 2 men who may not have had sex in over a year, as they may not have had girlfriends on the Island, have more of a motive to have forced sex with a women, then a Rich Kid who can get that anywhere.

[JohnThailandJohn]

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

I'm not accusing anyone here. I just want to query what I consider to be a possible error in your statement. What is the whole bunch of credible evidence that shows he could not have been on the island on that night? The time on the cctv stills from the uni that were shown would theoretically give someone time to fly back the next morning as I understand it?

The arguments surrounding the CCTV from Nomsod's room are complex. Thai journalists viewed what was purported to be the complete CCTV footage from the early hours of September 15 morning until Nomsod was seen leaving, purportedly to go to the university. If the CCTV had not been tampered with, it is strong evidence that Nomsod is in the clear. Reliable sources have shown a number of ways the CCTV could be falsified that would be difficult to detect. There have been claims that the furniture in the CCTV was wrong for the morning of September 15. That, if true, would prove the CCTV false and be extremely damning. Given the amount of attention this case generally, and the CCTV in particular, has received, I am confident multiple journalists would have investigated the furniture claims. No one, as far as I know, has convincingly proven the misplaced/missing/excess furniture hypothesis convincingly.

So even if everything you have said about this CCTV is true, and I am not saying it is, then what have you proved? That he was on an Island along with 2,000 other people on the night of the rapes and murders? That he lied to the press? Which for all you know if he did he may have had a good reason to, as maybe he did not want his girlfriend to find out he was there that weekend. Have you ever lied to your Wife or Girlfriend? Does this make you a rapist and murderer?

You have no proof he was on the island and what he told the Police as you were not there. What we all know for sure is Nomsod went in for DNA Testing and he was cleared of all suspicion based on the fact it did not match with the DNA they got from Hannah. The same way which cleared many other Migrant Workers who were tested, and other suspects of this crime, including a Fast Boat Operator, a Football Team, and his Uncle and Father.

How many times here have I heard that money talks in Thailand? Nomsod was a Rich Kid! Do you think having all this money he could not find a date? That he could not afford to pay for it with a Russian Woman, and many others like this in Bangkok, if he wanted to? Personally I think 2 men who may not have had sex in over a year, as they may not have had girlfriends on the Island, have more of a motive to have forced sex with a women, then a Rich Kid who can get that anywhere.

One addition / correction I would make is he was actually cleared well before he took the DNA tests. Police cleared him early on after they investigated and it was determined he wasn't even on the island making a DNA test moot. The only reason he arranged for numerous collections of his blood for DNA testing was to silence the conspiracy theorists playing social media detective but am sure he realized as most have by now, nothing is going to stop their social media detective game and in fact the more reality provided them, the more irrational their theories and convictions get and the more they ignore reality and disregard or twist anything that shows there is no mass conspiracy between police, Koh Tao, Bangkok, investigators, hospitals, labs, politicians, judges, prosecutors and so on because of some tiny island headsman who most involved had never heard of before.

The only thinking linking this kid to the crime was unfounded rumors that he was on the island and fled. The police took this claims serious and looked into them to found they were BS. But as they followed these leads the police, who somehow this family controls, had no issue at all publicly accusing them of being involved. In other words, they don't fear nor are they controlled by the family when it comes to this case.

[bunglebag]

I'm not accusing anyone here. I just want to query what I consider to be a possible error in your statement. What is the whole bunch of credible evidence that shows he could not have been on the island on that night? The time on the cctv stills from the uni that were shown would theoretically give someone time to fly back the next morning as I understand it?

The arguments surrounding the CCTV from Nomsod's room are complex. Thai journalists viewed what was purported to be the complete CCTV footage from the early hours of September 15 morning until Nomsod was seen leaving, purportedly to go to the university. If the CCTV had not been tampered with, it is strong evidence that Nomsod is in the clear. Reliable sources have shown a number of ways the CCTV could be falsified that would be difficult to detect. There have been claims that the furniture in the CCTV was wrong for the morning of September 15. That, if true, would prove the CCTV false and be extremely damning. Given the amount of attention this case generally, and the CCTV in particular, has received, I am confident multiple journalists would have investigated the furniture claims. No one, as far as I know, has convincingly proven the misplaced/missing/excess furniture hypothesis convincingly.

Would you agree that it's odd that if they had cctv from early hours of 15th then why did the lawyer not show that as proof rather than the later time (9.30am) which did not fully clear his client? or have I misunderstood and the earlier hours didn't show him.

And why is it 'strong' evidence that he is in the clear if it is feasible to travel to the location of that cctv within the required timeframe?

Again, I'm not pointing the finger here - just wanting to understand how this is this is considered a valid, unquestionable alibi

The lawyer showed a CCTV still of Nomsod purportedly leaving his room at around 9:00 am. Journalists were subsequently allowed to view full CCTV which, if genuine, shows he did not enter or leave his room between 2:00 am and when he left. It may be fake, but it is pretty strong exoneration if genuine. I do not think Nomsod scaled the outside of the building at 7:00 am in the morning to get to hos room while avoiding CCTV cameras.

are we talking about the lobby still at 9:16am here?

[JohnThailandJohn]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

No news agency reported that I used the toilet today, however I did three times thus far....... Unless you are Nomsod's personal assistant and are with him 24-7/365, you have no credible evidence that he WASN'T there.

With this logic, since there is no proof you have took a dump today, it would mean you are full of it.

However in this kid;s case there is not only absolutely nothing offered to show he was on the island, let alone involved but numerous things to confirm he wasn't.